Kyron Horman Missing and Endangered: Kaine Horman Points A Finger Directly At Terri Horman
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“I believe respondent (Terri) is involved in the disappearance of my son Kyron who has been missing since June 4, 2010”
The grim words of Kaine Horman as they appeared in the restraining order filed against his estranged wife, Terri Moulton Horman, were unsealed yesterday.
It was the start of developments beginning to weave a portrait of Terri Horman, from the eyes of her husband and Kyron Horman’s biological Mother, Desiree Young.
“I thought the marriage was doing pretty well,” Kaine Horman said during a one-on-one interview with The Oregonian, “until we had our daughter, Kiara.”
Declining to elaborate, rumors of Terri Horman suffering from bouts of post partum depression following the birth of the couples 19 month old daughter have been swirling since the case began.
Yesterday’s press conference with Kyron’s parents, Kaine and Desiree left no doubt they believe Terri is involved with Kyron’s disappearance, and confirmed what has been reported exclusively on blinkoncrime.com previously:Terri Horman failed both polygraph tests administered during the investigation.
“I have known Terri a long time, and I know she is lying.” She went on to say she had her suspicions from the onset of the phone call she received alerting her that Kyron was missing.
Curiously, famed Portland attorney Stephen Houze, retained by Terri Horman June 28th, known for his Public*Relations*Prowess, would not comment on the divorce, custody, or criminal investigation involving his client.
Although Terri Horman had 5 days to respond to object to the restraining order which denies her any visitation with the couples daughter, there was no response filed on her behalf in family court.
It is this editors opinion that was a calculated move on her part NOT to have to answer to the allegations of Kaine’s petition which could then be used against her in a criminal proceeding.
Last evening, an amendment was filed to the restraining order to force Terri Horman from the marital residence, which was purchased in Kaine Horman’s name in December 2006.
Speaking to blinkoncrime.com on the condition of anonymity, sources inside the investigation have confirmed that the detectives sting on the grounds of the Horman home, where a landscaper believed to have been in a romantic relationship with Terri Horman requested $10,000 for an alleged murder for hire plot, may have impeded the investigation.
“The climate was one where their hand was forced. They had the guy saying one thing, and when they said “prove it”, they felt they would be arresting her on at least the solicitation charge.
Did it backfire? Uh, yes, in a way, because for one– nobody gets paid ten grand for killing a live guy.. For two, she did not flinch, and between the two of them at the time she called 911, she looked more credible. It was an uncomfortable situation for detectives to have to explain to the patrol.
I think they are desperate to resolve this case, but I do not think Terri will be the first to be arrested, I think the landscaper may be arrested tomorrow. They are going to need a pretty solid case to get him to flip if she was involved, which it looks clear that she was. Our prosecutors use a grand jury in lieu of a preliminary hearing almost, so I would bet that is going on behind the scenes..”
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The more that desiree talks in her interviews, the more I realize that I knoW absolutely nothing about her. How many times she been married? Does She have anyone who would want to harm her kids? Did terrie know about the change in visit for the day of June 4?
Why does she keep talking? LE has made it very clear that they are NOT supporting the interviews because of ongoing investigation.(With a capital NOT) we asked the question about tanners grandma, when she did an interview when she was asked not to.
She is admitting to long term resentment of Terri. Resentment is the first step in all divorces, murder and war, then comes resistance, then revenge.
I’m just saying someone needs to get her to be quiet or lawyer up.
Unless LE goal is to get her to talk…then talk away desiree..
Re: #37 Hopalong
I would postulate that James moving out of the Horman household was part of Terri’s “plan.” Surely there were problems as with any hormone enriched adolescent boy, but HE was TH’s child,to be moved from pending harm’s way. Besides, by mere virtue of his presence he might accidently aquire information as to TH’s “plans.” Think of the consequences, what if he turned on her to protect Kyron? Divulged info to LE? Began to have serious negative emotions about her – a narcissist’s worst nightmare -criticism.
susan says:
July 10, 2010 at 5:44 pm
@oblio: You are confused. My comment was about the scene at Kaine Horman’s home when High**Powered**Attorney opened the gate to the residence (owned by Kaine Horman) and shooed away reporters with the comment “this is private property”. Implying that he and Ms. Hormone had rights to the property and the reporters had better keep away because of T.Hormones property rights. T Hormone has no claim to that property, it is ino Kaine Homran, only.
My apologies for confusion, but even so, this is a semantics issue at best.
Also, I find it a bit grotesque that you keep calling her Hormone. I thought Blink frowned on that sort of thing, but I could be wrong.
I have commented on this before, no name calling. Secondly, it is a marital residence. If he could exclude her from it based on the deed he would have. He can’t. Nothing bugs me more than unresearched legal opinions, cite your case or research or don’t comment on it. Ya know, like in court.
B
@ Kaylee–wow very interesting observations from your experience. Humans are such complex beings. Thank you for sharing your story.
Blink… Were you able to verify if the person being held by the MCSO as a ‘material witness’ is in fact Antonio Gonzales?
In the parking garage video, Terri looks like a scolded child or someone shamed the way she is hiding behind the woman with her. I also agree with the pelople who observed the woman smiling. At one point, it’s almost as if she bites her lip to stifle a grin. Then she gathers herself and reminds the reporters that they are on private property ect. JMO.
Angelica–
I agree she looks like guilty child in the garage video. Similar to the odd glance at Desiree in the first press conference, she looks up at D. As if she is guilty or to check if D. is buying what she’s selling.
I also agree the blonde with her smirked a little. I think it was becuase the media ambush was so cliche it wa preposterous.
Not that it matters, but she looked very youthful in the garage video. I don’t think her kyron tshirt was very flattering. I think that’s why Desiree doesn’t wear hers.
1) In Today’s Editor’s Column in The Oregonian, Peter Shata writes about:
“Exclusive plot-to-kill story puts sourcing in the spotlight”
If interested, here is the link:
http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/07/plot-to-kill_story_puts_sourci.html
2) Re: #2 Angelica: the reporter noted that the parking garage was not private property. There was no emotion in Terri’s face. As far as the woman smiling, she probably doesn’t encounter this often and it was a nervous response.
I keep hearing theories that Terri planned K’s disappearance. And about how she is really devious, psychopathological, a big crime-show fan, etc. Should know how to successfully plan, commit, and get away with a complicated crime.
So, for folks who hold that theory, my question is this: wouldn’t one of her major strategies be to establish a highly credible alibi for that entire day?? Or did she just forget that one major detail?
I was going to post this on Scared Monkeys, but as I have been waiting over 3 weeks to be approved as a member, I felt this post could not wait any longer. I am going to apologize in advance for the very long post to follow.
First off, I do not know if TH is innocent of guilty, nor do I care. I want to see Kyron home. I am not LE, I can only give you a glimpse of what happened to me as a “Step-Mom” the day my children went missing. That was the worst day of my life.
Before I get into that day, I need to fill you in on the background of why my Husband and I had full custody of his boys and why they call me “Mom”.
When I met my Husband, he was recently divorced and his son’s were in foster-care. Just before they divorced, his soon to be X stabbed him in the stomach with a steak knife, in front of the boys. “D” was 4 and “W” was 2. When he called the police she told them he attacked her and was only defending herself. It took some time before LE figured out it was all a lie, even though “D” told them what had happened. Because he was only 4, they did not want to listen to him, and they did not want to listen to my soon to be husband “J”, as spouse abuse is usually the man abusing the women 99 times out 100. They only wanted to listen to his X “T”.
Once they figured out that “T” was the one abusing, they took the boys away and placed them in Foster care while “J” was in the hospital recovering. Once out of the hospital he had to go through parenting classes, to prove that a single man could raise children alone (yes, this was many years ago, and I am glad to see things have changed since then). “J” had just finished parenting classes when we met. I was a LPN at the local hospital and had just gotten divorced from an abusive relationship myself. I was impressed that “J” could fully understand what I had gone through, as he had just gone through worse.
We had a whirlwind courtship and we moved in together, and less than two weeks later we had full custody of his son’s. Their Bio-Mom “T” was not allowed near us (RO). The RO was only good for one year, and we let it lapse as we had not seen hide nor hair of her for the entire year…big mistake. Less than a month after it expired, she was attempting to get visitation.
“D” had been so traumatized be seeing his father attacked by his mother, he developed ODD (Oppositional Defiant Disorder). In other-words, he did not like to hear the word “No”, and was always acting out. As I was a nurse, I understood this. It did not make life easier, but I understood it and the reasons behind it. The more “T” would come around, the more upset “D” would become. She did not want to hear from me that she was causing emotional upset with her son and refused to speak to me. My DH “J” tried to tell her, but she did not want to hear it from him either. She was in her own little fantasy world. We dealt with the fallout for about 4 years, when she was diagnosed with Schizophrenia. She then started new therapy, new meds and started to realize what she was doing to her children emotionally. She then choose to disappear out of their lives for the next three years without a word. So when she showed back up on our doorstep, it was a complete shock and surprise, as well as set off much turmoil in my house over her return.
By this time, “D” was almost 12 years old, and he took his Bio-Moms return VERY badly. His grades slipped, we were getting daily phone calls from school over his acting out behaviors, hitting teachers, running away from school, throwing books etc. His little brother “W” worshiped him, and would do whatever “D” told him to do blindly, even though he was 10 and knew right from wrong.
One morning we went to get the boys up for breakfast (it was a Saturday) and they were not in either of the boys bedrooms. We searched the house, we searched the basement and attic, we searched the street, but it was a blizzard nd the wind child factor was 35 below zero. I was terrified out of my mind! All I could think was their Bio-Mom broke in and took them! We called the police, while waiting for LE to show up, the neighbor who lived across the street was shoveling his driveway, and we asked if he had seen the boys. He said Yes, about 3 hours ago, he saw them around 5:30 am walking down the street together.
By this time LE showed up, and as soon as they heard I was the Step-Mom, I was asked to come to the station for questions. DH was asked to stay at home in case any phone calls came in. I grabbed my purse, and for the first time saw that my wallet was not in the right place in my purse, so I checked and all my cash was missing! $275 that was for paying the electric bill was gone! I told LE this, and they did not seem to care.
By this time is was around 9am, and I was escorted into a private room to be questioned by LE, and they grilled me over and over again on “where are the boys?”. I had no idea, but they said that because I was the step-mom, that I had to have done something to them while my DH was sleeping. Since they knew all about how “D” had been acting out at school, it had to be my fault! I told them what the neighbor said about seeing them early in the morning and the money that was missing out of my wallet and about the Bio-Mom, but all to no avail! I was questioned until 3pm on what I did to the boys!
Turns out that the boys had gone to the local grocery and had spent over $75 on chocolate, donuts, candy and soda’s. They then went to K-Mart and bought $100 worth of toys, collectible trading cards, and assorted junk. They were picked up by LE at McDonald’s at 12:30 in playland, eating burgers, playing with toys and having a grand ol time! Yet they did not release me for another two and a half hours!! Because It had to be MY fault that the kids “ran away”….
Four months later they changed “D”‘s ODD diagnosis to Bi-Polar Disorder. He was put on new medication and he was a new child! He just graduated High School with honors, and is on a variety of meds to keep his bi-polar disorder under control (to include Lithium, serequel and abilify). “W” is 16, “D” is 18, they call me Mom, and we have not heard or seen “T” in over 5 years now. Yet, I still feel uncomfortable around LE because of the way they INSISTED that I had to be the reason my kids were gone…all because I was the SM.
So yes, I have compassion for TH, and hope that Kyron is safe and will be found soon, and that it turns out that TH had nothing to do with his disappearance as SM’s are too easy to blame….
posted by Kleat on the wrong thread, moved by Blink as a courtesy to Kleatsy-
Blink, this is a nice turn of discussion and understanding. To that understanding, did you notice that you said ‘Kyron was…’.
I hope that this does not turn to become about lawyer faces and use of little Kyron’s baby photos, on GMA, Today Show, People, and the rag mags. The lawyer must know by heading to NYC for his ‘business’ (just like Baez) to pay his fees for his client, that this is a sad turn in the use of the ‘justice’ system.
‘The end of the week’ turn of events has not come to pass, the facebook Find Kyron page was not closed by the end of last week, as predicted in the media last week… something is coming.
Thanks for explaining the GJ set up.
RE: Beejay: Go back and start reading Blink’s reporting of this story beginning at Kyron Missing: Watch Press Conference Live. The only “theory” you should believe is the reporting by Blink.
snapoutofit: Sorry I don’t have time to reread everything posted here. And, frankly, I’m starting to get even the facts confused. I do not agree with any of the speculative theories I’ve heard here. My comment was meant to get people thinking a little more deeply. And perhaps being more consistent with their speculations. I.e., it’s unlikely that a devious, cunning, skilled “criminal” also just happened to forget to establish a good alibi.
It’s not my theory, though I do have one. I keep trying to ground myself in reported evidence and what I know. I don’t always succeed.
@ Kleat when you say
“I hope that this does not turn to become about lawyer faces and use of little Kyron’s baby photos, on GMA, Today Show, People, and the rag mags. The lawyer must know by heading to NYC for his ‘business’ (just like Baez) to pay his fees for his client, that this is a sad turn in the use of the ‘justice’ system”
I totally agree that seeing this kind of behaviour in lawyers is just horrible esp when we see it in cases such as Caylee’s when her mother has lied so much and in this case where the indications are that TH is holding back information but the problem here is money and someone who is rich and can hire a good atty would not have to do this, but we all are aware that a “good” atty can save or not save a person. I would never try to critise as the same thing happens here in the UK and this is a trans national comment, but, and this is directed towards people who may be innocent yet are accused, what can we do to make this fairer? Should a cap be put on murder cases for lawyers fees so that the rich do not have an advantage and that the photos of children are not sold to pay those fees? I am very respectful of US law and I admire your consitution. I make these comments with the aknowledgement that the same happens in my country, I just trying to make a general point about justice and money, which is that those who have don’t have to stoop to the level of selling photos etc and their lawyers are paid to keep quiet (I think) and not go on talk shows. My views on TH are pretty pessimistic but if we take the view that “innocent until proven guilty” which is a UK tenant (I am not sure the terms in the US but similar?) then it’s hard to defend someone (even if we are dubious) doing the most they can.
Can I say again that this is a US blog and I am a visitor who cares about missing children and respects the views of the American people here so my comment is not against US lawyers/defendants anyone, just a comment and as I am not that familiar with your laws and culture please respect that I am just considering things…
@ Kleat when you say
“I hope that this does not turn to become about lawyer faces and use of little Kyron’s baby photos, on GMA, Today Show, People, and the rag mags. The lawyer must know by heading to NYC for his ‘business’ (just like Baez) to pay his fees for his client, that this is a sad turn in the use of the ‘justice’ system”
I totally agree that seeing this kind of behaviour in lawyers is just horrible esp when we see it in cases such as Caylee’s when her mother has lied so much and in this case where the indications are that TH is holding back information but the problem here is money and someone who is rich and can hire a good atty would not have to do this, but we all are aware that a “good” atty can save or not save a person. I would never try to critise as the same thing happens here in the UK (where the lawyers are not better) and this is a trans national comment, but, and this is directed towards people who may be innocent yet are accused, what can we do to make this fairer (opps and this is a general comment I am not American so would never comment directly on your laws but in general)? Should a cap be put on murder cases for lawyers fees so that the rich do not have an advantage and that the photos of children are not sold to pay those fees? I am very respectful of US law and I admire and respect your consitution. I make these comments with the aknowledgement that the same happens in my country, I just trying to make a general point about justice and money, which is that those who have don’t have to stoop to the level of selling photos etc and their lawyers are paid to keep quiet (I think) and not go on talk shows. My views on TH are pretty pessimistic but if we take the view that “innocent until proven guilty” which is a UK tenant (I am not sure the terms in the US but similar?) then it’s hard to defend someone (even if we are dubious) doing the most they can by finding a good lawyer and having to find the means to pay for them.
Can I say again that this is a US blog and I am a visitor who cares about missing children and respects the views of the American people here so my comment is not against US lawyers/defendants anyone, just a comment and as I am not that familiar with your laws and culture please respect that I am just considering things…
I know others have pointed out TH’s overstatement of her teaching creds (claiming on LinkedIn special ed, college-level ed etc. when she is licensed for general elem/mid-school ed … see Scared Monkeys
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8198.0). She also mistated her actual teaching experience as being with Portland Public Schools (her license states Mooberry Elementary, in the Hillsboro School District). One wonders why she deliberately mis-stated what little true experience she had?
Also, anyone notice when she re-upped her teaching license? Feb. 23, 2010 … around the time she was allegedly hatching MFH plot.
She has a good alibi. She left Kyron at the school (so she says) and no one saw her leave with him. It doesn’t have to be some master criminal plot; just reasonable doubt. And if they can’t produce anyone who saw Terri leave the school with Kyron, that’s enough for reasonable doubt in a court of law.
If I was on a jury today; despite my feelings that she absolutely did this, based on the fact that no one can place Terri leaving the school with Kyron, I’d not be able to vote to convict.
In the Joran Van der Sloot case, we’re all fairly sure he killed Natalie. He was the last one to see/be seen with her; he’s acted guilty and even confessed a couple of times before withdrawing it. He even killed another girl, but based on evidence, if he went to trial just for Natalie’s disappearance, no jury could find him guilty.
Terri’s alibis are just fine. Until/unless someone comes forward or video tapes catch her with Kyron after she supposedly left him at school. She doesn’t need anything iron-clad or foolproof, or elaborate. Even her cell phone pings can’t prove anything. Sure it’s suspicious why she would lie about it,but it’s not proof she did something to Kyron.
So far, there is no smoking gun in this case. And I’m no expert, but I think a LOT of criminal cases go down with just this kind of planning.
oyce says:
July 11, 2010 at 4:26 pm
I know others have pointed out TH’s overstatement of her teaching creds (claiming on LinkedIn special ed, college-level ed etc. when she is licensed for general elem/mid-school ed … see Scared Monkeys
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8198.0). She also mistated her actual teaching experience as being with Portland Public Schools (her license states Mooberry Elementary, in the Hillsboro School District). One wonders why she deliberately mis-stated what little true experience she had?
Also, anyone notice when she re-upped her teaching license? Feb. 23, 2010 … around the time she was allegedly hatching MFH plot.
—————
Perhaps so she could be at work when the hit went down? Ironclad alibi.
FLGirl: I see your point. Not ironclad; it’s a little too high-risk for me. Fortunately I’m not a criminal. I would’ve wanted not only for no one to see me leave with Kyron, but for several people to see me leave WITHOUT Kyron. But that’s just the overly-cautious person I am.
The only other problem I have with the Terri’s alibi thing is you’d think she would’ve been establishing an alibi for at least PART of the remaining time. Assuming she had some free time. The more time you can account for with an alibi the better.
@ Oblio: I have already stated that “this is private property” by attorney is a true statement. Eviction complaint has been filed by KH.
Reading between the lines of KH’s statement on the eviction action against TH, I suspect that he was acting in fear of his life in moving out. If someone connected to the hit is now in custody, perhaps he wants his home back? I believe that we will see that play out in court later this month?
The bottom line on the attorney/property/access/money from interviews as I see it: it would be so much more appropriate for these dollars to go into the reward fund for finding Kyron, or for finding justice for Kyron. If several hundred thousand could be generated by interviews, and instead of being siphoned off into TH’s legal defense, could be used to build up the reward fund…..(?)
That amount of money just might be the difference in finding Kyron or finding justice for Kyron, if someone has knowledge and they may be persuaded to break the bounds of friendship with perp, WHOMEVER THAT MAY BE, and come forward.
I believe Joran Van Der Sloot is attempting, and has attempted to use the media funding for access interviews in this manner, so it must be legal. As far as ethical, or passing the smell test, not so much.
As regards the pseudonym I used, it was my take on the muscle bound body building pictures of TH. I am not used to seeing women building muscles of that magnitude. I have been advised that male hormones, (derivatives of testoserone) would be used to generate that bulk in a woman. I think we have all read about the issues regarding ‘roid rage’. MANY of the websites, and media have made some sort of play on her name and the hormone issue. Nonetheless, it is not my objective to offend her friends and supporters.
@Midwest Mom: Desiree comes across to me as justifiably upset, polished, professional, and believable. Evidently she also passed the polygraph test, and, I assume, has not attempted to hire a hit man for any husband. She also sounds to me like a concerned Mom, wanting to find her child.
Is it true what you are saying that Desiree and Kaine are speaking out in defiance of LE? From what they have said about being certain to comply with LE, and not compromising the case, I wonder if your statement insinuating that they are in defiance of LE is accurate.
susan- you are incorrect that “private property” relates to Terri Horman and her residence with Kaine.
Legally, there is no such thing as an “eviction complaint”. And I have repeatedly quoted family law as it relates to a marital residence.
Honestly susan, it is not to much to ask to research your LEGAL opinions. In that, if you make a statement about the legal position or standing back it he hell up already. I don’t care about your opinion if it conflicts with the known statutes. It is like a one person argument and tiresome.
I have no intention of mediating what should not be subjective, please already.
B
snaptoit: Jeez, I meant to mention this earlier. When I read the article you linked to, about sourcing and Maxine Bernstein’s story about the alleged MFH plot, this hit me:
Max found the LS witness after the sting? I had ASSumed he was being held as a material witness and not out running around. Where’d she find him? (I know his vehicle & license info. went out on the police scanner, so she could track him down if he were at home, or out and about.)
“She found the landscaper, and she confirmed independently what she had initially heard. All the conversations were required to be off the record, and she, quite understandably, told the landscaper she would not use his name.”
http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/07/plot-to-kill_story_puts_sourci.html
I support this 1000%.
As you will notice, I directly sourced them in my coverage, as should anyone.
Fwiw, I have found local outlets to be quite good about source linking, as opposed to those covering the Morgan Harrington case.
B
SCS asks:
“How can we help support those who have the awesome task of finding the evidence and bringing Kyron home?”
Yes, we know there is corruption and graft anywhere we turn, but for the most part, Law Enforcement personnel work their hearts out, difficultly balancing family and work and life, for their goal to keep our society on an even keel.
I don’t know how to support them more than to believe in them.
LE, LE spouses and families–you have more support than you’ll ever know. And thank you so much for your sacrifice.
Joyce says:
July 11, 2010 at 4:26 pm,
Deliberately misstated.
OR Didn’t make the profile ??
I saw this guy on Multnomah County Jail site, July 7th when he was booked as a material witness. Sorry I didn’t post it sooner! Here is the link:
http://www.mcso.us/PAID/BookingDetail.aspx?ID=IBFGWo9cC4T8oBfbZFrjsg==
***********************
Booking Information
Image Loading…
SWIS ID: 730674
Name: Gonzales, Antonio Jose
Age: 20
Gender: Male
Race: Hispanic
Height: 6 ft 0 in
Weight: 175 lbs
Hair: Black
Eyes: Brown
Arresting Agency: MCSO Transports
Arrest Date: 7/7/2010 8:00 AM
Booking Date: 7/7/2010 2:49 PM
Current Status: In Custody
Assigned Facility: MCDC
Projected Release Date: Unknown
Court Case No. 090933594 DA Case No. 2159257 Citation No. None
Charge Bail Status
MATERIAL WITNESS (U ) $0 Unsentenced
Court Case No. None DA Case No. None Citation No. None
Charge Bail Status
FACILITY HOLD (U ) $0 Unsentenced
*****************
I didn’t post it because he is only 20, and I thought the young age might make it doubtful for it to be him. Plus I thought you might already have it.
Blink, there are about 6 guys and 3 women in Multnomah County Jail as Material Witnesses right now, booked between mid June to July 7, 2010.
Also, here’s a handy link to a site called PDX Mugshots. It updates daily and you can click on a huge array of crimes and photos. It’s scary!
The cool thing about PDX Mugshots is the fact that you can click on the crime and bring up everyone booked for that particular one. Also, I stupidly forgot the link, here it is:
http://pdxmugshots.com/
The site last updated on July 9th.
Blink:
Will you address my question about where Max found the LS witness?
I said:
“Max found the LS witness after the sting? I had ASSumed he was being held as a material witness and not out running around. Where’d she find him? (I know his vehicle & license info. went out on the police scanner, so she could track him down if he were at home, or out and about.)”
@Blink: I was agreeing with Oblio, OK???? I said that Attorney’s statement “This is private property” is a TRUE STATEMENT.
Pardon me for phrasing KH action as “Eviction Complaint”. Would it be “petition the court for removal”? or perhaps I dreamt it?
http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Kaine-Horman-seeks-to-have-Terri-forced-from-their-house-98074584.html
I am not trying to antaganoze you, but I do not like mincing words between eviction process, eviction petition, eviction request, eviction complaint. I do believe that KH is asking the court for some action here for removal of TH.
You seem to be awfully upset. I do not like being cursed at when expressing my opinions in what I thought was a respectful manner.
Susan
Susan, I do not do passive agressive.
The law does not mince words, that is exactly my point. It is the same for every poster on here.
If you cite a legal position, it needs to be correct, and/or backed by a statute or case law.
It is not my job to take the time to clarify your words to have a blog that contains a “best effort” at factual info, it is the job of anyone that wants to participate, and is welcome to, under very easy conditions.
This is not the water cooler or a phone conversation with your BF.
My dear, I work on gruesome true crime cases. That upsets me more than I could convey in words.
You however, do not.
B
Take a look at this site and the insight into TH’s lack of a public statement.
http://seamusoriley.blogspot.com/2010/01/baby-gabriel-dead.html
TH was asked directly, repeatedly, in the parking garage if she had anything to do with Kyron’s disappearance and her answer was NOTHING. Innocent people say “no”, guilty people say nothing.
TH has told someone what she has done – directly or indirectly. A true friend does not protect the guilty friend from the harm she has done and the punishment that is due. Please share what you know for Kyron’s sake.
Hi, my first post here but have been lurking awhile now.
I wanted to comment on the press conferences. It almost seems to me that Kaine and Desiree (especially Desiree), are deliberately trying to discredit Terri to “someone” in particular who may be watching.
I have no doubt that DY really feels what she is saying (liar, etc), but I also recall when they said EVERYTHING they did or said was for the purpose of getting Kyron home. I can’t think of how this negative talk about Terri is helping with that unless they are trying to reach someone who may be helping/has helped her, in an attempt to turn them against her.
Just my opinion, could be wrong of course.
@snapoutofit-That is why I stated it was just my opinion. No 2 people see everything alike. That’s what is so great about this site. You get a variety of perspectives and it can make you look at things in a different light.
@beejay says:
July 11, 2010 at 3:11 pm
I keep hearing theories that Terri planned K’s disappearance. And about how she is really devious, psychopathological, a big crime-show fan, etc. Should know how to successfully plan, commit, and get away with a complicated crime.
So, for folks who hold that theory, my question is this: wouldn’t one of her major strategies be to establish a highly credible alibi for that entire day?? Or did she just forget that one major detail?
**************************************
Beejay: I believe that Terri did provide an alibi (running errands, etc.) but I believe that it did not hold up to close scrutiny by LE. I can’t speak for TH or her alibi, but I do know that *smart* criminals sometimes fail to establish a foolproof alibi. It’s part of the problem when committing a crime–one person can’t be two places at the same time (the place where crime is committed and somewhere else). Maybe TH didn’t think of everything. Most criminals don’t. Maybe TH thought that her vague alibi would be enough. Maybe she just thought because she’s gotten away with other things (like a MFH plot till recently) she could get away with others. Maybe a lot of things, but your statement that a smart person should be able to get away with a “complicated crime” is fraught with evidence to the contrary.
Also, TH may have been a fan of crime shows, but this doesn’t make her a criminal mastermind. I mean, I watched Martha Stewart and I can’t fold a napkin into a duck or swan or whatever the hell it is supposed to be.
I don’t know what TH did to Kyron, but what I do know about her so far I’ve cross-checked and cited several different items and I’ve been able to do a YES checkmark on a number of ASPD traits. I think that the reasonable minds on here would not be supportive of TH involvement without LE substantiation and other facts to support, and I’ve a feeling that Blink would stop anything too outlandish. JMO.
@blink: http://radionewz.net/?p=31328
this is the “private property” comment I was referencing, not your discussion of marital v. individual private property.
Eviction complaint, eviction action, request for removal, whatever, I was referring to the latest legal action by KH against TH.
http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Kaine-Horman-seeks-to-have-Terri-forced-from-their-house-98074584.html
Again I do not appreciate being cursed when I was expressing simply an opinion, as best I know how.
I am sure you are tired of working on Sunday, moderating comments, but I am truly offended at being cursed on a website when my comment was taken out of the context I intended.
I would appreciate your including my response, this post, so people will understand the context of my comment.
Thank you in advance and no hard feelings.
Susan
Susan-
I tire of this. It is beyond indulgent of you to need to be right in the context of a case of a missing child and I do not have the fortitude for it. Enough.
Respectfully, nobody gives a rats ass ( yes, now I am actually cursing) about your issues when there is a 7 year old child missing and possibly deceased. Start a blog. Start a Band.
Just use your powers for good already.
B
Lisa: I really don’t know (b/c LE is so close to vest) what transpired that morning, but I believe that Terri knew what was going to happen or did it herself. I believe she thought she had a good alibi, the pic of Kyron on the science fair was no accident. She figured she was known as a good involved parent at the school and above suspicion – remember Kaine claims he didn’t suspect her at all – only DY immediatley suspected her. Who knows what really goes on in other peoples homes anyway?
I know from personal experience how hard it is to prove even a simple crime – like someone slashing your tires. Your ex-boyfriend hates you, he sees you with new boyfriend, you wake up the next morning and your tires are slashed. Try to get your ex charged – sure there’s motive – and you swear you KNOW he did it- but is that what the prosecutor is supposed to argue to a jury? So in a case like this I try to just look at what I know so far – Terri is a major suspect b/c of polygraphs – great but inadmissible. Terri’s basically uncooperative – that is how I would characterize forgetting (refusing) to divulge your whereabouts the morning Kyron goes missing – admissible. Whatever she did divulge is meant to mislead b/c it doesn’t match up with cell pings – admissible. Landscaper situation – maybe admissible if you get the right judge but a cloudy issue – why Kyron and not Kaine? Need more info. DY says TH doesn’t seem concerned about Kyron etc – admissible. Possible statements made to teacher about Dr. appt – admissible. So all these things have to be laid out and then the prosecutor has to basically ask the jurors to connect the dots and find her guilty -but of what at this point? I know there is more meat to this case than we know and I guess that is what I’m waiting for b/c I know that with what we’ve been publicly told – it’s a really weak criminal case. And I’m not a big fan of yelling ‘convene a grand jury’ – for what – to indict a case that’s weak from the get go. No fun for the prosecution trying to prepare a case that is still under investigation.
And unfortunately, It’s not a crime not to care that your stepson has disappeared. I spent this weekend having a great time in the sun with friends and family and I often thought of where Kyron is and what his family is doing. And praying for them.
As far as Terri posting inaccurate information on LinkedIn.com – doesn’t that just reconfirm Desiree’s comment “she’s been lying in the 7 1/2 years that I’ve known her?”
28.snapoutofit says:
July 11, 2010 at 9:22 pm
As far as Terri posting inaccurate information on LinkedIn.com – doesn’t that just reconfirm Desiree’s comment “she’s been lying in the 7 1/2 years that I’ve known her?”
My point. Exactly.
The temperature around here is rising.
Did I miss something? Do we even know what TH’s alibi’s are?
From what I know, well, it’s nothing, just that TH’s story doesn’t match some mystery information that LE has. We know she took him to school and waved him down the hall and was home around 2pm when KH got there.
I am just wondering if something came out that I missed?
I read through comments made by HopeinVA on OregonLive.com. I brought a few over here. The first one was posted earlier today. I don’t know if HopeinVA is TH. I know it has been speculated that they are one and the same. I read these posts as taunting and very gamey, power play like. The posts seem to be written by someone who abhors weight gain (not shown in these posts I have brought over), critical of other mothers, considers themselves to be more educated and above others (corrects grammar and spelling, taunts those who appear to be less educated), and seem to feel she did the right thing (condemns Kaine and Desiree as parents).
I found HopeinVA posts to be creepy.
————-
“i’d bet your paycheck pfigment that he’s in northern cali, or thereabouts….too many cameras on the interstates & too many truckers who’re former LE in between coasts for Kyron to even get close to the Midwest much less east. sorry to bust y’all’s bubbles”
Posted on Potential development in missing Kyron case comes up empty in West Virginia on July 11, 2010, 10:34AM
————-
“a TRO is easy – preponderance of evidence
— essentially, no hard proof needed..just one-sided speculation–
now, the RO hearing is a different matter…the old sneak has banged up some other broad & is no angel (& SM has a better atty)”
Posted on Landscaper tells detectives Terri Moulton Horman offered him money to kill her husband on July 09, 2010, 2:52PM
————–
“someone would have to make an immediate threat to kill, a specific person, & the attorney would have to be the only one that heard it, & only then could the attorney divulge any info…atty-client privilege is “to the grave”, & would be disbarred & open to malpractice litigation if they breach atty-client confidentiality.
o.O
i’m sure the FBG is gonna have an aneurysm over that…LOL”
Posted on Landscaper wore wire, asked Terri Horman for $10,000 in murder-for-hire plot, sources say on July 08, 2010, 12:36PM
——-
“attorney-client privilege is gonna fully protect SM so there’s no way she won’t tell him every detail that she’s aware of, not only about herself but cold-blooded Kaine, ice princess Desiree, & so forth. she has nothing to lose in telling Houze. plus, he’s sorta cute so why not.
if the situation were that someone was saying to their attorney, in private, without any legal secy or paralegal or unretained atty in earshot, that they were going to kill someone else, THEN the atty would be free of atty-client privilege….but otherwise, it’s “to the grave”. o.O. i’m sure it’ll upset some of the haters & FB Gang now. pfft!
”
Posted on Landscaper wore wire, asked Terri Horman for $10,000 in murder-for-hire plot, sources say on July 08, 2010, 12:27PM
annla says:
July 11, 2010 at 8:51 pm
Annla, good post. I am of the same opinion and all of your posts are excellent. I am worried about the actual evidence. I am so hoping that LE has more than we know since they are playing it close to vest. I don’t know what it is that makes this case so upsetting to me, besides the obvious of course. There are parents that have abused and/or murdered their children and of course we are disgusted and saddened. Sometimes I can’t even watch TV specials on these cases because it is too much for me. As a parent, I cannot fathom anyone treating their children in that way. Desiree is getting to me. You can see the agony she’s going through. She is so raw that I can actually feel her pain. I just want it to stop for her and Kaine and Tony; whatever the outcome is – they need to know. I have nothing but deep respect for the local police, FBI, Blink and other people and agencies working on this case. It’s something they have to do, but I don’t know how they do it – I know I couldn’t – not with kids involved. Blink said on Dana’s show on July 7th that she thought the case would break soon. That opinion was shared by Casey Jordan, criminologist (CBS). I truly hope so. I really don’t want a sweet little boy to disappear with no-one held responsible.
Sources also told KGW Saturday that investigators have been creating a detailed timeline of what Terri did the day her stepson disappeared.
The following excerpt is from this article: http://www.nwcn.com/news/Sources-Someone-else-may-know-what-happened-to-Kyron-98201989.html
“While Terri Horman has said she was in certain locations, investigators have placed her elsewhere using bank card records and cell phone pings, according to sources.
Investigators know that she left Skyline Elementary School around 9 a.m. on the day her stepson disappeared and returned home about 1 p.m. But they are trying to fill gaps that opened up from what she told them.”
It goes on to say that LE had reason to believe that TH was involved in Kyrons dissapearance and passed that info to KH. And that sources say they believe TH is not alone in “knowing.”
So, perhaps I was wrong when I assumed that the LS was being held as a material witness after the sting. I do note that he’s being referred to as a “cooperating” witness. I just really thought LS was so deep into this himself that LE would have arrested him as a material witness.
Is he not a flight risk? Is he out on bond? Will he be bringing in a famous defense attorney soon?
Or do they need to have him out and about and under surveillance to see what/who pops up?? Tough choice to make if he’s all they’ve got as of now.
Hope he doesn’t flee or get “disappeared” by some third party who may also be involved.
Hmmmm: “Investigators know that she left Skyline Elementary School around 9 a.m. on the day her stepson disappeared…”
I thought she left him at 8:45. Around 9 is 15 minutes later +/-
Also, this: “Investigators believe someone other than Terri Moulton Horman may know what happened to Kyron Horman,…The sources declined to characterize anyone who has that information, including when and how the details of the disappearance may have been passed along. But Terri may not be alone in knowing, the sources said.”
So would LE do this to try to make TH a little less secure in her “secrets” or to start the who-talks-first-gets-the-best-deal scenario?
Praying that the other person who knows was on video with TH at one of the two store locations requested. If TH bank records showed she was there, not sure why LE would need videos *unless* LE thinks she might have been w/the someone who knows or the someone who dealt with Kyron for her or both.
Does anyone know if the Fred Meyer from which videos requested has an outdoor/fishing/boating dept? Some do, some don’t.
And you know, I just have to add, for someone who is supposed to be so smart, bloody h-e-double-toothpick, what was she doing leaving a bank trail?! Hello, pay in cash.
Midwest Mom says:
July 11, 2010 at 11:32 am
“…Why does she keep talking? LE has made it very clear that they are NOT supporting the interviews because of ongoing investigation.”
Blink, please oh please correct me if I’m wrong on my interpretation here:
@Midwest Mom: I went back and listened to the most recent video and the newscaster stated that KH & DY spoke “within the parameters of the investigation”, and the fact that LE doesn’t “confirm” the information is a far cry from “doesn’t approve of what they’re saying” or “asked them not to speak” (as they did w/Tanner & crew), so I don’t think that your statement that LE is “NOT supporting the interviews” is correct.
Blink?
LE is not appearing with them, and no, they will not confirm information of an ongoing investigation. Word on the street is that they have been asked not to comment in specific areas; standard stuff.
It is my personal opinion that while I understand their obligation to everything they feel they must to keep Kyron’s case active, I am not sure they are not adding fuel to the fire to keep Terri quiet.
That said, I am pretty sure they think she had her chance to talk, and probably never will
B
@ Julie
I read some of those HopeinVA post, eek; the first time she came up that I saw she posted something about a siting of Kyron in Vermont (feel free to correct me if I am wrong), but I think so and I think it was here…
Anyway, I don’t know who this person is, but I think some people have speculated that it is TH? I find it hard to believe, if so, she’s, wow, I can’t think even begin to analyze it…I have doubts that it is, but the condemnation for KH and DY and the “affair” is strange. This person seems to have to “know” them. I don’t know. I know that TH was “dicovered” posting on KATU, I am just wondering if people think this is TH? It’s very uncomfortable to read the postings. Like watching a ticking bomb. I honestly hope it’s just someone messing around, as awful of a thing to do as it is, I’d rather that be the case. It’s all just too sinister.
jane says:
July 11, 2010 at 12:38 pm
Blink… Were you able to verify if the person being held by the MCSO as a ‘material witness’ is in fact Antonio Gonzales?
———–
ok, I missed this somewhere…who is Antonio Gonzales? He was booked on the 7th and is being held but for ? Will have to try to look back at some of these posts…I’m obviously a bit behind..
Hmm…I can’t find a post on Anthony Gonzales but he was booked on the 7th as a “material witness” with no bail. Is he the LS?
Shifting gears here…If LE had a website for me to contribute financially to this investigation – I would. Whether it would be to increase the reward (which I think is only a good idea if you really believe there’s an accomplice out there), or to help the County. I know a case like this can really hurt a cash strapped county – and if there is a trial, especially if it’s a death penalty case – it’s going to be very expensive.
And I know some people feel like this case is all over the news but…I don’t! I have to really look for coverage outside of Portland. Kyron’s face should be EVERYWHERE if they think he’s really just “out there”. And that makes me think they don’t. Of course they have to follow every lead b/c there is a teeny tiny almost impossible chance that he’s in say West Virginia. But I’m afraid they don’t think he’s alive. I think the parents don’t really think he’s alive. But saying he might be keeps people hoping and looking and also maybe it scares Terri if she did have someone do something to Kyron and maybe it didn’t get done. Everyday I hope Kyron is found or that we learn another piece of this puzzle. And if any LE are reading this – stay strong, we need you!
Regarding TH’s timeline after she left the school, if she left the school at 9 and didn’t return home until 1, where was the baby all this time? It has probably been posted but I missed some things. Just wondering, did they have daycare for the baby even tho TH wasn’t working?
“47. osu says:
July 12, 2010 at 6:37 am
Regarding TH’s timeline after she left the school, if she left the school at 9 and didn’t return home until 1, where was the baby all this time? It has probably been posted but I missed some things. Just wondering, did they have daycare for the baby even tho TH wasn’t working?”
——-
osu- that has been a point of question, Kaine stated in an interview that Terri took the baby with her to the school, but Blink (and many of us posters) believe she was not with Terri for many reasons, and that possibly she was left with someone else and that someone else many hold important clues to the case. it has even been suggested (in some posters opinions) that perhaps Terri left the baby alone somewhere….the point though is that we don’t know where the baby was and that is one of the big questions in the case.
Who is Jose Antonio Gonzales, and why is he a material witness? I guess that is the question of the day, lol!
Do you think Antonio Jose Gonzales was arrested in relation to this case? He looks like he was already in trouble.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/03/portland_gang_member_who_shot.html
SWIS ID: 730674
NAME: GONZALES, ANTONIO JOSE
DOB: 07/01/1990
CHARGES:DATE & TIME: 07/07/10 14:49
136613 MATERIAL WITNESS
001300 FACILITY HOLD HOLD FOR EOCI