Dr. Phil Show Hosts Missing Portland Child Kyron Horman’s Step Mom Terri Horman Over Two Episodes
I have been covering this case since Kyron Horman disappeared from Skyline School in June, 2010. Like most missing persons cases I have covered in the past, I am of the strong opinion that best efforts at the truth are the only way to propel investigations that, similarly to Kyron’s, have gone cold for one reason or another. This approach has worked in resolving some of my previous cases. I am proud of that. I remain steadfast to the integrity involved in those and future cases.
Over the past 10 months (or so) I have been developing an updated series on Kyron’s case to include my multiple interviews with Kyron’s step-mom, Terri Horman. Needless to say as she was the subject of at least three simultaneous cases before an Oregon court and remains a person of interest by the agency investigating her sons disappearance, this has been an arduous and sometimes delicate journey. Ms. Horman’s experiences during the ongoing investigation of the disappearance of Kyron Horman are critically important to propelling his case and with great hope- finding the truth about what happened to this cherubic and innocent child. There are dozens of sources, collateral interviews, forensic experts and legal analysts that also contribute to my series and have done so because of their belief that my motivation is to bring to light information and opinions in such a way that would almost “require” a focused review of Kyron’s case and the likely shaking of that proverbial tree everyone talks about.
Set to publish about 6-ish weeks ago I was asked to postpone the first installment of the series, which I did. I subsequently learned Ms. Horman was participating in the Dr. Phil program after she completed taping. Dr. Phils producers were well aware that Ms. Horman had interviewed with me extensively, and anticipated my series would be publishing information that was not known to the public previously in the days prior to her scheduled episode. When Ms. Horman conveyed to me that she feels obligated to speak out about “her son” in any national medium that will have her, I most certainly respected that. I still do.
While Dr. Phil seems like a gregarious fellow for sure, I have zero interest in being associated with his program, nor do I believe his shows content is designed to do any furtherance of investigation or truth. There is much concern (although I have no affiliation to the show whatsoever) that the timing of the publication of my series on the Kyron Horman matter might be interpreted differently or inadvertently contribute to the programs content or audience reactions. Not what I signed on for. A missing 7 year old boy six years running is not a framework for entertaining a target audience. He is not fodder for online social media bully campaigns- yet it occurs.
I will be publishing my series on Kyron’s case at a later date, in it’s entirety with no editing adjustments as a result of any of the appearances on Dr. Phil. I appreciate your patience and your understanding. Feel free to discuss the show below.
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OK, picking some minds here, was there ever a search done at the Angell Quarry off of highway 30? I’m not seeing one, but someone else might remember. That quarry, I’m not sure was in use when Kyron went missing. Perhaps it was in the middle of changing ownership? IDK, was just wondering about it, as there seemed to be searches done elsewhere near there.
Not sure T. Ruth.
I have been interested in Rainbow Lake off 30- not necessarily for Kyron per se- but evidence?
B
ot https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sheriff-jayme-closs-found-alive-suspect-in-custody_us_5c3803bce4b05cb31c410d93
Thank God she is alive!!
This is one creepy offender that requires a great deal of analysis, imo. That said, she was clearly his target with no known established tie to her to date. What do we learn from this case to further or solve others?
B
have been minimally thinking the last 2-3 weeks that the simplest explanation consistent w/evidence is a starting point, and I accept the given that Kyron’s was an opportunistic sexually (or darker) motivated abduction. the primary evidence at the time (who last saw Kyron and where and why he left the bldg) was teacher Esther Mathews nodding permission for Kyron to leave her room to assist a man, who requested him, to carry something(s) in. We tended to tie said delivery to the science fair, maybe a parent, with goods relating to it, or to enterprises on site due to the Green Team or the solar grant. Having lived across from an el ed’s cafeteria & delivery doors for over 3 decades, I tend to think the first group to rule out would be deliveries that are ordinary and routine to the school from County Pub School vehicles for County purposes, and the “delivery man” would not have timed it for the SF, but simply encountered the SF. In my case, office supplies go in the front door to the top level where the office is. Cafeteria supplies and custodial supplies go in the lower level, cafeteria level door either into the cafeteria itself or into an adjacent door to a classroom corridor which the janitor uses to remove trash and receive supplies for cleaning etc. when there is a big event, parents park their vehicles in this area where they otherwise would not park, because it is a blacktop used at recess.
So, I am wondering if any of the genius bar inhabitants here, who are more organized than I, might have a link to the hopefully still available black and white architect schema of the school interior that shows the cafeteria (which I recall as right up the hall from Mathews’ room) and the janitor’s storage closet that would store cleaning supplies?
Which parking would access the lower level nearest the cafeteria (I’m pretty sure regular deliveries would be to the same level as the cafeteria, downstairs). Is it on the blacktop in the rear where that little playground was? There was an entry door there too wasn’t there? But was it to upstairs or down.
Was the door by Mathews’ room the only door directly servicing the downstairs ingress?
If so, I think routine deliveries to Skyline that were nonOffice from the County PS vehicles, as well as their drivers and subs should have been identified and alibis scrubbed. Did any retire or resign soon after, was one a sub who didn’t come back?
Blink posited early Suspect O (was that what we called him?) could get rapidly to a bolthole. That is exactly what Jake Patterson in WI had and did, only an hour away but rural and isolated. Did any PPS delivery driver to Skyline have access to a rural isolated home in property records for counties within an hour’s drive?
Interesting the Barron Sheriff said Gordon and this rural suburb were never on his horizon.
Anyway, I’d love to see that scheme of Skyline again, the blueprint itself that was on line.
Let me posit a question to your questions, lol, if I may.
Let’s agree that even if after several years no new “eyes” were used to review/recommend Kyron’s cold case file, once “new” eyes were engaged to do just that- wouldn’t you start with information previously unavailable to you that very well might “skew” your thoughts on what you already had? He disappeared from the school- on that EVERYONE agrees. SO therefore, school is ground zero, correct? Last known witness to have an exchange with him, also witnessed by others in the classroom, was Easter Matthews. Ms. Matthews was deposed by Steven Houze. Hello- your first order of business is not to pull any civil depositions of your named witnesses and in some instances those that had appeared before the grand jury as well?
I say again- unless Kyron is recovered in another jurisdiction, I have zero hope his case will ever be solved in Multnomah County. This case needs to go the FBI and his parents need to champion that effort.
B
One might just call Jake Patterson a Suspect Zero.
They happen.
———
such a SZ was never on the
Barron Sheriff’s horizon, apparently.
———-
The parents will never advocate for an FBI takeover.
Kaine is comfortable.
Desiree is psychotic about Terri.
He was a SZ until he was caught- absolutely. No known or discovered relational tie to the victims whatsoever until he told LE- it is patterning as textbook so far from that perspective. SO much more to learn though about how this offender escalated and I wont even know if I believe him until all the facts are in. I am particularly curious about his Dad transferring ownership of the cabin 8 days after the murder of her parents- is that supposed to be a coincidence?
B
regarding: “wouldn’t you start with information previously unavailable to you that very well might “skew” your thoughts on what you already had?“
Are you saying Mathews’ Civil Deposition in the divorce case, as well as her & other
witnesses’ Grand Jury testimonies, have been unavailable to, and thus not utilized by,
the MCSO deputies who have been, and are currently assigned to, investigate this abduction?
I am saying they never requested them from the civil file. To my knowledge, LE would never have access to gj testimony, which also to my knowledge was not recorded in 2010.
B
This Rainbow Lake?
https://www.co.yamhill.or.us/content/charles-metsker
No Ma’am. From memory it is a reservoir off route 30- possibly adjacent to Sauvie? Multnomah Channel mile #17
B
did kyron ever visit: https://campyamhill.org
re “ I have zero hope his case will ever be solved in Multnomah County” What skin does Reese have in this investigation other than not wanting Gates, Smith, & Gosson to look like fools? (The ones who’ve had the case under him. Unless he’s just incompetent at directing investigations like the last Sheriff. Wasn’t Reese promoted up in PPB from Patrol Supervision in a precinct? One notes Desiree’s Detective Relentless/Aggressive as she characterized him with joy a few years aho does not appear on the Org Chart as having moved up the ladder.
I presume that is a very wide berth if they got it wrong and ultimately would have to admit that very publicly- its an instant civil award of the gazillion variety. MCSO is well aware of that- as well as the fact that getting it wrong in a negligent way could very well mean an offender is free to offend again. I have personally promised them if that happens I will be on the front steps of the court house on every major network calling them out- true story.
An important note here- I maintain that the FBI, in their work on the case, does not share the MCSO prime suspect and that has been admitted to me personally.
B
Patterson saw her boarding a school bus w/“instant attraction.”
(Just call him fatal attraction.)
——-
If you wanted to rule out evidence findable perhaps by search at Rainbow Lake, that suggests you or another person posited a definite SZ with ties to Rainbow Lake who also had at least once espied Kyron & was potentially fatally attracted.
——
imo Desiree’s TV shows, Walsh & ilk, are so boring compared to your mind.
No rose, not at all that “intellectual” of a reason (sorry to disappoint, lol) for me it had to do with some work I did with a geo spatial analyst on Kyron’s case. Location + possible profile aspects + hunch + accessible body of water at junction of interest- not tied to any SZ to my knowledge.
B
“n fact, Jean Ann Van Krevelen a friend and “mentor” of Dede Spicher has used RS Landscape Maintenance on a few occasions, leaving positive reviews on the ServiceMaster listing which deleted his business from the site on 6/21/10. Heather Walters, owner of Rosemont Farm,which is not West Wind Farm, where Dede Spicher was working the morning of June 4th and out of reach by phone from approximately 90 minutes, has never met Terri Horman or heard of their family prior to Kyron’s disappearance. When I asked her if she knew Rudy Sanchez or if she ever hired his firm to work at WWF, she replied “not that I recall, no, but we did have a blackberry clean up a few years ago so it is possible.” http://blinkoncrime.com/2010/09/09/kyron-horman-missing-case-review-and-birthday-wishes-to-the-frog-prince/comment-page-1/
So Rosemont Farm is in Yamhill, & Walters knew Rudy & had her own blackberry bush cleanup?
was Heather owner?
seems a family ownership
http://www.hoodrivernews.com/obituaries/2015/jan/30/kevin-walters/
listing last updated July 2010?
https://www.localharvest.org/rosemont-century-farm-M29800
Kevin Walters 2007 obit said to donate to
https://www.gofundme.com/Rosemont-Farm
but that goes back to a bust project by heather n.
Is this place still in operation?
gazillion farms in McMinnville.
https://www.localharvest.org/mcminnville-or/farms
Did the eco warriors in the 2009-10 Skyline
pta contract with for any specific locally-sourced
produce to the 2009-10 Skyline cafeteria?
https://www.localharvest.org/mcminnville-or/farms
btw J Griffiths, pta honcho of yore, is on
on the Skyline PS Real Teacher list.
hoping ATG & his missus are well
Rose, Here is a map. Not the best that we have had though. Someone did a great walk thru once upon a time.
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&id=181681980C66897C29424CF3125E3BA3B1143E62&thid=OIP.QhSnENkSP2SL-Qn5PNJzNgHaJ4&mediaurl=http%3A%2F%2Fi231.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fee226%2Facreesefamily%2FPhotos%2FSkylineElem.jpg&exph=800&expw=600&q=Skyline+Elementary+School+portland&selectedindex=19&cbir=sbi&ajaxhist=0&vt=0&eim=1,2,6
Amazing story about Jayme. God Bless her.
Blink, Would you call this an obsession? I often think Kyron was “spotted” in a similar way.
snip>
Patterson first spotted Jayme while he was on his way to work one day. He was stopped behind a school bus and watched her board it, according to the complaint. He told authorities he had no idea who Jayme was, but said that “he knew that was the girl he was going to take.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/jayme-closs-describes-the-night-her-parents-were-killed-and-her-88-days-in-captivity/ar-BBSfypX?ocid=spartanntp
erose- unfortunately I cannot say- I can say that without being able to identify the individual Kyron left with, its a possibility.
B
Rose, You are spot on with your first impression. Can you remember your first thoughts regarding Kyron?
snip>
Rose says:
November 5, 2018 at 11:05 am
re Closs, NYT article. At first I saw the abductor as a local, psychotically
fixated on the girl, who preplanned the abduction & an off grid hidey hole
who eliminated rival love objects (parents).
http://blinkoncrime.com/2016/09/21/dr-phil-show-hosts-missing-portland-child-kyron-hormans-step-mom-terri-horman-over-two-episodes/comment-page-111/#comment-2263223
googling Rudy Sanchez blackberry bush removal,
one gets this but it can’t be opened & likely is in the missing thread that entirely disappeared:
“Blink On Crime » Rudy Sanchez
blinkoncrime.com › rudy-sanchez › feed
It is no secret that Oregon has seen it’s share of corruption allegations in ….. that he cleared some blackberry or blueberry bushes similar to Ms. Von Klevelen, and …”
——-
I was wondering where Rudy dumped/disposed
of/burned? all those blackberry byshes he pulled.
——
one would think btw if a woman pointed to Rudy as the sole person she’d had conflict with (besides Kaine) & he’d attacked her physically w/baby in arms, he’d accuse her of anything to get off the hook in a child abduction for which he had a revenge motive.
hadn’t seen this before:
http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/DeDe-watermarked-1.pdf
haven’t read the whole thing.
First impression: How can Elden & Devlin do this depo with a straight face.
Second impression: misogynists
Last impression: Elden’s ignorance is an insult to gardeners (like I
grew to be in late 3Os) everywhere.
I bit the bullet & finished the depo.
esp p32ff led to my
Impression: Chad Stavley is way competent.
Spicher is smart.
Soldier likely got Spicher’s employer site to stalk her at work
fromthis depo—which was available to Desiree via counsel.
Elden & Devlin ask offensive, salacious Qs that are gratuitous
& not germane which could be right out of Soldier’s playbook.
I’m surprisedhe didn’t ask about nutter butters.
All the mileage Elden got from the So Poverty Law Ctr
making him local counsel in the Seraw case was misplaced imo.
from that Nov 5 post, erose, thanks for the reminder “I think he saw her
personally, not online, to be so motivated. This was well-organized & executed; when police got there in 4 min, he was gone. The storyline police don’t know the weapon is dumb, bcz the bullets would tell them.”
——-
Interesting w/such a psychopath that a mere glimpse of her boarding a school bus could be such a driver.
think how much worse her lot would have been had he been older & experienced much less had higher education.
Whether or not she was assaulted or sexualized, she appears in essence a captive companion like a pet dog or cat.
imo he was afflicted, like his brother with the twin scrouges or marijuana & alcohol.
———
I see I was engaged in political worries then, still am. Glad I’m not my former federal employee self w/a mortgage. The O said today a local conservative Portland radio host got a 12 hour twitter ban. That’s pikers. I got a week for saying a certain Lahren should rely on her brains rather than something else. Apparently the word bimbo is on twitter’s no no list. Fortunately kyron’s case media has had brunette males, though I remember being disrespectful to one or more O ladies with fake news.
I see I had
first thoughts on kyron?
we’ve got a BC/AD situation.
First thoughts in June 2010 versus first thought after Blink gives us the real skinny about Mathews & the school egress.
———-
BC: Since the school was ground zero, the throwweight here was behind having the bldg searched thoroughly. The Yale researcher case had just happened with her body & clothes being secreted in ceiling tiles & behind a wall. Culprit was a bldg employee. There was a lot of focus w/kyron on bldg employees. One wondered if the utility contractors, & esp proj mgr specialists w/solar4schools who taught modules in the classroom were involved. Skyline seemed overrun with unregulated projects mostly generated by the Green Team.
AD: Once the sequence of events w/Mathews & SZ was known here, I still liked contractors & Solar4Schools personnel. They set Skyline apart from every other ElEd in the area.
Now that I think about it more recently, routine PPS deliveries likely occuring several times weekly & therefore expectable to Mathews THRU that door adjacent to Mathews’ classroom to either the cafeteria or custodians’ closet makes the most sense.
——-
I am now interested in Rainbow Lake evidence bcz Blink is though. Is this part of the Advance-the-Investigation interview?
Your faith in my instincts is probably more compliment than I deserve on the Rainbow Lake issue- I work pretty hard at not elevating an area of interest until/if it can be excluded. Case in point- I once had a situation in a mp case where I was told (and was confirmed) that a body of water was searched 11x, to include side scan sonar. I can’t discuss specifics but I had reason to believe the individual met with foul play PRIOR to where witnesses said they last saw the individual. As I believed the “witnesses” were involved and criminally sophisticated/motivated enough to make their story stick if the victim were ever to be found- I was convinced he was in that “lake”. Low and behold when I was able to produce evidence from my investigation LE had missed, LE heads back to that lake and on the 12th try- viola- we locate our victim.
My point is simply that as a matter of protocol, given what we know about the logistical interest points in this case that are known and likely unknown- and the area of the most recent searches, it would make sense to exclude it. That and unfortunately I have experienced first hand, more than once, how difficult it is to search for remains or items of interest in a case over 8 1/2 years old with the same agency who has not produced a single new lead in as much time. Once again, if this offender is of the profile I believe he is- Kyron will be found by accident, or through re-offense.
B
thank you for the architectural drawing erose. looks like the door from the rear blacktop playground leads to Flr 2.
Is that an outside entrance door by 103 which would be used for cafeteria & music room deliveries? (undiscernable where custodial closet is.) If one had 1st flr deliveries to the opposite end of the school from E Mathews’ room, that blows my theory that regular PPS deliveries went thru the door adjacent her room en route to the cafeteria & custodian.
1) “I am saying they never requested them from the civil file. To my knowledge, LE would never have access to gj testimony, which also 2) to my knowledge was not recorded in 2010.
B http://blinkoncrime.com/2016/09/21/dr-phil-show-hosts-missing-portland-child-kyron-hormans-step-mom-terri-horman-over-two-episodes/#comments
1) that is incredible.
I get that no mcso detective wanted to ask Houze/Terri for a lil favor,
but why wouldn’t Det Relentless/Aggressive, Desiree’s bud, pick up
the phone & ask her for a copy?
2) also incredible.
I thought the purpose of an investigative grand jury in this case was to preserve eyewitness
testimony while memories were fresh and to record them for posterity.
& w/out a record, how did GJ2 get up to snuff? Maybe mcda didn’t like what
they were hearing from witnesses.
kudos to the use of a geospatial analyst, plus hunches.
I will look at mult channel 17.
I really liked the real Rainbow Lake & its dam.
Apparently there’s an old scout camp there.
And the Yamhill area W of McMinnville is quite rural & interesting.
and lots of “landscaper” activity of Rudy’s ilk. maybe him too.
ps erose. long ago I thought the transient group (from CA & NV) surrounding Rev Quick Draw
volunteering rebuilding the church with a view of the school was of interest.
https://multco.us/file/67289/download
some maps
Gates & his investigation underlings probably figured they’d done their own far superior interviews of Mathews & relevant witnesses and Houze’s depos were an inferior product, not being done by a lawman. & they’d figure him biased. they’ve always presented as myopic.
That may be but its admissible evidence, and I don’t have any faith parties within MCSO knew it existed, to be frank.
B
didn’t kyron’s bus stop at the intersection of Skyline Dr and his street?
Plenty of opportunity day by day for a vehicle stuck behind the bus to see kids
boarding.
Bet the delivery trucks w/a regular southerly route at that time of day hated
getting stuck behind the stoppingschool bus.
I believe it stopped at the end of his actual driveway.
B
@erose. Perhaps he’d been watching school buses
when he worked in Barron for some time to have a
hallelujah moment as the “right” girl stood out to
feed his obsessive thinking? Anyway, it predicates
Kyron’s abductor was not in a truck but a sedan that day.
probably a poorer, older one.
here’s your Rainbow Lake just North of Logie Trail Rd & west of Sauvie. https://www.topozone.com/oregon/multnomah-or/reservoir/rainbow-lake-92/
Also stuff on USGeologicalSurvey site on it. I have a vague memory the list of employees of Bonneville Energy Fdtn who did site mgmt of projects incl Solar4Schools in 2010 none of them there now) were mostly male recent ba/s grads & the sciences like geology were represented.
idk why mcso divers wouldn’t search rainbow lake
in that location. beats the houseboat area,
which was quite exposed & public
His expecting Kyron to be in a K/1 room,
where he’d been the preceding 2 years,
when it was happenstance, suggests
he hadn’t been in the school in 2009-10
but had been in those classrooms in 2008-09. Can you ask Terri in your bucket list the date she wrote the
Bonneville EF lesson plan, who solicited her to do so & who
accepted it, and which school year Bonneville EF employee(s) were doing the one off classroom teaching modules?
———-
Maybe MCSO’s Q to Terri about who she had conflict with should’ve been rather
what visitors & teacher were in his K/1 classroom in 2008-09 but hadn’t been back in 2009-10.
I just looked at another map. That sucker is beside Hwy 30 en route to Scappose, just South of the Golf Course, just off Logie Tr Rd. Water should’ve been dive searched for evidence.
Wasn’t Kristina Porter & her child living up that way? One’s on a Safe & Sober Hi Sch Grad volunteer group of parents.
Correct. Thus my concerns.
B
Watching the school bus route was apparently Phillip & Nancy Garrido’s M.O. too. As far as I can remember, that was PG’s first encounter with Jaycee Dugard and she simply became the “chosen one”. PG & NG used to also peruse the neighborhood parks, sometimes videoing, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they also sat outside of school grounds doing the same.
It wouldn’t surprise me at all if Jake Patterson had been following the same M.O., and I also wouldn’t be surprised if he had at least planned/ attempted to do this earlier on to some other child.
Could this have happened in Kyron’s case? Sure. What a better day to be hanging out around a school, than a chaotic science fair day to finally capitalize on your diabolic plan? If it had been the Garridos, it would mostly likely have been Nancy that went inside asking for help, while Phillip remained in the car. How do we know the same exact type of thing didn’t happen to Kyron? We don’t.
***********
Rainbow Lake had significance to me simply because of the reported siting of a look-alike pickup coming off one of the roads leading there off of hwy 30. I don’t believe it was ever searched either. And I was just looking at some old records on the quarry, where it appears it was in some sort of transition to the new owners, which is Knife River Co. now, and I’m not sure it was operating at the time…..so it would have been highly isolated if not. (?) If Kyron was murdered nearby within days and his body disposed of, there were no buzzard sightings, so I was thinking either water disposal or buried deeply under loose soil, e.g., quarry, but one would think by now since the quarry is in operation, bones would have surfaced there at some point. I just wonder why neither place was ever searched in the first place, when searches were done all around those areas. If they truly were looking for a place where a body could be dumped, why not there?
jden says:
September 14, 2012 at 2:44 pm
James Pitkin (formerly WW) was tossed out of the PC by Kaine for not being a team player. I’ve heard Pitkin is relentless and I hope he has a dog in this fight. I believe it was Walsh who said the press would solve this.
Pitkin was able to interview TMH at the beginning. She wouldn’t talk about Kyron, stating to him that she is under “orders from investigators not to discuss the case.” Interesting note for those of us that thought it might have just been attorney counsel.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1006/29/ng.01.html
http://blinkoncrime.com/2012/09/11/kyron-horman-disappearance-series-part-i-desiree-young-v-terri-horman-civil-as-an-oxymoron/comment-page-4/#comments
**********
I was just doing some old reading (2012, hard to believe over 6 years ago) and came across the above post. Just posting it here, to show that TMH hasn’t changed her story since June 2010 when she indicated to Pitkin way back then, that it was LE who was telling her not to talk about Kyron, the family or the case.
She says the same thing today. Have they (LE) ever publicly been asked if that was true?
NelMel says:
September 17, 2012 at 2:51 pm
I know that the MFH accusation won’t be the primary chase in DY’s civil case, but…
I can walk outside right now, stroll down to my local village police station, have some of their bad coffee, and tell them that my ex-husband took a hit out on me that didn’t pan out.
That’s it? And then what? I have no proof. I have no tape recordings. I have no vids. I have no money trail. I have nothing.
What did RS (or whoever RS is) say to LE that convinced them that the MFH accusation was legit?
How the hell do you have evidence for that if you have no evidence?
Did LE GET evidence? Do they know for certain that the MFH plan occurred? That’s the oddest thing to me. It’s a terrible crime, and other MFHs are discovered in this country all the time and busted.
So why not this one?
Well I am going to assume for a timeframe they had probable cause based on evidence of some kind.
You don’t get a DEA undercover dude without it, at a minimum, however, it may have been wholly unrelated to this case. Maybe an existing investigation?
B
http://blinkoncrime.com/2012/09/11/kyron-horman-disappearance-series-part-i-desiree-young-v-terri-horman-civil-as-an-oxymoron/comment-page-7/#comments
***********
This is still a very, very good question. Even more so now than it was way back then. How did RSE convince them that there had been a solicitation for murder? So convincing, that the DEA got involved and wore a wire to catch their alleged perp? What kind of legal procedure (court order?) would be have been required to make such an act (the wire recording) legal in a court of law if they had gotten some sort of evidence out of it? And if it wasn’t RSE doing the convincing, and he agreed to go along with a LE idea, because of something being held over his head, who was holding something over his head, what and why? And why involve the DEA?
(PS I miss Nel, and Malty and MBS and Wpg and Amy’s sis, and on and on and on.)
Sorry T. Ruth- I responded to this but it did not post for some reason. It is my firm belief that RSE was inspired to allege the “mfh” to produce probable cause to arrest Terri- not the other way around. It gave MCSO enough to file a FAPA and destroy her relationship with her toddler, but never enough to file any criminal charges- it didn’t happen and it is (for me) the biggest Frink designed catastrophe in all of this outside of the fact that Kyron has not been located.
B
looks like the bottom of R Lake would be too dangerous to dive, old rotted logs & stumps, tho it’s not a salt lake, a preservative:
http://www.srnpdx.org/some-history-of-north-skyline-ridge.html
Here’s what puzzles me about these people. They seem “smart” insofar as they can pull something off and no one know who or where to look, yet simultaneously keep someone captive under a bed with totes and weights while still entertaining friends, which seems so “stupid.”
rose says:
January 15, 2019 at 12:04 am
snip>
Whether or not she was assaulted or sexualized, she appears in essence a captive companion like a pet dog or cat.
It is the hallmark of a crime of a completely seemingly random or unassociated person- they are the #1 hardest to solve.
B
Rose, WRT Rudy and the blackberry bushes. I don’t know about Oregon, but in WA burning them would be frowned on without a permit, but then if Rudy didn’t have a green card, I doubt a burn permit would stop him. He would either burn on Horman property or haul off and burn and hauling is the big expense in the process. Those bushes don’t compact and take up a lot of room in a truck. A pickup wouldn’t be big or deep enough. Removal would be either by dump truck or container dumpsters eventually picked up by a large truck. The cheapest way outside of an illegal burn on the same property is a chipper leaving the debris chipped on the property with no hauling involved.
As I recall, one of the reasons Terri hired RSE was because she received a citation for burning lawn/yard debris in her yard- ironic.
B
Blink and Rose, Thank you for first thoughts, Rose and conclusions, Blink. I too wonder about the contractors, delivery personnel, and the church. I will add the volunteer fire station to that list, keeper of the wall for awhile.
EM holds information we just aren’t privy to. Who did she think the man was? Relative, delivery man, other parent? She had to have some impression, even if she just nodded. The man wanted her to think he was ok for Kyron to leave the building with. Wonder if Houze got to the bottom of that.
rose says:
January 15, 2019 at 12:23 am
snip>
Once again, if this offender is of the profile I believe he is- Kyron will be found by accident, or through re-offense.
B
Did SZ own or borrow that poor old sedan? Did he get rid of it right after he abducted Kyron or did he keep it. Did he still have it during the August 12 presser? Was he afraid TO sell it then? Is it hiding in a barn somewhere? He had no way to know if someone saw he and Kyron get in to that car.
a fireman would be trusted at an open house.
probably some volunteer fireman had done
safety talks or visited on career day inside classrooms.
@erose. re “the cheapest way outside of an illegal burn on the same property is a chipper leaving the debris chipped on the property with no hauling involved.” http://blinkoncrime.com/2016/09/21/dr-phil-show-hosts-missing-portland-child-kyron-hormans-step-mom-terri-horman-over-two-episodes/#comments
Right, foolish me to think he hauled them to a burn site. He wouldn’t apply for a permit; he’d have chipped. So if he owned one, did LE get a subpoena to test for dna? He more likely rented one, so LE should’ve checked for rentals by Rudy & associates dating back to a week before & after the abduction, tho I don’t think Rudy was SZ. .
@erose says:
January 17, 2019 at 4:12 am
What sedan, erose? Was there an actual vehicle mentioned by LE that I don’t remember?
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When our blackberries need cutting, it is done with a brush-hog. Which pretty much just pulverizes then entire bushes. One could rake that up and remove it, but usually it’s just left on the ground to rot once it rains. Good time to do it is fall, for that reason, and as best I remember, the Horman property was done in the fall.
So the MFH un-sting was designed by the DA’s office (specifically, Frink)?
I always thought it was a MCSO idea, Bobby O’donnel-ish. How and why did the DEA climb on board, wearing the wire no less? Is it possible the DEA had something on RSE or that RSE was a past DEA informant?
I think initially I was of the opinion that O’Donnell was rogue independently, I now think it was joint rogue with the DA hoping to maintain plausible deniability. To this day, I am uber confident that the expectation by all parties was that sting was to end with taking Terri into custody. I’m far more interested in who made the decision on the fly “that” was not going to happen.
B
“EM holds information we just aren’t privy to. Who did she think the man was? Relative, delivery man, other parent?”
imo Blink is privey to it via the depo. Blink is discrete. Let MCSO go get it’s own copy. Let Desiree & Soldier pretend it doesn’t exist.
btw Who (category) did Matthew think he was was likely too speculative gor Houze to ask.
rose, my apologies but I dont understand the question.
B
Soldier just readvertized her twitter. Not surprized she’s not following anyone I follow, and I follow 600+ accounts. My newsfeed has grown like topsy. But into is way fast. So many mainstreammedia & smartie researchers out there.