The West Memphis Series Part II: Guilty By Plea And Have Been Set Free
Jonesboro, AR- In a shocking development, four days following the first installment of the West Memphis Three on www.blinkoncrime.com, on August 19, 2011 Damien Echols, Charles Jason Baldwin and Jessie Miskelley, through an Alford plea, were convicted of three counts of first degree murder following an agreement made by Prosecutor Scott Ellington and their respective defense attorneys for the murders of eight year old boys James Michael Moore, Christopher Byers ( Murray) and Stevie Branch.
Judge David N. Laser agreed to and imposed suspended sentences for time served to Echols, Miskelley and Baldwin; all were released and immediately declared their innocence during the ensuing press conference.
In Part I of our series, we touched briefly on the development of new evidence and possible murder weapon, the blue handled- mountain ice axe, which inexplicably was never presented at trial. It had been admitted into evidence after being retrieved from its owner, following it’s return by Jason Baldwin’s, younger brother Mathew.
Requests to confirm whether or not the ice axe was maintained in evidence at West Memphis Police Department were non-responsive at the time of this publication. Part II continues first with what the jury never heard. A podcast of my interview on the case following the release of the WM3 can be found here.
Premature Illumination
One of the larger points of contention in the murders was the lack of blood evidence at the scene. The lack of blood or blood spatter at the scene with such gruesome injuries spawned the defense theory the ditch was a dump site or secondary crime scene. This was largely due to the fact that the jury would never hear about the results of luminol tests; it was suppressed by motion of the defense In both trials.
Luminol enhanced chemiluminesence (LCL) technology in 1993 was geared toward examining items of evidence in a lab under black light for optimum photographic results, or its secondary application for use in an enclosed environment which can be manually darkened and a portable black light ( we now call this an alternative light source or ALS) brought to the scene.
LCL when sprayed onto a surface containing remnants of blood, or more specifically the iron in blood, will create a glowing reaction when iron, invisible to the naked eye, is present.
In 1993 under Arkansas law, Luminol testing was considered new, novel, and not accepted as scientific evidence.
While the methods for collection, testing and controls have advanced significantly since 1993 and LCL testing is widely used in criminal case work, analysis of the findings in the instant case flatly dispute the notion that there was no blood associated with the crime scene along the ditch bank of Robin Hood Hills.
Contrary to the misconception that there was no evidence of blood at the scene, the results of two consecutive days of luminol tests at the scene were enlightening.
As Kermit Channell and Donald Smith, from the Arkansas crime lab could not bring the “outside in” they were forced to set up shop in the woods along the banks of the ditch. Also present for testing both days were WMPD Detectives Mike Allen, Tony Anderson and Bryn Ridge.
Donald Smith’s report below in it’s entirety below, The other reports can be found here.
STATE CRIME LABORATORY
P.O. Box 5274
Number 3 Natural Resources Drive
Little Rock, Arkansas 72215
REPORT OF LABORATORY ANALYSIS
Investigating Officer / Agency / Address
Sgt. Mike Allen
West Memphis Police Department
100 Court Street
West Memphis, AR 72301
Laboratory Case Number: 93-05717
Date Received in Lab: 05/07/93
How Evidence Received: M E / Matthew Elliott
Agency Case Number:
Suspect (s):
Victim (s):
Steve Edward Branch
Date of Report; 06/10/93
FIELD INVESTIGATION. WEST MEMPHIS TRIPLE HOMICIDE. MAY 12 and
MAY 13. 1993 LUMINOL:
This analyst and Kermit Channell, Serologist responded to request to perform luminol on
a potential crime scene area on May 12, 1993. We left that afternoon, arriving in West
Memphis at approximately 6:30 P.M., proceeding to the Police Department.
Officers Tony Anderson, Brian Ridge, and Mike Allen accompanied Kermit and myself
to a swampy area in the northern edge of West Memphis where the victims were found.
A general survey of the area in the daylight hours was conducted. Approaching darkness
fresh solutions of luminol reagent were prepared. When the area became dark, using
flashlights for light support, the part returned to the area and proceeded to spray and
locate areas of luminol light emission activity, a presumptive test for the presence of
trace quantities of blood. The following observations were noted:
(1) At a trail along a stream bed an approximately 11 foot high bluff overlooking the
stream positive reactions were noted on either side of a tree with more reaction noted to
the right side of the tree, facing the stream bed.
(2) An Area with used plastic sheeting west of the trail and the bluff gave more positive
reactions were noted.
(3) At the west bank of the stream bed, to the right of some trees, an area gave positive
reaction. It was explained by the Police Department that this was where two of the
victims were placed when they were recovered from the stream bed.
(4) In the stream bed, below the described (at one time) water line, positive luminol tests
indicated where one of the victims was found in the water as related by the West
Memphis Police Department.
(5) On the east bank of the stream bed were a pile of sticks and a depression in the soil
where luminol tests showed a concentrated area of positive reaction.
[PAGE 2]
(6) North of this point luminol tests gave positive reaction to a large area of
concentration (described by West Memphis Police Department where the third victims
was placed upon recovery from the water).
(7) North of the point #6 near some tree roots, another large area of concentration of the
luminol reaction was noted.
(8) Trace amounts of positive luminol reaction was noted on the slope west of the area
where two of the victims were recovered and placed. (reference area #3). The areas north
and south of where the third victims had been placed (5) and (6) were unaccountable
known activity by the Memphis Police Department or rescue / recovery operations.
From these areas of noted luminol reactions for the presumptive presence of trace
amounts of blood the following opinion is rendered:
The traces of presumed blood detected along the trail (2), and at the bluff (1), and one the
slope (8) appear to be transfer of blood by the rescue and recovery teams.
Reaction in the areas where the recovered victims were placed is the apparent result of
trace blood transfer from the victims (3) and (6).
The area below the water level on the west side of the stream was accounted as where
trace amounts of the victimís blood diffused into the mud in the stream bed.
The areas (5) and (7) indicate activity prior to recovery of the victims and relate to
activity to the victims when perhaps they were being attacked.
It should be noted that the luminol testing was performed some days after the discovery
of the victims and at least one rainfall had occurred. There were no visible signs or
indication of blood at any of the locations that we investigated.
[PAGE 3]
Upon the group returning that night to the police headquarters Inspector Gitchell and his
staff were advised of our findings. It is our opinion the crime had taken place where the
bodies of the victims were recovered. Inspector Gitchell was further advised of the
inability to document the luminol reaction of the evening because of the light leaks from
stars and the back scattered light from West Memphis. To document the luminescence
Inspector Gitchell was advised that we would have to place tenting over the areas of
interest and to block out all stray light possible.
The luminescence requires near total darkness to document luminol reactions in the open
field.
It was decided that Kermit and I should stay over the next day perform the tests again
and photograph them.
The morning of May 13, Inspector Gitchell provided us with equipment, supplies and
manpower needed to document the areas of positive luminol reaction. A test with plastic
covering over the canvas was erected and photographs were taken of the positive areas
noted of the previous evening again with fresh luminol application.
Because of the limitations due to some light leakage, physical activity in the area
destroying some of the reaction, the weather conditions of some light rain the night
before and the originally low concentration levels in the areas on the bluff (area #1), along
the trail (area #2), where the victims were placed (area #3), and the area in the stream bed
where the body was recovered (area #4) and the area above the recovery area (area #8)
we were not able to document photography as we observed these areas the evening of
May 12.
The tented area over the areas where the victim’s body was placed (#6) and the
questioned area (#5), subdued the light to a degree that a less than perfect photograph
could be obtained. These photographs still documented the areas of interest, showing
luminol reaction in respective areas. These photographs were without the benefit of flash
painting application to reference the areas photographed. A still photo of the questioned
area from the original camera tripod location does reference the questioned area. The
photographs were processed revealing the luminol reaction at areas where the victim was
place (#6) and the questioned area (#5)
[PAGE 4]
The tent was moved and photographs were taken of the questioned area by the tree root (#7). Photographs of the areas (#4, #5 and #6) with surveyor flags mounted were taken to reference those areas tested and photographed. All photographs were left with Inspector Gitchell.
[signed] Donald E. Smith, Criminalist
Soil samples were submitted on May 14, 1993, but for unknown reasons not tested until 4 months later, and did not react to the luminol.
The result was considered inconclusive as it was not likely to detect blood from a four month old soil sample in the first place.
Although the luminol reaction results were not admissible in the trials, for analysis purposes, it tells an irrefutable story. The obvious counter-argument could only be that investigators were new to the technique, some of the initial testing was unable to be photographed, or to any conspiracies, that detectives simply made up results for some purpose.
However, as none of the investigators present had the autopsy results prior to the testing, and most certainly did not have Jessie Miskelley’s “account” to draw from, outside of the known injuries and other more circumstantial evidence in this case, these findings certainly further support there were multiple perpetrators in this crime- and that it all went down right there.
In 1998, Damien Echols filed a Rule 37 hearing for causes of incompetent counsel and due to his “actual innocence.” Jessie Miskelley lost his appeal to overturn his conviction also in 1998, but It was not until 2008 that Baldwin and Miskelley filed their Rule 37 petitions. For purposes of evaluation, I am including affidavits , exhibits and testimony excerpts from some of the expert witnesses at all three hearings and subsequent related appearance spanning from 1998- 2008.
Brent Turvey, of Knowledge Solutions, LLC trained under renowned blood spatter expert Dr. Henry Lee, did not consider any of the luminal reports when hired by Dan Stidham in 1998 for his expert opinion in his representation of Jessie Miskelley requesting a new trial. Turvey’s report found (here) was largely the impetus for future defense experts for all three defendants to “weigh in”.
While Turvey’s work was largely unsupported once his infamous “bitemark” was debunked and he bought into the “Baldwin knife” which has since been abandoned by all subsequent defense experts, as the first guy up at bat so to speak, his testimony demonstrated the burgeoning direction to the CSI Effect the West Memphis Three would take toward their ultimate freedom.
I explore Turvey’s initial observations taken directly from his report, in the beginning of each unique victim’s autopsy segment, followed by updated relevant expert information and my subsequent analysis.
Autopsy By Coroner- Autopsy By Proxy
In the interest of brevity, I intend to focus on the dissenting views of the experts, and I stipulate that in no report that I have reviewed, was there evidence of sodomy or object penetration of any of the boys.
While I believe Dr. Perretti’s prior experience with cases that involved same did form his opinion on the possibility as it relates to some of the injuries, I do not believe that such testimony should have been permitted at trial, nor would it be permitted today.
Memphis Triple Homicide May 5, 1993
James M. Moore #ME-329-93
Steve E. Branch #ME-330-93
Chris M. Byers #ME-331-93
LOCATION: On May 6th, 1993, all three victims were found, bound wrist to ankle with shoe laces, in the water of a drainage ditch, in a heavily wooded area called the Robin Hood hills, behind the Blue Beacon Truck Wash in West Memphis, Arkansas. An equivocal forensic examination of all available crime scene and autopsy photos, crime scene video, investigator’s reports, witness statements, family statements, autopsy reports and numerous other sources to be listed as referenced in the endnote section of this report. The purpose of this preliminary examination was to competently assess the nature of the interactions between the victims and their environments as it contributed to their deaths as indicated by available forensic evidence, and the documentation regarding that evidence.
James M. Moore
James Michael Moore autopsy found here.
The following forensic information is taken directly from the official autopsy report filed by Dr. Frank J. Peretti of the Arkansas State Crime Lab, Medical Examiner Division, dated 5-7-93, Case No. ME-329-93 and/ or from The official coroner’s report filed by Kent Hale, Crittenden County Coroner, dated 5-6-97.
The purpose of this section is not to present an all inclusive, detailed account and explanation of every piece of information in these reports, but rather to explore these reports, with the corresponding photos, for consistency, possible omissions, and to review injuries or patterns that this examiner deemed to be significant to the case.
Wound Pattern Analysis
This victim received more traumatic head injuries than any of the other victims in this case. Dr. Peretti states that defense wounds were present on the victim’s hands. These wounds were very few, indicating that victim was incapacitated quickly after the attack began. So the nature of these head injuries, and the limited defensive type wounds, combine to indicate sudden, forceful, and repeated blows that resulted in abraded contusions, multiple lacerations, and multiple skull fractures.
There is an unexplained directional pattern abrasion just below the victim’s right anterior shoulder area.
This unexplained injury does not correspond with any of the physical evidence collected at the location that victim was discovered. It is furthermore inconsistent with any of the naturally occurring elements that exist in that environment. The best conclusion that this examiner can reach is that this pattern abrasion was created by forceful, directional contact with something that was not found at that crime scene, whether it be a weapon, a surface or something else capable of creating that pattern.
The shoelace ligatures used to restrain this victim did not leave deep furrows, and also did not leave abrasions. This indicates that the victim was not struggling while the ligatures were in place. This indicates further that the victim was very much unconscious when the ligatures were affixed to his wrists and ankles.
We know that the victim drowned, that is to say that hemorrhagic edema fluid was present in the victim’s lungs, indicating that the victim was breathing when he was placed into the 2ft of water in the drainage ditch at Robin Hood Hills.
Together, these facts suggest that the purpose of the ligatures in this victim’s case was to keep the victim from moving around or being able to swim should he regain consciousness once he had been thrown into the water. It is this examiners opinion that the assailant in this case demonstrated all manner of awareness and cognizance at this location. The assailant knew that this victim was not dead when they threw this victim into the water, and that the ligatures would assist to complete the act of deliberate homicide should the victim become conscious.
Lack Of Injuries
When compared to the other two victims in this case, who were found at the same location, bound nude with shoelace ligatures in the same fashion, the most striking discrepancy is the lack of injuries suffered by this victim. In the crime scene and autopsy photos made available to this examiner, there were no readily discernible bite marks visible, the genitals have not been visibly disturbed or molested, and there are no discernible stab wounds. This lack of attention is very telling, and will be discussed in the Offender Characteristics section of this report. There is also, again, a lack of mosquito bites to this victim, which, as mentioned earlier, suggests that he received his injuries elsewhere first. This because the injuries took time to inflict, time during which many mosquito bites would have been received, even after death.
Analysis: I find the statement that he had the least amount of injuries, yet the most severe head injuries in dire conflict, as he died from multiple injuries, and drowning. The fractures to his head and lacerations to his left and front right skull were enough to cause his death within minutes on their own, and there can be no doubt that he received them while he was already unconscious because of the lack of injury at the ligature sites. There is very little hemorrhage involvement with the open lacerations, and all lacerations were abraded; one with a dovetail and upside down L producing an ovid fracture. In Jesse Miskelley’s confessions, he says one of them was moving as he was put in the water while he was leaving. I believe the reason he never mentioned that Michael Moore was beat about the head with an instrument of some kind is because he never saw that. Michael was located in the ditch just below the oak with the exposed root that had the luminol result “shaped like a V”, which would be consistent with him struggling to get out of that water, on that bank, with a cast off or blood spatter pattern consistent with someone beating him toward the bank and in front of that tree.
Mosquito bites: Only females take a blood meal, so that potentially reduces the population by 50%, and at no time will they bite a deceased person. They are attracted mostly by carbon dioxide, released from a breathing person. Both Dr. Haskell and Dr. Goff agreed to this ultimately.
What is further curious to me, is that while Turvey was hired by Miskelley, who confessed at least three times by the date of the generation of this report, does he not note the obvious discrepancy for the placement of Mike Moore upstream, or that he was found on his right side with the left side surfacing when in effect dislodged by Det. Mike Allen. Moore was also hogtied differently, with different knots than the other 2 victims, with ONE black shoelace. There is a reason that Turvey was not given Miskelley’s updated confession following his conviction, and instructed to disprove it; he would not have been able to.
Steven Edward Branch
Stevie Branch autopsy found here.
Wound Pattern Analysis
There are numerous violent, traumatic injuries to this victim’s face and head, as well as numerous superficial scratches, abrasions, and contusions noted throughout the rest of his body. Dr. Peretti, however, does not note the presence of extensive defensive wounds.
This indicates a violent, overpowering attack on this victim that he was unable to put up resistance against. The constellation of wounds are very similar to those inflicted on James Moore, however they are much more intense and include the victim’s face.
This level of attention paid to the victim’s face, in terms of depersonalization and rage, is indicative of familiarity and that will be explored later on in this report.
Furthermore, there is the existence of patterned injuries all over this victim’s face that could be bite marks. Since the ME may have missed this crucial evidence, other areas of his body may show bite mark evidence as well. The autopsy photos of this victim supplied to this examiner were not of sufficient quality to make an absolute determination of any kind, and would require a thorough examination by a qualified forensic odontologist for an informed, conclusive analysis. [note: Dr. Thomas David, board certified forensic odontologist, has confirmed the wound as a human adult bitemark and excluded Damien Echols, Jason Baldwin and Jessie Misskelley as the offender using bite impressions obtained from the men in prison] Bite mark evidence is very important in any criminal case because it demonstrates behavior and lends itself to individuation. It can reveal to an examiner who committed the act, because bite marks can be as unique as fingerprints. And, once established, it also reveals the act itself; biting.
Another unidentified pattern compression abrasion can be found on the back of Steve Branch’s head. The source of this injury caused a 3? inch fracture at the base of the skull with multiple extension fractures that terminate in the foramen magnum (that’s the hole at the base of the skull where the spinal cord connects to the brain). Upon close examination, this pattern injury is consistent with compression made from footwear. Again, without better photos supplied to the examiner showing a variety of angles, it’s very difficult to make a positive identification of any kind. But the pattern is consistent with a footwear impression, and would require a footwear impression expert to analyze and make an informed, competent determination.
The shoelace ligatures used to restrain this victim did leave deep furrows, and also did leave patterned abrasions on both the wrists and ankles. This indicates that the victim was struggling while the ligatures were in place. This indicates further that the victim was very much conscious before or after the ligatures were affixed to his wrists and ankles. We know that the victim drowned, that is to say that hemorrhagic edema fluid was present in the victim’s lungs, as well as in the victim’s mouth, indicating that the victim was breathing when he was placed into the 2ft of water in the drainage ditch at Robin Hood Hills.
Together, these facts, again, suggest that the purpose of the ligatures in this victim’s case was to keep the victim from moving around or being able to swim should he regain consciousness once he had been thrown into the water. It is this examiner’s opinion that the assailant in this case demonstrated all manner of awareness and cognizance at this location. The assailant knew that this victim was not dead when they threw this victim into the water, and that the ligatures would assist to complete the act of deliberate homicide should the victim become conscious.
Lack Of Injuries
There is again a lack of evidence to support any sort of strangulation. Dr. Peretti states that his examination of the neck of this victim revealed no injuries, and the photos that this examiner has seen support that conclusion.
Analysis: He missed the wound to Stevie Branch’s penis entirely. While not contained in his formal autopsy report, it was proven during the trial that Dr. Peretti’s colleague was called into evaluate what Turvey was calling “bite marks” and was ruled out. The fact that bite impressions did not match Echols, Baldwin or Miskelley was in no way exculpatory, and I will save you the bite by some animal with a rough tounge report nonsense I had to read .
The 3” fracture at the base of the skull, which “spiderwebbed” into subsequent fractures, also very likely severed his spinal cord, so one must assume this injury was also quite perimortem.
Steve ‘s left face was found to be abraded on the entire left side, and is consistent with someone either stomping on right side of his neck and fracturing it, with an obvious boot print, if the left side of the face was on the ground.
The gouging wounds- likely had to be inflicted following the fracture due to the lack of hemorrhage in comparison to the severity of the wound, and all experts agreed the injury was likely perimortem. So the question becomes- why?
Seems like a very important question, second only to what caused the trauma, based on the constellation of terminal injuries already inflicted on him. Wouldn’t the only thing left to do at that point be to submerge him?
It is my theory- therein lies the problem. Byers was put in the ditch first, and we know he was already deceased, therefore, he sinks. Stevie Branch is placed in the water next to him, and he either begins moving or floats and the suspects thinks he is still alive, and uses an implement to force him into the ditch bottom until he succumbs and stays submerged. I will leave out the specifics of the gouging wound as to why I think that resulted in the usage of the other end of the ice axe on Michael Moore. The luminol result, found in the ditch bed itself, after it was drained, slightly downstream from Byers and Branch, but still upstream from Moore could also support this theory. We know that Byers had already bled out, but Branch was still alive when he was put into the water and the only significant bleeding wound on his person capable of leaving blood evidence in the bottom of the ditch to survive it simply being washed away in the creek, there is a high degree of probability he bled directly into the dirt. He was found face down.
Christopher Byers
Christopher Byers autopsy found here.
It should be noted that this victim’s injuries were the most extensive, most violent, and most overtly sexual of the all the victims in this case. The nature and extent of this victim’s wounds indicate that the assailant spent the most time with this victim.
Additionally, this victim’s toxicology report revealed non-therapeutic levels of carbamazepine in the blood. All of these differences are very important, and will be explored in the later sections of this report.
Wound Pattern Analysis
There are numerous violent, traumatic injuries to this victim’s head, specifically to the base of the skull. There was also evidence of the violent emasculation of the victim’s sex organs, extensive lacerations and bruising to the victim’s buttocks, as well as numerous superficial scratches, abrasions, and contusions noted throughout the rest of his body. Dr. Peretti also noted that there were numerous healed injuries of varying nature on this victim. Dr. Peretti, however, did not note the presence of defensive wounds.
Again, this indicates a violent, overpowering attack on this victim that he was unable to put up resistance against. The general constellation of wounds to this victim is more advanced, more extensive, more overtly sexually oriented and includes the use of a knife.
This knife was used not only to inflict multiple stabbing and cutting injuries to the victim’s inner thighs and genital area, it was used in the emasculation process. There is, unmentioned in either the ME’s or Coroner’s reports, what appears to be a clear impression of the knife handle on the right side of the large gaping defect left behind after the removal of the victims penis, scrotal sac, and testes. This was impression was created when the knife was thrust full length into the victim by the assailant, during the process of emasculation. This indicates forceful, violent thrusts. The nature of this emasculation, as indicated by these wounds, is neither skilled nor practiced. It was a rageful, careless, but purposeful act carried out in anger.
It is the opinion of this examiner that this injury would have resulted in massive, uncontrollable blood-loss, from which the victim could not have survived without immediate medical attention.
It should also be pointed out that the nature of the stab wounds inflicted on the victim’s genital area, separate from those received during the emasculation process, show marked irregular configuration and pulling of the skin. This indicates that either the knife was being twisted as the assailant stabbed the victim, or that the victim was moving as the blade was withdrawn.
The second set of injuries is described as five superficial cutting wounds on the left buttock (pictured on the left in this photo at the right). It should be noted that these injuries are actually lacerations, as indicated by the bridging between the open tissue, and the irregular edges. Both indicators are apparent upon close examination of the photographs. It is the opinion of this examiner that this set of injuries is most consistent with the parental whipping given to Chris Byers by Mark Byers. It is further the opinion of this examiner that after having received this set of injuries, which tore open the skin and would have resulted in some severe bleeding, the victim would have been unable to walk or ride a bicycle without incredible pain and discomfort.
The third set of injuries is the multiple linear superficial interrupted cuts on the right buttock region (pictured in the photo above on the right). These injuries are not consistent with having been made by a belt as they are cuts. The edges are not irregular, and the cuts are interrupted, again indicating movement by the victim or the assailant during the attack.
Furthermore, there is the existence of bruised ovoid compression injuries all over this victim’s inner thigh that could be suction type bite marks. Since the ME may have missed this crucial evidence, other areas of his body may show bite mark evidence as well. The autopsy photos of this victim supplied to this examiner were not of sufficient quality to make an absolute determination of any kind, and would require a thorough examination by a qualified forensic odontologist for an informed, conclusive analysis.
Bite mark evidence is very important in any criminal case because it demonstrates behavior and lends itself to individuation. It can reveal to an examiner who committed the act, because bite marks can be as unique as fingerprints and positively identify a suspect. And, once established, it also reveals the act itself; biting. The shoelace ligatures used to restrain this victim did leave deep furrows, and also did leave patterned abrasions on both the wrists and ankles. This indicates that the victim was struggling while the ligatures were in place. This indicates further that the victim was very much conscious before or after the ligatures were affixed to his wrists and ankles.
We know that this victim did not drown, that is to say that no hemorrhagic edema fluid was present in the victim’s lungs, or well in the victim’s mouth. This indicates that the victim was already dead when he was placed into the 2? ft of water in the drainage ditch at Robin Hood Hills. This is, again, very different from the other two victims in this case.
Dr. Richard Souviron forensic odontologist: all mutilation is peri and post mortem, no knife was used.
On a final note, Mr. Hale states in his supplemental report on Chris Byers that there is a stab wound on his head. This is actually incorrect, and rectified by Dr. Peretti who states in his autopsy report of Chris Byers that the same injury is a 1¼-inch laceration to the left parietal scalp.
There is also, again, a lack of mosquito bites to this victim, which, as mentioned earlier, suggests that he received his injuries elsewhere first. This because the injuries took time to inflict, time during which many mosquito bites would have been received, even after death.
Additionally, unlike Steve Branch, there is no overkill present in this victim’s face. That is to say that this is another of the marked differences between the killings of Steve Branch and Chris Byers which is very important to note, and which will be explored more thoroughly in this report.
Recommendations
It is apparent from the physical evidence in this case that Chris M. Byers was attacked with sudden, violent force from which he defended himself in only a limited fashion. It appears as though this attack took place, at least in part, while his cloths were off and while the shoelace ligatures restrained him. He was sexually assaulted (an assault of a sexual nature, to areas of the body considered to be sexual, that does not include sexual penetration), and associated stab wounds indicate that he may have been conscious during several phases of the attack.
Analysis: How does he miss that the dosage of (car) was sub therapeutic, meaning below the level at which he was described and confuse it as non-therapeutic, in his estimation, as a possible means to subdue him. He completely missed the fact that it is likely that the level, found in his blood, was greatly reduced because there was very little blood volume left in his body. AND, it was a prescribed medication. Turvey does not mention the other factors that support Byers died first, and he died quickly and violently. While he did have stomach contents, he did not have any urine in his blatter and there was substantative evidence his bowels had evacuated at the scene, commonly a result of an immediate violent death.
Consensus or Conundrum- Depends Who You Ask
Regardless of which expert one believes, within the confines of each report, is the absence of the belief with any certainty that the “Baldwin” serrated knife was used. What they all agree on, is that the gouging injuries to Branch and Byers were very similar. They all agree that there was evidence of blunt force trauma, significant curvilinear fractures, what is commonly referred to in Forensic Pathology today as “chop wounds”, other sharp force trauma.
Thoughts onPost Mortem Animal Predation
I agree it is possible that snapping turtles could have caused what looks to be possible claw marks and at least one possible bite mark. I am emphasizing possible because I don’t think one can rule out animal predation 100%
Bryn Ridge himself testified he has seen snapping turtles in that area, some time ago. That said, there was not so much as a crawfish found in that creek as it was being pumped out, and that included a screen.
Dr. Spitz went as far as to suggest that somehow a carnivore of some kind was the cause of the animal predation although all oter evidence suggests that the boys were completely submerged, as well as their clothing, and there was obviously no animal tracks or other artifacts at the scene that would make that theory sound anything remotely believable. Thankfully, he stopped short of suggesting that a new breed of homicidal carnivores with a cleaner crew who could walk upright was responsible.
Fortunately I Dressed For Bushwhacking
Starting with one of the most important parts of the autopsy evidence, is the very fact that detectives knew VERY LITTLE about it outside of the cause of death, until late May at the earliest. So little in fact, that Gary Gitchell, Lead Investigator, wrote a list of follow up questions to the crime lab on May 26. (need link here)
Frank J. Peretti, MD preformed all three autopsies on May 7, 1993, and filed reports on May 10th for cause of death only. Those causes of death btw, were all listed as homicide by multiple injuries, period. Nobody knew that two boys died from drowning, and not all three. This is particularly concerning because the first conversation that Steve Jones and Det Sudbury had with Damien Echols was on May 7th prior to autopsy and in his subsequent interview with Det Bryn Ridge on May 10, when asked by Ridge how he knew about that, Echols told Ridge that Jones told HIM that whoever did this “urinated” in the mouths of the boys.
Urine was found in the stomachs of 2 of the victims, but that information was given by phone only to Gitchell, and not before May 16th, 1993. There is no possible way Damien Echols could have had case- specific information unless he was there or knew someone that was that told him what occurred, as the detective interviewing him at the time was clueless to that fact during the interview.
There are certainly many statements by both Echols and Miskelley prior to arrest that indicate they had prior knowledge of the murders, but I have been able to ride the see saw on those for the most part, like many.
The fact that Echols knew that there was urine in the stomachs of two victims, when it was intentionally ommitted from the report can only mean he was there, or knew someone who was, and in my opinion, both.
To be continued, West Memphis Three Part III
Sources:
Crime lab Index: http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/img/crimelab.html
Chris Byers autopsy:
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/autcb.html
Michael Moore:
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/autmm.html
Stevie Branch:
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/autsb.html
Turvey Report: http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/b_turvey_profile.html
Related Posts
Related Posts:
1,388 Comments
RSS feed for comments on this post. TrackBack URI
Ragdoll says:
September 27, 2011 at 12:48 am
I could share infinite stories about mental illness and medication. I fear it might come across as self indulgent.
_________
Ragdoll, one thing you could not ever be is self indulgent. You are helping so many by sharing your experience and your knowledge, and you’re doing it so selflessly. Thank you, Ragdoll and ATG also, to whom I say it was a most wonderful thing you did by caring so much for the friend of your son that you went out of your way to go in search of him. You, too, deserve thanks for caring so much.
___________
Blink says:
September 28, 2011 at 12:02 pm
You know, Blink, maybe LE just doesn’t want to admit that they lost that too?
@ mom 3.0
Of course not, can u confirm u got.this?
I have posted several times I cannot access my system on location and can only use my Droid.
My fault , my apologies.
yep this one posted- thanks- Dont worry about the others – they can wait till you get back -
Yes- I read your posts about being on location- I guess your droid does not like my style of writing LOL-
Take care See you when u get back
Noones fault- just one of those things I guess
Lol
Nope. It does not like me at all.
Here is.a funny. At the hotel their is a Verizon convention.
No help whatsoever. Do your missing posts say awaiting moderation ?
ha ha – can you hear me Now?
Yes they are still sitting in moderation staring back at me in a mocking manner…LOL
I am not sure if the last one you held on purpose… the one you just responded to, but it too is sitting in moderation and has not posted- the one from 9:33 pm
Go figure?
@mom 3.0
Aaaah! Frustrating to say the least. In word press on the Droid I can’t comment directly under, although my dashboard gives the impression I can.
I have a firewall admin issue I was not aware of when we converted a few months ago , and is a total pain in the add for travel and due to some of the files I need to work with, my settings will not allow me to use a hotel network.
Sorry , I know it is a total pain in the ass, wanted to give you a more complete answer. As to why it seems to hold some in mod, I have no earthly idea, it is my nemesis.
Hello Blink and Blinkers! I want to share a video with you all that i saw and wich i could have posted in the CA blog or in many other posts. This show us a woman that you surely all know. Anne Perry takes responsability of what she has done and talks about the importance to do such to move forwards and grow as a person.
Ann Perry was interviewed on being forced to face-up to reality by being sent to jail for the murder:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_oYT9mvChw
GraceintheHills says:
September 26, 2011 at 1:10 pm
Hi Grace, just wanted you to know that I did not intentionally leave off the last page of DE discharge notes. I am very familiar with term provisional diagnosis (my sweet pea daughter has had many in search for answers). I’m sorry the last page didn’t get linked. It seems like DE took his meds consistently during this admission, and the dosage was increased. His bizarre and unusual behavior was not noted during the admission (other than biting someone) and the therapists concluded he was just depressed during his stay.
mom3.0 sept 24, 1:24 pm
Hi Mom, I’m having difficulty posting this reply, so I will keep it short and see if I can make it happen! It seems like there is alot confusion about how to classify these murders, and that can be interpretted as the prosecution was way off base, or ignorant, or (fill in an adjective). Do you know what the reasons are that LE now says no to the satanic rituals? In other words, have they tried to redefine or classify the murders as something else?
As for evidence, Im wondering what you think about Damiens comments about the killings in his 5/10/93 interview? How the penis is a symbol of power, the number 3 is significant, innocent children more power from ,etc? I think he was relating this to his understandings of his wiccan beliefs? Though he did not admit to the murders, this is evidence, right? If Im wrong and this was not admissable, my bad. see link.
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/dwe.html
thanks for your thoughts.
Somebody should’ve been thinking schizoaffective with DE imo.
Hi Blink,
You said:
Her original statement was that Joe left her the night of the murders, which I believe. So how could they both be there on the alternative night she said joe left her, and was also his birthday.
————
The way I read it, she originally said that Joe left her on the 4th, Tuesday. But, then she said she realized it was a later date than that because she remembered his birthday cake was on the table, and his birthday is not until the 9th.
It seems more likely to me that they were all together at the Sanders on the 5th, and they separated after that.
LE is trying to say that they were at the Sanders on the 9th, which wouldn’t make sense either way, IMO. If they separated on the 4th or 5th, they wouldn’t all be together at the Sanders on the 9th.
By all accounts I have read (some of which are included in my earlier post), it seems to me that Pam, Joe, Damien and Michelle were all at the Sanders on the night of the murders, during the time the murders would have been committed.
respectfully, I disagree. Randy Sanders was in the process of being accused of sex abuse by a witness, and was awaiting trial/disposition in a sexual offense. That said, he was the only source of income from his disability in this family, and we must also consider neither Echols NOR Hutchison would testify to this alibis at trial.
And, no, Pam statement was that Joe left her on the 4th, the night before the murders, not the night of them, or 5/5.
In terms of likely, if that is the standard, it is certainly more likely the first account is more accurate, and we should also consider that Pam was never sure when she picked up the script, in fact, she originally said she dropped if off and picked it up the next day. Damien himself stated he could not remember where he was that day, during trial, and he was intimating he would tell detectives “what happened” prior to his conversation with her, whereby she told him they had “alibis”.
That is a[particularly odd use of the word, instead of “There is no way you were involved, we are at (such and such).
Sanders was most recently incarcerated in GA. I do not find people that are willing to rip off the Govt and and simultaneously rob from others in conjunction with other crimes, a believable person, and the note that Pam left Sandy was also never produced.
B
The following is a link to retired FBI Special Agent, John Douglas’s, comments regarding his analysis of this case:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DezJ0SUFgc&NR=1
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Rose says:
September 29, 2011 at 12:03 pm
Somebody should’ve been thinking schizoaffective with DE imo.
@Rose, with all due respect, the absence of any documented psychotic signs or symptoms precludes the diagnosis of Schizoaffective Disorder.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
9. kathy says:
September 29, 2011 at 11:04 am
mom3.0 sept 24, 1:24 pm
Hi Mom, I’m having difficulty posting this reply, so I will keep it short and see if I can make it happen! It seems like there is alot confusion about how to classify these murders, and that can be interpretted as the prosecution was way off base, or ignorant, or (fill in an adjective). Do you know what the reasons are that LE now says no to the satanic rituals?
@Kathy, I realize you have specially addressed your question to Mom3.0, and I’m sure she will answer, but I believe John Douglas, in the above link, also provides an answer to your question about why LE now says no to the satanic ritual. I find it very interesting that the WMPD tried to float that “theory” past the FBI in 1993-94, and were basically advised not to do so.
Grace- it pains me to say this, but, imo, SA Douglas was given data on behalf of the defense, as an expert witness for them in this case, with the full knowledge that Byers and Hobbs were in the cross-hairs as potential suspects.
His analysis actually contradicts his own teachings over the years. That said, he is one the most gifted profilers out there, and a tribute to his “science”, and nobody is 100%. I note that we have not heard from him since the pleas.
B
Blink- thanks for the explanation. I will just try to post short comments, maybe that will help. BTW I often use firefox perhaps that has something to do with it?
To everyone that addressed a post or question to me in the past days- i have answered the posts just havent gone thru yet- ill wait till Blink gets back to her captains chair before trying again.
Mom- everything is up, 100%, at the date/time you posted it.
B
Okay,…I am officially confused.
What are the date’s of the missing post’s that are now posted?
(did that make sense?) I know how much effort you all put into what you write, and I hate feeling like I’m out of the loop. Also, was it
just Mom 3.0 and Grace’s post that were missing, or are there other’s as well?
Everything is posted, and it posts the date and time when they wrote it, not when moderated so we are all set.
B
Kathy, hi.
Thanks for asking for my thoughts.
To me, it is not strange that DE would have answered those questions in that way, afterall he had researched and read a # of books and said that he was exploring various religious teachings ect..
Even someone with a rudimentary interest in Wicca or other religions/ early belief systems- would have been able to formulate much the same answers to these questions.
To me, the only solid evidence here is pointing toward DE’s reading comprehension skills, & his openness, & perhaps narcistic need to share his knowledge base – in other words-not hiding his reading habits and what he had learned- He shared what knowledge he had garnered through books ect. What is that proof of exactly- even in the way of his “occult” knowledge?
IMO Not a whole lot, when you look at what he “knew” and shared
Ill try to explain in part 2 Cont-
AJMO
Hurrah! Blinks back in bold and all is right with the world!!! Yeah-
Thanks Blinky, for finding them and posting them- be careful what you wish for sheesh so many errors…How do you read thru this mind numbing stuff Blink? LOL.
Blink I appreciate it and all you do!
Hi kathy- -heres part 2
You wrote in part-
As for evidence, Im wondering what you think about Damiens comments about the killings in his 5/10/93 interview? How the penis is a symbol of power, the number 3 is significant, innocent children more power from ,etc? I think he was relating this to his understandings of his wiccan beliefs? Though he did not admit to the murders, this is evidence, right?
–Kathy, a phallus has been a symbol of power/life/energy/ throughout many cultures and believe systems this belief-is not new nor is it based in Wiccan beliefs only-
here is a book that discusses these teachings ect.
http://www.amazon.com/Phallus-Sacred-Symbol-Creative-Power/dp/0892815566
Kathy the # 3 has always been a significant # not in just “occult” teachings but in other religious belief systems as well:
Snipped:
Many world religions contain triple deities or concepts of trinity, including:
* the Christian Holy Trinity
* the Hindu Trimurti
* the Hindu Tridevi
* the Three Jewels of Buddhism
* the Three Pure Ones of Taoism
* the Triple Goddess of Wicca
Catholicism and Christianity the # was important- as shown with the 3 wise men, and again with the Holy Family: Mary, Joseph, and Jesus- also represented through the 3 men that were crucified- Jesus and the 2 criminals… also with the Holy virtues: Faith, Hope and Love… also important when discussing the After life- with Heaven, Hell and Purgatory…
In other religious beliefs 3 is shown as important too.
In Judiasm
and with the three Patriarchs: Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and The Tanakh has 3 sections: Torah, Nevi’im, and Ketuvim
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3_%28number%29
And as for Children sacrifices yeilding greater power ect this too is held in many belief systems for example think of the story of Cain and Able, God did not look favorably on Cains offering of vegetables, as shown by the fire simmering and smoking not blazing as with Able offering of an animal- well we all can understand that Fat causes fires to burn- and along these same thoughts who is more “fat” a lean adult or a chubby baby?…also children are seen as more pure, closer to God- and more cherished and a “greater sacrifice- think Abraham on the mountain with his son….would not a “greater” sacrifice yield a better offering to your “god” and therefore a more abundant gift of thanks from God?
AJMO
Cont part 3
Blink~ In your response to Grace on Sept. 28th you said:
Moore was tied differently, and with one shoelace, presumably from his own shoe, as the other had the only remaining shoelace in it. He was tied right hand to left foot and vice versa.
Respectfully,…that is NOT what the coroners report say’s.
All 3 were tied left to left,…right to right.
From Kent Hale’s report:
Body #1
Body is on the east ditch bank
Right hand is tied to the right ankle by shoe lace, left hand is tied to the left ankle by
shoe lace.
Lacerations to head
Body lying on side lividity in buttocks and back will blanch with pressure
Rigor is set but can not tell to what degree due to limbs being tied body placed in sheet and transported
Body #2
Body is on the west ditch bank lying on left side
Right hand is tied to the right ankle by shoe lace, left hand is tied to the left ankle
Lacerations to face and neck
Lividity in left buttocks and back will blanch with pressure
Rigor is set but can not tell to what degree due to limbs being tied Body placed in sheet and transported
Body #3
Body is on the west ditch bank lying on right side
Right hand is tied to the right ankle left hand is tied to the left ankle
Body has been Emasculated
Lividity in buttocks and back will blanch with pressure
Rigor is set but can not tell to what degree due to limbs being tied
Body placed in sheet and transported
All three bodies show signs of post mortem staining in face and chest.
Also, while I am at it….I have a question about the lividity.
How it is that they all had lividity on their back’s and buttocks if they drowned face down in the ditch?
Please note: I am NOT trying to be snarky here, and I apologize if I am coming off as such….I am just trying to understand is all.
Kathy
At the risk of having to duck for cover, I am going to give you an opinion of the so called Satanic cult idea.
One of the investigators, Mr. Jones, was heavily into trying to understand the behavior and proceedures associated with the various satanic groups. I think this guy is like a carpenter that has only two tools in his toolbox. The carpenter is severly limited in what he can build. Likewise Mr. Jones is severely limited in what he can investigate. He wants to include his favorite subject in every investigation.
And Blink thinks she might get help from Verizon. This company is made up mostly of General Telephone with some new acquisitions and assumed a new name to improve their image. Unless one gets to personally know the local outside plant supervisor, you are going to have problems getting technical help. The repair guys are great, but the management people are hard to deal with.
I hope you have figured out what the firewall is doing. There is a way to remotely administer Word Press,but the firewall issue may have you blocked. ☺ ♪♫
@ATG
Techs fixed my problem and thank you.
B
@ mjh
Echols’s alibi is bs. Echols himself admitted on stand that he was lying about it.
“Q. As time moves on and the time period that is in question becomes later that evening, the visit to the Sanders’ becomes later that evening, correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. So the story kind of changes to fit the facts we need to cover, right?
A. Yes, sir.”
From what’s been said and released about Piers Morgan’s show, it’ll be same old, same old… Not that I’m surprised, just very much sick of it. I wish just once someone would ask them some real questions.
@Blink
Well, I wasn’t saying that Randy Sanders was a nice guy or anything. He isn’t the only one accused of sexual abuse in this cast of characters, nor was he the only one on disability. It seemed to be a way of life for a lot of these people. I don’t agree with any of it, and I wouldn’t be running out giving character references for any of these people.
However, Randy was not who I was referring to. Michelle Echols, Jennifer Sanders, Stacy Sanders, and Meredith McKay, all said that Damien was at the Sanders’ house on 5/5/93, and they all mentioned 90210 being on at the time.
Debbie McKay, who is Meredith’s mother, and clearly did not like Damien, also said it was a Wednesday night, because she was off work, they were watching 90210, and she saw Pam going into the house across the street, however, she wasn’t sure who was with her.
Michelle, Jennifer, Stacy, Meredith and Debbie also said that Susan and Randy had gone to Splash.
Susan Sanders said that the night they went to Splash was 5/5/93. She knew this because Randy’s disability check came on the 3rd, and they used some of that money.
Stacey mentioned that 90210 was a special show, it was one of the last ones of the season (which is correct), and that she thought it was the Prom episode. As I said in my previous post, I looked it up, and the Prom episode of 90210 “A Night To Remember” aired on 5/5/93.
This is why I was saying that it seemed more likely that this was the night, not going by only Pam Hutchison’s statements.
LE decided it must have been the night of the 9th that they went to Splash, but 90210 was not on on Sundays.
Aside from Damien and Pam saying they were at the Sanders this particular night, there are 6 other people confirming it. All of these people would have to be lying.
I do realize that Pam was not sure when she picked up the prescription. I think Michelle must have remembered that, and told her. As far as the note Pam wrote to Susan,Susan said she threw it away, which is what most people would do, and I doubt is was dated anyway. Even if they presented the note, I don’t know if it would prove anything as far as the date.
I would really like to know where the phone records are for the night in question. Did they check phone records? Are they documented? I haven’t been able to find any so far.
Mom3.0
You may have a point about your experience in a classroom and childrens dress and behavior. However, I spent eight years teaching music, after I retired, both in the classroom and private lessons.
I found that most of the time, the way children, ages twelve to eighteen, dressed was a very good clue as to how they would behave and how much they would contribute to the classroom experience. It also told me how concerned the parents were regarding the behavior of the child.
I also know that children will take their cue from the adult. If they percieve that you are not going to put up with nonsense, they will meet your expectations. In addition, many times in a sixth grade music class, the teacher must work with one or more children that are having mental problems. It is hard on the teacher, but the school and parents want the child to have the musical experience.
Xara says:
September 29, 2011 at 2:22 pm
Hi Xara, this is what I thought, also. I was going to go back and look again, but I guess now I don’t have to.
Thank you.
The knots were tied differently, though. So, just the different type of knots makes it seem like there were at least two people there. Unless one of the little boys, themselves, tied the first knots. Possibly something boy scouts are taught, I’m not sure.
I guess it’s also possible that a lone murderer tied them all, but the first one took too long, so he just did it more quickly with the other two.
Although, I do think that the one tied with the square knots was the one who was tied with only one lace, broken or cut into two pieces, which would make it appear that this is the one he was trying to save time on. I am not sure on this, though. I would have to go back and look.
Blink, Do not want to be pushy but do you post a third part of this case?
It is a bit sad that you are not in Germany because there are here also 2 cases of young ladies that disapeared where law enforcement will not continue in the investigation and with your blog your brain and the brain from all others here it would certainly have been very helpful. The two girls deserve it as dearly as they are.
continued part 3
Hi kathy me again- having trouble posting this one- trying again-
kathy, I am not saying that this “evidence” was not admissible, obviously it was, what I am saying is, it was not evidence of guilt in anyway- not when looking at “in and of itself” “or when taken “all together” in its totality… it still equals diddly squat in the way of “evidence”. IMO
DE’s knowledge and sharing of this knowledge does not prove that he was a evil witch or misguided wiccan-who killed these children, nor does it prove him to be a satanist or a dabbling devil worshiper,who was apt to kill these children. Taken “in and of itself” or in its totality, it doesnt even prove he was on the “dark side”
No evidence was ever collected at the scene ect, which pointed to these murders being a satanic ritualistic killing, or to a murder wrapped up in misguided “occult trappings”
Despite what was said in the closing arguments by the prosecution IRT religion being the motivation for many a killing throughout history, there was no evidence to show these murders were perpetrated by anyone who was even remotely motivated by religion in any form- not to Buddhism, not to Wicca and not to an Old testament sacrifice to God, ect.
All this occult “evidence” the clothes, the writings, the poems, the music, the drawings- do not go towards guilt, nor to prove anything, not motive, not poor character… these things were brought up inorder to make DE and JB “fit” into the theory, you know, the one SJ believed and the one JM “confessed” to, with his tales of dog eating, orgy having, doppelganger DE the briefcase wielding head hancho of the “cult”…
kathy, I do not know when the prosecution/state changed their thinking that these crimes were not Satanic ritualistic crimes or when they stopped thinking the motive was occult in nature…-
I do not know exactly when the State/LE ect came to this understanding. Perhaps it is when they took a step back and realized none of the evidence supports that theory- despite Sjones immediate belief that these were satanic ritualistic murders committed by DE.
In fact, according to Blinks first article- many did not want the prosecution to present this “evidence” from day 1, certainly not as motive, and I would think, not at all now, since everyone seems to now agree that these murders were not wrapped in “occult trappings” either-
All we have is Jesse saying this was happening, and we have possibly some candle wax on a victims shirt, and we have a whole lot of hearsay and JD and SJ beliefs that their was a cult in the area and that DE was the leader of it.…
Here is what Blink wrote in her first article:
http://blinkoncrime.com/2011/08/15/the-west-memphis-three-series-part-i-set-free-or-where-they-should-be
snipped:
Satanic Panic. Throw that phrase into any equation and I already do not believe it. This crime was in no way connected to a cult or an offering of sacrifice of any kind.
In December 2008 I had an opportunity to consult with retired 35 year FBI Behavioral Science Unit chief, Special Agent Ken Lanning, in a different case that showed elements of “Satanism”.
If he says there is no ritual activity associated with this crime, there is no better authority, and he does.
It should be noted prior to the prosecution phase of the murders, the FBI advised John Fogleman not to proceed with that angle as the motive.
-end quote-
Thanks for asking for my thoughts kathy, I look forward to reading more of yours.
as always AJMO
Just finished watching the WM-2 (minus Jessie as we knew it would be) on Piers Morgan. Piers made a statement that Jessie declined the invitation.
As expected it was the same nausea regurgitated spin.
57 minutes of questions centered around what did you think at the time and how was your stay in prison like it was a vacation. . 3 minutes of where do you go from here.
As expected, Damien plugged the fact that there is talk of a petition being started to present to the governor for a pardon from the crimes.
I’m still in the process of catching up; but, Whoo Hoo! 925 comments and growing! You can’t post Part lll now, Blink, until after it hits 1000! Please say you won’t!
ATG, I swear, you are the most fascinating man! There’s nary a thing you don’t know a whole lot about! It seems every time I read something you’ve written, I’ve learned something!
Mom3.0 says:
September 29, 2011 at 2:22 pm
Mom3, I’m anxiously awaiting your own Part lll!
GraceintheHills says:
September 29, 2011 at 12:54 pm
You know, I just don’t get it. I really don’t. All of this focus now upon Terry Hobbs and that strand of hair that may not be his at all, and if it is, it could have been transferred via one of the children. They were all in and out of the Hobb’s house. Neither Terry nor Jacoby had a motive to bo
There was, imo, so much more reason to suspect Byers, from the beating Christopher had already suffered at his hands and Mark’s continued anger, to the blood on his knife he lied about, time and again, which in my opinion is stronger than a hair in a shoestring that matches a good percentage of the population. Unfortunate for Byers the blood on the knife matches a his own and that of a dead child he wasn’t related to.
IMO, and I’d sure like to know yours, Hobb’s is just being used as a scapegoat now, for the soul purpose of taking the attention off of Byers, now that Byers has become such a supporter. I have read at supporter sights and there are those who yet suspect Byers. Be that as it may, have you (or any one else for that matter) ever heard Damien Echols accuse any one else of having committed this crime? The few times I have watched his interviews I don’t recall hearing him specifically name Hobbs, though at one point in the way back he did specifically name Byers.
Just curious, and would like your thoughts on Hobbs.
I caught the last 20 min. of Piers Morgan. I knew it would be the WM2, not 3. Jesse just isn’t going to speak publicly, is he? Are Jason and Damien mad at him or are they afraid of what he will say? Just makes me wonder.
Dear Blink, could you give us an estimation of when part 3 will come out? Are we talking days, weeks, months? Just kinda want to get an idea of when to look for it. Thanks.
Lucy says:
September 29, 2011 at 3:45 pm
Hi Lucy
I actually didn’t take it that way. When Damien gave his statement that he was at the Sanders on the day in question, he said he thought it was between 3 and 5. If you look at all the statments of people he was with at the Sanders that night, it was closer to 7pm. So, he had the time wrong.
I probably wouldn’t remember an exact time I was someplace either, when first questioned. Unless there was a reason to remember, like if I had to be home when my son gets home from school, so I know it was before 2:15, etc. Just like all the girls remembered 90210 was on, which pinpointed the time.
If you asked me today what I did on Wednesday, I don’t think I would be able to tell you. I could try to remember, and tell you what I remember, but it probably wouldn’t be exact. If it is important enough to remember, like, say I was being charged with a murder that happened that day, I’m sure as I thought more about it, and was reminded by other people that I was with them that night, at a certain time, then I would realize what I originally said was inaccurate or incomplete. My details would change a little too.
Damien didn’t know what time he was there that day. It got pushed back because all of the people he was with knew it was 7 pm. I don’t think the story changed to fit the facts. I think the lawyer was trying to make him look bad, as lawyers often do.
I think Damien was being honest. He didn’t remember, and people had reminded him. So, the time got pushed back.
The owner of webkookths announced that she and her co-owner were now moderators of the WM3 threads. She also announced that she had “chills” thinking that Damien might have been executed because he is innocent. She and her co-owner are actively trying to stop the non-supporters from posting anything against the WM3. Thank you, Blink, for posting the facts and allowing non-supporters to state our opinions and share facts. You are awesome!
Who is webkooths?
Angellica says:
September 30, 2011 at 3:37 am
I caught the last 20 min. of Piers Morgan. I knew it would be the WM2, not 3. Jesse just isn’t going to speak publicly, is he? Are Jason and Damien mad at him or are they afraid of what he will say? Just makes me wonder.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Piers Morgan made the statement that Jessie was invited to participate in the interview, but had declined.
I do not blame Jessie for declining, if that is the truth and he was actually invited.
Jessie’s “mental retardation” was discussed within the first 5 minutes of the interview.
In my opinion, Jessie is not going to be comfortable sitting in on an interview that is going to be televised to the nation, knowing that the topic is going to turn to his mental shortcomings.
Memphis Two (and a wife) on Piers Morgan tonight CNN
wow, so, it was advertised ,i read it with my own two eyes ,that jessie would be be speaking with piers morgan via satellite from arkansas,and no show.yeah!, his silence says everything,for now.i read a comment on piers blog that jessie never agreed in the first place.false advertising? i couldnt sleep cuz i thought jessie was gonna recant.bravo,jessie, keep it real.someone posting there said jessie’s iq is 88 and he has enrolled in community college to get his ged.
@susanm
Methinks maybe someone took my suggestion to help Jessie in his PR efforts. Also, to my knowledge the entire announcement was disingenuous. Why would Jesse be satellite and the other two on the set?
Just review their plea agreements. They made sure that would not happen.
I sincerely hope Jessie is getting PR help. Somewhere down the road I expect Baldwin to see the light also. This is the Echols show. Blink, if this petition to the Arkansas Governors does happen, how about a petition for sticking with the condition under which they were released.
Hi Morgan- my part 3 is up- just wanted to jump in on my thoughts on secondary transfer of hair from TH to MM- I agree this coul have happened- but I think in this situation it is harder to come to this conclusion…Why? Because TH was in the ligature of MM bindings- not just lying about- these were shoelaces that were pulled from the shoes of the little boys, through several eyelits- how is it that an “innocent hair could have survived the removal through each hole, then the forcible binding,ries and the submersion ect? To me it seems unlikely. This doesnot mean I think TH killed them, IDK who did…
TGF- Hello, thanks for conceding my point. I guess we just have different perspectives built from our own experiences with working with children.
xara- thanks for asking about my posts. Thanks so much for bringing over those excerpts from the autopsies. That is very interesting about the lividity- how is it possible that the victims would have this on their backs and buttocks when they were put in the water face down/stomachs down while still alive? Doesnt seem to make sense.
mjh- thank you for sharing your very well thought out points ect. I really learn alot from your posts, and I tend to agree with so many of your perspectives. I too think Damiens supposed lack of a solid alibi is not that big of a deal- and I too take most every witness statements with a grain of salt- because so much is open to interpretation ect- and who can say which witness is correct ? Unfortunately, I do not think LE asked very good followup questions ect.
graceinthehills- hello- nice to be able to read all the thought provoking posts that were held in moderation LOL- again thank you for sharing your knowledge with us- I truly find it invaluable.
AJMO
On the lividity- the boys were laid on their backs on the bank, with the exception of Michael Moore, who was laid on his side. Damien is not the only one lacking an alibis, all 3 are, and Damien’s alibis witnesses, did not even agree with him, or each other. I agree that in general, a loose or non-existant alibis does not a case make, but what are the chances all 3 have none, and although there was well over a dozen initial suspects in this case, they are the only 3 that did not, for that period of time, regardless of Jessie’s real or perceived confusion, initially.
Anyone else find it odd that at no time have I heard Damien mention his son with Domini, or seeing him since he is out?
A compliment to those of you that do not share my certainty of the guilt of these three- your posts are intelligent, well researched, respectful, and compelling. Good Show.
B
When can we see part III?
Here is the transcript from the PM show.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1109/29/pmt.01.html
I watched the show, and I found it rather tame- I truly hope the 3 will continue to fight to find out who committed these crimes- if not, THAT would speak volumes to me-
I found JB to be quite PERSONABLE- and he seemed genuine- DE is still aloof, and intelligent- and I can not blame him for coming off as such- if one takes into account that he has been on death row for 10years-
I was happy to hear JB has a job, and seems rather down to earth in his expectations. I worry that DE may have set his goals too high-wanting to find a job in the arts-
I had not realized that JB’s little brother was 8 at the time of the murders…
and I also found it sad that a Blue Oyster Cult album- was also shown as evidence in the trial…I wonder which one? Burning for you? Agents of Fortune? Some Enchanted Evening? All of them would cause an eyebrow or two to rise…. THE COVER ART IS “occultish” and I think rather COOL…. or at least I thought so when I was a teen.. sigh, I know I better be careful
For anyone looking for the facts or an unbaised or “non” point of view this show was not it-
Very lacking in both- and PM seemed to interrupt quite often…therefore not many questions answered either.
I do not know why Jesse didnt go on the show. It is part of the plea agreements that they do not hang out together with felons-
*IF* Jesse did falsely “confess” and IF he is barely over the threshold for being mentally “retarded”-then why is everyone so gung- ho about subjecting this guy to further scrutiny ect?
As for Jesse going to college and getting his GED I say good for him- he is less likely to “reoffend” if he can assimilate to the outside.
This education ect does not mean that Jesse does not still have developmental delay issues with his cognitive reasoning ect- many people who are mentally disabled to one degree or another, can successfully get an education and succeed at a career. Many of these students need aids, and certain modifications, and useful needed special accommodations- as the law does allow for these thanks to IDEA.
WE have come along way in the educational system from 20 years agao, and many may be surprised at how sucessful these children/adults can be- given the proper teaching learning stradegies , aids ect.
I also wanted to just state for the record that being developmentally delayed, or disabled, whether it is a person with Down syndrome or FAS ect- they want the same things out of life as adults ,as we do- they fall in love and have sexual needs and want families – being disabled does not mean that you can not have these things, and it does not mean that you wont be a good parent either- there are many special parents in this world.
ps- I just wanted to warn everyone out there that too much potassium can also cause heart-attacks- so it is best to talk to your doctor before changing your diets extensively.
AJMO and subject to change- sometimes frequently…
I do not know what is wrong with my caps lock sorry for all the shouting please disregaRd. Thanks
The key to maintaining the “WM3 are innocent” theme is held in the notion that Jessie Misskelly is retarded. Any variation from that and the case begins to crumble.
There was never any intention for Jessie to appear on Piers Morgan.
This is a “managed truth” from the top down.
@Blink, Sept. 30, 12:20:
Exactly. And remember, Scott Ellington agreed to it and the defense rationale purely was financial.
I imagine the handlers of Echols and Baldwin threated to pull out even if Jessie appeared via satellite. Given it was claimed he had the mind of a five year old, it would be hard to continue in that assertion after he answered a few questions. I had little use for Piers Morgan before last night and the fact he didn’t disclose the limitations placed on him, and we know they existed, diminished any credibility he had left.
@mom3.0 & @atg-
Thanks to you both for the posts and thoughts. Ive had to switch gears to a crime a little closer to home as my moms house was broke into yesterday. Wishing I had you all, blink and others to nail the sob’s, but am reminding myself that my mom wasnt hurt, so trying to keep it all in to perspective. I will rejoin this discussion when things settle down.
Dear Kathy,
I am sorry to hear of your Moms break in- I will keep you both in my thoughts and prayers. I am glad your momma was not hurt, at least not physically. I will look forward to you rejoining the discussion. Take care.
To Blink,
Webkookths=Websleuths
Lol, OOOHHH. Figures. Would be interested in knowing what Mr. Klaas opinion is of such sponsorship.
B
kathy says:
September 30, 2011 at 4:30 pm
@Kathy, so happy to hear your mom wasn’t hurt. Hope LE catches the culprits soon!
Morgan
Thanks for the compliment. I have spent a lifetime trying to learn as much as I can. As I told two of my french horn students one day “learning is fun when you learn how to learn”. They were in 7th grade and the look I got was pure perplexion. I don’t know if they ever figured it out.
And don’t think I am not learning from each of you as well. I spend a good amount of time examining the language used by all who post here. A great many of you are women and women do not think or express themselves the same way as men. So, I learn.
Kathy
I am sorry to learn of the break-in at your mothers home. From you post it appears as if she were home when the break-in happened. Robbers are going to watch a home prior to breaking in and if they think there is only a single person in the house, they will try it.
Maybe an alarm system would help. Many systems have video associated with them. Video can be transmitted over IP as you well know from watching video on your computer. Some company may have a method of transmitting video from her home to yours.