Kyron Horman Case: Terri Horman Sexts Sent To Kaine Horman’s Phone…. WHAT?
HOLD THE PHONE
In what can only be considered the latest bombshell development in the case of missing Portland boy, 7 year old Kyron Horman, blinkoncrime.com has discovered that the recent sexually graphic text messages or sexts, allegedly exchanged between Terri Horman and mutual friend Michael Cook, may have been altered. Definitely, alter-able.
Blinkoncrime.com has confirmed that the phone number which Kaine hand-wrote on the originally sealed emergency restraining order dated June 28, 2010, matches the cell phone number he also alleges, through his attorney Laura Rackner, was used by Michael Cook to RECEIVE the “sext” messages in question.
What’s the issue?
Kaine Horman owns the phone and the account it is registered to, and unless the allegation is that Terri Horman, using her own phone as purported by Kaine, is herself posing as Michael Cook and sexting herself, which would seem like a physical impossibility given some of her *glamour shots*, we have a serious problem.
In Kaine’s own handwriting on the June 28th Restraining Order, he pens that is an alternative number for Terri Horman.
In the contempt order filed by Kaine Horman on July 12, Ms. Rackner states that she has personally seen the “work phone” records of Michael Cook, and goes on to say “a search” of his cell phone reflected that he took snapshots on June 28th of the earlier served restraining order, which had been sealed, and was the basis for the contempt motion in the first place. He took pictures of sealed documents on the phone belonging to the other person bound by the same order prohibiting Terri Horman from showing anyone. As there are no texts on the work number until July, it is the only logical conclusion.
I am going to go out on a limb here and assume that at some point it occurred to someone that using good faith information in your affidavit, which when not alerting the court that your client has complete ownership and access to the data on the phone account in question, can look like bad faith in a nano-second, thus the withdrawal.
However, not everyone is on the same the playbill because the 21 pages of texts, which were released in PDF format, and do not include any numbers for Terri Horman herself, were supplied in an electronically redacted format; which again indicates this was not an original file.
It was not until the unredacted pdf’s became available October 26th and we converted them to HTML files could we see that based on the file format, it is clear these records came from the account owners and were not subpoenaed from the carrier. Original files, also provided to the respondent, are the requirement of the court. We all know texts can be sent from our phone online accounts, and from our phones directly; I think I even have voice command to text widget thingie.
Anyone that had access to the account, which is registered to Kaine Horman, could clone, spoof, or manipulate those messages, period. That aside, let’s consider the possibility that Terri Horman HAD implicated herself even slightly in any messages on phones that may be utilized to illicit information by a woman who demonstrated her complete knowledge that she understood what expectation of privacy parameters she was under the impression she was operating under, and engaging in, with the “textee”.
Terri Horman was represented by counsel, it would not be difficult for Stephen Houze allege that Kaine Horman was in constant contact with MCSO, had already been provided case sensitive information by them, and as such, was acting as an agent in soliciting the text messages. You see where I am going with this?
The fruit of that poisonous tree is more like the fruit of the poisonous orchard.
The implications of this scenario are abysmal. While I completely understand the desperation of a Father wanting to locate his child, since I have yet to really see anywhere Cook attempts to engage Terrri Horman about Kyron’s whereabouts at any time; I do not get the point of the exercise.
Ms. Rackner is a first rate “Super Lawyer”, but she is not above the burden of her duty to insure that what is being provided to her as a “good faith basis” is just that.
Does this information make Terri Horman any less vulgarly inappropriate at best? Hell to the No.
While it is true on the surface because of this information one will be hard pressed to prove it was definitely Terri Horman who sent the electronic ipecac none of us will soon forget, her attorneys have not denied it was her, nor do I expect them to, at least not until they read this.
What it does, yet again, is potentially compromise the criminal case involving the disappearance of Desiree Young and Kaine Horman’s son Kyron.
This afternoon, blinkoncrime.com contributing editor and Legal Analyst, Lea Conner weighed in:
Kaine Horman claims that law enforcement provided the texts records to him, but that does not mean that the records came from the cell phone provider, nor does it mean that the conversations involve Michael Cook or Terri Horman.
In fact, there are indications that the text message transcripts filled by Mr. Horman are not as they appear. At least one of the phones purported to belong to “Michael Cook” is registered to Kaine Horman.
Just as important, none of these records indicate any information about the texts Mr. Horman alleges were sent by his wife. Mr. Horman does not list any cell phone number, not one message ID, not one cell record that indicates the identity of other party to the conversation let alone indicating Ms. Horman as the other party to the text message “conversations.” In the case of the phone with the “503″ prefix (503-XXX-XX76), Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone that was purportedly sending texts as “Michael Cook.”
More bizarre, Mr. Horman listed this number as belonging to Terri Horman in his application for a temporary restraining order. Was this a slip on the part of Mr. Horman? Mr. Horman claimed in a motion for remedial contempt that Ms. Horman showed a copy of the restraining order to Mr. Cook and allowed him to photograph the document.
Given that the phone Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone he purports was used by “Michael Cook,” it begs the question as to whether Ms. Horman ever allowed Mr. Cook access to the sealed restraining order. As a party to the action, Mr. Horman had the very same sealed documents. Mr. Horman, through Counsel Laura Rackner, claimed to have reviewed Mr. Cook’s “work cell phone records.”
It is not clear if the documents Ms. Rackner referenced as Mr. Cook’s “work” cell records are, in fact, for the phone registered to Mr. Horman. If the sealed documents referenced in Mr. Horman’s contempt motion were photographed with the phone registered to Mr Horman — the same phone that Mr. Horman claims was used by Mr. Cook — it might help explain why Mr. Horman withdrew his contempt motion.
Had he gone forward with the motion, he might have had to explain how it was the documents allegedly photographed by Mr. Cook were the same documents that he had in his possession, and that the phone used to photograph sealed court documents was registered to him, not Mr. Cook.
The records for the phone with a “971″ prefix (971-XXX-XX63) are unlisted. This phone also purported to send texts as “Michael Cook.” Due to the unavailability of any registration for this phone, it is impossible to tell to whom the phone belongs, or who was actually sending texts from this phone. The unredacted copy of the cell phone records filed on October 25, 2010, only identifies one caller on each set of cell phone records. This means that the records came from the phone, not the cell provider. Text records on pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 are from (503) XXX-XX76 (“Cell Phone A”). These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 10:17 pm on June 30, 2010 through 7:19 pm on July 1, 2010.
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Cell Phone A is a Cingular/AT&T cell phone registered to Kaine Horman. It is also a phone number listed by Mr. Horman in his restraining order application as a phone number for Ms. Horman.
Pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the conversation attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. Text records on pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 are from (971) XXX-XX63 (“Cell Phone B”).
These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 6:49 pm on July 4, 2010 through 8:30 am on July 6, 2010. The bottom of page 17 has a partial text message sent on July 6, 2010, which purports to be sent after 8:30 am. Cell Phone B is an unlisted cell phone with AT&T (formerly Cingular).
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. All texts in Exhibit 2 are from Cell phone A, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 2:29 pm on July 3, 2010 through 9:40 am on July 4, 2010.
Exhibit 2 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. All texts in Exhibit 3 are from Cell phone B, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 8:44 pm on July 6, 2010 through 8:41 am am on July 7, 2010. The top of page 1 of this exhibit has part of an undated message from 8:41 am., possibly on July 6, 2010, that states “I understand. I’m upset about kitty. I didn’t do [sic]”
Exhibit 3 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. Surely investigators working on this case must know that the cell records filed by Mr. Horman as coming from Michael Cook’s phone were not from Mr. Cook’s phone, but from a phone registered in his own name.
Someone in law enforcement must have noticed that the number Mr. Horman claims belong to Michael Cook is also the number he claimed belonged to his wife in his TRO application. Mr. Horman signed his application for temporary restraining order on Monday June 28, 2010, prior to its filing at 4:39 pm that afternoon.
This was two days after the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office conducted its failed sting operation at the Horman residence on Saturday June 26, 2010. MCSO was unable to confirm the murder-for-hire plot that had been alleged by the landscaper. As a result, MCSO was not able to arrest Ms. Horman.
As such, why did law enforcement then give the green light to Mr. Horman to obtain a restraining order on the basis that his wife had hired to hire a hit man? Or did Mr. Horman act unilaterally without the endorsement of law enforcement? Surely Mr. Horman must have known that law enforcement could not verify the landscaper’s story, yet he went ahead and filed a restraining order based on the very allegations that law enforcement could not verify. So why did he sign his name to allegations that he knew were not true?
The text messages don’t check out. The murder for hire allegations don’t check out. The only common thread here is a man whose son disappeared on June 4, 2010. As tragic and anguishing as Mr. Horman’s circumstances may be, that does not excuse misrepresenting information to the court.
Mr. Horman cannot claim that the phone registered in his name is Michael Cook’s work cell phone, nor can he claim that the phone allegedly used by Michael Cook was used by Ms. Horman. When Sheriff Dan Staton talked about knowing things that might surprise people, could he have been talking about cell phone records? Maybe Stephen Houze and Peter Bunch will force the sheriff to reveal its source for the records.
Although the answer would not bring Kyron home, it might at least alleviate some of the blame heaped on Ms. Horman, as unpopular as that may be.
Lea Conner, contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
Madeline Tanner, copy and contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
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I disagree, I do not believe Kyron left with TH. What did she do with him in minutes to be seen on video?
B
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I have been waiting and waiting to see that post from you
Blink. Thank you, thank you thank you, more items
being put to rest on my list.
Have I told you how amazing you are at subtle clues?
If only I can learn a little of the gift you have in a life time
I will have achieved much.
Great work.
Ty but I have said that from day one, lol.
B
Blink, or anyone: Was suspect 0 actually in the school the day sweet Kyron went missing. Did TH cross paths with him that morning, and this encounter caused her bizarre behavior that day? This scenario seems likely to me.
Nancy says:
December 21, 2010 at 11:41 am
Just saw this video from what appears to be a Medford TV station, dated December 19.
http://www.localnewscomesfirst.com/index.php?option=com_seyret&Itemid=431&task=videodirectlink&id=6971
Desiree says about TH on the video (at about the 1:10 mark) “She will be arrested. She will go to jail”. When the reporter asked Desiree something to the effect of why TH hasn’t been named a person of interest or arrested Desiree replies, “there is a method to everything they do”.
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Thank you for posting this link Nancy.
I’ve seen other bits out of the clips various news sites have up with Desiree speaking at Walgreens, but the ones I’ve seen are Desiree saying she how much she wants Kyron home and how hard Christmas is.
(cannot even fathom that dark pit of hell she’s living in)
This is the first time station I’ve seen air that part of Desiree speaking specifically about TMH.
Desiree states that Terri Mounton Horman WILL be arrested and WILL go to jail with such deep conviction.
I view Desiree as a very intelligent and astute woman.
She is privy to much more info from her talks with LE than I am.
She also has Tony (who knows when an investigation is on track or not), who obviously is re-assuring her that LE is on top of this investigation.
This gives me hope that justice is coming for Kyron.
I do not know how she is keeping it together, I surely do not.
B
Blink, Do you believe that Suspect Zero had abusive access (taken or provided) to Kyron prior to the abduction? Not immediately prior, but say in the days, weeks, months leading up to it?
I do not.
B
YES!!! THANK YOU! This: ” I am confident that they K N O W Kyron was not with TH when he left the building. B” is what I was looking for. I didn’t expect you to answer on your own behalf, much less those of the other sources mentioned, I was just trying to describe what type of certainty & how the info came about. SO YES!!! Thanks, Blink, I’m glad to know this bit of info without doubt.
@Nancy says:
December 21, 2010 at 10:34 am
Blink says:
With much respect, I invite the local scuttlebutt to do their homework on high profile child abductions for the prurposes of human trafficking.
————————
Blink: you have mentioned several times that sadly you believe Kyron is no longer with us. Does this mean you now believe he could have been abducted into a human trafficking ring, and is possibly still alive? Do you believe this is what his parents may be thinking?
No, I definitely do not. I sadly believe he is deceased, and while human trafficking is very real, and a severe problem, I do not think it has any relevance in this case.
B
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I hope you are right about the human trafficking issue Blink.
Would the profile of SZ include murdering their victims (sorry for being graphic, I’m trying to get a handle on this type of offender and it just makes me sick). I wonder if Ky will ever be found if the offender was meticulous in disposing of the victim(s).
Just what did Ms. Horman get herself into…?
Imo, yes, very soon thereafter.
B
“MockingbirdSings says:
December 21, 2010 at 2:24 am
The issue of Kyron going to the bathroom without telling anyone concerns me a lot. I have decided to write about it.”
@MBS: thank you for your post! This was exemplary. I’m not a parent, or a teacher, so none of this would’ve occurred to me right away, and your post might help someone related to Kyron’s case. While this info might not help me find Kyron, it will help me when I spend time with kids of friends to think more about when something is *up*.
“What did she do with him in minutes to be seen on video?
B”
Video? Did I miss something? Video? Was this in FM parking lot, or some other video with Kyron on it? I’m confused (yet again).
She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B
2.Kimberly says:
December 21, 2010 at 11:50 am
Ty but I have said that from day one, lol.
B
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was speaking of the video portion you mentioned.
3.Saramom says:
December 21, 2010 at 11:51 am
Blink, or anyone: Was suspect 0 actually in the school the day sweet Kyron went missing. Did TH cross paths with him that morning, and this encounter caused her bizarre behavior that day? This scenario seems likely to me.
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I think it’s safe to yes to the first part of your question, and no one knows to the second part of your question, but, IMO no, I don’t believe TH knows who he is (SZ)!
safe to say, is what I should have typed ^^^^ up there
She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B
****
Could she not have left him in the car/truck?
Multiple stops over multiple hours, I guess, if he left with her, but he did not.
B
LE has stated they believe there is more than one person involved in Kyron’s disappearance. Therefore, Kyron leaving with someone other than TH does not necessarily point to or away from her guilt, in my opinion.
If TH is innocent of involvement in Kyron’s disappearance she does not know who took Kyron and never did.
If TH is involved in Kyron’s disappearance, however, the last thing she would do is risk being seen leaving with Kyron – since her alibi includes leaving him at the school and running errands without him during the crucial time frame.
I would have thought that the definative statement would have been that they K N O W Ky wasn’t with TH when SHE left the building. WOW.
This must mean they are sure TH left, did not come back, Ky was seen after she left and then went missing.
________________________________________
I would never comment on someone else’s sources, and I honestly do not know for certain what their thoughts are on this particular issue, but yes, my source is within the investigtion and I am confident that they K N O W Kyron was not with TH when he left the building.
B
That is my understanding, yes.
B
@10. “invasive investigation” – post’s contexts are countywide Silicon Forest and 3 pumpkin farms.
@39. “exactly” references prior local pedo acting out…and the poster alludes to skyline school. Sounds like all regional parents should talk with their sons of this age to see if any man has made them feel “uncomfortable” or worse.
If Desiree is correct regarding an arrest, DA won’t back down once it’s filed, even if case weakens with new info.
So, let the private efforts by local parents to search memories that day, and possible preexisting events, soldier on speedily with research support from long distance allies.
There were ample photos, the bathroom comment, on Terri’s FB, and no doubt plentyof online hookups; but, the IT portal of interest to Kyron could have begun thru Dad’s gaming, FB, and activities as well. And grandpa’s resume says he’s an IT expert & does web design. Ya never know.
@Melissab. My method is memorizing 350 SAT words in the car with my Jr daughter
Not fun, so much rides on it.
Perp must have known Kyron would come to the bathroom eventually
FB pics show daytime pullup diaper pants at an age later than other boys–nighttime too
No electronic footprint rules out some like GK & MR.
I hope MCSO got a list from PPubSch of all PPP staff working transiently or fulltime in the school bldg in the last two years, who had been hired in the last 5 years, and of those–their former addresses and places of employment. Then check out–especially those arriving from out of state
10. There must be some description then of who he DID leave with
I would never comment on someone else’s sources, and I honestly do not know for certain what their thoughts are on this particular issue, but yes, my source is within the investigtion and I am confident that they K N O W Kyron was not with TH when he left the building.
B
I disagree, I do not believe Kyron left with TH. What did she do with him in minutes to be seen on video?
B
She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B
She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B
Multiple stops over multiple hours, I guess, if he left with her, but he did not.
B
*********************************
This tells me that someone saw Ky leave with SZ that day, and this person or person(s) did not know what they were “seeing”, and did not/do not know who SZ is, and neither does LE. This has been my hunch for quite some time, IMO there is no other way to know with such certainty that he did not leave with TH.
Beejay, are you still here? Was wondering how your visit went, still surprised you weren’t on the news for shaking down the town, lol.
*********************************
FWIW, I’ve gotten the feeling from some recent chats that many of the Skyline neighbors think TH is responsible for Ky’s disappearance. It seems that the idea of a SO is not on their radar, which I find strange and somewhat alarming at this point. I’m under the impression thus far, based on my chats, that a meeting might not be met with enthusiasm, to say the very least. Any thoughts on this from some of the locals?
I sometimes wonder if Kyron sensed he was caught in the middle of a tense relationship between Terri and Ms. Porter. When did Skyline school recruit for Ms Porter’s position, and did Terri apply for it? I can easily imagine how Ms Porter might do nothing right in Terri’s eyes, and how irritated Terri would be at any little thing Kryon did wrong (because it would reflect badly on her) . This potential issue alone would have been enough for the poor little guy to want to move to his mother’s house. I also wonder if Ms Porter would want to avoid Terri when she was at the school, and maybe did not pay as much attention that morning as she might just because Terri caused her a lot of problems. Was Ms Porter really hard of hearing as Terri says, or did she just tune out Terri due to ongoing problems with her.
I hope everyone in the school that day is thinking about everyone they know or have seen around the school and neighborhood, and are asking themselves “is there anything unsettling about that person, or how and when did I got to know them, or questions they may have asked about the school or students there”. B’s idea for a get together is good, I think people are afraid or embarrassed to ask themselves questions or volunteer ideas that might cause friction in their neighborhood or family.
I have gone thru FB’s 500 last names of skyline’s special educator–can someone here see what I oveelooked? At one time I found his Calif license & a track race list from a race outside San Francisco a few years ago ( the real Silicon) but can no longer find the latter. Moved to Oregon 3-4 yrs ago? Has a local youth track club online, but no entries. Is NOT on the list for appearing at Skyline that morning. Not to wrongfully bandy about names, but hope for some “beejaying.”
In earlier reports I saw conflicting info about TH visiting the Albertson’s on Beaverton Hillsdale Hwy and possible survelliance tapes. I am still baffled by this considering that there are at least 2 other Albertson’s in the area that are alot closer than this particular Albertson’s. Most of the talk about the errands involves the 2 Fred Meyer locations and the gym.
A. If Terri and Dede did it they remain silent until LE proves them guilty.
B. If person #3 involved (found by Terri/Dede) the person disappears Kyron only after Terri sets it
for him to do so.
C. Why would person #3 do this? Be easier to go find his own victim without two crazy red heads
involved. Person #3 is being paid?
D. If person #3 involved will Terri and Dede rat him out for a better deal? They should know it’s over
for them.
E. Did Terri and Dede plan and carry this out alone? There were those photo’s of Dede by the
truck released by LE. Terri and Dede both wanted Kaine and Kyron gone so they could go on their
happy way with each other, and Kaines money?
She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B
______________
Blink,
Does this mean, TH was telling the truth when she told family that her phone pinged in places that she was not at?
Jackie Bauer
says:
December 21, 2010 at 12:47 pm
Video? Did I miss something? Video? Was this in FM parking lot, or some other video with Kyron on it? I’m confused (yet again).
———————————-
I believe this is in reference to Kyron not being seen on video at FM(s), (which we already assumed) because if LE had video of Kyron with TH at FM(s), she would have been arrested on the spot long ago.
35.MockingbirdSings says:
December 21, 2010 at 2:24 am
Just wanted to bring this hyperlink over from my area.
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2010/12/17/police-investigate-assault-at-school/
@Blink, does said profile you mentioned have an age range?
Locals: School has what kind of boiler? Water? Steam? Who could access it? We have a 100 yo steam boiler. My plumber said 20 yrs ago there were only 2 boilers left in our county public schools–he repaired them. (a credential that made me trust him). I don’t know school boilers; could a small kid be fit in? I guess that would leave physical evidence tho, so just a looney brainstorm.
Blink thanks so much for your answer re: prior access to Kyron. I thought perhaps if there was a previous relationship to Kyron with escalating attachment it would explain why the perpetrator felt they had to act now before losing Kyron to the Summer Holidays and possibly forever. It sounds like that is a dead end though.
“Logically she is involved, but logic is not evidence.”
B”
Agreed. Logic can help us know where to cast the net for evidence. And since we K N O W he didn’t leave with Terri the net has to be cast far and wide. Clearly, it needs to include her but not by excluding other possibilities.
A long time ago Blink made a comment about the possible reason for TH driving the truck on the day of the Science Fair was to try to go unnoticed (ie. was she trying to hide from someone that day?). This would also explain why she parked in the location that she did. Does anyone else recall this comment from Blink and do you think it still stands? Was she trying to hide from Suspect Zero or someone else on the day of the Fair?
Blink: Does LE know when or how Kyron left the school?
@Jackie Bauer
says:
December 21, 2010 at 12:47 pm
“What did she do with him in minutes to be seen on video?
B”
Video? Did I miss something? Video? Was this in FM parking lot, or some other video with Kyron on it? I’m confused (yet again).
She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B
————————————————
This is telling me LE has credible info leading them to believe TH left the school building and school premises without Kyron.
SZ—”the grabber”—most likely came in a different vehicle to the SF. I am still trying to connect the sightings of the truck/mustang driving erratically on SI that day. Previously, there’d been speculation if TMH had dropped off ” Person in Truck” at Intel to get the mustang, driving it to SI for ?? then back to Intel in time for Kaine to leave early. SZ—under own transport—nabs Ky, then notifies TMH “Game On”. Her only “job” that morning is business as usual with alibi nailed down ( receipts, sightings of persons who will verify, wait for the bus).
However, TMH seems genuinely afraid at first PC. By that time, she’s told so many versions of “the truth” as she’d rehearsed it, she knows that pro investigators and the pro-henchmen have her between a rock and a hard place. Her “truth” cannot be verified with a LDT— her “plantings” of Ky’s behaviors, the teacher’s inadequacies, the “appointment” talk, —not to mention a “little” matter of a MFH against her hubby. If life had not, up to this point, been stimulating the temporal lobe of her unstable mind enough, she is on overload. She is spouting, ranting, raving. No wonder Houze shuts her up. Houze arrest. With LE keeping quiet, seeming like they are taking forever, they know they can only charge her/whoever once, so they want to make it stick. Knowing what they alone know, barring the “leaks” that may or may not be true leaks, they <> to be secure in an outcome.
The degree of TMH and/or KH’s culpability in letting the vampire sniff around their door, will be exposed in time. The compelling evidence will be presented, judged, and acted upon. It is my sincere hope that the outcome of this sad,confusing case impacts the future safety of children, how schools do business with surveillance and security, as well as family safety protocol for children of broken homes where health/behavior issues are concerned.
Christmas wishes for all…. a deep peace that passes understanding.
Could she not have left him in the car/truck?
Multiple stops over multiple hours, I guess, if he left with her, but he did not.
B
I know you have stated Kyron did not leave with Terri numerous times. That being said IMO Terri was seen leaving with Kiara only and not carrying anything that Kyron could fit in.
Blink – IYO was Kyron seen outside the school with suspect zero?
If Terri Horman in fact had no idea what was going on that day until she innocently arrived at the bus stop, I just cannot reconcile all of the coincidences and incidences of bad luck that appear to have had to have taken place in order to make her look so guilty.
For example:
1. The Doctors Appointment
General assumption: Terri misled the teacher into thinking there was an appointment of some sort, in order to delay or prevent the reporting of Kyron’s absence?
Possible Coincidence?: The teacher simply misheard, got confused or dropped the ball on reporting Kyron’s absence, and in doing so has made it look as though the above statement was the case.
2. The Missing Time
General Assumption: Terri’s shaky alibi of driving around on country roads with a sick baby in the truck to calm her down, is really an attempt to cover up what she was actually doing at that time.
Possible Coincidence?: Kiara really was sick, Terri really was driving her around and unfortunately the fact that this particular time frame is turning out to be of critical interest to LE is making it look as though she is guilty of trying to hide what she was doing during this time.
2. The Missing Friend
General Assumption: Terri’s friend Dee Dee snuck away from work that morning in order to meet up with Terri for reasons unknown at this point, but assumed to be not good.
Possible Coincidence??: Dee Dee never left work at all and someone on her job site is incorrect in thinking that she was missing, when in fact she was just out of sight from the others working away? or Dee Dee left work that morning but it had nothing to do with Terri and she never saw or heard from Terri that morning but by being missing during the same time frame that Terri is unable to account for her whereabouts is making it look as though they were doing something nefarious together?
These are just three off the top of my head but there must be a half dozen or more similar examples where there is certainly an alternative option to the generally held assumption, but it is just so hard to believe that all of these alternatives could have possible come into play.
So basically in short I am saying that to me it looks as though she had to have known prior to the bus pick-up that day. When, how and why she knew, also what she knew, I have no idea. But it seems incomprehensible to me that she walked over to the bus stop that day without a clue.
I would like the blow by blow of TH meeting the bus, and Kaine and Kiara bringing up the rear while TH is standing there talking to the bus driver..
B
“She was caught on store tape minutes after she left the school, and in a few places, IIRC. No Kyron.
B”
If we didn’t know that TH left without Kyron, then I’d say that there were ways around him being seen. Since we *do* know without doubt that Kyron left with someone else, I agree fully with Nancy & others that ” Kyron leaving with someone other than TH does not necessarily point to or away from her guilt” and “If TH is involved in Kyron’s disappearance, however, the last thing she would do is risk being seen leaving with Kyron – since her alibi includes leaving him at the school and running errands without him during the crucial time frame”.
MOO (and I’m not a cow either, but i still like to moo) –TH leaving alone, the picture, the receipts, etc. were alibi-building. And while I know it might seem odd that she didn’t alibi-build well after that except for the gym, and she does have that unexplained “driving around” time, I think that two factors (at least) were in play:
1. no crime is perfect, and she may have had some things she had to do (evidence disposal, communicate in person w/perps or others). She can’t explain now to LE but she had to do those things, and couldn’t do these things later, after others knew Kyron was missing. One of the problems with crime is that the criminal has to be involved, and many/most alibis aren’t air-tight. It’s one of the ways LE finds what was done by whom obviously. TH thought that by having an alibi right after leaving the school without Kyron, she could then go about her necessary and nefarious deeds later in the a.m. and before heading to the gym. But why did she need the truck that day? Did one of the nefarious deeds involve a truck, or were two white trucks intentionally part of the plan to lure Kyron?
2. since she’s probably never gotten rid of a step-son before, she might’ve experienced a little stress during her first of this type of crime. I think it would be normal for TH to worry about her own hiney. Even sociopaths worry when it’s their own self on the line. Even Dexter felt a little angst when he thought he might be found out (yes, I know, it’s a TV show).
Watching Desiree always just breaks my heart, but her resolve and certainty are reassuring and I’m sure glad she has Tony Young to stand beside her thru this. She’s amazing, and I could never behave with such grace and composure. My prayers are with all of those who love Kyron, but especially Desiree & Kaine. If I could make one Christmas wish come true, I’d bring Kyron back to Desiree by the holidays.
@MockingbirdSings says:
December 21, 2010 at 2:24 am
What a great post, thank you so much for being so articulate and generous with your knowledge!
It would be great to know the answers to some of those questions, to tell us more about Kyron.
RE: MockingbirdSings says: December 21, 2010 at 2:06 am
About the FBI profiler, I remembered it just the way you do… the profiler was to profile Kyron (it stuck w/me because I’d not heard of that before). I looked up the articles at the Oregonian for us and snipped a few from the very first days that explain it (and turn out some ‘new’ old info).
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/day_three_search_continues_hun.html
Day 3: FBI calls in criminal profiler in search for missing Skyline boy; interviews with students and parents begin
The FBI has brought a vast array of resources to help the search for 7-year-old Kyron Horman today including launching its Child Abduction Rapid Deployment Team. It’s a regional team although they have flown in members from across the country, including a Quantico-based profiler who is on-site to help develop a complete profile of the boy.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/still_no_trace_of_kyron_horman.html
Still no trace of Kyron Horman as police, FBI conclude third day of search
Investigators said Sunday they haven’t turned up signs of foul play. Still, the FBI, which has assigned a sizable, though undisclosed, number of agents to the case, launched its Child Abduction Rapid Deployment Team, a group of agents and analysts that specializes in organizing large-scale investigations of child disappearances.
The team’s involvement is standard when a child goes missing, said Beth Anne Steele, a spokeswoman for the FBI’s Portland field office.
The FBI also called in a Quantico, Va.-based profiler to develop a more complete portrait of Kyron.
“You want to find out what his … strengths and weaknesses are,” said former FBI profiler Clint Van Zandt, now a Virginia-based security consultant. “Where would they go? Do they have a tendency to wander off? Do they have a tendency to cry? Have you ever talked to them about what to do if they get lost?
“You are trying to find out everything you can,” he said, adding that the FBI’s profile will go far beyond a physical description. He said the profiler wants to “find out what might make (the child) vulnerable to a predator.”
Van Zandt said authorities tend to deploy lots of police resources in those crucial, early hours after a child goes missing.
“Everybody knows the clock is ticking,” he said. “You don’t want to hold back any resources. You don’t want to refuse to go down any path right now.”
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/ground_search_resumes_this_mor.html
Search & rescue crews restart search for missing Kyron Horman
Olsen said ground search efforts will be reassessed later today after the FBI looks at a map of the region.
“The case here is unique,” added Arthur Balizan, FBI Special Agent in Charge. “The media has to keep the message out there. We need the public’s eyes out there. Keep looking for Kyron.”
—-
I thought that last bit was noteworthy.. That this case is unique. Or, maybe he was just being nice, who knows.
Hi Blink, I don’t see my post from last night. I was inquiring about the Sunday meet-up. Was that a no-no?
TIA
Yes, I cannot vett these meetings or people, therefore I prefer it not be set up or discussed here.
B
@Nancy says: December 21, 2010 at 12:03 am
Exactly, you get me, thanks. Some of us know these people, and just know it’s chasing down the wrong path.
———————-
@iodizedseasalt says:
December 21, 2010 at 10:37 am
“There are people who still just call my son by his gamer name.I wonder how far the LE have researched her online gaming friends”
Great points in both those posts this AM, iodized. lol, I have now real life friends and we call each other by the online nick we ‘met’ under in addition to our real names. There are also people I have been quite revealing with (not that way!) who only know me by an online nick. Hopefully, LE has pursued that line carefully.
But like you, I can’t let go of the gym/bodybuilding community yet. A real life contact seems so much more likely than an online friend ‘falling for’ Ky. To ME.
Or, see:
Stars says:
December 21, 2010 at 10:17 am
“Blink,
Has LE investigated if this perp has molested any other children
at skyline in the past?
If this is a Serial Pedophile then Kyron is not his first victim.
Who are his other victims?
Exactly.
B”
This is much easier for me to come to terms with, in logic world. I have mentioned before about some of the Skyline community kids/young adults and reading of their troubles. This could explain some of the extreme behaviors they admit to online.
———————-
@enumclawrose & jan: The pastor’s photos are still available (please people, if you don’t know how to shut your own FB down all the way, find out.. don’t assume!).
I can not get on board with you about the creepiness factor of the photos, but if you must look…
Call me Cleopatra if you must (DeQueen of DeNile) but I got upset over the past couple of days with the insinuation that any community gathering must be a way in for sickos–I do so much community building stuff! I know you can all tell me so many facts, but I just had a hard time having that innocence taken away and being as cynical as may be required.
Blink, is it your opinion that SZ has stayed abreast of the media coverage surrounding this case, and if so, is this a crucial part of his profile?
Yes and Yes
B
@@Blink sez
“I don’t suppose I could get you to take my word for the fact that part of the profile is very “spot on”?
B ”
ME: Respectfully, how can we? Without a suspect to compare it to, how can anyone know if the profile is spot on? Spot on to what? Rather, to whom?
BLINK: Respectfully, I completely respect your skepticism, and moreover, I encourage it.
I have only suspect zero to compare suspect zero to- but I put my professional reputation on the line in the beginning, and I do so again, this is a sexually motivated crime, my profile is sound.
That said, I stand for invasive investigation in this case and I say.. Hav at it.
B”
Just to be clear.. not so much as skepticism from me, but trying to understand better what wrote. However, I think you’ve worked another hint in there. : )
I would certainly have at it if I had the tools; I’m sure you know that about many of your readers. (speaking of, where is our beejay…. home from the holidays yet? Am looking for your posts!)
Some info on serial pedophiles. Read the behavioral indicaters.
http://www.suite101.com/content/the-profile-of-a-pedophile-a50767
Nancy says:
December 20, 2010 at 6:58 pm
DesertGirl says:
—————————————
It is not a requirement of Houze that a client be innocent. He has defended guilty people in the past and, depending upon the evidence against them, had his clients plead guilty to lesser charges.
———–
Thank you Nancy. I was not inferring that House might “require” knowledge of a client’s innocence before accepting her or his case, but that sure gives me something else to think about in a much broader and OT sense! I was asking if this was a routine, procedural tactic that criminal attorneys use, and I really appreciate you sharing your thoughts.
@Mockingsings
your post about the bathroom was great but I am
shocked about giving a child coffee or pop
for breakfast
or before school
hope this is rare
Thanks for the post
NelMel says:
December 20, 2010 at 9:05 pm
…I’m interested in Blink and everyone else’s opinion of what is being discussed on two other websites, a FB page and a forum split off from GLP…
———————-
Wait. There are other websites? other than this one? =) I’d like to weigh in and offer something profound, but I don’t do FB and I don’t read other sites re Kyron. I can’t be the only one. It seems like there is a very, very fine line between entertainment and news on so many other sites.
About the LDT
I can’t understand why she just kept taking
the test
but maybe Houze could get a pass to use
down the road
ok, this bathroom discussion has got me thinking in a different direction – I have been thinking about what happened outside of the school, post abduction, but Mockingbirdsings’ post got to me… WHY was he visiting the restroom alone and often indeed. If he was being “used” prior to abduction, did his abuser tell him not to let anyone see his “body parts”? Was he ashamed or worried that someone might see something on his “body parts” and the secret would be out?
And of course, I echo the idea that he had a bladder infection or other similar malady. Which could be merely an innocent,common infection. Or not. I subscribe to Occam/KISS – not exclusively, but firstly – but there just is no simple logic to follow here. So sad that this boy was let down by life.
I have to say, if anyone subscribes to occam’s razor it is me.
And if applied to this case, if we verify that Kyron was not abducted by his stepmom, then occam tells us this is an opportunist sexual predator abduction.
riverpearl says:
December 19, 2010 at 4:56 pm
JMO TMH had NOT dealt w/ being adopted & was still trying to “re-write” that part of her history.
—————————–
No, she definitely hadn’t and IMO, she is still re-writing, or trying to. We all do that. I have yet to find an adoptee that hasn’t and through the foundation/network that I have worked with on/off over the years since my own search, I have yet to hear of one adoptee (and I have heard thousands of them speak and tell their stories) who didn’t try to “re-write history” if even in their own mind to compensate for the myraid of feelings that come with growing up an adopted child in society the last 40-50 yrs. Anything to try to fool ourselves into believing it really wasn’t so bad and that “we’re” not so bad. Finally finding roots helped a LOT and I personally believe no search is wasted, regardless of what you find because knowledge is always better than living or pretending a lie. My situation wasn’t stellar either, but I was like a completely different person after I finally had the answers as to who/where I came from than I was before, despite the negative aspects of what I found out.
My husband even commented he could see/feel the difference in me and regardless of the less than positive findings, he told me it was obvious it was the best thing I had ever done and I have never ever regretted doing it. My guess is that TMH really needs to know. Anyone know why she didn’t further her search to find her birth family? I know at one time she had attempted to try. Why did she quit? It’s a grueling and very emotional process I admit, but nothing hurts as much as living a lie and never knowing the truth. But I also know that somewhat comfortable and “safe” place of denial can be very powerful indeed.
One more then I will shutty uppy.
evie says:
December 21, 2010 at 3:56 pm
…but I got upset over the past couple of days with the insinuation that any community gathering must be a way in for sickos–I do so much community building stuff…
———-
Thank you for saying this. Like you, I do a lot of community building activities and volunteering with children. I am a youth mentor, a religious youth group leader (high school), and a sex educator to boot. I have oodles of pictures of me and “my kids” laying in piles of leaves, hiding in odd places, hugging, hand holding and generally being very very silly. We work hard to create safe spaces (physical, mental, emotional) for our kids to search, learn, share, grow, do and be, and in 15 plus years of doing this work, I have never had a complaint of anything nefarious going on within my groups. (yes, I have been fingerprinted and background checked.)
With so many recent allegations (and confirmations) of many different types of abuse, it gets harder and harder to tell people what I do without having a subsequent conversation about the crap that is going on in different denominations and different circles with children and teens these days.
I am passionate about this, and just wanted to thank you for giving voice to the good, hard work that some of us do. I wish I had a chance to know Kyron.
If you are equally passionate about safety and community building events, you will be fine.
You absolutely must acknowledge that they can be a way from bad people to prey on others.
That is reality.
B
I do remember in one interview Kaine personally described Terri as deliberately lagging behind him and Kiara when going to meet Kyron at the bus. In the interview he described how he had to put Kiara’s shoes on. If I recall correctly, Kaine said he and Kiara were waiting at the bus. It stopped and Kyron did not get off. Kaine asked the bus driver about Kyron and was told he wasn’t on the bus. The bus driver contacted the school on the radio and was advised Kyron had been absent that day. In the interveiw Kaine said he just remembers running up the driveway… he also mentioned something about Terri speaking with the bus driver at that point… Don’t know that this make a difference, but I do remember this interview.
I think we should probably have a link for this, respectfully, I do not think is accurate.
B
enumclawrose says:
December 19, 2010 at 5:52 am
Is this all code for something more sinister, and do we dare question people who claim to walk with God?
************************************************
Sadly, yes erose … this just happened a few days ago within a few miles of my own neighborhood and this was the pastor! When my husband was young, he went to this very church for Vacation Bible School (diff denomination though), but thankfully it was a different pastor back then. Still … evil lurks everywhere and I have actually read where evil-doers often target church to make themselves at home because it’s one of the few places they will often be suspected of anything suspicious. I mean, who goes to church every Sunday with the thought, “I have to watch my kids 24/7 around Mr. Jones because he’s an opportunistic pedophile that may target my kids?”
Unfortunately, we tend to let our guard down in such places because it’s the last thing we expect there. Like school, parent’s often have a false sense of security when they send their kids to church, Sunday School, Vacation Bible School or anywhere religious-affiliated believing they are “safe” there. Churches like school are supposed to be safe, innocent, child-friendly places, right? But in today’s world, that is sadly no longer the case. It can happen ANYWHERE and as we’ve recently seen, unfortunately does.
This list is long … made me nauseous just reading the names/ages. Look how young some of these “men” are! Some are just teenagers/young men.
http://www.wkyc.com/news/local/news_article.aspx?storyid=164507