Blink On Crime Kyron Horman Investigation EXCLUSIVE: Terri Horman Friend DeDe Spicher Breaks Her Silence After Passing Polygraph- Requests DA Clear Her Publicly

A Blink On Crime Exclusive: DeDe Spicher speaks for the first time about her ordeal in the Kyron Horman investigation.  ©

S. Christina Stoy, Editor In Chief- Blink On Crime

Lea Conner,  Attorney- contributing editor, and, legal analyst


DeDe Spicher


In the days following the disappearance of 7-year-old Kyron Horman from the Skyline School on June 4th, 2010, Terri Horman’s inner circle of friends, family and associates—casual acquaintances, shop clerks, and gym employees—were deluged by law enforcement.

Word spread quickly that law enforcement was after anyone who knew, might have known, or had any dealings with Terri Horman. The term used to describe law enforcement’s behavior toward potential witnesses was “bullying. ”

As the president of her former condominium owner’s association, DeDe Spicher was involved in helping the association with litigation against the condo’s builder. Spicher had a working relationship with the association’s legal team, and one afternoon, she casually mentioned the investigation into Kyron’s disappearance to the association’s legal team. Although DeDe had not been contacted by law enforcement, counsel for her condo association recommended to DeDe that, in light of what DeDe had heard about the investigation, if law enforcement were to contact her, she should agree to interview only with counsel present.   She asked the attorney to sit in if that happened,  to which he agreed.  He quickly referred Spicher to attorney Chad Stavley.

With a search warrant in hand for electronic devices only, to which DeDe directed investigators, law enforcement proceeded to search her entire home. Multnomah County Detective Keith Krafve asked Spicher to answer some questions.

DeDe said she replied, “I would be happy to answer any and all questions you have but I would like to do so in the presence of counsel. ”

Law enforcement, in turn, began a prolonged and highly orchestrated effort to bully DeDe Spicher.

When I first introduced myself to Ms. Spicher, I offered my apologies for what she had been through and told her that in my personal opinion, she had been unfairly maligned, if not persecuted. I thanked her for her trust of me to tell her story. Ms. Spicher paid me some kind compliments on my coverage of Kyron’s case to date.

I found her extremely bright, animated and witty, with a charmingly confident , and self-deprecating sense of expression.

I also found Ms. Spicher to be very naive, even now, as to the standards, protocols and practices utilized by law enforcement.

I can’t say that I blame Ms. Spicher for trusting law enforcement so blindly.  The fact is, she grew up around law enforcement but saw very little about the actual workings of an investigation. Ms. Spicher is the daughter of a well-respected—now retired—deputy with the Klamath Falls Sheriff’s Office.

At times, I found myself questioning if I would be able to exhibit the sort of resilience this woman has. Probably not.

I found DeDe Spicher to be unwavering as to her account of events on June 4th, 2010, and ensuing dates.

It was only a few weeks ago, during a meeting with MCSO detectives Mark Herron and Keith Krafve , investigators  unofficially cleared DeDe Spicher of any involvement in Kyron’s disappearance or of having any knowledge of anyone elses.  She is hopeful that Multnomah County District Attorney Rod Underhill will issue a public statement from his office clearing her officially.

To date, neither the Multnomah County Sheriffs Office nor the DA’s office has publicly declared any persons cleared in the active investigation.

DeDe is adamant that she was not involved, nor did she ever see anything that led her to believe Terri Horman was involved.

DeDe spoke freely and without hesitation as to the relentless harassment she experienced at the hands of law enforcement.

However, DeDe is adamant that she does not want this piece to express any sort of “pity DeDe” perspective. She does not want anyone to feel sorry for her.

DeDe hopes that by speaking publicly, the public’s curiosity will be satisfied, and the focus of the investigation into Kyron’s disappearance can return to an actual investigation.

This is her story.


In Her Own Words

“. . . On a positive note, I have met some really nice people out of all this, so that’s how I choose to look at it. I can’t control other people’s actions or opinions about me…”

“I did not know anything’ I never knew anything ;and I could not get them (law enforcement) to believe me for over three years. ”

“. . . Since the investigation started, I believe they were able to narrow the time I was supposedly missing [never was, never left the property] but they never shared that with me and have not to this day. . ”

“. . . There was no communication between Terri and I since her birthday party in March [2010], and we had only been in touch the December before that [in 2009]. Terri and I were not best buds. I think that was something investigators were really hung up on. They could not understand that I would rush to someone’s aid that on the surface was a more casual friend. They saw that as behavior of someone that had something to hide, or as a motive of some kind…”

What investigators believed that motive was, they certainly never shared with DeDe Spicher.

No Reid School Alum

Investigators pummeled DeDe from the very start: You were missing at the same time that we can’t pin down Terri Horman’s whereabouts. Why did Terri pick you up? Did someone else pick you up and bring you back? We know you left the property, we have proof.

These are questions demanded from DeDe Spicher over and over again, for three straight years. No matter what she did to try to accommodate law enforcement–and she and her attorney Chad Stavely went through extraordinary means by any standards to assist law enforcement–investigators refused to believe she had no knowledge of the circumstances of Kyron’s disappearance. Until now.

DeDe Spicher’s story has never wavered.

DeDe arrived at her job at Westwind Farm Studio–a sprawling and lush forty-plus acre property scheduled to be on the Garden Conservatory Tour the next day. She parked at the main house, left her cell phone which was turned on, and her lunch cooler in her Ford Explorer.

She went inside the main house to check in for her assignment, and for the first time since working there, she was invited to lunch with the others at the house. There was no time set. The invitation was open-ended and she believed based on the timing of her project completions at the opposite end of the property. This was Spicher’s customary daily routine. Her duties in preparation for the garden tour took her to the end of the grounds for the bulk of the morning, near the road. Where she was working, bent over in tall grasses and vegetation is not visible from the main house.

Spicher was not wearing a watch nor carrying her cell phone, and headed to the house for lunch after completing work on one section of the property. When she arrived, she was told that Ms. Hockensmith tried calling DeDe’s name outside when everyone was ready for lunch. When DeDe did not respond and could not be seen from the main house, Ms. Hockensmith also called DeDe’s cell phone. Spicher said she apologized and explained her project’s location and status, and then sat down to eat.  DeDe resumed her work day to completion. Her cell phone records confirm this account.

On  one occasion, at the request of law enforcement , Spicher agreed to walk the property and demonstrate her activities that day. During one reenactment,, a female investigator attempted to mimic Hockensmith’s “lunch call” while Spicher was out near the property line. Spicher heard the investigator’s call.

“I heard that person that day. They never told me where she was standing, I just know I could not see her which is easy to do if you saw the grounds. I don’t know why I never heard the property owner that day except to say I try to be very mindful when I am working, and gardening is a love of mine I tend to immerse in. It was the first time I was invited to lunch and was looking forward to sharing the meal on break. Had I heard her, I would have stopped immediately and headed in. It was a nice treat. ”

It sounded like an innocent explanation. I asked DeDe why investigators did not believe her.

She responded: I was repeatedly questioned, hounded,my home and belongings were taken and searched for some time. Law enforcement kept telling me in interviews I agreed to participate in, by the way, that the only way to clear myself was to take a polygraph, which my attorney advised me not to.  Since I had been told by Terri that she was told she failed when she was adamant that she was being truthful, I had no desire to be set up like that. I do not know to this day if Terri actually failed any polygraphs or law enforcement just told her they did. I know that once she told me that [investigators claimed she failed her polygraph], my advice to her was that she should not speak to anyone without an attorney, but she continued to ignore it, I think for a few more days. As I recall, I don’t think I was the only person or friend telling her that.

Editors Note: has been able to confirm through an independent source which does not wish to be identified publicly, that Terri Horman was referred to her criminal defense attorney Stephen Houze via a family friend and attorney located in Bend, Oregon. Subsequently, Kaine Horman requested a search of the Bend attorney’s property, and indicated that Kyron may have gone there.

It was either completely naive or bold for Spicher to submit to a polygraph under those conditions. She was, by her own account, telling the truth, and then being punished for it.

However, investigators were adamant at “proving” a theory that Spicher left the Westwind Farm. I asked, “Considering there is absolutely no communication between you and anyone else, and you are working on a 40-acre farm on this day, wouldn’t it be true that the theory had to be that. . . ? ”

Spicher interrupted: Yes, that Terri swung by and picked me up for some reason, or some other unknown person. ”

The problem with that theory is that it required another person who was not at the farm to know where Spicher was working that day come meet her, without being seen by anyone else, and without communication with anyone else.

Spicher: “On several occasions,I reminded investigators that there was a witness to where I was working on that property on June 4th 2010, which I surmise would complete whatever timeline holes they thought I had. This has never been released publicly, but there was also an artisan show/market sale on the property the next day. There were a few vendors in and out of the property that day, but I remembered one specifically while I was working near the road that morning. I was there when he dropped off his pots/pottery and whatever else he had to show or sell. ”

The artist/driver who delivered his pottery was in his late twenties to early thirties and drove a red pick up. .

Stoy: So law enforcement knew that there was a witness from day one, that could corroborate your logistics on the property and approximate timing, is that correct?

Spicher: YES!I did not know the man’s name or the name of his creations or anything, and when I asked law enforcement for the information to provide my attorney they refused to even say if they spoke to him, or if they had, if they were now satisfied I was where I said I was and at what time. They declined to provide it to my attorney as well, and by that time Ms. Hockensmith had an attorney as well so I was not permitted to just call and ask her.  I even went to the Saturday market a few times to see if I could locate him myself.

Stoy: Why did Ms. Hockensmith need an attorney if you know?

Spicher: I assume it was because all kinds of people were showing up at her property and pounding on the gates, etc. She was hounded by the media for weeks, and all because she gave me a job. I was horrified for her. All because of me.

Stoy: Was there any connection between Hockensmith and the Hormans?

Spicher: Not that I am aware of, they were on completely different socio-economic levels and their kids went to a French American School, not Skyline. I would not even know where they would bump into each other.

Stoy: Has anyone ever mentioned to you whether Hockensmith hired Rudy Sanchez at any time?

Spicher: No. Did she?

Stoy: I am going to need to check my archives on that one, I thought so but I could be confusing her with a different property owner.

(Editors Note: Hockensmith’s friend and fellow farm-owner Jean Ann Von Krevelen did hire RS Landscaping Maintenence. DeDe Spicher was interning with Ms. Von Krevelen, and was referred to Maryellen Hockensmith to work on her property. It was not to be a paid position as Ms. Spicher was willing to ‘work for her sweat” to learn all she could at the time. Spicher said she has never met Rodolpho (Rudy) Sanchez nor has she observed him on either property. )


Frink or Fink- You Decide

So how does a casual friend such as Spicher become elevated to Terri Horman’s lifeline to the outside world, only to turn into the number two suspect in a de facto criminal investigation of Terri Horman?

Frink-in’ thinkin’.

Norman W. Frink, longtime chief deputy district attorney for Multnomah County, was former District Attorney Mike Schrunk’s right hand man. While no longer in office and the DA assignments to Kyron’s investigations are new,there are strong reverbations from the previous administration.

Stoy: You mentioned that law enforcement accused you of wasting their resources and distracting the investigation. In what way did they mean or how did they explain that to you?

Spicher: First it was Chief ADA Norm Frink who said I was wasting their time and resources by not “cooperating,” by which he meant “take their poly[graph]. ” That was just a couple of days before news first broke about my “involvement,” and was all part of his blackmailing me.

Stoy: How do you mean blackmailing you,the DA? Frink?

Spicher: Yes. We were in a meeting/interview and. .

Stoy: Was your attorney present?

Spicher: Yes. Sitting right there. Frink said that we do not think you had anything to do with this, but we do think you have information about Terri Horman’s involvement, and we do think she is involved. Either you take our polygraph, or provide the information we believe you have, or, I don’t care, we will tell the family that we do think you’re involved.

Stoy: What was your response?

Spicher: I said that I understood the need for them to do what they had to do, but that I was not going to tell them something that was not true.  I did not really expect them to say something they knew to be false. They did. The next day, my name was released to the press by Desiree Young and Kaine Horman.   It was a statement about me not cooperating and I think advising others not to or words to that effect.

Stoy: I am not sure I even know how to respond to that, or if I should during the interview. For me, that is tantamount to telling you that were looking at facing an indictment of your own. I think a reasonable conclusion by someone in your position would have been that you could expect to be arrested for something they knew you did not do, regardless of what it was, to further a case that they seemingly had no evidence in.  Again, I find you courageous to have ever had another meeting with any law enforcement officer or DA in this case. I think it would have been very, very easy to say, “Eff this. They are not going to find Kyron with anything I have to offer because I do not know anything, and they are not going to find him by putting words in my mouth against anyone else. I need to protect myself. ” You never did that. Courageous.

Spicher: Thank you, but I really don’t feel courageous.  To me courage is when one does something for which they have a great deal of fear.  Mostly, I haven’t been afraid, which is what pissed law enforcement off from the very beginning. The one time I was afraid was after the ADA tried to blackmail me and I began to realize I might have to live in a world where the truth didn’t matter. I was not courageous at all in facing that fear.

Stoy: I am not an attorney but based on what you are telling me I don’t see how that is construed as anything but blackmail. He unilaterally gave you 2 choices. Both of which were in contradiction to your 5th amendment rights considering he was ready to make a public criminal allegation about you- does not matter to whom it was.

On the following day, July 22, 2010 Norm Frink made good on his threat to DeDe Spicher.

From The Oregonian, Maxine Bernstein

In a statement late tonight, Kaine Horman and Kyron’s mother, Desiree Young, and Desiree’s husband, Tony Young, said they had been briefed by law enforcement and believe Spicher is hampering the investigation. They implored her to cooperate.

“She has not only been in close communication with Terri but has been providing Terri with support and advice that is not in the best interests of our son,” the statement said. “Additional information provided shows that she is refusing to cooperate with law enforcement, she is also going as far as to suggest to others that may have information regarding Kyron’s disappearance, not to cooperate as well. ”


In one fell swoop DeDe Spicher was the Richard Jewell of Portland, courtesy of Norm Frink.


Nothing grand about the grand jury

Dede Spicher was called before the first grand jury in July 2010. She was never asked any questions. I asked her if she had any information on that grand juries status and whether or not a true bill was sought, sought and denied, suspended, or dismissed.

Spicher: I don’t know any of that, but I believe that it was an election year and it was all DA strategy. I think they called me to scare Terri Horman and maybe Rudy Sanchez.

Stoy: Why do you say Rudy Sanchez? He testified as well, so that has a layer of at least limited use immunity and for all we know he had a separate agreement for what is called transactional immunity. I have no information on that though, he has never responded to my requests for interview.

Spicher: I don’t know, I just know that he is who Terri felt was involved.  His name never came up until Terri was asked who had been on the property that was not a friend or relative.

DeDe was again subpoenad to appear before the grand jury on July 10, 2013. She felt that it was her impression that law enforcement and the DA were running out of time due to the civil suit and divorce case, and she read that the grand jury was extended for 6 months previously and about to expire.  At the time, the civil case Desiree Young filed against Terri Horman and has since withdrawn was about to resume.  A stay had been granted in November 2012, a month before  a scheduled hearing to compel further deposition of Spicher in that matter.

DeDe assumed that what she did not know might, potentially, help the investigation by potentially shifting focus away from red herrings as to her knowledge of events.   The problem now for Spicher was that the prosecutor had already demonstrated to her that it was not above using almost any means or tactics,  and at the time she had concerns that even her own lawyer believed she was telling the truth.   Stavley advised her to tell the truth, tell everything she knew.  She did, repeatedly.

Stoy: So,  you get a subpoena once again to appear before the grand jury.  Detectives are telling you to your face they do not believe you.  The prosecutor [Frink] has demonstrated he does not believe you.   According to what you have shared with me so far, you question if your own attorney believes you.   How lonely of a place was that?  I think most people would have been completely terrified.  How did you cope with your fear?

Spicher:  You know I was terrified.  It seemed like every time law enforcement would ask me for something,  I would provide it, and it was like a fresh new hell each time.  It was not going away.  I could not even read about the case or discuss it with anyone other than my parents because it was absolutely clear to me that the public now believed I was the obstacle to either solving the case or arresting Terri to solve the case and/or find Kyron and I knew that to be false.   The truth did not matter to anyone.  I was told this so often I began to even question myself.   I won’t forget a conversation I had with a detective about whether or not I was unconsciously suppressing information I did not know I had.  I mean, imagine my response to that.  I said, well if I am suppressing something, then I think that means I have to wait for it to enter my conscious by way of my subconscious and if and when it does, I would certainly let you know.

Stoy: So what were they suggesting?  Hypnosis?

Spicher:  No.  Although I am not sure I would not have preferred that.   My attorney had advised against taking a polygraph.  I believed Terri back in June 2010 when she said she was telling the truth and they told her that the lie detector test was saying she was lying and I also knew that even if I agreed to it, that law enforcement was under no obligation to tell me if I passed or failed and even if they did tell me, that I COULD trust that information to be correct.  For me, it was not going to be an end to this because I knew that I had been telling the truth and that was not what anyone wanted to hear so what was verifying that going to get me?   It was more like the potential beginning of a fresh new hell.

DeDe absolutely believed that her impending grand jury appearance was designed to  result in her facing some sort of charge for something that investigators believed would lead  her to ultimately implicate Terri Horman in Kyron’s disappearance.  In fact,  she was told that what was an honest tax mistake/error on her part after she ended up being paid a nominal amount by Mrs. Hockensmith but never received a 1099, could end up placing her in hot water.  The Capone tactic for a woman that took the job with the understanding that it was not a paid endeavor and when Ms. Hockensmith told Spicher she wanted to compensate her she declined.  Hockensmith insisted.

On this basis, DeDe was advised to and agreed to an immunity deal.   The terms of which are under seal and Spicher nixed discussing citing a verbal agreement she made until such time as it is unsealed.

A source inside the investigation who does not wish to be identified as they are not authorized to speak publicly on the case- has confirmed that Spicher’s agreement includes provisions that she continue to cooperate with law enforcement as needed, be available to testify in any proceedings, and to take a polygraph.

Spicher declined to say to whom she committed to not discuss the agreement but that it also included neither party discussing that she had testified before the grand jury.

It would appear that Ms. Spicher is the only one keeping up her end of the bargain as Attorney Rosenthal announced publicly that DeDe Spicher had testified-  a fact that to this day she has no idea how he came by that information.

Spicher appeared before the grand jury for five and a half hours on July 10, 2013.

Because grand jury proceedings are secret, and the DA, grand jurors, and state court personnel are barred from discussing the goings on, the only person who can speak to a witness’ testimony is the witness.  In this case, the grand jury witness is DeDe Spicher.

Stoy: So before we get into the particulars, could you sum up those hours in the room at all- would you compare it to the civil deposition you endured by Desiree Young’s attorney Mr. Rosenthal?

Spicher: (laughs) No. It was far more comprehensive. I am referring to the civil deposition.

Stoy: When asked about your weight, you were far more reserved and eloquent than I would have been. . . . If someone asked me my weight at a deposition, I would have said I did not know but would be glad to sit on him and let him guess.

Spicher: I know, right? Not me, I am direct, I had nothing to hide, and I was not intimidated in the least.

Stoy: So without telling me what questions you were asked specifically, what would you characterize as your testimony ?

Spicher: They were obsessed with my sexuality. Was I a lesbian,what were my thoughts on homosexuals: Did I ever have a threesome with anyone, with Kaine and Terri, etc. I was thinking if I were a juror, I would be like, what does this have to do with anything? I answered every question respectfully and honestly but my takeaway is that some folks still have a hard time believing that I would rush to a friend’s aid if we had not been in contact, or particularly close in the first place. I responded that when your friend texts “I need you now,” I got in my car and headed over there. There was never a question in my mind. Even if I knew that everything that happened to me over the last 3 years would happen all over again, I would do the same thing today. That’s what friends do. I also testified when it was clear that sentiment was not shared by some, that I certainly was hopeful that they never needed a friend “immediately”.

Because of the travel time ,Spicher requested that since investigators wanted to give her the polygraph in Portland, that they schedule it for the day after the grand jury. It was easier for her to extend her time in Portland than to have to return again. They agreed.

Upon arrival, although Spicher was prepared for, and extended her visit to take the polygraph as committed, she was told that they had decided that because she was on the stand for such a grueling afternoon the day before that they never want to give anyone a polygraph after such an experience- as it might skew the results. She made a mental note that they had told her previously that one’s emotional state and exhaustion level are taken into consideration in a polygraph. In other words, while investigators were telling her Terri Horman previously failed her polygraphs, and she asked them if that could have been due to the fact that she went through hours and hours of interviews just prior to the exams, investigators now had a different story.


Herron Hamster Wheel

Mark Herron and Keith Krafve began the  interview the same exact way they had for years.

“We still can’t seem to put together the right timeline from when you were at the property. ”  And on again it went. Spicher continued the interview as she had agreed to, but informed them that if this was her time use that to perform the polygraph they would need to travel to Klamath Falls on their own dime.

They did just that. DeDe Spicher passed the polygraph administered by the same Gresham sheriff’s deputy who administered the polygraph exam to Terri Horman.  Spicher says in particular, Mark Herron was jubilant. She said it was like a party atmosphere. Spicher was verklempt:

‘Well, I am happy that you are happy, I guess, but the thing is, I have been telling you the same thing for three years so I guess I am just happy you’re happy ”

Herron went on to blame Spicher for the thousands of hours, and dollars that her refusal to take a polygraph cost the investigation. Then, they asked to speak to Spicher’s attorney privately, outside of her presence.  She agreed.

After a few minutes*, they called Spicher back in and asked for her permission to meet with her privately without her attorney. Spicher and her attorney agreed.

Krafve starts by telling her: We are so glad you are on the team finally. This is such a big step in this case and you are really one of us.

Then, the hook.

We asked to speak to you without (your attorney) because we would like you to participate in a sting against Terri. We can’t ask you in front of counsel, and you cannot tell him what we said because he will then be obligated to make some calls as a member of the bar and all that.

Spicher asks if she can at least discuss it with her dad, a retired deputy with the Klamath Falls Sheriff’s Office. Herron said she could, but that he could not discuss it with her attorney, either.

Spicher told them it was 10: 00 PM , and reminded them that she has not had any contact with Terri since July 2010. Spicher told investigators that she was not comfortable with the proposal and would definitely need to sleep on it. They told her they would follow up with her.

Stavley, presumably uncomfortable with law enforcement’s request to meet with this client without him, asked Spicher to tell him what the meeting was about. She told her attorney that it was something they told her she could not tell him and that she wanted to get out of there and discuss it later. Stavley said he was not at all comfortable with that arrangement, and within hours Spicher told him that law enforcement wanted her to participate in a sting operation.

It was not until last week that Detective Krafve contacted Spicher directly to follow up on their request for DeDe Spicher to participate in a surreptitiously recorded sting where she was to call Terri Horman, and at the direction of law enforcement, read from a prepared agenda to include coaching by them.

Spicher declined.

To Be Continued…

* Edit to reflect changing the word twenty to “a few” for accuracy.  9/11/13 4:43 PM EST

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  1. Maggie M says:

    And the story is on KGW’s facebook page.

  2. Sammy says:

    Thank you Ms Spicher.
    I’m so grateful that the silence has been broken – and I pray that the bright light of TRUTH may now begin to shine. Only thru the truth being shouted out to the world will what really happened to little Kyron be known.
    From MCSO and the DA office – we (the public) have been fed a steady diet of lies & insinuations of what happened that June day in 2010.
    Shame on them.
    Not only have their wrongdoings severely hampered any hope of finding out what happened to Kyron, but they are also responsible for putting every other child in the area in danger.
    They have consistently led the public to believe that this was an isolated family event with Terri wearing a target on her back.
    Never mentioning that there has been, and still remains a very dangerous threat out there to other children.
    That’s unconscionable.

    I feel I must apologize to you Ms Spicher for any doubts, bad thoughts, or words I may have expressed in the past.
    I was taking the bait of misinformation being disseminated by MCSO/DA office by the local Portland news “team players”.
    For that I am very sorry.
    I pray that you find some peace in your life as the truth continues to be exposed. (you look beautiful in the pic above – may that smile continue to grace your lovely face!)

    The lives of other children depend on people stepping up and refusing to go along with believing the fairy-tale they’ve been fed for the past 3 years by LE.
    That a child was disappeared from a public school is an outrage … And this cover-up has gone on too long.

    And of course THANK YOU dear Blink for your dogged determination working for Kyron.
    God Bless You!

  3. T. Ruth says:

    “Those new details were first reported in theonline blog

    This is the first time Dede Spicher, a close friend of Terri Horman, has spoken publicly about the case.

    Spicher spoke exclusively to the website’s editor-in-chief but KGW independently confirmed the interview took place.”

    LOL, this is not the first time Dede has spoken publicly about the case. People Magazine had an interview with her long ago. Are there any reporters out there who can get facts right? Why is it these reporters don’t see “the rest of the story”?

  4. kimberly says:

    Wow and Wow. (I think I just met erose on the floor.)

    DeDe, Bless you for staying strong, honest and coming forward.

    Blink, there is an angel smiling upon you for this…….

  5. Dale says:

    Too many contradictions about your (Casual friend) TH…Especially this part, after LE asked you to take a polygraph
    (((Since I had been told by Terri that she was told she failed when she was adamant that she was being truthful, I had no desire to be set up like that. I do not know to this day if Terri actually failed any polygraphs or law enforcement just told her they did. I know that once she told me that [investigators claimed she failed her polygraph], my advice to her was that she should not speak to anyone without an attorney, but she continued to ignore it, I think for a few more days. As I recall, )))) Then you tell her to NOT speak to LE and get an Attorney??? Also TH did not continue to talk to LE after she failed the 2nd Polygraph, that is when she clammed up and got an Attorney…
    Secondly, why now??? 3 years later, why now do you come forward and demand Immunity??? I am glad you passed the polygraph but this could have cleared up in July 2010…Why would TH, after not seeing you for 3 months and being a Casual Friend, text you and say (I need you now!!!) Again, I am glad your passed your test but there are lingering questions…Like everyone else, I want Kyron found. I believe he was killed. His remains needs to be buried by his Family. I wish you had went with the sting operation, you could have cleared TH, that was your chance to do it…Now the cat is out of the bag…

    Dale, your facts are incorrect. TH did not fail a second polly, and she did not retain counsel until after she was served with a RO. Again, the angers are misplaced but with the same goal. Gotta figure out how to come together and not divide folks.

  6. RedRose says:

    posted on previous thread:

    RedRose says:
    Your comment is awaiting moderation.

    September 4, 2013 at 8:55 pm

    There comes a point when being silent only hurts yourself. And the person you are being silent to protect gets to be the pure and innocent party.

    And you (DDS) end up really getting your name trashed.

    Good for you DDS, and also for being brave enough to use your real name. Gpd bless little Kyron and all those who advocate for him.

    @GraceintheHills says:September 4, 2013 at 4:59 pm
    Rose says:September 4, 2013 at 12:25 pm

    Rose says,
    Perhaps DDS feels freed by grand jury behind her,
    but if she reads or posts on blogs her risk is
    she’ll become as stuck on June 4 and immediate
    aftermath as Desiree.

  7. erose says:

    Gosh, I meant Lea, Mrs. O’Conner, my mistake, we truly appreciate you.

  8. Rose says:

    and @ Lea, doggie update?

    Having just re-read this account, Imo DDS is a survivor
    due to intelligence & ethics. Terri chose the right person to text
    her need to. Woukd DY & KH had the same
    caliber friends. And Stavely is an
    unsung hero in client guidance.

  9. RedRose says:

    I have always thought that…

    @SouthernMom says:

    September 4, 2013 at 1:59 pm

    I wonder how many would now also agree that Mike Cook was a “plant” intended to surreptitiously “sting” Terri Horman? Recalling cell phone used was one owned by Kaine Horman.

  10. Rose says:

    @ATG. Your points are all correct that a period of Court-ordered supervision of MCSO & Mult Cty DA is necessary due to malfeasance in “color of law” activity. Others have had similar complaints come to DOJ attention. Recently,
    & also back to Sheriff/Mayor Shrunk’s era.

    Such a remedy is possible when a Federal civil rights suit is brought on behalf of a “class,”
    like kids in foster care, or in the juvenile system, or mentally ill killed “mistakenly” at hands of PPB.
    Then, as part of the remedy, the Federal Court could order & supervise corrective actions.
    (we know Mult Cty civil Court judges have been tools in this hot mess.)

    I have no doubt the correct attorney could bring & win a righteous federal civil suit seeking reform remedies.
    Rosenthal has ridden an ancient case where he was associated as in-State counsel claiming just such righteous turf.
    Now, imo only a retiree, who wants to work 100 hour weeks again, like Wagner, is good for it, maybe
    associating with a Gerry Spence with deep litigation pockets.

    As long as the DA hires the politically connected (or children of), the office will be weak.
    MCSO’s history, top to bottom, revealed in lawsuits & investigations, speaks for itself.

  11. matt g says:

    I think DeDe should have gone along with the sting, it may well have provided a break through in the case. She knew that by informing her attorney it would stop the sting in it’s tracks.

    Well done DeDe, you’re sooo brave!

    Sure, everyone should sign up to set themselves up for some unkown criminal charge outside of the presence of their attorney ( um, hello- read up lately on Oregon Bar rules and responsibilities?) right after they spent the last 3 years and their own cash defending themselves against absolutely nothing.

    Seriously, who the eff believes TH, who btw, KNEW she was in the middle of the last failed sting, is going to implicate herself on a phone call of a person who has been public enemy 2? I can answer that. Idiots.

    I do not understand that logic. If one believed DDS was involved or had knowledge, and was subsequently cleared of both, doesn’t that call TH “guilt” in to question by proxy if nothing else.

    PS. Kyron Horman, still missing.


  12. SouthernMom says:

    @hervness says:

    September 4, 2013 at 6:11 pm

    Agree 100%…regardless of LE 101 to look at family and those closest to victim 1st, 2nd & 3rd…this is extreme tunnel vision.

    I may be wrong and this is my own opinion…but I truly believe DY & TY greatly influenced this focus.

    What I want to know now is this…did Terri pass or fail her poly? We know LE told her she failed, but it’s easier for me to believe they lied to her hoping to gain a confession than it is for me to believe she failed.


    Prayers for Kyron…rest well tonight angel.
    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

  13. Rose says:


    “involves Dede Spicher, a ****close **** friend of Kyron’s stepmom Terri Horman.”

    Oh, Kyle. sadly your paragraph 1 has a major reportorial error.
    In the article above DDS repeatedly makes the statement they were not close at all.

    You have just repeated MCSO’s accusations, not the content if the interview above.

    I can tell you that in my phone interview with him, I was very clear that the two were not close, more than once, fwiw.

    I thought he captured the sentiment overall, anxious to see how the O handles.


  14. Rose says:

    looked back for an example I’d found of Herron’s interview technique while on River Patrol,
    recounted by a ride along high school intern student:

    (insert, call me annoyed. The url below to theCatlin HS senior project, which pulled it up in Nov ’12 & as recently as March ’13, and I posted here twice before, no longer works.
    2013 entries come up on P 18 when previously that url went directly to Herron’s student’s writeup,
    and only that write-up (not a list).
    So, I went to Catlin Home, searched Senior Project, hit “last” & found 45 pp.
    Working from p 45 back to 34, it is clear kppr’s writeup of accompanying Herron
    at work is no longer on line that I can find. Hope someone took a screenshot.)

    posted on
    “March 27, 2013 at 11:42 am
    See 5/12/11 Interrogation – Day 2 at 5:33 by kppr
    On this date Mr Herron is a line level Deputy assigned to River Patrol
    working under the supervision of Brett Elliott. He also is and
    had been “a” SAR Coordinator. This student (high school) describes Herron
    orienting him to interview techniques. (which amaze one.)
    This (teaching) was subsequent to Herron interviewing a suspected burglar.
    In that case he went to the (alleged) burglar’s (home?),
    talked him into coming back to the Office with him to be interviewed (no Miranda warning),
    and conducted the interview alone without a colleague witness
    ,( as recounted by student who was present while Herron took in suspect but not for the interview.)

    Looking back,
    Monte Reisor was in charge until Task Force formation. We know line level was O’Donnell. Rees said so in Court docs.

    With Task Force, Kafvre takes over. (Reisor returns to River Patrol.)

    Herron, Reisor’s longtime River Patrol comrade dating at least to 2005,
    appears in TF era to work under Kafvre as a detective.

    snip: “grasshopper says:
    March 25, 2013 at 8:12 pm
    12/17/2003 how Krafve handled a drug trafficker case
    and his bio

    also snipped from url page below:
    ” March 27, 2013 at 12:36 pm
    Sgt Krafve is “the lead detective” on the dissolving Task Force. 5/11

    now supervises the Detectives Unit, which has 10 Detectives and includes subunits such as Human Trafficking & Cold Cases

    “March 27, 2013 at 1:14 pm
    … Answering myself as to when Herron changed jobs.
    Herron had been promoted from a River Patrol Deputy to a Detective in the Detectives Unit of Investigations by 08/12

    all from:

  15. T. Ruth says:

    SouthernMom says:
    September 4, 2013 at 7:06 pm

    Can you say when DeDe’s polygraph was administered? Wondering how soon after DY cancelled the lawsuit…

    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

    I can say that her polygraph occurred after the lawsuit was dismissed.

    More interesting information. Sounds to me like Rosenthal was just possibly informed that the GJ was dismissed after Dede testified. Dede was LE’s “ace in the hole”, i.e., some question they had would seal their case, and after 5.5 hours of testimony, there was nothing there for the GJ to pass a true bill against Terri Horman. Nothing. Not even a tuna sandwich, let alone ham.

    That explains LE’s response to Dede about no need to rush the LDT and then their last ditch attempt to crucify via sting.

    I hate this case and the way it’s been handled. Guisto is right, MCSO needs to offer up some accountability and so does PPS. Pronto.

  16. SouthernMom says:

    The Skyline Community has basically been lied to over and over again. A very special beautiful little “frogman”, Kyron Horman, a 7 year old 2nd grade boy was disappeared from Skyline Elementary…and it was not his Step Mom who removed him! If you have not read the previous articles here, you should do so now.

    Kyron Horman was definitely seen at the science fair in Skyline Elementary after Terri Horman left the school and was verified to be at Fred Meyer Store…and Kyron was seen inside and outside of the school some time after she left…so who was it who disappeared him?

    LE needs to answer these questions NOW…if they don’t know who the mysterious unknown man was…we call him SZ here…they need to tell the TRUTH that there are witnesses who have come forward with information that indicates Kyron was “not” last scene by his step mother at 9:45 headed to his classroom.

    I realize it will be hard for LE to come clean, and I realize the ramifications and lynching they may receive by being honest now.

    They’ve basically done everything possible to “sting” Terri Horman to support their theory. If it’s not working…try something else.

    Com’on’ LE ++ Put UP or SHUT UP!! Kyron deserves your efforts to focus on what really happened. In 3 years, if you KNOW Terri is guilty…CHARGE Her or if not, CLEAR Her! Just because you can’t solve this case and name “whodunit”…it does not give you the right to continue to allow Skyline Families to believe innuendos and theories LE knows is not true.

    I say “CLEAR Her” … not for Terri, but for Kyron!!! He deserves the TRUTH to be told. This case will never be solved without the TRUTH being revealed in every single aspect of the case. LE’s strategies have not worked to date…so it’s time to try something else.

    I vote for the TRUTH…and only the TRUTH in what is known and not known as fact, not speculations and assumptions!

    I will work on posting links to Representatives and Senators for the locals to easily contact their politicians. It’s gonna take an outcry of local citizens to push for the TRUTH to be told, IMO.

    Whatever It TAKES!!! to find Kyron and bring him home!

    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

  17. Rose says:

    @wpg. With all respect, and appreciation of you bringing us back to DY’s POV, with 2 Sheriff case investigators–one head of Cold Case Unit–and the DA’s Chief Asst telling tge Youngs DDS was involved, what could she or her attorney possibly say directly to DY or Rosenthal that they woukd believe? Moreover Rosenthal/Young had ditectly engaged DDS in an adversarial depo & had gone further to formally ask the Judge to relieve her of her 5th Amendment rights.

    From the before & after the search film footage I viewed, at the moment DY is in a very precarious mental state,stuck as she said on June 4, 2010, and needsprotection her family & supporters are not affording her. Imo that’s my big concern for DY now. Not Kyron, but her countertherapeutic feedback circle.

  18. evie says:

    At least KPTV called for comment.

    The Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office issued a “no comment” when FOX 12 inquired about the blog’s report that Spicher had been “unofficially” cleared.

    The district attorney’s office also issued a “no comment.”

  19. wpg says:

    September 4, 2013 at 5:22 pm

    I’m not feeling too chipper after reading certain revelations made here regarding the early weeks and months after Kyron’s disappearance.

    They are basically the same revelations that I read on ScaredMonkeys starting around September 2010 via posts made by “FlyMonkey” and real-time reposting of GLP posts made under the name “Tom Jones” that some Monkeys brought over right after they were originally posted on GLP.

    Here is a link to more or less the start (if I’m recalling correctly) to the GLP “Tom Jones” repostings on ScaredMonkeys:

    I have asked more than once here, how on earth would cousin Tom know certain details unless someone was providing them to him?

    So, DDS was participating in public postings almost 3 years ago, is that correct or no?

    Part of Desiree Young’s Hell on Earth for 3 years has been her frustration regarding beliefs about DDS and her not getting answers which did not allow her to move off that particular DDS road in trying to find the right road to Kyron.

    Compassion for Kyron should mean compassion for Desiree Young, imo.

    Why did DDS choose not to relieve Kyron’s Mother’s angst for 3, very long years in what could have been figured out to be in direct, private and credible communications with Desiree Young and counsel, but instead there is the appearance that she chose to participate in blogging on public sites behind other names, other people?

    I’m at a loss to understand this.



    wpg- what gives? I ask respectfully.

    Are you accusing DDS of posting under her cousin’s name anywhere- I want to make sure I understand your post before commenting?

    At the risk of over-reacting, are you seriously inferring this piece is comparable to that loons rants?



    Respectfully, Blink, I am not accusing, I am asking.

    And respectfully, I am clearly not referring to later posts by Tom Jones where he goes off in various tangents with his opinions and speculations on his cousin’s involvement.

    Blink, the following from your above article:

    “Spicher: “On several occasions,I reminded investigators that there was a witness to where I was working on that property on June 4th 2010, which I surmise would complete whatever timeline holes they thought I had. This has never been released publicly, but there was also an artisan show/market sale on the property the next day. There were a few vendors in and out of the property that day, but I remembered one specifically while I was working near the road that morning. I was there when he dropped off his pots/pottery and whatever else he had to show or sell. ”

    The artist/driver who delivered his pottery was in his late twenties to early thirties and drove a red pick up. .”


    The story of DDS waving to the vase artist in a red pickup was publicly posted on public-access websites by both FlyMonkey and “Tom Jones” almost 3 years ago.

    Here are a couple of examples of other posts:

    following entries from “godlikeproductions” posted on September 16 2010 at SM’s:

    User ID: 1046928
    9/16/2010 4:03 AM

    “Where is Kyron;
    Terri was seen by Dede crying real tears over all the things listed previously.
    As far as Terri setting up Dede with someone from the property, Dede said she didn’t know terris acquaintences and highly doubts that is what happened.
    According to Dede the people she met at the birthday party she would have easily recognized at the garden property due to the fact there were not many people there working before the 5th. And noone on the 5th either.
    Dede says her last work day was June 5th, and her whole reason for being there was to help get the place ready for that day. She said she never worked on the property after.
    Dede said she still is a gym member, but has not worked out at the Beaverton gym for years, and has not worked out at her gym since Feb 09

    Dede saw all coworkers and owners before and after it was said she left the property and still does not know who said she had left the property according to her.
    Dede says she got the internship on the property through her gardening mentor, and never met the owners before the arrangement was made to work on the property.
    June 4 morning time line;
    8am ate breakfast at home,
    8:15 am she left home for the garden and called her father while on the way and talked and drove reaching the property at 8:45.
    8:45 she hung up and changed into her gardening gear.
    8:50 she knocked on the door of the house hoping she was not too early.
    From 8:50 till 9:15 she was in the house talking with the owner.
    9:15 to 10:30 she was working with a group of people in the green house nursery area.
    She left the property at 4 pm and went home and showered then went to suhi land for dinner at Bridgeport then went back home and stayed there the rest of the night.
    Dede is wondering what you mean by “next step”.?
    She said she has not been told what the next step will be or what will follow. We are not sure what you mean.

    Where’s Kyron, I hope that has helped answer some of your thoughts.”

    User ID: 1060460
    9/16/2010 5:12 AM

    “What Dede has heard about Rudy Sanchez (RS) from Terri ;
    She said that neither Terri or herself are convinced RS did something with Kyron but can see possible motive and opprotunity on his part.
    According to Dede sometime around last fall Terri told her that Kaine was continuing to pressure her to get more done around the house and property and that Terri was thinking of hiring a landscaper.
    Then later at the birthday party in march Terri told her that she had hired a landscaper and that he had assaulted her in a sexual manner. Terri then talked to her about RS trying to contact her afterwards by phone one morning while she was with a friend from the gym eating at a IHOP.
    This friend was also at terris birthday party, Terri had told her about RS and what had happened so she took the call for Terri and basically told RS to piss off and to quit calling and leave Terri alone.
    According to Dede when she stayed with Terri she told her more about her interaction with RS.
    Terri told the investigators about RS and what had happened, they left and investigated RS.
    He then later showed up at Terris trying to extort the 10G, which turned out to be the botched sting.
    According to Dede they both suspect RSs motive could be that his ” machismo” was insulted when Terri rejected his advances and theorize that RS may have taken Kyron as revenge.
    Considering his past record with children and his knowledge of the school grounds and operation, he would be comfortable there and if seen would be able to explained his being there rather easily because he had worked there.
    They theorize when LE investigated RS infront of his family he came up with the MFH proposal of him by Terri, and then didn’t have much choice but to play along with the sting operation set up by LE.
    He had to to save his own skin and keep his family, who is now unaccounted for. What happened to them and where is Rudy Sanches?

    Blink, like I said, I’m not accusing, I’m asking.
    Neither you nor DDS owe me anything even though I would like to see this issue addressed.

    Thank you.

    I think it is a fair question wpg, but to answer your question, that was never DeDe. That was the cousin who got information, was discovered to be posting things online that were case sensitive so he was cut off from info because he was blabbering, and then just making up crap.

    DDS has nothing to explain in this regard. And to your point, I do feel I owe you an answer.

  20. evie says:

    vw should be able to corroborate.. OLive is deleting comments directly discussing this post. WW hasn’t posted anything yet. I’m extremely interested in how the local media reacts.

  21. erose says:

    @Rose, Lordy, lordy, is right.

  22. erose says:

    @WPG, I want you to know I am on DY’s side. I too want to find Kyron. I think we need to accept this new information and see where it takes us. The old notions and tactics haven’t worked in three years, it just seems they cannot be the truth. The truth just doesn’t have to struggle so hard to work. KWIM? JMO.

  23. T. Ruth says:

    Rose says:
    September 4, 2013 at 9:45 pm

    Blink says:

    I can tell you that in my phone interview with him, I was very clear that the two were not close, more than once, fwiw.

    I thought he captured the sentiment overall, anxious to see how the O handles.



    IDK, I think Maxine may have retired.

  24. T. Ruth says:

    The moment we begin to fear the opinions of others and hesitate to tell the truth that is in us, and from motives of policy are silent when we should speak, the divine floods of light and life no longer flow into our souls. – Elizabeth Cady Stanton

    Interesting quote for a day that came up, just thought I’d share.

  25. matt g says:

    “PS. Kyron Horman, still missing.”

    Yes, he is, and TH can help with that. Time can make a person complacent and sadly no one will now know if that sting would have been successful or not, even idiots.

  26. A Texas Gramdfather says:


    I knew what I was reading from the story. I have children in LE and have many friends who are attorneys and judges.

    This behavior by LE and the county criminal justice system is the very thing that makes people have a bad taste in their mouth regarding the behavior and trust of our hired and elected public servants. This is shameful.

    I now know that my suspicions were correct. These people have an agenda to punish someone that may not have anything to do with the abduction of Kyron.

    Blink spoke in an earlier response that a new “Red” team needed to be put in place as fast as possible.

    If I were the State AG, there would be a team attacking this problem beginning at 7:00 A.M. in the morning. I would get orders from a judge to remove all in this jurisdiction from their jobs until cleared by an investigation. There would be a team of experienced investigators brought in to rework the entire case regarding Kyron.

    DeDe is still at risk until all these thugs have been neutralized. She needs to be very careful. If they issue another warrant, she should have someone with a video camera ready to record everything.

  27. SouthernMom says:

    @matt g says:

    September 4, 2013 at 11:43 pm

    “PS. Kyron Horman, still missing.”

    Yes, he is, and TH can help with that. Time can make a person complacent and sadly no one will now know if that sting would have been successful or not, even idiots.

    Surely you agree there are more likely successful candidates (those who have been in actual contact in less than 3 years) to successfully ‘surreptitiously’ ensnare TMH than DeDe. The sting thing has been tried more than once to no avail. IMO truly a strong MOOO regardless of outcome, LE would try again. Who knows how many other “stings” have been performed with no results, yet LE continues to pursue the “holy grail” with Terri. I NOW feel certain there are multiple unknown “unsuccessful” attempts to “sting” Terri. I hope LE soon realizes this will not be the successful route to getting the goods. If Terri is guilty, they will need the evidence. Their failed attempts to obtain an actual confession have been unsuccessful and at this point I feel certain her criminal attorneys could cite harassment in defense.

    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

  28. Oneilgirl75 says:

    So now we know DDS is not involved. I feel bad for her. I do. But as a mom all I want to know is if my children or any other children for that matter are safe from this SZ. If he does not tie into TH and she is actually innocent and knows nothing and that is a fact I feel as parents we have a right to know as parents of children is Oregon. What is to day this SZ won’t do this again?

  29. cd says:

    wpg says:
    September 4, 2013 at 5:22 pm
    Part of Desiree Young’s Hell on Earth for 3 years has been her frustration regarding beliefs about DDS and her not getting answers which did not allow her to move off that particular DDS road in trying to find the right road to Kyron.

    Compassion for Kyron should mean compassion for Desiree Young, imo.
    I have always believed that DY knew DeDe was not directly involved in Kyrons disappearance from the get go just as LE knew. I Noticed that DY never mentioned DeDe agin after the initial accusations aimed at DeDe by DY and Kaine through the press.
    It has always bothered me that DY was willing through the actions of her Facebook supporters to harass and cyber bully an innocent person and continue that harassment for 3 years.

  30. SouthernMom says:


    JUST IN CASE YOU NEED TO KNOW: ….please read above for my comments regarding my own personal opinion of “Whatever It TAKES!!!”

    Multnomah County Board of Commissioners
    Deborah Kafoury, District 1
    501 SE Hawthorne Blvd, Suite 600, Portland, OR 97214 Phone: 503-988-5220; Email Web:

    Oregon Governor Ted Kulongoski (D)
    State Capitol Building, 900 Court St NE, Room 250, Salem, OR 97301 Phone: 503-378-4582; Web:

    Oregon State Legislature
    900 Court Street, Salem, OR 97301 Web:
    Website provides information about legislative process, Assembly schedule, and text of Oregon Constitution and Oregon Revised Statutes.

    Oregon State Representative Mitch Greenlick (D), District 33
    Office Address: State Capitol Building, 900 Court St NE, H493, Salem, OR 97301 Phone: 503-986-1433; Email:; Web:
    District Address: 712 NW Spring Avenue, Portland, OR 97229 District Phone: 503-297-2416

    Oregon State Senator Suzanne Bonamici (D), District 17
    Capitol Address: 900 Court St. NE, S-403, Salem, OR, 97301. Phone: 503-986-1717
    District Office Address: PO Box 990, Beaverton, OR, 97075. Phone: 503-627-0246
    Email: Website:

    U.S. Representative Earl Blumenauer (D), District 3
    Capitol Address: 2267 Rayburn HOB, Washington, DC 20515 Office Phone: 202-225-4811; Fax: 202-225-8941 Email:; Web: District Address: 729 NW Oregon Street, Suite 115, Portland, OR 97232 District Phone: 503-231-2300; Fax 503-230-5413. Legislative correspondence should be sent to his D.C. office. Casework correspondence should be sent to Portland Office.

    U.S. Senator Jeff Merkley (D)
    Capitol Address: SDB-40B Dirksen Senate Office Bldg., Washington, DC 20510, Phone 202-224-3753, Fax 202-228-3997. Web:
    District Address: One World Trade Center, 121 SW Salmon St., #1250, Portland, OR 97204,
    Phone 503-326-3386, Fax 503-326-2900.

    U.S. Senator Ron Wyden (D)
    Office Address: 230 Dirksen Senate Office Building, Washington, DC 20510 Office Phone: 202-224-5244; Fax: 202-228-2717; Web:
    District Address: 700 NE Multnomah Street, Suite 450, Portland, OR 97232 District Phone: 503-326-7525

    U.S. President Barack Obama, 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington DC 20500 Comments: 202-456-1111; Fax: 202-456-2461; Email: Web:

    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

  31. Rose says:

    @wpg. Thank goodness for the puppy that keeps Blink up for nitetime relief.
    We know of failed Sting 1 (resulting in a toddler who abruptly lost brother also being severed from Mother)
    We speculated MC was Sting 2 (Kaine’s phone), and knew he had severe problems from his X.
    Neither were successful in wringing blood from a turnip.
    What could then be so important about proposed Sting 3 to be executed by someone TMH hadn’t heard from in 3 years? Only a fool would propose another sting. And what would be new to TMH or attorney that fools are on her tail?

    Blink more than ably responded, but in a nutshell, transparency matters when mcso engages in illegal, nay stupid, activity as recently as a month ago.

    To us, that means mcso is relying on gimmicks & tricks and not conducting a real investigation.

    And Detective 101. You do not talk to a thoroughly represented woman, herself formerly subject to potential inclusion in a civil suit, and still imo in jeopardy of a criminal charge (ie perjury), to propose any scheme without Counsel present.

    If I lived in Portland, I’d gather a “parents’ at the polls” League, network with other Reform special interest groups, hold well-advertised candidates’ Q nites, do poll site work on election day, and take on incumbants 1 by 1, starting with Sheriff position to a real reform candidate, moving on to school board (who’d ask real questions at Board mtgs of Carol & her frequent token principal Keefer), and eventually get to the DA if he doesn’t enact systemic reform. Then, there’s the Judges’ slate.

  32. SouthernMom says:

    For those that want something simple or need help….cut, paste, trash all together…it’s all good here. Please just write your leader (representative, congressman, etc.) to ask for his or her help in getting this one solved.

    Dear Honorable _____________:

    I am a resident of _______________, near the Skyline Elementary School where missing Kyron Horman disappeared.

    I am very concerned about the investigation of this missing child.

    There are numerous contradicting stories being told in main steam and social media.

    Please take time to investigate the disappearance of Kyron Horman and advocate resources to help Law Enforcement solve this case.

    The parents of this particular case have been allowed to influence reporting and local media regarding their personal theories of what could have happened in the disappearance of Kyron.

    While well intentioned I’m sure, I personally worry for all Skyline children’s safety, especially when LE has not updated the community on the facts of this case.

    Please take a few hours to focus on Kyron’s case and please assign one of your team to track and report on it’s progress.

    Those of us who consider this case an injustice of LE services anxiously await and anticipate the updates on the when, what, & where they are currently focusing.

    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

  33. SouthernMom says:

    Both my boys were required to read the “The Rag and Bone Shop” by Robert Cormier, for summer reading. A novel about an overzealous (with a reputation to uphold) interrogator who “always gets the confession” reputation. Must read and I don’t want to publish spoilers, but basically he does get his “confession”…whether true or NOT. ~ It happens….nearly everyday sadly!

    Wow…so considered reading it and I’d love to hear your thoughts on how it applies to this case and I’m sure sooooo many others. It seems as though I read weekly of cases where convicted felons are now cleared through DNA evidence of involvement to the crimes they’ve been convicted of but yet they always claimed innocence to.

    Prayers for Kyron and his family.

  34. cd says:

    wpg says:
    September 4, 2013 at 5:22 pm
    Compassion for Kyron should mean compassion for Desiree Young, imo.

    Why did DDS choose not to relieve Kyron’s Mother’s angst for 3, very long years in what could have been figured out to be in direct, private and credible communications with Desiree Young and counsel, but instead there is the appearance that she chose to participate in blogging on public sites behind other names, other people?

    I’m at a loss to understand this.
    I believe that DeDe told LE everything she knew when LE initially questioned her. Desiree was probably aware of everything DeDe said at the time.
    Problem was LE did not want to believe DeDe which meant DY although she probably knew what DeDe told investigators did not believe DeDe either.
    So what would DeDe been able to say to DY to make DY believe she was being truthful. DeDe’s truth was not something LE or DY were interested in hearing if it did not include evidence against TMH.

    Also I believe TJ = BS.

  35. Rose says:

    @ATG re “DeDe is still at risk until all these thugs have been neutralized. She needs to be very careful. If they issue another warrant, she should have someone with a video camera ready to record everything.” Yup.

    Keep in mind ATG iirc the OR State AG is WW Owner’s wife from Goldschmidt’s synagogue. (could be wrong).
    This is the Texas justice system of the 50s imo, intertwined with business, unions, & press–all self-interested.

    @SouthernMom, I shared my opinion on last thread the PTA Exec & leadership knew the Matthews/Room 109
    back story from their principal, because principals do share such facts with a request of silence to their Execs.
    and, knowing the truth, with safety policies implemented, they’ve laid back, in part to protect school rep & viability.
    Neighbor & others made the point here years ago Skyline parents had moved on.

  36. Rose says:

    There was a wonderful story & panel
    on npr today (I hear on wamu)
    on teaching your teenagers how to
    respond to LE if stopped & questioned.

    I left my LD 22 yo in car, ac/motor/radio running,
    and he really reacted when I unknowingly shut radio
    off on return to car. He was much taken with the story.

    I never thot to train my two on this what to do if in a security
    guard or police stop. The interviewer pointed out black mothers do have
    this conversation.

    While the storyline was geared to autism & MR, this is
    training every child needs, as the LE stops referenced were far
    from benign & resulted in death in cases. The mother on the panel
    remained unrealistic to the end (just visit a friendly police
    station was her cure)

  37. Mom3.0 says:

    Reposting w/addition inorder to keep it all together- Sorry for the confusion-

    Wow just wow is right

    De De must be some kind of lady to drop everything and run to support just a one time casual friend- to stand strong inspite of the scrutiny in spite of the seeming threats of LE and all the rest..

    I hope this piece will aid in bringing Kyron home it certainly will help to keep his name out there.

    I commend De De for speaking here- and I congratulate Blink on the scoop-

    Blink were you able to live up to your hope of being the kind of reporter to ask the hard questions, or was that task harder than expected?

    I wish little Kyron had such a staunch advocate as De De appears to have been for Teri- an advocate who was not steered by bias who seemingly cared little for themselves and put someone in need above all else.

    Sadly it seems kyron is more often left to stand alone, or merely used as a backdrop in the ongoing battle over just who has suffered more in this case… BTW a battle which poor little Kyron never seems to win …and we all know that just cant be-

    So i commend De De for saying she doesnt wish this to be a Pity party for her…

    With that in mind I will begin

    I dont mean to be the fly in the ointment but to me I can not fault LE for centering in on De De in the beginning and wondering where she was or if she were helping Terri-

    De De says she was in a way missing right? She was called and could not hear and worked thru lunch…and has a witness

    Blink did you find the carts/pottery guy and confirm De Des story?

    I hope so, because frankly proof in this case seems lacking & (anyones) even LEs word that they have cleared a person and moved on would not be enough for me, nor are LD

    We all know Lie detectors are useless – unless ofcourse you choose to believe the results based on ones own leanings in a particular case…

    For instance, Those that believe Terri lied will cont to do so & Those that believe DE DE “beat it” will cont to so- much like the WM3 case and the many Lie detector findings there…

    Perhaps De De should beseech LE much like Nathan McDonald did in the Isabel Celis case- just ask them to write a letter on her behalf stating There thanks and that they think she acted in an appropriate way as a good Samaritan and a one time friend and neighbor to a mom in need (Terri)- going further to state they regret any and all scrutiny which befell Ms. Spicher and they do not think she is worthy of any negative commentary whatsoever.

    good job Blink
    thanks Ms Spicher
    For the life of me I cant understand why everyone is so Yay over this

    De De herself says she does not trust lie detectors- and even if she did she does not trust the law enforcement officers who relay the findings…

    According to her she does not believe Terri failed the tests twice

    So why is she and most here so gung ho to pass on the notion that she passed… as if passing means definitely yes she IS telling the truth…

    And just like with her Nonexistent 5th amendment shoutouts in the depo we still dont know much

    We now have De De’s “side of the story” sure

    She claims police were bullying her but how?
    By asking the same questions over and over? By still hoping she would answer them?

    which story is true as she has spoke out before has she not?

    To be cont

    For clarification purposes, Nathan MacDonald may or may not be a cleared individual in the Celis case- my conversation with LE will not clear him, and not acknowledge the letter he presented so I have no idea what the status is except to say he is a freak stalker about 3 seconds away from a cease and desist and that is my polite answer.

    Outside of that point, I am not really sure I understand your position on the piece Mom3.0.

    They threatened to charge the woman with anything – I would say that constitutes bullying.


  38. Mom3.0 says:

    Cont Part 2

    Was that De DE who gave the People magazine interview? For if it was then for goodness sake De De didnt seem to need a lawyer to give that interview and it seems it contradicts some of what she has told Blink

    A longtime friend of Terri’s, Spicher stayed with her for 11 days beginning June 28, shortly after Terri’s wife Kaine left her. “When Terri’s parents had to leave to go back home, they asked if I would stay with her to help keep her safe,” she says. “And I said of course I would.”

    She continues: “I dropped everything I was doing, and I went to see what my friend needed. And that’s when I learned she had been served with the divorce papers, there was a restraining order and a story about a murder-for-hire or something. So, it was clear that she was very distraught.”

    end snip

    It would seem De De is not telling the truth about the extent of her friendship with Terri or the People reporters just got it wrong- although I myself wouldnt think a casual friend would be asked to stay and protect Teri nor would i think a causal friend would accept such a duty…

    Casual friends dont drop everything casual friends dont remain silent in a depo not for info that is already available thru paid interviews-

    So how is it courageous that De De remained silent and plead the 5th as kryon was still missing and his mamma still pleads for any info?

    Why still today not sit down w/ Desiree and LE and answer the depo questions and any others after all LE has “cleared” you?

    Why remain silent for 3 years – was itto protect a grown woman a casual friend one that you yourself can not say is 100% not guilty- but that you do feel couldnt do something like this because she is a friend…
    But wait he friendship is only casual….
    Or wait it isnt

    Snipped quote;

    “There’s this horror that my friend is going through,” she says. “If I thought for a second that she was capable of [foul play], I would not have been there. She would not have been my friend in the first place.”

    end snip-

    So im sorry but which is it is De De a long time friend of terri one that knows terri is incapable of doing this or is terri merely a casual friend that De De hopes couldnt do this?

    Although yes I am right there with you all in thanking ms Spicher for speaking with Blink to clear her name…. I however do not share everyones kudos on a job well done.

    Did De De hamper the investigation did she advise her friends and neighbors and Terri to not speak to the “bullying” cops- at least not without a lawyer present?
    This advice can hamper an investigation- especially one that is looking to find a missing child.
    As A daughter of law enforcement de de knew this advice would slow down the investigation and the ability of LE to move on to other witnesses and theories…

    As a friend of Terri she also should have known what it means to a mother to lose her child- She comforted her friend terri in her time of “crisis mode” and protected her during her fear- why remain silent when her voice could have helped another Mom ( desiree) going thru the same
    To be cont


  39. Nelmel says:

    If you refuse to admit that you can make mistakes, you should not be cops.

    1000% accurate. I have family members that are career law enforcement. I have spent the last 2 years working on my advance degree along side many current or retired LE or Fed agents. They have the hardest jobs out there, imo. That said, it is my opinion that if you cannot let go of a theory and start all over if the evidence and facts do not support it you have no business investigating a smash and grab- let alone a missing child. For me, the behavior of the DA (Frink) was the most shocking of all.

    Spicher was terrified by his actions. I want to make sure that everyone is clear on that. She believed that LE was set to find or make up anything to charge her with once Frink pulled that stunt and I do not blame her. If you recall, her lawyer openly stated that he believed TH would be arrested, and privately his retainer was deemed a pre-indictment representation. Spicher had limited funds at the time, put out $5K she really could not afford but more than that was openly vilified and still is to this day.

    Even then, she continued to meet with LE with her lawyer present and gave them anything they had ever asked for. For that imo, she is a better woman than I would ever be because once I knew that the truth did not matter I would have told them to go pound sand and filed a bar complaint against Frink.


  40. erose says:

    @Mom3.0., Respectfully, I am “yay” over this because I think we are finally picking up some momentum to move in the right direction. The very fact that DDS testified in front of the grand jury says it all for me. The DA was willing to exchange the immunity of DDS to once and for all pin this on TH. If she had said anything of value, to further LE’s theory, there would be an indictment of TH. LE played there last card, and when that didn’t work, they tried to get DDS to roll the dice on another sting. Additionally, the civil case would not be dropped and the divorce case would not be moving ahead on equitable grounds for the first time ever.

    IMO, the hand writing is on the wall. What if you *can’t* tell LE what they want to hear, because what they want to hear isn’t the truth? What if you *can’t* help LE, because their idea of help is not what you have within your realm to offer? I know we’re both here for Kyron with just a different perspective. Peace to you. All JMO.

  41. Mom3.0 says:

    Cont part 3

    Hi Blink- just read your response so want to comment quickly-
    I am not saying Nathan McDonald is or is not still a POI and I definitely am not condoning his attititude or tactics-

    what i am saying is it should be relatively easy for DeDe to follow NM lead and get LE to publicly clear her and go further to state what was said in NM letter, yet they have not and according to the Foxs article– Beautiful picture of you BTW and awesome segment-

    Thank you friend, but I have been advised not to discuss the NM issue, but if I could, I would at least say that the two situations are grossly dissimilar.

    Who says they threatened to charge her with anything Blink?

    She does– and she says the police were bullies and she says— and she says she is telling the truth
    and I understand you believe her and i am not saying I dont
    BUT I am not willing to take her word as the be all end all you know? and i am not willing to call her courageous when she sat silent … and that in no way detracts from your interview or your hard work or your belief to the contrary… I hope you understand

    But she did not ever “sit silent”- what does that mean to you? With counsel, she went through numerous LE interviews, she went on the property to re-enact, how is that silent? To be completely honest, if I had not confirmed that DeDe was represented at all times while this was going on, in addition to the meeting where they asked her lawyer to leave the room and told her she could not consult with her own attorney, I am not sure I could have published this interview if it was simply her word v theirs, in fact I am pretty sure that my legal folks would have nixed it. That said, I believed her before I knew about the polygraph, but I could not act responsibly on that good faith without corroboration.

    I am in no way taking any scrutiny personally. It comes with the territory. What I would like to impart though, is that I think proper scrutiny has been applied to this woman and she has no obligation to further prove anything to anyone in my mind. It is my understanding that Ms. Spicher’s attorney intends to release a statement.


    Blink wrote;
    Word spread quickly that law enforcement was after anyone who knew, might have known, or had any dealings with Terri Horman. The term used to describe law enforcement’s behavior toward potential witnesses was “bullying. ”


    Wait- is it uncommon for LE to want to speak to everyone who knew the step parent of a missing child a parent who was the last to see kyron a parent who was being looked into as a POI?

    Why the terminology of “LE was after” and “bullying” as wanting to sit down with these potential witnesses seems prudent to me….

    Besides Unless I am missing something De De did not know whether or not she held important info- and she did not know if her friends and neighbors were innocent or whether or not they might have had helpful time sensitive info to relay to the police also

    That characterization was used by another witness whom I did not interview, but who was repeatedly interviewed without an appointment, at their place of employment, initially without counsel and also had been willing to meet with LE without a lawyer until such time as that behavior/activity where they were treated as a suspect not a possible witness ensued. Again, this person gave all information they could, but while I am not willing to quote them, this is not investigative behavior to create cooperative witneses- which is an obligation of an investigator.

    You are not missing anything, Dede did not know if anything she had was important to the investigation or not of course, so she agreed to an interview with an attorney present. She has been a defacto suspect until she took a polygraph that she was absolutely bullied into, imo. The issue here is that once she met with LE, they simply did not believe her although as I point out, they never had any reason not to as the investigation progressed.

    So why are we commending De De for remaining silent and for potentially advising others to do the same?

    Again, I am not understanding the reference by anyone that she was silent, that is simply false.

    Why are we glad about this?
    Think of it as if De De was George or Cindy or Lee Anthony-

    If George hadnt spoken to LE to the grand Jury where would the case have been?
    Now that is a post within a post response so I will simply say that a suspect was in custody for some time prior to George appearing before the grand jury and George was not considered a suspect or told he might be at any time. Had he been, through his attorney he would have invoked. Conversely DeDe appeared in July 2010 and was not called or asked any questions. She appeared again in July 2013 for 5 1/2 hours.

    Heck even the family they did not refuse to speak to LE without counsel- although they did frequently change stories…
    And even w/ lawyers they did not hide behind their 5th amendment rights during their depos….

    I am not seeing an available comparison here. Oranges and goat cheese, imo.

    As for De De refusing to be part of a sting- that would be crazy?
    How so? Tony L Caseys boyfriend did it- without his help how stinted would the investigation have been?

    Again her lawyer was speaking to LE with out her present just what do you think they discussed? And De De agreed to speak with LE alone and lied to them when she said she would remain silent….
    Yet she did pass a Ldetector test…

    What? How did she lie to them? That is patently false. They ORDERED her not to discuss the conversation with her attorney, which btw, is not legal potentially, worthy of sanction and actionable based on outcome.
    And that is without knowing the true intent behind the request.

    Food for thought: Did they have a warrant in place for that request even? I doubt that highly. The only person that could or should discuss what was said during the conversation between le and Stavley outside of Spicher’s presence should come from him. But I can say that at no time was the attorney, who most certainly never waived any of his or his clients rights, told of the request by le by le.
    If you are ok on LE breaching the laws under the Oregon Constitution they are tasked with protecting to potentially infringe on yet another’s some more- I am not. But to be clear, Spicher never, ever committed to not discuss anything with her atty. Frankly, and this is just my opinion, I believe that they asked to speak to the atty first to give DeDe the impression that he was ok with it so she would commit on the spot.

    Lastly- you do realize that if she had obeyed their “orders” and participated without her counsel’s knowledge it would absolutely be suppressed if it ever had any evidentiary value anyway. Not just that, all the ensuing investigative data it “spawned.” Nothing but planting a poisonous tree.

    How is that not an egregious misuse of resources in the first place? You do realize that your views on LE tactics here are the antithesis of your feedback from the WM3 case, and that is ok, I am just wondering why?

    Anyyone who has read my posts on Kyrons threads knows i am not accusing Anyone of harming Kyron – But I am not willing to exonerate anyone either
    as I do not have all the facts or info and as Blink so aptly said Kryon is still missing.

    Just because there is a SZ does not mean that anyoneelse is cleared does it?
    Of course not.

    WPG i share your concerns
    To be cont

    Respectfully submitted in bold

  42. Rose says:

    ATG on this State’s AG

    As is the Oregon/Goldschmidt/Kitzhaber way, Gov appoints after a planned resignation, then the candidate later wins the election.
    Prior guy had been in job 6 years & had announced he’d not run in 2012.

    Likely she knew in 2010 she was going after this Kitzhaber appointment.
    The question is what fealty K owed and owes to mcso or DA?

    Her husband the WW owner must have been supportive of her ambition back to mid-2010.
    my opinion only.
    omits the fact her judicial career was kicked off as a Goldschmidt appointee, which this article mentions:

    Is she a fabulous attorney, judge, and probably AG? Yes.

    Is she the AG to reform Mult Cty legal institutions? No. Her career was built on appointments of Goldschmidt & Kitzhaber.

    IMO reform is over to the DOJ or the ballot box. WW will not call for it wrt interlocking Judges, DA, & MCSO behaving in bad faith in this case. Not will the AG go after old colleagues like Meisenheimer.

  43. Mom3.0 says:

    Cont part 4

    Blink once wrote:

    “According to several sources, DeDe Spicher, Terri’s roommate post Kaine’s restraining order, was working in a garden near the Horman home the day of Kyron’s disappearance when she received a call at approximately 11:15 am. She left abruptly, returning at approximately 1:00 pm. DeDe was unreachable on her cell phone during that time and the property owner became concerned. Spicher is a long time friend and workout companion of Horman’s.”

    So was De De a long time friend, or was she a casual one time friend?

    As I wrote.

    Did Blink confirm there was no phone call at 11:15 am. from her boss one from terri at what time? Was De De on sight the whole time or was she missing? Did LE find the witness pottery guy or not?
    Did De De return at approximately 1:00 pm to the house for lunch? or was this the time period she had rushed to terri side?

    What? She never rushed to anyone’s side, and as I wrote in the piece, there was no communication between the two since the bday in march. There was no communication between them on June 4th and they did not see each other. This was a part of DeDe’s polygraph, which she passed.

    During the depos De DE was asked if she ever gave LE her phone records emails to LE Was there a call @ approximatly 1130 from her boss- was there another from terri- did her phone prove to be at that location turned on in the truck? IDK

    As I wrote in the piece, it was confirmed via cell records.

    In the piece it says LE had a warrant for electronic devices only… were other belongings taken IIRC 3 boxes were shown being removed from De Des home… all of that was electronic stuff?
    Now that she has been unofficially cleared will she be able to get those items returned

    Was only 3 electronic items, all returned a few weeks later.

    IS De De willing to answer all the questions in the depo now?

    The suit was dismissed in July, why would she need to answer anything?
    What questions in particular do you feel remain unanswered to date in light of this interview?

    and last was De De paid for this interview blink and was her lawyer present?

    I gotta be honest. This, I take personally and you have offended me, and there is no other way for me to say that.
    I am not intending to disrespect you, but you questioning my integrity is out of line, period.

    To answer your question, no. Neither Ms. Spicher NOR myself were paid for this interview and I do not discuss the legal arrangements we make as protocol for same, but everyone’s interests were considered and protected. I would also like to point out that much of the People article had some creative input, and spicher did not write it.

    As a result, for my piece, Spicher was so concerned about it’s factual accuracy that she asked if she could preview it for quote approval and fact checking purposes only; which she did.

    Blink thanks for giving us all the space to think and question no matter where we end up or for how long…
    as always i reserve the right to change my opinion at any time-

    I look forward to your next installments
    DE DE i look forward to you further clearing your name

    I don’t know what that means but it would seem she has. Clearly not in your mind apparently, and that is your right to believe- I support that 100%.

    You know I do not need you to agree with me or the piece and you know I expect you to shred anything that is not nailed down for alternative thought. I get that. You know I am quite fond of you as well.

    So I hope you take this in the spirit of which it is intended but My dear Lady- WHAT is up with you lately?



  44. Rose says:

    @Mom 3.0. with respect, not into a long convo, DDS’ response to a text from her acquaintance was typical of the women in my church singles group–the oldies but goodies (I married at 35). We were naive, warmhearted, & responded to needy people (all too often, needy men). And keep in mind, at issue was a distraught person whose stepson just suffered horrific abduction, whose husband had left her, whose daughter was taken.
    Many mid-30s women would’ve responded to a call of need in a red hot minute.

  45. MockingbirdSings says:

    Suppose a new LE ship. christened “The Case Against TH”, launched shortly after June 4th, 2010. Early on, the destination (guilty verdict) and course were quickly determined and although various crew members and associates have come and gone during the journey, the ship continues on its way without a review. Maps, weather forecasts, radar, communications, etc., are used only to maintain the course, never to consider whether there are better options.

    Through this blog we have attempted to (1) verify whether the original destination still exists, (2) point out the storms, the sharks, and the holes developing in the sides of the ship, not to mention the decreasing food supply, (3) offered to assist, (4) suggested other ports to consider. We have even learned to sail the sea ourselves in order to better understand and explain how to help – and still we are rejected.

    At times we are not even sure who the true captain of this ship is, but the seagulls continue to follow along as though they know something we don’t.

    It appears to me that if we cannot get the crew’s attention, we will have to drain the ocean. IMO, eliminating DDS as a suspect is the first step in reducing the water level.

    In other words, perhaps if, instead of looking for the guilty person(s), we focused on clearing everyone we possibly could, there would be fewer distractions to finding the bottom feeders. If the ship sinks in the process, so be it.

    I don’t know if that’s even possible, but strangely enough, it makes sense to me tonight.

  46. MockingbirdSings says:

    PS – well written, Blink.

  47. thanks, mom 3.0, you have kinda summed up some of the same things I was feeling tonite.

  48. Dale says:

    B wrote: Dale, your facts are incorrect. TH did not fail a second polly, and she did not retain counsel until after she was served with a RO. Again, the angers are misplaced but with the same goal. Gotta figure out how to come together and not divide folks.
    My facts are correct in that she stopped the 2nd test and stormed out when she knew she was again flunking the test…If a subject is being tested on a polygraph and they get mad and leave, what does that say? That she passed it??? No…A common sense, neutral as I could be, standpoint, it made her look all the more guilty…Also the RO and her Attorney were sure in close proximity, she knew the best Defense Attorney to call and had the money to hire him and post bail, if needed, all set up…
    As far as this blog, it is biased and shines a light on DeDe as being 100 percent clean handed…It is VERY implied TH is innocent. Innocent of what exactly??? If she is truly innocent then she is guilty of obstructing Justice. DeDe did as well…Like I said, the purpose of a Polygraph is to eliminate the suspects…The Police have been stopped dead in their tracks with the secrecy that shrouded TH, the dirty phones, sexting, the failure to even do fund drives to search for Kyron…I have worked in LE and as a paralegal and I can say that most of the time when an Attorney tells their client to keep their mouth shut, the guilty ones always do. It is usually the innocent ones that fight for vindication. I have seen neither from both these ladies…Now, please explain the contradictions that DeDe made, about being a casual friend to stating being close friends??? Which is it??? That is very very crucial for LE to know in order to move forward on the case…I have seen this turned into a circus all at the expense of a little boy and a grieving family looking for closure…

  49. erose says:

    @Mom3.0. wrt your part 2, it is the fault of the DA that DDS did not speak before the grand jury in 2010. She appeared, but was never called. I have to assume they did not call her because by virtue of her testimony she would have received limited immunity, and they did not want to give her immunity back then as they believed she was TH’s accomplice.

    She only plead the 5th during the civil case. I assume this was on the advice of her attorney. The strategy would be to have a witness say something in a civil case that wouldn’t to the letter match what she might say in a criminal case. It could be something very innocuous such as the color of the shirt she was wearing on June 4th, and if that did not match to the letter in the criminal case, (which could be ten years from now) then she could be prosecuted for perjury. It is her lawyers job to protect her from that.

    The information that she had, she shared with LE. It would have been the same information that she shared in July with the grand jury and it would have been the same information that she could have shared before the grand jury in 2010. So, if any one is to blame for her testimony being delayed for 3 years, it’s the DA.

    With respect, I think what you are missing is that they were gunning for her, so it was not simply just a matter of her just telling the truth to help DY, or refusing to tell the truth and hurting DY. She told the truth, and they didn’t believe her. What more does an innocent person do?

  50. AlbaLass says:

    frightening piece in the UK Daily Mail online yesterday.

    a controlled experiment with children who were well versed in ‘stranger danger”. Not only did 7 out of 9 children leave with a “stranger’ – it took on average 90 SECONDS for the perp to get the child to leave with them.

    here is the link – apologies if I don’t get it to work.–took-just-90-seconds-persuade-them.html

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