Dr. Phil Show Hosts Missing Portland Child Kyron Horman’s Step Mom Terri Horman Over Two Episodes

I have been covering this case since Kyron Horman disappeared from Skyline School in June, 2010.    Like most missing persons cases I have covered in the past,  I am of the strong opinion that best efforts at the truth are the only way to propel investigations that, similarly to Kyron’s, have gone cold for one reason or another.   This approach has worked in resolving some of my previous cases.    I am proud of that.  I remain steadfast to the integrity involved in those and future cases.

Over the past 10 months (or so) I have been developing an updated series on Kyron’s case to include my multiple interviews with Kyron’s step-mom,  Terri Horman.   Needless to say as she was the subject of at least three simultaneous cases before an Oregon court and remains a person of interest by the agency investigating her sons disappearance, this has been an arduous and sometimes delicate journey.    Ms. Horman’s experiences during the ongoing investigation of the disappearance of Kyron Horman are critically important to propelling his case and with great hope- finding the truth about what happened to this cherubic and innocent child.    There are dozens of sources,  collateral interviews, forensic experts and legal analysts that also contribute to my series and have done so because of their belief that my motivation is to bring to light information and opinions in such a way that would almost “require” a focused review of Kyron’s case and the likely shaking of that proverbial tree everyone talks about.

Set to publish about 6-ish weeks ago I was asked to postpone the first installment of the series, which I did.  I subsequently learned Ms. Horman was participating in the Dr. Phil program after she completed taping.  Dr. Phils producers were well aware that Ms. Horman had interviewed with me extensively, and anticipated my series would be publishing information that was not known to the public previously in the days prior to her scheduled episode.    When Ms. Horman conveyed to me that she feels obligated to speak out about “her son” in any national medium that will have her,   I most certainly respected that.  I still do.

While Dr. Phil seems like a gregarious fellow for sure,   I have zero interest in being associated with his program, nor do I believe his shows content is designed to do any furtherance of investigation or truth.  There is much concern (although I have no affiliation to the show whatsoever) that the timing of the publication of my series on the Kyron Horman matter might be interpreted differently or inadvertently contribute to the programs content or audience reactions.     Not what I signed on for.   A missing 7 year old boy six years running is not a framework for entertaining a target audience.   He is not fodder for online social media bully campaigns- yet it occurs.

I will be publishing my series on Kyron’s case at a later date, in it’s entirety with no editing adjustments as a result of any of the appearances on Dr. Phil.   I appreciate your patience and your understanding.   Feel free to discuss the show below.

 

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6,460 Comments

  1. Rose says:

    ya’ll know there’s another Skyline principal? iirc from another sch sys. & a mismatch with Skyline’s ed needs. You can have a “manager” as principal, which newbie apparently qualified as, or an expert in 3R leadership instruction to train and hold accountable k-5 instruction content & techiniques. whoever hires & promotes k-5 PPS principals and offers them training classes in instruction should be fired imo.

  2. oldladysmith says:

    Thank you for your answers.Since the haters won’t let Terri keep a job I was wondering if she could get an advance on writing a book! you know —–make lemonade.

    I don’t know the answer to that ols, but I would not be surprised at some point if Terri decided to take legal action. This is my personal opinion, not something she has shared with me. I can only say that Terri is pretty much of the opinion that finding Kyron will end this seeming persecution of her and while MCSO and MCDA remain fixated on her, that will not happen.
    B

  3. RoseRed says:

    I always thought that is exactly who was in that picture (where mostly his back was showing), but it seemed ppl were giving him a pass. Still my opinion that he is DIRECTLY related to Kyron’s disappearance. If you think about it, he was familiar to most people at the school, participated in events with the children. People knew him; wonder why nobody would say it was him. I suppose you need 100% identity. May never be proven unless somebody sits on him and squishes him like a bug until the information comes out.
    Plus. Stoller is actually pretty close to where the search happened this weekend, and not all that far from Skyline Elementary.

    Anyway. If Logan Storm WAS at the school that morning and wanted someone to help him, people knew him and would have no hesitation in saying OK. Wonder why they didn’t lean harder on the school people – or him?? I suppose you need 100% proof before even ‘suggesting’.

    Second opinion, while I’m here, is that those dogs that were finding scents at the houseboat were a true link, but seems that because people knew the man who owned the houseboat, nobody bothered to pursue it — and of course, it’s too late now.

    One or the other. Just seems either will point directly to what happened to the little guy.

    Rose says:July 12, 2017 at 12:00 pm

    not RoseRed but my memory of the Stoller MS teacher was he was convicted of child porn on his computer, had a then 12 yo son, was acquited of groping little girls at a community pool, and resembles a man running a schoollike carnival game in pic with kyron. do you know more first-time?

    Not first-time but I can tell you that pic was of Logan Storm at the carnival.
    B

    1. The only thing I know for certain is that Storm does not match SZ description and I truly believe he only became of interest when we posited his id from that pic. I do know a great deal of unpublished info about Storm (not his real name as we all know) but nothing I could draw so much as a “dotted” line to Kyron’s disappearance. Terri does not know him and never knew who he was until LE called her counsel to ask them in 2011. For anyone unfamiliar- this is a pretty good summary, although it underplays Rees’s involvement and that he was forced to dismiss the charges: http://koin.com/2013/09/10/logan-storm-gets-7-years-sentence/

    2. I respectfully disagree on that Harry persons assertions that his canines alerted or whatever on the area on Sauvie with the houseboats- specifically the one tied to Tanner Pumala’s extended family. Seemed opportunistic to me and the body of water was fair game if he wanted to acquire resources to search it himself. JMO, but I don’t buy it then or now.

    I don’t disagree that Storm’s access to Skyline and its students deserves much more scrutiny.
    B

  4. RoseRed says:

    No, First Time et.al., I really don’t know anything much, just have a sense from the bits and pieces I read back at the start, that that houseboat and owner were somehow involved.

    Also that Storm fits into all of the pieces (two different things, but I still think one of these is true) – people at Skyline familiar with him (isn’t that what pervs do, fit themselves in??). Kyron would have known him, etc. etc.

    Just a sense. I stopped bringing it up because it seemed that it was definitely ruled out (in capital letters) by folks here. Still …..

    Anyway. I think Logan Storm knows exactly what happened to Kyron.

    first-time says: July 12, 2017 at 4:27 pm

    ——-
    Hi Rose. Yes, I recall all that, but I thought Rose Red might have heard more of Storm, based on their question of a few days ago…

    Round and round we go….

  5. A Texas Grandfather says:

    I agree about the first grand jury B. That would be interesting information. I believe your thinking about a No True Bill being issued by the first GJ is correct. That should have ended the matter regarding TH’s involvement in the disappearance. But it didn’t, because the DA and MCSO would not accept the results. So a second GJ was empaneled without good cause and perhaps not legal, to continue the assault on Terri.

    This is the type of bad behavior that is corruption in the Criminal Justice System.

    I liked Rose’s idea about a Grand Juror having the power to issue subpoenas to get at facts and important information. However, to my knowledge it is not legally available in any state.

    O/T

    In my report on the Liberty Bell copy being loaned to the Bible museum in Washington, D.C. I for got to include the reason for its inclusion.

    Cast into the surface of the bell are two inscriptions. The first is from chapter 25 verse 10 of the book of Leviticus “Proclaim liberty throughout all the land unto all inhabitants thereof”

    The second is: “By order of the Assembly of the Province of Pensylvania for the State House in Philada” The spelling is the same as found on the bell. All of this took place prior to Noah Webster’s work of standardizing American English and its spelling.

  6. Rose says:

    speaking of skyline principals
    http://www.oregonlive.com/education/index.ssf/2017/05/portland_principal_quits_sudde.html
    imo blowhard untruth wrt he “came from the classroom”

  7. Rose says:

    That Grand Jury legislation, such that if Rod is “investigating,” in the future he’ll have a transcript, maybe.
    http://portlandtribune.com/pt/9-news/365697-247102-grand-jury-recording-stirs-strong-emotions

    Was passed by 1 branch on July 3, & 2nd Branch on Friday July 7. So likely sent to Gov on Monday July 1. So happens that was the last day of the Legislative Session.
    https://www.oregonlegislature.gov/calendar/Lists/Legislative%20Session/DispForm.aspx?ID=5

    Will the Governor sign it, seeing as how her chief Public Safety political advisor is Barker’s daughter, who was very opposed, adn her old boss the Mult DA is likely as opposed as the rest of OR DAs. So, I looked up the pocket veto rules for Oregon. It’s the opposite of Federal, where the bill would not become law if pocketed until Congress is out of session.

    In Oregon, if she does nothing (which with her amount of political courage and leadership one anticipates, it becomes law 30 days after the day she received it: http://cqrollcall.com/statetrackers/state-by-state-guide-to-gubernatorial-veto-types/
    About August 9.  That is because it was passed and sent to her during the last 5 days of the legislative session.

  8. Rose says:

    that’s to Gov on July 10.

  9. Rose says:

    @OLS, my opinion, based on 7 years of her prior behavior, is that TMH is unlikely to write or collaborate on writing a book. From the beginning, imo she has sacrificed everything she has in Kyron’s interests, let Kaine get away with figurative murder in the divorce. If she’d litigated imo there would have to be at a minimum regular generous visitation, if not shared custody. He would be fully unable to prove a case against her. And, she put Kiara first, like King Solomon’s story, rather than drag her through a fight Kaine was going to take to the mat. Having put everyone else’s interests ahead of her own, I don’t she’d change her stripes after 7 years. Any book would have to cover the marriage, and hurt Kiara, cover the Youngs, for which Desiree would delight in suing her again for defamation. And so on.

  10. Rose says:

    Yes ma’am.
    xo
    B

  11. Rose says:

    @ATG. I suggested based on one picture (stupid of me) DiNardo might be schizophrenic (or bipolar, manic), and indeed he has been termed that. My guess is paranoid type, thus the reason (besides drugs) why he felt threatened by buyers. Marijuana can exacerbate, esp if laced with something. His cousin appears a hardened criminal at an early age.

  12. Rose says:

    Q Blink. How many of the infant, toddler, or prepubescent pics of kyron were public on either desiree’s, her sibs, or either Hormans’ social media before the abduction? Soldier’s and Beth’s FB pages have long had a publishing storm of them, multiple a day, which seems to me highly titillating to SZ unless he’s moved on to another vic. If it were me the Grear & Green duo woukd have permission to publish the age corrected pic only, in perpetuity. So what was online & by whom preabduction that SZ could have seen?

    I don’t think I could answer that with certainty Rose, unfortunately. It’s a good question though.
    B

  13. Rose says:

    imo the fact bios let all of their son’s private family moments pics be published, unrestricted, violating this chikd’s right to privacy, even perhaps fed to these symbiotic sites, suggests to me 1) they believe he is dead, 2) they narcisstically want a record in public they were “good” and “typical” parents.

  14. erose says:

    o/t Looks like it could be true.

    snip>
    Former Seattle Mayor Mike McGinn and fellow mayoral candidates Jessyn Farrell and Cary Moon are calling for Mayor Ed Murray to resign after The Seattle Times reported new information Sunday about allegations that Murray sexually abused his foster son in the 1980s.

    New records, previously thought destroyed, show that an Oregon child-welfare investigator concluded in 1984 Murray sexually abused Jeff Simpson when he was a teenager.

    http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/seattle-mayoral-candidates-respond-to-new-ed-murray-sexual-abuse-revelations/

  15. erose says:

    o/t Rose, Thou the case worker spells it out, you can probably read even more between the lines.

    https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/3893750-CPS-Sexual-Abuse-Assessment.html

    I read this late erose and wanted to take a beat before commenting. My first reaction was this stayed with me as so closely parallel with the beginning of Sandusky’s victim investigation to include Ray Gricar and Gricar’s decision not to prosecute. As I recall, the social worker or psychologist ended up terming Sandusky a high risk, this finding clearly more absolute. Not just that though- there is an element here I want to highlight- Do we see the commonality in vicitmization of troubled youth and the want of a permanent home environment, parental care? Very important to confront the underlying issue here (imo). Sexual abusers of this particular profile prey on disadvantaged and troubled kids in the system because they are so vulnerable and desperate- they can spot these kids, most at this age with previous abuse, a mile away. What is also part of the grooming effect and we see/saw this in Sandusky as a recent example is that the abuser themselves convinces themselves that the “relationship” grows out of genuine care for the individual and that it is actually reciprocal and not a crime. This is one of the reasons why you have often heard me say that it is my strong belief that adults that are placed in a position of “trust” of any kind to a child they abuse should have stiffer penalties all the way around in cases like this.

    The cycle for abuse arising from chronic sexual abuse of a child risk is so high- and we are literally seeing these victims turning to drugs and crime as minors, also affecting the potential for risk for them to then victimize others, yet when the CPS caseworkers present findings they are essentially quashed.

    Sandusky’s last adopted son burnt down a barn before he adopted him months later.
    This young man burns down a placement residence by torching a Christmas tree. Ends up at Murray’s home.

    I applaud the CPS work here for a variety of reasons, and I do not think many people realize how difficult of a job that is in the first place. I have 2 very good friends and one extended family member that were all LSW’s working at the pre teen level for various court indicated placements and all left that work in under 5 years.
    B

  16. cd says:

    interesting About the Multnomah County DA position

    http://news.streetroots.org/2016/04/21/prosecutor-most-powerful-person-room

    Thank you CD- I dont remember reading that. I did read Frink’s piece it mentions, but I don’t recall that I knew it was co-written by Underhill. I can’t decide if I am shocked at the stats re DA’s in Oregon v other states, or if I should have known.
    B

  17. Rose says:

    TY erose. can’t work zoom on phone, trying tomorrow. I always believed the vics. Their stories meshed. I looked up caseworker yesterday & iirc she’s still in private practice locally (the nirvana of all CPS ladies imo). Such reports are supposed to be confidential, imo disclosing is highly unusual. I saw the ADA’s excuses for nonprosecution. Shrunk litigated animal rights, why not troubled teens in foster care? . Imo it was a good case and vic woukd resurface. And, the caseworker did not need to talk to Murray or his attorney, as he claims. The person who should have talked to him was the ADA.

    Tomlinson resigned from the OSB and has not practiced law in many years, I do not draw any inferences from that per se, just throwing it out there.
    B

  18. Rose says:

    The reason PPB is under a Federal Judge’s supervision re “reforms” has as much to do with the County DA as the
    polices’ behavior imo. Pity Justice settled rather than clean their mgmt up. Pity the new DOJ is unlikely to do anything with Hennepin Cty & Minneapolis “forces.” Problems there seem to be a pervasive lack of training and supervision and accountability. which also has a DA role.

  19. Rose says:

    ot next to last paragraph
    http://portlandtribune.com/pt/9-news/366487-247604-judge-nixes-portland-public-schools-motion-to-void-verdict
    conflicts of interest all around.
    PPS inhouse counsel left last yr to work for Miller.
    PPS needs a competent Supt & a legal dept head with litigation judgment.
    imo taxpayers literally throw their miney away with pps.

  20. Rose says:

    ot if consolidated, Reese’d lose his job in the negotiations
    http://portlandtribune.com/pt/9-news/366392-247752-county-takes-over-fairview-police-
    likely he got wind his former subordinate is not to be the new Chief.

  21. Rose says:

    ot woman’s in charge of PR for Nike, what’d anyone expect her Board mgmt to be but PPS PR and restoring image
    http://portlandtribune.com/pt/9-news/366498-247696-portland-public-schools-leader-says-were-going-to-get-better

  22. T. Ruth says:

    When I sat on the GJ, I don’t recall us ever asking a DA to bring in additional witnesses to testify before us, however, we did ask for other information to be made privy to us when something we were being *told was evidence* was either unclear as to why/how it affected the case and in some cases we asked for expert testimony or certain referred to records themselves. (For instance phone records.) I don’t think it’s uncommon for a grand jury to ask for more information, and if said information were to include *some other witness*, I don’t see the DA denying the request. (Wait a minute, thinking back, I do recall we asked for another witness to testify, and being told by the DA they were in fact present at the courthouse that day, but were hesitant to testify, but we did finally here from them.)

    The statues:

    “The grand jury shall weigh all the evidence submitted to it; and when it believes that other evidence within its reach will explain away the charge, it should order such evidence to be produced, and for that purpose may require the district attorney to issue process for the witnesses.”

    https://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/132.320

    So, in reading the above law, I’m not so sure that one couldn’t be on the GJ and ask to hear from some other witness they’d not heard from. That being said, I think the DA’s response to said request would depend entirely on whether that was something that was seriously keeping them from making a true bill or not a true bill decision and further, it would have to be directly related to the charges at laid out by the DA.
    FTR, the grand jury also has the power to add charges it deems should have been there. (Too bad no one did that in the Anthony case.)

  23. A Texas Grandfather says:

    Thanks for the Link CD.

    This material sheds some light on the workings of the Oregon criminal justice system. With the advances in video all GJ proceedings should be recorded so that a factual record may be obtained and retained by the court. Sending everything to a grand jury may provide a shield for the District Attorneys, but without records there is little proof of proper application of law.

    This piece is also about “Progressive” thinking regarding Social Justice for those being prosecuted. Social justice is a made-up concept. Everyone should be equal before the law regardless of their station in society or the color of their skin or ethnic background.

    If one particular group of people do not follow the law, then they will more likely be at the courts defending themselves. While this will show a disproportionate share of cases for that group, they should be looking at their behavior in society rather than claiming or lobbying for special considerations.

    This whole mantra of Social Justice is made up to by-pass quality social and community standards. It is always about meeting the norms of community behavior. Our country was organized under the rule of law that also included good manners and behavior before the public.

    The report also states that 46 percent of voters do not bother to vote for or against a particular person for District Attorney. This is probably caused by the way the law is written to allow an elected DA to retire and the replacement be appointed by the Governor. The lawyers occupying the office of DA are then allowed to make a recommendation to the Governor who should be appointed to hold the office until the next election.

    This is foolish and bad law. The people of Oregon have allowed this to happen and they must take steps to correct it. The state district attorneys association is not going to do it, for it works to their advantage against the people.

  24. A Texas Grandfather says:

    Rose

    Regarding the school principal selections:

    Originally the term principal referred to principal teacher. This title was conferred on the person who had the best education or experience or both in a school. This changed with the concept of Progressive Education as practiced particularly in the North East at the beginning of the 20th century. Gradually it filtered into all school systems across the country. By 1950 it was everywhere.

    It is a fact that some are just better than others regarding management and this holds true across all professions. That doesn’t keep someone from being a “square peg in a round hole” or the “Peter Principle” effect for promotion beyond capability in a school or other organization from happening.

    Today, in small schools in Texas, the majority of school principals come from the ranks of coaches or those with degrees in sociology. Some of them do a great job, but others do not. It is performance that makes a difference.

  25. oldladysmith says:

    I can’t help but agree on the reasons the book is not a good idea right now I just thought a source of income might help.I am afraid someone else will do it.Maybe lying Desiree.

  26. Rose says:

    ot http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2017/07/portlands_mayor_pressing_for_a.html#incart_river_mobile_home_pop
    power grab by Underhill. Good guys (wheeler, marshall) 2.
    Let’s see what acting chief Marshman, who wants Whereer to hire him, does…
    adopt DA’s opinion/procedure?

  27. Rose says:

    TY erose
    wrt “assessment” of foster home placement, this report was hard to read physically even on computer as I couldn’t figure out zooming,
    but harder to read in terms of government actors. I kept starting and stopping, appalled. In reattempting to read, I just kept running notes so hopefully I would keep reading.

    The first reporter of the abuse (likely some substance counselor) promised confidentiality. Big professional fail. Big betrayal as usual it seems. Should’ve said any sex abuse has to be reported to CPS which will entail an investigation.

    If Simpson was maybe l6 in 1984, then he came into care at six, younger than Kyron.  It took Multnomah 3 years to place him in a foster home.  Any Jewish, Catholic, or Masonic
    orphanage would likely have been better than a for-profit (even if it’s a nonprofit) group home at that age imo.  Most of these “group homes” are “for profit” and owned by “connected ones” like those who get all those no bid contracts for services to PPS. Patterson looks lazy and incompetent. 

    It is offensive a CPS worker went to the group home to talk to a boy who had been promised confidentiality by his reporter.  Put
    yrself in his shoes–surprised, stunned, and once again betrayed.  Every kid and worker there would know his business.  She should have had his assigned foster care worker bring him in to
    the office for privacy.  He was awaiting entry to drug treatment; no wonder he ran away rather
    than subject himself to testifying against Murray again and again (a GJ is just a starting point).  Nothing like describing your rapes and drug dependence to seven strangers and a judge. In fact, wrt drugs, he probably put himself in legal jeopardy.

    The stupid CPS worker returns to the facility with a Youth Division detective, whose province sex abuse is, to the very same group home.  Again, was the worker too lazy or too afraid to use her car to drive him to her office for a private interview?
    Again, no warning, no appointment with the teen.  Disrespectful imo. 

    On the 20th, back to the group
    home for the Third Time, with a Grand Jury in the offing. By surprise the same day of course.

    PPB Youth Detectives had the ability to file
    charges.  The use of a grand jury to “investigate” sex abuse allegations of a foster home is offensive in
    the extreme. It was Youth Division detective’s job to recommend what charges, and the DA’s to file. It was DHS’ responsibility to investigate the foster care placement.

    What’s supposed to happen is that the Youth Detective and CPS worker, the latter writing a brief Court report, go in for an emergency hearing and get a finding of probable cause and PPBB goes on from
    there to directly investigate Murray.  Why did they not follow what one would hope was ordinary procedure?
    BECAUSE DURING THE ABUSE SIMPSON WAS IN STATE CUSTODY AS A FOSTER CHILD AND THE AGENCY ITSELF WAS as a third party as
    RESPONSIBLE FOR THE ABUSE as Murray. (Witness a big payout to foster kids sexually abused a couple yrs ago in Multnomah.)  

    On the 20th she just headed with her two men to the group home for a 4th time to
    surprise Jeff with a trip to testify at the Grand Jury.  No attorney advice, no child’s attorney which should’ve been
    obtained by the agency responsible for his care and his abuse. In fact, since he was in care, he had the right to a Court assigned children’s attorney. Why did she take “Patterson” (one guesses a hapless foster
    care worker) and the detective.  Imo she was afraid of the boy (needlessly imo).  Of course after his GJ appearance he
    ran away, duh.  And, of course Tomlinson withdrew the cases, protecting the agency.  So, a boy in stable housing, having
    done some good things at Lincoln, and awaiting an appropriate placement, was screwed over by CPS and a PPB youth
    Division detective not following proper procedure, which was persuading the ADA Division head to paper the case, and
    let Murray disprove charges in court.  And why?  because Simpson was a ward of the State and the foster placement
    was the abuse site.   And as I google, this was never unusual for Mult County foster care system.

  28. Rose says:

    ot http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2017/07/parents_with_intellectual_disa.html
    I wish a federal court woukd shut this OR agency down & put it in receivership.
    Of course it all goes back to a long line of negligent governors.
    this is a terrific civil rights case. where are the lawyers?
    And what Judge (except most just like DAs seem to be initially Gov appointed and beholden)
    would do a TPR then adoption when the State never gave what are federally mandated (to get fed money into State system) services?

  29. Rose says:

    the difference Blink between Sandusky & Murray?
    Investigative reporting.
    No one in Oregon media will follow a trail to a Governor, to public
    school leadership, to state agencies, to police agencies,
    to a nonprofit but for profit care and services agency.
    Reporters could have been winning pulitzers in portland for years.

    Word.
    B

  30. erose says:

    Leave it to the pros, Blink and Rose, thank you. Like Blink said this is reminiscent of Sandusky and Gricar and I say that entire era, and here it was in Oregon, same time frame and I wonder about the associates of Murray who may have also been involved and who may still be there, large and in charge now so to speak. There is a (sub)culture (not just Portland) and Mayor Sam Adams perpetuated it in Portland, IMO. Not because he is gay, or Murray is gay, but because they do not seek adult relationships, they exploit kids, vulnerable kids no less. I still think Sandusky was the tip of the iceberg in Happy Valley. I wonder who else is left in Happy Valley that got away with it and who could be in the Mult. Co. (government perhaps) with the same proclivities, which might explain why no one is really looking for Kyron.

    Glad you made the extra effort to read it Rose, I appreciate it because I felt that the victim’s privacy was completely exploited too and no one was at all sensitive to him. Though I read it, I could hardly believe it was published and am hoping it was with his consent even though I doubt it. He seems glad the record(s) have been located but for some reason they were not available to him and his attorney, but to the Seattle Times instead.

    Rose says: Why did they not follow what one would hope was ordinary procedure?
    BECAUSE DURING THE ABUSE SIMPSON WAS IN STATE CUSTODY AS A FOSTER CHILD AND THE AGENCY ITSELF WAS as a third party as RESPONSIBLE FOR THE ABUSE as Murray.

    So absolutely true and we could extrapolate that Kyron was in the care of the state/county when he was abducted and if they weren’t directly responsible, they would legally qualify as a third party by any reasonable person.

    erose says:
    July 17, 2017 at 2:58 pm

    Rose says:
    July 18, 2017 at 10:55 pm

  31. erose says:

    I hit submit right when this posted. Rose, you said what I meant so succinctly.

    Rose says:
    July 19, 2017 at 12:17 am
    the difference Blink between Sandusky & Murray?
    Investigative reporting.
    No one in Oregon media will follow a trail to a Governor, to public
    school leadership, to state agencies, to police agencies,
    to a nonprofit but for profit care and services agency.
    Reporters could have been winning pulitzers in portland for years.
    Word.
    B

  32. Rose says:

    ot googling sex abuse foster home multnomah turns up plenty. Including this: https://www.cartercenter.org/news/documents/doc2064.html
    Maybe SZ has been in a “position of trust.” Maybe the List should be scrubbed for whether any of those generic lookalike men had boys 5-12 in foster care residence. Since the youth authotities don’t implement standards.
    Now I’m wondering who in mcso volunteers continously with minor male groups, like scouts.

    Another:
    http://newsregister.com/article?articleTitle=man-sues-oregon-youth-authority-over-alleged-abuse–1400273752–12960–state%20&%20region

    That particular profile (Milligan) tells me LE should be considering the potential for his involvement in any missing boys cases or unsolved homicides with a similar set of circumstances. Horrific.
    B

  33. Rose says:

    When I see an OR Gov put the need to scrap and rebuilt the State child welfare system–from Protection to Foster Care to Adoption–on the front burner for legislation (new statutes) and administration on a par with LGBTQ, health, energy, solar, and so on, I’ll have some respect. Right now for Ms. Kate Brown, zero, just like Kitzhaber. The problem is children don’t vote. So, even Rod DA can ignore his County system’s dysfunction. They put window dressing on (Multidisciplinary Team) when it was PC a couple decades ago, and assigned their least competent people. ie, the ADA who ignominiously lost a trial worked under ADA Charlene whatshername, now retired, on that team. Didn’t give it to Rees to supervise. O’Donnell was the 5 year MCSO delegee to the Team.

    One wonders why O’Donnell, having been a Youth detective delegated to PPB on the Multidisciplinary Abuse Team, was determined to pin this on Terri. In fact, that team must have worked this because of who was assigned (him and Moawad). So, how often in 5 years did he have a case of a 7 yo sexually abused by a stepmother. In fact, the only family associated molester were two in the Horman family (2 perps and one also a vic). His absolute determination to pin this on Horman, and hurt her marriage, employment, housing, etc, should fly in the face of his 5 prior years of youth detective abuse investigaitons once the existence of SZ was known. He should have driven as hard as he could to find SZ. Why not is unexplainable.

  34. Rose says:

    Rees may have gone before the GJ, Blink, but Moawad’s supervisors were Underhill and Charlene.

  35. A Texas Grandfather says:

    Kudos for your research Rose.

    After reading the pieces about the abuse by the Oregon Youth Authority, I had to go outside and cool off. This is government run amok.

    The people of Oregon need to get organized and find people with good character and behavior to run for government offices and get them elected. The current crop of office holders are not to be trusted.

    Pedophile or deviant behavior has always been about grooming and abusing boys and girls. Scouts and other youth organizations are prime areas where this behavior will be found. Parents need to keep tabs constantly on any of these organizations that their children attend.

    Rose has found, I think, the avenue of how Kyron may have been abused and finally abducted. It should have been fully investigated. We have little evidence of fact about the people in the various agencies in the Portland area, but it appears that the reason Terri was attacked was to protect the reputation of one of them. Therefore, the purposeful misdirection of the efforts to finding the truth.

  36. Rose says:

    ot interesting Federal history slide show
    https://cb100.acf.hhs.gov/childrens-bureau-timeline

  37. Cindy says:

    I have nothing to add other than I am deeply disturbed that this case has not progressed. Oregon is a long way from where I live in Ohio. But, notably, sexually deviant criminals are arrested here everyday. I almost hate to pickup a newspaper or watch the local news. It seems though, that most of the accused all have double lives (not all but most). People who know them socially, say the PTA, or the local coach, would be never be suspected. But turn up on the 6 o’clock news arrested for sexually deviant crimes with our youth.

  38. Rose says:

    Q for Blink. After Desiree D and Kaine married, do you know from Quinn’s father whether that couple made any effort to increase Quinn’s residential time in their home either formally or informally? We know KH took up with Terri when she had a boy about the same age as Quinn. One of his first acts was to alienate James’ adoptive father (++chikd support) & cut off their future visits. Now his regular volunteer enterprise is weekends at blue collar events at times in rural areas interfacing with young children & their caregivers (with a table of trinkets & an id photo to make them feel special). While DD & KH were together, before “it was over,” was any attempt made to gain greater residential time with Quinn?

    Desiree had primary physical custody of Quinn when she was married to Kaine- she did take steps to request a RO against Kaine after the separation, but it is my understanding that or a time after Kyron was born Kaine actually maintained a relationship with Quinn.
    B

  39. erose says:

    From Rose’s link, just the fact that they “joked” about this shows what is wrong with this system.

    snip>

    He also declined to discuss a search warrant affidavit filed last year in Multnomah County Circuit Court that said Boyles had a reputation among co-workers for preferring “clean-cut 13- to-17-year-old boys.” A former supervisor of Boyles told detectives “there were rampant office rumors and jokes about Michael Boyles surrounding the type of probationers that he liked to spend time with.”

    https://www.cartercenter.org/news/documents/doc2064.html

  40. erose says:

    Milligan was involved in a couple of other cases. Looks like the biggest MP search before Kyron’s.

    http://www.heraldandnews.com/news/top_stories/molester-is-top-suspect/article_794f3920-2077-5a12-a10b-51d6c66318b2.html

  41. erose says:

    Sorry, I posted the wrong link. Read this on Milligan.

    http://www.heraldandnews.com/news/top_stories/molester-is-top-suspect/article_794f3920-2077-5a12-a10b-51d6c66318b2.html

    O dear God I remember this guy/that case now- sick freak.
    B

  42. Rose says:

    @Blink. Did KH remarry? if so, did she have a child? If so, age/sex?
    How about the allegedly longtime mistress he was allegedly seeing in June 2010?
    If true, a child? ditto.

    In an environment where I seem to spend most of my time asking for folks to form opinions based on facts and not rumor or innuendo, it would be disingenuous of me at best to comment on that without having a marriage cert in my hand to back it up. I do not, therefore I do not know with certainty either way.
    B

  43. erose says:

    ATG, I wholeheartedly agree with you in principle, however the argument is that when LE targets a specific group they will appear in the courthouse more than their counterparts. I have no answers, only more questions. I am currently reading “Black Rednecks and White Liberals” by Thomas Sowell. It’s a compilation of essays that I think you will find it provocative.

    snip>

    The title essay is based on Sowell’s thesis about the origins of the “black ghetto” culture. Sowell argues that the black ghetto culture, which is claimed to be “authentic black culture”, is actually a highly dysfunctional white southern redneck culture which existed during the antebellum South. This culture came, in turn, from the “Cracker culture” of the North Britons and Scots-Irish who migrated from the generally lawless border regions of Britain. Sowell gives a number of examples that he regards as supporting the lineage, e.g., an aversion to work, proneness to violence, neglect of education, sexual promiscuity, improvidence, drunkenness, lack of entrepreneurship,… and a style of religious oratory marked by strident rhetoric, unbridled emotions, and flamboyant imagery.[1]

    says Wiki
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Rednecks_and_White_Liberals

    A Texas Grandfather says:
    July 18, 2017 at 3:07 pm

    snip>

    This piece is also about “Progressive” thinking regarding Social Justice for those being prosecuted. Social justice is a made-up concept. Everyone should be equal before the law regardless of their station in society or the color of their skin or ethnic background.

    If one particular group of people do not follow the law, then they will more likely be at the courts defending themselves. While this will show a disproportionate share of cases for that group, they should be looking at their behavior in society rather than claiming or lobbying for special considerations.

  44. Rose says:

    OT hadn’t planned to comment on anything construed political or controversial, but I suggest, ATG and erose, one might google the three words social justice Amos which I suspect erose and others are familiar with. I studied Amos when getting a BA in Theology in what now is most likely a right wing “evangelical” place populated with the less educated. In my day profs had PhDs, and our President from Philadelphia was Bishop of Pennsyl and 4 other States in the Reformed Episcopalian denom. None of these modern day TV shock jock “preachers” who mix politics and religion like today would be respected. At least Henry Fosdick, who pioneered the politicization of theology was well educated.

    For those of the Judeo or Christian faiths, our concept of social justice stems from our texts and most especially from the OT prophets, and particularly Amos and the minor prophets.

    in the US and abroad many people are not equal under the law for a variety of reasons, not merely poverty, race, or religion. Our founding fathers were aspirational, but it was a class, sexist, slave-holding society, and laws evolved to implement our aspirational Constitution.

    I would like to see some social justice for children who need protection, education, and temporary or lifelong care in all our States.

  45. erose says:

    Rose, To your reboot of the system. How does the state place foster kids in a home that isn’t licensed by the state.

    Oregonian 01-19-16

    Back in February 2009, the head of Oregon’s child welfare programs emailed her boss with worries about Portland foster care provider Give Us This Day.
    “At a site visit last week, numerous concerns arose (on top of the fact that they aren’t licensed) — the most serious of which is that every single staff person has a criminal record,” Erinn Kelley-Siel wrote to the Department of Human Services’ director, Bruce Goldberg.

    Yes, the group home didn’t have a license and every person on the staff had a criminal record. Every. Single. One.

    https://nationalparentsorganization.org/blog/22752-oregon-foster-care-system-riddled-with-crime-abuse-and-neglect-of-children

    I have no words.
    B

  46. erose says:

    Same link. Geez. (Maybe we should let kids vote.)

    Conditions there were well known to child welfare authorities, but nothing was done. As it turns out, that’s no surprise. Why? Because abuse and neglect by foster care providers is acceptable under Oregon’s laws and the rules that supposedly regulate them.

    Now, providers can keep their license if they’re “substantially” in compliance, even if regulators have repeatedly confirmed abuse and neglect.

    You read that right. “Repeatedly confirmed abuse and neglect” are A-OK with Oregon state regulators.

  47. erose says:

    More on GUTD aptly titled “Home Sweet Hustle.” If you read on you will see that the hardest cases such as sexual abuse vic’s were sent here, and as we later learn (in 2016) all of the staff are criminals. Hope I’m not drifting too o/t as I know Kyron was not in foster care, but being a foster parent could gain someone access to a school. (Not that anyone needed that to get in to the SF) In the larger sense, this seems to establish the lack of accountability of Mult. Co.

    snip>
    Holden, by her own admission, violated state nonprofit laws and Give Us This Day’s bylaws by improperly selling nearly $700,000 worth of real estate, including property donated by Multnomah County.

    http://www.wweek.com/portland/article-25389-home-sweet-hustle.html

    If that woman is not under investigation by the US DOJ I will eat my hat.
    B

  48. Rose says:

    ot anything known about f milligan’s early life or bio?
    ——
    If kyron were taken by a man in a position
    of community trust, what would that look like?

    That he was not known to anyone in contact at the school with the presumption he was also SZ. I used to think it possible that SZ must have been seen again at the school following his exit with Kyron- simply because it seemed to me LE was so reluctant to admit his “status” to the investigation. When I received confirmation that to date he has not been identified, I no longer believe that.

    Iirc Milligan was incarcerated several years before- but I could cite several cases where a previous abuse victim becomes an abuser. I do not doubt for a milisecond he is associated with unsolved crimes, however. In my view you are right to follow the track of a sexually motivated offender who “abducts”.

    As one more example of how “differently” Kyron’s case is being managed in contrast with other investigations- I offer the recent release of an artist sketch of an unamed suspect in the abduction and murder of Indiana girls Liberty German and Abigail Williams. Granted this image was allegedly corroborated via video taken from Liberty’s phone, but it was rendered from an eye witness account from a woman who came into contact with the suspect on the trail:

    http://fox59.com/2017/07/17/police-release-sketch-of-man-accused-of-murdering-delphi-teens-liberty-german-and-abigail-williams/

    So, if I were to contrast this with Kyron’s case- 1. Images and videos taken inside or outside the school that day were not requested from witnesses I spoke to. In my view, everyone interviewed should have been asked the question and asked to provide LE with a copy (without identifying a potential POI or anything else- they KNOW what they are looking for and it stood to influence genuine eyewitness accounts). 2. At no time have any witnesses to SZ ever been asked to assist with an artist sketch. Do we see the difference in a proactive and targeted investigation here?
    B

  49. erose says:

    DHS outright lied! Sorry for all of the posts, I am incensed.

    snip>

    (The DHS says both homes remain licensed for foster care.)

    http://www.wweek.com/portland/article-25389-home-sweet-hustle.html

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