Hannah Graham Body Located: Sources Say Tip Led To Her Recovery
Breaking News: The body of Hannah Elizabeth Graham has been recovered.
Press Conference involving multiple agencies to be held momentarily.
Thoughts and prayers are with Hannah, her family and friends this evening.
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heard Sat while driving Blink
http://www.npr.org/2014/12/06/369008760/how-the-rolling-stone-story-could-hurt-future-victims
answers some of yr comments.
I would like to see a summary of the “inconsistencies” in Jackies story since all of the accounts I’ve read to date seem to be glossing over how they “know” this was all made up, and that the date is wrong supposedly because there wasn;t an “official function” there (not exculpatory-it could have been informal function) and the guy was not a lifeguard or something.
Certainly what went on in the Duke Lacrosse case was horrifying with that prosecutor and the way the corrupt system supported what he wanted to do. However, by picking apart specific details as this fraternity is bound to be good at as they have now lawyered up, we need to consider that this kind of assault would be expected to leave someone emotionally crippled for a long while, and that doesn’t rule out inconsistencies. Rolling Stone has in effect thrown Jackie under the bus, in the PR scheme of things and now she is being villified. What we don’t know is whether this is deserved. It has been reported that this lack of credibility is coming from “friends who now doubt the story” and other hard to verify sources. If the accuser’s story did not sound right, then this rush to discredit Jackie also needs to be looked at with some balance. I am not going to make any judgement based on the rush to discredit, until I see some official investigation into all of this. It is possible that something very well did happen, some of the details are wrong due to emotional trauma or chaos. It also does sound like Jackie is socially naive compared to the frat scene and probably feels under siege.
If someone could let me know of hard facts that are now in dispute, which indicate that nothing Jackie said happened, did remotely happen, I would appreciate it. If this was a multi party attack it would most likely be hard to get every detail right, even to name every name. I also doubt the perps if this did occur are going to be admitting anything at all in the press.
What is obvious to me is that there is a PR effort to discredit Jackie, and so far it seems pretty amateurish. That doesn’t prove she is right, nor wrong. Investigation, please. Not spin coming from high dollar PR and lawyers finding unnamed purported “friends” who now are in doubt about facts which are never specified.
susan- you make very valid points without your usual flaming torch ( I say affectionately)so thank you. I agree in the sense that journalists and outlets cannot have it both ways. They cannot condemn the piece they consider innuendo with innuendo and vague responses of their own.
That said, I have a concern that might fall under a be careful what you wish for moment, as it relates to Jackie. What bothers me is that here we are several weeks later and this writer has not said a word publicly since her piece was called into question.
Don’t make me call Will MacAvoy. Sabrina has the RESPONSIBILITY to address the issues calling her piece into question- she has significant experience in the area of victimization and source management. I want to know why she is not talking but I already know that answer starts with “against the advice of counsel.”
B
Jackies Story-
First let me say that THIS is what is wrong with UVA and countless other colleges
The colleges handling of this is what made it what it is today-
How?
Because UVA not LE looked into these accounts
snip
At the end of her freshman year, Jackie found herself in the Peabody Hall office of Dean Nicole Eramo, head of UVA’s Sexual Misconduct Board. In his office, with her mother beside her, she’d burst into tears, and her mother explained she’d had a “bad experience” at a party. He’d blanched and given Jackie the e-mail for Dean Eramo.
When Jackie finished talking, Eramo comforted her, then calmly laid out her options. If Jackie wished, she could file a criminal complaint with police. Or, if Jackie preferred to keep the matter within the university, she had two choices. She could file a complaint with the school’s Sexual Misconduct Board, to be decided in a “formal resolution” with a jury of students and faculty, and a dean as judge. Or Jackie could choose an “informal resolution,” in which Jackie could simply face her attackers in Eramo’s presence and tell them how she felt; Era mo could then issue a directive to the men, such as suggesting counseling. Eramo presented each option to Jackie neutrally, giving each equal weight. She assured Jackie there was no pressure – whatever happened next was entirely her choice.
—end snip
Is this part undoubtedly true- Was she referred to the dean- Did the dean hear her allegations and then – leave it up to her on what happened next?
Why wasnt there an immediate investigation?
Had there been then it would have safeguarded not only the University- the fraternity- and the accused (if she was found to be lying-)
But it would have also safeguarded the countless victims who do not exaggerate lie or slander- it would have safeguarded the good that Take Back the night does and Jackies story may never have been a testimonial on take back the night rally
If Le found she lied…She would have been held accountable for a false report-
This story may have never been printed at all
had The University handled the ACCUSATIONS responsibly way back then
It should not be left up to anyone but LE once the accusations were brought to light in that room
If Jackie chose not to speak to LE then honestly she should never been a speaker at take back the night-
If she never named the fraternity or the men- then hers is just another nameless story in the background-never meant to be in the forefront not a rallying cry for others
- Lots of nonprosecuting victims belong to groups for support or join advocacy campaigns but never “speak out publically”
This story may have never been printed at all had UVA allowed RollingStone to interview Eramo-
(UVA declined to make Eramo available for comment.)
If Eramo had commented perhaps RS would have found Jackie never reported at all- or that UVA did investigate and found her not credible-who knows?
Interestingly enough- Jackie tried to back out of the RS piece-
In July, Renda introduced Jackie to Erdely, the Rolling Stone writer who was on assignment to write about sexual violence on college campuses. Overwhelmed by sitting through interviews with the writer, Jackie said she asked Erdely to be taken out of the article. She said Erdely refused, and Jackie was told that the article would go forward regardless.
—
Again no one is accountable-
Who is Renda? A feiend An employee for the university of Virginia – a sexual violence awareness specialist. She is a rape survivor of UVA and a graduate of UVA= why didnt her hinky meter alert?
Despite Jackie initially telling her the attack was by five students at Phi Kappa Psi not seven–
Why? Because:
“An advocate is not supposed to be an investigator, a judge or an adjudicator,” said Renda,
—
So True, but still an advocate and sexual violence specialist is Never supposed to introduce a victim to a magazine publisher are they?
There were countless other women who had went thru the entire process- had went to LE who had named their attackers- who could have told their tale and did- while in the group One Less
Jackie had only shared “elements” of her story at a Take Back the Nig
Jackie told The WPost
-she had not intended for it to reach a wider audience until the Rolling Stone writer contacted her-
“If she had not come to me, I probably would not have gone public about my rape,” said Jackie
Rende said:
Renda said, “I don’t even know what I believe at this point.”
“This feels like a betrayal of good advocacy if this is not true,” Renda said. “We teach people to believe the victims. We know there are false reports, but those are extraordinarily low.”
Renda said research shows that between 2 and 8 percent of rape allegations are fabricated or unfounded.
“The doubt cast on Jackie’s story has been feeding the myth that we have been combating for 40 years — that women lie about rape. And I feel that will put women at a disadvantage in coming forward,” Renda said.
=
Is Jackies story untrue? all of it some of it? IDK
Rende doesnt know either- despite introducing Rolling Stone to Jackie
Jackies story seems so easy to check yet no one did? Not the dean not UVA not Rende not Rolling Stone
Was jackie just looking for friends like those in One Less? IDK
Her story True or not dont get distracted
Heres what is the truth
UVA and other colleges are not protecting their students by NOT handing it over to police immediately
No protection for the real victims and none for those falsely accused
http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/a-rape-on-campus-20141119#ixzz3L5uTagZ3
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/u-va-fraternity-to-rebut-claims-of-gang-rape-in-rolling-stone/2014/12/05/5fa5f7d2-7c91-11e4-84d4-7c896b90abdc_story.html
AJMO Peace
sorry for typos
-
http://www.cavalierdaily.com/m/blog/on-sexual-assault-letters-from-the-community/2014/12/a-letter-from-a-friend-jackies-story-is-not-a-hoax
A letter from a friend: Jackie’s story is not a hoax
by Emily Clark | on Dec 07 at 10:43pm
I don’t know what that means and with almost zero exception- I do not modify comments.
B
When a Rapist’s Weapon is a Drug
snips>
One of those motives is obvious: simple opportunism, the reason men have spiked women’s drinks (or less commonly, women men’s) since the dawn of cocktail hour. Another is coercion; the perpetrator is aroused by domination, forcing his (or rarely, her) sexual will on the target.
“This is common enough that we debated whether to include it as a diagnosis in the D.S.M. 5,” psychiatrists’ influential diagnostic manual, said Dr. Michael First, a Columbia psychiatrist who edited it. But the idea was shelved, in part because of concerns that doing so would give rapists added recourse in legal cases, he said.
A third and far less common motive is a rare kind of “paraphilia”— an unusual sexual preference that becomes compulsive. “In this case, it’s a preference for unresponsive partners,” Dr. Cantor said.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/when-a-rapist%e2%80%99s-weapon-is-a-drug/ar-BBgvzTa
Mom3.0 says:
December 8, 2014 at 4:02 pm
******
Agree, Agree, Agree…great post.
Mom3.0 Said:
“UVA and other colleges are not protecting their students by NOT handing it over to police immediately.
No protection for the real victims and none for those falsely accused”
This was the very thing that I was addressing in my statement that the school had zero business operating a sexual assault board. However, because we have the DOE “Dear Colleague letter posted by Starbucks where the DOE attempts to force the schools to follow their regulations in order to keep their federal funding, the schools fall into the trap set by DOE within the regulations. Sexual assault is made so broad that almost anything from simple touching to words becomes a reason for reporting to the school so they can comply with the Title IX and Clery Act requirements.
Here, we have a direct conflict with the laws of the various states regarding true criminal sexual assault. The states should take steps to review the regulations set forth in the Dear Colleague letter with regard to the state’s criminal definitions of sexual assault. State criminal statues should always be the guide rather than some set of regulations put forth by a government agency such as the DOE.
I would venture to say that few to none of the schools have the expertise to conduct a proper investigation of alleged criminal conduct that follow state law. There also has to be the will of the investigators to find the real truth no matter “who’s ox gets gored” in the process.
A county or state attorney or attorney general has a staff of people who deal with criminal activities on a daily basis. They are the proper people to investigate sexual assaults.
.
ATG, It makes me wonder about the feasibility of federal jurisdiction over any institution receiving DOE dollars over any felonious crime primarily; rape, murder, kidnapping. Of course the weak link in the system will always be the initial reporting.
Like many, my initial response to the Rolling Stone article, my “blink” or “time-slicing” response, was that something was wrong with the article. Shortly thereafter, a had a “I’ve seen this movie before” moment. Initially, I assumed that the author had embellished the story for dramatic effect. Unfortunately, now basic facts have been called into question. She may have fingered the wrong fraternity. Her early accounts to friends didn’t match.
What has become obvious is that this woman needs psychiatric evaluation and counselling, without regard to what may or may not have happened. Does she have PTSD? She definitely has depressive symptoms.
I would not read much into the chapter voluntarily relinquishing its agreement with UVA. This chapter house apparently is on private property (most likely owned by a “House Corporation”) and received its charter from a national organization, so it really hasn’t disbanded, and, unless these allegations are proven, will likely re-establish relations with UVA soon.
The most troubling aspect of the RS controversy IMHO, is that the topic of campus rape cannot be freely debated in the public realm. There are too many people who have judged the veracity or falsehood of this article based on their pre-existing beliefs and stereotypes (e.g., Duke lacrosse vs rape culture). Many people who questioned the veracity of the article remained silent for fear of being labelled as “blaming the victim” or contributing to “rape culture”.
My personal impression is that something bad happened to this young woman. She did not receive adequate counselling and has suffered mental illness consequences which may have clouded her memory.
Yes, Eloise, I agree that the initial report is an important key to getting the truth of an alleged rape or sexual assault.
The real problem with Title IX and the attendant additions over the years is that it began as a single issue concerning women in the workplace and via mission creep has extended into areas where IMO it has no business intruding.
The Federal government has since the 1960′s intruded into the daily life of the people to the point of being a major impediment to freedom. New laws and their regulations put forth by the fourth estate of government, namely the agencies with hundreds and thousands of pages of pseudo law (regulations) and the false administrative law courts operating outside the intent of the Constitution are responsible.
I listened to a congress “critter” on tv a few years ago talking about how successful the current session of congress was because they had passed over 300 bills. This congress “critter” had a false concept of success. The real success story is how few bills get passed and those that do really are beneficial to the whole people.
To follow-up my previous post, the woman who has accused the UVA men of rape is under care for PTSD and depression.
” “If she had not come to me, I probably would not have gone public about my rape,” said Jackie, adding that she had been diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder and is taking antidepressants. ”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/u-va-fraternity-to-rebut-claims-of-gang-rape-in-rolling-stone/2014/12/05/5fa5f7d2-7c91-11e4-84d4-7c896b90abdc_story.html
I don’t know whether or not Jackie is a victim of seven men at the Phi Psi house, but she is definitely a victim of Rolling Stone.
Another article that spins yet more yarn in this strange saga:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/u-va-students-challenge-rolling-stone-account-of-attack/2014/12/10/ef345e42-7fcb-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html
I am looking forward to the results of the local LE’s investigation of this case.
Be careful what you ask for, indeed.
It appears that the link provided by GeorgiaDad provides information that the C’vile PD is investigating the allegations in the RS account.
At this point, there is a 50/50 chance that the story has some truth that something bad happened to Jackie. Was it rape? Maybe, but it may have something to do with simple rejection by a boyfriend that she was too immature to handle.
LE investigators should look at Jackies behavior in high school and family to clear that area of any strange behaviors.
The writer at RS just acted like a beginner reporter with the story. The editors didn’t do their job either. The school and its population have been stigmatized along with the alleged victim by the publication of this story.
However, there could be some good realized from the outfall. The good may be that LE will be recognized as the proper authority for handling such cases and students will be trained on how to assist in a meaningful way.
Hard to believe the RS was so sloppy. Is it possible they have effected this conversation?
The defense has asked for a gag order in the Fairfax case.
http://www.nbc29.com/story/27616609/jesse-matthews-defense-requests-gag-order-in-fairfax-case
I mapped the street given in the article. Look how closely US 29 passes.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Rock+Garden+Dr,+Fairfax,+VA+22030/@38.8580761,-77.327091,17.34z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x89b64edede0a248f:0xdb8af7198be07651?hl=en
Called it. They will get it.
B
Here is another article:
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Jesse-Matthew-Attorneys-Request-Gag-Order-285660681.html
Indahlia
Using your reference to the site at Fairfax it is .84 of a mile from hwy. 29 to Rockgarder Dr.
There are two important things in this view that have a bearing on the assault. They are the pool area shown next to a town limit line or a pipeline or utility easement that runs from the Giant foods East to the two apartment projects. The campus of Virginia International University is adjacent to the pool area to the North.
There is an area along the easement that has heavy growth under the trees. This is probably where the assault took place.
O/T:
This is another sad college experience ending.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/minn-student-falls-creek-freezes-drinking-cops-article-1.2043162
@ATG. imo she was simply in the wrong place/wrong time.
could’ve been anywhere.
wrt him, that crime speaks to an exquisite impulsivity
and a reckless disregard for victim/site/implications.
Imo same was at play in Hannah (feckless impulsivity on sight,
reckless disregard of cameras).
If you can stomach it, here’s the latest in a long battle in my neck of the woods.
http://prospect.org/article/report-bob-jones-university-responded-rape-claims-woeful-ignorance-law-often-blaming-victims
Indahlia says:
I mapped the street given in the article. Look how closely US 29 passes.
—–
By now I’m aware that the US 29 stalker is not JM. Sorry for the goof.
@ATG
You gotta love Google maps for the perspective they give, huh?
OT
Eloise, wrt Jessica C, she reminds me of H Bobo.
Based on her contact with the Christian author of
a personal redemption story, asking for help
telling her own (which she did
not receive; the narcissist didn’t engage her).
she apparently had a story to tell, ending in making it right.
Imo that DA needs Blink’s eagle eye. whenever feasibke.
oops, apologies Eloise. I thot you asked B about Chambers &
see I was wrong. You wrote about the Minn tragedy. I sent that link
about that poor girl to my kid. So many on her campus.
Girls need to party two by two.
Right now she hates her new prestigious sorority, considering
them alcoholic sots; she sees her club athletic team as ditto
(1st Captn act was to engage a
party bus to a club); and ditto for her music studio where 1 bad apple girl arrived
to turn every studio party into a shots party. picking her up at Xmas, I saw a great
men’s water polo team at a dinner, suits-ties & sisters & parents & a few dates & no
alcohol. To me it comes down to coaches & advisors (the sorority’s external ones
being very lax). It’s kinda like Sandusky, kids will be kids, and adults can be kids,
and everyone looks the other way thinking college is a voyage of self
discovery & the particular kids will be gone in 4 years anyway so why delve
into it. Like the PSU Board majority saying fugidaboutit, let’s not meet.
Rose
I am going to disagree with your impulsive behavior of JM regarding Hannah. The comment from the bouncer about having to bar JM from the premises for a period of time is the clue.
I firmly believe that JM was in stalking mode all the time. He was always looking for a victim. Some fought him and those he likely killed or attempted to as in the Fairfax case.
We don’t know what will be uncovered about his crimes over the years or if all will be found. These people usually have multiple offenses prior to being caught. I think that JM believed that LE wouldn’t do anything to him as was the case in the road rage incident with the assistant DA, the two dismissals at college with no criminal charges and he could just do what he wanted regardless of cameras. He IMO was is just arrogant and he would have attempted something even if LE were nearby.
@ATG. Thank you. I agree he was in stalking mode.
That is not inconsistant with gross impulsivity & feckless disregard
of social conventions or tracking business cameras. Imo his
was a combination of excessively imbibing alcohol,
fetish overstimulation (the couple on the street where he hit on
the lady, and the lady in the bar), and sociopathic acting on sexual impulses.
I see him as a combo of likely very low iq with
significant frontal & temporal lobe damage,
and inadequate family, school, & community structure.
When he lost his high school structure, he flamed out.
Rose
I am sorry to learn of the poor experiences of your child. It is not fun to be the only one sober at a drunken party. She will have to be the adult in the room.
She should attend the event making certain there is a source of safe transportation back to the residence so she can leave when it gets to the stupid point. They will not notice her absence because of being drunk. That would be difficult with the party bus to the club. However, she could have taxi fair set aside and leave when ready.
Been there and found that to be a reasonable way to accommodate the group. If someone presses her on why she left she can claim she needed to study or if she is brave enough she can tell the truth.
Indahlia
Google Earth and maps are very helpful when they are up-to-date, especially with the recent inclusion of the ground views and the “look-back” feature available for some locations. The one thing we have to remember is the zoom feature has limitations since it is zooming from photos of the earth from a satellite camera.
Photos taken from an altitude of 1,000 feet with a quality large format camera are capable of revealing things such as disturbed earth and compacted earth from times past. This information has investigative value and is not possible with the Google system.
Rose
I didn’t ask about your daughter’s music classes. Young people who learn music with a classical background either vocal or instrumental have an opportunity to learn or expand important skills. This also helps them to become mature at an earlier age than their peers. Furthermore, it teaches them perseverance in all activities.
This is what should have happened to JLM:
http://blog.chron.com/sportsupdate/2014/12/former-ut-players-indicted-on-sexual-assault-charges/#26321101=0
Rose says:
December 14, 2014 at 3:39 pm
OT
Eloise, wrt Jessica C, she reminds me of H Bobo.
Rose>
Oh yes it does. I was perusing the Conservative Treehouse as recommended by ATG, Jane & others- that is one scary place to live in to say the least. I did suspect drugs were at the root- she had such a dramatic appearance change from her graduation pic, imo- ? meth explosion or something. Rumors of involvement at the source may go very deep- how awful. Whats up with these rural places? I guess a town or county can hide for a long time until something ugly rears its head and out comes all the skeletons for all the world to see. Too sad.
The thing in JM’s mind about being near water must be some primal instinct or sub conscious need? Every attack we know about has ended near the water, creek bed, or a pool, and he was found at the ocean. What is this about? Is this typical criminal behavior? We do also have that theme from former town Hydraulic of the reservoir taking over the land by flooding. Water is a theme in this case, whether it means anything or not. Chief asked about fishing spots. There must be an importance to the water proximity subliminally like a bad novel.
Eloise, IDK if this is happening everywhere or not, but in WA state the larger cities, namely Tacoma and Seattle have task forces for gangs and drugs. This has pushed the criminal element into rural areas where small town PD’s or sheriffs have jurisdiction, but not always the resources necessary. Just a thought to consider, because we are seeing more crime in rural areas here.
Shortly after Tacoma cracked down on crack a few years ago, the county had a rash of car thefts, the cars were finally discovered by a US Forest Service cop. There was an entire chop shop set up in the national forest, complete with living quarters and daycare center. It took two tow trucks 48 hours of non-stop driving to remove the remnants of about 100 stolen cars, and days to deconstruct shanty town.
Eloise says:
December 15, 2014 at 6:24 pm
snip>
Whats up with these rural places?
P.S. Forgot to mention Shanty Town had two meth labs. No doubt near the “daycare center.”
Blink, your phrase suggesting answering innuendo with innuendo is exactly what I was thinking. Perhaps Jackie is not talking to the RS writer any longer, and I agree since that frat has gone into damage control and lawyered up, they are going to be poking any holes they can find.
IMO this is exactly the problem created when the College disingenuously suggests to a possibly traumatized victim several options, do nothing, let College handle this, or law enforcement. The College can’t have it both ways, do nothing and expect a victim to be forever silent as if the matter is resolved. Although doing nothing is an option, not changing the culture after something is alleged to have happened is not an option. Now College gets to suffer the consequences in public of this strategy and push to keep whatever happened controlled. An investigation to get to the bottom of a possibly traumatized victims inconsistencies. This could get interesting.
Wow Erose- thats unbelievable all that could be going on and no one was the wiser- hidden in the forest! LOL. I guess it is every where in one way or another- like heroin I know has gotten very bad along the east coast, it just presents itself in many ways. But the horror of burning people- if that IS what happened here is just over the top for me. I have always feared fires- so maybe that is just my thing, idk.
susan- I wonder if LM uses the water or plans to use the water to wash himself- clean himself off from the deed? Just a thought.
Tango
Thanks for the link to Bob Jones University and the article that references the report by the GRACE organization. The summary article was very informative as to the narrative of how the investigation was conducted. However, we do not know what the actual work product of the investigation uncovered. There was no link to it.
The University may have claimed ignorance in their requirement of following the law, but I believe it was deliberate to keep several members of the university administration and faculty from potential criminal charges. I don’t know the statutes of limitation for the crimes associated with sexual assault in North Carolina. Some of their acts may still be actionable in the courts.
Bob Jones University is a unique organization. It is not quite as extreme as Pensacola Christian College, but is in the same ballpark. Until fairly recently, BJU refused to accept any federal money (directly or indirectly) in order to avoid federal regulation. The federal government’s authority is quite limited by the constitution, not that the 10th amendment is enforced very often, but uses strings attached to federal funds to get around its constitutional limitations.
Although its moral rules are quite strict, I have known a few BJU grads who were quite wild. At one time, students were allowed to walk arm-in-arm only if they didn’t actually touch. The school is considered extreme even in predominantly Southern Baptist South Carolina.
I suspect most of BJU’s issues stem from their belief in the idea of living a Christian life separate from “the world”. It is a very insular institution by its nature, and far from transparent. I suspect much of their initial response to these allegations stemmed from denial (“it can’t happen here”), more than a cover-up.
To me, the bottom line is the failure of Title IX. Most students would never think twice about calling the police if victimized by armed robbery, strong-arm robbery, car theft or assault and battery. Why does the federal government want sex crimes treated differently?
The latest statistics from the US government about campus sex assaults:
http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/rsavcaf9513.pdf
Thanks ATG and GeorgiaDad for your comments about the link to the article on Bob Jones. I’m sorry the report itself was not linked in the article. I thought it was interesting that the founder of GRACE is a Liberty University graduate and the grandson of Billy Graham. GeorgiaDad you’re right BJU is unique. A former pastor of mine was a Liberty U grad and even he thought BJU was kind of “out there”. Even so, I felt the mistakes in handling sexual assault cases at BJU were indicative of the general ambivalence of most college administrations up until just recently. False narratives such as Jackie’s in Rolling Stone infuriate me because they do nothing but harm real victims.
Blink I have some questions IRT MORGAN’s case.
You said a while back that BOC was “discoverable”. Do you anticipate a subpoena at any point or do you think a law clerk is indexing your Morgan threads as we speak?
Do you think JLM read or posted on BOC at any time in the past?
Is it possible former BOC posters are now employed by JLM’s defense team?
Most high profile murders have several books written about them. Why has that not been the case with Morgan’s murder?
BOC is not discoverable. It is possible some of my work in the case will be, I don’t know. I never publish case sensitive information for that very reason. I have been/am under subpoena in other cases and I have no problem ever complying- as long as it is structured properly and not a violation of rights afforded to me or posters.
If JLM read here or posted here, I would find that information to be case sensitive and not publish it.
There are quite a few posters on BOC who are licensed to practice law in the Commonwealth- I am not aware of any of them working for the defense and if I became aware it is my policy NOT to disclose private information of any poster. If you meant BOC editors who may have worked on Morgan’s case I don’t have any “formers” who ever had access to case sensitive information so I don’t see how that would have any value as some sort of strategy perspective.
I am not a publishing rep but you can image I know a slew of them- in true crime, you typically want the end of the case for any published work on it.
I also think there are things that the general public does not yet know about that evening in general and those details are best preserved for the civil and criminal litigations.
B
A brother from the Colonial Parkway Murders spree of the late 1980′s in Virginia is still looking for answers. Also his comments about multiple jurisdiction involvement is interesting. We don’t need problems like the taxi screw ups in Morgan’s case—-right hand not knowing what left is doing— defeating these investigations.
http://www.wsls.com/story/27432622/colonial-parkway-murders-remain-unsolved-28-years-later
Thank you Blink!
The problem in Virginia College administrations of dealing with any issue which might cause question to their reputation or legal liability appears to be at the root of the manner of handling the sex assault cases. Whatever changes may be made to this current method of guiding people to a non-complaint or to a college supervised handling of the complaint is going to be difficult to fathom with the liability adverse mindset and spin/damage control mindset of these administrations. That damage control mindset, denial of any problem whatsoever permeates throughout these entire organizations and appears resistant and rather impossible to change.
Susan
I agree about the Virginia college administrations problems and their mindset. However, it is not limited to colleges in Virginia. It is everywhere.
We need to have a moral change in the behavior of the college population and those that teach and administer at all schools. The “hook-up” mentality among the college youth needs to change. Alcohol and other drug consumption is the root cause of poor behavior.
Girls need to learn how to be “ladies” and guys need to learn how to be “gentlemen”.
Rose’s report of her encounter with the party of male swimmers and their families at the restaurant is the type of appearance and behavior that should be the norm.
I would be wary of applying broad brushstrokes in describing modern college students. I have read multiple anecdotal reports of the prevalence of “hook up” culture, but surveys have shown that the number of sex partners for college students has not increased dramatically. From my reading and personal experience, the prevalence of “Hook up” culture is dramatically overstated.
My impression is that current college students are no less moral than those of my generation. From speaking with college administrators, many of the current generation are more academically inclined than previous generations, in part due to the fact that there is a large surplus of college graduates. When I graduated from a well-respected small liberal arts school in 1982, for those not going to med school, law school or seminary, employment as a bank vice president or mill manager was almost guaranteed for those interested. After the recession and corporate restructuring of the early 90′s, the guaranteed white collar jobs have gone. Current students are well aware of that.
Obviously, there are generational differences. Modern students are more tolerant of non-traditional relationships. Many do not consider oral sex to be sex. And coed dorms do open up the opportunity for more sexual encounters. I agree with ATG that “Girls need to learn how to be “ladies” …”, but would also add that young women need to be taught to _demand_ to be treated like ladies.
another campus struggled & failed to integrate campus investigations &
sanctions with le/da
http://www.oregonlive.com/sports/oregonian/john_canzano/index.ssf/2014/12/canzano_oregonian_investigatio_1.html#incart_m-rpt-1
Thanks for the link Rose
I agree that this is very similar to what happened at Penn. State, but with a twist. This time LE and the DA were involved with strong evidence of the crime and those involved. What put a stop to the criminal investigation? The article indicated that the victim was to blame for some of it. However, we don’t know the truth of such a statement.
One thing that needs to be addressed in the Laws of Oregon is the statute of limitations for such a crime need to be extended to fifty years. Oregon is one of many states that IMO should do a complete review of their criminal statutes and court procedures with the aim of curing the mistakes of the past.