Kyron Horman Case: Terri Horman Sexts Sent To Kaine Horman’s Phone…. WHAT?
HOLD THE PHONE
In what can only be considered the latest bombshell development in the case of missing Portland boy, 7 year old Kyron Horman, blinkoncrime.com has discovered that the recent sexually graphic text messages or sexts, allegedly exchanged between Terri Horman and mutual friend Michael Cook, may have been altered. Definitely, alter-able.
Blinkoncrime.com has confirmed that the phone number which Kaine hand-wrote on the originally sealed emergency restraining order dated June 28, 2010, matches the cell phone number he also alleges, through his attorney Laura Rackner, was used by Michael Cook to RECEIVE the “sext” messages in question.
What’s the issue?
Kaine Horman owns the phone and the account it is registered to, and unless the allegation is that Terri Horman, using her own phone as purported by Kaine, is herself posing as Michael Cook and sexting herself, which would seem like a physical impossibility given some of her *glamour shots*, we have a serious problem.
In Kaine’s own handwriting on the June 28th Restraining Order, he pens that is an alternative number for Terri Horman.
In the contempt order filed by Kaine Horman on July 12, Ms. Rackner states that she has personally seen the “work phone” records of Michael Cook, and goes on to say “a search” of his cell phone reflected that he took snapshots on June 28th of the earlier served restraining order, which had been sealed, and was the basis for the contempt motion in the first place. He took pictures of sealed documents on the phone belonging to the other person bound by the same order prohibiting Terri Horman from showing anyone. As there are no texts on the work number until July, it is the only logical conclusion.
I am going to go out on a limb here and assume that at some point it occurred to someone that using good faith information in your affidavit, which when not alerting the court that your client has complete ownership and access to the data on the phone account in question, can look like bad faith in a nano-second, thus the withdrawal.
However, not everyone is on the same the playbill because the 21 pages of texts, which were released in PDF format, and do not include any numbers for Terri Horman herself, were supplied in an electronically redacted format; which again indicates this was not an original file.
It was not until the unredacted pdf’s became available October 26th and we converted them to HTML files could we see that based on the file format, it is clear these records came from the account owners and were not subpoenaed from the carrier. Original files, also provided to the respondent, are the requirement of the court. We all know texts can be sent from our phone online accounts, and from our phones directly; I think I even have voice command to text widget thingie.
Anyone that had access to the account, which is registered to Kaine Horman, could clone, spoof, or manipulate those messages, period. That aside, let’s consider the possibility that Terri Horman HAD implicated herself even slightly in any messages on phones that may be utilized to illicit information by a woman who demonstrated her complete knowledge that she understood what expectation of privacy parameters she was under the impression she was operating under, and engaging in, with the “textee”.
Terri Horman was represented by counsel, it would not be difficult for Stephen Houze allege that Kaine Horman was in constant contact with MCSO, had already been provided case sensitive information by them, and as such, was acting as an agent in soliciting the text messages. You see where I am going with this?
The fruit of that poisonous tree is more like the fruit of the poisonous orchard.
The implications of this scenario are abysmal. While I completely understand the desperation of a Father wanting to locate his child, since I have yet to really see anywhere Cook attempts to engage Terrri Horman about Kyron’s whereabouts at any time; I do not get the point of the exercise.
Ms. Rackner is a first rate “Super Lawyer”, but she is not above the burden of her duty to insure that what is being provided to her as a “good faith basis” is just that.
Does this information make Terri Horman any less vulgarly inappropriate at best? Hell to the No.
While it is true on the surface because of this information one will be hard pressed to prove it was definitely Terri Horman who sent the electronic ipecac none of us will soon forget, her attorneys have not denied it was her, nor do I expect them to, at least not until they read this.
What it does, yet again, is potentially compromise the criminal case involving the disappearance of Desiree Young and Kaine Horman’s son Kyron.
This afternoon, blinkoncrime.com contributing editor and Legal Analyst, Lea Conner weighed in:
Kaine Horman claims that law enforcement provided the texts records to him, but that does not mean that the records came from the cell phone provider, nor does it mean that the conversations involve Michael Cook or Terri Horman.
In fact, there are indications that the text message transcripts filled by Mr. Horman are not as they appear. At least one of the phones purported to belong to “Michael Cook” is registered to Kaine Horman.
Just as important, none of these records indicate any information about the texts Mr. Horman alleges were sent by his wife. Mr. Horman does not list any cell phone number, not one message ID, not one cell record that indicates the identity of other party to the conversation let alone indicating Ms. Horman as the other party to the text message “conversations.” In the case of the phone with the “503″ prefix (503-XXX-XX76), Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone that was purportedly sending texts as “Michael Cook.”
More bizarre, Mr. Horman listed this number as belonging to Terri Horman in his application for a temporary restraining order. Was this a slip on the part of Mr. Horman? Mr. Horman claimed in a motion for remedial contempt that Ms. Horman showed a copy of the restraining order to Mr. Cook and allowed him to photograph the document.
Given that the phone Mr. Horman is the registered owner of the phone he purports was used by “Michael Cook,” it begs the question as to whether Ms. Horman ever allowed Mr. Cook access to the sealed restraining order. As a party to the action, Mr. Horman had the very same sealed documents. Mr. Horman, through Counsel Laura Rackner, claimed to have reviewed Mr. Cook’s “work cell phone records.”
It is not clear if the documents Ms. Rackner referenced as Mr. Cook’s “work” cell records are, in fact, for the phone registered to Mr. Horman. If the sealed documents referenced in Mr. Horman’s contempt motion were photographed with the phone registered to Mr Horman — the same phone that Mr. Horman claims was used by Mr. Cook — it might help explain why Mr. Horman withdrew his contempt motion.
Had he gone forward with the motion, he might have had to explain how it was the documents allegedly photographed by Mr. Cook were the same documents that he had in his possession, and that the phone used to photograph sealed court documents was registered to him, not Mr. Cook.
The records for the phone with a “971″ prefix (971-XXX-XX63) are unlisted. This phone also purported to send texts as “Michael Cook.” Due to the unavailability of any registration for this phone, it is impossible to tell to whom the phone belongs, or who was actually sending texts from this phone. The unredacted copy of the cell phone records filed on October 25, 2010, only identifies one caller on each set of cell phone records. This means that the records came from the phone, not the cell provider. Text records on pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 are from (503) XXX-XX76 (“Cell Phone A”). These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 10:17 pm on June 30, 2010 through 7:19 pm on July 1, 2010.
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Cell Phone A is a Cingular/AT&T cell phone registered to Kaine Horman. It is also a phone number listed by Mr. Horman in his restraining order application as a phone number for Ms. Horman.
Pages 1 through 12 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the conversation attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. Text records on pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 are from (971) XXX-XX63 (“Cell Phone B”).
These pages allegedly represent text messages sent between 6:49 pm on July 4, 2010 through 8:30 am on July 6, 2010. The bottom of page 17 has a partial text message sent on July 6, 2010, which purports to be sent after 8:30 am. Cell Phone B is an unlisted cell phone with AT&T (formerly Cingular).
In separate court documents, “Michael Cook” is identified as the sender of text messages and the recipient of text messages is identified as “Terri Horman.” Pages 13 through 17 of Exhibit 1 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. All texts in Exhibit 2 are from Cell phone A, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 2:29 pm on July 3, 2010 through 9:40 am on July 4, 2010.
Exhibit 2 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (503) XXX-XX76. All texts in Exhibit 3 are from Cell phone B, and allegedly represent text messages sent between 8:44 pm on July 6, 2010 through 8:41 am am on July 7, 2010. The top of page 1 of this exhibit has part of an undated message from 8:41 am., possibly on July 6, 2010, that states “I understand. I’m upset about kitty. I didn’t do [sic]”
Exhibit 3 does not list any phone number for the portion of the text messages attributed to Ms. Horman, only that the texts listed were received by (971) XXX-XX63. Surely investigators working on this case must know that the cell records filed by Mr. Horman as coming from Michael Cook’s phone were not from Mr. Cook’s phone, but from a phone registered in his own name.
Someone in law enforcement must have noticed that the number Mr. Horman claims belong to Michael Cook is also the number he claimed belonged to his wife in his TRO application. Mr. Horman signed his application for temporary restraining order on Monday June 28, 2010, prior to its filing at 4:39 pm that afternoon.
This was two days after the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office conducted its failed sting operation at the Horman residence on Saturday June 26, 2010. MCSO was unable to confirm the murder-for-hire plot that had been alleged by the landscaper. As a result, MCSO was not able to arrest Ms. Horman.
As such, why did law enforcement then give the green light to Mr. Horman to obtain a restraining order on the basis that his wife had hired to hire a hit man? Or did Mr. Horman act unilaterally without the endorsement of law enforcement? Surely Mr. Horman must have known that law enforcement could not verify the landscaper’s story, yet he went ahead and filed a restraining order based on the very allegations that law enforcement could not verify. So why did he sign his name to allegations that he knew were not true?
The text messages don’t check out. The murder for hire allegations don’t check out. The only common thread here is a man whose son disappeared on June 4, 2010. As tragic and anguishing as Mr. Horman’s circumstances may be, that does not excuse misrepresenting information to the court.
Mr. Horman cannot claim that the phone registered in his name is Michael Cook’s work cell phone, nor can he claim that the phone allegedly used by Michael Cook was used by Ms. Horman. When Sheriff Dan Staton talked about knowing things that might surprise people, could he have been talking about cell phone records? Maybe Stephen Houze and Peter Bunch will force the sheriff to reveal its source for the records.
Although the answer would not bring Kyron home, it might at least alleviate some of the blame heaped on Ms. Horman, as unpopular as that may be.
Lea Conner, contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
Madeline Tanner, copy and contributing editor, blinkoncrime.com
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@Kimberly says:
January 26, 2011 at 1:43 pm
All respect to you Kimberly, but that is an opinion piece, yes? The data seems very faulty to me (a lot of the math doesn’t add up).
S says:
January 25, 2011 at 9:31 pm
“enumclawrose says:
January 25, 2011 at 2:49 pm
Separately, all the issues can be explained away, but when dumped in the same bag, wellm as has been said before, TH would have to be the unluckiest person in the world to have a bunch of innocent behaviors look that bad.
———————————–
Unlucky indeed!
There was a conversation on Hawaii Five-0 last week that really made me think of this case.
Chin: You know what they say about consequences?
Danno: No. I don’t.
Chin: They take a lot of planning.
Sorry … correction on previous comment.
Above quote should’ve read “You know what they say about coincidences?” not consequences
6.evie says:
January 26, 2011 at 3:57 pm
************************************
2 posts, 2nd post posted before 1st.
if you follow the link I gave the author shows his sources
As I stated above, my interpretation is a study!
I am trying to find the interview with RS that Maxine Bernstein did for the Oregonian. Does anyone have a link to the actual interview done with RS by Maxine Bernstein.
This is all I could find about the interview.
The landscaper, contacted by The Oregonian last week, confirmed that he was hired to do lawn work at the Horman home off Northwest Sheltered Nook Road. He said he’s talked with detectives and could not comment further. His name is being withheld to protect his identity as a cooperating witness in an ongoing criminal investigation.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/landscaper_tells_police_terri.html
@wendy’scrush says:
January 26, 2011 at 12:40 am
“Keep in mind, this is hearsay — TMH is still in Roseburg, spending most of her entire day(s) working out at the local YMCA (every day), taking yoga classes (etc). Doesn’t talk with many, if anyone at all, very “blank” appearance. For whatever it’s worth.”
Thank you, wendy’scrush.. just last night I was wondering why there hadn’t been even a little gossip about TH coming out of R-burg.
I can’t explain the rest of the silence around Oregon, but it helps to know someone is still watching and talking.
(taken from “The Complete Idiot’s Guide to Forensics”)
The FBI Crime Scene Analysis distinguishes between organized and disorganized crime scenes. Below is the list …. FYI
Organized offender characteristics include:
* Average to above average intelligence
* Adequate level of social competence
* Prefers skilled work
* Sexually competent
* High birth-order status
* Father had/has stable work
* Childhood discipline inconsistencies
* Mood was controlled during the crime
* Used alcohol in connection with the crime
* Situational stress precipitated crime
* Lives with partner
* Is mobile, owns a car in good condition
* Follows crime in the news media
* May change jobs or leave town after the crime
Disorganized offender characteristics:
* Below average intelligence
* Socially inadequte
* Works at unskilled labor
* Sexually incompetent
* Low birth-order status
* Father has/had unstable work
* Received harsh discipline as a child
* Mood was anxious during the crime
* Minimal use of alcohol in connection with the crime
* Situational stress played little role in precipitating the crime
* Lives alone
* Lives or works near the crime scene
* Not interested in following the crime in the news media
* Significant behavior change follows the crime; may resort to drug or alcohol use
Regarding the “organized crime scene offender” list for which I’m assuming we all agree based on what we know would describe the alleged “crime scene” at the school based on there being little to no evidence left behind …
If the organized offender will often change jobs and/or leave town after the crime, how can we be so sure Ky’s perp hasn’t? I ask because didn’t Blink tell us initially that she was of the belief that Ky (and the alleged perp) were still somewhere to be found in Oregon and hadn’t left the state/area? IIRC, that’s what I remember. But doesn’t that go against one of the characteristics on the organized offender list described here? Now I’m confused …
Blink … can you help us out here?
CD, This is not the exact article you are looking for, but it confirms that the Oregonian had contact with the landscaper. The other article, which I have read but cannot find now, it not an interview per se, but it does make note that Maxine Berstein has interviewed the landscaper. To my knowledge, you will not find an article with an actual interview. Hope this helps explain.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/landscaper_tells_police_terri.html
The landscaper, contacted by The Oregonian last week, confirmed that he was hired to do lawn work at the Horman home off Northwest Sheltered Nook Road. He said he’s talked with detectives and could not comment further. His name is being withheld to protect his identity as a cooperating witness in an ongoing criminal investigation.
@1. Was he instructed to intro the new guy as trigger dude?
O
I am just going to be sick. Thank you for telling me.
B
This is a story coming from my state. As I have expressed here before, could this investigation involve a minor? Could Oregon have such the same public school policy as Washington? Skyline is K-8. That includes middle school aged children. Not trying to get anyone (please do not) to start running names of minors, just wondering if that is why the investigation is so different.
http://www.kirotv.com/news/23581175/detail.html
snip> We found regular students and their parents are intentionally being left in the dark by school administrators, so young rapists and child molesters can get uninterrupted public educations.
It wasn’t easy, but we identified about 60 schools in this area where registered teenage sex offenders are on campus every day. Our website features details on each offender, including exactly where they attend class.
@cd Perhaps this is what you were looking for. I do not ever recall seeing anywhere that $10,000 was for the MFH itself or that the LS expected that amount from Terri or that it was any sort of down payment or that he agreed to carry out the plan, etc. I think a lot of speculation has gone into the mix.
This article is where I remember getting the $10,000 from, and it was recorded in the conversation that he asked for $10,000 or he would tell the police about the MFH. Of course, it’s possible the $10,000 figure was chosen because she had mentioned it before so he assumed she could pay that much – but to my knowledge we were never told that. Perhaps we all need to MOO a little more because it’s easier to remember the MOO when you think back and wonder if you read something as fact or opinion.
Perhaps Blink has other sources.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/landscaper_wore_wire_asked_ter.html
enumclawrose says:
January 26, 2011 at 8:06 pm
(snip)
This is a story coming from my state.
http://www.kirotv.com/news/23581175/detail.html
*****************************************************************************
@ e-rose.
Oh my gosh.
This is so disturbing to read.
Thank you for passing this along – you certainly have opened my eyes to something I had NO idea was happening in many communities.
WTH ????
This is so hard for me to understand.
How can the “rights” of these (juvenile) convicted sex offenders … trump the safety of every other child that happens to attend the same school ????
How can this happen … I would think this would be a HUGE liability on the school district that is purposefully keeping these dirty little secrets from the parents of every other child at these schools.
And WTH with the court system that makes part of the parole/probation of these sex offenders – that they are court ordered to attend a public school ??
I’m speechless.
Some snippits from your link above:
“Nearly all of them must attend public school as part of their probation, parole, or other court ordered decree.
Many of their rap sheets are serious, including nearly 100 teenagers who were convicted of child rape, child molestation, for first-degree rape. Hundreds more have convictions for indecent liberties, sexual assault, stalking, and a half dozen other serious offenses.”
“Pearson says, “Student sex offenders have an advantage. If no one knows they’re a sex offender, they can groom a student, which has happened.”
“Public records show that one particular junior high student was recently convicted of sexually assaulting a 4-year-old girl. A judge sentenced him to probation and registration as a sex offender. With no jail time, the young man went right back to hanging out in the school courtyard and going to class.”
No interest in running minors, but based on having a son like Kyron as to weak motor (what brings bullies) & attentional skills, I felt the first week it was likely older school bullies, tho my son’s school was a bully-free el ed (kudos to Shriver parents yhere & a mainstreaming Congressman’s autistic son there who pioneered).
I realized this crime is too sophisticated, bullet-proof, etc, to involve minors. I would not be surprised to find the most sophisticated intellect as planner. Brighter than TH or RS.
Rose, I really respect your posts and I don’t have a better answer than you, so I apologize in advance for being pushy, but you are smart and a logical thinker and might not mind a little probing of your thoughts.
I play the scene in my head. White truck pulls into the Horman driveway. TH sees the truck and knows who it is. The other guy is in the truck and she has never met him. How does LE think, going into the sting, that RS will explain this other guy. What was the reason he would give TH for bringing the other guy.
It just seems that if he was going to ask for hush money there would be no need to bring another guy along. In fact, who would admit to a MFH in front of any stranger, sting or no sting. Bad business. Just seems there was a reasonable explanation that was planned to be offered up on this guy. I mean, this doesn’t say, the guy hid in the van down the street while the landscaper wore a wire and went to the front door.
Blinkoncrime, Kyron Horman Case: The Pathway From Suspect to Defendant is Forged
snip>
The same Portland source confirmed that an undercover detective, playing the role of an associate of the landscaper turned alleged assassin, was present.
__________________________________________________________________
10.Rose says:
January 26, 2011 at 7:56 pm
@1. Was he instructed to intro the new guy as trigger dude?
enumclawrose says:
January 26, 2011 at 8:06 pm
“This is a story coming from my state. As I have expressed here before, could this investigation involve a minor? Could Oregon have such the same public school policy as Washington? Skyline is K-8. That includes middle school aged children. Not trying to get anyone (please do not) to start running names of minors, just wondering if that is why the investigation is so different.”
——————-
Can’t tell you about the investigation, can’t tell you about the “policy” – CAN tell you I know it has happened in Oregon. I doubt if anything has changed from what I experienced in regard to how it is handled. This was a high school with a grade school close by. I could give you details, but I don’t think it’s relevant to do that. In each case there was a safety plan and a juvenile justice caseworker. Safety did not include informing students or parents or anyone else except those most closely associate with the student or student discipline management. It also included a transportation plan and a lunchtime plan or an adult aide who accompanied the student – depending on the student’s needs. I have no reason to believe it wasn’t the same in other schools as the need arose.
I can tell you 3 things without reservation.
(1) In my many years of experience, I have had principals I dearly loved and some I didn’t respect very much. In all cases, only telling a principal of a school is like doing absolutely nothing. A principal’s job description does not include the kinds of activities that allow him or her to monitor a student or a safety plan, do any follow-up, contact case workers, check on transportation arrangements, or any of the other things that would be necessary to keep kids safe.
Depending on the school, these things are done by vice principals, deans, counselors, assistants, lead secretaries, Special Ed staff if the student has an IEP, and other staff members assigned to related roles in the school. When I had a student on a safety plan and he was transported (by cab) to treatment at the end of the day, I called to be sure he got there. I would show up in juvenile court with an attendance record, I would call case workers and foster parents, etc. People would say to me, “I didn’t contact you because I didn’t expect anyone from the school to return my call,” or, “We don’t usually get reports from a school even if we ask for them.” Or the reports would be too little, too late. (And yes, I had to argue with my bosses sometimes, in order to be allowed time to do these things and take work home as well. The solution isn’t just notification.)
To me, keeping secrets from those most able and available to help is like being admitted to the hospital where only the hospital administrator knows what surgery you are supposed to have and the doctors and staff just have to guess. Everybody loses.
(2) When a student is assigned a personal aide, it is unusual because it costs extra money, but it sometimes happens. The aide would go to the student’s home (maybe a foster home), ride the bus with the student, spend the day going everywhere including the bathroom, and back home again. This would most commonly occur if a student had an IEP defining other needs as well. Aides who do this are often very poorly trained and poorly paid. I know of one case in particular where the aide was regularly getting off the city bus ahead of the student who was supposed to be monitored – and the student managed to act inappropriately in just that short a time, resulting in a child’s angry father confronting the aide at the bus stop one morning.
(3) There are hardly any good alternatives for these kids to get an education. Many years ago, we had home tutors, alternative schools, various work programs, and some other options. Only a fraction of that exists anymore due to economic issues. This is true not only for sex offenders, but for many other students with behavior issues that are beyond what can be handled in an average classroom by dedicated teachers. Not only does it make teaching and learning much more difficult, it also limits the possibility for successes that at least some of these students found in a more structured, monitored environment designed for their needs.
Evie, I am in Roseburg…in the same neighborhood as the Moultan residence…at first, people were very defensive of Terri…people didn’t want to believe that a person they went to highschool with could be involved & were very quick to cut off those of us who believed that she had to have some link to the situation…those same people don’t have the same feelings that they did in the beginning…now they see that it appears that she is involved…. I have friends that are yoga instructors, front desk workers & childcare workers…we’ve had conversations about the case & none of them have ever mentioned that she has been there…. otherwise, people are waiting for the case to unfold…. There are a few that are very nervous that she is living so close to our neighborhood school….
I meant to say…at the “Y”….
@e-rose (i’m still up coughing), in reply, my memory was only what the Oregonian article contained as later posted: $10,000 to keep quiet re MFH. I can’t rationalize the presence of no. 2 guy, because the entire sting setup was irrational, esp with KH not being told to remain out of the way on premises & conflict-free w/TH to mollify her (an acting competence beyond any of us however). I wouldn’t tell him to walk out in anger and pull it concurrently. I think no 2 was there bwcause of PoliceProcedure, not common sense.
From the bottom of my heart, thank you, for all that you did. In “my day”, I remember people like you. I wish there were more out there like you. I know there are still good people in the schools, but we have bureaucratically tied their hands. How can schools teach common sense when they aren’t allowed to practice it? Lead by example. TY for the post. How are we going to turn this boat around?
18.MockingbirdSings says:
January 26, 2011 at 10:18 pm
I would show up in juvenile court with an attendance record, I would call case workers and foster parents, etc. People would say to me, “I didn’t contact you because I didn’t expect anyone from the school to return my call,” or, “We don’t usually get reports from a school even if we ask for them.” Or the reports would be too little, too late. (And yes, I had to argue with my bosses sometimes, in order to be allowed time to do these things and take work home as well. The solution isn’t just notification.)
enumclawrose says:
January 26, 2011 at 8:06 pm
This is a story coming from my state. As I have expressed here before, could this investigation involve a minor? Could Oregon have such the same public school policy as Washington? Skyline is K-8. That includes middle school aged children. Not trying to get anyone (please do not) to start running names of minors, just wondering if that is why the investigation is so different.
Eumenclose–
This is extremely important information!!
We are such a small army but we have to become aware!
Thank you for linking your local information so we might have a pivot point in our own communities…omg–have we even asked the questions?!
Blink–have you asked your school community about their sex offenders?
http://www.kirotv.com/news/23581175/detail.html
snip> We found regular students and their parents are intentionally being left in the dark by school administrators, so young rapists and child molesters can get uninterrupted public educations.
It wasn’t easy, but we identified about 60 schools in this area where registered teenage sex offenders are on campus every day. Our website features details on each offender, including exactly where they attend class.
I wish I was as confident as you are. I was thinking something along the lines of TH ala’ Pamela Smart. Something from the article caught my eye:
Mug shots uncovered by Team 7 Investigators show the criminals are just baby-faced 14, 15, and 16 year olds, who are allowed to blend into crowded public school lunch rooms and hallways throughout the state.
16.Rose says:
January 26, 2011 at 10:04 pm
snip> I realized this crime is too sophisticated, bullet-proof, etc, to involve minors. I would not be surprised to find the most sophisticated intellect as planner. Brighter than TH or RS.
Older article, same subject, from my state. Not trying to get OT, but here is the flip side. WTH? Gee, why wouldn’t we want this guy working with our kids?
http://www.seattlepi.com/local/368007_youthoffenders23.html
snip>
Consequences for these youths may depend, at least in part, on a child’s attorney. Jack, for instance — also 23 and identified here by his middle name — was discovered at 12 fondling a 5-year-old neighbor. But his lawyer was able to get a felony child molestation charge reduced to assault with sexual motivation, a misdemeanor, and the distinction allowed Jack to have his childhood record legally expunged.
He now works with youngsters at the Big Brothers/Big Sisters program in Seattle and plans to apply to medical school in the fall — all of which would have been impossible with a felony history, even if it happened when he was 12.
“I sat down with this woman for like 15 minutes, paid her $100 and the next thing you know, my record was gone,” Jack said. “If I hadn’t, I know it absolutely would have prevented me from the work I’m doing now, helping kids.”
CD, check this one out.
http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/07/plot-to-kill_story_puts_sourci.html
She found the landscaper, and she confirmed independently what she had initially heard. All the conversations were required to be off the record, and she, quite understandably, told the landscaper she would not use his name.
Folks, I believe that at one point in time Blink told me this did not involve a minor. I am not trying to derail our thoughts here, so please forgive the OT posts. Just frustrated, confused and frankly upset at the sad state of affairs of our schools.
KGW did a piece on the trucks with Kyron’s info. last night and a breif interview with KH. Nothing new, just thought I’d share, I’m glad to see something in the media for a change.
http://www.kgw.com/news/kyron-horman/Kyron-Hormans-image-to-appear-on-semi-trucks-nationwide-114419534.html
@Idahogal says:
January 27, 2011 at 8:41 am
KGW did a piece on the trucks with Kyron’s info. last night and a breif interview with KH. Nothing new, just thought I’d share, I’m glad to see something in the media for a change.
http://www.kgw.com/news/kyron-horman/Kyron-Hormans-image-to-appear-on-semi-trucks-nationwide-114419534.html
———————————————–
I saw it on our local news yesterday. I hope we hear something from law enforcement soon regarding the status of the investigation. I’m beginning to feel that “no news” is “bad news” for LE solving this case. I hope I’m wrong.
beejay- have been working on this for 2 days, will be up tomorrow.
B
@Sheila says:
January 26, 2011 at 10:58 pm and
Sheila says:
January 27, 2011 at 1:52 am
I meant to say…at the “Y”….”
Sheila, wow, thanks.. so to clarify, your ‘word on the street’ contradicts the rumor of TH attending the Y and working out daily/frequently?
BUT, I most empathize with the neighbors who didn’t want to consider TH.. I’ve had my own versions of that play out over this past 8 (eight, people) months. I’ve had my mind open about her, but other ‘criticisms’ take a while to accept.
I know R-burg a bit. I know it’s a small enough town that one couldn’t be out and about in public without someone noticing and commenting. While it’s hard to believe TH could be housebound all this time, I know someone in the community would be murmuring if she were out. Hmmm.
why is my post still in moderation while there is a whole page of posts after me? I don’t quite get the hierarchy of posting on this site. Are some posters more important than others? If you only want certain people to post then don’t make this a public forum, I’ll leave.
I moderated at the same time, if they posted previous to yours, it will get posted in chronological order, I have no say in that. I am behind today, we got 20 inches of snow and 3″ of ice and am managing spotty connectivity.
B
I’m here cause I want Kyron found- my only reason
DAD’s landlady is on NW Lucy Reeder. Her name is in recent MSM articles. I believe it’s her parents who own their own house on Sauvie Is, which in the past few yrs they put a huge addition onto. Its landscaping is gorgeous. (I very quickly checked into the Fazios, so can’t swear its his landlady’s parents, but believe it is some relation that own the big house).
DAD himself is not currently a fulltime landscaper; works for the print shop. He’s either a hobbyist landscaper, a parttime landscaper, or has previously been one.
I’m trying to create some news here; lobbying with MCSO and local media for coverage on the Feb 1 Task Force report. Some other locals are doing same. More help would be appreciated!
Well, just maybe Terri mistakenly thought the undercover agent was SZ and if she didn’t pay up she could be next. I’d be darned scared of someone that could kidnap a child or do a mfh and have the guts to come to the house knowing LE was all over this thing. Maybe she called 911 because she was afraid for her life, not because she smelled a rat.I am not putting this out there as an opinion…just an option.
Thanks for the info and the input.
Rose says:
my memory was only what the Oregonian article contained as later posted: $10,000 to keep quiet re MFH.
______________________________________________________________
OMG. Tonight try this, vicks vapo-rub on your FEET, cover with socks. Got an email, said works 100% of the time. Haven’t been able to try it out.
21.Rose says:
January 27, 2011 at 3:07 am
@e-rose (i’m still up coughing),
Maybe, no news is good news? Trust things are moving forward and will be completed in a timely fashion. Have faith, there is a lot of paper work that needs to be sifted.
enumclawrose says:
January 26, 2011 at 8:06 pm
This is a story coming from my state. As I have expressed here before, could this investigation involve a minor? Could Oregon have such the same public school policy as Washington? Skyline is K-8. That includes middle school aged children. Not trying to get anyone (please do not) to start running names of minors, just wondering if that is why the investigation is so different.
http://www.kirotv.com/news/23581175/detail.html
snip> We found regular students and their parents are intentionally being left in the dark by school administrators, so young rapists and child molesters can get uninterrupted public educations.
It wasn’t easy, but we identified about 60 schools in this area where registered teenage sex offenders are on campus every day. Our website features details on each offender, including exactly where they attend class.
——————
@erose
Wow … I don’t even know what to say to this one, except at this point, I believe almost anything is possible and we do know that this kind of thing does happen. Not only sexual inappropriateness, molestation, etc but at times murder too. Yrs ago, I remember reading about an unsolved crime for mths because police had no suspects. Eventually, the truth came out and the perp was a 12-yr old boy at the time who had lured a little 4 yr old boy into the woods with the intent of killing him.
The 4-yr old was beaten with a tree limb, sexually assaulted w/a stick after and left to die. No one ever suspected a child and so police were completely on the wrong track for mths looking for the suspect. It wasn’t until the young boy eventually confessed to one of his family members mths later that the crime was finally solved. Police later commented that the crime was atrocious and had the boy not eventually confessed, the crime may have gone unsolved completely. Could this really possibly be part of what Staton originally said “would shock us?”
Wow … just wow all around.
@ riverpearl: I never thought for a minute you were “snarky” in the slightest. I would love to have lunch and go sleuthin’ with ya sometime if we lived in the same city. I think I came off as judgemental and for that I apologize to everyone.
@ e-rose: hugs??
All: please be gentle with me on this, but I see the TH/RS dyad this way and of course it’s strictly moo:
Rudy and Terri were intimately involved. He was a guy who could appreciate being bench pressed and REALLY liked the golf-balls-thru-the-garden-hose routine. I think he is an illegal and that is what LE has on him. I have not read anywhere that he admitted to being involved in a MFH plot, but that he told LE that Terri asked him and offered him money to kill her husband. For me, that is a big difference. I’m not saying he didn’t do other bad stuff necessarily, just that I have not read that. He could be involved with the criminal Sanchez element but that has, in my mind, not been established. It wouldn’t surprise me if he were involved in drugs, porn, etc, but I just haven’t read that anywhere. If I were a gangster, I wouldn’t be chatting with Maxine Bernstein, I’d be laying low. Of course it’s a he said/she said thing, but for me, the one thing I’m real sure of: she’s a L.I.A.R..
Part of the irony is that we spend time and money on maps so we can locate SO’s, they have to stay so many feet/yards away from schools, playgrounds, etc., but they don’t put the dot on the map inside the school. So what is the point of the rest of it?
Word Girl says:
This is extremely important information!!
We are such a small army but we have to become aware!
family, big one, back attacha…
@ e-rose: hugs??
Ok, my post at January 27, 2011 at 1:43 pm is going to seem out of left field till Blink puts up the one prior to it. Assuming I actually hit “Submit” for it. Lol. If I don’t see it in awhile, I will repost it. Just for coherence.
Meanwhile, around Roseburg they have their own little 11 yr old sex offender (not named in paper) now locked up. Might be released to attend public school later on, if “treatment” goes well. Where I live, a few years in juvie jail completes the warping of mind and character. Perhaps Oregon does a better job. Quote and link:
“ROSEBURG, Ore. — A Sutherlin boy, 11, has admitted to first degree sodomy and first degree sex abuse against an 8-year-old girl.”
http://www.kval.com/news/local/114721329.html
Thanks, Blink, this just came up for me:
beejay says:
January 27, 2011 at 11:46 am
beejay- have been working on this for 2 days, will be up tomorrow.
B
Blink:
Stay warm in all that snow! Sending you a big cup of e-hot chocolate, lol. I heard there is another big storm coming straight for ya too so be safe. I remember back in 1978 we had blizzard conditions for several days and schools, businesses, roads were closed for almost a week because we were just buried! I’ll never forget my small town out in the country having to call in the National Guard just to have trucks big enough to plow through all the snow! The first day we were able to go anywhere, there were literally 20 foot walls of snow on each side of the road going to the store. It was literally like driving through a roof-free tunnel! I was just 8 yrs old at the time but it’s a memory that has stuck with me forever! {:)
Snow is great … but not when it closes airports, snarles traffic and shuts down passneger trains, lol.
Can anyone say “Rudy”? Rudy Sanchez and associates. That is where Blink put her money on. That’s where I’m going.
At first I thought “nah, he’s just a pawn”, but now I’m starting to think differently. There is definitely something hinky about them.
I would like to ask the question, what is the “R” in Ubaldo R. Sanchez stand for? Also the “F” in Ubaldo F. Sanchez.
O/T Glad I’m not living in NJ now with all of that snow Blink!
I post this because it shows how easily this can happen in a public place. Can’t imagine the nerve, stupidity and illness.
http://www.kirotv.com/news/26643088/detail.html
While working as an assistant, Shafer was moving about the school bus with the children as another employee drove the bus when the molestation of the two girls occurred, police said.
beejay says:
January 27, 2011 at 11:46 am
beejay- have been working on this for 2 days, will be up tomorrow.
B
*****************************************************************************
This sounds promising … looking forward to tomorrow’s edition of BOC for sure!
Seems so long since we’ve had anything new to chew on.
Thanks Blink.
@29. Beejay & blink: you go girls!
Yes, power outages all around. Sympathy, blink.
all nite here large tree limbs crashing…
Kudos to evie and others calling the county council.
That will get returns.
They have the power of the purse….
Hi Blink-hope you aren’t too snowed in! I had a comment this afternoon I posted that showed in moderation, but now it has disappeared-could it be in spam? Thanks for checking!
And sorry-now it’s showing in moderation again. Weird…
Know it’s tough with the outages and weather. Just wanted to make sure my hug gets out of moderation.
41.enumclawrose says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
January 27, 2011 at 5:39 pm
family, big one, back attacha…
@ e-rose: hugs??
iodizedseasalt says:
January 27, 2011 at 11:59 am
why is my post still in moderation while there is a whole page of posts after me? I don’t quite get the hierarchy of posting on this site. Are some posters more important than others? If you only want certain people to post then don’t make this a public forum, I’ll leave.
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@ i-salt.
Now don’t you be thinking about going anywhere, ok?
We need you!!
I think many/most of us have had some of our posts get hung up temporarily “in moderation” – but at the same time we see other people’s posts that were posted at a later time showing up first.
It confused me for awhile too … and I admit I too took it personally briefly.
Or thought I’d said something wrong and PO’d Blink.
But >>> my posts always end up being posted a little while later (and always inserted back in the proper chronological order they were posted in).
I know Ms B is one busy woman who’s multi-tasking a whole slew of balls up in the air.
I just figure she checks + posts a chunk of posts at a time (sometimes not always the first ones received in) … and then she gets busy with another of the cases she’s working on … but she ALWAYS comes back to check + post to the board any posts that were not done on her last trip thru this one thread.
We all want to be here when justice comes for sweet little Kyron.
Stick around b/c I always look forward to reading your thoughts!