Kyron Horman Case Update: Blinkoncrime.com Legal Analyst Lea Conner Weighs In
Portland, OR- Please Welcome Again blinkoncrime.com Contributing Editor And Legal Analyst, Washington Family Law Attorney, Lea Conner.
Although I am not licensed in Oregon, I grew up there and was a news reporter for several years in that state, during which time I covered the cops and courts beat. My practice in Washington state deals in family law matters. As such, I can comment as to my knowledge of family law and court proceedings, but my comments are general analysis, not legal advice.
Kaine Horman’s pleadings of October 25, 2010, unleashed a tempest of charges against his wife, claiming she was a raging drunk whose inability to control her anger and her drinking had already caused her to give up custody of one child prior to the disappearance of her stepson on June 4, 2010. Unlike his prior, more tersely-written court filings, Mr. Horman’s words are more personal and angry. They are also contradicted by his prior statements to the court and to the media, and the very documentation he provided as part of his October 25 court papers.
The latest round of pleadings from Mr. Horman seems to fit a far bigger effort by Mr. Horman and Desiree Young to push Ms. Horman to the point where she would be forced to speak in her own defense. Ms. Horman’s own writings within days of Kryon’s disappearance evidence her Achilles heel in that Ms. Horman complained loudly about criticism heaped upon her via the internet.
What followed was a whisper campaign of purported law enforcement leaks about Ms. Horman and people around her that has continually kept her name in the news since June 4, 2010. Mr. Horman’s court filings also evidence an effort to keep Ms. Horman under constant public scrutiny, by filing multiple motions over time that could have been either avoided or filed jointly.
Consider this: Kaine Horman failed to mention in his June 28, 2010, restraining order application that he wanted his wife out of the house and, as a result, on July 1, 2010, filed an amended petition for restraints and asked for an expedited hearing.
“..This omission is an odd oversight, considering that Mr. Horman filed for divorce, took the parties’ child, but failed to ask for the house. Possession of the family home is such a basic issue it would seem impossible for a family law attorney to forget to mention it in a party’s opening paper…”
Filing a separate motion to seek return of the family home seems like a good strategy for someone seeking to keep the focus on Ms. Horman. It’s new information to the media, whereas the fact that Kryon remained missing and Mr. Horman and Ms. Young’s suspicions about Ms. Horman were yesterday’s headline.
Early on in criminal investigation and prior to the divorce filing, Mr. Horman described his wife in benign terms. As the weeks stretch on, these descriptions became increasingly negative. Mr. Horman and Ms. Young both stated their objective was to keep the focus on Kyron. In the absence of anything new to report, both parents embarked on a campaign to slowly heap increasing pressure on Ms. Horman to talk.
From the law enforcement perspective, Ms. Horman is a natural suspect, given her relationship to the victim and the fact that she was the last person known to have been seen with him. Except for anonymous leaks and rumors, the only people who have put their names to allegations are Mr. Horman and Kyron’s mother Desiree Young. Both claim their information comes from law enforcement, but both have disagreed at times as to the credibility of the information they shared publicly. Such was the case with Ms. Young’s claim that Kyron was last seen outside the school near a white truck, while Mr. Horman quickly corrected her, saying the information had not been confirmed.
“..Without Ms. Young and Det. Tony Young in the room, Mr. Horman seems to have gone off script and now cannot control his message nor his anger. Mr. Horman angrily complains about horrible things that might have happened in front of Kiara, yet he cannot say what exactly became of Kyron, and whether there is any evidence to suggest Kiara was a witness to this unspecified event…”
In his most recent pleadings, Mr. Horman angrily recounts that Ms. Horman claimed she was going to the gym, but since their separation, he has come to believe that she spent the time talking to people and flirting. The portrait of a social butterfly chatting people up at the gym for hours on end doesn’t quite fit with Mr. Horman’s other claims that she was an angry, depressed new mother who drank her self blotto and could not maintain any sort of civility toward those around her.
Which is it? Was Ms. Horman a mean drunk who drank herself to sleep, or was she self-absorbed and social, staying up to all hours playing on the Internet while her child sat in the same room unattended and un-engaged? Or was she a social butterfly who spent most of her time outside the home while Mr. Horman was super dad, working long hours from home, caring for the children, and providing an income that he never could enjoy because Ms. Horman was spending it all? The claims are so disjointed, it is as though Mr. Horman decided to throw spaghetti at the wall, just to see what might stick.
Mr. Horman’s over-reaching was fore shadowed in an earlier motion filed on July 12, 2010, alleging Ms. Horman had violated the courts seal on the restraining order. The pleadings in the contempt matter went well beyond Mr. Horman’s claim that Ms. Horman allegedly disclosed confidential court papers to Michael Cook.
Mr. Horman asserted that Ms. Horman was involved with a sexual relationship with Mr. Cook and had sent him hundreds of text messages, most of which were sexual in nature (AKA “sexting”). These text messages allegedly included images of “graphic sexual activity,” though no such photos have been filed with the court.
“..Mr. Horman accused Ms. Horman of lacking any genuine affection for Kyron or Kiara saying that although her texts said she missed both children, the mentions were few. The implication of the narrative was that Ms. Horman could not possibly care about either child…”
Except for the specific passage alleging Ms. Horman shared a confidential document with Mr. Cook, none of the other allegations had anything to do with the underlying motion. None of these claims addressed the issue of whether Ms. Horman violated the court order, nor do they indicate any involvement by Ms. Horman in Kyron’s disappearance.
Mr. Horman went on to claim that an unnamed member or members of law enforcement “informed” him that the sexualized text messages “resemble” text messages sent to the “the man Respondent [Ms. Horman] previously attempted to hire to murder Petitioner [Mr. Horman].” Mr. Horman claimed in the same July 1 2court papers that Ms. Horman had asked Mr. Cook to lie to her attorney about “the fact that she had gone to Mr. Cook’s home.”
One news outlet found Mr. Horman’s pleadings so lurid it titled the document “sleazy.pdf” before posting it to its website.
On October 25, 2010, Mr. Horman finally filed the aforementioned text messages with the court, as an exhibit attached to his response to Ms. Horman’s parenting time request. A review of these document reveals that Ms. Horman never asked Mr. Cook to lie, nor did she speak of Kyron and Kiara in dismissive tones. Although most of the texts showed varying degrees of sexual discussion, there were also several texts that had nothing to do with Ms. Horman’s romantic attachments. Ms. Horman discussed cooking, eating “nutterbutter bites,” weight lifting, and their respective children.
..”Ms. Horman told Mr. Cook, “I was really upset that Kaine has Kitty but doesn’t know what her favorite toy or blanket is.”
-Terri Horman
A parent who does not care about her daughter would not waste a single moment worrying about her child having her favorite toy or blanket. The allegation that Mr. Horman did not know such basic information about his daughter provides motive for Mr. Horman to attempt to discredit Ms. Horman’s words as insincere. Otherwise, Ms. Horman’s words are truthful and reflect her historical relationship as primary care giver to both children.
On July 28, 2010, Mr. Horman filed yet another motion demanding Ms. Horman reveal the source of funds used to pay her lawyer. It was as though Mr. Horman was asking how Ms. Horman could have ever come up with that kind of money, given her status as a social pariah?
The problem with Mr. Horman’s strategy of piecemeal litigation it does not serve the purpose of expediting litigation. Instead, it creates a lot of embarrassment and harassment for Ms. Horman.
Oregon is a no-fault divorce state. This means that either party can ask for a divorce without having to prove any wrongdoing. Oregon is also an “equitable distribution” state which means that the court divides property equitably between the parties. Issues like infidelity and rude behavior are not factors in whether a party is entitled to divorce, or in dividing up the parties assets.
Mr. Horman raises several issues about Ms. Horman’s alleged conduct citing them as as basis to award sole custody and care of Kiara. The allegations are such that it becomes difficult for Ms. Horman to leave any responses up to her lawyer, who would not have personal knowledge required to speak to the many issues he raises.
Ultimately, the court will consider the allegations made by each party, weigh the credibility and relevance of each claim as to parenting issues then enter a temporary order as to the care and custody of the child.
Mr. Horman claims in his October 25 filings that Ms. Horman has a five year history of alcohol impairment. In his statement to the court, Mr. Horman claimed that his wife “could have an un diagnosed personality disorder or some type of emotional disturbance.”
The most recent claims by Mr. Horman are contradicted by his prior assertions in media interviews, and the actual chronology of the Hormans’ relationship.
Mr. Horman met Ms. Horman in the spring of 2002. According to Mr. Horman, the couple moved in together in December 2002. The couple was living together when Ms. Horman was cited for DUI on July 10, 2005. Two years later, the couple moved to their home on NW Sheltered Nook Road in January 2007.
Despite the DUI, Mr. Horman nonetheless went on to marry Ms. Horman on April 15, 2007. Ms. Horman gave birth to Kiara on November 12, 2008.
In a prior interview with KGW, Mr. Horman called Ms. Horman “a good person when we first met and for several years (I’d say up until 2008). She was always about children (teaching) and helping them grow and develop. Her attitude was always about those types of things first, her own self not even being a priority close to that. I believe that this is the Terri that everyone else saw and got to know as I did. Honestly everyone, including myself, that knew her or knows her did not see this coming. She was not the type of person we are seeing right now.”
Mr. Horman told KGW that he was blindsided by Kyron’s disappearance: “There were some signs of emotional distress here and there over the past year and a half but not enough of that directed at any one person to conclude she would be capable of anything even remotely close to events of the severity we have all seen. She recently got her teaching license re-instated and has been applying for teaching positions so even the state of Oregon didn’t see this coming.”
The person described in Mr. Horman’s October 25 court papers is not someone who could be described as hidden danger. If believed, Mr. Horman’s most recent statement outline a terrifying picture of a five-year pattern of child abuse and endangerment. Mr. Horman could not possibly be telling the truth in both of his interview with KGW and in his more recent court papers.
Also in the October 25 filing, Mr. Horman claims that he has always been the primary care giver to both Kiara and Kyron and describes Ms. Horman as frequently absent from their home, apparently leaving him with both children.
In a July 28, 2010, Oregonian article, Mr. Horman claimed Kiara was a much different child now that Ms. Horman was gone. He claimed Kiara did not ask about her mom. “‘She’s a new kid,’ he said. ‘She’s whole new kid now.’”
In a separate article, Mr. Horman discussed Ms. Horman’s excessive involvement in Kyron’s schooling and adamant enforcement of discipline. “He [Mr. Horman] said when Kyron brought home anything but a green card [indicating good behavior at school] she [Ms. Horman] wanted Kaine to discipline him by grounding him to his room for the evening.”
Mr. Horman also asserts in his October 25 court papers that Ms. Horman would put Kiara in the gym day care for “hours at a time,” and further claimed that Ms. Horman “spent more time on the computer than caring for the children.” If Mr. Horman was home and providing primary care for the children, then how would Kiara have ended up in day care for “hours at at time”? How would the children have remained unattended while Ms. Horman was updating her Facebook page?
Mr. Horman’s other narrative seems to indicate that Mr. Horman was not present in the home during the day, leaving Ms. Horman to care for the children. It also contradicts Mr. Horman’s escalating accusations that Ms. Horman was absent from the home, uninvolved, and not involved with the care of Kyron and Kiara.
Mr. Horman also claims in his pleadings that Ms. Horman’s son James lived with them until Feb 5, 2010, when he moved because Ms. Horman “was unable to interact with James on a healthy level and had him move to her parents’ home in Roseburg.”
Mr. Horman also claimed he was unaware of any landscaper, a detail which contradicts his most recent work-from-home story: “No, I did not know we had a landscaper and have never met him.” If he was at home, surely he would have known about a landscaper.
On July 8, 2010, Mr. Horman told the Oregonian that Ms. Horman began having problems with postpartum depression in November 2008.
“‘I thought the marriage was doing pretty well,’ Kaine Horman said during a one-on-one interview with The Oregonian, ‘until we had our daughter, Kiara.’ Horman said he thought his marriage to Terri Moulton Horman fractured within six months after she gave birth in November 2008, the result of postpartum depression.Terri Horman was put on medication for the depression, and her doctor told Kaine to keep an eye on her to make sure she was OK, he said. But she wasn’t OK.
If Mr. Horman thought Ms. Horman was a chronic danger to her children and Mr. Horman’s son,why did he not mention it prior to October 25, 2010? Could it be that Mr. Horman’s entire series of pleadings are designed to push Ms. Horman with ever-increasing allegations to the point where she has no choice but to respond?
There are other clues that Mr. Horman’s latest version of events is not entirely accurate. According to more recent news stories, James is again living with his mother. Strange, considering Mr. Horman’s claims that James changed high schools mid-semester and moved hundreds of miles because of Ms. Horman’s behavior.
There are also hints concerning law enforcement’s interest in the Horman dissolution. A June 6, 2010, letter from Norm W. Frink, chief deputy district attorney for Multnomah County, rescinded his statement that un sealing the restraining order would undermine the “ongoing criminal investigation.” If Ms. Horman was the target of the investigation, what purpose would be served by sealing court documents that were to be served upon Ms. Horman? The only other person identified in the pleadings was an unnamed landscaper alleged to have been contacted by Ms. Horman.
As we now know, the landscaper was involved in what has been characterized as a botched sting operation against Ms. Horman. As such, the only person protected by the the seal was Ms. Horman to the extent that the seal prevented the allegations from being disseminated publicly. Or could it be that law enforcement was concerned about accuracy of the information provided by the landscaper?
Law enforcement conducted its sting operation over open channels that were accessible to anyone listening on police channels. Was this an oversight, or was it a convenient way to ensure the information was released “unintentionally”?
If there was any blame for promoting a bogus murder for hire plot, law enforcement could point to Ms. Horman as bringing upon her own misery. She chose to disclose the documents, and as a result, the information was disseminated because of her actions in violating a court order, not law enforcement’s efforts to run out a possible lead, even if later proven false.
We don’t know what role Michael Cook played in the disclosure of the now-public restraining order. The texts between he and Ms. Horman seems to indicate Mr. Cook was not so much interested in sexual banter as much as he was in gathering information for Mr. Horman
The roles of Mr. Cook and the landscaper are highly relevant to evidentiary issues. If the landscaper was a confidential informant, the information he reported that was used as basis for the restraining order could not then be considered an admission against interest. Same thing applies to Mr. Cook.
Mr. Cook in particular seems not to be acting out of concern for Kyron. Who the hell smirks at a vigil for a missing child?)
Reading Mr. Cook’s texts to Terri, there’s a tone that suggests that someone was sitting right next to him, telling him what to type. If true, the question becomes who is that someone guiding Mr. Cook’s actions?
The sexting is weird, but it is hardly ground breaking. The courts have heard such allegations many times before, and without a doubt, the court has seen far worse. That is not to see the court is going to like the texts. Rather, the judge here is going to look at the pleadings with a critical eye for issues that affect parenting time.
Mr. Horman does not offer any evidence that Ms. Horman ever sexted when she should have been parenting. To the contrary Ms. Horman’s lawyers can point to Mr. Horman’s other statements as evidence that Ms. Horman was the primary care giver for James, Kyron, and Kiara. Her extensive collection of family photographs on her Facebook page support this assertion.
Mr. Horman cannot credibly claim that Ms. Horman was a threat to the children, considering that he often left the kids in her care. Mr. Horman did not have any concerns about Ms. Horman’s sobriety and fitness to care for the children the morning Kryon disappeared from school, as he left Kiara in her care and allowed her to take Kyron to school.
If she was a drunk and mean spirited, would Mr. Horman have have allowed Ms. Horman to have access to Kyron’s school records, and to become involved in his discipline? Ms. Horman was a step parent to Kyron. She had no rights except to that which Mr. Horman granted in signed consent forms required by Kyron’s school.
The text messages are racy, but they do not indicate any homicidal tendencies or ill will toward anyone. Nothing in the texts is homicidal by any stretch.
Mr. Horman’s source for his allegations poses a huge problem here. He cites to “law enforcement” as telling him Ms. Horman tried to hire a hit-man, and as to other issues. Not one of these allegations is admissible under any exception to hearsay. The fact that Mr. Horman does not identify the source is a problem in itself. This information might as well be graffiti on the wall of the public bathroom at the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office.
Were Mr. Horman to say that he read an allegation on the a bathroom wall at the MCSO would at least give it some sort of context that would suggest credibility. Mr. Horman’s vague claim makes it impossible to identify which law enforcement office among thousands in the United States might have conveyed such information. Without further identification, the reader cannot tell if the “source” was in a position to have any such knowledge in the first place.
The hearsay allegations offered by Mr. Horman allege child abuse and domestic violence. Under the Confrontation Clause, Ms. Horman has a right to confront her accusers. Ms. Horman does not need to speak in order for her lawyers to cross examine the sources of these allegations.
“..Mr. Horman claims that judges believe there is sufficient information to implicate Ms. Horman in Kyron’s disappearance. This begs the question: How is it that Mr. Horman is getting this information?”
It seems likely that Mr. Horman is referring to search warrants, which require reliable information that the item sought can be found at that location. If Mr. Horman was in fact referring to search warrants, it would be very interesting to find out who provided the information for the searches and what exactly was law enforcement looking for?
If Mr. Horman was the informant, it raises questions as to motive because Mr. Horman wants custody of Kiara. If the landscaper was the affiant, his personal motive for revenge becomes an issue, if it true that Ms. Horman had law enforcement go to his house and expose his extramarital affair in front of his family.
What law enforcement was seeking matters. Ms. Horman’s specialty was in teaching children with learning disabilities. She would have had access to confidential psychological testing, mental health records, medical documents, and possibly, CPS records, none of which could be disclosed except by parent authorization, or pursuant to subpoena or search warrant. Even though she had not worked in that area for some time, she may still have had such records in her home or on her laptop.
If Ms. Horman had such documents or data on her laptop or among her personal papers, she could not turn it over except by subpoena. As such, the mere presence of a search warrant does not mean Ms. Horman is guilty of anything.
..”Mr. Horman’s threat to conduct extensive depositions seems a clear warning to Ms. Horman that he intends to call Ms. Horman’s friends to deposition, put them under oath, and ask them questions. Lots of questions. If Mr. Horman’s pleadings are any sort of a hint, he is not going to make people feel good about befriending Ms. Horman…”
Peter Bunch’s statements at the prior court hearing referencing a December 26 call to 9-1-1 also suggests that maybe something happened the day after Christmas 2009. The implication is that Mr. Bunch intends to discuss that December 26 9-1-1 call in more detail. Don’t expect Mr. Horman to like any of it.
Discovery procedures allow Mr. Horman to get at any information reasonably calculated to lead to discovery of admissible evidence. This does not mean the information specifically sought must be admissible, only that it could reasonably lead to evidence that would be admissible. By that definition, Mr, Horman could justify deposing a great many people in Ms. Horman’s life.
Peter Bunch’s statements at the prior court hearing referencing a December 26 call to 9-1-1 also suggests that maybe something happened the day after Christmas 2009.
Clearly, each of these people has reason to avoid going back to court.
The most confusing aspect of this case is the fact that the restraining order and dissolution were consolidated months ago. Ms. Horman’s attorney notes this in his July 12, 2010, letter to the court.
Given that there is an abatement order in place, how is it that Ms. Horman can go forward with her request for parenting time under the restraining order matter? You would think that Ms. Rackner would have noted this information to the court. But she didn’t. Yet another strange footnote in a even stranger case.
Law enforcement likes to push the weakest link. Ms. Horman seems to be that link. What information does law enforcement hope to gain? Who is law enforcement’s ultimate target?
..”If not Ms. Horman exclusively, or Ms. Horman in any capacity, then who exactly does law enforcement hope to catch by pushing Ms. Horman until she finally breaks?”
< ?xml:namespace prefix ="" o />
Related Posts
Related Posts:
414 Comments
RSS feed for comments on this post. TrackBack URI
Terms/items that jump out @me w/ first read:
Bunch (again) states; “Father obtained FAPA Order against Mother, based on hearsay statements” …
“Despite repeated requests by Mother’s lawyers, which date back to July 2010, Father refuses to allow Mother to see Kiara under any circumstances.”
“after the court abated the parties’ divorce proceeding, because Father continues to deny Mother contact w/ Kiara, Mother filed a motion to modify the FAPA order so that supervised parenting time could occur. As Father is aware, because Mother is the focus of ***parallel criminal investigations***, she is not in a position to fully participate in any legal proceedings @ this time. Importantly, she is ***unable to obtain information from the police*** that is essential to the claims raised by the Father, and upon which the court granted Father’s petition for a FAPA Order.”
“After filing her motion to modify … Mother continued to have ***some hope*** that Father would respond to her efforts to ***informally arrange supervised contact*** between Kiara & her. However, Father rejected those efforts, and, on October 25, he filed an affidavit in response to Mother’s modification motion that can only be described as ***vicious in its tone and content***. The ***thrust*** of Father’s affidavit is to ***vilify*** Mother. His allegations have little or nothing to do with whether there
exist appropriate conditions under which Kiara can reconnect w/ her mother>”
“Based on the ***incendiary tactics*** Father employed in his affidavit, and in view of his concerted efforts to deny Kiara any contact w/ her mother, it is becoming evident that Father’s ***mission*** is to completely ***destroy & sabotage*** the mother/child relationship. It is also becoming evident that, no matter what the court may ultimately order, there is no reason to believe the Father will do anything other than to continue to engage in these ***harsh tactics***, to the ***utter detriment*** of his daughter.
“It is important to reiterate that this proceeding is govern by ***Oregon Evidence Code, the Oregon Rules of Civil Procedure, & the Oregon Rules of Professional Conduct.***In clear contravention to those governing legal principles, Father’s affidavit is peppered w/ references to Mother’s alleged difficulties w/ ***multiple polygraph examinations***….”
“Father’s affidavit was prepared by his experienced attorney … previously employed as a DDA. The affidavit, purposely & in a calculated manner, included ***inadmissible polygraph references***, which in Oregon Supreme Court has expressly ***forbidden*** to received in all Oregon courts. After Father filed the affidavit, it was immediately made public & disseminated widely by the Oregonian newspaper & local TV news outlets…”
:It is apparent that, under the circumstances, the intent the Father & his lawyer was to ***deliberately*** introduce into the FAPA & divorce proceedings ***inadmissible*** polygraph evidence in a manner that is calculated to ***gain unfair advantage*** in those matters, and to ***inflame*** & ***poison*** opinion against Mother. Father’s actions in this affidavit were ***contrary*** to Oregon law.”
“Similarly, Father & his lawyer gratuitously included !& pages of deeply ***personal*** texts message exchanges between Mother & mutual friend of Mother & Father. The subject matter of the texts is plainly adult in nature. Nothing in those messages support Father’s allegations that there is no conditions under which Mother should be allowed to see her daughter. Again, one can only conclude that Father & his lawyer set forth these texts to further ***tar*** Mother in his on going campaign to ***convict her in the court of public opinion***. That conduct violates the requirements of ORCP 17.”
“There are ongoing ***criminal investigations*** that are ***focused*** on Mother & that raises serious impediments as to Mother’s ability to assert her custodial & parenting time rights. Because of the ***possible jeopardy*** Mother faces, she is not in the position @ this time to testify on her own behalf in support of request for parenting time. The ***sole*** issue that needs to be addressed in Mother’s motion is whether there are appropriate, supervised circumstances under which Kiara can be reunited w/ her mother. However, rather than making a long-range & reasoned assessment of what is in Kiara’s best interests, Father is ***focused***on Mother’s ***destruction***. His ***inflammatory*** rhetoric does nothing to meet his daughter’s needs; rather he is flouting well-established principles of Oregon law to further his ***crusade*** against Mother.”
“In sum, it appears that there is no conceivable set of rules or circumstances under which the Father will ***ever*** agree to allow Kiara to ***promptly*** reconnect w/her mother, notwithstanding the fact that even parents who are ***incarcerated*** get to see their children. It is consistent w/the norms of our society to promote the continuation of contact between parents & their children; public policy simply does not support prohibiting supervised contact between Kiara & her mother.”
“Despite Father’s ***overheated rhetoric***, it is not a matter of great complexity for the court to establish safe & secure guidelines for contact between Kiara & her mother. This matter need not, as Father alleges, ***require extensive discovery, multiple depositions, a custody evaluation, & a four-day trial to resolve***, particularly in view of these facts:
>>>(1) Mother cannot obtain reciprocal discovery;
>>>(2) as Father knows, Mother ***cannot participate in providing any information*** @ this time; given the focus of the criminal investigations on her & given Mother’s ***interests in preserving her freedom***; and
(3) Mother is willing to accept virtually any conditions for parenting time ***that do not require the waiver of her constitutional rights***”
“Father & his lawyer, Ms. Rackner, deliberately chose to introduce ***hearsay & other improper evidence***. This includes polygraph evidence, even though the Oregon Supreme Court decided 26yrs ago that such evidence is unreliable & inadmissible in any court proceedings. Such improper and ***sanctionable*** actions are not motivated by what is the best interest of Kiara. Further, this ***brazen*** disregard of an Oregon Supreme Court ruling was apparently calculated to cause Mother ***grievous*** harm in these proceedings a\& in the community @ large. ***The full extent of the harm to the Mother caused by these tactics is far-reaching, unacceptable, and likely irreparable***.”
THIS IS SIGNED BY BOTH HOUZE & BUNCH.
REMEMBER, Houze is known for following “the letter of the law” & he expects any lawyer he is dealing w/ to do the same.
Once again, we SEE WHERE TMH stands by the Lines 5 thru line 9 of page 5 states: “Mother ***cannot participate in providing any information*** @ this time; given the focus of the criminal investigations on her & given Mother’s ***interests in preserving her freedom***; and”Mother is willing to accept virtually any conditions for parenting time ***that do not require the waiver of her constitutional rights***”
RESPONDENT’S REPLY TO PETITIONER’S RESPONSE TO RESPONDENT’S MOTION TO MODIFY RESTRAINING ORDER TO PREVENT ABUSE CASE NO 1006-66084 [DATED 10/29/2010]
OREGONIAN LINK:
http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/hormanfiling.pdf
I have not had time to reread the analysis as many times as I’d like and don’t want to analyze the analysis anyway. I would like to say I appreciate Lea Conner’s time and efforts and insights. I mean absolutely no disrespect, and I hope it isn’t taken that way, but it appears to me that she has been a member of the Washington Bar for 3 years. Like a family member of mine who is an attorney, she is very intelligent, skilled in her field and in doing research – that’s obvious.
That said, this case is so complicated in many ways that it seems almost to be a battle between attorneys relying on years and years of experience plus their “silent partners”. “Silent partner” could mean LE, the DA, even a judge – not in the sense that a judge would side with a particular motion intentionally, but my experience has been that attorneys with lots of experience get to know and be able to predict pretty well how each particular judge is likely to react to certain things. I expect some precedents will be set in how this is handled when all is said and done.
I do not believe any of the attorneys have taken leave of their senses or forgotten their law school training, or that they would allow their client to present anything they didn’t approve unless it was one of those Perry Mason end of the trial confessions on the stand. I also am confident the attorneys will not knowingly allow their clients to lie or to give testimonies that seem to change over time without being able to explain.
I would expect Houze to already have had a psych eval of Terri done for his own information. He has no obligation to tell that he did or the results. I see some of what is being done as “posturing” rather than direct legal moves. I would not be surprised to see more things withdrawn or amended or settled bit by bit in this legal chess game.
What I’m saying is that I really like reading the general textbook correct and customary way of doing things – I think it helps us sort out what’s being presented, however, I have to keep in mind that there is a lot more going on behind closed doors than we know or will ever know. It reminds me that I once had a student who was diagnosed with oppositional defiant disorder. If a teacher got to the “end of her rope” of ideas, she (or he) would sometimes present the opposite suggestion from what was desired in order to get the student to do a project or test the right way. It was a risk, but the outcome benefited the student.
I certainly consider Ms. Conner’s contributions a lot more valuable than those retired or out of the loop LE people that the media (and Nancy G.) use to second guess the MCSO. I just went through a case that had both DHS, 2 different counties, and the state criminal court involved. It was much simpler but even at that, the family court judge had to ask the lawyers for help during court about what he was supposed to make a judgment on or whether another court should do it.
Perhaps someday there will be attorneys who are trained and who specialize in dealing with “odd combinations of jurisdictions”, although I’d prefer to think we would stop having the crimes that bring this on.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman.html
This was probably the best article about Terri’s life in general. She was a sub teacher but I don’t see anywhere that she was a Special Ed teacher or that she even qualified to be one in Oregon. There were likely some Sp Ed students in the classes where she subbed, but I can’t imagine any reason why she would ever have files on her own computer or need access to anything but the IEP with information about what was supposed to be done in the classroom. She could have been the “classroom teacher” on the IEP team, but if she had personal files on her computer at home, I’d be very concerned – not saying she did, but it was brought up as a possibility.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2009-09-14-women-alcoholism_N.htm
from the article: The numbers are troubling: An estimated 17.6 million adults in the USA are either alcoholics or have alcohol problems, according to the National Institutes of Health. By some estimates, one-third of alcoholics are women. Yet if you were to ask a woman’s friends and family if she has a drinking problem, they might very well say no.
When Paula Tokar, 26, told her friends she was getting sober and wouldn’t be partying with them anymore, “They said, ‘You seemed fine to us,’ ” says Tokar, now two years sober and living in Marshfield, Mass. That’s because she’d worked hard to hide her alcohol abuse. “I was doing the things many women do, hiding drinks around the house, hiding vodka behind the frozen veggie burgers.”
————————-
I would not be surprised if every time a period of “good” came along in the Horman relationship, Kaine dropped his concerns about Terri’s drinking, wishfully thinking it was no longer a problem. It can take years for someone to develop alcoholism especially if they start as an adult. Hopefully, Terri didn’t drink during her pregnancy which would have been another period when things seemed to improve. I can’t say one way or another – all I can say for sure is that alcoholics manipulate the truth and those who are manipulated may not see it until it appears in the rear view mirror.
ccane says:
October 30, 2010 at 4:43 pm
Blink if Terri is a danger to her daughter like Kaine claims why is child protective srvs not involved. Surely police can bring them into this case .. right?
—————-
I’m not Blink, obviously, but I can see no reason the state (DHS) would want to bring anyone into this case to protect Kiara since she has one parent obviously doing his best to protect her now and Terri has no contact with Kiara. If she got unsupervised visitation and something happened, then a report could be made to CPS-DHS. I think we have to wait and see what the family court decides about custody and visitation.
@Beejay … if you notice, KY references the MFH but not the alleged sexting with RS, which was during the marriage .. in fact RS is never ever mentioned … MC sexting was after KH left … curious???
oops … was suppose to be KH references the MFH .. not KY
Blink,
I was just curious what you meant in the first quote below. Was it in relation to the following quote? Sometimes I hate being so literal. It is a personal struggle I have that can be good and bad
I just think I got lost in my translation and know I made the 2nd quote relative to great praise of the work contained by you and Ms. Conner. I hope it was understood that way.
—-
“Please practice my favorite line to the-collective- hands-over-their-ears of BOC editors.”
“’It is what It is’”.
Was not personal, was general. I have attempted to help some remove the emotion out of the situation and focus on the instant case issue.
B
26.Kaylee says:
October 30, 2010 at 12:35 pm
Kaine’s filing doesn’t talk about the specific time frame (besides for “five year history of alcohol impairment”) of Terri’s alcohol abuse and whether it was continual or did it increase recently. Kitty doesn’t look (facially) like she has fetal alcohol affect and she seems right on or above benchmark for development. Maybe it was something that recurred in the six months prior to Kyron’s disappearance and could account for the weight gain. And maybe it was coping for feeling like she was trapped in a bad marriage or dangerous relationship (RS). Regardless, I think it should be added to Mockingbirdsings’ list of possible triggers.
It’s so funny that you should say that because I have been looking at Terri’s pics from FB and I honestly think that Kitty does have the look of a child with fetal alcohol syndrome. Perhaps not badly, but there is something odd about her eyes. I don’t know anything about her development stages so my comment relates only to what I’ve observed in the pictures. Hopefully, I’m flatout wrong. She is a precious little girl.
Can somebody answer a question for me? I posted this on Scared Monkeys.
If this goes to court and Terri pleads the 5th does Kaine still have to take the stand and be crossed examined by Terri’s lawyers?
Re: Mockingbirdsings saying “…I see some of what is being done as “posturing” rather than direct legal moves. I would not be surprised to see more things withdrawn or amended or settled bit by bit in this legal chess game…”
Yes, I wholeheartedly agree and want to add that I think the motion from Houze and Bunch reads more like a press release than a legal motion, perhaps an effort to reshape public opinion that Teri is a victim. And, with all of this smoke, it may be that Houze is already working steps ahead on his appeal in the event that Teri is later convicted of MFH and Kyron’s disappearance, namely that she couldn’t get a fair trial since public opinion has been “poisoned” with allegations from Kaine and LE.
Someone was talking about how relatively small Portland is. I’m thinking how compact the Skyline community is, as well. And wondering now if Jill I. (who got the grant under which RS was hired at Skyline school) has possibly given LE info. as a witness: she must live practically next door to West Wind Farms, where DDS was working on June 4. And, the street they’re both on was one that LE wanted to find witnesses who’d seen that white truck on June 4 morning.
Jill is less than 1/2 mile from WWF, which is a 40 acres-parcel.
********************************
@ puzzled says:
October 30, 2010 at 6:15 pm
________________
Interesting…is your RS sexting focus on “alledged” or on the time frame (during the marriage)?
Rudy Sanchez is … in custody .. a material witness .. irrelevant .. an undercover informant.
What you think about RS’s role depends on what you think happened on June 4th.
@Mermaid14 says:
October 29, 2010 at 12:33 pm
“He talks about her spending too much time on the internet yet I saw facebook posts from him to her facebook account showing his participation in some kind of online gaming thing. ”
****************************************************************
I think he also spent a lot of time online as well, and all of us do too! I regret that That he is using this a a point against her, when he is also guilty of it.
I see that Kaine played Mafia Wars on FB -called himself “Slick Willie”, level 376 -whereas TH called herself “Stealth”, and only at level 89. I know about MW, and you don’t get to level 376 overnight!
So yeah, pot calling the kettle black on that point. imo
I also think it is ridiculous and irrelevant to point out that she would chat and flirt at the gym instead of exercise, leaving baby in kid club… I mean really, it is exhausting and isolating mothering an infant…a couple hours of free child care and a small dose or social life of some sort -good for TH! Does he expect that she should just stay home 24/7, and solely do baby-focused activities, like would be expected of a paid nanny?
by the way, adding to my last post about KH playing Mafia Wars up to level 376… I wonder if he chose to click away in the evenings during family time, or on the clock at Intel… Neither way is ideal….
NelMel,
If Terri is truly being investigated for other crimes, what I would suspect mostly is drug related (pot, steroids, but not so much meth). 2nd would be entrepreneur of some sort of illegal sex business. However, I guess it is very hard for me to suspect her of child sex abuse because I just don’t get that from her. However, I know it happens all the time and I think Oregon has its fair share of issues in that regard.
Moo
@enumclawrose- Tis’ “nameless”, “a” changed to “e” after family “problems”, maybe even legally, IDK. Seems we are of like mind on this one.
**************************************
FWIW – Here is a snippet from DDS alleged “interviews” with her cousin that he posted on the GLP site:
“Dede said she bought the phone on the 30th of June at the Tannasbourne AT&T store in her name with her own credit card, and that LE has the receipts. She said she didn’t know for sure about the other phones but thinks Karen bought one for herself and suspects that Terries phone was purchased by her parents. On the advice of Terris investigator. Not LE.”
Of course this is hearsay x 10, however I would certainly think that TH’s attorney(s) have a PI or two on this case and probably on retainer as a matter of course. This is standard procedure in a case like this, so I tend to believe this particular bit of gossip.
http://ezinearticles.com/?How-Lawyers-and-Private-Investigators-Work-Together&id=1501411
Kaine should immediately take his daughter to a developmental pediatrician or a clinical geneticist physician for an evaluation. If Terri was drinking even small amounts in her pregnancy, she permanently damaged her child. Fetal Alcohol Syndrome or Fetal Alcohol Effects is proof of child abuse which caused permanent damage to multiple organ systems and her skeletal structures.
Regarding the statement by Houze “even convicts get child visitation in jail.” He should know better than to make a statement like that. What he doesn’t say is that it is a far cry different from supervised visitation where you have a caseworker present. Since I have a family member incarcerated, you have no idea the kind of security you have to undergo just to get to visit an inmate. There is no way any monkey business of any kind will take place.
But with just a caseworker who is usually on the non-custodial parent’s turf, things can get much more complicated. You have only to look at the history of child abductions during supervised visitation. It has happened time and time again. TH is NOT incarcerated and free to carry on as she always has which as we know is always suspect and never in the best interest of ANY child, even her own.
If I were the presiding judge, the only way I would ever allow her visitation would be in an enclosed room behind locked doors with someone guarding the door on the outside and the caseworker on the inside watching every move. To do anything else would be to put this child who has already been at risk in even further jeopardy.
6.GraceintheHills says:
October 30, 2010 at 1:13 am
@grace- RE: Lea is Newsatfive…Well, if so, she’s not anymore, LOL, you have “outed” her! I thought she was trying to go incognito for nefarious purposes…
Beejay,
I am the one who commented on how small OREGON really is. You will find people that know people and be amazed by the acquaintance(s) (would not dream of it). I have taken notice previously at how Portlanders infiltrate the less populated areas of Oregon and have amazing connections to carry on — so to speak. Nevertheless, I am sure the area you speak of is very small.
consider this … all of TH’s friends, acquaintences, neighbors were investigated and properties searched. Media reported this. Why not Rudy Sanchez? Why has there not been any investigative reporting on RS? Who he is .. where he lives .. his many business address .. where he was on June 4th .. where he is now ..
sorry, but this is really beginning to bug me.
“Ms. Horman works in special education. She does testing. This suggests she is involved in Individualized Education Program (IEP) evaluations.” – Where is this info coming from? How do you know that she actually WORKS inspecial education? I’ve never seen this.
“Ms. Horman’s resume says that she continued to assist in testing at Skyline from “September 2008 to present.” As such, she might have been involved in more recent testing, whether as a paid consultant or volunteer.” Absolutely NOT true. If this were happening – Ben Keefer and I would be having a talk – even BEFORE Kyron’s disappearance.
10.beejay says:
October 30, 2010 at 7:22 pm
Someone was talking about how relatively small Portland is. I’m thinking how compact the Skyline community is, as well. And wondering now if Jill I. (who got the grant under which RS was hired at Skyline school) has possibly given LE info. as a witness: she must live practically next door to West Wind Farms, where DDS was working on June 4. And, the street they’re both on was one that LE wanted to find witnesses who’d seen that white truck on June 4 morning.
Jill is less than 1/2 mile from WWF, which is a 40 acres-parcel.
********************************
We’ve ALL been interviewed by LE. Every single solitairy parent and child at Skyline.
7.skyline parent says:
October 30, 2010 at 1:38 am
Okay, this part is really bugging me:
“What law enforcement was seeking matters. Ms. Horman’s specialty was in teaching children with learning disabilities. She would have had access to confidential psychological testing, mental health records, medical documents, and possibly, CPS records, none of which could be disclosed except by parent authorization, or pursuant to subpoena or search warrant. Even though she had not worked in that area for some time, she may still have had such records in her home or on her laptop.”
As a parent with a special needs child in Oregon, I will tell you that the IEP is confidential to a select few and that is the law. I do not believe that TH would have these type of records on her laptop, period. Given her work history over the past few years, she has not been directly involved in a teaching capacity that would allow her access to those types of files. Further, neither she nor anyone else would be allowed to have them on a laptop that thay are hauling around with them where it could be stolen or accessed by others. I could write a book about all of this but I won’t. Mockingbirdsigns will know about this as well and I imagine she will chime in.
*****************************************************
@Malty- I was up at 5:30 too, but Blink was not here. Sounds like we were both at seizure onset, lol. Now I am way behind again!
I can’t figure this case out. I would like to know though, if TH is as clean as you say, why dosen’t she talk and tell what she knows and take a poly.
Andy,
Don’t you think that the Obstetrician and/or his/her acompanying medical staff at Kiara’s delivery would have NOTICED fetal aclohol syndrome?
Just sayin.
“Kaine Horman said in the filing that Cook has provided investigators with information about his relationship with Terri Horman, including “hundreds of text messages as well as several photographs of (Terri Horman) in various stages of undress and graphic sexual activity.”
Kaine Horman’s attorney said in the filing that Terri Horman’s “stated personal relationship concerns and sexual overtures to Mr. Cook resemble those made to the man (Terri Horman) previously attempted to hire to murder (Kaine Horman).”
http://www.theolympian.com/2010/07/13/1302999/missing-boys-stepmother-accused.html#ixzz0u9lGt2Ps
another version …
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/kyrons_stepmom_wont_contest_he.html
… “Law enforcement informed Kaine Horman that Terri Horman not only shared concerns about her marriage with Cook and made sexual overtures to him, but made similar overtures to the landscaper who she had attempted to hire to murder Kaine months before Kyron’s disappearance, the filing says.”
@Mockingbirdsings,
I would hope that the state/DHS would not take the same bold assumption when it comes to Kiara. No arrest have been made so far. And as far as we know the perp is still out there. How do we not know that KH did not let the vampire in? Or that the vampire was both acquaintances of KH and TH? A family friend? Who is taking care of her when he is absent? I mean, none of us have even heard of kiara being seen by anyone since the gym before the R/O was even in place. I know that keeping her out of sight for her protection is of most importance however I assumed that DHS would be checking in regularly. If nothing else, KH is under a lot of stress, to take care of a child, especially that age is a challenge for anyone. Especially for a parent who is learning to parent alone.
This concerns me…Blink?
______________________________________
MockingbirdSings says:
October 30, 2010 at 6:14 pm
ccane says:
October 30, 2010 at 4:43 pm
Blink if Terri is a danger to her daughter like Kaine claims why is child protective srvs not involved. Surely police can bring them into this case .. right?
—————-
I’m not Blink, obviously, but I can see no reason the state (DHS) would want to bring anyone into this case to protect Kiara since she has one parent obviously doing his best to protect her now and Terri has no contact with Kiara. If she got unsupervised visitation and something happened, then a report could be made to CPS-DHS. I think we have to wait and see what the family court decides about custody and visitation.
Hi, I had said some time ago that I thought I had seen the red Mustang (I notice all Mustangs especially red ones) w/ Terri’s special license plate heading back into Gresham from Sandy, Oregon around the time (not sure exactely of the date) but today going through Sandy I could have sworn I saw a boy that looked so much like Kyron (hubby too-a head turner) with an older Grandpa lookin man (not thin with grayish hair & I believe a mustache~happened so quickly the area was full of kids trick or treating at the shops in Sandy (today was the day set aside for that- the day before halloween~ I dont know ~just thought Id mention it ~ Dont know if they have looked towards the Mt or Sandy area yet?
enumclawrose says:
October 29, 2010 at 10:15 pm
I think this is okay to post, this guy spells his name with an “A” and was involved with the PTA as of 2006.
http://courts.oregon.gov/OJD/docs/OSCA/cpsd/citizenreview/CRBNetworkNews0706final.pdf
See Page 5
————————
Very interesting … he has remained on my radar for the last couple of weeks. There is just something very off about “nameless.”
Considering his claims of 12 years of appointment, and you will only find him on the 2006 roster, I would say-
B
In Houze response it states “Mother is the focus of parallel criminal investigations.” Also, states “….there are ongoing criminal investigations focused on the Mother…”
Not the word investigation is plural. What the he** is going on here?
Amy’s Sister says:
October 30, 2010 at 11:20 am
Very well said …
Mermaid14 says:
October 30, 2010 at 8:19 pm
Regarding the statement by Houze “even convicts get child visitation in jail.” He should know better than to make a statement like that.
—————–
You are so right in your post.
As a foster parent, I had to take a 1 year old to visit her dad in prison for an hour or so once a week for months. At the sound of the clinking doors the baby would shiver and shake, scream and cling to my shirt while the caseworker pulled her away (I couldn’t go in). Even the guards were saying why would a judge order something like this?! It was because the dad said he would do all these things (like classes and counseling) required of him – but he never did. He had abused a previous child and was also a sex offender, AND, as in all DHS cases, the child had her own attorney, but it still happened. I would go sit in my car and cry. There was no worthwhile interaction, the child didn’t even know her father since he hadn’t been around until he got in jail – he was a stranger with just a few toys and a DVD player.
Later when we went to an animal shelter to look at a possible pet, the sound of the cage doors and echoes of concrete floors was so traumatic for the baby that I had to take her out of the building screaming until we got to the parking lot.
Children who have known their parent and miss them should, in my opinion, be assisted to know they are OK and have some sort of supervised appropriate relationship if they want it and were not a victim of that parent. But babies need to bond – if they do it well, it helps every relationship they ever have in the future. A painful experience does not help that.
I do believe in the case of babies who truly know their mothers from birth and have bonded (and perhaps were breastfed), that maintaining at least the recognition of that relationship can be appropriate – depending on the crime and the future of the mother. Fathers possibly, too. But if society believes that this is in the best interest of the baby or toddler, we’d better do a lot better at providing an appropriate setting for the visits than I’ve seen so far. You are allowed 1 bottle and no diapers or toys or favorite stuffed animal, etc.
If I were a parent, knowing what I know now, I would not ask for visitation if it was clearly traumatic for my child no matter what age. I would send stories I read on tape, write letters and poems, draw pictures, whatever, but I would be sure whatever I did was helpful, not harmful. I wish the judge and the child’s attorney had been required to go with me just once.
If Terri had ANYTHING to do with the disapperance of Kyron and won’t give anyone information to what she knows why should she be rewarded by being given visitation rights – supervised or not?
” TH is too delicate to work…”
Okay, I promised myself I was not going to comment on this post at all, but then I read the above, and immediately I thought “Hell, she can bench press 190 and arm wrestle a man to the ground, she could work as a bouncer!”.
2.MockingbirdSings says:
October 30, 2010 at 6:08 pm
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wow, Mockingbird. I never cease to be amazed by your viewpoint. On the way out to dinner tonight my husband and I discussed the filings in this case. We were joined at dinner by two other lawyers, one of whom is a seasoned criminal defense attorney, the other has practiced family law for thirty years. All of them assured me that they considered both filings pretty much par for a complicated case like this, and none of them were the least bit surprised–or alarmed–by the content of either. Like you said, there is likely a heck of a lot going on behind closed doors with multiple lawyers, judges, LE and various other “experts” weighing in.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
9.Justalurker says:
October 30, 2010 at 7:17 pm
Yes, I wholeheartedly agree and want to add that I think the motion from Houze and Bunch reads more like a press release than a legal motion, perhaps an effort to reshape public opinion that Teri is a victim.
~~~~~~~~~~~
I think we have some very savvy posters here. Well said, Justalurker.
Hey Blink & Co,
Wanted to pop in to say Happy Halloween. Hoping Kyron will be found soon. Blink, as usual, great job! Hoping to catch up more tomorrow.
Titch
@mag603 says:
October 30, 2010 at 3:31 pm
Could TMH mortgaged the house to pay for Houze? Is that why Kaine is bring up the house after the fact?
**************************
The house is in his name only, so no.
@puzzled,
Ya lost me, and I generally follow your line of thinking.
RS informant, undercover.
_____
puzzled says:
October 30, 2010 at 7:23 pm
Rudy Sanchez is … in custody .. a material witness .. irrelevant .. an undercover informant.
What you think about RS’s role depends on what you think happened on June 4th.
@puzzled says:
October 30, 2010 at 6:15 pm
@Beejay … if you notice, KY references the MFH but not the alleged sexting with RS, which was during the marriage .. in fact RS is never ever mentioned … MC sexting was after KH left … curious???
********************************************************************
Everyone is assuming that LE is the one who provided the texting transcripts to KH. I believe that it was MC who did so, NOT LE. And that the sole purpose for him to text in the first place was a cat and mouse game, in partnership with KH and designed to glean information. MC was also on standby to give testimony at the dissolution hearing on KH’s behalf, so this is why I think this.
Any RS sexting is in LE hands, as well as any information they have gleaned from HER phone/computer -and they did not give any of it to KH.
Unless someone can prove differently…?
But sexting with either man at any time is ultimately irrelevant, as Oregon is a no-fault divorce state. I don’t think the sexting has any legal impact on establishing the fitness of a parent either. Being morally challenged is NOT equivalent to either criminal behavior, or unfitness to parent a child. If being morally challenged were, then sadly we would have millions of orphans in our country.
@ NelMel
I too have wondered about the child’s testimony of Terri hiding under the stairs. I believe that she told Kyron to exit a particular door and meet her at the truck in a few minutes. Then she pretended to leave the school using a different exit but snuck back in and hid under the stairs near the door she instructed Kyron to use in order to watch him exit and cue the abductor that Kyron was on the way to the truck. I believe Blink said that this didn’t happen but I’m not sure how she would know.
@Skyline Parent
I was a special ed teacher in the Hillsboro District not far from you. There is no way a teacher should have any personal files of his/her students at home. I was told it was illegal to have information such as psych tests, medical documents or anything labelled as confidential out of the school. My understanding was that Terri never had an actual teaching contract or job so she wouldn’t have had access to that anyway. I never had the impression she had a special ed endorsement which is very time consuming to get. Oregon had and may still require the the highest NTE (national teacher’s exam) scores in the country. Your insight and first hand knowledge are so appreciated.
@Mockingbird Sings I love the story about the Oppositional Defiant student and the teacher instructing them to do one thing and the fact they did the other and that was the desired result. Your postings are always informative and well thought out. I always look forward to reading them.
@Jackie B
I thought it was 195 pounds LOL
you are funny!!! Thanks for the laugh
that text about Benching sounded just like the young guys at work
always bragging
@JackieB
in the old days a gal dropped her hankiechief to get a guys attention
LOL
Skyline parents says:
October 30, 2010 at 9:00 pm
“Ms. Horman’s resume says that she continued to assist in testing at Skyline from “September 2008 to present.” As such, she might have been involved in more recent testing, whether as a paid consultant or volunteer.” Absolutely NOT true. If this were happening – Ben Keefer and I would be having a talk – even BEFORE Kyron’s disappearance.
——————————————————————–
Hi Skyline Parents! I was just wondering about your statement, that if TH was doing testing on special ed students-you would be having a talk with Ben Keefer about that-even BEFORE Kyron’s disappearance?
Was TH considered risky, incompetent, unprofessional, etc., etc., by other parents at Skyline? Or was she just deemed untrustworthy for some reason? And how long had she been earning this reputation? I’m really curious since you are a local, and hope you don’t mind me asking this. Thanks for your help!
Mother Hen says:
October 30, 2010 at 9:37 pm
Andy,
Don’t you think that the Obstetrician and/or his/her acompanying medical staff at Kiara’s delivery would have NOTICED fetal aclohol syndrome?
Just sayin.
—————————————
I noticed that Andy was concerned about FAS or Fetal Alcohol Effects. FAS is actually only one diagnosis related to prenatal exposure to alcohol. I think what Andy is referring to is:
Alcohol-Related Neurodevelopmental Disorder (ARND): People with ARND might have intellectual disabilities and problems with behavior and learning. They might do poorly in school and have difficulties with math, memory, attention, judgment, and poor impulse control.
This would not be obvious to the OB/GYN at birth. Depending on the severity, it may not be noticeable until ages 2, 3 or beyond. I imagine a mild case could be misdiagnosed, especially if mom says she did not drink alcohol during pregnancy.
Another disorder in the FAS Spectrum is:
Alcohol-Related Birth Defects (ARBD): People with ARBD might have problems with the heart, kidneys, or bones or with hearing. They might have a mix of these.
This may not be apparent for quite some time either.
——————————-
Terri may not have drank any alcohol while she was pregnant with Kiara. I hope she didn’t. From what I can see though, especially the sexts, Terri doesn’t appear to have a lot of self control. In light of what Kaine said in his filing regarding Terris drinking habits, it sure wouldn’t hurt if Kaine did talk to Kiaras pediatrician about the possibility of FASD. An early diagnosis would benefit Kiara.
@SkylineParent: Actually the reason I brought up Jill was to suggest that there are people around Skyline who probably know a great deal about the actual disappearer of Ky (assuming it was not TH; or TH alone). They may not know that s/he did the act, but they know some candidates. Assuming s/he is still at large, s/he is someone who might well be dangerous to that community, its children.
If I were a local, I would be asking around, taking names. I would want to know exactly who worked with Rudy; I trust that Blink has some good reason to say we should look at RS and his associates. I would try to find photos of same and memorize them.
I would not be waiting for LE to do all the work, hamstrung as they are to some extent by all our legal/prosecutorial safeguards. I do not that trust that this is isolated in the sense that something similar could never happen again in that community. Or can only happen to skanks’ kids.
While the LE continues its 25 tasks’ investigation, working with the DA to build a solid case, I would want to be aware of what’s going on around me and who I might want to look out for. The people involved in bringing RS and his associates into Skyline school and supervising their work and processing their payments, etc., could be very helpful in protecting their community while the wheels of justice turn–every so slowly.
I would be talking with my community unless LE had forbidden me to do so, which Blink has said is not the case. Not in a hysteria-inducing way. In a cool, information-gathering way. In a totally legal way.
I hope that Skyline community is doing just that, rather than sailing down the river of denial and not-my-job and “I’m from the government and I’m here to take care of you.”
The student files on TH’s computers, if true, make we wonder if she is a silent member of the CRB. What do you think Idahogal?
Houze cites public policy as the reasoning for TH’s visitation. Maybe we are in need of policy changes. I personally gave up hope when OJ Simpson was granted custody of his children after losing in civil court branding him a murderer. TH will get supervised visits eventually and that is just the screwed up way things are.
I believe the parallel investigations Houze refers to is the MFH and the disappearance of Kyron.
Puzzled, I get what you are saying about RS. He is one of the many things you listed, depending on what theory we subscribe to. I know it bugs you that he is under the radar. I think he looks like he could be undercover (there is even a RS LEO from NYC), but in this case I think he is an illegal landscaper. Who knows, he could be in witness protection due to his knowledge of the person who ultimately took Ky, if such a person exists, or as you say incarcerated for his participation.
Beejay, I get what you are saying about Wayne being an American name and all. I am looking for a connection between two worlds in a small area of Oregon. The networking is promoted by the marketing agents. The members of these organizations are mostly on the up and up, but the concept a/k/a money and the marketing might be a little phoney. JMO.
For a small example, AWARE INC. is not listed with the Sec. of State. Why? Might be innocent, might not, IDK. Child care center in Woodburn linked to the same marketers as Friends of Pimpollo. Not exactly a direct connection, but it is a small world, and we do know of people in Woodburn.
Justice23, I forgot about KH being adopted until you brought it up. I hope you won the adoption lottery like I did. Had the BEST parents ever, and they got me at four days old so I never knew the difference. My birth-mother was 13 and stone to death by her family after I was born due to the shame she brought on them for being raped by the man she worked for. Needless to say, I had no desire to meet either side of my birth families. People always ask if I tried to find them, I tell the story and my answer resonates with the smart ones. There is nothing wrong with trying to get some answers, but somethings in the past should just stay there.
As far as TH perhaps seeking out her birth-mother, I agree, it could have been a real stress on her. You would think being adopted herself would have made her in to a great stepmother. Do you have any information on the circumstances, ages, of KH’s or TH’s adoptions?
Where is Eloise?
Blink, I think it does more harm then good for the discussion on this site. I think if the writer would have stuck more with just the facts and not interject her opinion would have been more useful. Like the following quote from the article.
******************************************************************
In his most recent pleadings, Mr. Horman angrily recounts that Ms. Horman claimed she was going to the gym, but since their separation, he has come to believe that she spent the time talking to people and flirting. The portrait of a social butterfly chatting people up at the gym for hours on end doesn’t quite fit with Mr. Horman’s other claims that she was an angry, depressed new mother who drank her self blotto and could not maintain any sort of civility toward those around her.
Which is it? Was Ms. Horman a mean drunk who drank herself to sleep, or was she self-absorbed and social, staying up to all hours playing on the Internet while her child sat in the same room unattended and un-engaged? Or was she a social butterfly who spent most of her time outside the home while Mr. Horman was super dad, working long hours from home, caring for the children, and providing an income that he never could enjoy because Ms. Horman was spending it all? The claims are so disjointed, it is as though Mr. Horman decided to throw spaghetti at the wall, just to see what might stick.
******************************************************************
It is very obvious that KH has learned much much more since when this all started. He has learned that she would spend hours at the gym.. Someone that has a drinking problem can do this.. He in my opinion never claimed to be SUPER DAD and just stated he worked a couple days a week from home.
I think that LE came to him as soon as they found out about the MFH and told him to get Kiara and get out asap. And then his main concern after that was to get the RO against her and protect his baby girl. From that moment on I believe KH started LEARNING a whole lot more.
I do understand what this article was meant to do but it was riddled with opinion and it seemed to be more of a fit in the leave a comment section… What I mean is usually your articles are filled with facts and then the rest of us put our opinions or questions afterwards..
Like I said I understand the reasoning but it would have been more useful if it looked at both sides.. Or else just stuck to the facts and maybe stated here and there that Kaine has since learned there were many more problems then he had realized..
this is not just a cut and dry divorce/custody trial and to say that Kaine is mad seems to me to be the understatement of the year…
All in respect and all MOO
The only reason I can think of TH having “ANY” childs records on her laptop, or in her hands, is if she was ADVOCATING for them. Why else would this information leave the school?
@Mother Hen:
Fetal Alcohol Syndrome may or may not be noticed at birth. Often it is diagnosed later. Fetal Alcohol Effect is FAS to a lesser degree and often is not dignosed but those children’s symptoms are often behavioral and more noticable once they begin school.
@Andy:
Hmmmm,that is an interesting thought. Could a mother be charged with abuse if her child is diagnosed with FAS? I can’t say that any parents of children with FAS or FAE that I’ve worked with have been charged with child abuse as far as I know, but maybe in a case like this that would happen if she was FAS.
But for the record, I don’t think Kiara displays physical symptoms FAS symptoms.