Caylee/Casey Anthony Case: Caylees Autopsy Revelations Part I
Orlando, FL– Under heavy objection last Friday afternoon, Judge Stan Strickland denied the motion on behalf of George and Cindy Anthony to seal Caylee Marie Anthonys autopsy until their daughter Caseys capital murder trial in their granddaughters death. Late Friday afternoon, the Findings of Dr. Jan Garavaglia, Chief Medical Examiner of Orange County were released. In Part I, we explore a few of the notable findings, In Development for Part II, Blinkoncrime will be is creating an interactive 3D Model, incorporating the evidence recovery field, bone disbursement pattern, and anatomical example of the duct tape placement.
The Laundry Bag
Although the report contains a significant amount of anthropologic and forensic data, it does not contain photos or X-Rays, pursuant to the Earnhardt exclusion under Florida Law. Blinkoncrime.com will attempt to offer some observations and in some cases, correct some erroneous information that is being reported in the msm. For starters, the laundry bag picture being circulated, it is incorrect, the image to the left is the correct bag, note the dimensions are exact. The top of this bag does not cinch.
The Duct Tape
I have seen rampant speculation on the duct tape beginning around 15 minutes following the release of the report. 
There are many who believe that Casey Anthony killed her child by wrapping her nose and mouth with duct tape. Allow me to point out the report actually reflects the antithesis of this theory. First, there IS NO TAPE ON THE POSTERIOR of her skull. The only posterior placement of the tape mentioned is still located on the mandible, or face. The tape, which was actually small strips of grey cloth-based, delaminating tape is applied on top of itself, not really feasible with a live toddler. Given the findings that Caylee’s mandible stayed in almost true anatomical position, although slightly posterior and that the hair that was attached to the tape extended from the back of her head and over her head and face, it is likely Caylee was laying on her back when the tape was applied. Henkel makes 2 kinds of duct tape, one is more Industrial grade of adhesive “hot set” over cloth designed for waterproof and outdoor projects. It has not yet been disclosed which formulation was used.
The O Sign
A contributing poster at blinkoncrime gave me something to think about that had not occurred to me. I am on record stating I do believe that Casey Anthony murdered her daughter, and that she will end up pointing the finger at one or both of her parents as a defense strategy.
However, the duct tape never really fit for me. I have always believed it to be a post mortem tactic to stage a kidnapping. I do believe I may have been wrong. Very well known to medical and critical care professionals, there is something called an O effect; occurring at very near death, or shortly following death and before rigormortis sets in.
Some medical people refer to it when the person is very near death or has just died–the jaw drops open. Nothing left to hold the mandible shut. In morgue kits there is a strap that is applied around the jaw to gently close it before rigor sets in. This “O” sign can be very pronounced and unsettling to see first hand. Casey probably wasn’t aware of this and was really spooked by this silent scream and used the duct tape then put a heart sticker on it as a ________
This makes sense to me. The tape is applied in small strips across the nose and mouth areas, catching her hair in the face over the Coronal plane region. One interpretation that may be drawn is that Caylee was lying on her back, upon seeing what Casey had done to her child as evidenced by the relaxed mandible; she attempted to “fix her”. As if covering up the evidence of death on her baby would change things, complete with a heart sticker. No sooner did I arrive at this conclusion on Saturday, did I see Dr.Michael Baden appear on Geraldo Live on Sunday evening bringing up the mortuary kit issue. I am not saying this idea originated here, not that it would be the first time, but it at least tells me there is corroboration within the forensic Medical community as to the premise. The FBI report on the duct tape has not been released. One thing is certain, what I have been stating all along about Casey’s prints being on the duct tape seems foreboding. With multiple strips of tape, chances are there are several. The defense has had this report for months, is this why Casey Anthony retained Todd Macaluso?
Swim Diaper?
There are several remnants recovered that are described as a diaper or pull ip item. However, there are a few that appear to be strictly synthetic. When I read the report, my immediate reaction based on some of the coloring was that it was a “swimmie”, or disposable swim diaper. After mapping out the dimensions and a closer look, I believe it is actually referring to remnants of both a pull up, a reusable swim diaper, or swim floation/assistance device or both, as pictured here:
Paper Towels
Simply stated there is decomposition fluid on paper towels in the plastic garbage bag found in her trunk that came from Tony Lazzarros apartment.
In my opinion, Casey ripped the bag Caylees remains were in when she moved her body into or out of the trunk to her final resting place in the woods off Suburban. The stain in the trunk, emitting the ungodly stench, was the target of the paper towels after Casey returned to TonE’s apartment. She brought the paper towels and garbage bag out with her in an attempt to clean it up and realized almost immediately it was an excerise in futility. Immediately following are her comments to Amy about George Anthony borrowing her car, and the infamous squirrel stowaway story.
Her Clothes
In contrast to only a stitching remnant with a manufactures tag left of her shirt, Caylees shorts were found nearly 2 ft ft away from the laundry bag, in relatively good condition. Based on the reports findings of trunk and femural animal activity and the corresponding recovery area, I am of the opinion that it is not possible that Caylee was wearing those shorts when she was dumped in the woods. Frankly, given the fact that the actual color stripe pattern was discernable versus the condition of the other items, I am suspect Casey was in those woods more than once. How do you get only the collar of a shirt remaining and her shorts completely intact with no noted damage? Lastly, Caylees shoes if she were wearing any, were not recovered.
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suz, if Cindy kept her mouth shut, they could have covered this up completely– you bet if she could have, she would have. That would hit a big problem– the baby existed, then she was gone with no explanation. Keeping quiet would mean they could not shift blame to anyone else, couldn’t explain where the baby ‘went’, and moreover, couldn’t claim to have a missing child and immediately get a charity/foundation set up in their own names.
And then there’s Cindy’s love of the media and self-belief that she has the smarts and ability to turn things her way.
martha ,suz- cuz casey went off script and left a trail of decomp that george and cindy were left to clean up AND EXPLAIN they had no idea where to start cuz they had no idea where aLL casey might of left tracesleft traces and who all,casey had seen,lied ,casey was a wild card,,did the bank know?, the tow truck driver? and just what is casey up to? heck yea, when they gotto the car and smelled it ,houston,we have a big problem (how many other people know what this car smells like),freak out! casey has now put them in a very precarious position.
Suz-
Don’t sweat it.
They can tie Casey to the crime via what is a virtual mountain of circumstantial evidence, coupled with the forensic evidence found at the crime scenes, to wit: the back yard/home; the vehicle; the location of Caylee’s remains.
there was a loose body out there that traced back dead to cindy’s car. george calls and reports his gas cans stolen cindy calls and reports her car stolen.
Suz,
I believe that she was killed the evening of the 15th of June into the early morning hours of the 16th.
I believe that she was killed at the home of Cindy and George, by Casey.
I believe she was killed for two reasons..she was in Casey’s way as far as her social life..and the second, biggest reason..Cindy was trying in her control freak method, which hadn’t worked before nor did it now, to control Casey..stand up and be the Mom you are supposed to be. Casey made a huge effort in her life from teen to adulthood to not be the person Cindy tried to bully her into being.
Casey dropped out of school short a credit..to make Cindy mad. She did many things just to make the stance she was her own person..not Cindy’s person. I think that goes back to childhood and Cindy just never understanding where to draw the line between discipline and bullying. Casey decided at a young age to not be bullied
Cindy is controlling..George is the classic passive/aggressive personality. Casey combined those two and decided to learn how to manipulate Mom, by making her so mad she would bully ..and then Casey would do exactly as she pleased. George she handled as anyone does, by placating and then bullying..on his good side one day..his bad the next. Lee learned early on to placate and do as told..maybe because of his illness in his early tens..he knew he needed them ..and knew how to work the family system..that Casey only knew how to buck.
Cindy was only concerned with controlling Casey..not Caylee..otherwise she would have known the number for every babysitter and where Caylee was. She really never worried that Casey would do something to Caylee..because she knew that Casey used Caylee to get toys, clothes , money ..etc for Caylee.
Caylee’s use was gone the night of the 15th..she no longer had a home and a place to go to get free everything. So in the ultimate act of revenge on Cindy she murders Caylee..if Cindy won’t take care of her and Caylee..if Cindy won’t tow the line..then the most precious thing in Cindy’s life is gone..Caylee. Oh..did I mention the jealousy Casey had for Caylee..it was paramount to all this..no cash cow anylonger..no one to claim Caylee as their responsibility..it was a done deal.
1300….we aren’t privy to states evidence,therefore no complete picture until trial.
Some questions will probably be answered and some not.This girl will go to prison anyway.
C and G had nothing to do with the murder imho a lot to do with covering up as we all know.Why did they do what they did,and are doing….because they are grieving grandparents who are making some of the poorest choices I’ve seen ever.
Dang, and he is the creepiest, that Urine.
B
They should call the Van der Sloots and ask how well their creep of a son is turning out using the same playbook .
Cindy and George underestimates how dangerous their daughter is.And that is the understatement of the year.So to speak.
Hi Martha,
Yes this site is great i love it,and i now exactly where you are coming from when you say you love every moment you get to spend with your grandchild. I cherish every minute with my children. George and Cindy i believe have told many many lies to save their daughter Casey, but i do believe that they loved little Caylee and i am sure there is a very huge hole in their hearts. Like i said i cherish my children as i am sure you do your grandchild and i cant even imagine that void they must feel.
Suz, and as one example, all that defense rhetoric about ‘junk science’ is just what it is. The science, in the test equipment, analytical techniques, the qualifications of scientists who perform the tests, etc, is solid and accepted in determining chemical makeup– that’s not ‘junk’ in a courtroom. Other issues need to be questioned of course, and scrutinized if it is to be given weight as evidence, but I’m guessing that this ‘new’ unproven (yadda yadda) ‘conclusion’ isn’t really needed in this case. There’s enough corroborated observations, from George Anthony ex cop and grandfather, to knowledgeable and experienced front line police investigators, to people we have never heard from about this as evidence that there was a body in that trunk (such as lab personel). Oh, and the coroboration of tow yard worker(s), who were not expert in decomp odours, but could recognize similarity to what was found in another vehicle.
The defense is making a lot of noise (or has in the past) about ‘junk science’ but I bet that doesn’t matter one iota because they won’t really need it– the most it would do is corroborate what the cadaver dogs and what many experienced people, observed and will testify to. (amateur opinion– but I don’t think the air samples are really the crux of anything here– it’s interesting as heck though)
hmmm…. did Cindy change the date of ‘stolen’ car on purpose BECAUSE this would not tie Casey to the ‘theft’ on the day she left with the baby… and Cindy is concocting a date that would fit had someone taken the car from Casey’s control, abandoned it where it was subsequently towed to J’s Tow yard?
That’s it– the 30th of June– the date Cindy KNEW the car was out of Casey’s possession FOR SURE because she had the notice of towing for June 30th. Cindy knew enough to make sure she said that date, and not the date of June 15th, 16th or 9th.
I think cindy and lee knew caylee was dead by 7/3 but didn’t tell george because he would have called 911. Instead cindy sent lee to find casey and he did. She confesses to lee and cindy but not where she moved caylee because she wants to play cat and mouse so they set out to frame others 30 days no more otherwise others would have started asking. Cindy called 911 because george had the car and she had no choce. Lee however told a bud who told a bud. When george finally found out what lee and cindy had done he was trapped and didn’t do the right thing.but when he testifys he willl have others to cooberate JMO
As far as “where” Caylee was killed: Did Casey carry duct tape around with her all the time in one of her “purses”? She stayed away from the Anthony house after she killed her daughter, right? So if the mandible frightened her, did she “just happen” to have duct tape and a heart sticker on her? Just curious….
And on another note, I’m sickened that little Nevaeh was buried ALIVE by her killer/killers according to the autopsy report. How totally unbearable is this to think about?!
Blink – before you ask for a link, better late than never!! This report about our little piece of Heaven was on Jane Valez Mitchel show tonight, and is on ABC News.com and freep.com…..(sorry ’bout that!)
I have been paying close attention the last few days of all the scenarios posters wrote of how Caylee died. I feel I am surrounded by heavy artillery investigators—I am very impressed.
If I may I would like to add something.
Could it be…that Cindy and Caylee did take a swim in the pool, (after spending the day with Cindy’s dad), and Casey came home, noticed they were in the pool, came out to have a conversaiton. Casey thought about jumping in too, Cindy said no, becasue they were getting out (there is something about Cinday saying it was getting too cool). Could it be Cindy was already on edge becasue she was blasted and confronted earlier that day that her own daughter had taken money from Cindy’s mother. So, here she is already hot mad, and then a small argument accrued. Then as they make their way thru the house the argument excalates into an instense fight. Then eventually coming to be a knock down drag out fight where Cindy actually reaches out and grabbes Casey’s throat.
I have either read here or on other secular authorities that it is very possible (Cindy) left in a heated rage. If that is the case, that would leave Casey alone with Caylee and in a furry of hate. We have all become resolute in the fact that Casey killed Caylee over jealousy, envy, and even resentment.
Could it stand to reason that she sufficated her in a fit of rage or drowned her in the bathtub. (There was something in the many pages of autopsy ducuments that said that the air samples of Caysee’s car produced air that was from the “condition” of “suffication” or something like that.) Now that no one was home, (where was George when the fight happened?) Caysee grabbed Caylee up and shoved her in her trunk.
Now lets say for argument say sake Caylee has been in the trunk for 2.6 days. Caysee makes several calls home making sure no one is home… Caysee realized she has to do something. When she opens the trunk she is taken back and horrified by the her daughters appearance. Let’s say then the “O” effect had taken over Caylees face. Jolted by the appearance, she looks around (because she has backed her car into the garage), and sees the grey tape on the shelf. She seizes the tapes and does what she can to “fix her” as Blink helped us to understand
From there she lays Caylee on the ground in the back yard, goes next door barrows a shovel. Now, what if she attempted to dig a hole in the ground (making the ground disturbed), but, that doesn’t work. So next she then moves the payhouse, digs and removes some pavers—trying to create a hole to put Caylee in. When she has that does she bags Caylee and places her in the whole. Tadaaa she is done and know one needs to know. But, woops! now she finds out mom and dad are going to “rework” the back yard.
Again, on another day she calls home to see if anyone was home, then backs her car into the garage, retrieves Caylee. But, where is she going to put her? (There are pings showing the possiblity of Caysee driving around and around possibly looking for a place to “dup” Caylee. When she does, the bag rips….she has to rebag her and then puts her in a laundry bag (that she has swipped from someone elses home).
I realize there is more to it than this. There is gasoline, octadencane, heptanol and acetic acid and so many other scientific words in the trunk…….
This is the scenario that keeps voyaging accross my mind. Cindy’s 911 calls crashes with fear and pain….doesn’t sound like someone to me who has already done their grand daugter in. And please rememer, this scenario is only becasue of what I have read from those who have researched, wrote, or news articles.
I highly respect the explority minds on this sight. If you decide I am really off kilter—I respect that.
I just couldn’t help but think Cindy did not do the murdering. (Now, if Caysee uses the “Cindy did it scenario” I would not be shocked or suprised.)
Please give me some feed back or fill in missing information. I do not mind constructive criticism at all.
#1314 randie. I think she drowned caylee at home.I think when cindy mentioned her finding the pook kadder out that says a lot. Also when le searched the anthony they took pool chemicals
BTW-
If the case actually goes to trial, don’t expect the pundits on msm and cable news to make it seem as though Casey’s goose is (as) cooked (as it is).
They need the ratings, so they will go out of their way to try to make it seem more suspenseful than it is.
July 15th has been qhite the sad “anniversary”.
RIP, CAYLEE MARIE.
Casey killed caylee and confessed to lee and cindy. Cindy the stalker gave casey some chores and lee some chores.and kept her husband in the dark. Until he got the car. Then cindy got casey and had to call 911. The jig was up that’s why you hear stress in cindys voice in the 911 call.
Cindy choked KC 6/15 & George choked KC when she was out on bail. per several sources… I have never heard anyone report that Casey tried to choke a friend or a lover in a fit of anger. That was her parents m.o. not hers.
The last time Caylee was seen ALIVE by anyone outside of the Anthony clan she was with CINDY. There was a fight on the 15th of June that Cindy denies… but e-mails and neighbors statements make it plausible that something MAJOR went down in that home on Father’s Day – a date that Cindy purposely avoided until LE found the Mt Dora video with the great grandfather.
In Cindy’s July 3rd “My caylee is missing” she used the word “betrayal” TWICE! Cindy states “A mother’s love is deep, however there are limits when one is betrayed by the one she loved and trusted the most. A daughter comes to her mother for support when she is pregnant, the mother says without hesitation it will be ok. And it was. But then the lies and betrayal began.”
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/betray
BETRAYAL:
1: to lead astray ; especially : seduce
2: to deliver to an enemy by treachery
3: to fail or desert especially in time of need
4 a: to reveal unintentionally b: show, indicate c: to disclose in violation of confidence
Oh my! Who slipped up and revealed the truth? Whoever it was, Cindy attempted to harm/kill KC and then Caylee ended up dead.
Casey may be in jail charged with murder. However Ms Cindy has some splanin to do! If George did lie about seeing the “girls” on 6/16 (which I believe he did)
CINDY was the last adult ever seen with Caylee. THINK ABOUT IT!
After all Cindy made it a point to say when she left for work the girls were “breathing” because she heard them through the door- hence both were ALIVE. Then why did someone from the Anthony home call Casey on her cell phone on 6/16 around 7:00- 8:00am when they could have just knocked on her door and talked to her…after all she was in the bed asleep with her baby YES?
UMMM – I’m not buying it!
Silverspnr –
We’ll have to agree to disagree because I am 100% convinced she intended to retrieve the car. However, to respond to your latest . . .
I don’t think she was pretending to want to get gas for Tony’s sake. Casey called Jesse and asked to borrow his gas cans on June 28. He said he couldn’t help because he was across town. Casey sent a text to Amy on June 29 and asked to borrow her gas cans; Amy’s gas can was in storage and she had to work that day, but she told Casey she would buy one and let Casey borrow it. The next morning, June 30, Casey dropped Tony off at the airport at 9:00am and THEN went to Amy’s so that she and Amy could go to Target to buy the gas can. They did buy the gas can and Casey did borrow it that day, but unknown to Casey, the car had been towed when she was at the airport dropping Tony off. She did not go through the motions of buying the gas can with Amy and then borrowing it to hoodwink Tony because Tony was on a plane halfway to New York.
There was no advantage to Casey in ditching the car at Amscot.
The car was locked, there were no keys in it, and it was out of gas, so it would have been extra difficult to steal. And if she wanted it to be stolen, she would have left it unlocked at the VERY least.
If she wanted someone to smash the window to take the satchel and CDs from the front seat (thereby complicating up the crime scene, I suppose), all she would have done is ensure that Amscot would call OCSO to report the break-in instead of Johnson’s to request a tow, and George and Cindy would have been contacted immediately by LE. That could hardly have been her goal. [The break-in scenario was not your suggestion, but I read it in another comment on this thread.]
I’m sure you are correct that there is nothing on the Johnson’s Wrecker Towing signs to indicate how many days a car may be left unattended before being towed. However, if she wanted to rid herself of the Pontiac because the smell was becoming intolerable to her, she was only acting against her own interests if she deliberately left it at Amscot intending it to be towed. The car is registered to George and Cindy, so they are the parties who would be (and were) notified by Johnson’s. Casey caught a bit of luck because the car was towed four days before a holiday and because Johnson’s is greedy (delayed mailing the notice until July 11). If not for those things, the Anthonys might have learned of the tow during the week of June 30, and that is not something Casey wanted to happen.
Just four days after the car was towed, Casey went ballistic according to Troy and Melissa because they were at The Lodge and Casey wanted to leave because Lee was trying to find her. Lee said he had checked her MySpace and saw that she told someone she would be at The Dragon Room. I suspect that person was Maria Kissh, who told LE that on July 3 Casey had contacted her to ask if she was going to the Dragon Room that night. Maria said yes and asked if Casey would be there. Casey responded that she was also going to be at the Dragon Room that night. Lee and a friend went to the Dragon Room looking for Casey or anyone Lee recognized as a friend of Casey. He didn’t find her but he said he believed someone had tipped Casey off that he was looking for her. Casey talked to Lee by phone later that night and insisted she was in Jacksonville.
The next day, July 4, when Lee checked Casey’s MySpace again, he saw that all her comments going back to late April had been deleted. Casey deleted those comments IMO after realizing they would have allowed Lee or Cindy to contact all her newest friends who had exchanged messages with her on MySpace (Amy, Tony, and Tony’s roommates especially) and would possibly have allowed Cindy or Lee to track Casey down through one of those friends.
She did not want to be found by George, Cindy, or Lee.
So if Casey wanted to ditch the car because she couldn’t stand the smell, she would not have done it in a way that would have alerted George and Cindy and prompted them to demand a visit with Caylee. And that is exactly the response Casey would expect once George and Cindy were notified of the tow, smelled the foul odor in the car, and saw Caylee’s car seat and favorite doll in the back seat.
Cindy was able to locate Casey on the night of July 15 because Amy’s telephone number was on a resume in Casey’s “work bag” and because Amy was willing to take Cindy to Tony’s apartment. Before calling Amy, Cindy had sent text messages to Casey saying, “Call me asap major prob” at 4:47pm and “Call me” at 4:45pm. Casey wouldn’t call her, and that is why Cindy called Amy.
If those resumes had not been in the car, George and Cindy would not have found Casey on their own that night. If they had picked up the car a day earlier when Amy was still in Puerto Rico, they would not have found Casey on their own that night.
But given their anger and great concern after retrieving the car, if Casey had continued to stonewall and continued to refuse to let them see or talk to Casey, Cindy and George would have called OCSO and given LE Casey’s cell phone number to use to locate her, probably the next day.
I do not believe it was driving her insane with impatience waiting for Johnson’s to pick the car up because I don’t believe she expected the car to be taken away quickly, but I do believe it was wearing on her last nerve waiting for Cindy and George to learn that the car had been towed and to discover the condition it was in.
Cindy knew that Casey was returning home to get clothes for herself, never for Caylee, and Cindy also knew that Casey was ‘playing her’, this all according to Brittany Schrieber’s LE interview excerpts from one of the OCSO document releases.
Cindy knew that Casey was playing her by calling her on the phone, asking to meet her somewhere, then when Cindy leaves the house, Casey sneaks in, gets her stuff AND STEALS money each and every time. You try to pull this type of ploy on a hungry dog to steal it’s cache of meaty bones a couple times, you might fool it once, maybe twice, but it’s not going to take the bait and play your game for long. So why would Cindy keep falling for this trick more than a time or two? Why wouldn’t quick-minded Cindy, figure this out, drive around the block and come back into the house and catch Casey in the act of stealing money and confront her about the missing grandchild?
(was Cindy’s Universal trip one of those Casey-diversion scenarios where Casey came in for more clothes and cash– maybe)
A savy parent could have caught Casey in the act, demanded to know where Caylee was to be sure she was alright, but apparently they did not do that.
Source:
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/media/acrobat/2008-11/43612651.pdf (includes excerpts from selected interviews of the Nov 26th doc dump)
Brittany’s interview p. 2412 (p.54) (more than one interviewer)
Q: you had made a mention that the mom mentioned that uh, Casey’s items were missing from her room, but none of Caylee’s were.
A: None of, yes. Uhm, Cindy told me that Casey would call occasionally to meet up with her, or have a reason for her mother to leave the house, and that gave Casey just enough time to get in the house, take stuff that she needed, but never took any of Caylee’s stuff. And Caylee’s stuff was never moved. No shoes, no pajamas, no clothes, no dolls, no anything.
[well, we know about the Winnie-the-Pooh quilt was taken, Cindy must have also known this if she paid attention to what was and was not taken]
Q: And you said that they were stealing from her?
[note this investigator, 'EE', said 'they'-- Cindy planting a 'they' theory vs a 'she did it alone' theory?]
A: Stealing money.
Q: Stealing money?
A: yeah
Q: Was that during the same window of ……
A: Yes
Q: … removing clothing?
A: uh-hum (affirmative)
Q: And that’s from the 9th through…
A: Yes
Q: All the way through July?
A: uh-hum (affirmative)
Q: 9th of June through July?
A: It could have been before, but she told me that every time Casey would come that she was also stealing money, so.
[so, why didn't Cindy and George set up a sting to catch Casey? Was that what George did try to do with the gas cans in the trunk incident but didn't follow through when he got the cans back?]
(We also know that the reference to June 9, should be read as June 16, at least ‘officially’)
Was the Myspace page created for ‘Zenaida’ created by Casey?
If so, Lee’s statement to LE (same source above) that Casey told him “I know where Caylee is, she is with the nanny” might have a ring of truth to it….
The Myspace page for Zenaida shows an image for Zenaida as ‘Dora’. (The image is of Dora the Explorer)
Caylee’s Dora the Explorer backpack was found in Casey’s car. Is Casey trying to use this detail via what she told Lee, to tie the car to the ‘kidnapper/killer’? (last time Casey saw Caylee she was with Zenaida/the nanny)
If Zenaida is Dora
and if Zenaida is ‘the nanny’,
Then Dora is the nanny.
Dora was last seen with Caylee by Casey. Zenaida was the last person Casey said she saw Caylee with. Casey didn’t see Caylee again once she was put in the bags and moved from the car to the woods and Dora the Explorer, stayed with the car.
The world knows Casey IS guilty. 31 days without reporting your child missing. Her own mother has to report her missing. How long was she going to “hunt” for little Caylee? There IS NO DEFENSE for this biotch. They HAVE to be planning to tamper with a juror or threaten a member of a juror’s family. There is NO OTHER way this is going to trial. It DOESN’T MAKE ANY SENSE!
Can we please dispense with the name calling? It’s cheesy and has no place here.
TIA
B
I would like to say a couple of things about what I am thinking.
First off, I think it’s kinda interesting that everyone thinks that Cindy should have been on top of things when Casey took off with Caylee. Casey was Caylee’s mother. She had every right to take her and go anywhere she wanted with her. LE would not be able to do anything about Casey “running away” with Caylee. Cindy could not call LE and report Caylee missing. She acted, IMO, as soon as she had justifiable reason to do so. Upon finding the “dead body” car and finding her daughter with no Caylee. Cindy had NOTHING to do with Caylee being killed or I think Casey would be telling everyone and anyone that she did. I think we would have heard about that by now. Casey wants it all to be about her and have everyone’s sympathy. If Cindy had assisted in any aspect of Caylee’s murder, Casey would be crying “See feel bad for me. My own mother killed my daughter.”
I also believe Casey killed Caylee at the house. That’s where the blanket, trash bags, duct tape, and possibly the laundry bag all came from. I think she used chloroform (this site says you can make it with pool shock http://www.sci-spot.com/chemistry/chloro2.htm and that’s why LE took pool chemicals) and made a feeble attempt to bury her in the back yard. After it was discovered yard work was being done, she moved her (someone above said the same thing, but I don’t remember who. Sorry.)
If Cindy, George, and Lee where that involved in her murder and/or ensuing cover up of such, they never had to report it. All they ever had to say was Caylee was placed for adoption or living with family in Ohio, or anything. They didn’t seem too friendly or close with the neighbors. I really don’t think any of the neighbors would have asked twice. Casey killed Caylee alone, and now the family is trying to save their daughter/sister. She’s all they have left. Caylee’s gone, they need to hold on to Casey.
Just my thoughts.
Does anyone know if there is actually video from Amscot parking lot that shows Casey and her car?
Maybe, Cindy went back to work on July 15th, (the day the car was picked up from impound) with the intention to get some cleaning chemicals. The kind of cleaning chemicals that only a hospital would have readily availabe (as in not sold in general stores) for cleaning the smell of death away. Just a thought.
It is hard for me grasp why she would go back to work after such a discovery of the car smell. Added with; well everything else in last 30 days.
Add in that George said he was told by Cindy to go back to work immediately. But he did not-
hmm
B
Maura had previously posted that the Dora the Explorer backpack was with the remains, which I’d first thought when making the Dora with Caylee connection, then saw a report about the backpack being in the car. Either way, it works as a reason for Casey to make that statement and to be thinking in a twisted way, she’s telling the truth.
Maura, Kleat, Silverspnr,
Wow, you guys are some serious thinkers/sleuthers. Talk about thinking outside the box. Yikes for Casey if you were on her jury, or anyone’s for that matter, ha. Please understand that I give you credit for digging up things, and going in depth to a degree that most of us wouldn’t, or couldn’t for that matter. I respect your opinions greatly, and while I’m amazed at things like Dora being the sitter, Casey going to traffic court as Zenaida, and leaving clues of this and that. I think the problem is, you give Casey too much credit. You’re thinking of Casey as someone who might think like you do, which I assure you, she is NOT that bright. Cindy tries to appear “that bright” as does Lee, but neither of them are either, and George, well…..speaks for itself.
I’ve read all your clues and opinions, and while I try to be a real “thinker” I’ve found maybe I’m not as in depth as you guys, and so I’ll give you the opinion of maybe a person that would be seated on Casey’s jury, or what that person would see. Maybe even what LE see’s, or some of them, as I’m not sure anyone has dug as deep as y’all have.
I think there was a time before all this happened, that Casey looked up neck breaking, chloroform, and household weapons. I don’t know who exactly she planned on getting rid of, but I can assure you it was on her mind. It either hadn’t played out yet, or she changed her mind, per: circumstances related to Caylee dying. I think there was also a time she thought about life without Caylee, looking up the 100th episode of One Tree Hill is evidence of that for me. I think she thought of the nanny at that point. I don’t recall if Cindy or Lee said they had heard the name Zanny prior to all this, but I know George said he hadn’t, and I’m not so sure Richard Grund did either. Nanny, yes, Zanny or Zenaida, I just don’t know. However, I do recall there being a Zenaida connected to Casey’s myspace initially, so who knows. As for the connection to Sawgrass, that is why I think there may have NEVER been the name mentioned before, only nanny. I think it was quite possibly then and there that Zanny came about. Yet another reason I think Casey is given too much credit for being smarter than she is. I think she didn’t bet on Zenaida just “looking” at the apartment, but assumed she would rent from there, and therefore, her story would stick that a Zenaida that lived there took her child.
I think that Casey met Tony and while he didn’t flat out say he didn’t like little girls, or that Caylee wasn’t welcome at his house, he made it clear that it wasn’t the place to bring a child, not a good environment. I think if you add in the conversation that he would rather have little boys, gives you an insight on what Casey maybe thought the night this happened and she needed a place to go.
I believe there was a fight the night of the 15th, and I believe that’s the last time George or Cindy saw Caylee. I think Casey left the house and Caylee was probably crying for Cindy, maybe she killed her then, who knows. Maybe she taped her mouth shut and put her in the trunk because she was going to Tony’s, as she had nowhere else to go, and wasn’t about to go back in the house and ask to stay with Cindy. I don’t believe Cindy heard them through the door, “breathing” no less, pfffft. There would be no reason to say you heard them at 7:30, then to call Casey’s cell phone at 7:45. Nope, no reason at all, unless of course, she wasn’t at home. You were either calling to say you were sorry about the fight and to bring Caylee home. You were just checking to see where they spent the night, etc. etc. I believe that Casey killed Caylee, without a doubt in my mind. How exactly, or when exactly, I’m not positive. I do however, believe that she did it, she tried to cover it, and no one knew about it until later. I don’t believe for a second that Cindy killed Caylee, nor did she know about it till later. I think Casey was going to make it appear as though Caylee drowned, therefore, she put out the ladder to the pool. Maybe she did drown her, who knows. Anyway, I think she made the flurry of calls, no one answered. She started to doubt her own story, no one would believe Caylee drowned. She freaked out, put Caylee in the playhouse went and borrowed the shovel, tried to dig a hole, realizing that was too hard, or wasn’t going to work, she hid Caylee in the sandbox, as it had a lid and Caylee would be hidden while she thought of what to do. She backed the car up to the garage, put Caylee in and off she went. I think her cell phone pings that showed she was in the middle of nowhere basically, she was probably looking for a place to dump her. I believe on one of her trips back to the A’s to take something she needed, she decided to dump her around the corner, as it would be a place she could check on, she was familiar with, and she knew, or thought no one would find her.
I think from that moment on, she decided to not look back and live “the beautiful life”…. until or unless she got caught. One of the reasons I say Casey isn’t very smart, during all this time, she never thought to take any of Caylee’s stuff. Either she didn’t want to look at her room, or she just didn’t want to be bothered with it, or she just didn’t think of it. Out of sight, out of mind.
I think a lot of Cindy’s guilt comes from enjoying the time that Casey was gone. I don’t think she thought Casey would kill Caylee, therefore, when they first left, she did actually believe that Caylee was with Casey, or at the very least, that Casey wouldn’t do her any harm, or leave her anywhere she would be harmed. As much as Cindy and George loved Caylee, having them gone was probably a nice little break for them. In fact, maybe Cindy even thought to herself, “finally Casey is going to be a mother and I can take a break from it.” However, I do think at some point, on or around the 3rd, something happened to make Cindy think Casey was lying, and something could have happened to Caylee. I don’t think she initially thought death exactly, as I think she would have tried harder to find her right then and there. I don’t think it was long before she thought that though, or at least worried about it.
I think during the first couple of jail visit videos, Cindy is asking Casey questions because she truly didn’t know, or didn’t want to believe that Caylee was dead, that Casey did it, and wanted to believe the Zanny story. I think there was almost a light bulb moment on one of the videos when Cindy is so sad looking, she is telling Casey they aren’t doing well, she is trying to evoke some sympathy from Casey, to get her to finally fess up. I think a couple of times she did this, tried to show Casey that she was killing her and George and Casey could end it all by telling them the truth. Some of the questions she asked, such as about the car, about not taking any of Caylee’s things, the tiffany ring, the haircut, etc. She was actually trying to believe the Zanny story, but was beginning to realize it wasn’t true. When she told Casey to look her in the eye, she knew then, she just didnt’ want to know. I think George knew from the moment he smelled that car, and I do believe he was truthful in the beginning with LE. I think he tried so hard to keep it from Cindy that he somehow convinced himself to try and believe the Zanny story, and then at some point though, they both found out the truth. That’s when all the lying started. That’s when George became angry. During the M&M depo’s George smirks and smiles many times, but those are the times he is blatantly lying about something. He actually smiles/smirks EACH and EVERY time he gives an answer that he KNOWS to be a lie, knows to go against every thing he told the grand jury or LE when he was trying to be honest. His anger comes from the lies. He is NOT good at it, he doesn’t necessarily like doing it, but he’s doing it. He is now all caught up in it and I think it makes him angry. When he is questioned it makes him mad, just as it did Casey during the jail visitations.
Each time the jail visits started, Casey would plop down in the chair with a big smile and big hello, only to realize that each visit would turn into another question/answer session. She hated every second of it. She hated it because she didn’t want to get caught, but she also hated it because it was all about Caylee. She wanted it to be about herself. She wanted them to ask how she was doing, talk about what she was eating, talk about how much they missed her, etc.
Ok, I know I’ve gone on and on, so I’ll cut to the chase. I think a jury will look at a few things, then nothing else will matter. They will look at the fact that it was 31 days before Cindy called 911. If it hadn’t been for Cindy calling, who knows how long it would have gone on. (though I believe Cindy wouldn’t have made that split second decision if she had it to do over, she would just try to cover it up forever)…anyway, Casey got caught, otherwise no one would have called 911 at the 31 day point. The jury will look at the pictures taken, the videos from target, the testimony of friends who claim she never even mentioned Caylee, except to say she was with the nanny, but even more than that, she never once acted as if anything were wrong. The jury can look at her text messages, myspace messages and see she was never a grieving mother, or worried mother. She never one time searched for that baby. She wasn’t grieving, in fact she was celebrating.
The jury will see that the Anthony’s are NOT standing behind Casey, but attempting to help her get away with murder. They will see that Casey NEVER helped look for her daughter before, during, or after any of this started or was going on. They will look at her demeanor while she was out on bond and realize she didn’t care at that point either. They will also realize that Cindy claimed at one point to have phone numbers and addresses for Zanny, yet NEVER ONE TIME did they look for Zanny or anyone even remotely related to her. She will be found guilty. The defense can talk all day long about evidence being circumstantial, but even to us more simple-minded thinkers, even we can see that evidence is EVIDENCE, regardless what you call it. Without a crime of some sort, there would be NO EVIDENCE, circumstantial or otherwise. Her goose is indeed, cooked!
To #1305 Gypsy DD, I agree with your whole scope. Cindy’s trajectory is bent on a new path. She is dead set in protecting, shielding and covering up for her daughter.
Maura-
Now that I think about it…
I think that Casey selected a public place to ditch her car for a reason.
Have you listened to Annie Downing’s LE interview?? Try listening to Part 2 in its entirety.
The “when this is all said and done, I have so much to tell you” statement is put into context during this segment. Annie reveals –after some probing– that this came on the heals of Casey’s “I DON’T TRUST JESSE” theme.
She was trying to tie him to the car. He didn’t take the “bait”. Perhaps Amy was just next in line.
In any event, she had to tie someone else to the car, but also, she had to ditch it at some point.
Keep in mind: the car contained evidence of Caylee’s DEATH in it. More than that- have you ever smelled decomposition??????
She had to get rid of that car. No two ways about it.
I think you are giving this girl far too much credit in the intelligence department, although I will give you this:
She had TWO reasons to ditch that car there. She called JESSE first for a reason.
It’s called FRAMING someone.
Re@ Scarlett # 1293 post.
My thoughts pretty much to a T. I don’t believe the parents knew anything from the get go. I think it was out of rage on Casey’s part and I agree.. she couldn’t go home with out Caylee. So I think she tried to act like everything was normal and fine.
If the parents or just Cindy did know what happened, why wait a month and then throw Casey under the bus, and then do a total flip and defend her with every breath you have?? That doesn’t make sense. When you watch the jail house chats with the family you can tell and feel the family tip toeing around Casey. They know her rage first hand and they know she can explode if questioned about anything and would clam up so they try to be gentle with her..
Cindy is something though… While talking to Casey you can tell she just wants to shake her and scream at her for information on where Caylee is.. Even when Caylee is raging about, not letting her talk and how nobody knows how she feels and how she is effected by all this blah blah blah, you can hear Cindy in the background with her zingers about how this should be about finding Caylee. Those are little one liners that Cindy just can not hold inside and that is just a smidggen of what she really wants to say. When I watch her it is almost like I can feel her near eruption in Cindy. You know she just wants to go off and scream at Casey to tell them where Caylee is… Watch Cindy when Casey tells her she had asked for her dad to be the “one” to come and see her. Cindy says something like “well talk to your dad then” sarcastically and hands George the phone.. You know she wanted to flip out right there.
Another example of Cindy and her personality is in one of the chats Casey tells them to hold on for a minute and starts getting up and Cindy goes “yeah well don’t waste our time”… Like Casey was just going to leave them sitting there while she took a stroll around the place or something?? Casey is in custody and if someone tells her to get up and put the chat on hold.. Well that’s what you do. But Cindy the control freak didn’t like that for a second..
Nope I just don’t think this family knew from the begining but I think they realized after retrieving the car what was going on but they just couldn’t wrap their brains around the reality of it. It was probably a survial mechanism of some sort to stay halfway sane..
One more thing is when Cindy asked her why “SHE didn’t pick up the car and that it doesn’t make sense” it made me think that Casey had told them a story about the car that hasn’t come out..
#1314 Randie
I have been thinking along the same lines that you are especially if Cindy drove off on June 15th and left Casey and Caylee at the house.
When Cindy got back home Casey and Caylee were gone. I think Caylee probably drowned that night. Whether accidentally or on purpose I don’t know.
#1319 Silverspnr
I also think Casey intended to get the car from Amscot. She tried too hard to get gas cans. But there are a couple of things that I still have questions about. Why did Casey have to have Amy go with her to get the gas can at Target? To drive Tony’s car back to the apartment?Did Amy pay for the gas can? And did they actually put gas in the can and go to Amscot and find that the car was not there? Why didn’t Casey just go buy a can and put gas in the car? Was she broke at that time? Because Cindy took money out of Casey’s wallet when Lee got to the Anthony house with her things from Tonys. Or was she planning on maybe setting the car on fire? That would have gotten rid of the odor. Did she intend to take the car to Tony’s and try to clean it up?
Being car-less was certainly not part of Casey’s plan; rather, it became a necessity due to Casey’s carelessness when moving Caylee’s decomposing body from the primary crime scene (Hopespring) to the tertiary crime scene (Hidden Oaks) via the secondary crime scene (the Sunfire).
BTW-Maura- I have to thank you for making me think about the car at Amscot situation more deeply, because I believe it sheds light on when her plot to frame Jesse was hatched.
#1326 well said Wendy! It’s amazing the group of intelligent people on this site! I love reading everyone’s insight even if it differs from my own. Blink, Maura, Kleat, Silverspnr and everyone else bring up so many valid points and careful speculation. You all really know your stuff! I still feel, however, that Caylee’s body was in the backyard but not for any long period of time. Maybe an hour or two at the most. I just think if she left it there overnight in the sandbox or under the playouse she would be sick with worry that her parents would discover the child’s body. And her demeanor after June 16th based on all her friend’s accounts never included worry.
Wendy #1327
This case is very compelling for those of us who enjoy sleuthing, and it is rare that so much evidence is available to review before trial, in part due to Florida’s liberal disclosure rules, but also because of Casey’s (and the Anthony’s) countless lies, which forced LE to conduct so many interviews, etc. For example, Iassen Donov. Without Casey’s lies upon lies upon lies.. this is a guy who could have been ignored. But now we have another little piece of the puzzle, because he had that Instant Messenger log saved. And there Casey is again… flirting with & leading on yet another guy/(pretending to casually be) inquiring about Brandon Snow’s engagement, making plans to party.. all while her daughter was supposedly “missing”/”kidnapped”, all while she was allegedly following some “script”.
What a terrible waste of taxpayer dollars this girl/this family has caused. Taxpayer dollars that should have gone to REAL “missing” child cases.
You find yourself guessing at the specifics (we all do), but you know in your heart and your mind that Casey is guilty.
Jurors are instructed to use their “common sense” in arriving at their verdict, and for good reason. I obviously agree with you that a jury of reasonable folks will not need to delve as deeply into the details as we may here, but perhaps some of what we do discuss here will be useful to others, more intimately involved with the case, down the road.
Correction! Sorry again, Maura! I see that you were not giving Casey too much credit in the intelligence department at all. More like perhaps just missing how scheming and remorseless she truly is?
Let’s focus on who she selected to frame.
Jesse Grund. The guy who, while certain he could not have been Caylee’s biological father, still stayed in the life of a girl who accused him of something that generally sends a guy running for the hills. The guy who looked upon Caylee as his own, whose family looked upon Caylee as their own.
He may have had an issue which caused him to resign from or be terminated from?) his LE job(don’t know the specifics), but regardless, there is no evidence tying him to this horrific crime (other than Casey pointing her guileful finger at him).
A brilliant example of the saying, “No good deed goes unpunished”.
I have a comment regarding Cindy’s going back to work after going to the tow yard. It could be that there was some sort of plan in her/their minds at the time to perhaps clean up the car or get some chemicals…but I think it could be equally plausible that Cindy was just doing what she seems to have always done regarding Casey. She was waiting to hear what Casey had to say, she refused or tried to refuse to believe the worst and probably thought she could ‘handle’ whatever it was herself, as she had done so many times in the past. She just couldn’t face it at the time and going to work was a mechanical response to her. IMO, it was too early for the Anthonys to begin their damage control. Of course, I’m reading that there could very well be things that happened on 7/3 that changes this but it’s just my opinion.
IMO
I think that it’s a possible that casey looked up neck breaking possibly?? for cindy!!
After all it was cindy that grabbed casey by the neck the night they had that big fight??
Is that a possible due to the fact that she hated her mother and was going to get her back for breaking her neck.
More like I will fix you!!! attitude??
Lori, yes ‘let Casey’ explain the smell of death in the car, the smell that George later yelled to media was not from his granddaughter being the body in the car, and Cindy theorized that the security of Johnson’s Towing was questionable enough that the media should go investigate how a body got into their car and caused the smell ‘after’ it was towed– ie: her statement while wielding hammer in her front yard. (right– so where did this body go after it decomposed in the car and why would someone take it out again in ‘that’ condition”???)
Lori, you are right, they were letting Casey dictate things all along– steal, lie, etc. But Cindy waiting for the explaination of where Caylee was again, is fine but this car was a crime scene and they knew it. Had Cindy not talked to Casey for the prior two weeks, she would have not allowed that car to be moved, called the police, FBI, the works, in right then and there so a proper investigation could begin. (and as Silverspnr commented earlier, not paid the bill because there would be no need to pay it)
The question I have always asked myself was this, why did casey want her last jh visit to be with george alone? And why did cindy go abyway? What did cindy not want george to hear? Casey was not happy that cindy showed up. And why no more visits after that? Oops that’s several questions.
More Questions than Answers, your last post– why all the work of Casey getting gas cans etc. The car was NOT run out of gas and pushed into the parking space. Go back and read the interview of who was that, Gary Ridgeway, tow driver? (boy does he have one unfortunate name that makes it easy to remember)
Also, Amy and Casey went to Target to buy a gas can but never got gas, never returned to Amscot, never actually used the gas can (per Amy’s interview– when did they buy it– Sunday 29th wasn’t it?). Sunday– yes, but already the car in the lot for two days. (and not actually out of gas remember– it was only Casey who said that the car ran out of gas and she had some help to push it from the street to the parking lot).
The use of filling a gas tank from cans– you don’t have to go under video at a gas station or be seen by the clerk and probably several other customers and you can get someone else’s prints on the cans. But more importantly, running on the low end of the tank, allows you to easily say ‘I ran out of gas AGAIN! Stupid car!, and you can know there is very little gas in the tank, even if you don’t actually sputter to a stop. And if you do end up stopped somewhere, there is that can of gas to get you to where you plan to leave the car– Amscot.
Maybe Jesse just didn’t work out so well for getting prints on the brand new can. Maybe Amy was a target all along too, and going off to PR, led to investigation going there as if someone took Caylee out of Florida and ‘off-shore’. As of April, Cindy said in her depo with Mn’M, that they still had investigators watching a Zenaida in PR.
Kosmo, they didn’t know ‘from the beginning’.
What Brittany S’s interview shows, is that Casey was able to come and go from the house, conveniently without Cindy being there. (Cindy was on holiday, so getting Cindy out of the house that week while Casey returned for her stuff and money was most important then, less when both she and George were working).
If someone knows that someone is coming into the house and taking things including ‘their money’, they they don’t keep money there, period. But Cindy was concerned about the baby obviously, so Casey taking money would give Casey a source of money to pay for Caylee’s needs– food, milk, juice, mini-pancakes, waffles, and the like.
Seriously, Cindy probably wanted to be sure Casey had some money accessible to her so the baby could be cared for so she would not change the locks, hide the money away, at least for the while.
Re: Kleat, #1338 — This assertion by Cindy that the smell was from a body placed in the car after it was towed to Johnson’s seems to fly in the face of her being so adamant that the smell was from rotting pizza. Huh??? Guess she really did know the difference between rotting food and decomposition after all!
Kleat, thanks for your comment. Another comment (sorry if this is obvious) – if Casey’s car had run out of gas, then it wasn’t as if she ditched the car, she pulled it into Amscot because, presumably?, this was the closest lot to pull in to? Am I correct? I guess I don’t understand why some think she purposely left the car there to be stolen..I just don’t see how that can be. Whether she planned to get back to it or just leave it is another thing.
Thanks – I love this site
#1336 – Lori – I agree with you , Cindy was doing what Cindy does best, trying not to admit to herself that it was anything other than the bag of garbage stinking and thinking this will make casey and caylee come home when she will demand that casey tell them why the car stinks so bad and why it was towed. She was probably also thinking now casey will come home, cause she has no car. I just think cindy thinks she has “the goods” on casey now and this will make her talk. Cindy wasnt letting herself believe that it was really a dead body put in there by casey and dont think she believed for a second that the dead body would have been caylee.
If something was found in the yard on july 3rd, I dont think it was really any huge thing or they would have made sure they got to casey, way more than just once having lee get to her to talk to her. I think the caylee missing on july 3rd on facebook is just what cindy has said, she was attempting to guilt casey into bringing caylee home. I really just havent read any facts that would lead me to believe that cindy and george had anything to do with caylees death nor anyone else other than casey. Cindy and George loved caylee, there is no doubt in my mind on that one. I believe that for the most part this family was doing the best they could to be a normal family but in wanting that, they were in denial about how deep caseys problems were and they ended up enabling her to lie and steal. I think shirleys mother says it best when she says casey hated her mom more than she loved caylee. Shirley was totally onto how twisted casey was and how deep cindy and george were in denial.
#1325 Blink brings out a good question. Why didn’t Geore go back to work? I did not know that he DIDN’T go back to work.
I knew from one of Cindy’s co-workers police report that Cindy (did) go back to work, but, only under the pretext that “she wanted to give Casey a chance to explain.” Then she was requested by co-workers to go home.
But, why did George not go back to work???????????????
a. He stayed…long after Cindy left to: clean clean clean clean the trunk.
b. He stayed….to see if Casey would slip in and repossess the car. He did take out the battery so the car could not be driven. Was he waiting waiting waiting waiting for Casey. (He was fed by with what happen to the gas cans.)
c.?
d.?
Help me out here I am stumpped.
Also, why in the evening of the 15th does George only take at the very leaast just one of Cindy’s calls? And why doesn’t he come home the first time she asks him to? Where was he????? Cindy sicks Lee on George to go and get him. Then George arrives only after Cindy makes her famous call to 911. When you listen to it, you can hear he has just arrived and she is explaining what has transpired. Until Blink mentioned that–I had never given it any thought. Any thoughts anyone????????
I would imagine DNA tests of the decomp material where the mystery body the Anthonys claim was in their car,must be part of the reason Casey is charged with CayLee’s death and facing the DP.
So Kleat as you describe so well….Cindy and Georges explanations just make them seem even more unfortunate.
They aren’t the only people who have had a child murder their grandchild.As time goes on I hope they are fortunate enough to have some one or support group that will help them come to terms with this.
For now they continue to keep company with people who are encouraging and taking advantage of their denial.
Silverspnr
You gave me a good chuckle with your 1329 comment because I think you’re the one who’s giving Casey too much credit for intelligence.
Casey asked Jesse and Amy to borrow their gas cans because they were both friends she was in near-daily contact with who OWNED gas cans.
Starting around June 25, she had been setting up an innocent alibi for the smell. She told Amy that suspected George had run over an animal when he borrowed her car. She “confirmed” the dead animal story in a text message to Amy on June 27 – less than 30 minutes before Tony picked her up at Amscot. Amy said during a phone conversation around that time Casey said she believed the animal was a squirrel. Casey maintained a variation of dead squirrel story (minus George’s involvement) through the night of July 15 when Cindy called 911. On that night, Casey told Lee that the smell started back on June 5 when Casey believed two squirrels had crawled up under her hood and died.
Seeing that she had been setting up the dead squirrel story for days before running out of gas at Amscot on Friday, June 27, I sincerely fail to see how asking Jesse and Amy over the weekend to borrow their gas cans indicates any plan devised by Casey to frame either one of them for the smell.
If she had been planning to ditch the car and frame someone for the evidence of decomposition, she would not have talked about the smell at all much less sent a text message indicating her awareness of a decomposing animal in her car.
Do you really believe that after days of setting up an innocent alibi for the smell (involving George) that she arranged to run out of gas in the Amscot lot, called Tony for a ride (establishing that she herself drove the car to Amscot), sent a text message to Amy while waiting to be picked up stating she had found an animal carcass stuck to the frame of her car, then called Jesse the following afternoon in an attempt to frame him for the evidence of decomposition? And that when Jesse said he was on the other side of town on Saturday afternoon and therefore couldn’t help her, that instead of arranging for his help the following day (assuming she was determined to frame him), that she simply let Jesse off the hook and turned to Amy as the next available patsy?
Are you saying it was all for show that Casey woke Amy up on the morning of June 30, drove Amy in Tony’s jeep to Target to get a gas can, and then left later that afternoon with the gas can? Amy said Casey stayed with her until Amy went to work around 5:00pm. Casey’s cell pings show that she left JP’s at 4:48pm and drove west on Colonial. At 4:51pm, she was pinging a tower located about five miles east of JP’s condo and 0.76 miles west of Amscot. She stayed in that area until at least 5:04pm. She couldn’t have known, before leaving Amy’s house with the new gas can, that the car had been towed eight hours earlier when she was dropping Tony off at the airport because she drove directly to Amy’s after leaving OIA.
After a 25-minute break in phone activity, at 5:30pm she was back in the immediate neighborhood of JP’s condo. So after leaving JP’s condo with Amy’s new gas can, she drove five miles east, stopped in the Amscot area for 30 minutes or so, then turned around and drove five miles west back to the area of JP’s condo. For what reason did Casey take the gas can, drive to the area where she had run out of gas on June 27, and then after a short stay, turn around and go back? She hadn’t gone to Tony’s place because he did not leave her a key to his apartment when he went to NY.
Hours later, she went shopping and made a cash purchase at Target for $7.49 per Lee’s receipt list, so we know she had cash for gas at that point (plus, she had paid $16 in cash on Saturday night for two movie tickets), so I am assuming she got money Friday night at Fusian via tips or stealing or both.
I perceive no indication whatsoever that she had devised a plot to frame Jesse Grund or Amy Huizenga simply because she tried to borrow his gas can on Saturday and her gas can on Sunday. The fact that she took Amy’s gas can on Monday evening, drove from the condo to the area where she left the car, then turned around and drove back to the condo tells me she expected to find the car there and intended to put gas in it.
1331 More Questions than Answers
I believe Casey was dead broke when she ran out of gas just before noon on Friday, June 27, and that’s why she called Tony for a ride from Amscot.
She expected to get money that night at Fusian because she had taken it upon herself to manage the shot girls, and I expect they gave her a cut of their tips in appreciation for making sure each girl got equal time and territory on the floor. She may also have been stealing tips from the tables.
She didn’t want to spend her own money for the gas can. When she sent Amy a text message on June 29 (Sunday) asking to borrow Amy’s gas can, Amy explained that her gas can was in storage so she couldn’t get it. But she told Casey that she could always use another gas can, so she offered to buy one and let Casey borrow it. Casey was not about to turn down that offer because it would save her from spending her own money.
Amy was working on Sunday, so on Monday morning, after Casey drove Tony to the airport, she drove to JP’s condo and woke Amy up. They went to Target and bought the gas can between 11am and 1pm, then went back to the condo and hung out until Amy had to go to work around 5pm.
Amy said Casey took the gas can. Casey’s cell pings show she left the condo when Amy left for work and drove in Tony’s jeep to the area where she left the car. She was hitting the cell tower she was hitting when she was at Amscot waiting for Tony to pick her up the previous Friday. The car had been towed that morning when Casey was taking Tony to the airport, so when she left the condo with the gas can, she didn’t know the car was no longer in the Amscot lot. After staying in that area for about 30 minutes, Casey turned around and drove back to the condo. I think she went to the Amscot with the intention of putting gas in the tank using the gas can she had just borrowed from Amy, but the car was gone.
On July 15, Cindy took money out of Casey’s wallet, but that money was from the $250 check Casey had cashed earlier that day (made out to herself for cash) using one of Amy’s stolen checks. She didn’t get that checkbook until July 8. Some of that cash may also have been from the $400 wad she stole from Amy in the early morning hours of July 3. At any rate, Casey didn’t have much cash on June 30.
It’s possible she may have set the car on fire at some point, but I don’t personally think that was her intention during the weekend that her car was sitting at Amscot.
Was she planning to clean up the car? That could very well have been her intent. I do believe Casey was being truthful when she told Amy that the smell in the car was getting worse every day.
My opinion is that she disposed of the body on June 19. When she lifted the body, the plastic bag broke and some malodorous decomposition fluid spilled onto the carpet liner in the trunk. She threw a trash bag from Tony’s apartment into the trunk for an alibi and also (according to discovery) threw in some fabric sheets (four IIRC).
At that point, she may have expected the smell to diminish over time instead of strengthen. But the smell was getting worse. She may have wanted to deep clean the carpet but didn’t yet have money for that. On Monday, June 23, she ran out of gas and had to break into George’s shed to get gas. She had run out of gas that day when taking a shortcut to the Anthony house, so I suspect she was driving there for the express purpose of getting those gas cans because she didn’t have any money to buy gas.
By the time the smell was getting bad enough that she felt she had to come up with an innocent alibi (the dead squirrel story she told Amy), she was biding her time until she could get money to clean it properly. But by the time she did get money (at which point the smell was so bad that she HAD to work on getting rid of it) and did go back for the car, it had been towed away.
bottomline #1292, LE asked casey’s friends (i am forgetting whom, but I think at least tony and amy) if they saw kc with any packing materials e.g. duct tape, and they said no. She was so careless about everything else, I am surprised they haven’t found the roll of duct tape used (unless she just lifted the strips of tape from somewhere, like the strip of tape that was on one of George’s gas cans).