Kyron Horman Missing Case Breaking News: Remains Believed To Be Human Located Off Sauvie Island
Sauvie Island, Oregon-There are unconfirmed reports that a teenage boy fishing off of Sauvie Island located a human skull, and potentially other human body parts.
Update 1: As referenced on KOIN, a teenage fisherman believes he snagged a scalp with human hair attached, which he originally thought was horse hair. Columbia County detectives cordoned off the scene last evening and MCSO dive teams entered the water but found nothing. The possible “hair” was sent for testing.
Multnomah County Sheriff Office will not comment on the find, or confirm whether their office has facilitated the removal of same, or forwarded any items to the medical examiner for testing.
Following the disappearance of Kyron Horman, Sauvie Island has been the subject of repeated searchers for the missing Skyline second grader with no results.
It is also the former home of a man considered to be Federal fugitive following a confrontation with a Lincoln City officer with nearly fatal results. Officer Steven Dodds was able to return to duty after extensive rehabilitation.
Durham was a Sauvie Island resident for over 6 years and a volunteer fire fighter until he was removed from duty 6 months prior to the shooting.
David Durham’s dog was recovered injured following what appeared to be an accident in the suspects vehicle and is being cared for by a friend of the family. Mr. Durham has not been seen since his vehicle was recovered in the bay town of Waldport, Oregon.
Please check back to www.blinkoncrime.com for updates to this breaking story.
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T. Ruth says:
August 25, 2012 at 7:13 pm
FWIW, an audio from Bruce McCain discussing the civil/criminal case.
http://www.kxl.com/common/global_audio/418/73751.mp3
Interesting about the “double-edged sword” statement he makes.
————–
@T. Ruth- TY for sharing that, it was very helpful for my wee brain.
T. Ruth says: August 25, 2012 at 7:13 pm
———–
Interesting. I asked earlier if LE could be deposed. It sounds like they might be able to, which could cause problems with the investigation. It IS a “double-edged-sword.” It seems that the investigation continues to s-l-o-w-l-y move forward, so if LE is deposed it could show Terri their hand. However, it also seems that it might take years for their investigation to be solved, if it ever is. The civil case could, through witness depositions, get answers that are under Grand Jury wraps and help (because less evidence is necessary in a civil case) lead Desiree and Kaine to understand what might have happened. Tough call.
T. Ruth says: August 25, 2012 at 7:13 pm.
Interesting. This answers my question as to whether LE can be deposed. It sounds like they might be able to, which could cause problems with the investigation. It is a “double-edged-sword.” It seems that the investigation continues to s-l-o-w-l-y move forward.. In addition, if LE is deposed it could show Terri their hand. However, it also seems that it could take years for their investigation to be solved if it ever is. The civil case could, through witness depositions get answers that are under Grand Jury wraps and help (because less evidence is necessary in a civil case) lead Desiree and Kaine to understand what might have happened. Tough call.
I thought I heard the word Years
T. Ruth says:
August 25, 2012 at 7:13 pm
FWIW, an audio from Bruce McCain discussing the civil/criminal case.
http://www.kxl.com/common/global_audio/418/73751.mp3
Thanks T.Ruth. I usually avoid McCain, but this conversation was interesting.
I’m trying to picture Terri attending each deposition. Of course, she would have an attorney there with her. It will be interesting to see how Houze handles it – wonder if she can pick and choose which to attend or has to say she’s attending all or none. You would think he might need her help in his part of the interviewing, but maybe not. Can she decide not go but still see the tapes or read the transcripts? That would really add a lot more time to get through the process.
It would also be interesting to see the attorneys’ bills someday.
Seems these depositions would be videotaped. So much has been made of Terri’s body language in the past, you have to wonder what people (who have access to the tapes, if they happen) will be looking for even if she doesn’t say a word. Because of her silence and staying out of the public’s view, we tend to think of her as emotionless, I think, but that isn’t necessarily true. Would it be possible for her to sit through hours of listening to other people answering questions about the case, and still be expressionless?
Isn’t it also Desiree’s right to attend? I would think so.
Depositions are confidential. Are they allowed to go back to a previous witness if another witness brings up something that causes them to need more information? Or is it a “one-shot” deal? Does everybody need to be questioned under oath – or if someone testifies about something new, can ER simply and confidentially ask Kaine or LE about it “off the record”?
Just wondering.
Good questions MbS. Hopefully we’ll get some answers soon. I read the order again, and unless I’m missing it there’s no time limit given by Judge Kantor to the attorney’s for their responses to his 3 questions.? I wonder if they will be made public?
I am interested on who they can find like RS
The person who got the emails
School staff
Oh yes and there is Dede
And Kaine’s friends who told him info
The list goes on
Working?
Oh finally I see a moderation after 3 days!!!!!
Used my other email Blink, since for some reason the one I have always used isn’t working….
I am not finding him in that competition though Lauren.
B
I just want to bring this up again, because IMO it’s still a definite possibility. I can only hope and pray that LE got a list of who has old wells on their properties near that school and checked that all the old hand-dug wells were filled as I believe is required by law. Sometimes they’ve simply been overlooked, particularly if the place(s) have been on rental properties for years, or on properties that have been abandoned and the original homes are no longer there, because this is what can happen when they’re not:
Missing Roseburg woman, 82, found dead in well
http://www.kmtr.com/news/local/story/Missing-Roseburg-woman-82-found-dead-in-well/2fQPto8LB0K6jL8vrFUv4w.cspx?rss=191
@T Ruth
I remember when I was a kid
We were told about wells and were to stay away from them
They were not covered as they are now with concret
Still us kids would go out and try to look in them
An adventure
@T Ruth
It is pretty far out to think Kyron went to check out an old well
and throw rocks in them like we did
They did look like the pic in your post
And someone could have put him there
I agree they should be checked out
If there are some around
Houze may forever be linked with Terri Horman’s case – see below.
http://www.koinlocal6.com/news/local/story/Doctor-charged-in-late-night-surgery-death/1AQ3eUD9E0q-38D7_8C6OA.cspx
(snipped)
At the start of the procedure, Abbassian administered a local anesthesia to the patient who shortly thereafter started complaining of chest pain and shortness of breath, state medical records read. Abbassian did 15 chest compressions and then called 9-1-1, telling dispatchers she did not have all of the proper life-saving equipment to revive her patient, records show.
When paramedics arrived at the doctor’s northeast Portland office, they found the victim unconscious in the exam room, records show. The state determined that Abbassian was no longer performing CPR, officials said.
The woman was transported to a local hospital, where she died four days later. A medical examiner determined the woman died due to complications related to either medicine or anesthetics administered by Abbassian, state medical records show.
The second allegations prosecutors are making in this case involve a second woman … and a second surgery.
According to the indictment, on or between July 1 and Sept. 30, Abbassian caused a “substantial risk” to one of her patients. A grand jury indictment was filed Monday and Abbassian was arraigned on that charge Tuesday, Aug. 28.
Prosecutors said the grand jury has been meeting to review the case for several months.
Abbassian appeared in court with her attorney Stephen Houze. The Portland-based attorney has served as defense attorney for such clients as Terri Moulton Horman, who is the step-mother of a missing Portland boy, and an Oregon anesthesiologist accused of sexually abusing woman under his care.
Houze declined to comment on camera – but did tell KOIN his office would eventually release a statement.
—————————
The doctor (dermatologist) was operating on a friend and had no support staff and no crash cart in her office. Maybe this will be a Houze crafted plea deal eventually.
I am curious about something. Do you think if Houze is going to represent Terri in the civil case, he (or any attorney) would ask for an additional retainer to be used for the new case since the first amount was only for the original estimated/anticipated work? Even though no charges have materialized yet, he has had significant work to do already. It seems he would (or she would)be between a rock and a hard place if he didn’t represent her or advise any other attorney, as he has done with the divorce. If he didn’t take part, his job defending her in a criminal case, should there be one, could be much more difficult.
He is a criminal defense attorney, he will not lead her defense or lack thereof in the civil case, should it continue.
B
MockingbirdSings says:
August 28, 2012 at 5:05 pm
Blink replies:
He is a criminal defense attorney, he will not lead her defense or lack thereof in the civil case, should it continue.
B
————————-
OK – I’ll bite on “should it continue”.
Reasons I can think of for why the civil case might not continue (my own guesses):
1 – Absolutely nothing comes from any of the depositions to support Desiree’s case.
2 – Terri realizes (but no one else does yet, except Houze) as she hears sworn testimony(s) she has not heard before, the information from the civil case could combine with what she thinks is the information from the investigation and is headed in directions she does not want to go, so Houze starts working on a plea deal (MFH?) and whoever her civil attorney is starts negotiating a settlement of the civil case – and they somehow tie the resolution of both together in the process. Desiree would settle if she got the information she wants, IMO. Kaine would probably get what he wants out of this result, too. (In other words, Terri sees that her silence isn’t paying off for her so she makes a deal for her version of the truth.)
3 – At the case management hearing in October, Terri’s team moves to dismiss the case based on #1 above, or some related legal point, and it is granted.
4 – Kyron or his body is found or some associated evidence is found and Terri is shown to be guilty, an accomplice, or not guilty because someone else can be tied to the case. Desiree ends the suit because she reached her goal and doesn’t want to continue the struggle simply over money she will probably never get even if she wins.
5 – DAD turns himself in for shooting the officer and, having been off medications for a substantial time, tells everything he knows, leading to some sort of ending to all of this. Or due to a fatal illness, he swears to a deathbed letter which reaches the DA.
Caution – please don’t worry about trying to debate the “facts” of my guesses – they are just an exercise to figure out if Blink was really telling us she has good reason to believe the suit will not go on, and what that reason might be. Hopefully, Blink will explain. If not, anyone else is welcome to jump in – I’m sure there are more possibilities, although at this point, I really want the suit to proceed. I’m tired of waiting for a train at the bus stop and going nowhere.
I believe Judge Kantor had no legal basis to abate the suit, and an abatement is not a response to the suit, as interpretable by the “special appearance”. As his order is written, imo, and you know I apologize for not having written a piece addressing just that yet, I hope to, I feel the judge was coaching from the bench to both sides.
For the defense- he said I already know you are going to move to dismiss or appeal because as written the allegations are so freaking vague their is no way for ANYONE to “answer” if they COULD mount a defense without compromising their 5th amendment rights.
For the plaintiff- If you have a chance in hell of moving forward and successfully responding to an appeal to the abatement decision or more likely a response to dismiss or motion to quash, you are going to have to demonstrate to the court how you can prove merit and not a fishing expedition because if you are able to produce evidence of criminality an indictment or an arrest says this thing in a hot minute anyway.
More, of course, but that is the basics as I see them, fwiw.
I feel intensely protective of Desiree in particular as you know, and I DO NOT believe she is going to get what she is hoping with this suit and she deserves to know where her baby is as he deserves to be found.
B
Interesting that when I log on to Blinkoncrime.com using Internet Explorer new posts don’t show. But if I use Firefox they do.. not sure why comments would be stuck in moderation using one over the other… Anyway, nice to see – finally- some new posts.
maybe in explorer you are set to “older comments”?
B
Blink,
Did you get my private post?
Thanks, I have been having trouble posting for some reason
Did Lauren, thanks, and your other posts are posted
B
If this civil case is appealed and dismissed due to lack of evidence on the plaintiff’s side, then I wonder what the DA’s next move will be? Does that just end the investigation and Kyron’s case becomes cold as ice? Or will they finally release some more information in hopes of gaining the truth from some other source besides those whom already been interviewed by the GJ.
I would, at the very least, like to see something substantial from the investigation that has cost millions of dollars. #1 would be a statement from LE, saying that they know Kyron did not leave with Terri (or did) #2 a statement as to whether or not Kyron was seen with an adult male who no one can identify. #3 a statement that all of the other family have been cleared based on their solid alibis #4 a statement on what exact information were they looking for that had been destroyed by the school and when it was purged #5 a statement as to how many potential suspects they still have under their scope, is it still 60 or has that been narrowed down to one or two?
I guess I could go on and on come to think of it. LOL IMO, they don’t have to give up any valuable specific information to the public that might hinder their case. Just some information as to where they are now. Like, “this much we are sure of……….”
Wait, maybe they aren’t sure of anything other than Kyron is missing and has been for over two years.
*****************
Up thread I posted about the poor woman who fell into her well. There was a story in the local paper last night. It was a grey water cistern a few 100 yards away from the house. I guess, used for watering the landscape, etc. (How foolish to put a switch for the pump that can only be reached by standing on the rotting plywood cover.) LE used an underwater camera to look into the cistern. Anyway, she sounded like a wonderful woman, local volunteering, etc. Getting ready to move back to her home state, Hawaii to be with her sisters. I hope she didn’t suffer in there long. RIP Carolyne McCue.
It was interesting to me that the first thing her family thought was that “she had been abducted”. The story is here, but you cannot read it’s entirety without a subscription.
http://www.nrtoday.com/news/2368653-113/mccue-riddle-body-cistern
I still am wondering if at the beginning of the searches if septic systems/wells on the Horman property or nearby were searched….Does anyone remember this being discussed/reported?
I thought you were suggesting the other, still cant put them together.
B
Re the suit, I separate out Desiree’s interests as a Mother
from the interests & agendas of whoever those “bad advisors”
are Blink refers to. I think Blink is doing a good job of that.
At issue is the investigation path forward.
Kyle Iboshi @KyleIboshi
Appears “America’s Most Wanted” working on upcoming piece on Kyron Horman case
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ugogurl
4:58 PM – 28 Aug 12 · Details
https://twitter.com/KyleIboshi
****************
Maybe this is where Rosenthal hoping to get his new evidence? Seriously, the timing is curious. Why would AMW feature Kyron’s case, if LE believes Terri Horman did it? I wonder if they will bring up SZ? Very strange.
Michelle Sigona @MichelleSigona
Los Angeles to Las Vegas —- and now, in Portland, Oregon — Filming today with Kaine Horman& Sheriff’s Office for update on Kyron Horman..
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Kyle Iboshi ugogurl
7:37 AM – 27 Aug 12 · Details
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***********
Filming with Kaine AND MCSO? What on earth is going on in this case?
Thanks Blink – you always give me more to think about.
MockingbirdSings says:
August 28, 2012 at 9:38 pm
Blink says: (snipped)
I believe Judge Kantor had no legal basis to abate the suit, and an abatement is not a response to the suit, as interpretable by the “special appearance”. As his order is written, imo, and you know I apologize for not having written a piece addressing just that yet, I hope to, I feel the judge was coaching from the bench to both sides.
For the defense- he said I already know you are going to move to dismiss or appeal because as written the allegations are so freaking vague their is no way for ANYONE to “answer” if they COULD mount a defense without compromising their 5th amendment rights.
For the plaintiff- If you have a chance in hell of moving forward and successfully responding to an appeal to the abatement decision or more likely a response to dismiss or motion to quash, you are going to have to demonstrate to the court how you can prove merit and not a fishing expedition because if you are able to produce evidence of criminality an indictment or an arrest says this thing in a hot minute anyway.
More, of course, but that is the basics as I see them, fwiw.
I feel intensely protective of Desiree in particular as you know, and I DO NOT believe she is going to get what she is hoping with this suit and she deserves to know where her baby is as he deserves to be found.
B
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To me, what amounts to an “abatement” of sorts is built into the process, aside from the formal 2-year one allowed any case with good cause.
http://courts.oregon.gov/Multnomah/docs/CourtRules/CivilCaseManagementProcessForCasedFiledAfterFebruary12012.pdf
First, there is a brief case management hearing. I thought the August 15th hearing was it, but it was only the motion for abatement, so the case management date is in October as Blink mentioned earlier. One judge (Kantor, it appears) is assigned to hear all motions and handle all hearings related to this case.
At the case management hearing, either side can ask to call this a “complex case” which then allows an extra year to prepare. I don’t personally think this is a complex case in terms of preparation time – not in the same way a case which requires experts, environmental studies, international records of some sort, etc. would be, but that’s just my opinion.
The judge who actually hears the case in court is assigned at the trial readiness hearing which is about 8 months later. IF no other delays occurred, that would still put us into next summer – and another year will have gone by since Kyron disappeared. A ruling of a “complex case” would add a year, making a total of 2 years at least. A 2-year abatement would have made that a minimum of 3 more years before trial – add a “complex case” and you have 4 years before a trial, which seems unlikely and ridiculous, but technically possible.
Everybody (media) got so excited about the case being allowed to go forward that they seem to have overlooked there are other ways to try to stop it – or legal potholes.
I’m not sure if the abatement is appealable to another court. If they were going to file an appeal, you’d think they would have done it by now, but maybe the questions asked by the judge left work to be done which would make an appeal impossible yet.
Except for James, my understanding (which may be wrong) is that depositions start after the case management hearing and are to be completed by the date of the case readiness hearing. Since Terri and her attorney are entitled to be present at those, they would know what ER has before the case readiness hearing, and whether they should move to dismiss the suit, will be able to present a defense, or are likely to lose. I guess the big question is whether it is possible for someone to present an adequate defense based on everything they have except the defendant’s testimony in court. May depend on how honest the defendant is with her attorney and what facts she knows which can be corroborated by others or by evidence.
I am unclear whether ER is required to give a copy of all documents he subpoenas to Terri’s attorney before the case readiness trial – I would think so, but not sure of the civil process.
I can see an advantage for Terri if Houze gets to see a lot of what LE has or might get. I can see an advantage for Houze, and a quick good-by, if he finds out Terri has lied to him, unless he knows she has mental issues.
I can see a disadvantage to Terri even if the suit is dismissed – if people who were subpoenaed start talking to LE or the media (if they care to ask) about what they know and said under oath. I don’t see any rule against that if the suit is dismissed. There isn’t even a rule against a GJ witness talking to the media if they choose to (only those actually on the jury).
I can see an advantage to Desiree if the depositions take place, which it seems they will, even if the case is dismissed – IF she then hires a P.I. to start looking for gaps in this body of knowledge and new directions to follow. Even if the depositions are confidential, she would have been there and made her own notes – maybe not good enough for LE, but good enough for an experienced, capable P.I. to review.
It seems that whatever conclusion this case has, there are still many ways the 2 sides could benefit or lose, or both.
yesterday I checked vantage point Fitness, Briede’s holding co for Edge, on corporationwiki for first time in ages. at the bottom is a screen that says people who came to view this business wiki also went to…..
saw the usual case associated names (a Horman, a Finster, on one look Rudy Sanchez, Ariceli & other CA names, etc). there was only one new name to me: Dolly Boals. Any association?
@Blink. I think this Judge in the interests of equity is ready for fishing season,
he just needs a scintella of some arguable circumstantial evidence of involvement
and/or motive from plaintiff, enough to have a jury question.
Team Calco also shows up with Boals named as “also looked at”
on Vantage Fitness’ Corpwiki. Going to its corpwiki it shows a
sec of state regristration in 5/12 & Briede is an active officer
I’m no expert, but I cannot imagine that the searchers wouldn’t check all the area wells. I was up there 2 days after Kyron disappeared to drop off food and water. There were a ton of people out there, and the search crews had every section of land cordoned off, it was very thorough, IMHO.
Multnomah County Search and Rescue is one of the best in the PNW, they are called to the Gorge and mtns. to find lost/missing people all the time. I do recall that LE checked all area homes and asked homeowners to check their barns, wells, etc.
Of course any thing is possible, but maybe not probable in this case. I am horrified by the Roseburg well story, how tragic and sad.
I can only keep praying for little Kyron, and all that love him, breaks my heart.
Plese forgive my lack of knowlege. While reading Judge Kantor’s ruling regarding Stay.. I find this paragraph interesting, but not sure I am understanding it correctly.
“There has been no public indictment and therefore there is no actual criminal prosecution
pending. While the absence of an actual criminal prosecution does not bar a stay, this factor
weighs against a stay, especially as it has been two years since Kyron disappeared and there is no
way for this court to determine how long the investigation will go on without a decision of
whether or not to prosecute the defendant or anyone else.”
I read this that because Terri isn’t an official “suspect” and because she isn’t awaiting court, she can’t argue that it may interfer with her criminal case. Am I correct?
Kaine Horman says they have growing evidence that has significantly strengthened their belief that Terri had involvement in the situation. (see link below) He also said recently (and darn if I can’t find the link) that recent witnesses (friends?) had come forward with new information. Could these statements have anything to do with why Desiree felt confident going forward with the civil case?
—-
Order regarding stay: http://www.kptv.com/link/581639/judges-order-regarding-stay-in-terri-horman-lawsuit?clienttype=generic&mobilecgbypass
Kaine: http://www.kgw.com/news/Hearing-today-on-Kyron-civil-suit-delay-request-166253236.html
@T Ruth
So sad about the lady thanks for the info
I agree with the things you hope this suit finds out
And want Desiree to find Kyron
Yet some how I think she is taking suit with the wrong person
I can see a case against the school staff
But what do I know
I just hope they can locate some of the people
Who have disappeared
I don’t want Blink mad at me but I wish LE
Could be made to answer a few questions
Susan Cox’s family have the right idea
MOO
@T.Ruth
@Amys Sister-
Using Lexis I did find a link from Thomas E. Jones (dob:1970) to Dede Spicher:
*SPICHER, DEDE LEE
SPICHER, DEDE L
(DOB: 09/1966)
(Age: 45)
27010 DUGOUT LN
KLAMATH FALLS, OR 97601-8628
(10/2010-Current)
*JONES, EARL E
(DOB: 09/1923)
(DOD: 01/12/2002)
(Age at Death:78)
27010 DUGOUT LN
KLAMATH FALLS, OR 97601-8628
(08/1983-Current)
1114 E MAIN ST
KLAMATH FALLS, OR 97601-3313
(08/1983)
*JONES, LYLE DAVID
(DOB: 04/1949)
(DOD: 03/11/2011)
(Age at Death:61)
1114 E MAIN ST
KLAMATH FALLS, OR 97601-3313
(2000)
1122 BOX
KLAMATH FALLS, OR 97601
(01/1994)
*JONES, THOMAS E
(DOB: 03/1970)
(Age: 42)
1122 BOX
KLAMATH FALLS, OR 97601
(12/1990)
I know its not a direct link and that they are separated by a couple people, but Dede is associated with members of a Jones family, who happen to be related to a Thomas Jones. I know this doesnt mean the person on GLP is actually Tom Jones, but I thought it was worth posting.
———–
T. Ruth says:
August 23, 2012 at 11:30 am
@Amys Sister says:
August 22, 2012 at 12:15 pm
Okay, thanks. I see how one could surmise that LE was hinting that Terri moved her truck, but IMO it does not mean she did, especially, considering the discussion we’ve had about the possibility of more than one white pickup.
As far as anything that was posted on GLP, I would take it with a huge block of salt. I read most of his posts. TJ, Tom Jones, or whatever his real name is, as far as I know, was never verified to be Dede’s cousin and even if he really was, he could be full of you know what. Just sayin’.
I just thought maybe I’d missed something, thanks for clearing it up.
In case someone hasn’t posted this yet –
http://www.katu.com/news/local/Americas-Most-Wanted-comes-to-town-to-feature-Kyron-Horman-167927125.html
supposed to air in September
Is it remotely possible that Terry could come out of a civil suit unscathed and challenge the RO for her daughter? This is bugging me, maybe some of you seasoned vets might have some thoughts on this.
I read here everyday and like you all, I pray for Kyron to be found and peace for Desiree.
Rose,
Wondering if motive can/will be established through what Desiree said, paraphrasing here – - multiple emails to multiple people, and that the emails made it clear that TH wanted Kyron out of her life.
Perhaps depositions/interviews will bring verbal expression of same.
Maybe the LS has something to offer on that . . . the same LS that was allegedly heard yelling at/egging on TH to call the cops during the mfh sting . . . and by gosh, she did. Perhaps this was his way of warning her before she maybe said something LE wanted to hear ? But I digress.
just some layman thoughts
Rose says: August 29, 2012 at 4:44 pm
+++++++++
Google search shows: Dolly Boals was born in 1947. Dolly currently lives in Lake Oswego, Oregon
Linkedin shows: Dolly Boals is Owner, Wine Matters
Portland, Oregon Area
She is also on Facebook..
Don’t see a connection though..
sunnybrook says:
August 29, 2012 at 11:04 pm
Is it remotely possible that Terry could come out of a civil suit unscathed and challenge the RO for her daughter? This is bugging me, maybe some of you seasoned vets might have some thoughts on this.
I read here everyday and like you all, I pray for Kyron to be found and peace for Desiree.
——————————
@sunnybrook -
Technically, Terri could have challenged the RO in the beginning and still could at any time, however, the RO is based on risks LE told Kaine about (as far as we know) regarding the MFH, not Kyron’s disappearance. The result of the civil suit may not affect that issue directly at all.
Keep in mind, though, that Kaine has full custody of Kiara during the abatement. At this point, even if there were no RO, I think Terri would have to go back to court and ask for visitation or shared custody, and the court would make the decision and then oversee a plan for that. After all this time and Terri not living a normal life with social contacts, activities, work, etc., I think any request she makes is going to lead to psychological testing (of both parents possibly) and an evaluation of whether she can adequately parent regardless of whether she is cleared of anything she hasn’t been charged with – confusing, isn’t it?
I personally don’t expect anything to come up about the RO until the divorce abatement ends and they go back to court to take whatever steps come next in the divorce case – IF she chooses to ask for contact with Kiara at that time. If they settle anything about the divorce without changing the custody order and/or challenging the RO (which is separate from the divorce case), she can return to court at any time she wants to argue for parenting rights or to challenge the RO which has to be maintained by regular renewals by the court.
The whole divorce thing is sort of unique now. Normally, since she was not working when they split, but has training and credentials to teach plus a history of working in other kinds of jobs, Kaine would be asked to provide spousal support for a specified period of time (likely to be 2 years) while she had time to find a job and support herself. A lot of time has passed and obviously, she is not working and able to support herself – however, that is not Kaine’s burden in the same way it would have been right after they split. He is only one of many voices – and not even the loudest right now saying anything which is contributing to her hiding out with her parents instead of looking for a job. Since she appears to be paying 2 attorneys at least, the court could find she has resources and made her own choice how to spend them, or the judge could order spousal support. I can imagine the arguments from both sides, but even though I try, I can’t imagine what a judge will say. The property division will probably be a bit simpler.
I’m not an attorney, but I am more familiar with Oregon divorce courts through family and friends than I care to be. Perhaps others will contribute what they know. (Oregon is not a community property state.)
Malty says:
August 29, 2012 at 7:48 pm
I don’t want Blink mad at me but I wish LE
Could be made to answer a few questions
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Oh, Malty – nobody, least of all Blink, IMO, is going to be mad at you. I suspect we all wish the same thing.
AMWs Facebook page posted weeks ago asking for people to recommend a story they wanted AMW to investigate. There were many comments from people asking for John to investigate Kyrons disappearance. I ‘liked’ AMW FB page months ago so this is how I saw this. It was some type of social media coverage label.
T. Ruth says:
August 29, 2012 at 2:33 pm
Kyle Iboshi @KyleIboshi
Snipped>>>>
Appears “America’s Most Wanted” working on upcoming piece on Kyron Horman case
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@T. Ruth- AMW had a “contest” asking the public to choose cases they would like AMW to follow up on. I went to their FB page and chose Kyron’s case. I saw that many others did as well, and I’m thrilled that they will be doing a story on him.
To Miss Bri
I have done all the family trees for the Spicher Family and verified who her cousins are and her Aunt that had the property that was searched. I also know that the man posting on GLP was indeed Dede’s cousin although there were some copycats chiming in from time to time.
Gosh I hope AMW was able to obtain some new information from Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office.. I see they were filming there. Even a few crumbs would be nice to nibble on.
http://www.katu.com/news/local/Americas-Most-Wanted-comes-to-town-to-feature-Kyron-Horman-167927125.html
@mbs. imo Kaine does not have full custody due to the abatement of the divorce proceedings.
imo it’s due to the RO alone. imo if there were no RO, temp custody would be decided in divorce
court, and Kaine would’ve had to prove Terri was unfit rather than her having to prove she was fit.
That would’ve taken LE testimony, which Kaine & LE did not want. The RO was critical.
Was Kaine ordered to do anything whatsoever monetarily for Desiree in that divorce? given their new baby & her health? Did they have formal joint custody? What was that custody decree? We know he eventually got virtually full physical custody? Was custody with Kyron joint apart from physical residence? I bet not. Love to see that Court order for its predictive value. Imo Kaine woukd’ve divorced Terri, and left her with nada, with or without Kyron’s abduction.
He was and agreed.
B
@January. I read JK as saying a rigid approach would require an actual criminal indictment for a stay. goes on to say I acknowledge though case law says an indictment is not necessary. But, he reasons, 2 years without an indictment gives weigh she is not in jeopardy, tipping this factor to plaintiff. imo he’s full of it, masking his reasoning with poor written explanation. imo “poor writing” is an inability to explain yr reasoning. JK gets A plus for poor written explanations. Blink by contrast, spelling or not, can explain anything in 2-3 sentences.
@mbs. imo just like the retired J Meisenheimer, this Judge will in NO WAY give up this case. Assignment is not merely random but also collegial. There is a Borderline’s “stickiness” to this case; likely
more than one. No one wants to let go of this family on any level. The interesting thing is before this abduction, imo, the family system was on a more social periphery in their social systems.
@Concerned Citizen-
Thanks! I didnt know you had already done the research and verified that was for sure her cousin. Has anything ever been made of the things he was saying? I think Im going to spend some time looking into Dede’s family and associates.
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Concerned Citizen says:
August 30, 2012 at 9:15 am
To Miss Bri
I have done all the family trees for the Spicher Family and verified who her cousins are and her Aunt that had the property that was searched. I also know that the man posting on GLP was indeed Dede’s cousin although there were some copycats chiming in from time to time.
What’s interesting to me about AMW picking up Kyron’s disappearance again is the way AMW, usually anyway, presents these cases. They usually ask for someone to come forward about seeing someone don’t they? A person, a car, etc. LE in this case has already asked a multitude of the population to come forward if they saw Terri and/or Dede, as well as the Horman vehicle at many different locations. (Never on Sauvie Island that I know of, which is curious as well.) It will be interesting to see if LE actually brings up a request for anyone to come forward who may have seen yet another person, “SZ”. If there is nothing else new, I wonder if it will just be a repeat of the same ol’ information. I hope not. Wonder if it’s scheduled to air on Kyron’s birthday.
I hope something breaks in this case one way or another.