Jodi Arias Travis Alexander Murder Trial Day 8: Sex, Lies and Duct Tape Causing Jury Doubt
Phoenix, AZ- As the beginning of the second full week of testimony in the State of Arizona v Jodi Arias unfolds we learn some of the most damning evidence against Arias. We also learned that there are clearly holes in the prosecution’s case. Not referring to the holes on visual display last week-in HD, unfortunately.
The very intimate and anatomical chronology of the afternoon of June 4th 2008 leading to the brutal and merciless murder of Travis Victor Alexander included the very carnal and the very barbaric.
A few frames of images deleted from Travis’s camera and a few minutes of time stamped consternation and Alexander ends up stuffed in his own shower.
Kill or be killed was the impetus for this tragedy Arias’s defense promises us in their opening curtsy.
There can be no doubt that Jodi Arias was present the day of the murder, and by her own admission she killed Travis in self defense. By my rough calculations, that would mean under one stab wound per minute plus a gunshot and near decapitation. Travis was 5’9” tall and 189 lbs after nearly total blood loss.
Dr. Kevin Horn Is No Dr. G
The fact that Dr. Horn, forensic pathologist for Maricopa County looks freakishly like Robe Lowe with facial hair aside- he now says that Travis Alexander could not have been shot first. According To Detective Esteban Flores, lead investigator in the case, he was told differently by Horn in telephonic conversations in August 2009. Horn denies he ever said this and Flores gets hung out to dry. A rinse and repeat will not help the prosecution. Horn went on to say that since the bullet passed through the front lobe of Alexander’s brain that he would likely have been rendered unconscious and it may have occurred after his death.
There is no medical evidence to substantiate this. There is no physical evidence to corroborate this, and in fact, it WILL be argued that evidence contradicts this opinion. Dr. Horn could produce no findings of the projectile pathway outside of its final location in the left maxilla. This was definitely not a close contact wound and it produced no star-shaped entry, soot or stippling. The casing of a .25 caliber bullet was found on the floor of the bathroom in a pool of blood believed to be deposited there prior.
Is this opinion outside the scope of submitted evidence AND theory? Horn was an effective witness as to autopsy and wound identification. Travis Alexander fought for his life at least for a few seconds and the gaping wounds to his hands indicate he grabbed for the knife at some point. I found it particularly interesting that he was not asked to speculate on what type of sharp blade might fit the incised wound approximations. Travis Alexander was stabbed 29 times, shot and his throat was slashed.
Editor’s Note: Jodi Arias is left-handed as is Travis Alexander. There is much in the way of fodder to feed incident reconstruction in his report as well as the blood spatter and pooling evidence neither Horn nor Perry were ever asked about.
Esteban Flores Does His Own Stunts
Detective Flores played his own stunt man in this case. His phone interviews and interrogations of Jodi Arias are impressive.
He brought his A game. A for Alexander as he would tell you himself.
His case interrogation skills in this case might ultimately be what convicts this woman and his lessons in patience and diligence should be topics in investigative training for homicide detectives everywhere.
So why the stunt man status?
Because he came into the case on 2 wheels based on the Medical Examiner testimony which I happen to believe accurately shaped the detectives testimony in both the Conus hearing and this trial. Defense counsel Nurmi as well as Prosecutor Martinez eviscerated Flores on his previous testimony regarding Travis’ wound sequencing and Flores was accused of perjuring himself in a motion that is still before the court. Ouch.
Rarely do you see a detective take a cross examination and subsequent motion for dismissal containing the words “perjury” on such a sturdy chin. He took one for the team and he took one for Alexander and the Mesa Police Department is lucky to have him.
And NO, his name does not sound like all other Hispanic names (how offensive was that?) Unfortunately after his testimony this afternoon the shine is off the penny a bit. The jurors submitted questions to Flores while on the stand today through Judge Stephens and it was clear by the tone of them this jury is not eating what the prosecution is serving.
Flores was dejected and sullen when answering the juror questions. He knew.
Juan In The Box
Prosecutor Juan Martinez has an excellent tailor. He is excitable and apparently not a fan of cross examination of state witnesses. By re-direct he is out of the box the defense has been winding up and pop goes the weasel is in the form of evidence he tossed on the floor.
This actually happened.
In his Ad hoc demonstrative aid or improper display as alleged by defense attorney Jennifer Wilmott, Martinez tosses the camera on the floor to the collective spectator reaction “ What the snap??”
Pun intended. Juan Martinez is an effective prosecutor who knows his case well. Where the problem comes in is that his own witnesses are not sure what he is asking them, and he is not putting the issues he already knows will be in contention with the defense out there first. If that scene does not find its way to an auto tune I will be surprised.
Editors Note: Arias is lefty. The button that broke during examination by Detective Melendez and if it had not been already, definitely by Martinez, is located on the right of the camera. It is more likely Arias changed the mode to auto on the camera and that began the successive picture taking. Was it on the strap so she was then hands free? The shower door opens to the right and the person snapping the images at the time Alexander first becomes wounded is very close to his level. Point is- there is much in the way of probative value in the operation of this camera and a simultaneous attack or altercation. Arias receives a cut to her left finger at some point.
A well- intentioned but intransigent message to Mr. Martinez: Pre-emptive is the new appellate repellent.
With daily motions for dismissal and mistrial alleging prosecutorial misconduct and the prosecutor firing a piece of material evidence into the podium- is the writing on the wall on this one?
Martinez is wearing a pace pattern into the carpet in front of the prosecution’s table and the defense is wearing matching hues daily.
To borrow the words of Sweet Brown, “Ain’t Nobody Got Time For Dat”.
Taking a page out of the book of The State of Florida V Casey M Anthony would benefit Mr. Martinez immensely . That said, Mr. Martinez has been known to change it up with a lesser included in that “other” Mormon murder.
Hello…… N U R M I
Say it like Seinfeld would. Kirk Nurmi , while not big on the fashion forward movement, belies his posture and gets the no slouch designation in this trial.
Nurmi misses nothing and his assessment of The Honorable Sherri K Stephens and her courtroom etiquette are spot on.
Nurmi is artful and deliberate. If there is a credible defense to this case he is establishing the predicate for it or a weighty appeal. He is ambi-lawyerous. One senses he sees the holes and knows it is also his job to backfill. In a trial involving such a heinous murder and downright chilling images, the fact that he refuses to tuck the tail of his shirt in the back gives us a necessary chuckle when he is at the podium.
Jennifer Wilmott, the public defender’s representative is intentionally disarming to witnesses for the first few minutes but gave herself away when she corrected Dr. Horn by reminding him of a puncture to the Vena Cava sustained by Alexander. She enunciated it perfectly and with feeling- as if the boots had not given her away earlier.
She leaves her Coach satchel in plain view next to the bailiff door all day. She knows the drill.
Death On a Reel
There was video of the sexual encounter between Travis and Jodi on June 4, 2008. It was deleted according to her and not recoverable per Detective Flores.
What was recovered in both the flash drive and un-allocated space on the SD card of Travis’s camera were like a Kubrick draft. Lust, contentment, fear, crescendo, gore. Did I just see that?
It is all there to view as if one is having some sort of synapse misfire that only allows brief images.
There is a clear and distinct mutual trust between Arias and Alexander before 2 PM on June 4, 2008.
What changed and for whom?
Explicit and sexually graphic images were displayed in open court. Noteworthy items would include that Ms. Arias has had breast augmentation and a very recent pseudo-invasive waxing. Mr. Alexander is apparently not fond of body hair himself. It appeared Travis was less comfortable posing nude for Arias then she for him.
Nothing Says Bonding Like Duct Tape
Travis Alexander clearly has duct tape around his right arm in the explicit pics. Although the shower images are approximately 4 hours later- the marks from it are fresh. Not that the medical examiner nor the prosecution has bothered to reference it or it’s possible connection to the events.
The duct tape found on the tile floor , evidence marker #40 may just be the clue from the glue that provides motive in this case .
Outside Marriage, Sex’s Emotional Bond:
However, outside of marriage, this bond still occurs. The emotional bond is a part of sex, it’s always present, whether we like it or not. But, this extremely tight emotional bond is not such a good thing outside of marriage. Here’s why…(DO NOT remove the duct tape until you describe the break-up of the relationship)
Relationship Examples:
So let’s say that I’m 16 years old (use yourself as an example, not the volunteer) and I choose to ignore God’s plan for sex and chastity and decide that since my boyfriend and I are in love and we’re a serious couple, we’ll have sex. (rub the duct tape in even more, as you continue to talk). Things are going real well, are hearts are real close – like this duct tape here – and then…he starts to get on my nerves, so, we break up. (quickly tear off the tape)
I am not one to believe in coincidence and this case is no different. When Casey Anthony was leading OCSO detectives to her imaginary office at Universal, Arias we being booked. Anthony was arrested the next day. It does make the case for simultaneous bi-coastal mind control. Watching and listening to Arias spin her detailed faux-fession was surreal in comparison.
White Knit-Rental Guy
Raphael Columbo took the only opportunity to ever where a bulky knit in Arizona. During direct examination by Martinez we learned that Arias may have been with a gentleman while renting the vehicle. Columbo also testified the floor mats to the new-ish vehicle were missing when Arias returned it late and that he personally cleaned what he thought was kool-aid stains from the passenger and rear seats.
Yes- he legitimately stated he saw and cleaned kool aid stains in the rental vehicle used by a woman accused of stabbing and shooting a man and neither the prosecutor nor the defense attorney asked him what kind of kool-aid stains they were. Lime? Fruit Punch? Grape? Would seem germane to the discussion, no?
Martinez also neglected to ask him about the notation of a heavy smoke smell.
Arias does not smoke. But she did buy kerosene on June 3rd at Walmart. She dyed her hair brown sometime between the evening of June 2nd and the morning of June 3rd.
Me thinks Mr. Columbo is going have another chance to don that turtleneck again before this trial is over.
Following the excuse of the jury this afternoon Nurmi raised the issue yet again, of possible Brady violations in the case by Martinez for not producing the contact information for the woman who was allegedly dating Alexander and received a John Doe email from Arias. It is believed Julie Andrews was aware of at least the allegation that Arias followed the couple on a date and subsequently slashed his tires. Andrews was not on the list of state witnesses.
The State of Arizona V Jodi Arias continues tomorrow.
Jacqueline Beaufort, contributing editor
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Since I brought it up….
I don’t have the Book of Mormon to reference.
@ATG…perhaps you can confirm this for me, since my source is Wikipedia…
QUOTE:
the principle of blood atonement (repudiated by the LDS Church in the mid-20th century)
UNQUOTE
The practice was rejected in the mid 1900′s. That’s not that long ago, but nonetheless, it appears this is no longer part of the Mormon faith.
I’ve heard Wiki is not the best or most reliable site for accurate info. I’ll post the link, regardless, as it does give insight into Mormanism in relation to other faiths.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormonism
@Mom3.0
(snipped) “and if the jury can buy that she first shot him in “self defense” from the gun she had to have stolen and had to have it readily available out loaded-and be able to point and shoot it etc then there is a way they can discount the premeditation and cruelty too”
—————————————————————————–
What evidence (other than theory) might the defense have to prove JA killed/overkilled) TA in self defense?
Someone posted on HP that they live in that area and it is not unusual to have to drive long distances to hire a vehicle. I checked and there is currently a car rental place in Yreka but cannot confirm that it was there 4 years ago.
There are hundreds of rental facilities between Yreka and Redding- it is about 90 miles. Jodi has family in Redding, it is my presumption whomever accompanied her may have been a family member.
I read somewhere her vehicle had mechanical problems and that was the reason to hire the vehicle. She needed a lift there to go pick up the car.
That is not accurate. She was actually purchasing her car from the decedant.
I think whoever gave her the lift was not central to this.
The defence started out with the statement of the highly charged sexuality of the relationship and that Jodi regretted what she had done in that mode with Travis. I think they pushed boundaries. My impression of Jodi with her hair in pigtails was of a school girl. I think they were playing sex games and role playing that afternoon. It should be noted her hair was in braids. I have seen other pics of her in long braids and my bigger concern is how she went from blonde to brunette if she was sleeping in her car in the former 24 hours.
I think she did steal the gun and it and the knife were used in their “games” that afternoon.
Besides the mark left by the tape on Travis arm, can you also see what looks to be red dotted lines on his back when he is in the shower. Could they have also used a whip?
The water droplets are a double image. It is the water droplets on the back, droplets falling, and droplets through the shower door. There was no ecchymotic areas on his back outside of the stab wounds.
With regard to the water everywhere does anyone know if the bathroom floor is lower or higher than the carpeted area? Generally bathroom floors slope towards a drain. Was the shower still running when they found his body?
No, and the floor does not slope, the floor is level and the downslope is to the drain of the shower floor insert.
Jodi is left handed. For the fatal cut on travis neck she must have been facing him. The cut is more to the front as though the weight of him pushed down on the knife. The trachea is pretty tough to cut.
The stab wounds in the back are in a localised area as though her reach was limited. Does anyone have a link for more details of the coroners report? Does anyone know if the wounds in his back went straight in or were at an angle?
Respectfully, I have no idea where you are getting this from. It is just patently incorrect. I would offer that homicidal throat slashing is almost never from a “front facing offender”. I would say never because I could not find a case where a hand held blade was used to compare to your comment but I never say never. Moreover, the only spatter or “spurt” patterns that remotely exist for comparison in the crime scene are in the hallway.
This might explain her position to him. If he was on top of her when she cut his throat then it might also be that he was on top of her when she was stabbing his back.
If she intended to kill him then why not just pump the last bullet or six into him in the bedroom/hallway? Why go to the considerable effort to drag him back to the bathroom?
The blood splatter in the sink makes me think that blood was entering his trachea from the blood vessels in his neck, causing the cough reflex.
I submit the blood pattern from it’s source resembles aspirated blood. When we have a decedant in his fifth day of decompositional event, we have to sync the crime scene evidence with the autopsy exam findings. That neck wound, in a 5’9″ man upwords of 190 lbs, as exacted by a suspect of Arias’s build is not represented at that sink. I would offer that happens on the hall floor. I am convinced the gunshot occurs in front of the right sink. There is simply no other explanation that attaches to the wounds on this decedant.
I think if he was stabbed in the chest the blood would dribble down his chest, the blood spurting from his heart with each pump would more likely fill the chest cavity. The majority of the cuts were just 1″ wide. The one on his neck 3-4″. So maybe we are looking for a knife that is about 6 inches long. Not a butcher knife as that is too big. there is no mention of any tears in the cuts. Was it newly bought? I know my knives get blunt pretty quickly. It is a hell of a job to cut up meat with a blunt knife. Did the police check his bank records as well for purchases?
His chest wound was fatal, and it is a fallacy to think that one can assess the severity of a wound to the chest, in fact this punctures his vena cava- he bled out internally.
Welcome susan, as we have a bevy of susan’s please allow me to add au to your monkiker until and if you choose to add something of your own. I responded to your post in bold.
I am out of here, no further need for warnings, approvals, or other little girl stuff. will not waste my time reading or posting in the future.
Interesting your comment of little girl stuff when you previously were so adamant against the belittling of women.
Best to you John
B
Blink,
Maybe a dumb question but why aren’t there date/time stamps on all of the photos from TA’s camera? Are the photos in the various slide shows in chronological order?
@ATG/Blink – Thank you for clarifying where/why someone would have heard this shot. I’ve been around shotguns and rifles my whole life but have no experience with handguns. I wondered why noone heard the shot. It sounds like it wasn’t likely/possible unless they were in the house.
I don’t know if this post deserves a graphic warning or not, so consider this a precautionary warning.
Is it possible that JA shot Travis first, as many of us believe (why she may have controlled him initially– why she was able to take the photo of him with that devastatingly sad expression on his face). As someone else posted, perhaps a struggle ensued and Travis slipped bc he was wet from the shower or perhaps she made him kneel down– either would explain the trajectory of the bullet. After the first shot the gun jammed forcing Jodi to go into the bedroom/kitchen/where-ever to retrieve the knife. Perhaps Travis thought that it was over– the gun jammed and Jodi split– and he braced himself on the counter top of the sink in shock/dizziness. But instead of abandoning the plan after the gun jammed, Jodi switched to plan b and re-entered the bathroom with the knife. She could have stabbed Travis in the back while he was leaning over the sink, a position which I feel would make him very vulnerable to the wounds he suffered in that location on his body. (I sometimes wonder how she stabbed him in the back that many times– because I would think that he would turn around… but perhaps this is explained by him already being weakened, in shock, dizzy). The gunshot wound to his face or multiple stab wounds to the back could have caused Travis to aspirate blood in the sink. Perhaps then he realized the severity of the situation and/or Jodi’s insanity and tried to make a run for it, calling for the neighbors, etc.– part of Jodi’s half-truth-lies. And that’s why the scene moved from the bathroom into the hallway.
This is all awful to think about. But in doing so, I find myself asking why Travis wasn’t more frightened of Jodi or why he didn’t change the key code to the garage, report her to the police, get a restraining order, etc. All I can think is that he needed a better developed “gift of fear.” So often I feel that women are the ones who are told to be on high alert, but men should be too, especially when dealing with someone who is acting irrationally (repeatedly) and is clearly coming unhinged. It’s so sad that this happened.
Ragdoll
The process is still in the Book of Morman. If you look at one of my earlier posts regarding my grandson reading the book. When he reached that point in the book is when he stopped reading. He is just 20 yrs old so he has yet to be able to accommodate information that is abhorant to his truth meter.
There are always changes in practices of every relegious group. Is it universally shuned by every group in various locations? IDK. Some of the breakaway groups may still practice it. The group that moved into Texas near the town of El Dorado originated from Arizona. This group is behaving like the original beliefs. Was Travis affiliated with the Arizona branch from which the Texas group originated? We need more information.
Watching Jodi during interrogation and listening to some of her words lets me know she is guilty immediately. If you did not kill in anything other than self defense, you would immediately, after killing them, rush nervously away and your behavior would see nervous and odd. Sitting in the chair in the interrogation room when the detective tells her he has evidence and he knows she did it, instead of denying it in an angry manner, which is what most would do that are innocent…or start crying, instead she starts calmly making up stories, or saying “well, that certainly looks like me”. She was acting like a deranged person in that room. “Can I see the pictures?” That told me immediately that she wanted to see what they had against her before she said anymore, and it was sort of a turn on to see the damage she inflicted. Im willing to bet after she killed her boyfriend she stood there and admired her work…scoffing at him. When women kill they are hidiously cruel and evil. I know she is trying to save herself from the death penalty, but honestly I dont see why. If I had to choose between living life in prison without parole, or the death penalty, I would take death. But then again, I know where I am going after death so I am not afraid of dying. She on the other hand… That detective has my complete respect. How he could sit there time after time and listen to her deranged stuff when he knows she is a cold blooded killer…I would probably reach across that table and slap the snot our of her. Complete waste of human life and space.
Hello Lyla you asked:
What evidence (other than theory) might the defense have to prove JA killed/overkilled) TA in self defense?
IDK They haven’t presented their case yet…and it is only theory until they have an expert testify to its validity…
Then its up to the jury to decide which theory holds more weight,
Hopefully then, Jodi Arias will be found guilty.
AJMO
Peace
The concept of the rental car (Susanau’s hiring) being difficult is not true. Both Redding and Yreka are located on I-5. Redding is a town of close to 100,000 people. There is a regional airport and many automobile dealerships. If Jodi told a story of having to leave Redding to find a car rental, this is just some more misdirection and and perhaps an attempt to hide her activities.
It is true that some areas East of I-5 are sparsly populated. However, this is a large recreational area and there is plenty of opportunity for rental agencies to rent vehicles of all types. I drove this area in 1999 and spent the night at Redding.
Blink I was referring to the sound of the pistol shot escaping the room and being heard outside or through several walls. One of my neighbors who lives a half mile away was out shooting his 30-06 today and that sound could be heard both in the oriinal report and as an echo against the granite ridge in our area.
Understood ATG, I wanted to make sure folks that are not used to such sounds had a perspective.
B
Ty Blink for the info on the six pack laid out for J. Colombo. Are the other five faces of one person? They look very, very similar.
John, I hope you weren’t referring to Word Girl when you mentioned little girl games. And I really hope you read my note to you–it’s not about approval, I can tell you that. There are plenty of people here who don’t like me (my style, opinions, whatever) and that used to bother me.
Little Word Girl has grown up a lot over these past few years of advocacy. I just wanted to let you know that I’ve found it helpful to step back a little bit and see what might be offensive in my language or attitude. That’s hard to do at times. I figure if it makes the message clearer, more accurate, more insightful, well, that’s what it’s going to take to keep this justice ball rolling.
Word- by law, there are certain parameters a photo line up must comply with- so everyone looking the same is one of them ( simplified). What struck me was Arias side smile. At the risk of sounding unprofessional- this girl creeps me out. That does not happen to me often.
B
Do we know that JA left for her trip immediately after renting the car? If her parents live in that town, maybe after renting the car she went to her parents’ or one of her sister’s places and dyed her hair there?
I think Jodi went to Mesa to try to get Travis back.
I think she dyed her hair dark brown and bought glasses to look like Marie Hall, his new interest. Travis’s girlfriend BEFORE and DURING Jodi had dark brown hair, too. So I think she thought she’d do a makeover to look more like Travis’s type. And I think she chose to date that guy Ryan to make Travis jealous. Ryan was a competitor of Travis’s at Pre-Paid Legal.
The thing is, if she had dyed her hair dark brown so that she wouldn’t be recognized while she was in Mesa so that she could pull off this murder, then wouldn’t she have dyed it back to blond after leaving Mesa?
My suspicions don’t support premeditation on the hair color change, but I have to say that a .22 disappearing from the home she lived in only a week before the murder seems to be a very suspicious coincidence.
It was a .25 , just as a point of clarification. She admitted to firing a .22 at some point.
B
My apollies to BOC for the non sense. In hindsight, it would have been best for everyone AND me, if I hadn’t addressed John’s post….AT ALL. Oddly, I wasn’t even that offended, so the response wasn’t necessary. I posted hastily.
John, I do hope you reconsider your decision not to post here. If it’s one thing I know about this group, it’s forgiving and encouraging. A lot of us go back a few years on BOC. We’ve all had our differences with each other at some point, but it’s only deepened our respect for each other.
Lovin on y’all! xo
Mom 3.0 and Blink,
Wow. Everything you said about the camera and the picture taking is making sense. First, I never thought the pictures of Travis in the shower looked posed. When you said he probably didn’t know he was being photographed and more, that he looks like he’s praying, well, that explained a lot and that’s EXACTLY what it looks like.
And Mom3.0, you said several days ago that by killing Travis, Jodi robbed him of his chance to make his peace with God. But if he was praying in the shower right before it happened, well, that’s hopeful. I’m not a Mormon. I’m not an evangelical Christian. I believe that there’s room for redemption at the very moment of death and even after death and that we can pray for Travis’s soul even now. It’s off topic, I know, but when you said that Mom3.0, I wanted to respond to it because it had crossed my mind, too.
But back to the pictures in the shower. Yes, it looks like Travis is unaware that the pictures are being taken. And then I thought well, how on earth would he not see her in his peripheral vision?? But yes, that explains it, that the camera could have been set down somewhere and could have been operated remotely from out in the hall even.
And then the last picture of him alive, when he’s looking right into the camera, when his eyes were all fear, betrayal, sorrow, and anger. What a haunting picture! That must have been when he saw the camera. It’s so disturbing. BlackPearl I agree. I wish Travis had the gift of fear, too.
Now I’m trying to figure out the bathrobe. It does seem strange that it’s hanging there, perfectly undisturbed.
@ Mom3.0 says:
January 19, 2013 at 1:44 am
I so hope the defense isn’t reading here! LOL
Your post had me recall a true story about a man who survived a work site explosion during construction of a railroad in the 19th century.
His name was Phineas Gage. I remember learning about him in my Biology 30 class
-snipped
Phineas P. Gage (1823–1860)[B] was an American railroad construction foreman now remembered for his improbable[C] survival of an accident in which a large iron rod was driven completely through his head, destroying much of his brain’s left frontal lobe, and for that injury’s reported effects on his personality and behavior, effects so profound—for a time, at least—that friends saw him as “no longer Gage”.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage
That says it all.
I’m beginning to think Arias expected the shot to Travis’ head, would kill him instantly. Instead, he may have remained conscious and became belligerent because of the damage to his brain. Arias was not prepared for this. This could explain the ‘hack job’ on him. She was, in a sense, being attacked but offensively, not defensively. If this was pre meditated, it certainly didn’t go down how she intended HENCE, leaving her camera behind, evidence AND lies upon lies. At some point, it could have been possible Travis was crawling away from the knife attacks. She was striking out at a moving target, fighting for his life. I couldn’t understand why he stab wounds on his ankles or lower extremities. Much of the fight took place on the floor, imho.
Had he not been continually attacked, he could have survived the gun shot wound to the head. If he was conscious after that shot, the whole situation went beyond control for Arias, making her even more desperate to kill. You’d think a shot to the brain would have done him in and I’m sure she thought that, too. If this is true, I can understand why he suffered intense knife wounds, one that lead him to bleed out internally.
The whole crime scene is a murder plot gone wrong, disastrous and a blood bath Arias didn’t expect. She had no reason to believe there’d be much to clean up. She attempted to clean, but hastily, leaving behind a camera, evidence and lies. I think there’s some truth to her story about a confrontation with a man and woman who broke in, except there was no break. The woman she spoke about, was herself. The man, was Travis.
Needless to say, I’m praying for a miracle. If she is a text book stalker, she will fuse with another man and God forbid, he rejects her.
JMHO.
Remembering Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
Joan T
Thank you for giving me a different perspective on Travis last talk with God.
Thanks for reading through my camera posts-and for weighing in with your thoughts.
yes I think it is possible JA was surreptitiously taking the pics via the remote control. But we cant say-
Oh how I wish LE had experimented to see if they could recreate the photos.
You wrote:
Now I’m trying to figure out the bathrobe. It does seem strange that it’s hanging there, perfectly undisturbed.
Yes yes yes this bathrobe bothers me immensely
take a look at the photo of Travis shaving- I believe he is wearing that bathrobe- in his bathroom notice from the sink area you can see the pic above the bathtub… well its still hanging above the bathtub you can see a corner of it in the below pic… BTW take a look at the shower it is open- and the door is shown open it extends towards the wall..
so what was the vantage point where the shower pics were taken from?
The Huffington post link (graphic)
101 of 149 shows the robe next to the shower just hanging there (palm tree art can be seen here just a corner)…notice under the arm of the robe on the wall between the shower and the tub there appears to be a blood drop?…was this tested and if it was blood… was it tested to see it it was Arias’?
102 0f 149 shows Travis dead in the shower (blurred out) notice the pic shows what appears to be the outline of the bathrobe- Is it?
what was the vantage point of this photo?
The bathrobe was not shown in any of the alive showering pics…
So what was the vantage point of the pics and where was the robe?
IDK
AJMO
Re
Ragdoll says:
January 22, 2013 at 12:10 am
@ Mom3.0 says:
January 19, 2013 at 1:44 am
I so hope the defense isn’t reading here! LOL
Hey RagDoll- nice to talk with ya.
I hope the Prosecution IS reading here because I worry that they havent covered all the bases and Travis’ family and friends deserve the best representation.
Yes RD that Gage story is fascinating-
Heres the thing with all those accounts the strange behaviors happened AFTER they healed not immediately after being shot or injured ya know?
But again the defense can claim whatever they want-
Its if the evidence supports it and if the jury believes it-
how can they prove that Arias was fighting for her life and how can the jury believe it
when she has NO defensive wounds- none
how they claim self defense FOR HER when they say Arias shot him first?
Arias had to have had the gun very handy- she had to have had been able to aim and shoot (in self defense in a matter of seconds…
She had to have had the knife handy and be willing to stab travis over and over instead of hitting him over the head with one of those soap jars or the vases of flowers on the sink or the huge picture frame above the bathtub… Or she could have chose to spray him in the eyes with any of those cleaners under the sink…or she could have hit him over the head with those heavy candles or that iron candle holder sculpture on the bath tub or one of those scales……
She was NOT defending herself – she was trying to kill Travis other wise she would have first done everything possible to ward him off other then using DEADLY force with a gun and a knife.
AJMO
Peace
Ps
hey John- Dont leave- I am hated from time to time here too in fact I am almost as hated as Blink all over the net
yet I am still here trying to help.
We all get our feelings hurt we are emotional people if we werent we wouldnt be here posting
those victims and underdogs, they need your voice john- just like they need RD and WG and countless other Blinksters.
AJMO Peace
I am just getting into this
About all my info has come from watching Nancy G and Dr. Whoever and 48 hours
J A seems to look to small to do all this damage
Some think she had help
So do you think this
Is possible
And hi Blink
Hi Malty!
I think for me it is more about it being possible as a perception because the prosecution has not presented compelling evidence to support it’s theory she acted alone. The disparity of their physical sizes and the blood evidence, etc, make it very difficult for the average person to view Arias as someone capable of this kind of domination and eventual death. I personally believe she acted alone.
B
Survivior wrote: “Maybe a dumb question but why aren’t there date/time stamps on all of the photos from TA’s camera? Are the photos in the various slide shows in chronological order?”
Many modern digital cameras, including the one TA owned, actually save an image twice. One copy is the full resolution image which contains both the image and “EXIF” data. EXIF data, also called metadata, includes information about date, time, camera setting, whether special features were used, focusing modes, and so forth. The other copy of the image is a “thumbnail” or “preview” image which is at much lower resolution and is generally the version used when reviewing images on the camera itself. The thumbnail images do not contain metadata.
The prosecution expert stated that not all images were recoverable from the SD card, and that in some cases, only the thumbnail/preview image was recovered. This explains why some images are quite blurry, and also explains why some images are not time-stamped.
A few other camera issues to point out.
1) Most cameras have a shutter delay function, so that the picture is taken 2-10 seconds later. This allow the photographer to get into the picture and also reduces motion blur when using long exposures. Few cameras have “time lapse” modes where the camera takes pictures at fixed intervals. This is not generally a function of Sony cameras. There are ways to do this, but I doubt the TA would own the equipment. JA was a Canon shooter, and most hardware she would own would be incompatible with TA’s camera.
2) Why weren’t the shower pictures blurry? When taking a camera from a cool dry environment such as a bedroom into a warm humid environment, the lens will quickly fog up. This suggests that TA was taking a cold shower.
3) The broken shutter release button. The prosecution expert states that HE broke the shutter release button while examining the camera (what kind of expert is that?) I have owned many cameras by different manufacturers (including Sony), and the only accidental pictures I have taken have been when I pushed the wrong button. Possible TA’s camera’s shutter release was damaged in some way such that accidental pictures were taken, but unfortunately we will never know
To further the pic conversation- EXIF data is stripped when pics are uploaded to most social media sites. Certain sites allow the user to choose whether or not this data is removed upon upload ( mostly your photo sites like photobucket, shutterfly ) If emailing an image saved to a hard drive, most users would need to manually remove that data similar to how one removes author or PC file data from other docs.
I mention this because although it has not been introduced as evidence, there was activity on Travis’s computer (nonspecific) and according to Arias the couple had sex in his office – we have no idea if the computer was checked for those images prior to their deletion, which WOULD contain the EXIF info.
B
Snip MOM 3@ Mom3.0 says:
January 22, 2013 at 1:27 am
Yes yes yes this bathrobe bothers me immensely
take a look at the photo of Travis shaving- I believe he is wearing that bathrobe- in his bathroom notice from the sink area you can see the pic above the bathtub… well its still hanging above the bathtub you can see a corner of it in the below pic… BTW take a look at the shower it is open- and the door is shown open it extends towards the wall..end snip.
And I say, what was the vantage point of this shaving picture taken and when? Can’t help but wonder when that was taken? If we all recall, in the laundry that was presented there was a white t-shirt- mens size, as well as Jodi having mentioned to Det Flores in the interrogation room that she had him clean shaven that day. Wonder if it could possibly been that day after the mid afternoon romp? He may possibly have had discarded a t-shirt white mens underwear, black shorts and socks and robe and then jumped into the shower. They were all likely bloodied and therefore needed laundering along with the bedding.
I am still undecided as to where she was during the pics and as to whether she hid during the taking of them. But, there appears to be no shower curtain, so he would have to be blinded to not see her, but I thought Martinez was trying to paint the idea, that a zoom feature could have been used along with a lack of flash. IDK, something is odd or isn’t as it appears.
I think in her words she was crouched down to the left next to the tub.
B
Ragdoll
One never knows the real effect of a shot from a gun, the damage from a stab wound or the blow to the head from a blunt object until proper examination is performed by medical people.
One of my school mates was wrestling as boys do with his older brother in their house. The older brother shoved him in such a way that he went through the half glass front door. A shard of glass penetrated his heart. He survived that because the boys were afraid to remove the shard of glass. We all thought he would die, but it didn’t happen. Within six weeks he was back at school.
Yes, it penetrated the area above his frontal orbital bone (above the right brow- not sure if midline or what, was not introduced as to measurement) The reason this specific info is so important is because that bone is rounded- as part of the orbital roof would likely affect trajectory- as we all know now the bullet lodged downward in the left maxilla- intact. There is simply no way to determine what area or hemisphere through the right frontal lobe was injured, if at all in a deceased person at that level of decomposition. Most especially if the cannot say whether or not the bones of the skull deflected the projectile- that would be easy to see. He was also not prepared for the cross examination he got, as he stated he did thousands of autopsies and he had no counter-argument for different TBI.
B
Is there any real evidence that the .25 cal. bullet actually penetrated the skull and affected the frontal lobe of Travis? If it didn’t, then other than the force of the bullet as a blow to the head would be the only effect. Would it make him slow to respond? Probably.
Why do you think she bothered to drag him back into the shower? To wash away the blood seems ridiculous since there was so much blood everywhere….baseboards, walls, rug, etc. The only thing I can figure is that she needed to contain him in case he wasn’t dead, and she planned to stick around and wash clothes, etc.
The roommate that found him said on Nancy Grace that his bedroom door was locked. She locked the door prior to leaving…that’s creepy.
Can someone share with me how long the roommate was home before he found Travis?
Room mate was home within a half hour of what is believed to be the time Jodi left. Napoleon was given to a friend and not harmed.
B
I can’t find any information about Travis’ dog. I am assuming the dog was not locked in the bedroom with Travis (how horrible a thought). How long was the dog abandoned before the roommate returned home?
Ragdoll, I am featuring that info in my update, as I made contact with that individual, would you mind terribly if I held that comment until I finish the update please?
Discussing this case tonight on Dana’s show as well.
B
I looked at the shower photos again, and the thing is Mom3.0, the camera wasn’t in the same place for all the photos. If you’re facing the shower stall and you visually place a clockface over it, some of the photos were taken from 6 o’clock, some from 4:00, some from 8:00, some from 9:00, etc. So Jodi must have taken the photos, but it really does look like he doesn’t know she’s there, and I don’t know how he could have not seen her.
how did none of the roomates notice the smell of travis’ decomposing body? i know this really has nothing to do with anything but still, it bothers me. One would think you would smell that. Also, just saw an interesting point made by David Otunga (jennifer hudson’s husband) on Insession, where he said that he think she turned her liscense plate upside down once she got to Utah so that she would get pulled over and have an alibi.
Well, I would say that the jury had the same questions.
B
I’ve been thinking that it’s unlikely that Travis experienced a personality change due to the bullet possibly passing through his frontal lobe. But then, I’m no expert. What I did imagine though was a personality “change” in regards to the bullet not killing him and possibly only rendering him temporarily unconscious, if at all… meaning that once he realized what had happened– saw blood or took a quick look in the mirror– maybe he did become pissed. Wouldn’t you? If your ex-girlfriend had just shot you in the head??? I could totally see him becoming angry, yelling at her, calling her names, anything. Perhaps this reaction– and not simply that the gum jammed– is what pushed her over the edge and influenced her decision to retrieve a knife and to finish him off, and to make it gory and brutal… because if she was angry before, she sure as heck would be after getting a tongue lashing for shooting Travis in the face.
I’m also wondering if anyone knows whether Travis wore glasses. He isn’t wearing glasses in any photos I saw online after doing a quick search. But some people who need glasses wear contacts everyday. Did Travis? Perhaps this is why he didn’t notice Jodi right away when she was taking pictures in the bathroom.
Also, a lot of people, especially men, stand under the shower and close their eyes tight to keep shampoo out of their eyes– they never learned the art of tilting their heads back and keeping their eyes open and free of water/shampoo. Between that possibility, the question of whether he needed glasses or contacts for his eyesight, the fact that if he was praying he was most likely lost in thought, and that the sound in/of the shower would have masked a lot of little noises JA might have caused sneaking back in…there are a number of factors as to why Travis may not have seen Jodi right away in the bathroom.
I did some cursory reading about stalking (my motivating interest was in whether the act of tire slashing is a predictor of later violent attack or murder of the victim by the stalker). I’ll share some relevant information in my next post along with a link.
But my big question for the group is whether the prosecution could have (or should have) presented evidence of Jodi’s stalking– intercepting text messages from other women, sending threatening emails, hacking Travis’s email and Facebook, breaking into his home and possibly stealing his journals, slashing tires, etc., etc.,– as evidence that there was indeed domestic violence in their relationship… but that it was Jodi who was the perpetrator of said violence, not Travis as the defense claims. I don’t know if those other incidents would be considered inadmissible in court or not. But it might have been an interesting tactic– in addition to going over the hard evidence and the circumstantial evidence against Jodi– to have turned the defenses claims of domestic violence, abuse, and self-defense on its ear by presenting evidence that Jodi was the abuser/aggressor, not Travis… would that not undermine the claims of Jodi-as-victim and murder in self-defense?
See new post:
http://blinkoncrime.com/2013/01/22/jodi-arias-trial-new-witnesses-may-reveal-defense-strategy-prosecution-omissions/
Relevant info about stalking & violence… all quoted from source… link to source at end
Stalking as a form of domestic violence is the most common form of stalking, encompassing an estimated 75-80% of all cases (Roberts & Dziegielewski, 2006)
When stalking does occur in intimate relationships, it is likely to coexist with other forms of violence.
Palarea and colleagues (1999), in an analysis of stalking cases from the Los Angeles Threat Management Unit, found that stalkers with previous intimate relationships [with the victim] were significantly more likely to threaten, damage property, and physically harm the victim.
The “Rejected-Known” classification of stalker – Behavior is frequently seen to be motivated by the desire for power and control. In this conceptualization, the ending of a relationship is a threat to the power and control that an abuser exercised over his or her partner. Stalking then includes a series of behaviors aimed at regaining control and reestablishing the relationship.
Domestic violence stalking is often open in nature, in part because of the stalker’s belief that the behavior is justified and a right. ***When it leads to violence, the stalker believes that the violence was provoked by the victim.*** However, to an outsider, the actual behavior of the victim that may result in an attack is not predictable; rather, the nature of the provocation resides in the fantasy world of the stalker (Burgess, et al., 1997).
The need for power and control in domestic violence stalkers is generally ***fuelled by rage at abandonment*** (Douglas & Dutton, 2001). Mullen and colleagues (1999) thus referred to this group of stalkers as “rejected stalkers.” In their study of 145 stalkers, people in this category described a complex mixture of desire for reconciliation and revenge. They experienced a sense of loss, alternately combined with frustration, anger, jealousy, vindictiveness, and sadness. ***The majority of this group carried a diagnosis of personality disorder,*** although a smaller percentage of them had delusional disorders.
Following is an excerpt with additions by me in [brackets]:
Burgess and colleagues (1997) describe a process that occurs in these types of stalking situations based on their research of domestic violence cases in Michigan. First the stalker is open in his or her attempts to contact the ex-partner, and when this fails the stalker begins to contact others and discredit the partner [Jodi intercepting text messages of women and playing the role of the "other woman" so that women think Travis is cheating; e-mailing women Travis is dating]. Next, the positive emotion of love becomes converted to hatred, and the stalker goes underground and clandestine, using tactics such as phoning and hanging up or entering the premises without permission [Jodi entering Travis's house via the dog-door and possibly being responsible for stealing Travis's journals from him home; as well as covert hacking of Travis's email and Facebook accounts]. Following this, there is a phase of ambivalence where the stalker may send gifts and flowers [Perhaps the gift here was a bottle of lube and Jodi herself-- flowers blurred out for national TV audiences]. When this attempt at reconciliation is unsuccessful, the stalker may become explosive and violent [Jodi murders Travis in cold blood].
Prediction of dangerousness…can be inaccurate. Considerable controversy exists about the role of actuarial testing in the assessment of offenders. Research on correlates of violence in stalkers does, however, lead to some indications that stalkers are a higher risk of committing violence acts against the victim. Research shows that those who threaten are indeed more violent. Other factors associated with violence in stalkers are that violent stalkers tend to be young (below age 30 years), have lower levels of education, have made prior threats, and had previous intimate relationships with the victims (Rosenfeld & Harmon). Schwartz-Watts and Morgan (1998), using a clinical sample, reported that 80% of violent stalkers had previous relationships with the victims, compared to 55% of nonviolent stalkers; Palarea and colleagues (1999) found similar results.
http://samples.jbpub.com/9780763772109/72109_Ch09_Roberts.pdf
“Chapter 9: Stalking Victims” By Cheryl Regehr
The question the jury had about the roommates alibis etc. seems pretty telling.
Blink, What do you think are the chances of Martinez asking for lesser charge(s) to be added, and what are the chances the judge will allow it?
If he doesn’t add lesser charges to give the jury wiggle room, she could get off entirely! In the very least there could be a hung jury.
I think the jurors’ questions are showing us that some of them are still struggling with the question of whether she did it at all, never mind the premeditated part. I think it was a mistake to show the interrogation video for hours and hours. JA is a convincing speaker, and ironically, she may have learned some of those skills from Travis. I take it from the juror’s question about the roommate’s alibi that they’re wondering if the roommates had something to do with it, or maybe they’re asking simply if the intruder story was investigated as a possibility. I think some of them may believe the intruder story, or at least can’t discount it without being SHOWN.
Showing that video also allowed the jurors to hear her talk about her relationship with Travis in her own words, and I think it could have allowed them to develop sympathy for her. It’s evident she was brokenhearted about Travis, and they may see her as less of a stalker than a brokenhearted girl committing a crime of passion. I’m wondering if the prosecution didn’t make more of the stalking issue because the evidence of it is hearsay? That’s why I wish Travis had filed police reports. I thought the prosecution should have talked about stalking more in the opening arguments and they should have brought in experts to educate the jury on the nature of stalking. Saying in the opening arguments that Travis was a good man, and she killed him because he was a good man just didn’t fit the whole narrative of this case IMO.
One more thing. What I’m afraid of is the jury not being sequestered. I don’t know how it will be possible for the jury not to see or hear anything about this case this week. I’m not saying they won’t TRY. But it’s everywhere. I heard Arizona didn’t sequester the jury because it’s so expensive, but if the trial has to be retried, it will cost a whole lot more. And then would JA have a case about her right to a speedy trial?
@ GeorgiaDad – Thank you. I had a feeling it was something like that.
So many of you are stating he was shot first. I thought the ME stated very clearly that he was shot last. Detective Flores had said he was shot first and the defense asked for a mistrial because of perjury of Flores
[...] does seem the prosecution missed quite a bit of potential evidence including a possible motive- the duct tape around Travis’s right arm. Was it the final straw that made Jodi Arias snap as she was [...]
Blackpearl
If the prosecution could present a witness to the stalking that could not be refuted and they didn’t present it, they IMO missed a good opportunity to show character and prior behavior. Maybe all they had was in fact hearsay. We may learn about it later.
Someone either repaired or replaced the tires that were slashed. There should be reciepts for the work. The people doing the work could have had a conversation about the cause of the damage.
http://blinkoncrime.com/2013/01/22/jodi-arias-trial-new-witnesses-may-reveal-defense-strategy-prosecution-omissions/
Your right, prior behavior to this victim is absolutely critical.
B
I don’t mean to say that the prosecution didn’t do a good job. I mean, on the bright side, they kept it short and simple. She was there, and they showed evidence of that. She had a motive, and they showed evidence of that. She’s pleaded guilty. So what more is there? The defense will have a very hard time saying it was self defense I think.
I think we tend to worry because of all the cases where celebrities and Wall St. CEOs get off scot free and it seems to apply to pretty young women too.
Joan- she has plead not guilty to the charges- as the act was in self defense. I take no pride in “spanking” a prosecution where I feel a defendant is guilty- but we have got to stop being complacent when we have a high profile case in front of a jury.
B
Here’s hoping the prosecution is taking this break to prepare their rebuttle AND depositions/affadavits for character witnesses for TA.
I hope I worded that properly. If not, PROSECUTION UP!!!!!!
Joan- she has plead not guilty to the charges- as the act was in self defense. I take no pride in “spanking” a prosecution where I feel a defendant is guilty- but we have got to stop being complacent when we have a high profile case in front of a jury.
B
____________________________
Blink, yeah, you’re right, she plead not guilty. I was thinking she plead guilty with an explanation of self defense. In other words, that she has admitted that she did it, but did it in self defense. But IMO it would be good for the jury to actually HEAR her say it.
I agree 100% that we can’t be complacent in a high profile case, or in cases involving the death penalty. And that includes the jury. Thankfully, it sounds like they at least aren’t being complacent. They sound conscientious. As far as criticizing the prosecution, I feel comfortable doing that from the perspective of the jury. What they might be thinking and needing to have explained. Anything other than that I just don’t feel it’s my place. I don’t know enough about the law. I leave that for people like you and their colleagues in the court. Blink, my Dad is a retired court clerk. I love discussing cases like this with him…another reason I’m happy I found this blog. Not many people go into the details like we do here. (My father’s recuperating from surgery but he’s going to start following the case next week.)
BlackPearl, Thanks for your post on stalkers! That sounds like what happened here!
Mom 3.0, I think I’ve figured out the story with the towel. Most of Jodi’s pics are focused in the shower stall. None of them are panned out enough to show the bathrobe. It looks weird to us, in contrast to all the bloody pictures, hanging there seemingly pristine. But I looked at this set of pictures:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/17/jodi-arias-trial-state-rests_n_2498572.html
and this set is different from the set you were referring to Mom3.0. In this set, there are many pictures of the house and the bathroom in the last 30 or 40 pics in the set.
There are many things and areas of the bathroom that remained clean and undisturbed.
No doubt the techs checked the bathrobe for blood stains and hair and whatnot, but the violence seems to have taken place mostly at the sink on the right and low in the room by the floor. (There are two sinks and the one on the left seems clean and undisturbed, just like the bathtub).
I’m wondering why the bleach in the washer is so important. I saw the part of the trial where the forensics woman held up almost all items found in the washer to show whether they’d been splattered with bleach or not. It looked to me as though the washer had finished, the clothes were all clean and the cycle was done and then someone just poured a cup of bleach in. The towel got most of the bleach, a few t-shirts and a few socks, but many items seemed completely untouched by bleach, even diluted bleach. The thing is Mom3.0, I didn’t see even one blood stain on any of the items, just splotches of bleach. What do you make of that? I’m wondering if Jodi did laundry at all. If maybe Travis had done his laundry, and then Jodi threw a cup of bleach and the camera in the washer? You said it seemed to you that the camera hadn’t gone through the wash cycle. It seems to me the bleach didn’t go through the wash cycle either. But why would she throw a cup of bleach and the camera into the washing machine? Maybe I’m completely wrong. I haven’t seen the whole trial. I’m wondering what you think. And too, why are they so interested in the bleach in the courtroom.
Hi Joan T-
Glad to be trying to work some things out with you i find it always helps to bounce questions and ideas off of one another-
I think you could be correct on the bathrobe and the camera photographer being close-
BUT if that were the case then Georgia dad has to be correct on the fogging of the camera- was Travis taking a cold shower? that is possible its Arizona- how hot was it that day and what are the other implications of a cold shower– was travis trying to get his desires under control? IDk those shower pics bother me.
If Jodi was using the zoom lens then that could account for not seeing the robe in pics as well…
But again it seems as if there is a blood drop in the evidence photo and during the trial the finger print person testified that they dont put down finger print powder until the scene is cleared of evidence that may become contaminated- and if IIRC the blood person comes first too- well that robe is there not collected and finger print powder is all over…
AND- in both of Jodis stories she claims she was near the bathtub reviewing photos right where the bathrobe would have been in her way and why not just take it down so as there is no reason for it to accidentally sway or fall into your shot?
and if intruders came in or if she was fighting for her life or since travis was fighting for his- How can that robe be there?
and i agree lots of areas were clean but we cant tell if they were cleaned in the “clean-up” and other areas that appear to be clean arent like the blood drops found under the scale or the bloody tp found in the trashcan..
and if The “scuffle” began in the bathroom like jodi says and she had to stab him after shooting him- then there would be blood
most definitely with using the knife there would have been caste off-
yet we seen none most items like the shades appear devoid of blood the tub etc what about the ceiling where are the evidence pics of the ceiling
I assume travis was moving she says he was right- we know he did- yet none of the blood was on that robe even though he pushed her to the ground there, even though he was on his knees even though he couldnt feel his legs…
There had to be blood more than what we see- so how could that robe be there with no blood? Was the robe even tested?
and why wasnt it just thrown in the wash for good measure too-
How did Jodi clean the scene?
only two towels were in the wash IIRC- and they didnt look to be beach size towels/… and some clothes
how did Jodi clean up the scene with only these towels and maybe the clothes? if you were covered in blood- if you were bleeding yourself,
if you were trying to clean the bathroom if there is no blood past the bedroom
wouldnt you grab the item that was the most handy—say a robe to start to absorb the blood?
The bath robe doesnt make sense. why wasnt it thrown in the wash?
Your thoughts on the bleach and the wash yes you could be right
perhaps he did start the laundry himself or at least was going to-
was he doing socks then? IMO travis doesnt seem to be the type of person to wash his white underwear with a load of darks-
perhaps he was only going to wash his underwear- and he added the bleach but then Jodi used the socks as gloves to try and clean the scene and she thru in the darks used and the towels that she used with Travis underwear… but why not the robe?
IDK
Your thoughts sound good to me and the camera wasnt ruined it does seem to be just placed there…perhaps the whole scene was staged even after the murder- perhaps jodis planning went much deeper than we think.
Joan T i look forward to reading more of your well thought out theories.
thanks for asking for my thoughts
AJMO
Peace
I would like to move this convo to the next thread, but in the interim- one thing I totally agree with is what you mentioned on the load of bedding (whites) and dark socks.
I can recognize certain OCD traits I “may” possess in others. One of those happens to be laundry. Not proud of it, but I am freakish about it without going into the full lunacy of it, lol.
I do not recall how many dark socks were found in the laundry, but in my opinion they were there because Arias put them on over her shoes ( I know there was a shoe print- keep in mind no shoes were collected or exhibits and in that amount of blood it is likely it would still produce a tread- or fabric transfer) and then threw them in, or Travis goes to bed with socks on and takes them off in bed- but would never wash them together.
B
is there any way of telling if his throat was cut left to right or right to left?
Yes, there absolutely is- however, in a person in their 5th day of a decompositional event with wounds that deep it is unlikely to be determined by autopsy alone – remember that Horne would not even say with certainly anything past a sharp edge. A true analysis would encompass the crime scene and approximations .
B
Maybe Travis had run a load of laundry, all dark color t-shirts, basketball shorts and so on. Then Jodi, not noticing there was laundry already in the machine, threw bleach in (ruining the clothes and towel), and had it fill with water, then threw the sheets and white t-shirt, etc. in. But I didn’t see any blood stains, and you know how hard protein stains are to get out.
LOL Blink and Mom3.0, Not that I have OCD, but the laundry is bothering me too. I looked up the court transcripts. The light colored things, sheets, etc. were found in the DRYER. And the dark colored items, socks, shorts, etc. were found in the WASHING MACHINE.
But I don’t think Jodi ran any laundry at all. I think she may have thrown a cup of bleach and the camera into the machine where Travis’s laundry had finished cycling already (the dark colored laundry that got ruined by bleach).
From the crime scene photos that I’ve seen, nothing seems to have been cleaned. There is blood in the sink, on the floor and on the walls. But then the photos I’ve seen have not been of large areas. It would have been good to see a photo of the entire hallway before it was touched by technicians.
I believe there was one white t shirt and one pair of white undies found in the washer with the dark colored things. All others in dryer. If this helps.
If she cleaned up, maybe she took the clean-up items with her and burned them? No one would be able to tell if Travis was missing towels.
I’m left-handed. I can take a photograph with my right hand. Duh, all cameras have the shutter release on the right side. It’s not any harder for me than a righty. I can also open any door with my right hand. Also not a parlor trick.
However, if I were trying to stab a man who’s 50% larger than me, I’d surely use my left hand and would suck at it with my right.
Isn’t Jodi ambidextrous?
@JH
No evidence of that, but I will say in a physical confrontation situation anyone might be
Pure Speculation but this has crossed my mind a few times so I thought I would share it –
Regarding JA hair color change..When hair is bleached it becomes extremely porous can be easily stained. What if JA dyed her hair darker to avoid blood stains? From the pictures of her on TA’s bed it’s clear that it had already been dyed prior to his murder so if this were the reason for the change, it would speak to premeditation.
Blink what do you think was the significance of the duct tape on Travis’ arm?