Blink On Crime -

McStay Family Murders: Charles Chase Merritt Arrested In The Murders of McStay Family

Posted by BOC Staff | Chase Merritt,Chubba McStay,Dan Kavanaugh,Gianni McStay,Heather McFadden,Jonah McStay,Joseph McStay,McStay,Michael McFadden,Michael McStay,Patrick McStay,Summer McStay | Friday 7 November 2014 11:55 am

This is a developing story, please check back for details.

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Comments (580)

580 Comments

Gold prospector says:

August 20, 2015 at 4:21 pm

Sorry if you are getting repeat comments from me Blink, I don’t know if they are being received or not because it usually post my comments with a message waiting for moderation and now the comment is just going poof on me. Please just delete this and a couple of others that are repeats of the same . apologies

I don’t have any duplicates for you GP- you are all up and you are fine- in general, the system takes care of that for me.
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Rose says:

August 20, 2015 at 5:59 pm

Well, I am not a businesspaypal customer. just regular.
I did not have to prove I was anyone when creating a new acct (I’d rid myself
of the original years ago, tired of theit “use us” emails.) and I was
paying by credit card rather than their money system.
I only needed a valid email address, and a valid credit card.
And when I forgot my password, there was a reset iirc to my email.
So imo all DK needed was access to Joey’s email address.
Rose says:

August 20, 2015 at 6:09 pm

Blink is your theory Chase was involved with an unknown partner in these murders, and that DK knew about the murders somehow and opportunistically invaded the business account self-interestedly? It is possible I suppose CM needed DK after the murders to access money, and that their conspiracy was a financial crime, but DK was not involved in the precursor murders. Making it likely he’d roll over on CM on the after financial conspiracy to avoid a murder charge.
I have never interviewed DK personally but I have seen many of the EIP business records and correspondences between he and Joey. In my initial review of this case, I did develop information that contradicted what he has stated his role in the company was- using what was an IM conversation from Jan 2009, Dan was allegedly organizing the vendors providing SEO services for the website. In short- allegedly he was responsible for the eip site’s google ranking. I don’t know if he was writing any of the code, but as I passed on to SBCSD then- if he was the one responsible “still” for same during the time after that dispute and shortly thereafter- he was actually doing the opposite for the site. I don’t know why, but he was. I found that particularly odd. So if he is intentionally “hiding” the EIP site- why is he pulling thousands out of Joey’s account presumably to “pay” himself for services rendered. I do believe there will be a transaction between DK and CM – at least that is what DK stated at one point – that he was told by the family to pay “someone” and that was his answer for why he withdrew funds. I have also seen an email where he stated (recipient withheld) Chase was out of a job for stealing from Susan (post disappearance)- but I don’t know what the specific allegation was. DK alleges he was in Hawaii (Maui)leading up to and following the disappearance ( now murders) and at one time I also saw an interview he gave that he did not have access to his computer there or words to that effect to access paypal- but we all know any business center in any hotel would provide access- I don’t know what kind of phone he had at the time or if in Feb 2010 paypal had phone apps like they do now.
Bottom line- I don’t know what the nexus is between these two, except to say at the time of Chase’s interview he said if he were to kill anyone it would be DK- I have to believe LE knows what the story is behind that comment. It would seem BOTH had an understanding by some means Joey, Summer and the boys were gone- that will be a question DK will need to answer for sure.

I don’t have a theory about the “who” as much as I believe there definitely is a who.
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Lyn says:

August 20, 2015 at 6:17 pm

The neighbor said there was a white truck parked in front of the home the evening of 4th with no trooper there. Do you know if he claims this was before dark, around 5:30 pm? If so, and you have Chase’s phone pinging Rancho Cucamonga at 5:48 how will this be explained? We know the video shows a truck pulling out at 7:47pm and RB added that it also shows it stopping to talk to another truck that was coming in. Curious if you think there may have been 2 white trucks at the residence that evening?

I don’t know what time the neighbor ( woman) claims the white truck was parked there, or if it can be confirmed her account was on Feb 4th, and I have no idea if it is verifiable that 2 trucks were seen- I can tell you google images from the basic trimeframe show at least 3 white trucks in that culdesac that I have counted. Unfortunately, outside of that, RB is devoid of credibility for information through his own doing- I can’t comment on that.
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Alli says:

August 20, 2015 at 10:00 pm

Who else (friend, family, business associate) had a white truck similar to Chase’s?

Does anybody have a picture of Chase’s truck showing a side tailpipe? Did all these particular model/year trucks have the tailpipe on the side? Or was this custom to Chase’s particular truck?
PaMom says:

August 20, 2015 at 10:08 pm

In QuickBooks every transaction is recorded even deleted transactions. The transaction detail are under the accountants reports. The QuickBooks log will also say who was logged in and when. If they were operating QB under Joey’s name that’s fraud unless DK was logged in under his own name. That would mean there was an arrangement perhaps and some protection for him. The large amounts of money will definitely hurt the prosecution and make DK look guilty as sin and maybe he is in an underhanded way.

Do you think DK encouraged Chase by planting the seed of doubt in his mind knowing that he was a desperate ticking time bomb. Maybe he set Joey up for murder by implying to Chase that he was losing his job. I don’t think that DK was involved physically with the murders but he may be involved psychologically. That could explain why DK knew Joey and family were probably gone for good and also why he would take a plea deal and testify. The prosecutors are hip to him. This is a sick bunch.

Thanks PAMom- if I might add a few facts to your post:

Joey had 2 QB online accounts- I want to address the fact that means that his “activity report” is different than an “audit trail” report. I mention only because to your point- every log in and in this case as we know “remote access” is logged. What has not been presented, although we can assume based on the fact that testimony at the prelim specifies as to access to the QB account via the activity log- is when Joey accessed it over the given timeframe. In other words- if the theory is that Joey discovered the fraudulent check creations to his account and as a result was heading to fire Merritt- do his records reflect him logging onto QB to verify the data, change the password, alter settings, and the like? It is unclear to me so far if Joey had a direct online banking interface which reconciles directly with the account at log in ( or manual in 2010). If he did, that meant that the individual logging in (if he utilized the feature and according to the prelim the only checks written to this QB account began with the creation of “chasemerritt” this remains to be seen) knew how much was in the account “real time”. I would also add- that interface requires not only the QB pw and security measures from Feb 2010- but also Joey’s online banking access pw’s- if he utilized that option. In other words, to my knowledge in 2010, prior to QB’s cloud storage as well, if one logs into their QB account and wants to reconcile their bank accounts it also required the banking account sign in info to follow the 124bit enc standard.
One thing that keeps bothering me is that after re-reading the SW’s- the potential for fraud was brought to the attention of SDSO following a warrant to the bank, which of course means that occurred while they maintained jurisdiction. We also know Merritt was confronted in 2011 and admitted the check writing/cashing ( but stated he had permission and that it was payment for services rendered and gave no explanation or conflicting stories wrt to the backdating) Doesn’t the fact that the bank becomes aware of the fraud through the investigation in 2011 negate the possibility that Joey was made aware of it on the 3rd/4th by them?

The assertion that CM was about to be fired comes from only one source- Dan Kavanaugh- although it is refuted by many, including Patrick McStay who stated to Randy Kaye that CM was NOT about to be fired but that Joey was about to “give him some competition.” FWIW, CM cell ping ( if accurate) pinged off a tower of his “competition” the early morning of Feb 5th. (Upland)

I agree with you that I don’t see DK as complicit as a physical actor in the actual murders of the McStay family, but I have to go back to the fact that the very motive in this case, as provided by the State so far- is that Chase had a massive gambling debt and either liens from the IRS or impending liens and as a result began embezzling funds. I was told by a family member that a check for over $15K was received from Chase to Joey ( I believe it was for a job, iirc, and not a check written by CM) that was never mentioned in the prelim. I don’t know what any of this means until we see the actual testimony and business records- hopefully we will have a clearer understanding of what went on between the two. I don’t know what role DK played, except to say we know he accessed funds prior to anyone’s knowledge the family was missing, and as we now know- deceased.
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 21, 2015 at 11:13 am

Alli

I have not found a photo of CM’s white 3500 truck. Trucks sometimes have dual exhaust systems as factory installs. Large V-8 engines used in trucks with single exhaust systems often use four inch single exhaust with either a straight pipe that exits the vehicle under the rear bumper or exits on a forty-five degree angle in front of the rear tires on either side. It would depend on how the exhaust manifold is configured as to which side the pipe exits.

With the ability of muffler shops to bend exhaust pipe from straight pipe for custom installations, any arraignment is possible. After market changes are often done by people who wish to make their vehicle different from factory delivery. One of the problems that exhaust systems have is they must be “tuned” so as to prevent too little or too much back pressure on the engine. This is less of a problem today than formally because of the computer controlled combustion systems.
Gold prospector says:

August 21, 2015 at 2:42 pm

Alli. MM had a white truck which can be seen on his Precision fire Facebook page which oddly like the pictures of Chase we have all seen of him standing in dirt hole MM is also standing in a dirt hole. Creepy at the least, leaning toward weirdly disturbing. Rumors McCarger also drove a white truck but unless someone else can confirm just a rumor. Also I don’t know how the neighbors who said they saw a white truck on the 4th can be very credible because it was over 3 weeks before the Sheriff started knocking on neighbors doors. I know I couldn’t tell you what was parked in front of my neighbors house 3 weeks after the fact, especially because they were not even aware that anything was amiss. Just want to give my opinion because the neighbor and the white truck story has always bugged me.
Gold prospector says:

August 21, 2015 at 4:34 pm

EBAY link 2nd to last picture showing the tailpipe location on a 2000 C3500 HD Chevy HD utility truck. Pipe exits behide rear wheel passenger side. Second link 1995 Isuzu Trooper tailpipe exits drives side below rear bumper. So the neighbors ( Of course grainy )security video shows part of the wheel and tire on the passenger side and now a tailpipe too ! SD needs to fire every detective they have and start over. Why the Sheriff never released the video I don’t know but if they had there is no doubt that the online armchairs would have figured out what auto it was. Come on a tailpipe can be seen but the public still read comments like this one from Det. Dugal from the LA Times.
Piling into their Isuzu Trooper, parents Joseph and Summer and young sons Gianni and Joseph Jr. left behind two dogs, two bowls of popcorn and, soon, a mystery.

http://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-victorville-bodies-20131116-story.html
http://www.seattlecarzone.com/vehicle-details/1995-isuzu-trooper-s-suv-800d392ac42d2447a86e4bdf329bdbd6/
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevrolet-C-K-Pickup-3500-WORK-TRUCK-/161798845001?rmvSB=true

Not just that GP- but how is it that the SDCSO KNEW CM stole or forged checks or both upon receiving the account info via their SW and did not so much as use that info to further their investigation of him as a POI? And what did they use as confirmation that the family went to Mexico as a result, or comments that there was nothing touched in their bank accounts- I still do not understand that.

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A Texas Grandfather says:

August 22, 2015 at 9:27 am

This case reminds me of the Florida nincompoops being paid by a sheriff that allowed two alleged detectives to work for weeks and produce little to nothing in the way of records. (i.e. Jennifer K)

All across the country, in every county and every state there are competent and incompetent people working in LE and the courts. Most sheriffs and District attorneys are elected by the people. The people have often been lazy in their efforts to find top quality talent to elect to these very important jobs. No state is immune from having lazy uncaring people and some are just as crooked as the people they arrest.

Texas just sent to prison a judge that used a case when he was DA to give himself a political boost to get the judge appointment. He withheld evidence that would have proven the man indicted and convicted did not do the crime. It took 25 years to get the information to a court of appeals where the truth was discovered.

The legal system in general is in crisis mode. I was literally accepted to every law school I applied and my LSAT was 160, GPA for second undergrad 4.0. While that may sound impressive, lol, it is SOOO not, competitively, and I am the first person to say at my age and responsibility this chit does not come easily. Law school matriculation is down like 40% at least and graduates with private offers is so nil nobody is posting those results. It gets better- very high rate of malpractice possibility if one does not have the full intern rotations and just goes into private practice. Three of my professors were practicing trial lawyers who gave it up to go the academic route and told me- stick with your path as an analyst. This is going to sound self-serving of course ( what else is new- I am frequently insulted as a narcissist for talking about such matters ( how the hell that happens since I admitted to having to take ADV ALG 3times and Calc 2x I will never know.)

Here’s my thing- I think people pay very little attention to criminal element as it relates to their elected officials overall. Outside of high profile, who is really paying attention? I think the career path of LEA’s as investigators is the problem. As analysts, we are truth seekers, neutral parties that develop facts based on data (evidence or potential evidence) There needs to be top-down change. You can’t have a dog in the fight and be objective, imo.
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Gold prospector says:

August 22, 2015 at 12:33 pm

Can I take a guess at who the rival welder might be ? Could it be Walker’s custom sheet metal ? The reason this is my guess.

1. 9256 Center Ave. Rancho Cucamonga is duel address used by Walker’s and CBP Investments.
2. Joseph’s last call on Feb 4th just before the meeting with Chase (And the last call to anyone other than Chase )was to Walker’s welding in Hopeville Virginia. owner Warren Walker used to live in Rancho Cucamonga and might be related to Richard walker owner of Walker’s sheet metal.
http://walkerscustomsheetmetal.com/
http://www.whereorg.com/cbp-investments-1551349

GP- one was Randy Miner, owner Living Waters Fountains. According to documents I have reviewed- he ended up at a loss. I agree that your comment about Joey’s last cell activity and I can say after analyzing his records it is an anomaly over the almost full month prior and that is ALWAYS want analysts look for, but many are not aware that Joey’s eip line was forwarded directly to his cell so the calls you see as incoming eip- could have been clients, prospective clients or the like- and because he could not tell who was on the other line, as you could also see from his records he almost always took those calls. Ostensibly, one scenario is that if someone knew this, and could not get him to pick up his regular cell line, they could call through the eip line. I believe this will be a line of testimony by SA Kevin Boles at trial more specifically as imo, this included communication from that day between CM and Joey.
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A Texas Grandfather says:

August 22, 2015 at 5:28 pm

Thanks for your links GP

The 1999 Chevy 3500 work truck was purchased without a bed and a 3rd party work area was added. One of the old mfg. of these work areas is a company named Koenig. They also build heavy duty winches and flat beds for five & six ton trucks used in oil field maintenance and construction.

This particular work area could have been used for electrical or plumbing. You are correct about the exhaust being on the passenger side behind the wheel. The related photo of the Trooper shows the exhaust on the drivers side, but it too is angled at 45 degrees behind the wheel.

Many people, including some of those in LE, do not pay attention to vehicles in a way that specifically identifies features on it. I have an expression for people with that behavior. It is “they look, but they don’t see”. Seeing is engaging the brain to store the information for recall. ATG I believe the detective at the prelim got the model wrong- in the SW’s it is identified as a 2000. I am assuming that is correct because it had a corresponding VIn and Plate ( redacted)

His truck is a def 8 cyl, RWD diesel. As I recall, aren’t all C3500 extended cabs?

Here is a pic, to include his truck with the red tie downs that may or may not be included in the graves, and as you can see a bobcat, shop towels and woven material in the back and under the fountain.
Rose says:

August 22, 2015 at 8:53 pm

Blink. I heard an npr whatever 1-2 weeks ago that mba and md still are worth the cost (and loans) but jd is def not because of an oversarurated & abysmal job market. So stick with applied crim…

Thanks Rose- that is exactly my path-
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A Texas Grandfather says:

August 22, 2015 at 10:44 pm

There was a change in the 2000 model year as is done every few years to keep up with technology.

The photo shows a truck with a standard cab and an after market work bed with tool boxes on each side, a pipe rack on the passenger side and a bed area that is open. The little red nylon tie-downs have a hook and ratchet take-up system. I keep four of them in the door pocket of the extended cab on my truck. The tool boxes are long and can store long handle shovels. It would not be a surprise to me that those boxes held one or more short handled sharp-shooter shovels,a long handle round nose shovel and a square point.

The lighting at the rear of the truck uses round mounts for all of the functions which is quite different from the factory beds. That should be easily spotted in a surveillance video. Whoever first looked at that video from LE didn’t know anything about vehicles.

Beginning with the 3500 series one ton Chevy trucks there are two large gasoline V-8′s and a V-8 diesel engines available. Diesel engines have greater torque output at low rpm and diesel fuel has more BTU’s per gallon than gasoline. Therefore the ton miles per gallon is greater than that for gasoline.

Ton miles per gallon is the proper way to measure fuel consumption. The high mileage of small cars with three and four cylinder engines is a myth. A truck that weighs 5,000 lbs and gets 24 or 26 miles to the gallon is more fuel efficient than a VW or Fiat that gets 38 miles per gallon with a vehicle weight of 1500 to 1800 lbs.
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 22, 2015 at 11:08 pm

There is a second truck in the photo with a standard bed. It is located behind the fabrication sitting on the furniture dolly. It is not white and appears to be a short bed. The color could be silver or light brown with a clearcote finish. The license plate is not visible nor is the photo clear enough to read the inscription on the lift gate.

The fabrication is either stainless steel or polished aluminum frame with glass or plexi-glass inserts. Both stainless and aluminum require different welding techniques than plain steel.

Some people have trouble with math. The main reason is that math is mostly taught by people who are teaching from rote. They don’t understand it either, they just know the answers and the process required by the lesson material. This begins in primary school and continues all through the system. The result is people in retail no longer can count money properly and high school grads have to take make-up courses to meet the requirement for college work.

An eighth grade graduate in the 19th century was better educated than the majority of 12th grade students graduating after 1960. A sad commentary on our failing educational system.

the pickup belongs to an associate, not Chase, but it does go to show how large the facility is. There are multiple pics I have that show white cording and white extension cords- it should be very interesting to see the cell phone data of Summer during this afternoon. My opinion only- there is no verifiable data that Joey ever made it back to Fallbrook on Feb 4th, 2010.

On the math, LOL, I would offer that I did have un-diagnosed ADD as a kid, and I was not a fan of the monotony of it but I got there ( kicking and screaming really).
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Alli says:

August 23, 2015 at 10:48 am

Thanks to all who answered my questions. GP, I checked the Precision FB and saw several white trucks in the photos that look like Chase’s. I also noticed a bobcat in his photos.

Texas Grandfather noted a bobcat in the warehouse picture. Does anybody know if Mike shared equipment with EIP?

Now I have another question. In the Steph Watts video, it sounds like Mike describes Chase’s truck as an old Chevy SBC 2500. Was Mike wrong in his description of Chase’s truck or did Chase have more than one truck being a 3500 is being discussed here?

3:40
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GbvPKlj_a5M

The truck the testimony at the prelim refers to has the wrong year (1999) and iirc, model as the 2500. However, according to the SW’s it is a Chevy C3500 2000.

Just to clarify, the image posted was mine, not ATG’s , I mention only because he may not be aware of some of the details of it and he is a facts guy all the way, lol!
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Ode says:

August 23, 2015 at 11:57 am

I am wondering Blink, if Joey never made it home that night do you believe his truck did? Was it parked in the drive way when the white truck leaving was videoed? Blocking view maybe? They never talk in the media about the McStay’s green truck that Joey drove. A second person could have driven Joey’s truck home. That person stays after the white truck leaves and gets on the home computer. I wonder if then they drove the Trooper away after that? If the video only catches one white truck leaving why does it not show the arrival of any of the vehicles? Perhaps you need to be turning to go a certain direction both into the driveway and out of the driveway for the camera to catch your vehicle.
1,2, or 3 trucks entering and leaving and only one caught on camera does not add up…..it’s bad MATH.

The storage facility (as you saw) can easily hold 2 trucks inside with the doors down. I agree with you that the video does not show an arrival, so in my book, that truck is parked there before dark. Additionally, to my knowledge, there is no other footage from that camera for the balance of 2/4. I don’t know if there is more for other days but I doubt it and I don’t believe the footage and it’s enhancements can be conclusive enough for an expert to the exclusion of others so let’s hold that theory to the left at the moment.

I feel like we are working with a timeline to be consistent with the bulk of the ruse or acts that are centered around the home, at 5:47-5:48 PM. Here’s why. We know Joey’s phone pings home, while up through 5:48 Chase’s pings in RC. At 5:47PM a simultaneous call to Chase, and texts between Joey and Summer’s phones occur. Nobody is going to ever tell me that can be a coinky. And if Merritt’s phone is in RC ( and I am going to bet the storage) if he was working alone, my guess is he had Joey’s phone ( again, only calls from it the balance of the day are to CM phone) drove to the house under the auspice of painting and either forced them out of the house via ruse, arrived suggesting a ruse ( Joey was in an accident, blah, blah) or murdered Summer and the boys in the home. ( Not going to lie- I do not see that but let’s agree to keep an open mind). What I think the more likely scenario is that CM phone was with an accomplice and the 5:47 back and forth was one of the two confirming Summer was intercepted. In my book, only one truck returning means Joey would have to be incapacitated or not with it- if we agree the truck leaving is Merritts. Hope that made sense, lol.
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Ode says:

August 23, 2015 at 1:25 pm

If someone was backing up it would be possible to only see one rear quarter of a truck so that could mean lots of things could be happening in the driveway you can not see. For some reason I thought that the truck on video that night had backed into the driveway.

I was assured of that myself.
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Ode says:

August 23, 2015 at 1:34 pm

Disregard all the video stuff…I just am confused. It is frustrating because I would really like to know about Joey’s car. I wondered if it was swabbed? I did see pictures of them photographing inside the truck with the doors open when they first started investigating.

The trooper definitely was. CM was minor contributor on steering wheel, gearshift and I believe trace on 4×4 and I think radio/heat controls.

If you are referring to the green pick up, although many have said it was not, I believe it was field tested as indicated by the warrants AND.. I don’t know the date, but I have a pic of the Isuzu in the inpound next to a green pick up very similar to the one Summer drove.
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Gold prospector says:

August 23, 2015 at 5:59 pm

Ok going to try and make a point without going over the line and since I am not sure where that line is because I haven’t been around that long lol I just don’t want to have complete tunnel vision on this case just yet. Because Precision fire system Facebook page shows a white truck with the PFS logo on it, This truck which I think ATG would know but my guess looking at other trucks similar looks like a 2008 Ford F150 and the tailpipe is in the exact same place that the Chevy truck in the photo above. Picture 9 of the 61 pics and pic 21 less interesting but a pic of a mini sledge hammer. So the neighbors video that the SDSD thought was the Trooper the whole time must really not show much of the truck body. assuming the tire and tailpipe and enough of the truck body to know it is white is all. Point being that I don’t think that video is going to be used in court as evidence but really want your opinions is why I am bringing it up. I could be very wrong but gut say’s I am not. Thanks

For the record, I do not believe Mike McStay has any involvement in what happened to the McStay family. That said, I don’t believe the enhanced video ever comes in at trial unless the defense sees it as advantageous to them.
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A Texas Grandfather says:

August 23, 2015 at 9:36 pm

In clarifying about the warehouse. I saw the bobcat parked near the wall. It was new or had recently been repainted. It could have been a part of the shop equipment via purchase or lease. Bobcats are able to be customized and range between 28 to 40 thousand dollars in price.

The warehouse is probably 40 ft. wide and 60 ft. long or approximately 2400 Sq. Ft. If the warehouse is in a commercial center, the walls between units are normally on 10 ft. centers unless a tenant requires something different.

Chevy pickup trucks are 1500 series 1/2 ton, 2500 series 3/4 ton and 3500 series 1 ton.

Don’t think the neighbors video surveillance system just worked after dark. Most are operational 24/7. This tells me that LE had access to video of the area for several days. Did they have the smarts to spend time on viewing more than just a small segment of that time period? I don’t have that information.

Just like Sgt. Joe Friday, “just give me the facts mam” is my operational mode. 1950′s detective TV for those that are unfamiliar.

LOL- any thoughts on the ability for the 3500 to tow an 1995 Isuzu trooper? And I am off to check my facts so I apologize if I am wrong, but my limited research suggests the 3500 is always extended cab?
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Gold prospector says:

August 23, 2015 at 11:40 pm

From the warrants. I guess this is why they think that they were killed in the home.. WEAK..The paint stain on Summer’s bra are consistent with her laying on her side when the paint dripped and her being found with a robe without a shirt, consistent wit her having the robe on at the time of the paint spilling on her. This indicates the crime scene occurred at the residence.

And I need help understanding what this from the warrants means. This statement to me is like the detective who said the dirt looked disturbed and then put back. I guess I am just a Dah or maybe not they are.

On Feb 8, 2010, the internet to the computer was accessed and the address of 17037 Brookhurst Street, in the City of Fountain Valley was revealed. It was determined the location had five suites, one belonged to a former customer of EIP and the other was a T-Mobile service center. Did someone go into that service center in order to gain access to the McStay’s cell phones.

I think we should keep in mind ( at least I am very hopeful) that verbiage on the search warrants is used to secure them. They need a judge to use his 4 corners “view” to sign off on the probable cause, and that the evidence secured during it’s execution was done so properly.

I need to review that part of the SW again, I know who the client was and CM was definitely a part of that project the week of the disappearance at last.
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Gold prospector says:

August 23, 2015 at 11:43 pm

What computer ? Joseph’s computer ? On the 8th ? What former EIP customer ? What site did they go to while they were sitting in a T Mobile or a former client of EIP ? LOL come on a former client ?
Rose says:

August 24, 2015 at 12:52 am

OT

@atg

wrt Sgt Friday.

I hear him every Sunday night, including tonight.
try a Free app called Tunedin radio.
then find & set 88.5 WAMU.

each Sunday evening, 3 hours of old radio shows on
The Big Broadcast with Ex Walker.
I streamed it tonite as I drove in the South.
Rose says:

August 24, 2015 at 12:57 am

referring to cm’s accomplice,
do you mean a female companion?
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 24, 2015 at 4:55 pm

Yes the ISUZU could be towed by another vehicle. Blinks question raises the possibility of how someone like CM could have placed the ISUZU at the border himself without any help.

I have a set of tow-bars that have been in my set of tools since 1958. I often traveled alone to a new construction location. I had a company car, but if needed, it was available for use by others on the engineering team. Knowing this, I had a welding shop fabricate a special hitch to mount on my 1958 Buick that used a long bolt to attach the tow bar to it. I was towing a 1957 ford at the time.

Today,with the advent of receiver type hitches, it is easy to duplicate a tow set-up. Northern Tools and others sell tow-bars as well as a hitch insert for a receiver type hitch that allows a long bolt to be used for the attachment of the tow-bar.

More Truck Information

Ford ,as does Chevy, has a system of load capacity and physical size designation as a part of their model number. The 150 is a 1/2 ton truck, 250 is a 3/4 ton and 350 is a 1/1/2 ton truck. Their heavy trucks go all the way to F-800 which is a heavy construction truck that can support “gin-poles” for lifting objects attached to a winch line.

The 3500 line is like any other truck regarding the cab possibilities. An extended cab today is larger than those built in the 1990′s. A standard cab has about 6 inches or a little more behind the seat for small items or items that are long and thin. Keep in mind that the frame length is a constant that does not change on regular production. If the cab is extended, then space must be taken from the bed area to accommodate it.

Right! And wouldn’t that mean tracks from such a vehicle would reflect the commensurate payload in the rear v the front?
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A Texas Grandfather says:

August 24, 2015 at 6:46 pm

Gold Prospector

Soil that has been dug out by hand or machinery will show signs of a disturbance- termed disturbed earth- for quite a length of time depending on the amount of rain and the type of soil. With desert soils receiving so little moisture, disturbed earth may take several years before it blends in with the surrounding soil. In this case, it was perhaps visible after four years. Disturbed earth captures air when it is turned and replaced in an excavation. Unless one leaves a mound of dirt over the excavation when back-filling, it will create a depression as it compacts over time.
Gold prospector says:

August 24, 2015 at 7:29 pm

Thanks Texas Grandfather. You know I didn’t know the term disturbed earth. I mean I knew what he meant kinda but didn’t really know that there was a term used. So basically the Detective wasn’t saying anything other than there was an area of dirt that was disturbed meaning dug up and then put back.. Ha Ha Yep I think I was trying to make something out of nothing. Thanks again

GP- that detective is going to need to clarify that statement during his testimony and if it favors him- the defence’s cross. It was unclear to everyone and certainly can create improper inference.
B
Gold prospector says:

August 24, 2015 at 7:41 pm

GP- if it is ok with you, I am not posting your last post answering my question, lol, because I believe it gives plenty of identifying info about you and I support everyone’s expectation of personal privacy here.
B
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 24, 2015 at 8:43 pm

Pickup trucks are notoriously light in the rear when not carrying a load. Fully 60 percent and sometimes more of the empty weight is on the front-caused by engine weight . A tool bed configuration would change the ratio of front to back weight. A load of 1,000 lbs on the bed would be the limit of a 1/2 ton truck (axle and springs limitations). The max live weight on a 3500 would be 3,000 lbs. Ford and Chevrolet both have options where a truck can be configured with and extended cab and still have a full length 8 ft. bed area. These are special order options from the factory.

Four people consisting of two adults and two small children would add at most an additional 400 lbs.

The trooper line was discontinued beginning with the 2002 model year. There are several different engine and transmission options on the Troopers built prior to 2002. The curb weight varies between 3750 and 4250 lbs. I don’t have any information on the type of transmission in the McStays’s Trooper. Two automatic and one std. transmission options were available. Towing a vehicle with a std. transmission is simpler than one with an automatic. All one has to do is to place the gear shift in neutral. There are other things that must be done for some vehicles such as those with a front wheel drive. Those cannot be towed except on a dolly where the front wheels are on the dolly.

Thanks ATG-
B
Alli says:

August 24, 2015 at 8:58 pm

This is just a test. I’m not certain my comments are coming through to you, Blink. I’m not getting the usual waiting moderation message after I submit.

Alli, everything I have for you is posted- please be sure and refresh the page or comments.
B
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 25, 2015 at 12:48 am

All this detail and information we are discussing on this and other threads are things that make a detective job difficult. It takes a person with a curiosity about everything and a willingness to be in learning or discovery mode all the time to become a good one. It also helps to develop a good memory and in today’s world of computers and smart phones be willing to learn to use them with confidence.
Gold prospector says:

August 25, 2015 at 2:15 pm

DNA evidence looks weak to me if you have a visual of the Isuzu Trooper’s interior. Look at the location of the 4×4 gearshift and Radio/AC knobs. Chase said he never drove the Trooper but was a passenger 6 weeks prior. The 4×4 gearshift has nothing to do with street driving and is right next to the passenger seat, with the AC/radio knobs not a unusual place for a passenger to engage do you think that this evidence can hold water in court ? especially since they have no evidence of Chase ever being near San ysidro

http://gtcarlot.com/gallery/34764783.html

I have seen many people find this “presentation” and I will call it presentation because in a preliminary hearing, it is not evidence- that all encompassing word everyone loves to throw around. As I have posted several times in several places, CA prop 115 allows investigators to testify beyond their “expertise” and use the familiar knowledge they have to present findings to render a ruling from a judge that:
1. a crime was committed
2. There is enough “evidence” to infer or conclude ( Judge’s words) that the defendant committed it.

To offer a visual- it is the equivalent over driving slowly over a speed bump vs. needing a pass to open a gate for access. In this case, I DO BELIEVE we are seeing a great deal of the case in chief “menu” but it is very important to remember that after the case is bound over, there is still an ongoing investigation (usually linked to the DA office review and the defense movements- motions to come later) AND in every high profile case I am aware of- since the defendant is in custody- many civilians who may have knowledge or information feel compelled to forward that in either direction.

This standard is entirely different at trial. Unlike posts I have read, in criminal evidence, CA adopts the FRE as it relates to Article VII rule 702, although I do admit the adaption to it under CA evidence code is actually stricter. All “evidence laws” derive from common law- FRE to what is called the Unified Code of evidence or UCE. California has its own- California Evidence Code or CEC. Practitioners in CA in both Federal and criminal or civil court must take a lot of ibuprofen.

That said, to your point, it is going to depend on a variety of factors- 1. is the DNA finding relevant to the instant matter to assert it’s truth? In CA- in particular, the finding of the expert field interestingly enough moves to “methods” in reaching the opinion by the expert than the experts opinion itself. At that point, it moves to peer review and whether the expert testimony is based on the “methods” and if same are generally accepted science, peer reviewed, etc, etc.

There is going to be a DNA expert at trial, I don’t know if that will be covering both the autopsy protocol confirmations et al, as well as any and all DNA findings hoping to be submitted or not. I have said before, I do not believe so far that secondary (minor) DNA is the smoking gun people seem to want to glom to- but I don’t think like most it is being offered as proof of anything but rather to impeach Merritt’s interview that he was in the vehicle but never drove it. Sometime’s prosecutors set up their case ( and this will be one) that the only way a defendant can attempt to overcome the totality of evidence is to testify directly. Chase spent a great deal of time with Joey, on jobs, at each others homes, Chase was at the home the day before the disappearance- this can absolutely be considered secondary transfer and it cannot be excluded by any expert I am aware of-

Now, the defense will also have an expert to rebut (potentially) if that evidence makes it in- and here is the converse of that. There is no direct evidence nor DNA evidence to support the murders occurred in that home. There is a big risk in a case like this to make it a “DNA” case because the reality is their is an egregious lack of it and what there is does not tie the defendant to the crime whatsoever. Can it? Possibly if other factors come in and a jury has the ability to weigh that evidence accordingly. So does an expert want to be asked why there is no DNA or other samples found in the home by anyone that was submitted for testing or if there was- in his opinion, has he ever worked on a case with a quadruple homicide that yielded no evidence of same at the crime scene? Of course not. This jury will need the complete picture of events to convict a man to death in what I personally consider one of the most brutal crimes I am aware of. There’s more that is going to be a smoke screen of sorts, potentially.

Lastly- I sincerely hope that the state is not intending to present times when CM phone did not ping for whatever reason as evidence he had time to do some of the deeds he is accused of. SA Boles is on record that he verified that he reviewed CM pings for 6mos- 1 year back. The defense will have those records going in.

I actually truly agree with Sgt Chris Fischer. He said emphatically this case had no smoking gun because it does not. Unfortunately, I believe the stronger case is that Joey was killed in the “business building he and Merritt shared”. That said, then it should be very interesting to finally see what Summer’s cell records and the landline records report.
Gold prospector says:

August 25, 2015 at 4:14 pm

Totally cool of you to spend the time explaining this. Although some of it is still going over my head I now have an agenda to educate. where before I had no direction. much appreciated
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 25, 2015 at 6:38 pm

With the type of evidence presented at the preliminary hearing, I am hopeful that the prosecution has better information tying CM to the crime. Maybe at the place of business, perhaps the home-although doubtful, and at the burial site.

And just so that everyone has the information about the LSAT score Blink made on the test. (see her reply to me at #10 on this page) I just finished reading a study done by a professor at North Texas University of scores reported by LSAC, the agency responsible for administrating the test program. The study covered three years of tests and were averaged. The study also looked at the average scores by 32 school majors. The top scores average were 160 by physics and math majors, a full eight points above the average score for a person working on a criminal justice degree.

We all knew Blink was smart and this proves it. Congratulations for a job well done.

Heart u ATG- as you know. I did not know this and I am not going to lie- I am an emotive gal so it made me cry. Not because it is a great score, but because you said what you did for encouragement. If this is accurate- I relish the fact that I could score along those who are excelling in an academic field I would likely not “grace the hall of”.
Lol- the bigger question is how many of those majors are seeking JD’s?

I am a firm believer in the ego defloatation device, all about the faith on that.

WRT the presentations at the prelim- no direct attachment to CM in any capacity- no idea at the moment what that means
B
Goat says:

August 25, 2015 at 8:29 pm

This is off the wall.
Just a thought.
With the savagry that they were killed.
Could it be that summer,hoping to get chase fired, knowing that chase owed a lot of money and was not paying Joey, told Joey that chase was coming on to her, though false. It would explain his firing and also the violence to summer.
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 26, 2015 at 10:10 am

Your welcome B

I was not sure of the LSAT score you made regarding it being high or low, so I took some time to find out. The report referenced was a summary and did not show the methodology and details of the actual study. It did show however that the non-scored section four with the 500 word limit on taking both sides of the argument of a particular subject were not being used by many of the schools. Is it because young people are not using and have not been exposed to good writing skills? I don’t know.

The post I made about the needed skills for a detective are not just limited to one profession. The very same skills are needed for most successful work situations. When my children were in school, especially as teens, they often had questions that required research to find answers. Research in those days was a lot more difficult than today. No personal computers and no internet,just libraries. The girls were especially grateful for the way I helped them to get answers. They shared this with their mother and I did not find out about their appreciation until years later when Mrs ATG shared the information.

The LSAT was developed as a tool to help administrators determine the probability of success in the first year of law school. The study did not look further than that year. The number of LSAT tests in one year was over 166,000. Just how many of the test takers continued to obtain a JD degree was not reported.

All of us are on the planet for the purpose of learning and making our communities a better place in the process. To do this requires an open mind and a desire to help others in a meaningful way. This is a form of love.

XOXO

xoxo.
I completely agree about the skills not just applied to investigators et al.
B
Gold prospector says:

August 26, 2015 at 7:52 pm

I have been struggling some because my thinking about this case and trying to stay with the white hats and believe they must have the right person who carried out this heinous crime vs No they don’t.. The whole Chase was getting fired bla bla but have this person over for pizza and help build a shed and continue to engage in the over the top communication co dependent relationship they had just doesn’t make sense. The DNA moot. The checks I think is something Joseph and Chase may have discussed and decided to use an old QuickBooks account as a way to run his business without the prying eyes of a ruthless SEO DK from taking whatever he thought he deserved which by his emails was 50/50 . And this may be they came up with . Now the pings is where I get stuck, I cant find a way around it, which leaves me right back to square one

I get the stream of consciousness post GP- Hopefully when you have a chance to think it through as to the form of a question for me (if you have one) I can answer, lol.
B
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 26, 2015 at 11:15 pm

GP

I have to disagree with your thoughts about Joseph and Chase agreeing to run the business from an old QB account. The journal in QB is used as an audit trail for all transactions. It recorded all the creations of the company name in lower case including the back and forth of writing checks and then deleting them. It also showed the backdated activities after Joey and family were killed. The clincher is the effort Chase went to with the Intuit help desk to get the new company information removed from the records. In that effort, chase claimed to be Joey and the caller ID of the Intuit phone system showed the call was placed from chase’s phone number.

One of the most compelling things for me in this case wrt the QB account is the “custom” account was 2 years old and no checks had ever been written from it. Chase did have and cashed a handwritten check from the EIP account for $200. I re-read the SW’s and the prelim a few more times, Joey’s QB account was an online version and the software was not on his hard drive nor connected to a bank so he really was using that account as a ledger. Which means, he had no real time accounting reconciliation with it. The SW says that the bank was NOT alerted to the fraudulent activity until the SDCSD brought the discrepancies in check signatures to their attention, and I presume that coincides with CM’s July 2011 admission that he “wrote them” for work he preformed( said he had Joey’s permission) and offered no explanation as to why he backdated them. The old EIP checkbook was requested of the family, was received, and it appeared about 76 uncashed checks were missing.

Here’s my thing- If the impetus for the alleged “firing” which to date, is solely on DK’s word that I am aware of- and even then, I have seen am email from DK (source withheld) that said Susan Blake fired Chase for stealing from her- which, as you know was likely months later.

There was another account involved I have yet to see mentioned, so I am not, but it would coincide with another reason Joey was on with the bank. There is activity in terms of log in by Joey on the 4th into the QB- log in only apparently, no transactions from his home- we know the computer underwent forensic analysis so I am going to assume that was fruitful with the exception I know that some family accessed his laptop and may have accessed the desktop- no idea how that will factor because it could dilute the chain of custody protocol.

Long way around to say- right now, I am not convinced Joey knew that first check was cashed because his bank was not connected to the account, and it was a new statement period. I don’t have the answer but it seems to me that although the state is not obligated to prove the motive per se- they really need to in a quadruple homicide of the most violent kind I have ever seen.- and that is saying a lot.
B
Goat says:

August 26, 2015 at 11:24 pm

What baffles me is a motive, if Chase did it. It appears that summer was the most brutally beaten. Why. Had to be a fit of uncontrolled rage. Why????

If I am looking strictly at the wound infliction- and I want to be clear- NOBODY and I mean NOBODY can profile this facet of the case without a full autopsy protocol review, anthropology study and medico legal findings contributing to same- I know there is information missing because the SW’s are still looking for two other prospective weapons.

Joey’s total wounds and his remains condition at recovery does not match any other family member. He is also bound by the neck with a knotted white extention cord, wrapped in a tan woven material ( some believe is the futon cover- however, if it does not have zippers or evidence it once had zippers, it is not) and he is then secured by red tie downs of some kind. He is the only victim appearing to be fully clothed and his tibia is literally broken in half and his posterior rib is broken prior to the fractures to his skull, one of which, produces a depressed void of his posterior skull. ( this is a purposeful simplistic interpretation). I should also note that the child’s remains from the same grave were mostly unearthed, as well as Summer’s bra entangled with a second red tie down under a greasewood plant. For me, and I know for any criminal investigative analyst the anomaly is always the priority to “conclusion”. I am not sure if you have viewed some of the pics of the warehouse/workshop in this thread- but it literally has every item in it that the DA was attributing to the home. I maintain my belief that Joey never left that warehouse alive. Nobody will ever convince me one person exacted these wounds in one location on 4 individuals without alerting a neighbor, who was paranoid enough to have a camera, or leave a scintilla of physical evidence of same. I am not alone by a longshot in that. And I realize the counter is always how they were dressed. There are numerous videos of Joey to include him in short sleeves, shorts, flip flops and I think I have seen exactly one where had pants on and that may have been his wedding. There is video of him in the trooper with his feet on the dash barefooted with one of the boys in the back asking to take their shoes off. There is video of G at a home where he immediately took off his flip flops, placed them on the back of the truck, and was running around barefoot the entire time. I would agree that I do not think Summer would take the children out without proper attire in a normal environment- but it would seem to me the house appeared very much that they left in a hurry, with no evidence of a crime or struggle anywhere.

That said- you are asking to have the incongruity explained to you for such an evil and vulgar act just like a jury will- and in my view, I am not sure the State will ever have that answer satisfactorily.

B
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 27, 2015 at 2:33 pm

The new information that Blink just revealed about the QB accounts tells me that Joey knew very little about how to run the accounting side of the business. This is quite common where salesmen types and workmen with little exposure to how a business keeps up with receipts and expenditures operate. Joey probably used an accounting firm to prepare his business taxes with the IRS.

I am not surprised that the bank did not catch the forged signatures. People who work at tellers positions today are a lot less educated and trained than those who worked in the decades prior to 1980. Mrs ATG worked in banking from 1950 until 1985. She could spot a likely bad signature or a counterfeit bill almost instantly.

Storing business records exclusively “in the cloud” is very troubling to me. As an off-site backup, the cloud makes sense.

ATG- I would never do my own business taxes, lol. Unless the checks were side by side, I am not sure how anyone would pick up on it- but my point is – isn’t the allegation that Joey figures this out with the banks input and therefore they would have known yet no risk procedures are applied to an insured account with that kind of funds? It’s definitely not protocol and makes no sense to me still.
B
Gold prospector says:

August 28, 2015 at 12:49 am

LOL you are right, where was my question ? Dah ! I guess I wanted to see if you thought it might be a sound argument. Today I do have a question. Dugal said he got a DNA swab from Chase because the Trooper was a missing person case but could be crime case in the future, he wanted to get his DNA for exclusionary reason because he would expect to find Chase’s DNA in it. So how is this evidence of guilt ? And the last question do you think he meant McStay but just weird misspeaking saying McCarger

Q Did — during the course of that interview, did Detective
25 Fisk ask the defendant at least twice if he had ever driven the
26 Isuzu Trooper?
27 A Yes.
28 Q And what — what was the defendant’s response?
64
1 A He said he had not.
2 Q Did he tell you and Detective Fisk whether he had been in
3 the Trooper?
4 A Yes.
5 Q What did he tell you?
6 A He had been in it on at least one occasion or more. And
7 the last time he could immediately recall being in the Isuzu
8 Trooper was weeks before our interview on February 17th of 2010,
9 when he went to play paintball with Joseph.
10 Q But he indicated that he was the front passenger during
11 that time?
12 A Yes
Q And at the end of the interview, at some point during
2 that interview, did you obtain a buccal swab from the defendant?
3 A I did.
4 Q And could you describe for us what that is and what you
5 did in this case?
6 A Essentially, because it was a missing person’s case and I
7 had knowledge that Charles Merritt was going to be some type of
8 business associate and that he had been in the McStay vehicle,
9 which I knew I needed to process, I wanted to collect his DNA
10 for one of two purposes.
11 Well, it’s evidence. But it’s evidence of a potential
12 crime in the future, or it’s exclusionary evidence, to extract
13 his DNA when we find it inside the vehicle. And I asked him for
14 his consent to submit to that. And he did.
15 Q Okay. What is that
27 evidence, DNA, fingerprints, photographs, whatever we find.
28 Q During any of your contacts with the defendant, do you
67
1 recall him telling you that it took exactly one hour for him to
2 drive from his residence to the McCarger residence?
3 A Yes.

First my opinion on his minor contributing DNA located within points of the vehicle- It is NOT evidence of his guilt in 4 homicides whatsoever and I say that before anyone has reviewed the lab reports and testing methods associated with it. He admitted he was in the vehicle when asked and as you point out ( and I recall Drugal stating in a TV show that nothing was found in the trooper that was not expected to be there or words to that effect) when now we learn that the intimation was that Merritt’s DNA was never tested until a few months prior to his arrest? Can that be accurate, or is it possible SDCSD got a different result, the same result, or some other permutation? If it truly was never tested before Sept 2014 than to me it is also clear that Merritt was never a suspect to SDCSD which boggles my mind even further because you read as well as I did that in July 2011 they confronted Merritt about the “bank fraud”. So long way around to answer you ( or thorough I like to call it, lol) but I think the State’s intention was to relay this result in the context that they will be able to use CM’s prior comments to impeach his credibility over using it as some physical evidence he killed anyone and lay the foundation as to .. if he moved the vehicle than he must have murdered them, what other reasonable conclusion can one reach? That said, I have outlined the problems with that theory. It can’t be admitted without an expert and said expert’s “process and methods” and unless that can also exclude the possibility that it was secondary transfer from someone sitting in the passenger seat, from Joey simply shaking his hand at lunch, or handling something in the shop Chase also handled or someone moving the vehicle at a job site for 30 seconds all it does is support that when asked, Chase Merritt admitted to being in the vehicle and voluntarily gave a DNA sample investigators expected to find. The converse is if he had something to hide, why would he? From there- we go- how did he get the vehicle and when, to coincide with the timeline?

Yes, I believe he meant McStay.
B
Gold prospector says:

August 28, 2015 at 12:58 am

Question lol . Are comments like the one below from a CNN show from friends and family allowed to be used by the defense ? I added a few of my own thoughts only because the comments needed to be explained so as why I would even ask a question about them.

MICHAEL MCSTAY: My mom said “Oh, Chase just left here. He just drove by Joey’s house.” I’m talking with Chase everyday.
Susan Mcstay from Disapeared.. ” I lived 3 hours to the North of Joey ” ( No she didnt she lived in Corona, why lie ? Because she wanted an excuse why she didnt go with CHase or drive herself to check on the family. Whatever reason she is lying.
why she didnt go with Chase or drive herself to check on the family.
Susan Mcstay : ” Joey called me and said he wasnt feel well and he was going to pull over because he didnt feel he could drive.
that was the last time I talked to him.” ( So your son has been sick for months since Aug you said, was even in
the hospital for 2 weeks he was so sick, many days couldnt even get out of bed you said. But you still didnt
go to the house until the 17th to clean and look for finacial papers . OK thats normal

I have him in Fountain Brook in the AM and Corona on the 8th at 1:31PM- do you recall ( and please source) if Susan was referencing February 8th?
B
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 28, 2015 at 4:11 pm

A possible answer to Blinks question about the bank account and how Joey may have information about the forged check(s).

Joey may have called the bank to verify the current funds in the account and what checks had cleared. We don’t know if this was a procedure he normally used.

Often in a business that sells to others, where they operate on currently generated cash, it is necessary to verify that the funds from a check in a deposit have been received and are in the account. At the same time, the account owner can have the bank verify all the checks that have been written or what number have been paid out.

This is where the hidden activities of a bank (hidden only from the public in the details) take place. The checking systems in use across the country create a great deal of support work for them to work correctly.

If we look across the bottom of a check that has been through the total process and returned as a part of the monthly statement (today one has to pay extra to get them back) we will find some information in a strange type face. This type face was developed by the American Bankers Association and the Federal Reserve. It is called Magnetic Ink Code Recognition or MICR. Encoded across the bottom of the check in MICR are the instructions for the Federal Reserve district transit routing which includes information about the bank where the account is sited. Next is the actual account number. Last on the check bottom is the amount of the check. This last information is encoded automatically when the check is processed either individually at your bank for cash.

If a business account, someone will encode by hand or insert them into a machine with optical character recognition to first read the amount,then encode it in MICR. Finally a large number of checks to deposit is read by a large machine that can sort them into one of the twelve Federal Reserve Districts. Funds are not paid to an account until the Federal Reserve district electronically transfers them to your bank. Checks from an out of town bank can take as little as one day or as long as three days to be placed in your account.

There is a lot more to this process that I haven’t described, but those are details related to the electronic systems (computer)to produce input or output from an account.

Today, most banks have a customer on-line system that allows one to with a password, query an account via the internet 24/7.

As usual, you are in my wheelhouse, lol. Right out of school ( first round undergrad) I worked for First Data Corp for 8 years until I took my leave for Blinkette. Microbilt was an adjunct for retail purchases and reconciliation and in the office next to me was my colleague for check truncation and micr equipment. Now I bank from my phone which syncs to my QB. My only scan adjunct is for live receipts via neat, but that is a back up. Once I tag my receipts that are linked- I really only keep them as a scan of a paper copy. I do think 5 years ago is a very long time as it relates to accounting software and I DO admit my math aptitude drives my need for automation and backup
B
A Texas Grandfather says:

August 28, 2015 at 10:06 pm

All of the banking descriptions began in the late 1950′s and was the first effort to automate banking. The major changes was the advent of computer technology that was capable and cost effective. Large main frames and then smaller dedicated computers as technology advanced.

Blink or myself would require a short time to absorb the changes made since each of us worked in that area. The principles are the same while the tools both hardware and software are advancing at a steady rate. The current half-life of computing equipment and software is between 30 and 36 months.

After all of the descriptive workings of bank backroom work, do you think it possible for Joey to have queried the system as I described?

ATG- I am just not sure. All indications are that Joey paid bills through online banking, paypal, and 5 years ago that was pretty contemporary. He was constantly filming, and for a few weeks in the Fall prior to the murders, uploading his work and another home they were interested in. My point is- in general, someone doing those things then, with his business aspirations and understanding of SEO (DK) leads me to believe for him to strictly use the custom account for ledger purposes and hand writing checks incongruent with the technology he had access to. However, it could very well be that for reasons only he knew, he was concerned about the potential for what ultimately happened- would happen. Summer had her own accounts as well, which as she was a realtor (both were), If she had a QB account I am aware of it and I was told there was more $$ in her accounts than originally thought.

And then you have the fact that his vendors and sub contractors may have needed physical checks for the A/R practices.

Something that continues to bother me tremendously- Chase Merritt was sued and had judgements against him going back into the early 90′s- his biggest about a year before meeting Joey ( if he knew him 3 years as I was told) Every business he had belly-up, every partner he had, ended up suing, countless U/D’s. When I see this in conjunction with the IM between DK in Jan 2009- I ask myself- Do I believe Joey was a savvy business person and not just an artist? Yes, I do. But back to DK in 2009- in his IM Joey said “whether he makes $3K or $8K a month” it’s gone immediately ( or words to that effect). If I am looking at finances and I was given a figure of gross sales the previous year I am not disclosing without permission`- I don’t get it. Nothing fits so far ATG.

Completely O/T: I have the ledger of my maternal great grandfather who made his living during the depression and into the early 40′s by selling women’s silk stockings and undergarments to only those who could afford them, lol. He spent a lot of time in Atlantic City I am told.
B
Gold prospector says:

August 29, 2015 at 12:51 am

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2510247/Prime-suspect-McStay-murder-mystery-breaks-silence.html

‘On the fourth day I drove out to his house, stopping at his mother’s on the way. I asked if she’d heard from him and she said she hadn’t. She called Mikey (Joseph’s brother) and I suggested he meet me out there. I drove out, but Mikey didn’t call me

Also a Detective in the State v Charles Merritt said that Chase stopped by Susan Blake’s house on the way back from Joseph’s on the 9th and said she lived in Corona or he said she lived in Temescal valley which is a suburb or Corona.

Hang on-if Chase said he was going to Joeys, but stopped at the mother’s first he would have had to have been South of her, correct? That fits with him being in Fountain Brook in the am, Corona at 1:31 and heading north toward Mira Loma on the 15 at 1:42- correct?
B
Gold prospector says:

August 29, 2015 at 1:01 am

So I guess after Chase took the futon cover off to wrap Joseph’s body in he went and microwaved a bag of popcorn took out a couple of bowls from the cabinet, filled them with popcorn and sat then on the now coverless futon. Brother I am more inclined to believe the post from Summer’s Aunt who said that Susan and Mike threw the covers to the couch into the trash on the side of the house. But I don’t have a screen shot of that comment she made so we have to discount it as far as discussion, but really its me trying to give info to you knowing its against the ruuuuules lol

I get the snark GP. There is much garble to go around here. For me, if someone believes that the futon cover is what Joey was wrapped in, then you have to believe this happened in stages, and that a man that was beaten prior to the fatal blows did not alert to anyone in the house and “let’s start the popcorn.” I have read the theory that the person staged the popcorn and food on the counter. That seems ridiculous to me- for what purpose? If the killer humps the trooper to the border and the impetus is to have people believe they left willingly- then why in the world would anyone stage a scene to LOOK LIKE they were forced out of the home in a hurry? It’s incongruent. Unless, of course, as I believe is possible, that Summer and the boys were forced from the home.

I am very interested in that comment as well GP- there were no covers I saw removed from the home by the 23rd, just documents. But who knows how those got there considering everyone was bustling about the McStay home serving their own interests, apparently. For me, I have seen nothing so far to exclude if he is guilty that he acted alone, and plenty to conclude he likely did not.
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Gold prospector says:

August 29, 2015 at 12:53 pm

More info relating to post 44 above. This is jacked up. There is no other way for me to phrase it sorry but it is Jacked up, why ? I have read heard interviews from print and TV straight from the players mouths 20 different versions of how it all went down. Now MM talked to JM on the 4th, Joseph’s Phone records show no incoming/outgoing that they talked. ( He might have called the home phone ? I am not going to buy that one for many reasons or that Joseph had other numbers if he did they would have got SW for them)
Also said that Mike found out on the 8 from Patrick who found out from Chase and Mike physically went to the home on the 9th. Now we can expand the days that MM wasted calling the Sheriff because he went to the home and who knows what else he did that day but in keeping with the facts known this one where mike went to the home for the first time not on the 13th as he has said but on the 9th as he has never admitted or said before . What say you Blink.

Q Did he indicate how — how he became aware that Joseph,
2 Sr., and members of the family were missing, or people were
3 unable to get ahold of them?
4 A Michael actually talked to his father, Patrick, who was
5 alerted of the missing family by Joseph’s business partner,
6 Charles Chase Merritt.
7 Q Was that on February 8th of 2010?
8 A Yes, sir.

Did Michael indicate to you the last time he had actually
10 spoken to Joseph was about February 4th of 2010?
11 A I believe, yes.
12 Q And I slipped. Joseph, Sr.?
13 A Yes, sir.

14 Q After receiving the call from their dad, Patrick, did
15 Michael McStay say that, or indicate to you that he attempted to
16 contact Joseph, Sr.?
17 A He did.
18 Q And did he say he did that on February 9th of 2010?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And what did he say was the result of that attempt to
21 contact his brother, Joseph, Sr.?
22 A He was unable to contact him. Nobody was there at the
23 house.
24 Q Did he call or did he go to the house?
25 A He went out to the house.
26 Q Did he attempt to call as well?
27 THE COURT: What date was that?
28 THE WITNESS The 9th

I make it a policy to never reply to “what say you”, so if you don’t mind I hope we can dispense with that going forward, lol. Mike McStay was not at the home on the 9th, period. It is not unusual for detectives to get a date wrong with so many witnesses, however, they will be coached and have their reports and notes with them at trial and the prosecution will set that straight with them before their testimony.
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Gold prospector says:

August 29, 2015 at 1:07 pm

Ok sorry for so many post but I just now found this. Regarding post 44 you asked for source regarding SB living in Corona. Here it is

Recalled)
2 BY MR. IMES:
3 Q Detective Bachman, who is Susan Blake?
4 A Susan Blake is Joseph McStay Sr.’s, mother.
5 Q Did you have an occasion to speak with her during the
6 course of this investigation?
7 A I did.
8 Q Did you ask her, specifically, about events surrounding
9 February 9th of 2010?
10 A Yes.
11 Q What did she tell you in relation to speaking with the
12 defendant?
13 A Basically, that the defendant stopped at her house, had a
14 conversation about the fact he was going to check in on her son,
15 and would keep her updated on what he found out.
16 Q Did she say coming to or coming from?
17 A You — you know what, I’ll have to double-check to
18 confirm that one, sir.
19 Q Would it refresh your recollection to do so?
20 A Yes, sir.
21 Q Please do so.
22 MR. IMES: With the Court’s permission?
23 THE COURT: Sure.
24 (Brief pause.)
25 THE WITNESS: He was coming from.
26 THE COURT: Coming from where?
27 THE WITNESS: From the McStay residence.
28 Q (By Mr. Imes) And at the time did Miss Blake live in
138
1 what’s called the Glen Ivy area?
2 A That’s right.
3 Q Where is that?
4 A The Temescal Canyon area, down near Corona.
5 Q At some

He was def in Corona (or his phone) on 2/8 at at least 1:31PM. I know he was there in the morning as well- that can be found ( although let me warn you) as usual, I am the black sheep bearer of information until it is confirmed, however, it is supported by the SW’s we discussed previously about someone accessing the internet within the McStay home, from the location on Brookhurst. Yes, if you can believe it, my opinion was met with the “no it says someone was inside the home on the 8th”. That’s rich, because if that were true, it is confirmation there is once again activity where CM could not possibly be there. Nor can he be on his way to San Ysidro that morning. ( ref truck pulling out 7:47 and desktop access from 7:59-8:05) and Joey’s cell pinging in the same place at 8:28PM. ( no, it was excluded and some might say avoided altogether in the prelim) Let’s not forget the SW is supported by the narrative that “suspects” take the phones to… Not suspects pick up the phone in the den and use it.
A sidenote preview peeps: SA Boles mentions cell “line activity” is present when there is data usage for a reason. LE was not applying for a secondary warrant unless the activity they were asking for was present on the first.

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A Texas Grandfather says:

August 29, 2015 at 6:29 pm

O/T
Your great grandfather was a smart business man. Choosing a market for clothing in demand by wealthy people. It was totally different during that time period. Most women were using cotton stockings and underwear until rayon was developed into a reliable form. I never saw rayon used for stockings, but it could have been.

Nylon did not appear until 1946 and the first women’s hose product was by Haynes with 30 denier thread. The reason I know this is a cousin was the superintendent on the construction of the plant. He sent my mother and his a half dozen pair each from the pilot run of the plant. They wore like iron. Finally after a year all were worn out and they asked him to send them more, which he did. This second batch lasted about four months with runs and fabric breaks not found in the originals. The answer was that Haynes had introduced an aging agent into the process so that it would increase sales. In fact, people who sell nylon hose have to be careful to rotate their stock or it will rot in the package. The finer 15 denier thread for nylons appeared about 1950.

Back to the case.
I was aware that CM was the type of person to have problems keeping himself straight with business associates. To me, these types are very dangerous and are to be eased out of the business wherever found. Joey had bailed him out on at least one occasion and perhaps two or more. It also appears that CM was addicted to gambling or if not addicted, a heavy gambler.

It is possible that Joey had decided to remove CM from his position as chief fabricator and he may have gone to CM’s shop to notify him that with the new large contract, he was going to add someone else to share the fabrication and installation activities.

Addicts get angry when someone removes their ability to practice their addiction. This could be the motive for the murders. It would also explain the extensive broken bones found in the bodies of Joey,Summer and one of the boys.

I don’t disagree with you ATG and ultimately, it may be that simple. That would make Merritt the first of his kind from a profile perspective. Rarest of rare- and for me, that gives me pause as I am trained. For lack of a better descriptor- his entire adult life he is a “sheckey”. A passive loser of the garden variety. What makes someone have a trail of losses like that and not only *chit* on the best opportunity he has had as far as I can tell, for several years? And even then- why kill 2 innocent babies when you are a father of three?
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