Kyron Horman Case: Terri Horman Sexts Sent To Kaine Horman’s Phone…. WHAT?
HOLD THE PHONE
In what can only be considered the latest bombshell development in the case of missing Portland boy, 7 year old Kyron Horman, blinkoncrime.com has discovered that the recent sexually graphic text messages or sexts, allegedly exchanged between Terri Horman and mutual friend Michael Cook, may have been altered. Definitely, alter-able.
Blinkoncrime.com has confirmed that the phone number which Kaine hand-wrote on the originally sealed emergency restraining order dated June 28, 2010, matches the cell phone number he also alleges, through his attorney Laura Rackner, was used by Michael Cook to RECEIVE the “sext” messages in question.
What’s the issue?
Kaine Horman owns the phone and the account it is registered to, and unless the allegation is that Terri Horman, using her own phone as purported by Kaine, is herself posing as Michael Cook and sexting herself, which would seem like a physical impossibility given some of her *glamour shots*, we have a serious problem.
In Kaine’s own handwriting on the June 28th Restraining Order, he pens that is an alternative number for Terri Horman.
In the contempt order filed by Kaine Horman on July 12, Ms. Rackner states that she has personally seen the “work phone” records of Michael Cook, and goes on to say “a search” of his cell phone reflected that he took snapshots on June 28th of the earlier served restraining order, which had been sealed, and was the basis for the contempt motion in the first place. He took pictures of sealed documents on the phone belonging to the other person bound by the same order prohibiting Terri Horman from showing anyone. As there are no texts on the work number until July, it is the only logical conclusion.
I am going to go out on a limb here and assume that at some point it occurred to someone that using good faith information in your affidavit, which when not alerting the court that your client has complete ownership and access to the data on the phone account in question, can look like bad faith in a nano-second, thus the withdrawal.
However, not everyone is on the same the playbill because the 21 pages of texts, which were released in PDF format, and do not include any numbers for Terri Horman herself, were supplied in an electronically redacted format; which again indicates this was not an original file.
It was not until the unredacted pdf’s became available October 26th and we converted them to HTML files could we see that based on the file format, it is clear these records came from the account owners and were not subpoenaed from the carrier. Original files, also provided to the respondent, are the requirement of the court. We all know texts can be sent from our phone online accounts, and from our phones directly; I think I even have voice command to text widget thingie.
Anyone that had access to the account, which is registered to Kaine Horman, could clone, spoof, or manipulate those messages, period. That aside, let’s consider the possibility that Terri Horman HAD implicated herself even slightly in any messages on phones that may be utilized to illicit information by a woman who demonstrated her complete knowledge that she understood what expectation of privacy parameters she was under the impression she was operating under, and engaging in, with the “textee”.
Terri Horman was represented by counsel, it would not be difficult for Stephen Houze allege that Kaine Horman was in constant contact with MCSO, had already been provided case sensitive information by them, and as such, was acting as an agent in soliciting the text messages. You see where I am going with this?
The fruit of that poisonous tree is more like the fruit of the poisonous orchard.
The implications of this scenario are abysmal. While I completely understand the desperation of a Father wanting to locate his child, since I have yet to really see anywhere Cook attempts to engage Terrri Horman about Kyron’s whereabouts at any time; I do not get the point of the exercise.
Ms. Rackner is a first rate “Super Lawyer”, but she is not above the burden of her duty to insure that what is being provided to her as a “good faith basis” is just that.
Does this information make Terri Horman any less vulgarly inappropriate at best? Hell to the No.
While it is true on the surface because of this information one will be hard pressed to prove it was definitely Terri Horman who sent the electronic ipecac none of us will soon forget, her attorneys have not denied it was her, nor do I expect them to, at least not until they read this.
What it does, yet again, is potentially compromise the criminal case involving the disappearance of Desiree Young and Kaine Horman’s son Kyron.
This afternoon, blinkoncrime.com contributing editor and Legal Analyst, Lea Conner weighed in:
Kaine Horman claims that law enforcement provided the texts records to him, but that does not mean that the records came from the cell phone provider, nor does it mean that the conversations involve Michael Cook or Terri Horman.
In fact, there are indications that the text message transcripts filled by Mr. Horman are not as they appear. At least one of the phones purported to belong to “Michael Cook” is registered to Kaine Horman.
Just as important, none of these records indicate any information about the texts Mr. Horman alleges were sent by his wife. Mr. Horman does not list any cell phone number, not one message ID, not one cell record that indicates the identity of other party to the conversation let alone indicating Ms. Horman as the other party to the text message “conversations.” In the case of the phone with the “503″ prefix (503-XXX-XX76), Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone that was purportedly sending texts as “Michael Cook.”
More bizarre, Mr. Horman listed this number as belonging to Terri Horman in his application for a temporary restraining order. Was this a slip on the part of Mr. Horman? Mr. Horman claimed in a motion for remedial contempt that Ms. Horman showed a copy of the restraining order to Mr. Cook and allowed him to photograph the document.
Given that the phone Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone he purports was used by “Michael Cook,” it begs the question as to whether Ms. Horman ever allowed Mr. Cook access to the sealed restraining order. As a party to the action, Mr. Horman had the very same sealed documents. Mr. Horman, through Counsel Laura Rackner, claimed to have reviewed Mr. Cook’s “work cell phone records.”
It is not clear if the documents Ms. Rackner referenced as Mr. Cook’s “work” cell records are, in fact, for the phone registered to Mr. Horman. If the sealed documents referenced in Mr. Horman’s contempt motion were photographed with the phone registered to Mr Horman — the same phone that Mr. Horman claims was used by Mr. Cook — it might help explain why Mr. Horman withdrew his contempt motion.
Had he gone forward with the motion, he might have had to explain how it was the documents allegedly photographed by Mr. Cook were the same documents that he had in his possession, and that the phone used to photograph sealed court documents was registered to him, not Mr. Cook.
The records for the phone with a “971″ prefix (971-XXX-XX63) are unlisted. This phone also purported to send texts as “Michael Cook.” Due to the unavailability of any registration for this phone, it is impossible to tell to whom the phone belongs, or who was actually sending texts from this phone. The unredacted copy of the cell phone records filed on October 25, 2010, only identifies one caller on each set of cell phone records. This means that the records came from the phone, not the cell provider. Text records on pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 are from (503) XXX-XX76 (“Cell Phone A”). These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 10:17 pm on June 30, 2010 through 7:19 pm on July 1, 2010.
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Cell Phone A is a Cingular/AT&T cell phone registered to Kaine Horman. It is also a phone number listed by Mr. Horman in his restraining order application as a phone number for Ms. Horman.
Pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the conversation attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. Text records on pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 are from (971) XXX-XX63 (“Cell Phone B”).
These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 6:49 pm on July 4, 2010 through 8:30 am on July 6, 2010. The bottom of page 17 has a partial text message sent on July 6, 2010, which purports to be sent after 8:30 am. Cell Phone B is an unlisted cell phone with AT&T (formerly Cingular).
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. All texts in Exhibit 2 are from Cell phone A, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 2:29 pm on July 3, 2010 through 9:40 am on July 4, 2010.
Exhibit 2 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. All texts in Exhibit 3 are from Cell phone B, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 8:44 pm on July 6, 2010 through 8:41 am am on July 7, 2010. The top of page 1 of this exhibit has part of an undated message from 8:41 am., possibly on July 6, 2010, that states “I understand. I’m upset about kitty. I didn’t do [sic]”
Exhibit 3 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. Surely investigators working on this case must know that the cell records filed by Mr. Horman as coming from Michael Cook’s phone were not from Mr. Cook’s phone, but from a phone registered in his own name.
Someone in law enforcement must have noticed that the number Mr. Horman claims belong to Michael Cook is also the number he claimed belonged to his wife in his TRO application. Mr. Horman signed his application for temporary restraining order on Monday June 28, 2010, prior to its filing at 4:39 pm that afternoon.
This was two days after the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office conducted its failed sting operation at the Horman residence on Saturday June 26, 2010. MCSO was unable to confirm the murder-for-hire plot that had been alleged by the landscaper. As a result, MCSO was not able to arrest Ms. Horman.
As such, why did law enforcement then give the green light to Mr. Horman to obtain a restraining order on the basis that his wife had hired to hire a hit man? Or did Mr. Horman act unilaterally without the endorsement of law enforcement? Surely Mr. Horman must have known that law enforcement could not verify the landscaper’s story, yet he went ahead and filed a restraining order based on the very allegations that law enforcement could not verify. So why did he sign his name to allegations that he knew were not true?
The text messages don’t check out. The murder for hire allegations don’t check out. The only common thread here is a man whose son disappeared on June 4, 2010. As tragic and anguishing as Mr. Horman’s circumstances may be, that does not excuse misrepresenting information to the court.
Mr. Horman cannot claim that the phone registered in his name is Michael Cook’s work cell phone, nor can he claim that the phone allegedly used by Michael Cook was used by Ms. Horman. When Sheriff Dan Staton talked about knowing things that might surprise people, could he have been talking about cell phone records? Maybe Stephen Houze and Peter Bunch will force the sheriff to reveal its source for the records.
Although the answer would not bring Kyron home, it might at least alleviate some of the blame heaped on Ms. Horman, as unpopular as that may be.
Lea Conner, contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
Madeline Tanner, copy and contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
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I would bet money suspect zero was back at that school after the incident to avoid suspicion.
B
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But Blink … didn’t you say mths ago that the person to potentially be looking into was quite likely someone who HADN’T been back to Skyline since June 4th?
Not trying to start anything here but I vaguely remember you saying that in the past. Please correct me if I’m getting that wrong. I wouldn’t blame you in the least for changing your mind if anything has changed in your thoughts recently as I believe at least all of us at some point have had our brains turn to mush trying to figure out this case and put all the mysterious pieces together w/so many unknowns. So are we kinda leaning more toward the “parent/staff member” being involved/responsible now in your opinion or is it really possible a parent/staff member could also be a potential offender of sorts? Or are we leaning more toward a complete stranger offender who was just very opportunistic and had quite the set of cajones? My head is spinning.
Early in the case, yes, that is one of the first things LE weeds through. Absolutely. Who have we not seen onsite since the incident is 101 if you will.
As the Suspect profile has developed for us, I am of the opinion this is a person that was not unfamiliar to the school or community in general, and it is possible, given the substantial risk the suspect was comfortable with apparently, he might see the opportunity to return as both a way to say “what boogie man would be bold enough to step foot back here, I am not afraid of being caught?”, as well as this sick ticket reliving portions of his crime by returning to the scene of it.
My opinion is that because of the supreme concentration on TH and her friends, initially, that created a false sense of security for this individual for a time. I do not think for 10 seconds he bargained for the assets and agencies mobilized for this case, so at this point, I expect he is laying low, or is underground altogether, but that is just my overall opinion. He may be on the radar, and if he is, he is just living life as usual under the watchful eyes he knows he has.
If Kyron is not located, I have a very sick feeling about the outcome of this case.
B
Thanks for clarifying Blink … but now I feel kinda nauseous thinking there is someone out there LE might not have a name/identity for. One last comment if you will please?
“If Kyron is not located, I have a very sick feeling about the outcome of this case.”
B
Could you maybe elaborate a little more on that? Not sure I really want to know, but the other part of me just really needs to for closure sake. Are you saying if he’s not located that you feel it’s possible the perp will never be found and will remain at large and potential strike again? Or if he’s not found, TMH will potentially be off the hook? Combination of both?
????????????????????????
Maybe I should have said in your opinion
Merry Christmas or whatever you celebrate everyone (I mean that sincerely) . I need to remove myself for awhile.
I will check in from time to time.
I hope this ends soon for Kyron and his parents. I could never imagine their pain!
I’m still not getting where Blink is going with this. If it’s truely a parent/volunteer/worker at the school. How would Terri be involved? Based on her actions and what we know of her whereabouts that day, I believe 100% she was involved. So this new theory being bandied about has me scratching my head.
@kjf says:
December 16, 2010 at 5:46 pm
I don’t know, but this has always been on my mind…Kyron took the bus to and from school most every day like most kids, right? Who would know what vehicle someone had or didn’t have on a certain day? Or, if he wasn’t going on the bus?
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Normally Ky took the bus to and from school. Terri and Kaine had agreed to switch vehicles on both Thursday June 3 and Friday June 4th.
She wanted the truck on June 3 to take Kyron’s project to set it up at the school. Her reasoning for taking the truck on June 4 was to pick up his project (which she never did pick up). If one thinks TH was responsible for Ky’s disappearance one might presume she didn’t want to take her red Mustang with the RDSQRL plates because it would be easily recognized at the school and/or wherever she traveled that day. Hopefully, LE has checked her whereabouts on Thursday June 3 also.
Blink says:
(snip)
I think MCSO is in a most unenviable position. Honestly, were I to be asked what I recommend in the parental community of that school?
I would start a support group, and I would get the parents talking about whether they had a creep factor about “who” that day, and any other day, and have a trained and certified child therapist monitoring should they need to “takeaway” issues to discuss at home.
Town Hall format, private to parents, with security support.
I am just not comfortable with the “isolated incident” designation.
*******************************************************************************
A support group that MCSO is involved in would be a brilliant idea Blink.
Do they not have that set up for Skyline parents/students/teachers presently?
If only for the tremendous support this would provide to parents – it is something that should be happening.
But, as you mentioned, getting people together with each other in a safe + secure environment would get the conversations going about any creep-factor feelings anyone may have felt ping their radar. (that day, or any other day).
I would imagine most families are struggling to make sure their kids feel safe going back to Skyline each day – when one of their classmates suddenly vanished from the school.
How scary is that to a 7 year old kid.
And the fears the parents must be living with each day – as they send their most treasured + loved little person off into the world each morning.
Getting these parents/children/teachers together in an informal setting might just get people thinking and saying aloud the little things that might have been niggling away at their internal alarms.
One parent might say something about some seemingly innocuous little detail of that day or some person that was/is around Skyline
And then someone else may say “Hey, I had noticed that too. I was afraid to say anything b/c I didn’t want to call LE with what was probably just my imagination gone wild.”
Among all the people around Skyline on that day and the days that have followed … there have to be many things that seem like small little insignificant blips.
Who knows what kind of real leads might be developed if they got these people together to compare notes?
This is something that MCSO should really have in place.
(All parents should be given a copy of Gavin deBeckers “Gift of Fear” to help them tune into those internal nigglings that may be pinging away at their radar too!)
Sorry if this has been asked before (lots of fascinating posts here the last couple of days and I’m trying to keep up), and I certainly understand that it may be case-sensitive…but, B–as you have stated that you believe the perp subsequently returned to the school–is it therefore your opinion that the perp’s name is on “the list”?
I think the issue you are having when you say, “I have tried to get it across before”, is that the very notion you are so convinced makes it seem that you are not open to the possibilities that have not been excluded in this case. It is as if you feel you failed at getting your point across because others continue to have a different opinion.
The point I was referring to had nothing to do with the case or her guilt or innocence it had to do with the double standard of the followers. If someone expresses a belief that she was the mastermind and they do not agree with opinions to the contrary they are often attacked in a polite condescending way. However there are people who no matter what evidence you present to them that implicates her they minimize and make excuses. I have not once seen anyone “in that camp” challenged. I am really not here to argue this is just something I have been observing here. I am and always have been on Kyron’s side
I think this horse is deceased. I don’t think you can take the “guilt” or innocence” out of the equation if that is the divide in the first place. The point is, we do not know. We should remain open, if we are to evaluate as objective analysts.
Again, in 4000 comments on this thread alone you really think it is a fair asessment that nobody but folks that belong TH is “in it up to her eyeballs” has been challenged? Seriously, that is just not true.
Lastly, I have noticed that when people have strong opinions one way or another, and someone disagrees, that person feels condescended to- food for thought.
I have editors in my camp that disagree with me, each other, and sometimes have a completely different take on a piece of evidence. We thrive on it, and usually find our work benefits from it.
I have learned to use the phrase, and not just to Mr. Blink.. “Perhaps you could just try it on and see how it fits for a minute, then decide..”
B
justice23 says:
December 17, 2010 at 10:53 am
And blink,
General question: I remember DY saying she knows completely about the school at the time it made me question myself because I two kids at the same school, I know the basic layout of the school, where bathrooms are,gym art room ect. But I don’t know “completely” about the school, such as storage rooms utility rooms ect.
Is this something that I “should” know as a parent?
I think we ought always to entertain our opinions with some measure of doubt. I shouldn’t wish people dogmatically to believe any philosophy, not even mine.
Bertrand Russell (1872 – 1970)
Fight for your opinions, but do not believe that they contain the whole truth, or the only truth.
Charles A. Dana (1819 – 1897)
Bravo, point taken.
B
@Blink
If Kyron is not located, I have a very sick feeling about the outcome of this case.
B
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This has been my worst “fear” since his disappearance.
@mary says:
December 17, 2010 at 11:16 am
I’m still not getting where Blink is going with this. If it’s truely a parent/volunteer/worker at the school. How would Terri be involved? Based on her actions and what we know of her whereabouts that day, I believe 100% she was involved. So this new theory being bandied about has me scratching my head.
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From all of TH’s actions and reactions since June 4th, I believe she has knowledge of who took Ky. It’s been said since the beginning of this case that it was “well planned”. That tells me there was more than one person involved which makes a case more difficult to solve. I do not believe it was a “random” act and I am relieved LE has openly shifted their focus to SZ and taken the spotlight off of TH. My opinion from early on has been LE needs a “body” and/or a confession to solve this case and my worst fear is the case could ultimately go “cold”.
XACTLY. Well said.
Guilty, a little guilty, the mastermind, whatever, that information right now, changes nothing.
I have a better chance of levitating than pinning this on her today.
But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B
If Kyron is not located, I have a very sick feeling about the outcome of this case.
B
~~~
Like it or not, the #1 Suspect is a pedophile … a serial pedophile.
If Ky is not located, it is not likely TH will be charged with anything. If Ky is located, maybe she could be charged with conspiracy or obstruction … maybe.
The first line of defense Houze has in defending TH against any charges, is this FBI profile. It is not the profile of TH. There is not enough circumstancial evidence to stack up against the profile of a serial pedophile. There would have to be direct evidence and the Sheriff has said they have none.
At this stage of the investigation, while MCSO is still combing the area for clues and possible location of Ky, it more likely this case has been rolled into a larger, more encompassing investigation … and has been stated by many, can take months, even years to come to a conclusion.
Thinking of staff/workers/contractors….did Skyline have a company that laundered “entrance mats” (carpet) throughout the building? Where I used to work, we had a company come in twice a month to change out the mats and take uniforms. They’d bring new clean entrance mats and take the dirty ones back to their company for cleaning.
@ Blink
But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B
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We see a larger part of what actually took place on June 4th.
In the meantime let me know what it’s like to “levitate”
I posted a long time ago wondering if the bus driver also picked up kids on or near Sauvi Island based on the link below.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/10/searchers_will_return_to_sauvi.html
Quesnel said kids who live on the island rode the bus with Kyron and are taking his disappearance the hardest: “That’s probably the most disturbing thing, how hard it is on the kids.”
Also, does anyone know the name of Kyron’s bus driver? Is he on the list? After McKinney bus driver was arrested awhile back, I have wondered if Ky’s own driver was at the school very long that morning. I would think the driver would drop off and leave prior to 8:45. I know Ky didn’t ride the bus that morning but some kids would have arrived by bus at the normal time. The bus driver would be someone who would return to the school later, would have known Ky and family.
One of the names on the list that people were researching had possibly been a bus driver. He had a record and a hispanic name, SB. Is he a parent of a student or what? All MOOO. Thanks!
@puzzled
If Ky is not located, it is not likely TH will be charged with anything. If Ky is located, maybe she could be charged with conspiracy or obstruction … maybe
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Since it’s been over six months since he’s disappeared what could a body reveal other than “cause/probable cause of death”? I would think the location of body would be significant.
What findings would lead LE to a perp(s)?
I just think that its a stretch of a coincidence that a serial (or not) pedophile would come into Skyline on THAT day and kidnap, of all children, Kyron Horman and it’s revealed that his step mother on THAT day acted out of character and borrowed her husbands truck to bring a project home that was not brought home- that a child who usually takes the bus, does not take the bus-that a close friend of the step mother is missing unaccountable at the same time the step mother is missing unnaccountable- that the step mother’s daughter has an earache and then appears to be fine- that Kyron was to be in the program but wasn’t and no one seemed concerned-that the step mother then fails 2 polygraphs and refuses to take a third to clear her name- her friend also refuses to take a polygraph-and… the step mother not only hires a lawyer BUT a celebrity lawyer for an amount of money that she doesn’t seem to have but must be able to get!annnd it’s discovered has tried to have her husband killed BUUUUUT Terri is not involved??? come on Kyron must be found
@7. Jamie. I am attracted here because it is not an opinion blog. It seems to be set up as an information-gathering, investigatory, analytic blog, guided by someone experienced in that process. It is a process. If Blink seems “convinced”, then it’s to open up a reasonable area of investigation. I feel rewarded when others more diligent than I turn up possibly relevant material to screen in or out based on analysis. The last thing I want to read is an opinion which is not the conclusion of evidentiary research and analysis. Kudos to those who Blink for Kyron and other children
One question is why SZ’s subliminations no longer worked for him? Blow of some kind–loss of job? Falloff in profits? Divorce? Death of a loved one? etc. And, “serial” makes me thinks of someone who travels for job. Is porn the parallel investigation?
lyla says:
December 17, 2010 at 12:18 pm
Lyla Says:
From all of TH’s actions and reactions since June 4th, I believe she has knowledge of who took Ky. It’s been said since the beginning of this case that it was “well planned”. That tells me there was more than one person involved which makes a case more difficult to solve. I do not believe it was a “random” act and I am relieved LE has openly shifted their focus to SZ and taken the spotlight off of TH. My opinion from early on has been LE needs a “body” and/or a confession to solve this case and my worst fear is the case could ultimately go “cold”.
***********
I agree with this assessment about well planned and someone helped TH but I guess I’m not as sure about another parent at the school being her helper. I would be more likely to believe it was DDS or the landscaper(or associates) than another parent. But I have to admit, THAT would truely shock me if it was.
Blink said:
“Respectfully, I have noticed that if people were of the mindset that TH premeditated what happened to Kyron no amount of evidence to the contrary is being absorbed.”
@Jamie
I hear what you are saying, have thought the same thing at times. Like the above comment, came across to me like – for those of you still having the opinion TH premeditated it, you aren’t basing that opinion on facts, but rather on some emotional-based, preconceived “mindset” that renders you too dimwitted to absorb any other possibilities.
I never rode the short bus. I am open to all possibilities that are a reasonable extrapolation of the facts/information that is known.
Whatever opinion anyone has – agree, disagree, kooky or not – at least people are still talking about Kyron’s case and he hasn’t been forgotten.
That is going to be the last post where dimwitted or short bus appear. Offensive.
That never happened, was your perception, and for a welcome contributor, I sincerely hope you have posters remorse.
B
@11. “What do we see?” We see a list of self or school identified SF attenders, designed to confirm they were there. Subtract staff & it’s a small list indeed. (probably even less for talent show.) We see MCSO ask for i.d.s of attenders spotted not on the list due to not self identifying. We see TH’s known (FB etc) and unknown contacts, the RSEs of the world. We see those in the area, knowing the school somewhat, with a prior interest in children from clubs, coaching, business ownership, scouts, churches, etc.
Well what I see is – NOTHING NOTTA ZIP public statements, actions or reactions that do not involve TH. That is disturbing to me…
I agree totally, TH is involved. She is NOT gonna talk. So, without a body or some sort of public focus on a potential accomplice then this case isn’t going anywhere. Obviously they didn’t find what they need through digital forensics, post kidnapping surveillance, botched undercover MFH schemes or through very public statements, flyers, innuendos and searches.
Absolutely.
One should ask themself, as lily as.. With everything I know, does that sound logical to me?
If the answer is no, then a Plan B needs to be executed.
B
“But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B”
Hopefully we will see the big picture and her part in it will fall right in place.
Thoughts and prayers are with Kyron, his brothers, sister, friends and classmates.
But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B
So, let me make sure I’m following:
LE knows that Kyron was taken out of the school by someone other than TH. Blink may know, but we do not know, how LE knows this with certainty, but LE does know without doubt.
So taking TH out of the equation does not equate to her guilt or innocence or involvement or lack of involvement. Removing TH from the equation simply means that without her in there, there’s still a problem to be solved: WHO took Kyron?
LE has a profile now, and most likely some ideas re: how and when (I’m basing this on your “case sensitive” response earlier), but it’s not TH.
This does *not* mean that TH isn’t in it completely (and I fully believe that she is), it means that Kyron is still missing and to find him it means focusing on others, besides TH.
Looking at TH alone, guilty or innocent, will NOT bring us to Kyron.
Am I following?
If so, then is it too much of a stretch to say that LE has not been able to tie TH to the Subject Zero either thru her regular cell phone (though she could’ve been using bat phones) nor thru her FB or other email conversations (but we all know there are ways around those)? I’d *think* that if TH were even exchanging innocent text messages (along the lines of the one suggested above: “hey are you going to the SF…”), LE would’ve been thru all of those.
I would encourage everyone to read this very intelligent summation.
It encompasses both schools of thought, so to speak.
B
“But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B”
I can tell you one thing I see; I finally see ASS’s docket and exhibits. He was removed (deported) based on a Rape II charge. That data was incorrect; his conviction was for Rape III (which is not ‘rape’ as we know it), which is not an aggravated felony and is not a deportable charge. In fact, under federal law, the charge is not known as ‘rape’ at all.
Therefore, when he returned, it was an entry without inspection, but not the same as an ‘illegal reentry’ (sheesh, we need a complete overhaul of the immigration laws, but I read this stuff every day).
Since he is still in Tacoma (ICE detention), and did not enter the US with inspection, he is under a new removal order. Now that I have his A# I wonder if I have the nerve to call and really snoop his current case status, which is available to anyone who calls.
Now I will tell you what I don’t know. What exactly is ASS’ relation to this case. Unfortunately, right now, I am no closer to knowing.
Puzzled do you have an open door to the middle of this investigation?
About the white truck(s) in school parking lot. I have made many trips to school in the morning driving various children, project, pets, etc. The children I drive all normally take the bus, but things happen and they get driven also. Our schools have drop off points; stop briefly, kids exit car. Always a school staff person is there and usually a “mommie helper.” The kids all know who arrives in what car/truck. Believe me they know everyones cars, some even know everyone license plate number, really, OCD numbers kids? The boys especially can tell one persons car from another. They get driven around to sports events, sleep overs, etc. The children for the most part do KNOW everyones cars. Kaines truck had decals in the rear window, easy to spot.
“puzzled says:
December 17, 2010 at 12:24 pm
If Kyron is not located, I have a very sick feeling about the outcome of this case.
B
~~~
Like it or not, the #1 Suspect is a pedophile … a serial pedophile.+
Should someone alert Skyline Elementary parents that there is a serial pedophile out there since LE is so busy trying to pin the crime on TH, they don’t seem to think this is important enough to share?
I personally believe MCSO is doing what is necessary in this investigation at this point and I mean that sincerely. I believe they went with where the leads took them, and a little child was missing and at the end of the day, if they had a mili-chance of hope their actions could save this babe, they will never hear a criticism from me.
The way I see this, in terms of priority, is identifying this individual and securing an arrest (s) ,recovering Kyron, and progressing a successful prosecution in this case.
One thing I want to address about serial pedophiles- and it skeeves me out so much this subject matter, that I am way guilty of what I fault others for, and that is a loss of objectivity.
I feel strongly they are the scariest, most understudied, shunned societal problem there is.
In the interest of full disclosure, I am in the middle of an FBI course regarding same, that takes every bit of nerve I have to stomach so that I am better skilled at work as it relates to their analysis and profile.
Saying more at this point, would be all emotion for me. My constitution would exclude these individuals.
Every child, in every situation, is vulnerable, and we need to be vigilant with a capital V.
B
29.pdxgirl says:
December 16, 2010 at 12:59 pm
Another follow-on thought about the masterful IT skills. I am welling up with anger, rage, and horror at the thought, but what if LE has found images of Kyron in some online porn exchange? Could this be what makes LE well up with tears at press conferences? The things we wish we didn’t know? The reason why Desiree is so certain Kyron is stashed somewhere? The reason why Blink is saying this person has masterful IT skills but no electronic footprint? Why this is not your “garden-variety” pedo?
******************
It’s a possibility. Would match what I ‘saw’ before I knew much about the case (that Kyron was held somewhere dark (few windows, curtains drawn) but ‘homelike’ (furniture/large dining table) with other children there and quite filthy in the back recesses of the place, for a period of time then taken during the night to a boat with a bridge in the background and an older Caucasian man at the helm, at which point he was filled with deep fear and foreboding).
All the posts here have made me think. I like to think and I appreciate the differing perspectives. I do have ‘feelings’ about this case. I could absolutely be incorrect but these feelings say that Kyron is no longer with us, Terri was neck deep in why he is missing and she knew harm would come to him, at least two others are involved, a trial and conviction will happen, his remains may not be found, Kaine holds some liability because he knew things about his wife and did not protect his child, this eats at him from the inside but he is trying to protect himself from this feeling of guilt, we will all be surprised at what is revealed but many people have hit close in their theories, LE has far more information than they are revealing, Kyron’s life served a greater purpose and public perception may change as a result.
Doesn’t it seem we should take the offensive instead of the defensive when combating the issue of pedophiles? Catch them in real time, not wait years in order to ‘net as many as we can’ while the kids are being harmed over and over during those years. Get them and get them now, then don’t stop, keep going after them relentlessly. Make them afraid the same way they like their victims to be. These three year investigations of online pornography are ridiculous. Meanwhile, how many pedophiles are being created out of those who are victimized, like a growing cancer?
Reading the posts here makes me smarter. Thank you all for sharing.
@beejay
Thanks for clearing up the Ubaldo, Maria, Elsy connection.
@Midwest Mom
Wow! JK.
It seems like the cyber world and the real world are colliding at a pace that is difficult for LE to stay ahead of. If someone were “shopping” for a child, they only need to browse through the online “catalogue” of children so lovingly displayed by their parents, school districts and anyother extra activity that has a website. There could be people who “fill” these orders for a price. It may be a crime that is just now being discovered. Just a terrible thought.
Macabre yes, but I agree to a point. Childrens pictures, imo, should be kept private because we know for a fact that it is arousing to a sick group of “patients”.
I know it is not popular, but your childrens photos should be private to your trusted family members, period.
B
(Snip)
But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B
____________
Oh my! What a loaded question! Not sure where to start…
How about a community that appears to be afraid of something, they are too quiet, and yet do not appear to be afraid of the redheads. I keep expecting to see.. IDK..anger maybe? They have a man who admits to expecting payment for a MFH roaming among them and…nothing..no mention of that at all, where is he at? Why has he not been arrested? Is he living next door?
Just revisiting some of TH’s premeditation, misdirection, and cover-ups after Ky’s disappearance:
Many of TH’s behaviors seem to set the scene for distancing herself from Ky’s disappearance.
*Taking the white pickup instead of the Mustang. There was no need to. Tri-fold project board should fit in Mustang.
*Complaining to people at the gym about Kaine — with the apparent lie that Kaine forced her to send J away. TH could be creating the image of a household from which a younger brother might leave too, on his own. Or, it could shift things to “whatever the child did, it wasn’t because of HER, but Kaine, who made J leave.”
*The murder-for-hire for Kaine. This is so outrageous anyway, but it also fits into the development of a larger “life plan”, which, as you all have discussed, could include getting Ky too out of the house and TH’s life.
*Harsh punishment for Ky’s behavior in school, and her scrutiny of the tiniest details of his school day. This would make Ky look “incorrigible” and “difficult” after his disappearance, and would probably slant opinion towards Ky being uncontrollable and TH not responsible.
*After reading about the sexting and the photos, it’s understandable why Kyron was told to stay in his bedroom in the morning until a parent came to get him (per Kaine). Or sent to his room in the evening if he didn’t get a good report from school. [I agree with another poster that it could also been to keep him from waking the baby.] TH’s activities, such as sexting, seem to be good reasons to get an active, curious boy out of the house. Making Ky stay in his room a lot could be seen as premeditation in that TH would get to “test” the additional privacy she’d have without him around.
*Don’t know when this was mentioned by Terri, but working on Ky’s behavior to LISTEN TO ADULTS and follow their instructions seems to me like a premeditated gem she planted to make people think he could easily have been led away by an adult.
*Sending older son J away mid-school-year. Kaine said it turned out to be successful for J, but it’s also possible (as others here have said) that TH was bringing disreputable people (or romantic partners) (or both!) to the house that J would have been mature enough to notice and question. This really might have been one of the early steps of “clearing the house”.
*The whole doctor’s appointment mess up, which she blamed on a RETURNING teacher who TH said was NEW, as well blaming the misunderstanding on that teacher’s hearing problem. Do we know if that teacher (Miss Porter) really is deaf in one ear?
*Being sure to be seen at the SF by “important” people (i.e., Ky’s teacher and Mrs. Z from PTA).
*Having her “doctor’s-appointment-reminder” conversation with Miss Porter (apparently) in the gym, a noisy place at the school.
*Emailing friends detailing her whereabouts the morning Ky went missing. Setting up her alibis ASAP. Who’d be thinking about THAT?
*Going to her gym for what turned out to be a unusually short work-out, but it served to establish where she was at that time.
*saving purchase receipts for (what sounded like) low-cost purchases (little things, maybe coffee, photos, OTC meds?) TH didn’t use a credit card, did she? Don’t people usually toss those receipts if it was paid in cash? So that could be TH establishing an alibi — along with having her only long conversation with “A”, the woman from the gym at FMs.
*acquiring new “bat phones” — for after-the-fact cover-up?
*don’t know exact date, but her emails describing Kyron’s possible “little seizures”. If TH said this BEFORE he disappeared that would be a perfect premeditated set-up; if AFTERWARDS, a cover-up.
*If TH mentioned the small-seizure symptoms to the doctor or his secretary when making an appointment (symptoms that a poster here noticed were practically word-for-word from online medical sites!), this would indicate premeditation in terms of pre-planned misdirection of investigators after Ky’s disappearance(“he probably wandered away, as he’s been doing lately”).
*Having things to discuss with friends in private, since the house was perhaps bugged or still had an LEO present. I can understand that to some degree — needing to complain to a friend about some unfairness or a particular officer, etc., BUT I just can’t see myself in the middle of a sickening crisis, making arrangements to obtain a new cellphone!
*Being sure to take a few photos at the SF, which might be what she usually does for her photo albums, yet it could be to document that they were there together.
OK, enough unsourced stuff!
Blink, I’m pretty new here. How do I get a message to you without posting it for everyone to see?
Jill, first line of your post mark PRIVATE
Nobody will see it but you and I, it will say awaiting moderation.
B
14.enumclawrose says:
December 17, 2010 at 5:06 pm
@beejay
Thanks for clearing up the Ubaldo, Maria, Elsy connection
****
E-Rose, I missed this and read back, not finding a comment from BJ regarding them. Can you clue me in? I also found interesting pics on FB. Looks like AS-S is RS’s brother if the pics are correct.
Prayers for Kyron.
@45.beejay says:
December 17, 2010 at 9:53 am
My last comment, promised. If I miss the weekend lunch date it’ll be because I can’t make it back from CA in time. (Gotta pick up a friend.)
My tech friends are gonna take the use of my electronics away from me for awhile. Ya’ll keep up the good work!
——–
I hope you are able to make it back. Looking forward to possibly meeting you if you are here on Sunday during lunchtime.
Everyone-
This is the last social gathering post I will allow. That is not the scope of our work, and I cannot vett y’all.
Not appropriate.
B
I am just sick…I would kill Mrs. Porter if Kyron were my child.
Like my first post in June, how could she mark Kyron absent when she had seen him there
that morning?????? Why did she not look for him, call his parents, alert the school
that he was there that morning and then gone. I will never understand……
I can not imagine my son’s teacher not wondering where he was and
not following up right then and there.. That poor boy. Nobody caring about
his whereabouts…
Stars, respectfully, that is out of line. We do not know the facts, and Kyron was abducted, she is not to blame.
B
from all of TH’s actions and reactions since June 4th, I believe she has knowledge of who took Ky. It’s been said since the beginning of this case that it was “well planned”. That tells me there was more than one person involved which makes a case more difficult to solve. I do not believe it was a “random” act and I am relieved LE has openly shifted their focus to SZ and taken the spotlight off of TH. My opinion from early on has been LE needs a “body” and/or a confession to solve this case and my worst fear is the case could ultimately go “cold”.
——————————————————————————-
This is JMO but i think that having Kyron abducted from his school would be a really poor plan and anyone helping TH with any sense would see that. If she wanted to have KY disappeared then why not just have the bad guy be at the mall in a certain place when she was there with KY. She could just walk away from him, send him to the restroom, or tell him to go look at the toys in the toy section of a store. The bad guy grabs/lures him away. TH waits the agreed amount of time (says she spent that time looking for KY) then hits the panic button with the mall security. No alibi, endless driving around or lying to teachers required. If TH took KY from the school then I don’t think that she had the help of anyone who had knowledge of ways to disappear someone. And yes the mall has cameras but I’ll bet determined criminals know how to avoid them.
Blink says – Guilty, a little guilty, the mastermind, whatever, that information right now, changes nothing.
I have a better chance of levitating than pinning this on her today.
But if I focus on efforts that do not seem to focus on her at all- what do we see?
B
————————-
I almost didn’t post this because Blink said information about the degree of Terri’s involvment wouldn’t change anything right now, however, IF my thoughts (MOO!) were true, it would explain her lack of cooperation from the very beginning and from what perspective she may have related to SZ. So I’m posting, FWII.
Could we have looked at this backwards as far as TH is concerned?
Could SZ have targeted Kyron first and then further assessed his family and found the one person who could be enticed to be his accomplice? No super expertise or high IQ would be needed to figure out she could rationalize and accept the disappearance of Kyron and might be willing to help set him up. Maybe she was the one being “groomed” for this purpose and it may have gone on for months, at the same time reinforcing her attitude toward Kyron and her treatment of him which also helped to separate him emotionally from the family and make him feel more alone (combined with James leaving) – without SZ having to directly relate to Kyron in this way yet.
Terri was said to have frequently complained to anyone who would listen. My guess is that most people gave only small answers – “I hear you”, “that’s tough”, “hang in there” – or started in with their own stories. Someone who really seemed to hear her and sympathize (especially a man?) might be able to manipulate her with the smallest of hints about what THEY would do in such a situation. Even the MFH could have started with a kernel of someone else’s comment to make it seem justified. With a MFH, SZ would also have been rid of Kaine at Terri’s expense, or it could have been an unwanted distraction.
Yes, I do believe SZ knew Kyron was not Terri’s son, but I also believe if Kaine were gone, there would have been a window (SZ doesn’t mind very small windows) of time during which Kyron might have been vulnerable before he moved to Medford (and someone else to blame for both). Also as we have seen many times in the news, pedophiles are willing to travel – I also believe (just my own analysis) that whatever obsession a person has is also his or her most likely area for risk-taking and, therefore, success or failure, whether it’s business, sports, entertainment, personal or criminal activities. I’ve never seen a study, and doubt if you could do one, that indicates how willing a pedophile is to give up on a “target” once chosen and set in his fantasies, but my guess would be that few do unless incarcerated.
Many times it has been said in thread after thread that people think Terri is keeping quiet because she is fearful – for herself and James and Kiara. I didn’t personally see that, but I listened. However, now I am wondering if the motivator is NOT fear at all. Some, including me, have said it seems to make more sense to get rid of Terri to keep her quiet (rather than take Kyron hostage) if someone were worried she would turn them in for some other criminal activity or expose an affair they were having. Thinking about what values Terri appears to have – what if the motivator is not fear, but REWARD. Threatening someone is also a risk for the one who threatens. Offering to “help” someone is – well, offering to help someone. (Without a connection, it’s not exactly a bribe.)
What if she has been promised a LOT of money and no prison time in addition to the incentive of keeping herself out of jail by not confessing? If the charges are small and never proven, it’s entirely possible she could get probation only, or not be charged or convicted. What if the person said they had connections in the judicial system? What if they guaranteed her Kyron would never be found? What if they promised she could get Kiara back when this is “over” and get even with Kaine plus spousal and child support? (I don’t think she truly understands children’s development or feelings, and I do believe she would think she could get Kiara back and Kiara would just pick up where they left off and she could become the “doting mother” again.) What if SZ did not think Terri would become so central to this case, but isn’t really worried about it?
So – if she keeps quiet or gives only a little information and claims that is all she knows, she not only has little to be charged with, but also stands to gain a lot of money and her independence – and a certain degree of fame from her version of her story.
Please now read what I am NOT saying – I’m not saying if SZ promised her money, he is really going to give it to her. I’m not saying she won’t be charged with anything, or convicted of anything. I’m not saying she would really get Kiara back, although it’s not impossible, but “not charged” and “cleared of” are 2 different things. I’m not saying SZ paid Houze’s retainer (I still think book/interviews deal) because (1) if she didn’t talk, neither of them probably feel she’s in danger of being convicted (right or not), and (2) if a “benefactor” paid all of Houze’s fees and for the divorce, she still would have nothing except whatever she can get from Kaine and selling her story.
Why would SZ offer her money? Because she could still hint of his involvement in interviews or a book, she could still find a way later to accuse him without implicating herself, she could stop pointing at a landscaper, she could drink too much and talk too much (but offer no proof). I did not say it would be a “good deal” for anyone. I’m just pointing out that fear is not the only possible motivator.
I often reject many of my own ideas, but I am particularly taken with the thought that SZ may have chosen Kyron as his victim, then patiently worked at getting Terri to play at least a minor role in his disappearance, rather than Terri enlisting an accomplice for herself. Could there be a reason for Terri to feel a strong loyalty or obligation toward this person that outweighs what we think a “normal” person would have done from the beginning?
Just thinking about it – still MOO.
27.Marci says:
December 17, 2010 at 2:41 pm
Puzzled do you have an open door to the middle of this investigation?
~~~
No. My credentialing is in having worked with the clearinghouse for missing and exploited children set up by John Walsh after the disappearance of his son Adam, some 28 years ago.
You did not need to disclose that puzzler, fyi.
B
Blink said: “One thing I want to address about serial pedophiles- and it skeeves me out so much this subject matter, that I am way guilty of what I fault others for, and that is a loss of objectivity.”
———————–
The clinical man who was my late father used to say “we need to stop using the death penalty because it prevents us from preventing people like the guy on death row from doing what he did, especially if he does it to a child.”
Our shared opinion for 45 years as friends as well as father and daughter was pretty simple concerning the worst crime committed in our world — our scientific and medical professionals are so good in this country that we are negligent — seriously so — in not wanting to keep convicted pedophile killers alive and studied relentlessly. Use them for learning and for solving and for preventing, do not kill them. Once they are executed, we lose every chance of finally figuring out how to stop others like them.
My opinions are not popular.
Pedophiles are such a distinct and revolting presence in our world that we believe the best way to punish them is to execute them (if they kill a child) or to incarcerate them in a general population until one of the truly noble other inmates (no matter what he did) kills them. And we all feel a bit of comfort, even if we don’t want to admit it, if a man in prison for armed robbery, who did not kill another human being but was only being stupid and reckless and dangerous in a moment of insanity, kills a child killer.
It is on that rock that our justice system is cracked and permanently broken.
What I have always believed needs to be done concerning pedophiles once we catch them:
1. Keep them alive, house them in high security facilities, make it legal to use them as clinical study subjects, provide ample funding to study them, and learn how to prevent them from ever committing another crime by taking what we learn from an incarcerated pedophile and applying it to all of our pharmaceutical, legal, and DSS safety net funding.
2. Mandate that every state must become a no-fault divorce state. In my state, fault must be proven in a divorce trial. Other states do this. Many do not. But if your state is a “cause” or “fault” state in divorce, that alone is keeping women legally married to pedophiles. Small thing, but huge after you stop saying that it’s small.
3. End all current therapy for released (completed sentence) pedophiles as currently committed. It does not work.
4. Overhaul how children are interviewed in sexual abuse cases. This includes when necessary re-training social workers, physicians, nurses, other professionals in the field who work with sexually abused (or, not sexually abused) children. Part of that re-training must include a comprehensive clinical psychiatric and psychological curriculum that studies parents of sexually abuse children — including the one who is not the abuser.
5. Police agencies still lag way behind in training to understand women’s issues when women report concerns or criminal acts. Look up the case of John Jamelske, Dewitt/Syracuse, NY. No police agency believed his earlier victims’ reports. This was a wholesale failure on the part of LE to accept the claims and accusations and reports of women “on the fringe of society.” His victims included very young women. He was not a pedo, but the bottom line is that police, handling his first victim’s reports, did not act and did not even believe, in some cases, the victim’s statements.
6. Mandate that all police agencies have on staff a trained and credentialed FEMALE crew of police officers who specialize in working with the mothers of sexually abused children.
7. Let’s be blunt here. Women in many socio-economic instances cannot even say the words “vagina,” “clitoris” or “penis,” without having a mental breakdown and feeling deep humiliation. Vocabulary matters. FEMALES must be more heavily incorporated in sex crime investigations.
8. All states should be community property states concerning divorce. This would end the vicious practice of attempting to accuse a mother or father of a sexual abuse charge against a minor child. Money drives these false accusations. The old fashioned and sexist idea that if a mother does not “work” for wages that she did not help amass a family nest egg or the family’s assets must be driven from our culture. Children suffer abuse at the hands of financially feuding parents, either by experiencing abuse that is not believed in custody wars or by suffering the effects of life with a parent who makes a false accusation.
9. Pedophiles who commit one proven offense should receive a sentence to a distinct facility that only houses pedophiles. Keep them in once place, and figure them out!!!
10. I also support brain research that determines, once and for all, if a surgical fix is possible or not. WE HAVE TO DETERMINE EITHER/OR, AND THIS REQUIRES GOBS OF MONEY!!
11. Enforce a new or revised federal law that puts a pedophile back in prison FOR LIFE if that pedo is released, and then after registation moves out of state and attempts to hide. Make capturing these monsters a highly budgeted LE effort.
12. Incorporate in all school districts a mandated program for first grade students (yes, six year olds) a comprehensive course on identifying what they should know about pedophiles having contact with them. This is not being done successfully by squeamish parents.
13. EDUCATION — sex education, reproduction, and “where do babies come from” continue to make American parents faint. END THIS. We are not teaching our future citizens the facts of life in a consistent way, and that affects EVERYONE. This education should include frank conversations about molestation. Not discussing it HAS NOT STOPPED IT.
I was an EMT. I cracked open my anatomy books when each of my 3 kids were beginning to talk, and I used the real words. Parents must stop being embarrassed by the human body, and start raising future generations with facts. Human sexuality exists, it is how our species continues its life on earth, it is a vital part of a healthy adult partnerships, and the pedophile is a permanently damaged and, to date, unfixable human failure among us. To date we cannot cure the pedophile. But with law and education, we can dramatically reduce the pedophile’s presence among the general population.
There is one more thing to say, and this makes some people far too angry. Women are on the front line to stop pedophiles. Divorce, and not getting married in the first place, has shown to me through my work that too many young women move new boyfriends into their homes and trust them with their young children. I cannot emphasize how many cases in my area of child abuse are based on this awful decision. The most common situation involving physical or sexual abuse in my neck of the woods is a woman moving a new male partner into her home. This is the one thing that EDUCATION could end.
Adults humans need partners — it is how our species lives. But the turnover of boyfriends I used to see in the subsidized housing communities I managed was sickening. Men moved new girlfriends into their apartments, only to wind up testifying against that new babe after she beat his children. Women had boyfriends move in and commit child abuse within weeks. This has to stop. This is not a matter of human rights, so much as it is a matter of self-preservation. Young adults must be taught that if they have children, the new pedophile boyfriend is out there, and your odds of letting one live with you and your children are sky high.
We have to stop being wimps. Okay, I’m done with my rant. I need a beer.
Blink,
I am sorry! I should have said “I blame Mrs. Porter” for the 6-7 hour
time loss. She should have looked for Kyron, UNLESS, TMH told her
she was taking Kyron with her. Like you said, we do not know the facts.
I can not take it anymore!! This is how I would feel if it were my child.
Why didn’t my son’s teacher let me know he was NOT there.
What happened to Futureman??? He/She added some levity.
@iodizedseasalt—I just cant help it either, your statements just hit me in the gut..and I have wanted to lay that out there again, just couldnt articulate it as well as you just did. thanks, god bless the Hormons, the Youngs, and LE.
@Iodizedsalt & Caracara: I agree with your summaries of hinkiness re: TH. I think she knew the person who took Kyron, I think that she arranged for Kyron’s abduction, I think that she hated Kyron because she’s a … (whoops! I can’t use that word here). I think that she found a way to be rid of her problem (Kyron) via some of her unsavory behavior (I always remember Blink’s words to one of my posts early on: “maybe he knew a guy who knew a guy”) and I think that she’s a narcissist/sociopath (working from the list of symptoms and checking off what we’ve learned about her behavior against the list).
I think that on June 4 TH created a reason for Kyron’s absence (via the doctor’s appt confusion), thought a picture and a receipt might be enough alibi for a loving step-mother, I think that her call or email to the school was a status check and then she gave a go-ahead/all clear (maybe with a bat phone) to her sick partner in crime, and then I think she sat back and waited.
I also believe that she didn’t think that this would ever become the big focus from so many people and agencies. And to top it off, I don’t think her heinous plan was a desire to sue the school–too much work, had to convince Kaine and get the money away from him after. I think she was betting on the book sales and the Oprah shows, all that sad, sobbing, loving, grieving act could bring in some much bigger bucks for her.
BUT
Since TH’s not talking, and LE has seemingly (according to Blink) exhausted all possibilities in determining who actually took Kyron, I think that taking the focus off TH may let her relax a little and might help other people focus on the other possibilities, too, and perhaps recall something that they’d forgotten.
I think there must be some way to find the abductor. TH had to have contact with him prior. And in fact, the date that piques my interest is June 3. She asked Kaine for the truck that day (and yes, I know that there are people who don’t believe Kaine, but I’m going with the seriously grieving father as true) and she must have needed it for something, but what? What was she doing that day, who was she meeting, what had to be done in prep? something to make the Perp’s white truck look like Kaine’s white truck? DId they get matching decals? Did the perp need a big, over-done red hair wig? Something else used to lure Kyron and either subdue him and toss him into the truck or make him think it was the right truck or…? What did she need the truck for june 3?
She had help, so I’m guessing her help is more devious and smarter than TH. So maybe putting more focus on the “how could the abductor remove Kyron (second part of the equation) will answer more questions and yield more results than worrying about TH. Besides, she’s probably loving all of the attention and thinking she’s pretty smart having fooled so many people. A real CSI case that can’t be solved and she created it.
Or not.
I personally know that Kyron is still with us, at least in spirit and has touched all of our hearts. Every night I hear those tree frogs, and I think of a little boy I’ve never met, and I pray for all who love him that he is safe and will come back to them someday.
Still, I don’t understand how this could even begin to happen, and I know that there is no answer to this, but what kind of person could sell a 7 year old to a pedophile? Someone heartless, soulless, without conscience or any kind of moral compass. I agree with Blink that pedophiles are the worst, but isn’t selling a child to a pedophile right there with Satan as well?
pdxgirl says:
December 16, 2010 at 12:59 pm
Another follow-on thought about the masterful IT skills. I am welling up with anger, rage, and horror at the thought, but what if LE has found images of Kyron in some online porn exchange? Could this be what makes LE well up with tears at press conferences? The things we wish we didn’t know? The reason why Desiree is so certain Kyron is stashed somewhere? The reason why Blink is saying this person has masterful IT skills but no electronic footprint? Why this is not your “garden-variety” pedo?
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@pdxgirl.
I read this post of yours earlier today and I haven’t been able to shake the thoughts about all this entails out of my head.
Your anger, rage, and horror are mine too.
Along with the points you made about LE maybe finding online porn of Kyron:
1) makes LE well-up at press conferences.
2) things we wish we didn’t know.
3) reason why Desiree is so certain Kyron is stashed somewhere.
4) perp is masterful IT skills-but not electronic footprint.
5) not the garden variety pedo.
A possible finding of Kyrons images on some online porn exchange (My dear Lord, it’s hard to even type that) … would make sense of Kyron’s case possibly being tied in with another parallel criminal investigation.
And why so many Federal agencies are still active in Kyrons case.
I’ve read some articles about international porn and child trafficking (huge problems in SE Asia/Thailand/etc) … there are so many kids that just seem to disappear off the face of the earth that are living in hell.
This is an enormous (and profitable) international business.
It’s not far of a stretch to think that TMH may have gotten to know some low level scumbag PEDO in her shady alternative lifestyle. MOO
Not saying that TMH personally sold Kyron into porn slavery …
But that low level scumbag PEDO would know and associate with the PEDO’s higher up the chain.
Via Facebook, emails, grousing about her home life to anyone that would listen to her, etc – TMH left her family in danger of so many evils.
Tie that in with possibly pissing off scum bag people that would have themselves hired for her failed MFH plot, and poor Kyron could have paid the price for TMH’s stupidity.
@MBS: “So – if she keeps quiet or gives only a little information and claims that is all she knows, she not only has little to be charged with, but also stands to gain a lot of money and her independence – and a certain degree of fame from her version of her story.”
In addition to her loathing of Kaine & Kyron, I also believe that this was her motivation, revolting and disgusting though it is. I would also add that she thinks she is smart enough to get away with it, and then be eating nutter-butters on Oprah someday.
@CD:
Malls have cameras everywhere. Kyron couldn’t easily be concealed all thru a mall and out to a van without being seen on a number of cameras, in the mall and in the parking lot. And there were no security cameras at the school. And TH knew that.
TH would have to hit a panic button pretty quickly in a mall if she “knew” she couldn’t find Kyron–instead by creating confusion at the school, TH built in a 6 hour lead time which has so hurt this investigation. She was far more in control this way, she knew what the school didn’t and no one was looking for Kyron for 6 hours.
Those are just a couple of good reasons I can think of off the top of my head.
@justice4kyron says:
December 17, 2010 at 6:07 pm
“I also found interesting pics on FB. Looks like AS-S is RS’s brother if the pics are correct.
Prayers for Kyron.”
justice… how very timely. I have been looking at more ASS the past 2 days than in my life. Can you drop me a hint about where to find that fb? I have been close, but no ceegar.
Alright all, I am not only suffering from Blinkmyopia but also a severe Blink wedge. I wish I could get both feet on one side of the fence. I think about some perv hearing a mother, stepmother, wife saying my stepson is such a bother, his father doesn’t care enough about him, he leaves me with his child all the time, I can not stand it, his mother doesn’t fight for him…they all leave poor me to worry about him. ( I am in no way saying that DY or KH actually fit this description). Poor me, poor TH, no one cares about this child and I am stuck with him. Perv’s attraction and his belief that no one cares about dear Kyron. No big stink will happen when he disappears. TH will not say anything because there is to much bad stuff hanging over her head. No one really cares about Kyron. The perfect victim for SZ. Surprise (to SZ) a lot of people cared about Kyron. A lot of people have learned about Kyron and care about him. I pray someone sees the footprints and will figure this out. TH, even if you did not directly participate in Kyron’s disappearance, if you can not find a way to help bring this to an end it will in its self be your undoing. Karma is a bit… Love and peace to you sweet Kyron.