Kyron Horman Case: Terri Horman Sexts Sent To Kaine Horman’s Phone…. WHAT?
HOLD THE PHONE
In what can only be considered the latest bombshell development in the case of missing Portland boy, 7 year old Kyron Horman, blinkoncrime.com has discovered that the recent sexually graphic text messages or sexts, allegedly exchanged between Terri Horman and mutual friend Michael Cook, may have been altered. Definitely, alter-able.
Blinkoncrime.com has confirmed that the phone number which Kaine hand-wrote on the originally sealed emergency restraining order dated June 28, 2010, matches the cell phone number he also alleges, through his attorney Laura Rackner, was used by Michael Cook to RECEIVE the “sext” messages in question.
What’s the issue?
Kaine Horman owns the phone and the account it is registered to, and unless the allegation is that Terri Horman, using her own phone as purported by Kaine, is herself posing as Michael Cook and sexting herself, which would seem like a physical impossibility given some of her *glamour shots*, we have a serious problem.
In Kaine’s own handwriting on the June 28th Restraining Order, he pens that is an alternative number for Terri Horman.
In the contempt order filed by Kaine Horman on July 12, Ms. Rackner states that she has personally seen the “work phone” records of Michael Cook, and goes on to say “a search” of his cell phone reflected that he took snapshots on June 28th of the earlier served restraining order, which had been sealed, and was the basis for the contempt motion in the first place. He took pictures of sealed documents on the phone belonging to the other person bound by the same order prohibiting Terri Horman from showing anyone. As there are no texts on the work number until July, it is the only logical conclusion.
I am going to go out on a limb here and assume that at some point it occurred to someone that using good faith information in your affidavit, which when not alerting the court that your client has complete ownership and access to the data on the phone account in question, can look like bad faith in a nano-second, thus the withdrawal.
However, not everyone is on the same the playbill because the 21 pages of texts, which were released in PDF format, and do not include any numbers for Terri Horman herself, were supplied in an electronically redacted format; which again indicates this was not an original file.
It was not until the unredacted pdf’s became available October 26th and we converted them to HTML files could we see that based on the file format, it is clear these records came from the account owners and were not subpoenaed from the carrier. Original files, also provided to the respondent, are the requirement of the court. We all know texts can be sent from our phone online accounts, and from our phones directly; I think I even have voice command to text widget thingie.
Anyone that had access to the account, which is registered to Kaine Horman, could clone, spoof, or manipulate those messages, period. That aside, let’s consider the possibility that Terri Horman HAD implicated herself even slightly in any messages on phones that may be utilized to illicit information by a woman who demonstrated her complete knowledge that she understood what expectation of privacy parameters she was under the impression she was operating under, and engaging in, with the “textee”.
Terri Horman was represented by counsel, it would not be difficult for Stephen Houze allege that Kaine Horman was in constant contact with MCSO, had already been provided case sensitive information by them, and as such, was acting as an agent in soliciting the text messages. You see where I am going with this?
The fruit of that poisonous tree is more like the fruit of the poisonous orchard.
The implications of this scenario are abysmal. While I completely understand the desperation of a Father wanting to locate his child, since I have yet to really see anywhere Cook attempts to engage Terrri Horman about Kyron’s whereabouts at any time; I do not get the point of the exercise.
Ms. Rackner is a first rate “Super Lawyer”, but she is not above the burden of her duty to insure that what is being provided to her as a “good faith basis” is just that.
Does this information make Terri Horman any less vulgarly inappropriate at best? Hell to the No.
While it is true on the surface because of this information one will be hard pressed to prove it was definitely Terri Horman who sent the electronic ipecac none of us will soon forget, her attorneys have not denied it was her, nor do I expect them to, at least not until they read this.
What it does, yet again, is potentially compromise the criminal case involving the disappearance of Desiree Young and Kaine Horman’s son Kyron.
This afternoon, blinkoncrime.com contributing editor and Legal Analyst, Lea Conner weighed in:
Kaine Horman claims that law enforcement provided the texts records to him, but that does not mean that the records came from the cell phone provider, nor does it mean that the conversations involve Michael Cook or Terri Horman.
In fact, there are indications that the text message transcripts filled by Mr. Horman are not as they appear. At least one of the phones purported to belong to “Michael Cook” is registered to Kaine Horman.
Just as important, none of these records indicate any information about the texts Mr. Horman alleges were sent by his wife. Mr. Horman does not list any cell phone number, not one message ID, not one cell record that indicates the identity of other party to the conversation let alone indicating Ms. Horman as the other party to the text message “conversations.” In the case of the phone with the “503″ prefix (503-XXX-XX76), Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone that was purportedly sending texts as “Michael Cook.”
More bizarre, Mr. Horman listed this number as belonging to Terri Horman in his application for a temporary restraining order. Was this a slip on the part of Mr. Horman? Mr. Horman claimed in a motion for remedial contempt that Ms. Horman showed a copy of the restraining order to Mr. Cook and allowed him to photograph the document.
Given that the phone Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone he purports was used by “Michael Cook,” it begs the question as to whether Ms. Horman ever allowed Mr. Cook access to the sealed restraining order. As a party to the action, Mr. Horman had the very same sealed documents. Mr. Horman, through Counsel Laura Rackner, claimed to have reviewed Mr. Cook’s “work cell phone records.”
It is not clear if the documents Ms. Rackner referenced as Mr. Cook’s “work” cell records are, in fact, for the phone registered to Mr. Horman. If the sealed documents referenced in Mr. Horman’s contempt motion were photographed with the phone registered to Mr Horman — the same phone that Mr. Horman claims was used by Mr. Cook — it might help explain why Mr. Horman withdrew his contempt motion.
Had he gone forward with the motion, he might have had to explain how it was the documents allegedly photographed by Mr. Cook were the same documents that he had in his possession, and that the phone used to photograph sealed court documents was registered to him, not Mr. Cook.
The records for the phone with a “971″ prefix (971-XXX-XX63) are unlisted. This phone also purported to send texts as “Michael Cook.” Due to the unavailability of any registration for this phone, it is impossible to tell to whom the phone belongs, or who was actually sending texts from this phone. The unredacted copy of the cell phone records filed on October 25, 2010, only identifies one caller on each set of cell phone records. This means that the records came from the phone, not the cell provider. Text records on pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 are from (503) XXX-XX76 (“Cell Phone A”). These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 10:17 pm on June 30, 2010 through 7:19 pm on July 1, 2010.
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Cell Phone A is a Cingular/AT&T cell phone registered to Kaine Horman. It is also a phone number listed by Mr. Horman in his restraining order application as a phone number for Ms. Horman.
Pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the conversation attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. Text records on pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 are from (971) XXX-XX63 (“Cell Phone B”).
These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 6:49 pm on July 4, 2010 through 8:30 am on July 6, 2010. The bottom of page 17 has a partial text message sent on July 6, 2010, which purports to be sent after 8:30 am. Cell Phone B is an unlisted cell phone with AT&T (formerly Cingular).
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. All texts in Exhibit 2 are from Cell phone A, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 2:29 pm on July 3, 2010 through 9:40 am on July 4, 2010.
Exhibit 2 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. All texts in Exhibit 3 are from Cell phone B, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 8:44 pm on July 6, 2010 through 8:41 am am on July 7, 2010. The top of page 1 of this exhibit has part of an undated message from 8:41 am., possibly on July 6, 2010, that states “I understand. I’m upset about kitty. I didn’t do [sic]”
Exhibit 3 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. Surely investigators working on this case must know that the cell records filed by Mr. Horman as coming from Michael Cook’s phone were not from Mr. Cook’s phone, but from a phone registered in his own name.
Someone in law enforcement must have noticed that the number Mr. Horman claims belong to Michael Cook is also the number he claimed belonged to his wife in his TRO application. Mr. Horman signed his application for temporary restraining order on Monday June 28, 2010, prior to its filing at 4:39 pm that afternoon.
This was two days after the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office conducted its failed sting operation at the Horman residence on Saturday June 26, 2010. MCSO was unable to confirm the murder-for-hire plot that had been alleged by the landscaper. As a result, MCSO was not able to arrest Ms. Horman.
As such, why did law enforcement then give the green light to Mr. Horman to obtain a restraining order on the basis that his wife had hired to hire a hit man? Or did Mr. Horman act unilaterally without the endorsement of law enforcement? Surely Mr. Horman must have known that law enforcement could not verify the landscaper’s story, yet he went ahead and filed a restraining order based on the very allegations that law enforcement could not verify. So why did he sign his name to allegations that he knew were not true?
The text messages don’t check out. The murder for hire allegations don’t check out. The only common thread here is a man whose son disappeared on June 4, 2010. As tragic and anguishing as Mr. Horman’s circumstances may be, that does not excuse misrepresenting information to the court.
Mr. Horman cannot claim that the phone registered in his name is Michael Cook’s work cell phone, nor can he claim that the phone allegedly used by Michael Cook was used by Ms. Horman. When Sheriff Dan Staton talked about knowing things that might surprise people, could he have been talking about cell phone records? Maybe Stephen Houze and Peter Bunch will force the sheriff to reveal its source for the records.
Although the answer would not bring Kyron home, it might at least alleviate some of the blame heaped on Ms. Horman, as unpopular as that may be.
Lea Conner, contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
Madeline Tanner, copy and contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
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@TBZ….I am so happy your story ended happy! What a nightmare!
Thoughts and prayers are with Kyron, his brothers, sister, friends and classmates
http://www.koinlocal6.com/news/local/story/Portland-child-care-worker-faces-21-sex-abuse/s-CiXZhIRkGaN9qBKQRHww.cspx
Disgusting POS.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2011/01/portland_woman_accused_of_vide.html
This article says more.
Her Marine boyfriend sounds like a sick b@stard as well.
Thank God for her friend who turned her in.
I say let him loose on his colleagues who are desperately missing their children while stationed overseas.
He would not make it 5 minutes. Some days, I just really hate knowing about any of this horror.
B
Malty says: What I would like to know is were these hate emails ever reported to anyone or where they came from if an adult writes they hate a child in their care it should have been investigated and the child should have been removed this just wasn’t right or it WAS reported.
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My guess would be the person receiving the nasty emails from Terri about Kyron had already been brainwashed into believing whatever Terri had been saying about Kyron … they would have had no reason to defend the little guy if Terri had convinced them otherwise.
evie says: January 19, 2011 at 12:53 pm
@enumclawrose says: January 18, 2011 at 10:14 pm
enumclawrose says: “I have tried to research this question and cannot come up with a straight answer. If a person in the US is here illegally and has a child (commonly refered to as an anchor baby), who has legal custody of the child?”
Unless there is a court order to the contrary, the parent(s) has(have) legal custody.
Where legal paternity has not been established (by marriage, paternity affidavit, or otherwise), the only legal parent would be the mother.
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enumclawrose says: “If the child is on any form of public assistance does that make the state automatically the custodial entity for the child?”
No. Public assistance does not transfer custodial rights.
However, the state can initiate legal proceedings to terminate custody where there is abuse or neglect.
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evie says: “Second, ‘anchor baby’ is a pejorative, those babies are called US citizen neighbors by me. I wouldn’t say ‘anchor baby’ is a common term since IIRIRA (their ‘anchor’ status is functionally useless now). To answer your question; the child still belongs to the parent! Immigration status does not determine custody. Immigration status is often a fluid thing.. someone who is illegal today can be legal tomorrow–the law is overly complex. In my case, I woke up one day and was a dual citizen; laws change.”
Not entirely true. The child of foreign nationals who are not domiciled here, or if you have someone here on official business (i.e. a diplomat), would not receive US citizenship on birth. See US v. Wong Kim Ark.
However, a child born to foreign nationals are domiciled here and engaged in business (but not diplomatic or official business) receives citizenship on birth.
lizzygoat says: January 19, 2011 at 12:48 pm
Lea Conner posted:
“Shame on any of you who are using this post as speculation!!!! Kaine was at this event today to extend a helping hand to other families in need while also supporting the new TextNoMore App that is spreading his sons flier across the world!!!!” (posted by Ronda Williams Hall at 9:57 pm Sunday January 17, 2011.
……
lizzygoat says: “Its the part about spreading his son’s flier around the world that would suggest sex trafficking to me. What other purpose is there for taking this search to another country?”
I agree completely. True Nelson said it best: Kyron disappeared too quickly and too cleanly. This suggests he was transported out of the country.
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lizzygoat says: “Shame should not be associated with speculation. Ms. Williams must be related to the Hartleys.”
I’m staying out of the way on this one. Clearly, emotions are running high all around on this.
On an unrelated note, am I the only one who finds the app’s name “Text No More” to be a bit ironic, given the allegations of illicit texting?
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For those of you who have been following the discussion here for the past few months, you may recall a discussion about Gov. Neil Goldschmidt’s relationship with an underage girl (age 14).
Gov. Goldschmidt’s victim just passed away at age 49. She was in hospice.
Here name is published on several websites, and it is noted in blacked-out-but-not-fully-redacted PDF filed posted on the two major Portland-area newspapers.
She had a very sad life. May she rest in peace.
There are credible witnesses that saw Terri Leave.
She left without Kyron, I have no idea why that is so difficult to process for some.
B
I think it’s because –
1 – we haven’t yet found out exactly how he did leave
2 – you haven’t said anyone is 100% sure the TRUCK left without Kyron
3 – there may be credible witnesses, but the whole case is just INcredible
Lea says – I’m more puzzled by the left arm that’s cut off in the photo, but it looks like Kyron tucked his left arm behind his back so that it wouldn’t obscure the view of the diorama. Kyron’s left shoulder and body are angled in a way that suggests the focus of the photo — for him — is his science fair project.
MBS says – I have taught hundreds of kids who were small and thin like Kyron and liked to stand around with one arm behind their back – boys and girls both. However, every single one I can remember and have looked back at in pictures, liked to hook their hand around the other arm, so the fingers from his left hand would show up on his right arm. When I saw the picture last June, my first thought was to wonder where his fingers were that would have been on his other arm. I have a picture of myself taken from behind doing the “behind the back arm cross thing” when I was about 6 years old – but I can’t begin to reach around my back now – wish I could.
Even if the t-shirt is too large and hung down below his elbow, that very fact seems to me would cause his elbow to bend inside the sleeve and pull it at least a little out of the perfect shape it seems to be in as his arm went across his back. I would have to have a model try it a few times to see for sure.
I don’t think he was aware of what could or couldn’t be seen through the camera lens and if Terri wanted the diorama to show up better, I think she would have stepped back one step or asked him to turn a tiny bit. If I told a child to scrunch up so I could get a better picture, the natural response, I think, would be to pull his shoulders toward the front which feels like you are making yourself smaller.
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Lea Conner says- If you enhance and blow-up the photo, the mystery man is definitely male and with facial hair. He looks a bit older and ‘weathered.’”
“MBS – I thought no one could see his face in the picture.”
Here are the enlarged photos (courtesy of Brandi Monkey and Crankycrankerson):
http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Kyron/Image149-1.png
http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Kyron%20Horman%20%20-OR-/m_68adde70378c49229cd024e30e8e6a6a.jpg
http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Kyron/Image154.png
and “My comment was not directed at you personally. In my opinion, if you have other people touring the science fair, it would be hard to get a photo without someone in the frame. To me, the person who stands out most is the heavyset man in the background who is bent over in a very awkward position, not the tall guy who was circled by Willamette Week and dubbed “mystery man.”
Lea – I didn’t take it personally, didn’t mean to imply that. I agree with what you said, but I think I’m beginning now to understand where the MM confusion came from. You refer to the Willamette Week article calling the tall man with facial hair the “mystery man”, but we’ve been referring to the other one as MM, the mystery man. (see next comment)
Neighbor says – Sammy says: “… these are the 2 pics being discussed:
#1 picture: we can see a guy in the very top corner of pic and CAN see his face. (talk has been that this man HAS been ID’d by Skyline parents/staff)
#2 picture: The pic of the guy in the background wearing the plaid shirt that is standing with a little (Asian?) girl = “MM” (Mystery Man). This man’s face cannot be seen in the photo.”
We should have named them “Plaid” and “Beard” from the beginning, I think.
Sassifras, If possible could you please provide a link to the 13441 Pacific Hwy E search. Having trouble with it, don’t know why. Thanks.
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@Evie
Agreed. I really considered whether or not to use it. When I saw it got 2.25 million google hits on a search, I went with it as a common term. I guess if less of us use it, it would take the common out of it. My bad, so sorry. Also, thanks to you and Rose for answering the custody question.
Dear e-rose, first off, yesterday, WOW. Thanks. the connection to Holm is artful.
Second, ‘anchor baby’ is a pejorative, those babies are called US citizen neighbors by me. I wouldn’t say ‘anchor baby’ is a common term since IIRIRA (their ‘anchor’ status is functionally useless now).
__________________________________________________________________
Me too, Malty, but we have to give Puzzeled credit for that laugh. My name was there because she was answering me. BTW, I Love your posts. You have a way of saying so much in so few words. You are poetry in motion.
29.Malty says:
January 19, 2011 at 3:14 pm
@En.rose
LOL my bottom is flat and legs numb to
______________________________________
Ode and Riverpearl,
Thanks for opening my mind on the Tweet post. Sorry, can’t bring your comments over to the new page. Ode, you are right, Kim would have only had three kids in 2002. Also, Beejay had a good point about why do the older kids have dad’s last name and the one that went to Skyline used the Holm last name. Isn’t there a child younger than Curtis? Wonder what his last name is? Riverpearl, wow, the caregiver scenario makes total sense to me, too.
I think this is another associate of RS, due to the Sanchez-Estrada name. It would also be a link for him in WA.
http://www.usa-people-search.com/Results.aspx?view=PE
I tried my last link, did not work. If you go to USA People Seach and type in IRAIS SANCHEZ-ESTRADA, RS will show as relative. I believe it to be our RS because of the Sanchez-Estrada last name.
Dan Staton is supposed to be presenting a report on Ky’s case to County Commissioners by Feb 1. Are locals talking to their county commissioners? Planning to be present at their meeting site to indicate interest? There is a slot for an approved citizen to address the board for 3 minutes prior to their meeting; anyone planning to go and ask any questions on their minds? Because where I’m from, citizen involvement makes a huge difference with elected officials. And we don’t like being patted on the head and told it’s all being taken care of.
Deborah Kafoury, District 1 Commissioner, is the only one who broke ranks at the Board and asked Staton a question about the budget for Ky’s case. She’s new and has a lot of energy for getting things done.
Short reading list:
1) There are 2 other Commissioners who’d like more details about items they’re asked to vote on.
“But Shiprack and McKeel see a problem.
“I have been concerned that our board meetings as of late have been almost all budget modifications and proclamations,” Shiprack said. “We’re ready and willing to assume a little greater role in the oversight of departments.”"
link:
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/12/multnomah_county_commissioners_9.html
2) Here’s where to read all the past and upcoming agendas for the Commissioners. Agendas supposed to be posted on Fridays before upcoming week’s meetings. Board is briefed on tues; board meets on thurs. Click on sidebar on left of page, including items just outside it on right. You can view the weekly agenda packet of materials provided to the board. This is the meat all here.
http://www.co.multnomah.or.us/cc/agenda.shtml
3) Commissioners main page:
http://www.co.multnomah.or.us/cc/
4) Who is your commissioner? who represents area of Skyline K8? See commissioner map at:
http://web.multco.us/ds1/district-1-map
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And the point of this would be? Staton said he has “almost fully briefed” the county Commissioners, and he has to answer their questions to get more operating money. So, Mult County residents should take their questions to their Commissioners.
If I lived there, one thing I would tell my Commissioner that I wanted to know is: did Ky leave Skyline K8 with Terri? And if not, who? No BS bureaucratic answers. I would want a straight answer to that one question. We know the answer because MCSO has leaked it that they think TH had help. But, that’s easy to ignore, dismiss, go into denial about, etc. If MCSO would at least allow the Commissioners to “leak” the answer to that question, than I think locals might talk to each other about what they saw or anything else that might help them to protect their community.
The answer to Blink’s question about why some people find it hard to accept that Ky didn’t leave with Terri is that MCSO hasn’t told them so. It’s time, because he’s out there. And no embarrassment to a government dept is adequate reason for failing to inform the public of an ongoing danger. MOOOOOOOOO
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footnote: last year, where I live, whole families showed up at the courthouse and peacefully assembled for a 7 pm county commissioners meeting. In the hallways, and out the doors on the sidewalks, spelling each other for bathroom breaks in nearby restaurants. The meeting ended at 2 am. Voters have never been ignored since that. It was VERY well understood by elected officials.
@TBZ that happened to me when my son was little. The bus didn’t drop him off. He missed it. I thought I was going to faint. Another time he went to his friends to play (he was 7) and when I went to get him for dinner the father said he wasn’t there and closed the door. I panicked! I walked up and down the street and knocked on doors. Finally a neighbor went to another of his friends across the street and he was there. They were all downstairs and didn’t hear me knock the first time. He did get a lecture from me to always let me know where he was. For about an hour the feeling of despair and panic was overwhelming, I cannot imagine what Kyron’s parents must be feeling.
IIRC correctly and this is IMO.
Kyron was never seen leaving with Terri or ANYONE else.
This is why initially LE was looking for some sort of container or gym bag something of this nature on Sauvie Island because Terri’s cell phone pinged there during the time she could or would not account for and during the time DS was MIA also.
Blink do you think Terri knew SZ?
46.TBZ says:
January 19, 2011 at 6:32 pm
@TBZ- I am so glad your son was okay! I cannot imagine the panic you went through. Maybe you should get him a bat phone?
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47.DEB1948 says:
January 19, 2011 at 6:37 pm
Please tell me …Is there PROOF, KYRON did not leave with TERRI,if so
what is it? I DO not believe there is any real crediable wittness that saw TH leave.
Ya’all do such good work on here…I hope LE reads it.
There are credible witnesses that saw Terri Leave.
She left without Kyron, I have no idea why that is so difficult to process for some.
B
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My guess is that some wonder if Ky went out to the truck prior to TH’s departure and was somehow subdued and not visible in the truck when she left. Just saying…
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11.skylineparent says:
January 19, 2011 at 9:43 am
Yes, of course I know his name, but I see no reason to violate his privacy by sharing it. I couldn’t stand up in a court and say its him without seeing his face, but the little girl and his body type and clothing fit.
I meant privately, if he can be verified, I have no incentive or wish to post his name, which, is already posted on the list, however. I have to be honest, I get emails and posts constantly saying this person has been confirmed, but I get equally as many from FELLOW SKYLINE parents, who say, nope, I spoke to “so and so” and nobody knows who that is.
Not once when I have asked for a name, has a person been able to provide it and that is seriously starting to freak me out, If I am being honest.
B
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Not sure I understand…this person is allegedly on “the list” BUT others have said he is not that alleged person and they don’t know who he actually is? This is freaking me out too, WTH?! Further, how can this person be identified without a face in the photo? I’m beyond confused, pass the coffee please.
To add to my post IMO Terri was not seen with a container leaving the school.
I don’t really remember why but Kim Holmes always seems to raise a red flag with me. I merely scan these very intelligent views here so my memory is probably off. Nevertheless on some instinct, that name registers. Any one that can help here?
Just an FYI … when child care workers themselves are abusing the kids on their watch, it’s definitely time to start putting bleach into the gene pool, don’t ya’ll think? How truly sad. I hope this woman gets the book thrown at her!
http://www.koinlocal6.com/news/local/story/Portland-child-care-worker-faces-21-sex-abuse/s-CiXZhIRkGaN9qBKQRHww.cspx
Did you notice her current (prior to her arrest) is not listed? That is bunk.
She previously worked at LA Fitness in Portland, who is now cooperating in the investigation.
If you leave your children with any person, you need to ask that the provider ran a clean background check and ask to see the worker’s references. If they balk, get the h out of there.
B
DEB1948 says:
January 19, 2011 at 6:37 pm
—————————————————-
There are credible witnesses that saw Terri Leave.
She left without Kyron, I have no idea why that is so difficult to process for some.
B
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Blink
I don’t doubt your sources or your knowledge for a moment, so I mean no disrespect here at all, but I have always wondered if it was in fact possible that witnesses did in fact see TMH leave without Ky, (better alibi later), but then at some point later, Ky actually walked out to meet her in the truck (or somewhere else) at Terri’s request hence making it LOOK as if TMH might’ve left without him, when in fact she may not have. Is that a plausible theory at all from what you know? If you can definitely rule that part out as well, I’m on the same boat with you completely.
You know I fully support the skepticism when I am not at liberty to disclose a source, in fact I encourage it.
The best way for me to answer that is this:
Does it make sense to you, if LE could put Kyron in the truck with TH in any capacity whatsoever, by any means, prior to her departing the Skyline School, that she has not been arrested long ago?
I would venture to say, that pat of the LDT, she passed-
B
FWIW … I beginning to think there is still yet another possible scenario that is being looked at and we not privy to it.
Blink … as our only reliable source … says we’ve got what she’s got on the RS & Associates. I’m thinking Ubaldo R IS RS … the alias Bunch referred to. Don’t know if Jaime/Jamie Estrada is “elizabeth” or not. RS has gone underground … don’t think he’s “disappeared” … I have confidence in LE that they didn’t lose a suspect.
There is a 2nd white truck … parked in back, Horman truck parked in front … and TH left without KyH.
I’m just not so sure about the “serial pedophile” … I’m thinking it’s more personal … specific to KyH. Also, I go with Rose’s assessment that KyH wouldn’t go with a “hispanic landscaper” … but likely someone who mirrors male authority … like his father or step-father. KyH does have good role models.
I also think the likelihood is KyH walked out of the school and got into the white truck on his own.
Because everything we know of, has been torn apart and looked at, again and again … I’m just thinking there’s another storyline that we don’t know about.
Mornin’ Blink…wondering if you could be of any help to the family of Samanth Ann Clarke in Orange, VA? I know you are busy busy but I just had to ask you. Thank you for looking!
Unfortunately, we looked at her case briefly some time ago, I don’t feel there is anything we can add to the open investigation. They have a suspect, imo. I am 3 cases deep on top of our current cases, I wish I could help anyone and everyone, sadly.
B
You know I fully support the skepticism when I am not at liberty to disclose a source, in fact I encourage it.
The best way for me to answer that is this:
Does it make sense to you, if LE could put Kyron in the truck with TH in any capacity whatsoever, by any means, prior to her departing the Skyline School, that she has not been arrested long ago?
I would venture to say, that pat of the LDT, she passed-
B
————————————–
Thanks Blink! Got it … that’s all I needed to know. Completely on board with ya.
Blink says “She left without Kyron, I have no idea why that is so difficult to process for some. B
The reason it is difficult to process is because we have not heard from any witness that fact. We have to take it on your word, which is not to say we do not believe you, it is just that it has not been stated that there are witnesses (plural) before this. Are we supposed to discount some of what Tanner said (i.e., substitute), and then believe him that he saw TH leave without Ky? When up to this point he is the only witness that we have heard say TH left without Ky. Also, it is hard to discount what DY said about a credible witness seeing Ky by “Kaine’s truck”
There are too many factors and not enough facts to believe or disbelieve anyone and it is frustrating. TY though for saying witnesses (plural) that to me makes it more believable.
He is not the only witness, and keep in mind that if Kyron was seen leaving the location, with any person, it would have qualified him for the Amber Alert, which as you know is one of the requirements.
B
I should’ve known you prolly looked at the Clarke case before my dear! You are too wonderful! Thanks for the consideration, I know how busy you are.
Does anyone think that the reason MSCO expanded the official time of interest to include the hours from 10am to noon might imply that they think Ky was removed from the premises during those hours? (Expanded time frame came with their Dec list circulated by Skyline K8) That maybe someone still present at school later on in the morning saw something, and that something was Ky being removed.
Just putting that together with Blink’s response to Patricia, to wit:
He is not the only witness, and keep in mind that if Kyron was seen leaving the location, with any person, it would have qualified him for the Amber Alert, which as you know is one of the requirements.
B
Uh, clarification: what someone saw, that was Ky being removed, was NOT recognized by that person as Ky being removed. But could’ve been.
Is it suspected by LE or known, but not stated publicly, that TH left the school without Kyron, but in another car?
DY had mentioned someone seeing Kyron at “Kaine’s truck.”
Did TH have an accomplice who just switched vehicles with her?
Is that why LE has tried to determine if the white truck was seen at the stores that morning?
Police Search For Missing Woodburn Woman
Police Search For Missing Woodburn Woman. Woodburn police are looking for a missing woman with medical needs. Manuela Yvonne De La Rosa, 37, was last seen leaving her Woodburn home on Luba Street around…
Article: http://www.kptv.com/news/26539241/detail.html
I wanted to post this because of the recent brief discussion we had about “anchor babies”.
Kids of Illegals Costing
L.A. County $600 Million
Welfare benefits for the children of illegal immigrants cost America’s largest county more than $600 million last year, official says
U.S. Expands Crackdown on IllegalsOfficial: Border Violence Worsening
http://www.foxnews.com/
Patricia says:
January 20, 2011 at 10:07 am
Patricia, I’ve been feeling that way as well. So, if, as Blink has stated, no-one saw Kyron leave the school with anyone, did he ever leave the school? I know the school and grounds have been searched, but what if there is an area that isn’t on the blueprints? Somewhere that someone stumbled upon (or built) that is unknown to everyone else? That would account for the lack of physical evidence. I guess if dogs were brought into the school, that would be unlikely. Which leaves the container theory. Someone had to see a person leaving with a container, unless the perp waited to remove the container when classes were back in session and the hallways were empty. Even then, wouldn’t someone have noticed a vehicle leaving from one of the offices or classrooms? Maybe someone did notice and report it – and it’s a white truck. Back to square one…..
I’m thinking the two white trucks were def. part of the plan. Kyron was directed to walk out to the truck (Kaine’s truck) and was abducted at that time. TmH left Skyline in the other white truck. Maybe TmH did a few errands, was supposed to meet up with the perp to exchange vehicles. That would explain her pinging on SI, and do I recall reading about a frantic phone call being overheard at one point? Also, wasn’t the white truck in for some kind of service immediately after the incident? What was done and where? I assume LE has the work record.
I post this again followed by the Oregon statute to point out this may have been not only a sex offender issue, but also, if there were pictures, a money making venture – IMO. If this person is guilty, I wonder if she had a juvenile record that was not available for a criminal background check, and no adult convictions yet since her age is listed as 24. One sad thing is that it often takes so many victims before a person is caught.
by David Krough
kgw.com
Posted on January 20, 2011 at 9:40 AM
Updated today at 10:34 AM
PORTLAND, Ore. — A Portland daycare worker was arrested earlier this month for child sex abuse and detectives feared there could be more possible victims.
On January 9 Portland detectives arrested 24-year-old Inez Lambert of Northeast after a tip came in from the Child Abuse Hotline. Court documents showed that she also lived near a park frequented by children.
Lambert was indicted Friday on child sex abuse, sodomy and using a child in a sexually explicit display charges.
Detectives were concerned about the possibility of additional victims under the private care of Lambert. Investigators said Lambert also worked as a daycare provider for LA Fitness in Northeast on NE Weidler. Gym employees were cooperating with police.
Anyone with information should the Child Abuse Tip Line at 503 823-0306.
163.670¹
Using child in display of sexually explicit conduct
(1) A person commits the crime of using a child in a display of sexually explicit conduct if the person employs, authorizes, permits, compels or induces a child to participate or engage in sexually explicit conduct for any person to observe or to record in a photograph, motion picture, videotape or other visual recording.
(2) Using a child in a display of sexually explicit conduct is a Class A felony. [1985 c.557 §3; 1987 c.864 §3; 1991 c.664 §5]
Blink,
I have a couple of questions,
Since the relatively new information you have given us regarding
SZ, I was wondering if you still had the opinions of these statements?
1. Two nearly identical white trucks-
“One parked in the rear, and Terri parked on the shoulder.
B”
would the truck in the rear be near the above mentioned door?
I personally do not think that is the door Kyron exited from.
B
**************************
2. August 4, 2010 at 3:28 am
I am unaware of any confirmed report anyone saw Kyron leave through any door. B
I am
B
Blink,
Also this one. TIA
1. Twinkletoes says:
June 11, 2010 at 9:52 am
1. Not if he was “in something”, and sadly, not if nobody is looking.
There is only one way in and out of the school, and there are no cameras.
The likelihood that this is an employee or volunteer of this school is very high, I am choking myself out of not just coming out and saying “the suspect is the man that has not been on the job since early this week.”
I despise these cases. I did not know when I went on my rant about pedophiles on Dana’s show last week, it was prophetic.
B
He is not the only witness, and keep in mind that if Kyron was seen leaving the location, with any person, it would have qualified him for the Amber Alert, which as you know is one of the requirements.
B
*************************
So either Kyron was removed from the school in some sort of container or no one happened to see him when he did leave. This all takes me back to square one again! My original theory was that someone else (RS or SZ I suppose) had a white truck at the school that day, and Ky was seen near said truck. I surmised that he disappeared in that truck, but the witness assumed it was the Horman truck and thought nothing of it at the time. And there was enough confusion about the date of the Dr. appt. that Ky was not missed the entire school day. I posted all this ages ago and I still think it’s possible. I just don’t understand any other way he could disappear without one single person out of hundreds seeing or hearing something suspicious!I hate that LE and everyone else cannot figure this out. I hate that so far someone has gotten away with this crime. And now, this far down the road, even if LE did find little Ky, what kind of evidence would still exist as far as securing a suspect and being able to indict them? It’s a never ending nightmare, it really is.
All I can do is pray some more, I hope some of you have better luck thinking things through. Barring some sort of epiphany I’m out of ideas. So sad.
justice23 says:
January 20, 2011 at 9:25 am
Just an FYI … when child care workers themselves are abusing the kids on their watch, it’s definitely time to start putting bleach into the gene pool, don’t ya’ll think? How truly sad. I hope this woman gets the book thrown at her!
http://www.koinlocal6.com/news/local/story/Portland-child-care-worker-faces-21-sex-abuse/s-CiXZhIRkGaN9qBKQRHww.cspx
**************************************************************************
@ justice23.
Equally as disgusting is that its being reported that this POS woman was filming the sodomy of these poor children – and sending it to her boyfriend who’s deployed in Afghanistan.
She also skyped the child abuse LIVE to this a-hole.
Another fine use of technology. Not.
Thankfully NCIS has already picked up the partner and is flying him back to hand him over to the FBI on child porn charges.
snip from article @
http://www.koinlocal6.com/news/local/story/Portland-woman-accused-of-taping-sex-abuse-of/QDsUPOpNGUeiEe2uqYmv_A.cspx
“24-year-old Inez Lambert, who worked for LA Fitness in Northeast Portland, faces 21 sex abuse charges.
A Multnomah County grand jury indicted Lambert on Jan. 14 on seven charges each for sodomy, using a child in a display of sexually explicitly conduct and sex abuse.
Investigators believe that Lambert taped the abuse and sent videos via email to 31-year-old Staff Sgt. Corey H. McAdoo, who was deployed in Afghanistan. It is believed Lambert also skyped the abuse live to McAdoo.
NCIS took Lambert into custody and will bring him back to the U.S. next week on a military flight. He is expected to be handed over to the FBI where child pornography charges await. ”
———————————————————
@ Blink.
Are there a group of posts from yesterday from about 7pm until 8am this morning that are still in moderation?
This mornings posts have been up all day … but there seems to be a gap of posts missing – with last nights/early am todays post not making it out of moderation ??
Thanks.
I think I got everything, that was an odd glitch on my part, thanks for telling me.
B
Is it written in stone that SZ is a pedophile ?
or could he be some body who felt Kyron was
in trouble with living with Terri
and she hated Kyron
just how much complaining about Kyron did
Terri do
someone should have been concerned
IMO
18.Kozyotb says:
January 20, 2011 at 9:06 am
IIRC correctly and this is IMO.
Kyron was never seen leaving with Terri or ANYONE else.
This is why initially LE was looking for some sort of container or gym bag something of this nature on Sauvie Island because Terri’s cell phone pinged there during the time she could or would not account for and during the time DS was MIA also.
Blink do you think Terri knew SZ?
*****************************************
I would like to point out that although I generated the piece suggesting that cell pings were being used to generate the request for traffic video and thus led to the search on Sauvie- I never said they were Terri’s, that to my knowledge is from “un-named sources.”
B
Who left their job at Skyline right after Kyron went missing?
I work in the medical proffession and a few years ago, MCSO showed up at our hospital here on the east side.
They arrested my co-worker, who was charged with several counts of child sex abuse, encouraging sex abuse, internet porn and a few others I don’t remember off hand.
SHE, didn’t have great attendance at work and whenever she could justify a way to leave early she would. As time went on before she was arrested, she disclosed to a few of us at work in matter of fact way, that she was proud to belong to the swinger population in PDX!
What bothered me then and even more so now, is wondering IF this particular lifestyle contributed (and possibly still does today) to the child sex charges she acquired.
I am telling this story because I truly believe this type of lifestyle, being discussed quietly and not talked about by many is relevant to KY! I don’t have facts, but I do remember “lifestyle” issues briefly being discussed at the begininng of this story.
If what I’m saying is in fact part of this case, then it’s a matter of finding a person who was involved in this lifestyle and also with ties to PPS enough so as to not be considered a stranger. Who could that be?
1. Twinkletoes says:
June 11, 2010 at 9:52 am
1. Not if he was “in something”, and sadly, not if nobody is looking.
B1. Twinkletoes says:
June 11, 2010 at 9:52 am
1. Not if he was “in something”, and sadly, not if nobody is looking.
There is only one way in and out of the school, and there are no cameras.
The likelihood that this is an employee or volunteer of this school is very high, I am choking myself out of not just coming out and saying “the suspect is the man that has not been on the job since early this week.”
I despise these cases. I did not know when I went on my rant about pedophiles on Dana’s show last week, it was prophetic.
B
Was this said by B?…If so who is he????
I am choking myself out of not just coming out and saying “the suspect is the man that has not been on the job since early this week.”
Mark my words, this comes down to someone with a lifestyle issue that caused this, and they never saw it coming. Secondly, I think information is being withheld from Desiree.
B
**************************************
1. I think it is a possiblity until it can be ruled out. I think whatever the angle is that surrounds Terri right now, most knows what that is. What was more important to me was when Kaine said, something to the effect of .. We can put what happened to us back together after Kyron is found.
That spoke volumes to me.
B
***************************************
1. I do not believe Terri harmed this child. I think a lifestyle choice on the behalf of her, or her and Kaine may be the connection to who did. I think she initially tried to withhold that info, and it bought her a second or 5th round with the po po. Option #2 is some sort of stalker she is unaware of , also though due to a lifestyle choice of some kind, and that is as specific as I will be on the issue.
As far as her retaining counsel, I would absolutely advise her to. Everyone gets so hung up on that issue as if to say that means a person is guilty. IT DOES NOT, necessarily. I can tell you in most cases, a good defense attorney is able to get through to people about what LE needs, and do so without implicating their client. Moreover, they actually aid in a successful and fair prosecution if necessary.
If she does know anything, a lawyer is the best chance of getting that info in the right hands, one must consider that.
B
THE LOVELY BONES…
Movie about an under ground play house for a perv to lure children…….I would be using blowers, mowers, pokers, over every inch around the school, sauive island.Is this a way our missing children disappear into thin air? To scary!!!! FIND KYRON ,PLEASE DEAR LORD
Added…..is it true,
LONER MEN, no children, volunteer around them,smile, they think hes really nice, seems harmless, are #1 on le radar screens??????
Kimberly says:
January 20, 2011 at 2:20 pm
Blink,
Also this one. TIA
1. Twinkletoes says:
June 11, 2010 at 9:52 am
1. Not if he was “in something”, and sadly, not if nobody is looking.
There is only one way in and out of the school, and there are no cameras.
The likelihood that this is an employee or volunteer of this school is very high, I am choking myself out of not just coming out and saying “the suspect is the man that has not been on the job since early this week.”
I despise these cases. I did not know when I went on my rant about pedophiles on Dana’s show last week, it was prophetic.
B
*******************************************************************
@ Kimberly.
I was looking for that exact message from Blink just a week or so ago – and never could find it.
I looked back and must have searched thru hundreds of pages to try to find that specific post from Blink.
I guess I didn’t go back far enough to June 11th, 2010.
Glad you brought this forward.
I was looking for it for much the same reason as you were … wondering if Blink still feels the same about:
1) “the suspect is the man that has not been on the job since early this week.”
2) “The likelihood that this is an employee or volunteer of this school is very high”
… or if events since then have changed things ??
Kimberly says:
January 20, 2011 at 5:29 pm
Mark my words, this comes down to someone with a lifestyle issue that caused this, and they never saw it coming. Secondly, I think information is being withheld from Desiree.
B
**************************************
well, well, well … I have not read these comments by Blink … until they were just now reposted by Kimberly!
Here’s the “other” storyline we are not privy to.
oh .. and thank you Kimberly for re-posting B’s comments.
Sammy says:
January 20, 2011 at 5:39 pm
Kimberly says:
January 20, 2011 at 2:20 pm
Blink,
Also this one. TIA
1. Twinkletoes says:
June 11, 2010 at 9:52 am
1. Not if he was “in something”, and sadly, not if nobody is looking.
There is only one way in and out of the school, and there are no cameras.
The likelihood that this is an employee or volunteer of this school is very high, I am choking myself out of not just coming out and saying “the suspect is the man that has not been on the job since early this week.”
I despise these cases. I did not know when I went on my rant about pedophiles on Dana’s show last week, it was prophetic.
B
——————————————————
Wasn’t it the GroundsKeeper who left for Mexico shortly after Ky disappeared or am I mistaken?
does anyone think that Kyron was sexually abused before he was abducted? Meaning an ongoing abuse? Is that why he didn’t want to go home after staying with Desiree? Maybe someone thought he would tell Desiree and her husband so they abducted him? Maybe it wasnt sexual, maybe just physical abuse
not meaning to trivialize physical abuse by the way.