Caylee/Casey Anthony Case: Caylees Autopsy Revelations Part I
Orlando, FL– Under heavy objection last Friday afternoon, Judge Stan Strickland denied the motion on behalf of George and Cindy Anthony to seal Caylee Marie Anthonys autopsy until their daughter Caseys capital murder trial in their granddaughters death. Late Friday afternoon, the Findings of Dr. Jan Garavaglia, Chief Medical Examiner of Orange County were released. In Part I, we explore a few of the notable findings, In Development for Part II, Blinkoncrime will be is creating an interactive 3D Model, incorporating the evidence recovery field, bone disbursement pattern, and anatomical example of the duct tape placement.
The Laundry Bag
Although the report contains a significant amount of anthropologic and forensic data, it does not contain photos or X-Rays, pursuant to the Earnhardt exclusion under Florida Law. Blinkoncrime.com will attempt to offer some observations and in some cases, correct some erroneous information that is being reported in the msm. For starters, the laundry bag picture being circulated, it is incorrect, the image to the left is the correct bag, note the dimensions are exact. The top of this bag does not cinch.
The Duct Tape
I have seen rampant speculation on the duct tape beginning around 15 minutes following the release of the report. 
There are many who believe that Casey Anthony killed her child by wrapping her nose and mouth with duct tape. Allow me to point out the report actually reflects the antithesis of this theory. First, there IS NO TAPE ON THE POSTERIOR of her skull. The only posterior placement of the tape mentioned is still located on the mandible, or face. The tape, which was actually small strips of grey cloth-based, delaminating tape is applied on top of itself, not really feasible with a live toddler. Given the findings that Caylee’s mandible stayed in almost true anatomical position, although slightly posterior and that the hair that was attached to the tape extended from the back of her head and over her head and face, it is likely Caylee was laying on her back when the tape was applied. Henkel makes 2 kinds of duct tape, one is more Industrial grade of adhesive “hot set” over cloth designed for waterproof and outdoor projects. It has not yet been disclosed which formulation was used.
The O Sign
A contributing poster at blinkoncrime gave me something to think about that had not occurred to me. I am on record stating I do believe that Casey Anthony murdered her daughter, and that she will end up pointing the finger at one or both of her parents as a defense strategy.
However, the duct tape never really fit for me. I have always believed it to be a post mortem tactic to stage a kidnapping. I do believe I may have been wrong. Very well known to medical and critical care professionals, there is something called an O effect; occurring at very near death, or shortly following death and before rigormortis sets in.
Some medical people refer to it when the person is very near death or has just died–the jaw drops open. Nothing left to hold the mandible shut. In morgue kits there is a strap that is applied around the jaw to gently close it before rigor sets in. This “O” sign can be very pronounced and unsettling to see first hand. Casey probably wasn’t aware of this and was really spooked by this silent scream and used the duct tape then put a heart sticker on it as a ________
This makes sense to me. The tape is applied in small strips across the nose and mouth areas, catching her hair in the face over the Coronal plane region. One interpretation that may be drawn is that Caylee was lying on her back, upon seeing what Casey had done to her child as evidenced by the relaxed mandible; she attempted to “fix her”. As if covering up the evidence of death on her baby would change things, complete with a heart sticker. No sooner did I arrive at this conclusion on Saturday, did I see Dr.Michael Baden appear on Geraldo Live on Sunday evening bringing up the mortuary kit issue. I am not saying this idea originated here, not that it would be the first time, but it at least tells me there is corroboration within the forensic Medical community as to the premise. The FBI report on the duct tape has not been released. One thing is certain, what I have been stating all along about Casey’s prints being on the duct tape seems foreboding. With multiple strips of tape, chances are there are several. The defense has had this report for months, is this why Casey Anthony retained Todd Macaluso?
Swim Diaper?
There are several remnants recovered that are described as a diaper or pull ip item. However, there are a few that appear to be strictly synthetic. When I read the report, my immediate reaction based on some of the coloring was that it was a “swimmie”, or disposable swim diaper. After mapping out the dimensions and a closer look, I believe it is actually referring to remnants of both a pull up, a reusable swim diaper, or swim floation/assistance device or both, as pictured here:
Paper Towels
Simply stated there is decomposition fluid on paper towels in the plastic garbage bag found in her trunk that came from Tony Lazzarros apartment.
In my opinion, Casey ripped the bag Caylees remains were in when she moved her body into or out of the trunk to her final resting place in the woods off Suburban. The stain in the trunk, emitting the ungodly stench, was the target of the paper towels after Casey returned to TonE’s apartment. She brought the paper towels and garbage bag out with her in an attempt to clean it up and realized almost immediately it was an excerise in futility. Immediately following are her comments to Amy about George Anthony borrowing her car, and the infamous squirrel stowaway story.
Her Clothes
In contrast to only a stitching remnant with a manufactures tag left of her shirt, Caylees shorts were found nearly 2 ft ft away from the laundry bag, in relatively good condition. Based on the reports findings of trunk and femural animal activity and the corresponding recovery area, I am of the opinion that it is not possible that Caylee was wearing those shorts when she was dumped in the woods. Frankly, given the fact that the actual color stripe pattern was discernable versus the condition of the other items, I am suspect Casey was in those woods more than once. How do you get only the collar of a shirt remaining and her shorts completely intact with no noted damage? Lastly, Caylees shoes if she were wearing any, were not recovered.
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perhaps some of Caylee’s hair was found. Possibly cut by the shovel?
maybe the dog even found it. That is possibly why Cindy asked Casey “who cut Caylee’s hair”? just a thought
casey isnt a mastermind or brillant she’s just slightly overly creative when it comes to lying her wayout of a situation, she gave into fantasy along time ago(probably cuz of cindy),she’s a pisces,when pisces take the lowroad they are the most fantastic liars of the zodiac.when the take the high road they revel the most fantastic truths,
i do not believe cindy would go more than three nights w/o caylee,without major tactics to get her back ,i wouldnt either, i dont have children but if i did i would be so paranoid of everyone with my child (next door neighbors,boyfriends,uncles, priests)off the top of my head,i would offer casey big money to bring her home,if that didnt work ,then i would devise a tactic through caylee’s doctor’s office that caylee had a doctors appointment with phone calls to casey from the doctors office and notices to casey everywhere through eveyone if she didnt show for the appointment i would 911, this isnt hindsight,(and i thought of this day one) THIS IS A TWO YEAR OLD.was this the result of some sort of variation of a custody battle,cindy was seeing a counselor that was saying kick casey out & take custody,or kick them both out. interesting that casey goes to (live) with tony the night caylee goes unaccounted for.but there’s never a reason given.except that casey was keeping her away out of spite.what are the statistics of a child being killed in a custody battle? remember brittany spears famous night ,when her visit was up, she ran with the baby locked herself in the bathroom refusing to give him back,she was drawing a bath and there was standoff for hours with police cuz they thought she was going to hurt the child,or herslf ,i cant remember but was she threatning something. my caylee is missing reveals the issue,when casey was pregnant and didnt want the baby cindy bribed her saying dont worry i will take care of eveything,(like melissaab’s mother)well that was then ,stolen checks,credit cards ,401k,george gambling,forclosures,NOT WORKING ,NOT CONTRIBUTING,economic hard times,sole supporter of two fuck ups,and a college education ,this was a mistake .CASEY DEFENDS HERSELF TO LEE, EVEN MOM SAYS SHE WAS A MISTAKE,(maura, that was my take on that,i was going to point it out)
Re; Casey’s abuse claims
Jesse Grund and Tony Lazzaro both testified that Casey claimed Lee had tried to sexually abuse her.
Tony said Casey claimed that when she was in middle school, Lee had touched her inappropriately and that Cindy had not believed her.
Jesse said that back in September 2005, Casey had claimed that Lee had tried to force her into sexual intercourse.
Nathan Lezniewicz (one of Tony Lazzaro’s roommates) said Casey had told him her father was abusive but she didn’t specify what kind of abuse (physical, sexual, emotional, verbal, etc,).
Susanm, lol, I totally agree with you on the astrology front. Dr. Seuss, Einstein, and Copernicus are a good examples of pisces who can create or expand whole universes. It’s a shame she used her talents for evil instead of good. Actually, I don’t see her as evil, just badly broken. I feel pity for the whole trainwreck of a family and how they got themselves to this point. Sad.
I don’t think Casey is a criminal mastermind by any stretch of the imagination. Masterminds plan things out in infinite detail. Casey seems to have been winging it, and was just incredibly lucky that the body was not found sooner, even though it was right where you would think it would have been dumped if she were the killer (in the woods close to home—that’s pretty common, isn’t it?). I know sweet little jesse called her lies diabolical, but to me she really kind of seems inept. She seems to lie compulsively (lying even when the truth would serve her better), but her friends always catch on eventually. Her HS friend said she would lie blatantly and not back down even when confronted by proof that showed otherwise. I think her M.O. is to just move on to a new set of friends as soon as the others catch on to her ways.
To that end, I wonder if things were spiraling out of control for her. Ripping off Amy and Grandma, perhaps, was part of a last hurrah. That strange “why do people kill people who kill people” facebook cartoon (essentially a commentary on the DP) makes me think of those murderers who go to Florida to do their killing just so they can get caught there and get the DP. “Stop me before I kill again.” I think it’s similar to suicide by cop.
Oh Blink…please hurry with part 2!! Although i am so pleased to see the comments go over 1000..i think the “comments” imagination factor is straying off path…also, very glad you agree she says home….it is nothing more then that…
Re: The Pontiac at Amscot
I do believe Casey planned to return for the car because stinky or not, it was the only car she had and she needed a car. She began complaining to Amy about a foul smell in the car around June 25 and blaming the smell on a dead animal, so she had been setting up an explanation for anyone who got too close to the car to smell it.
Tony picked her up around noon on Friday, June 27, and she initially told him not to worry about the car because he was busy with school and she would take care of getting gas later. She may not have wanted to ask him for help because he had just taken her to her parents for the gas cans a few days earlier (June 23) when she had run out of gas. When Tony answered some questions on Scared Monkeys in September 2008, he wrote, “I was in a hurry cuz i had to go to school to hand in my Music Business project.” I doubt Casey told him that the gas cans that he helped her to get from the Anthony house on June 23 had been already been returned to George on June 24, and Tony obviously did not have a gas can of his own or she wouldn’t have been asking Jesse and Amy to borrow theirs.
The next day, Saturday, June 28, she called Jesse to ask if she could borrow his gas can. He said he was on the other side of Orlando visiting his family, so he couldn’t help her out.
On Sunday, June 29, Casey sent Amy a text asking to “borrow you and your gas can today.” Amy reminded Casey that she had moved all her belongings into storage, so she didn’t have access to her gas can.
Casey sent text at 10:25am to Amy: “Can I borrow you and your gas can today?”
Amy’s response to Casey: “Storage hun. I was supposed to have my stuff out by now.”
Casey sent text at 11:24am to Amy: “Shit. I forgot.”
However, Amy said she could always use an extra, so she offered to buy one and let Casey use it. On Monday, June 30, around 9:15am, unknown to Casey, Gary Ridgeway was towing her car from the Amscot lot. When the car was being towed, Casey was at the airport dropping Tony off for his flight to NY. She then went directly to Amy’s. They went to Target to buy the gas can then hung out at Ricardo’s until Amy went to work around 5:00pm. By the time Casey got around to getting gas for the Pontiac and drove to Amscot, she discovered that the car wasn’t there anymore.
It was only then that Casey made up a story (to Amy and Tony) that her father had towed the car to a dealership to have it fixed. There was nothing else she could do since she couldn’t have gotten the car back from Johnson’s even if she knew it was there because the title and registration weren’t in her name.
As for the “purse,” Cindy clarified in one of her LE interviews that what was on the front seat of the Pontiac was not Casey’s primary purse (with wallet and make-up, etc.) but rather her “other purse” which was a large black leather bag like a satchel that Casey pretended to use for work. That bag was on the front seat of the car and contained Amy Huizenga’s resumes and Casey’s Universal lanyard (with the shamrock beads). Also on the front seat was a black bag containing CDs.
The car was locked per Gary Ridgeway and Simon Birch. Contrary to comments I’ve read on the forums, there were no keys left in the car.
I also do not believe she left the car at Amscot in hopes that Cindy would see it. Casey left the car in the Amscot lot around noon on Friday, June 27. She knew Cindy was taking a week of vacation from June 28-July 6, so Cindy would not be driving to work and hence would not have any opportunity to notice the car in the Amscot lot before Casey retrieved the car.
My opinion is that Casey would have retrieved the car either on Saturday, June 28 (if Jesse had been able to help her out) or on Sunday, June 29 (if Amy had easy access to her gas can that was in storage) or on Monday, June 30 (if the car had not been towed hours before she bought a gas can at Target with Amy). I do not believe Casey intended to abandon the car for good on June 27 or that she left it there to entice a car thief or that she wanted Cindy to see it.
***
I think Catherine Sanchez was wrong about seeing the car at 7:00am on Friday, June 27 and that it’s more likely she noticed the Pontiac in the lot if she looked out at the parking lot around lunchtime or if she left the building and returned (say for lunch) that afternoon.
Casey’s cell phone records confirm that she was at Tony’s overnight on June 26 and her cell phone didn’t pick up a new tower until around 9:30am on June 27, which is when she probably left his apartment. Cell phone pings indicate she was back at his apartment around 12:30pm. In the intervening three hours, she was moving around and using her phone to make several calls and send several text messages.
The cell phone records really do call Mrs. Sanchez’s recollection into doubt. In her defense, she saw the car in the same spot on the mornings of June 28, June 29, and June 30, so that is why I believe her memory of seeing the car early in the morning of June 27 is so strong.
***
Lot’s of people get dates wrong. Chris Stutz told LE he thought he saw Casey jogging on Chickasaw around 9:30am on July 15 when he was on his way to work, but when he sent her a text message, she said no, that wasn’t her. Casey’s cell phone records show no text messages from Chris Stutz on July 15.
Casey’s phone records and text messages DO show that Chris Stutz sent that text message the day before early in the morning. The message at 7:38am on July 14 reads, “Were you running this morning?”
Jamie Lynn Realander claims she met Casey for the first time at Fusion on Friday, May 23 and that Casey was managing shot girls. She said this was the night of the infamous pictures of Casey in the blue dress. Jamie Lynn is off by a month because Casey did not go to Fusian before meeting Tony Lazzaro, and she didn’t meet him until the following day at a pool party. Moreover, the infamous photos of Casey in the blue dress at Fusian were taken on Friday, June 21.
During his second interview, Ricardo believed Casey might have been in the Glenwood condo on the morning of July 1 and that Casey spent the whole day at the condo. Amy also had a sense that Casey spent the night of June 30 at JP and Ricardo’s condo. Casey’s cell pings show she was nowhere near the Glenwood condo that night; she was on the other side of town about 15 miles west of the Anthony home all night long. The next morning, July 1, Casey went to Jesse’s in the morning and took a shower.
I am sure that Catherine, Chris, Jamie Lynn, Ricardo, and Amy all believed they were giving accurate information to LE, but that doesn’t guarantee that their information was accurate.
Corrections to previous post:
The photos of Casey in the blue dress were taken on the night of Friday, June 20/early morning of Saturday, June 21 at Fusian’s Hot Body Contest.
On the night of June 30 and into the early morning hours of July 1, Casey was hitting a tower about 15 miles EAST (not west) of the Anthony house. I have no idea what she was doing there or with whom (if anyone) she was hanging out. The Anthony house is about 10 miles east of JP’s condo, and Casey was about 15 miles east of the Anthony house, so there is no way she spent the night of June 30 at JP’s condo.
I also meant to say that I believe Casey went to the Anthony house on the morning of June 27 in hopes that George had refilled the gas cans. The gas she got from those cans on June 23 would not have gone far, and she was probably broke because she had not lived at the Anthony house since June 16 (so she had no opportunity to nip $20 from anyone’s unattended wallet).
She had not yet stolen Amy’s $400 (which happened in the early morning hours of July 3), so I suspect she went to the Anthony house on July 27 hoping to get a few gallons of gas and any type of currency lying around (cash, checks, credit cards. She didn’t find any gas. She likely searched the house looking for cash, and that’s when she found Cindy’s JC Penney card, which she took. She also took groceries from the freezer.
She headed back to Tony’s apartment, but realized she wasn’t going to make it when she was six miles away (I imagine her car was beginning to hitch, which is what happens when the tank is almost empty). She spotted the Amscot and pulled in next to the dumpsters so that anyone picking up a foul odor would attribute the smell to garbage. She may also have chosen Amscot because Amscot is a company that serves people who often live hand-to-mouth and are in need of cash. Perhaps because of that, she thought the Amscot employees would be somewhat flexible about a car left on the lot for a day or two.
Backyard, and kept from George, whomever found it, imo
B
Blink….I am so curious now about the day of July 3rd and the backyard. I have went back and read and reread whatever I thought was pertinent and I still can’t come up with anything. If you can’t say what happened can you lead us in the right direction so we can answer that question for ourselves.
ok new clues here to add to my puzzle. i dont know whether to go with the “occums razor” (spelling) rule or add in all the hundreds of details. Sometimes i feel like I am one of the only ones that feels just dizzy with all of this and it is very disturbing not to be able to grasp and put my mind around all of it—–
#1046 imableredhead. I agree no common sense in casey’s actions. I think she left caylee so close to the home because she wanted the family to find her, she wanted to hurt the family.
Wendy #1045 & Silver:
I have listened 5x’s and heard the “T”. Absolutely NOT “home”. At appx 6 mins into the conversation, definitely a “T”. Doesn’t even sound like home. I am the biggest skeptic, looking for only things that can be verified, and definitely not seeing some brilliant plot from this psychotic woman & her brother. But, this word definitely needs to be analyzed by voice specilists. I am even leaning towards an “alt” or “awt” sound. JMO
Kleat: I thought Casey told Cindy that LEE tried to “fool around” with her, not George. Do you know where that is posted? I’m sure Lyon will use this …BIGTIME to prove how “damaged” Casey is. (along with the fact that Cindy “choked her”…Lee also tried to “fool around” with her etc…
Another thing I have found from reading on here that is also a concept that needs to be furthur analyzed….WHEN exactly in all of her months of lying about “Nanny-Zanny”…did she first tell anyone it was Zenaida? Gonzalez? Was it after she dumped the body (& conveniently came up with the names of the owners of the two different properties)?
Kudo’s to whomever came up with this thought.
Nejame posited that the reason the prosecution wants to move forward with the fraud case is so that Casey will already be a convicted felon at the time of the murder trial. Could be.
The only reason the fraud case was initially delayed was for purpose of “judicial economy”, i.e. why bother spending time/judicial resources/tax payer dollars convicting her of a crime she would serve however many years for when she is also looking at facing LWOP or DEATH in the murder case.
Now.. with all of this delay due to the DP on the table again… it seems fair to the fraud crime victim to move forward. I’m just wondering if there is another reason relating to the evidence, but Nejame’s reasoning makes sense.
Just finished reading Catherine Crier’s book about the Scott Peterson case– “A Deadly Game”. Amazing how much evidence was never released to the public, and also how many psychological similarities there are in terms of the parent/child relationship dynamic.
Remember, the Sheriff warned against any leaks a while back. What we are not privy to, even despite the liberal disclosure of evidence under Florida’s Sunshine Law, is probably.. a LOT.
Casey is creative, I’ll give her that. But sometimes the truth is really stranger than fiction, and I think there are some strange coincidences here that were not planned out in advance.
I enjoy examining all of the evidence on this level.I still think Casey said “close to home” in one tape, but clearly hear “close to hoLT” in the other. One could argue that it really doesn’t matter, since Caylee’s remains were, in fact, located. To me, that could show she knew PRECISELY where the body was located, and could also serve as evidence concerning LEE’s involvement, as an accessory after-the-fact. Why was it HIS attorney who mentioned that he might be facing charges back in what? January?? And how did that “go away”? Why has he become so “invisible”? Why was he not with his “united” family on Father’s Day this year???
They love to pretend to the world that they are/were this close-knit family… but what close family spends so many key holidays apart??! Mother’s Day, Father’s Day.. Cindy’s 50th birthday.. (Lee said he just stopped by, but had other things to do, and while Caylee was there, Casey was not–???! “This family is united! But this family is broken.” I have news for LEE. That family is ONLY “united” by SECRETS AND LIES. PERIOD. That family has been BROKEN for a long, long time.
In any event, the key at trial is to keep it as simple as possible when it gets before the jury. Juries are always instructed to use their COMMON SENSE. Rick Plesea’s succession of emails to Cindy are priceless on that note. (Thanks to Suzee/post #1032 for the ACandyRose.com link, because they are laid out nicely there).
In any event, I am waiting –on edge– for Blink’s next submission=)
Is it a sure thing that the Anthonys poured a concrete slab in addition to laying the concrete pavers. My friends say they did not pour a slab. Does anyone have a credible link to verify about a concrete slab.
NO SLAB.
B
silverspner, since this is still true:
“The only reason the fraud case was initially delayed was for purpose of “judicial economy”, i.e. why bother spending time/judicial resources/tax payer dollars convicting her of a crime she would serve however many years for when she is also looking at facing LWOP or DEATH in the murder case.”
…it still leaves me wondering why they want to push ahead with the fraud case. What’s the rush? She’s sitting in jail so who cares?
And (with all due respect to those who differ in opinion) I still think they can’t bring up an unrelated felony conviction, but maybe they will try slip it in by saying “While caylee was missing, casey stole checks from her friend Amy, for which she was convicted of a felony” and then the defense will object and the judge will sustain the objection and have those remarks stricken from the record and tell the jury to disregard that little nugget but of course you can’t unring a bell. That would be naughty of the state if they knew they were doing wrong, so I would hope they wouldn’t do that. And they sure don’t want a mistrial. Or maybe they are just relying on potential jurors having heard about it in the news, and then they wouldn’t have to try to bring it up in court. Dunno. Jurors I think would be instructed to forget about any stuff they have heard in the news, which I assume would inclue the felony conviction, but they are after all just people.
You’d hope the state’s case is strong enough as is, but maybe they are worried.
I’ve often said I think the state needs to produce a smoking gun, while casey needs to produce a smoking hot nanny.
Maura, couldn’t Casey have been running the gas tank down planning on Amscot? Her guage WAS working correctly, so she had an idea how much was left in it, especially if she knew how much she put in and how far that would go (she’d done it before using the gas cans when running at the bottom of the tank).
suz/post #1067, I already posted about the rules of evidence concerning admissibility of a prior conviction. I can assure you that the prosecutors have no need/would not try to “slip it in”. On its own, the conviction on the fraud charge is not relevant to the burden of proof on the murder charge. It is relevant to Casey’s credibility, and as we know, there is more than ample evidence on that note.
Kleat,
Yes, she could have been deliberately running the tank down, but does that make any sense to you? It does not make any sense to me that she would do that.
Casey needed her car for practical reasons and because she needed to maintain the pretense of going to work and going to see Caylee. She didn’t have any money, so she would not have been able to rent a car or buy one.
She left the car at Amscot IMO because she did not have money by the morning of June 27, because George had not refilled the gas tanks Casey returned on June 24, and because she had not found any cash, blank checks, or major credit cards at the Anthony house that would have enabled her to buy gas on the way back to Tony’s.
She left the car at Amscot IMO out of necessity and only meant for it to be a temporary measure.
That very night she planned to be at Fusian managing the shot girls, and in that capacity could very well have expected to get a cut of the tips, which would have given her some cash for gas to buy the next day (when she called Jesse). She could also have been slipping tips off the various tables and into her pocket at Fusian.
To Elmosmommy Post # 1047 I tend to think a lot like your post… I have flip flopped on this in my mind but I just really don’t think this was this huge plan from the get go. I don’t think anyone in the family knew what happened when it happened.. I do believe they found something that brought alarm and that is when the searching for KC started but not that they put this grand plan together JMO… Specially when Cindy in the begining told KC she wouldn’t be in jail if she would have told the truth.. I think the whole family was in complete shock and just didn’t want to admit to themselves or to each other that Caylee was gone.. Too finale. I think it was easier to tell themselves she was still out there. George even said he didn’t want to think a child of his could do such a thing…
As far as Lee goes.. You can hear in his voice on the phone calls from KC that he would hesitate when she would start out the conversation with “how are you doing” like it was just a regular phone call. I think he was a little thrown back or even disgusted that her voice and choice of words were so flipant.. Like it was just another day..
I also think he was really trying to find his little niece but knew in his heads she was gone…
suz, who cares? The person who was wronged cares. I’d guess there is a time limit on fraud cases, so she has to act within that time.
Just to follow up-
The news of a conviction on the fraud charges would become common knowledge in such a sensationalized case. How often does the msm report on an economic fraud charge involving so little by way of monies actually taken? The msm hardly reports on far more serious/heinous crimes. Read Blink’s most recent article in the Tracy Ocasio case, and be prepared to be astounded by the rap sheets alone (not to mention the entire story itself).
If Casey ends up taking the stand in her own defense in the murder case, the FACT of her PRIOR CONVICTION on a FRAUD charge IS ADMISSIBLE, particularly because the crime involves dishonesty.
#1063– it wasn’t reported that Cindy told anything re: that Lee story. Go check Jesse Grund’s LE interviews. Casey told Jesse that story about her brother (we know she takes portions of the truth in her lies but could be just a story for some reason).
The ‘HOLT’ vs ‘home’ issue:
So we can listen to something close to what Blink would have had to listen to, I’d like to make a suggestion that we (non Blink persons of course) get a source for as close to the original as possible. If we can find a version that went from OSCO to media directly, there will be less chance anyone played with the word, and we will be listening to the same thing.
This might lower the chances of a version that has been ‘played’ with and give best quality for listening. Of course, computer speakers are different, maybe best to set to ‘spoken word’ for listening too.
Maura-
How about this?
Casey left the car at Amscot to get rid of it, because it was part of a crime scene that she could not clean up/sanitize.
If she needed a few dollars just to put gas in the car, she would have found the few dollars. We know she is resourceful when it comes to “finding” money. Who wouldn’t just ask their boyfriend to lend them a few dollars to throw some gas in the tank til she earned the tips that night at Fusion, as you suggest? Who just abandons a car in a public lot with TOWING signs when they simply run out of gas, particularly when there are a plethora of gas stations IN WALKING DISTANCE?!
This “UNITED FAMILY” can barely keep their stories straight on WHAT DATE CAYLEE “WENT MISSING”. In fact, they royally screwed that one up for a while–long enough to print POSTERS with JUNE 9TH ON THEM, didn’t they! Unless, of course, the date was selected on purpose to steer attention away from a LOUD ARGUMENT on the 15th, and they simply forgot about the Father’s Day VIDEOTAPE at Mt. Dora, because there is NO WAY IN HELL THAT CINDY DIDN’T KNOW SHE HAD CAYLEE WITH HER ON FATHER’S DAY. (Sorry, but GET REAL.)
So it makes you wonder, how is it that THIS UNITED FAMILY is so certain about other, seemingly meaningless dates, like WHEN THAT CAR WAS ABANDONED. Take a listen to LEE’s interview when the subject comes up on the timeline.
This is NOT the call but does anyone know who the call was to ? Thought it was Tony by the voice at first, but must have been to Lee. Casey wanted Lee to get Baez to get in touch with her asap, date given August 2nd, 2009. http://cfnews13.com/uploadedfiles/audio/080802CMAnthonyInmateCall.wav
Why would Casey go through Lee to get to her counsel? That makes no sense. Maybe she just wanted to hear family voice instead of Baez’s reception, but still, it was a roundabout way to get to her lawyer ‘fast’ and to know if he could come and when.
Also…
Shirley Plesea’s emails are a treasure trove. Look at the back and forth with ML & Shadow (I love that ML as much as SP, God bless them both). The progression of “reporting” about Cindy’s feelings towards/relationship with George are quite telling about when these two–all of a sudden– become “UNITED”. Just after July 3rd, there is a MAJOR turn around there… not to mention poor Cindy with all of that HARD WORK she is doing.. AT THE HOUSE.
i dont know, but this is becoming clearer to me ,helps with maura knowing the facts so well,and all you others ,george calling the cops about his gas cans ,if casey were to use those gas cans to burn the body away,and left georges cans and prints(for all he knew),at the scene of the burn(or produced them later)he would be the suspect,did mr detective smell(fear)a frame up,good to call intereference with you and your gas cans.
Yes, SP is a treasure!! A breath of fresh air in that family! She deserves none of this, especially over and above her care of her own husband and the challenges that presents to her physically and emotionally.
If SP has friends who read here, but don’t share with her of course, they might already know that SP has sincere well-wishers here.
i dont know but it seems pretty clear why their going ahead with the check fraud,why not for the first reason, i cant wait,plus to me it is obviously about the ugly coping, i think its brillant,theyve got her cornered,she finally has to talk if she is going to use ugly coping,in the trial,cuz baez qouted the other case of the woman who went on a shopping spree after the death of her hubby,casey went on a shopping spree stealing amy’s money her mom’s jc penny and plans to call it ugly coping,they can dig more verbal evidence,and agreed it puts the pressure on her big time,if she takes the stand,which i am sure she wont,the right griller could possibly get a breakdown confession right there
What chosen defense scenarios (besides allocution for a plea deal), would necessitate Casey taking the stand? (ie: if they continue to insist on ‘innocent’ and have another person in mind who ‘did it’)
We know from Terrance Lenamon’s position and withdrawl as DP counsel or advisor for Baez, that he would have handled the case differently from the beginning, and that his position on how to best defend Casey was at odds with Baez’s position at that time.
Will Baez be able to take the second or even lower, chair during trial? Will he have any active ‘in front of camera’ role besides housekeeping issues?
We should expect a motion from Ms. Lyon re: the Amy Huizinga case against Casey within the next two weeks or so, and what will her ‘order of motions’ preferences be– to clear this fraud case away would be a big issue given ‘dp’, but IF she gets the DP dropped, then the fraud case could rear its head again sooner than later. So, wouldn’t she want the DP issue fought and taken care of first? How many kicks at that can does she get? (appeals? pulling a ‘Cindy’ and attacks on the judge again to withdraw from the case?)
and blink of course ,all the information(and more) is right here on this site you just have to go all the way back (like kleat says)and read (like blink says).the keith williams interview ,brillant score. i like the hard grill about which side of the road,i think you got a little up chuck there when he ,caught off guard ,by your hard grill,says i would have seen a bag on the right side,how did he know he was looking for a bag?yes i guess it could be explained away,but i think its an up chuck,good grill.
Kleat, do you really thnk it’s Amy who wants to push her part of the case so to trial speedily? What do I know, perhaps she is the one, but I can only try to put myself in her shoes and imagine if I were the one who was wronged, and I am thinking I’d be pretty happy if the perp was already stuck in jail on trial for their life. Unless you think she’s somehow gonna’ get her money back (but is that likely to happen? Does FL have restitution?), in which case I would understand it a little bit better. But I am quite certain other people think and operate much differently than I do, which is what makes the world so grand!
wont this put the defense stratedgy on record ie:why did you steal the money?because……fill in the blanks,ta da at the very least clues to the defense stratedgy(sp?)?
suz, I think that Amy does have an interest in going forward, but it’s her case, not her lawyer’s case, not the state. But it’s complicated by the state’s case, and the state has a serious interest in this. So too, would ZG’s lawyers on behalf of their client, I’d assume because it was ‘the nanny’ who told Casey to do all she did, during that ‘missing’ month.
It is Amy’s cause afterall, and I’d guess her lawyer would advise that it is in her best interest to go forward with the charges. If she forgave her friend, then what would the defense bring up as the reason, at Casey’s trial– an accomplice? Or simply a friend who believed that Casey had to steal under threat? Better to deal with it, even if it is not what you want to do to a friend. And ‘what if’ Casey used Amy’s car to do something illegal other than fraud against Amy? What if her car was tied to some other crime that we don’t know about (just as an example). Amy has to protect herself and not try to help Casey by not pressing charges.
Amy Huizenga knows Jose Baez wants her cell phone records along with those of a dozen other witnesses, and she knows he’s hoping to find something in those records that will raise suspicions against a person or persons other than Casey.
She is also highly likely to be aware of Cindy’s FBI interview in which Cindy attempted to convince Scott Bolin that “Zanny” could be a code name for Amy Huizenga. Cindy speculated that Amy had been promised a place to live in the Anthony home with Casey and that Casey had not come through with the offer, so it was possible that Amy had taken Caylee to ‘teach Casey a lesson.’ Cindy has also noted that the photo of Caylee with a drum set (a photo Casey had claimed was taken in Zanny’s apartment) was taken in JP’s condo, where Amy was living for a while.
Amy got a lawyer recently because she filed a motion on April 20 to block Baez from obtaining her cell records.
In the hearing on May 28 to discuss Baez’s motion to obtain the cell phone records of a dozen or so witnesses, Judge Strickland more or less said he could figure out why Baez wanted the records. He told Baez to try to work out a compromise with the witnesses (Jesse, Amy, Kronk, etc.) who had filed motions to block access to those records, but that if a compromise could not be reached, then to refile the motions giving a reason for needing the records. My take on that hearing is that Strickland pretty much implied that Baez would be able to get the phone records.
Three weeks later on June 22, the prosecution filed a motion to set a trial date for the check fraud charges within the next 60 days.
So my opinion is that it was Amy’s new lawyer who decided that forcing a speedy trial on the check fraud charges (which are unquestionably going to end in a guilty verdict) will provide protection to Amy Huizenga during the murder trial. In other words, by the time Amy testifies for the prosecution during the murder trial, she will essentially be a jury-certified victim of Casey Anthony.
No clue how they will whack up the trial work on the defense team. Baez is still counsel/can still participate; he was simply not qualified to handle a DP case, so needed a DP qualified attorney on board.
The defenses to the murder charge that could require putting Casey on the stand would either be that she was legally “insane” at the time she committed the crime, or… as many have come to suspect, that she is going to point the finger at someone else. (Waiving HELLLLLLLLL-O to CINDY).
(or maybe I should be waiving HELL-O to GEORGE).
Maybe both, but she will point it, absolutely.
B
# 1076 silverspnr
Your theory that she was abandoning a car because of the crime evidence does not make sense to me.
If she intended to ditch the car to distance herself from the evidence of a crime in the trunk, then she would not have been preparing her friends for the smell a few days before abandoning it.
She did not ask Tony for gas money for a few reasons. First, as I noted in a comment upthread, Tony was in a hurry because he had to go to school to turn in a project. He also said in one of his interviews that he was irritated that she had called him for the second time in the same week because she had run out of gas. He could well have allowed some of that irritation to come through, and it was not in Casey’s interest to antagonize him in any way.
For another thing, she had a bag full of frozen food, so maybe she didn’t want to stop there and then to take care of the gas.
The facts are that she called Jesse the next day (Saturday, June 28) to borrow his gas can, and she called Amy the day after that (Sunday, June 29) to borrow a gas can. She finally got a gas can on Monday, June 30, but the gas can was purchased hours after the car had been towed. And since Casey took Tony to the airport that morning and then went straight to Amy’s, she could not have known the car had been towed.
I am sure there are signs up in the Amscot lot saying cars will be towed, but I don’t know exactly what the signs say. Irrespective of what the signs say, it is my belief that Casey chose Amscot as a temporary place to leave the car because Amscot serves a clientele that is often down-on-their-luck and cash-strapped, and for that reason she may have expected them to be more forgiving than other local businesses about a car that was left on the lot for a day or two.
And, in fact, Catherine Sanchez said she was told by the corporate headquarters not to call for a tow until three days had passed.
Amy is not waiting to get her money back because she has already been reimbursed by the bank. The checks were stolen, and banks have insurance for those situations. It would be the bank’s business to then go after the businesses that accepted the checks (Target, Winn Dixie, etc.) to recover their losses.
Nahhhh. Strike that. Forget the insanity defense.
It would be the latter for certain if she takes the stand.
There are just so many problems with that though. She could have told the detectives so much the very first night they had her alone, the very next day… at ANY time to avoid being charged with MURDER and facing LWOP or the DP. Why be locked up all these months if you actually KNOW FOR CERTAIN WHO KILLED CAYLEE (if it wasn’t YOU).
1085 susanm–what do you think the defense strategy might be. do you think they are still hanging in with zanny after all the info that is out. i havent really thought about the defense much because of all that is out in favor of the prosecution.
Did I ever believe that casey was able to convince her folks that she hadd a job? Nope I don’t. And after I read the m&m depo’s I knew I was right.I also don’t believe much in the content of casey text mssg sent to her friends or the ones sent/rcvd from her family after 6/15. I only think their useful in establishing her wherabouts at any given time.just wanted to put that out there.
sorry boo, but i certainly dont think cindy and george knew she was lying about a job.
These parents bought into all of her lies and still do, in my mind. They totally enabled this girl to become the girl she is today !!
Kleat link for you from #1075, the transcript says Home on CFNews, but in this clip from the Sentinel I still hear holt. IIRC there were 2 different tapes where she said the same thing, one did sound like home, but IMO this one sounds like Holt. Hope it helps
Lee Anthony’s Jailhouse Call With Casey
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/orange/orl-casey-anthony-lee-excerpt-mp3,0,4706409.mp3file
Does anyone stop and think if you were hit with the news that not only is your grandaughter missing and has been for a month, that your daughter has been keeping this fact from you, whether you suspected somhing wrong in that 31 days or not…..and your daughter is for some reason lying about everything, and then goes to jail for several child related charges and the lies … dont you think it is easy to see a mistake on timelines such as what day was fathers day. I am the same age as Cindy and my mind gets boggled sometime on what happened last week and I am not in the middle of the crap these parents are going thru so I give the anthony`s a break on some things … and one thing that bothers me is Cindy tells in her FBI interview that she offered Casey`s grey pants to the officer and they didnt want anything that was in the car so she washed them. If that is true, then I cant really hold her responsible. I dont defend either cindy or george now that they appear to be telling outright lies in defending casey but I would have a hard time figuring out which are simple mistakes in their minds and which are purposeful lies. I cant imagine going thru the crap they have been put thru for the last year and still having my mind at all. But for myself I would know that I could get easily messed up on what took place when so I wouldnt be doing any interviews and making claims unless I had positive proof in front of me, such as a daily diary. I dont hold quite the hate that a lot of people have for the anthonys, but I do certainly think they have brought some of this trouble on themselves with their behaviours and actions. But then as I have already mentioned I blame some of Casey`s bad behaviour on them as parents I am just glad I am not in any of their shoes.
Ok just watched a youtube video that reports George did molest Casey. Whether or not there is truth in it or not, I believe there must be a grain of truth at least. Now it goes back to the theory again is George really Casey’s father? And if he is why would Casey say he and Lee molested her if there was’nt some truth in it?Casey might be a liar but these are huge allegations.I also watched a video on youtube titled “How to commit the perfect murder” and it states that a wooded area is a good place to get rid of a body. Anyway here’s the link for Casey molested.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHzQhA1qjXA&feature=PlayList&p=A5824498ECD82DA2&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=43
I am 8 years older then Cindy. I have my son, his daughter aged 3.5 years, and a son aged 1 year living with us. They are here most of the time, but also with their mothers. I don’t know how you can feel a 50 year old gets messed up on what days her grandchild, who is living with them. is there at their home. I have two to watch..and I know where they are when they are here..and when they are with their mothers.
Life is tough..never did I believe I would be in this situation of taking care of grandchildren now..but I am. Life holds surprises..they are two of the best I ever had. Life also says you have to step up..rather you are 50, 58, or 19 and do the right thing.
My problem with the A family is..they do not seem to ever know the right thing to do. They do not care all that much for each other and none of them seems to be a mature adult. Maturity brings huge responsibility. If you know your daughter is stealing from the family..money, checks, credit card purchases, gas, even change from her daughter’s piggy bank..it is not a stretch to believe she is not working and has no intention of taking responsibility for herself, or her daughter…let alone having the money to pay a nanny. The writing was on the wall..all the A’s decided not to read it..then as well as now. Why..because for Cindy or George to read that writing on the wall, address that writing, they would have been called to tackle the situation. The A family doesn’t tackle situations..they spin them. Unforetunately ..a little girl..almost 3 years old , got caught in their immature games of not seeing, not doing,,not being responsible.
ItsMeLyn, thanks, yes, I hear the ‘lt’ in that clearly too.
ELMOSMOMMY, Cindy also claimed that the LE did not pick up the car for ‘two days’, yet it was picked up the 16th afternoon, after LE had spent most of the night there, that makes it a few hours, not two days. Washing the pants was stupid if a ‘mistake’ because if someone had done something to Caylee and evidence was on those pants, then that would go against finding the perpetrator– could have someone else’s DNA on them. And the hairbrush– technically, Cindy was not asked specifically for the brush that was used just for Caylee, so she gave them the brush she used for herself and Caylee. Now what sort of common sense is that, but to confuse things?
No problem with the mistake of Father’s Day, things can get mixed up and if that’s what happened, that’s what happened. Casey could hear Cindy talk to LE through the garage door, and Lee figured (he was with her) that since they could hear things that Cindy was saying, Casey got the idea of the 9′th as the date she left with Caylee and repeated it. She did say 31 days, so obviously, that wasn’t the right date.