Caylee/Casey Anthony Case: Caylees Autopsy Revelations Part I
Orlando, FL– Under heavy objection last Friday afternoon, Judge Stan Strickland denied the motion on behalf of George and Cindy Anthony to seal Caylee Marie Anthonys autopsy until their daughter Caseys capital murder trial in their granddaughters death. Late Friday afternoon, the Findings of Dr. Jan Garavaglia, Chief Medical Examiner of Orange County were released. In Part I, we explore a few of the notable findings, In Development for Part II, Blinkoncrime will be is creating an interactive 3D Model, incorporating the evidence recovery field, bone disbursement pattern, and anatomical example of the duct tape placement.
The Laundry Bag
Although the report contains a significant amount of anthropologic and forensic data, it does not contain photos or X-Rays, pursuant to the Earnhardt exclusion under Florida Law. Blinkoncrime.com will attempt to offer some observations and in some cases, correct some erroneous information that is being reported in the msm. For starters, the laundry bag picture being circulated, it is incorrect, the image to the left is the correct bag, note the dimensions are exact. The top of this bag does not cinch.
The Duct Tape
I have seen rampant speculation on the duct tape beginning around 15 minutes following the release of the report. 
There are many who believe that Casey Anthony killed her child by wrapping her nose and mouth with duct tape. Allow me to point out the report actually reflects the antithesis of this theory. First, there IS NO TAPE ON THE POSTERIOR of her skull. The only posterior placement of the tape mentioned is still located on the mandible, or face. The tape, which was actually small strips of grey cloth-based, delaminating tape is applied on top of itself, not really feasible with a live toddler. Given the findings that Caylee’s mandible stayed in almost true anatomical position, although slightly posterior and that the hair that was attached to the tape extended from the back of her head and over her head and face, it is likely Caylee was laying on her back when the tape was applied. Henkel makes 2 kinds of duct tape, one is more Industrial grade of adhesive “hot set” over cloth designed for waterproof and outdoor projects. It has not yet been disclosed which formulation was used.
The O Sign
A contributing poster at blinkoncrime gave me something to think about that had not occurred to me. I am on record stating I do believe that Casey Anthony murdered her daughter, and that she will end up pointing the finger at one or both of her parents as a defense strategy.
However, the duct tape never really fit for me. I have always believed it to be a post mortem tactic to stage a kidnapping. I do believe I may have been wrong. Very well known to medical and critical care professionals, there is something called an O effect; occurring at very near death, or shortly following death and before rigormortis sets in.
Some medical people refer to it when the person is very near death or has just died–the jaw drops open. Nothing left to hold the mandible shut. In morgue kits there is a strap that is applied around the jaw to gently close it before rigor sets in. This “O” sign can be very pronounced and unsettling to see first hand. Casey probably wasn’t aware of this and was really spooked by this silent scream and used the duct tape then put a heart sticker on it as a ________
This makes sense to me. The tape is applied in small strips across the nose and mouth areas, catching her hair in the face over the Coronal plane region. One interpretation that may be drawn is that Caylee was lying on her back, upon seeing what Casey had done to her child as evidenced by the relaxed mandible; she attempted to “fix her”. As if covering up the evidence of death on her baby would change things, complete with a heart sticker. No sooner did I arrive at this conclusion on Saturday, did I see Dr.Michael Baden appear on Geraldo Live on Sunday evening bringing up the mortuary kit issue. I am not saying this idea originated here, not that it would be the first time, but it at least tells me there is corroboration within the forensic Medical community as to the premise. The FBI report on the duct tape has not been released. One thing is certain, what I have been stating all along about Casey’s prints being on the duct tape seems foreboding. With multiple strips of tape, chances are there are several. The defense has had this report for months, is this why Casey Anthony retained Todd Macaluso?
Swim Diaper?
There are several remnants recovered that are described as a diaper or pull ip item. However, there are a few that appear to be strictly synthetic. When I read the report, my immediate reaction based on some of the coloring was that it was a “swimmie”, or disposable swim diaper. After mapping out the dimensions and a closer look, I believe it is actually referring to remnants of both a pull up, a reusable swim diaper, or swim floation/assistance device or both, as pictured here:
Paper Towels
Simply stated there is decomposition fluid on paper towels in the plastic garbage bag found in her trunk that came from Tony Lazzarros apartment.
In my opinion, Casey ripped the bag Caylees remains were in when she moved her body into or out of the trunk to her final resting place in the woods off Suburban. The stain in the trunk, emitting the ungodly stench, was the target of the paper towels after Casey returned to TonE’s apartment. She brought the paper towels and garbage bag out with her in an attempt to clean it up and realized almost immediately it was an excerise in futility. Immediately following are her comments to Amy about George Anthony borrowing her car, and the infamous squirrel stowaway story.
Her Clothes
In contrast to only a stitching remnant with a manufactures tag left of her shirt, Caylees shorts were found nearly 2 ft ft away from the laundry bag, in relatively good condition. Based on the reports findings of trunk and femural animal activity and the corresponding recovery area, I am of the opinion that it is not possible that Caylee was wearing those shorts when she was dumped in the woods. Frankly, given the fact that the actual color stripe pattern was discernable versus the condition of the other items, I am suspect Casey was in those woods more than once. How do you get only the collar of a shirt remaining and her shorts completely intact with no noted damage? Lastly, Caylees shoes if she were wearing any, were not recovered.
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Maura,
While your posts are always so full of information and facts, including the last one, there is something that rings so true in it more than anything, just a simple statement.
You said, “No one could’ve ever gotten past her lack of reporting Caylee missing.”
I realize you went on to say that no one would believe her elaborate tales with nothing to back them up, and the ridiculous wild goose chases she led LE on, not to mention her insane behavior while Caylee was supposedly missing.
I think though….this fate of Casey lies in that one statement. No one has been able to get past the 31 days, not in the beginning, not now, and there would NEVER be an explanation good enough to explain that away, not in my book anyway. I suspect not in any jurors mind either. I truly believe that if they were to find 12 people that had NEVER heard of this case, and/or at the very least had heard Caylee was missing and later found dead, without knowing any other facts….I believe whole-heartedly that those 12 jurors will NOT be able to get past that. I don’t care what the defense tries to spin, and in fact, I don’t even think it will matter what the prosecution says after that. The fact she didn’t report her missing and only did so because Cindy picked up the phone, I believe that will fry her. As you said, not to mention all the things that followed and were going on while she was missing.
That one statement, (hopefully opening statement by prosecution) will be the, “be all, end all” to this case and Casey’s future.
Oh- and I think Cindy knows of these “half truths” because she invented them. I think they have lied to LE and told them “half truths” because it is the only thing they know to do. They HAVE to lie- it is who they are. I think they really believe they are stumping people with cleverness- but guess what it is just plain old LYING!!!!!!!!!!!
Blink (responding to your reply to my 1581 comment),
Casey did not send the “rental” text message to Will on July 10. She sent it on July 15, which was the day she was giving back Amy’s car, so there was nothing suspicious in her saying she was getting a rental or needed to get a rental. Furthermore, Will wasn’t sure which one it was – getting a rental or needing to get a rental – and there is an enormous difference between the two.
From the testimony will provided in his OCSO interview and from Casey’s cell phone and text message information in the discovery, there is no doubt that the “rental” message was sent on the morning of Tuesday, July 15.
On page 9 of Will’s interview transcript, he directly confirmed the date of the “rental” text message as July 15:
“Eric Edwards: The 15th. She was arrested the 16th. The 15th where you saw she called you, and texted you and said . . . .
Will Waters: Right
Eric Edwards: . . . she was getting a rental car, that’s, that night, that evening is when her mom went and got her. She and Amy went to the house and got her.”
Will Waters: Yeah (affirmative).
On page 12, he indirectly confirmed the date of the “rental” text message as July 15 because he said he got that text the day after he went to the beach (which was July 13) and that the text came out of the blue when he was on the roof working. He told OCSO he works Monday through Friday, and he gets out of work at 5:00pm, so he starts around 8:00am. Casey did not send any text messages to Will on July 14, so the text message about the rental, by process of elimination, was the 8:51am message on Tuesday, July 15.
Will Waters on page 12: “The only two [text messages] that like stood out to me was the one where I went, that one I was telling you when I got back from the beach she texted (sic), “Give me a call, oh, give me, yeah (affirmative), give me a call whenever you get back in town. I have, I have plans but if the occasion arises tonight then I can’t come out or whatever.” Then the following day was, the text out of the blue about getting a rental car. That’s, like I didn’t even text her before that. I just, I’m at work on the roof and out of the blue and she (unintelligible), “I’m getting a rental, I might be getting a rental.”
Here is the Casey-Will Timeline. Will confirmed that the “rental” text message was sent at least one day after he went to the beach (which was July 13), so I am not listing the cell phone exchanges before July 13:
Friday, July 4 – they met for the first time at a July 4th barbecue at Will’s house hosted by Will and Amy. They went in a group to the Lake Eola fireworks later that night.
Saturday, July 5 – Casey showed up on Will’s doorstep and they spent the day together (Target, Zaxby’s, IKEA). Will thought they were together until around 4:00pm. Casey went to a carwash with Tony’s jeep and then drove to OIA to pick up Tony. At 5:41pm, Casey paid $4 cash for Citco Car Wash per Lee’s receipt list.
Sunday, July 6
Monday, July 7
Tuesday, July 8
Wednesday, July 9
Thursday, July 10 – Will and Casey were supposed to take a helicopter ride to Saw Island but Casey cancelled at the last minute.
Friday, July 11 – Casey asked Will to hang out at Fusian (he did not go)
Saturday, July 12 – Casey said she would hang out with Will but then told him Tony’s roommate broke his hand so she was staying at Tony’s apartment.
Sunday, July 13 – Will Waters went to the beach. He invited Casey to go with him and told Amy he had invited her but he doubted she would go.
Text from Will to Casey on Saturday, July 12 at 11:17pm: “Hey, sorry 2text u but we r going to vixon. Hit me up n the morning I will c there I am leaveing sun up hit me up when u wake up I have friends that have a house on the beach.”
No response from Casey.
Text from Will to Amy at 1:26am on Sunday, July 13 (two hours after inviting Casey by text): “Time is good just drunk getting ready 2 go surfing at 7 the surf is up. she said she might come thats doughtfull. i wont let her go how was ur day n what”
Text from Will to Casey at 1:30am on Sunday, July 13: “U looked sex”
No response from Casey.
Text from Will to Casey at 7:57am on Sunday, July 13: “Get ur butt up. And grab ur board.”
Casey responded by text at 8:14am on Sunday, July 13 (no message available)
Text from Will to Casey at 8:17am on Sunday, July 13: “I am hung over 2 were going 2 ihop later than finding some new spot 2 play n the sand n with our cars n it will b a fun day get off ur but ill buy u 50 full throttles”
Casey responded by text at 8:19am on Sunday, July 13 (no message available)
Text from Will to Casey at 8:45am on Sunday, July 13: “Well ok. If ur plans don’t work out I would love 2 hang out.”
Text from Will to Casey at 12:47pm on Sunday, July 13: “Bring amys car over ill take off that tint.”
No response from Casey.
At 8:37pm on Sunday, July 13, Will left Casey a message on her MySpace (message unknown).
Text from Will to Casey at 1:36pm on Monday, July 14: “Hey, I am going 2 b picking up tickets 4 all three shows this month let me know if you want any. And when r we going 2 Universal”
Casey called Will at 1:37pm (836 seconds = almost 14 minutes)
Text from Will to Casey at 2:22pm on July 14: “So I am going 2 run when I get home and than up to hob 2 pick up tickets let me know if u want 2 go”
No response from Casey.
At 11:30pm on Monday, July 14, Will left Casey a message on her MySpace (message unknown).
Text from Casey to Will at 8:51am on Tuesday, July 15: [Message not available]
*****This has to be the “rental” message because it’s the first text message Casey sent to Will that was at least one day after he went to the beach and that she sent to him while he was working and without having heard from him first (out of the blue). His responses make it clear that they were discussing her car situation.*****
Text from Will to Casey at 8:54am on Tuesday, July 15: Good morning cutie. Y cause you have 2 give amys car back. Whats wrong with yours. You know I can pretty much fix anything.
Text from Casey to Will at 8:56am on Tuesday, July 15: [Message not available]
Text from Will Waters to Casey at 9:00am on Tuesday, July 15: New cars are swell. So sorry 2 ask or bug about it but what the heck do I have 2 do 2 get some time with Casey again or do we just become myspace texting
****
Yes, it’s likely that Casey wanted to know more about the tow buddy. However Amy’s car was towed by this guy on June 14; Casey knew about it because the car was towed to Tony’s complex, Sutton Place. Casey met Will on July 4 (days after she discovered her car was no longer at Amscot), so I think she would have tried to find out if the tow buddy had a connection to Johnson’s much closer to July 4 (maybe even on July 5 when Casey and Will spent the day together).
I agree with you, however, that Casey was probably interested in any angle she could work relative to Will’s tow buddy and how she might get a car out of the connection (her own Pontiac back without involving her parents or a car to drive gratis if he had access to impounded cars that were still running but were scheduled to be auctioned because of abandonment).
1596 Boo
NOT AN APPROPRIATE COMMENT FOR THE ORTIZ FAMILY.
The only person in Caylee’s life that failed her was her Mother Casey.
Caylee’s parents did everything they could for there grandchild when she was alive.
Scarlett, I think your words are a bit jumbled. You mean Casey’s parents, and I happen to disagree. I believe they should have stopped enabling Casey years ago. They knew alot of what was going on, and then when they did not, not even so much as a call for a wellness check. And now in her death, I feel it is even more egregious the way they stain her legacy with their antics. Sorry, I started out believing in this people until I learned differently, I stand for Caylee.
B
BrendaT 1577
Several witnesses claimed to have heard about Zanny the nanny (even the name Zenaida) prior to June 16, 2008. And then there’s the curious Zenaida MySpace page . . . .
At any rate, here is a rough timeline of when various witnesses claim to have first heard of a babysitter named Zanny/Zani or Zenaida:
Spring (April) 2006
Richard Grund called Detective Yuri Melich in September 2008. Richard explained to Melich during a recorded call that babysitting Caylee was becoming a burden to the Grunds in the spring of 2006, so he asked Casey to make alternate arrangements for babysitting. Richard said during that interview that Casey had used the name Zenaida Gonzalez back in 2006:
“So I began to press Caylee [sic] about, “Have you found anybody yet?” . . . She finally said, “Oh, yeah (affirmative), I found this lady, uh, Zenaida Gonzalez, and she, she watches my friend Jeffrey Hopkins’ son, Zachary.”
However, when Richard Grund appeared on Nancy Grace on September 22, 2008, he only claimed to have heard the babysitter called Zanny, not Zenaida Gonzalez.
“GRACE: Back to the father of Casey Anthony`s ex-fiance. Richard Grund is with us. Did you ever know of this nanny, see her, talk to her, hear of her?
GRUND: I never saw her or spoke to her, but I did hear of her. I heard of her in April of `06, when Casey lost her regular baby-sitter. As I said, Jesse would watch her. I would watch her. She tried to get my high-school-age son to watch her, which meant I watched her because I have an office in my home.
Finally, one day when Casey came home from work to wait for Jesse and hang out with us, I kind of greeted her at the door with, What are we going to do about this baby-sitter thing? And she says, I found one. I have a nanny. Her name is Zanny, and I got her from Jeffrey Hopkins, who has a son named…”
August 2007 (or earlier)
OCSO interviewed Shirley Plesea, Casey’s grandmother, in August 2008. Shirley told OCSO that she had heard the name Zani for over a year. I wouldn’t normally put stock in any testimony from the family, but I make exceptions for Shirley and Rick Plesea since neither is trying to protect Casey.
December 2007
Jesse Grund told OCSO during a July 2008 interview, “I never met Zani before, but I’ve heard the name Zani for at least six months.” In another interview, Jesse said he first heard the name Zanny in December 2007 when he and Casey had briefly resumed their romantic relationship. He said he heard the name Zani at his police academy graduation on December 7, 2007, which was also the last day he and Casey were romantically involved. In an appearance on Geraldo on September 20, 2008, Jesse clarified that he had only hear the name Zani, never Zenaida Gonzalez.
Geraldo said “You mean Zenaida Gonzalez?”
Jesse replied, “No, all I knew was Zanny.”
Circa February-March 2008
Ricardo testified in July 2008 that early in his relationship with Casey (which began in February 2008), Casey told him Caylee’s nanny’s name was Zani and that he asked Casey what Zani stood for.
Detective Edwards: “What did she call the nanny? What, what name?”
Ricardo: “Zani. Uhm, and she did confirm at the time that her actual name was Zenita.”
Ricardo: “Because I had asked her, ‘What does Zani stand for?’ And she told me, ‘Zenita.’”
***In his investigative reports, Detective Yuri Melich used the spelling Zenaida, not Zenita, in this transcription. I assume Melich must believe the person who transcribed that interview had simply misspelled the name. Melich believes Ricardo said, “Zenaida.”
May 6, 2008
During an IM conversation with Tony Rusciano, Casey said she was waiting for the nanny to return from Tampa and referred to the nanny by name when she wrote, “I’m playing phone tag with both Zani & my mom.”
June 16, 2008
Date of creation of a MySpace page for “Zenaida” from Miami, a Pisces who was 23 years old in June 2008. The avatar is a Dora the Explorer doll. The page was last accessed on October 14, Casey’s last day of freedom before being jailed with no bond on murder charges. There is nothing about this MySpace page in the discovery, so there is no IP confirmation that this page was created by Casey. Looks mighty suspicious, though.
June 17, 2008
A woman named Zenaida Gonzalez visited Sawgrass Apartments on South Conway. Harry Garcia, a consultant in the management office at Sawgrass, filled out the guest card with information supplied by Ms. Gonzalez. He testified that he recognized his handwriting on the card and noted that he had conducted the interview in Spanish because he wrote down the names of Ms. Gonzalez’s children who would be living with her using a Spanish conjunction (Michelle y Jasmine). He also wrote down Ms. Gonzalez’s phone number.
The name of the guest was Zenaida Gonzalez, but in the space for first name, Mr. Garcia wrote what appears to be “C- Zenaida” and in the space for last name “Gonzale”. I have two theories for Harry Garcia’s error regarding the first name:
1) It could be that Mr. Garcia started to write the last name in the space for first name (so a partial “G” appears before the name Zenaida), or
2) Perhaps Harry Garcia asked her for her first name and she replied, “Si, Zenaida” (speaking Spanish for “Yes, Zenaida.”), but he thought the “Si” was the initial “C” so he wrote her first name as C. Zenaida.
The last name as it appeared on the guest card on July 16 was written Gonzale, not Gonzalez, which implies that Harry misheard Ms. Gonzalez when she spoke her name or that he simply misspelled her last name.
July 15, 2008
When talking to an OCSO dispatcher during the third 911 call, Casey said the kidnapping babysitter’s name was Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez.
===== ===== =====
PS – I find it interesting that in their written statements on the night of July 16,
Cindy did not refer to any babysitter whatsoever by job description or personal name (didn’t use the words nanny, babysitter, Zani, Zenaida, etc.).
George wrote that Cindy told him their granddaughter, Caylee Marie, was missing and had been taken a month earlier by “a person by the name of Zany.” George did not used the words nanny or babysitter in his statement and did not identify the relationship of the “person by the name of Zany” to Casey or Caylee.
Lee wrote that Casey had told him she last saw Caylee after dropping her off with the nanny, Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. He was clearly simply repeating what Casey had just told him.
I am not very sophisticated with computer searches and I have been trying to review all the times George told the story of Casey not letting him see in the trunk. I know he has told several versions of the trunk story, but I can’t find the one I’m looking for. Maybe I am immagining it, but wasn’t there one of the stories where George says he saw into the trunk? (and thereby implies there was no body there?) Would someone have pity on me and help me out here?
Kleat 1593
Tara lives in Michigan, so it would be pretty hard to connect her to the car. I haven’t checked the cell records, but Cindy was saying Tara had claimed to have a recent one-hour phone conversation with Casey and had also talked to Caylee during that call. Casey said she hadn’t talked to Tara in two months.
It’s entirely possible that Casey and Tara exchanged text messages and MySpace messages (as they did), neither of which involve talking to each other as in a phone conversation let alone a one-hour conversation.
Today the My Orange Clerk lists: Motion for Transcription and Order. Any idea what this means?
Baez REALLY doesn’t want the fraud case to go ahead. Wonder where the money came from?? http://www.wesh.com/news/20132509/detail.html
Wendy 1601
You’ve probably realized your error, but it was Riddle’s post you were admiring, not mine.
NosyRosy, so right you are and I love your quote. The Anthony’s live on denial and lies. It seems that long before KC pulled her nonsense they were all living and telling lies. And I think they all are aware of each other’s lies and just never say anything. Now they are dealing with the real world, where if you lie someone will call you on it… and I don’t think they have any idea how to function.
They raised that misfit, allowed her to bring an unwanted child into the world and did nothing to protect that baby. The defense isn’t going to be able to use their tricks and lies to defend KC and they monster they raised will pay for what she did. The public won’t have it any other way. Look at this blog, over 1600 entries. I can’t even keep up. We are the majority and I don’t think they’ll be able to find 1 person on a jury that won’t see what we see. But as Blink says, this will never go to trial.
#1585 kosmo. I respect your point of view about tthe anthonys behavior. I myself have seen casey as a gamer who was playing cat and mouse with them or to be more clear a predator who likes to mentally and emotionally torture her family and others, look what she put that whole community thru, all those who were searching for caylee. I can see that the family was trying to locate caylee but when they did they left her there. I don’t understand that but it is my belief that if this goes to trial george will finally say the truth and possibly lee since I believe he was telling his buddy about what was going on. Why take the “she is innocent” position, why would they want casey out?
Riddle-
After just glimpsing quickly at the more recent posts about the family/the defense recently floating some laughable claim about the body not being that of Caylee .
Did I get that right?? Something about a bone sample sent for testing being bogus??? Is that for real a claim being made here????
GOOD LORD.
I can gladly admit that I am in no way capable of predicting what this tag-team of sensationalists has planned or would plan. Can someone fill me/us in more? Are these things coming directly from defense counsel or from a PR rep??? I mean, I almost fell off my chair there for a second. If what people have posted about here is what is being officially claimed on Casey’s behalf– it’s extremely troubling. Those are serious accusations against medical/forensic witnesses. I have to tell you, this shocks the conscience).
Back to your question though (sorry, but I am just astonished).
IMO, the only reasons to put her on the stand:
1. If her defense is that this was an ACCIDENTAL DEATH (and all of her lying, etc afterward was an attempt to cover it up because she didn’t know what to do, etc– which, imo, will be asking a jury with common sense a LOT to believe since she didn’t break down and make this kind of admission from the get-go or at ANY time for months while having plenty of opportunity to reflect on it and consult with counsel); OR
2. If the defense has something to do with her MENTAL CAPACITY BEING DIMINISHED AT THE TIME OF THE CRIME. FYI-I have already posted that I would not recommend an insanity defense, because there is too much evidence to prove that she was an remains “legally” “sane”; HOWEVER, dimished capacity–either due to mental defect or intoxication, for example– is another area entirely. (uphill battle with the mental defect imo as well, but if she was–and admits to being intoxicated– at the time of the killing, and a jury bought it, she could escape the DP); OR
3. If she is going to testify that SOMEONE ELSE killed Caylee and she knows who that someone is, can back it up with credible evidence of some sort (although many of us here believe this is most likely since Casey will never admit what she has done to Caylee/has a love-hate relationship with Cindy & George/attorneys for both are starting to take shots across the table at one another, she has a real problem with backing up such a claim with credible evidence); OR
4. If CASEY INSISTS ON TAKING THE STAND, regardless of and against the advice of counsel. Remember, it is her right to take the 5th–or not–, not the right of her counsel to invoke/enforce. If she wishes to testify in her own defense, she will be on that stand.
I highly doubt anyone plans to put her on the stand though, and she seems to enjoy keeping all the details to herself, doesn’t she? It eats everyone up alive, not knowing what this sociopath did to Caylee (although I know that once she is convicted, people will feel satisfied, and interest in HER will drop off exponentially, if not entirely as time goes by).
We know that if she does take the stand, the prosecution has the upper hand. Her credibility is already off-the-charts 6-ft-under.
*She will be confronted with, and will have to admit to, lying to and stealing from her mother, father, brother, best friends.
*She will be confronted with, and will have to admit to, lying to LAW ENFORCEMENT CONCERNING THE LAST TIME SHE SAW HER OWN CHILD, at the time she was supposed to be providing them with the very information that would assist them in any chance they had of finding Caylee and bringing her home safely (or at least to recover her remains as quickly as possible, with as much dignity for Caylee’s remains as possible).
*She will be confronted with, and have to admit to, lying to family and friends about her entire life (education, employment, etc, etc, etc).
*Thanks to Cindy’s statement to LE, Casey will be confronted with, and will have to admit to, lying, on a daily basis, to her mother about where she was–where CAYLEE was– from the last time Cindy saw her on the evening of June 15th to the evening that Cindy and Amy showed up at Tony’s apartment on July 15th.
*Thanks to photographic evidence, Casey will be confronted with, and have to admit to, partying on a regular, routine basis at Orlando night clubs–while her daughter was allegedly “KIDNAPPED”. (add witness testimony and txt msgs to that–and who knows– perhaps MySpace entries???)
*She will be confronted with, and have to admit to, lying about many other crucial items. Just to highlight a few:
*NO ONE (LE AND OTHERWISE) CAN LOCATE, HAS MET IN PERSON, SPOKEN TO ON THE PHONE, ETC AND/OR CAN VOUCH FOR THE EXISTENCE OF A NANNY/NO ONE ELSE, INCLUDING HER OWN MOTHER, THE OTHER PRIMARY CARETAKER OF CAYLEE, NOT TO MENTION HER FATHER, HER BROTHER, HER GRANDPARENTS, OTHER RELATIVES, BEST FRIENDS, ANY FRIENDS, ANY ONE. THE FACT THAT SHE MENTIONED “ZANNY” BEFORE JUNE 15TH ONLY SHOWS A)EVIDENCE OF PREMEDITATION, OR B)THAT CASEY WAS USING THE FAKE “ZANNY” AS A COVER SO SHE COULD SLEEP OUT OF THE HOUSE ON HOPESPRING (we know she slept at Rico’s overnight a lot–and WITH CAYLEE while Caylee was still alive), or C) FOR BOTH REASONS A & B.
* NO ONE (LE AND OTHERWISE) CAN LOCATE, HAS MET IN PERSON OR SPOKEN TO ON THE PHONE, ETC AND/OR CAN VOUCH FOR THE EXISTENCE OF ANYONE WHOM CASEY CLAIMED ALSO KNEW/SAW/COULD VOUCH FOR THE EXISTENCE OF “ZANNY” (JEFF HOPKINS WHO IS NOT THE ONLY JEFF HOPKINS SHE KNOWS; JULIETTE LEWIS –who Cindy sometimes screws up and refers to as “JULIA”; GLORIA (Zanny’s “mother”); “SAMANTHA” (the enforcer-ha); “RAQUELL FARELL”, ETC
* JEFF HOPKINS-never worked WITH Casey at Universal/does not have a son, let alone a son named Zachery/does not now and has never known and/or dated and/or introduced Casey to anyone named Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzales, or just Zenaida, or even just “Zanny”, has only seen Casey in passing a few times since highschool, and only had casual conversation with her on those occasions;
* Comments/txt messages to Amy about THE SMELL IN HER CAR JUNE 25th, JUNE 26th (and btw–per Amy’s statement, also the comment to Amy that she “got rid of it” by the 27th– and clearly she intended Amy to understand that the “it” she got “rid of” was the smell, but we know, for a fact, that technically, she never got rid of the smell; it was only the car that she “rid” herself of, –and whether she intended to retrieve it from Amscot or not (i do NOT want to go there again–we all have our ideas), she did rid herself of the smell, practically speaking.
* The of the ODOR in the trunk of the car–and its SOURCE (human decomposition–and notice I didn’t say Caylee’s decomp, I just said HUMAN decomp) when it was opened at Johnson’s on July 15th (since she is the last person to have used the car before it was towed and impounded).
ETC, ETC, ETC (many posters here could add on, and on, and on)
To me, it doesn’t matter if she takes the stand or not though.
I still predict guilty on Murder One; DP.
Look at casey’s universal interview. She being confronted about killing caylee and hiding her body and I mean she was being HAMMERED by those guys and she didn’t even blink. I would have been a puddle at that point. She could have said it was an accident but she “chose” not to. She killed her own innocent helpless baby for petes sake then drove around in the car her babys body was in, getting tatoos and handing out “shots” at fusion. Do the anthony’s really believe that casey won’t kill again? I don’t think the state of florida believes that.
thanks boo….can they not test DNA from his family to prove this once and for all? have they?
so right now I am irratated…Blink help me out here…can Jose Baez “pay” off Casey’s bill to Amy legally I read that it is a big no no…what then if anything can happen????? got the tidbit from http://www.wesh.com
But your right kosmo the death of caylee has been the anthonys “undoig”.
This looks like the prosecutors have unearthed some “mistruths” (what the heck is that anyways!) on the Baez camp. They want the transcript from the sidebar on how he was being paid to use in the trial!
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-casey-anthony-072109,0,984426.story
re: Scarlett – #1578
Casey’s password to one of her web sites was “timmer55.” 55 days from June 15 was Caylee’s birthday. I also believe she killed her on the 15 of June for that reason.
Thanks, Maura, Casey seemed to be connecting to all sorts of people for whatever reason during the ‘missing days’.
The Tara call was from a cell ping (as per Klaasend’s YouTube 360 degree mapping videos) on June 30th in the calls between 4:48-4:56. At least that’s an attempt, which Casey didn’t admit to in her jail video, calling her psycho. This call was in the JC Penny area. Casey’s Amscot pattern seemed to be interrupted that day and she was all over the map. Maybe reaching out to whoever, to suggest connections, who knows.
If someone might be thinking of committing a major crime, like murder, then why not go live the good life, committing all sorts of small crimes to live that good life, like theft, fraud, whatever…. go for a ‘good life joy ride’ because committing the next crime will be the biggie, and you won’t have to pay for the fun times ahead of it– because your lawyers, maybe judges, won’t allow that to influence your murder trial and jury, and take time away from your lawyers. So, why not do all the small stuff– take advantage!
The judge will have to consider the implications of not allowing justice to be served to Amy, Shirley, and others should they also press charges– just because lawyers pay off the tickets so to speak, to make the charges effectively ‘go away’.
sosad, that is interesting. We will have to wait and hear Blink’s weigh-in on this as it relates to Baez’s problems with the bar and Blink’s past article subject.
Blink or Silverspnr, is ‘the side bar’ only at the judge’s bench, or did it continue as a ‘side bar’ in chambers? Or are the two separate in this instance? (ie: is it only confidential for the part ‘in camera’ in chambers, or is the side-bar in the courtroom separate– even if it contains information about Baez’s source of funding for Casey?
I wonder if this new request stems specifically from the cheque fraud case preparation, as now, the prosecution can also say that they must know where that money came from, the actual source of the funding, that Casey used, via Baez, to pay off the bank, that paid off Amy and made everyone ‘whole’ again. (right– whole without justice served)
Will the cheque fraud case be fought on this level too– to gain information about funding of Casey’s case? Interesting.
Did Baez step ‘in it’ once again??!??!
#1604 scarlett. If I came across as disrespectful to the jose ortiz family I do apologize. I did not mean to imply that it was good for caylee that he was dead. I did not mean to come across that way. My condolences are with the ortiz family who lost their child too.
Boo-
I do not feel it did, You echoed my sentiments I have posted many times. In my personal opinion, if he is her Father, what a sad travesty as I do believe he was a fine young man with a bright future. I so would have wanted that for Caylee. While I do agree her grandparents loved her without question, sometimes our own prejudices and self absorption clouds the big picture; that is what I believe happened with them.
B
silver
she is total toast !! no matter what the defense tries to do it will all unravel before their eyes. there is just to much evidence against her. she has virtualy no credibilility or any friends left to speak as a character witness!! can anyone name one friend she has left? I think that the prosecution will discredit any time lines and lies told by her and her parents and brother. what will be very damaging to her will be her gramother testifying for the prosecution along with cindys brother.
Casey has burned many bridges behind her, she no longer has tony or anyone else for that matter unless its a looney that sends her money for her books. all baez’s efforts will not matter!! I dont see any jury believing her or her family to be credible.
usualy I just lurk and read all the intelligent posts and comments. but I just wanted to put my two cents worth.
thank you
maura,omg omg,i’d been looking for an instance where zenida’s signature started with a C,as i always sign s then realize my mistake and laugh at myself(that i do it everytime) when my disabled neighbor Tom has me sign for his yum yum deliveries ,i know i do that so i purposely was looking for an istance WHERE casey might have done that,are you sure he filled out the card?i wouldnt believe it,til i had to.i smell baez, wouldn’t believe it til i had to(there always was something fishy about the sawgrass story and how she knew zg went there)mark furhman believed at one time the vistor could have been casey in disquise.
Casey’s ‘income’ for that period of time was ‘stealing’ and her role as ‘shot manager’ or ‘photo model with customers’ did not give her any payments of money or earnings. (Tony said to Lee in car video she was not paid).
So the state would need to know if the bank of America accepted stolen money as payment for the bad cheques. (isn’t that called money ‘laundering’???? ‘;)
#1606 carolyn S. Try this link, its george talking to greta about the 6/27 encounter with casey about the “gas cans.”. http://elfninosmom.wordpress.com/2008/08/07
HA!!! I looked at the sentinal site, then wftv, but now after posting above, checked WESH and see that the headline is just what I was thinking in that post!!! STOLEN money!!????
(now to go read the WESH story behind the headlines)
yep– Baez says cheque came from ‘Anthony’.
1604 Blink
Thank you for the correction, I definitely jumbled my words, and meant to write Casey’s parents.
I can separate my feelings on how George and Cindy treated Caylee when she was alive and living with them, compared to how they enabled Casey while she was also living with them.
I don’t believe that George and Cindy had any idea there enabling of Casy would affect Caylee’s death by the hand of her Mother, their daughter.
I truly believe in my heart that George and Cindy loved Caylee very much.
I believe it’s despicable how they’ve acted since Cindy found Casey on June 15th.
Do I believe right now Casy’s parents could have done more after she left the house with Caylee? Of course, but that’s hyndsite.
I believe if Cindy, George or Lee knew Caylee was in any danger/deceased they would’ve found Casy sooner. I really believe Casy’s immediate family thought Casey was trying to punish them by keeping Caylee away from them, and she would come home for financial reasons in time.
Although it may not have come across in this site, I also stand for Caylee.
seriously,i searched and searched for zg22′s signature thinking it would accidently have a c in front of it, when i found the traffic ticket that zg 22 signed i microscopicly looked at hoping for a C,i digressed,but now your telling there’s a c before zenida on the guest card,im sure it can be explained away,but imagine my excitement.if i had carte blanche in an ideal world i’d handwriting analyze that guest card.
It would do you no good, not considered an exemplar
B
Blink I realize that in the link I referenced george is giving the date of his run in with casey as 6/24. I just don’t believe him. He does have a history of fudging his dates alittle. I believe he actually followed her on 6/27 and saw her ditch the car at amscot but that’s JMO
I love this place. So many different ways of dissecting the issues from so many different viewpoints and so many different mental stregnths.
I know she’s guilty, but what I’d like to know now is: should totmom die on the gurney or should she die by another inmate’s hands … or old and decrepit from 50 years of solitary.
Personally, I’d like to see by another inmate’s hands, but I’d accept any of the three as acceptable. What say you all?
oops, by mental stregnths, I really meant strong-points. … areas of great talent and intuition. We’re all strong here and weak there, but when you add it all up…..
susanm, hint– the writer of the card started to write ‘G-onzalez’, got part of the letter started, then wrote the name in order, first name first, surname last. Nothing sinister, not a ‘C’ at all, just an incomplete ‘G’.
Fred, George alluded to that problem in his very early interviews with LE. He even went so far as to suggest things working in Casey’s favour if the baby was found safe, and some things could maybe go away for her if she cooperated. Scott Bolin, FBI said that if that were to happen, he surely would be willing to speak on her behalf. (they were talking just the child neglect, fraud charges then)
And George expressed concerns about losing his daughter if she were in general population. So much her lawyer had to work with back then– instead of letting it snowball like this. She could have pled, and maybe had a chance of her time in protective custody.
Some chance now.
silverspnr ~ Michelle Bart is back and actually did a show on blog talk radio on 7/15/09 and yes, she seems to be saying there’s no proof that it was Caylee that was found. These people just will not give it up, lol. Here’s the link but remember it’s 45 minutes of your life you won’t get back….
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/helpingheroes/2009/07/15/Voices-for-Justice-a-look-into-the-Caylee-Anthony-case-and-other-missing-persons-files
Blinks comment page has turned into a Box of Chocolate’s, ya never know what subject you’re going to get! Today I pick…the very interesting ANTHONY BACKYARD.
While reading the Motion filed by Lyon Baez regarding the blocking of the release of Team Padilla statements…
http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20089834/detail.html
Please note their cause number 7, that reads as follows:
“Leonard Padilla, Tony Padilla, Tracy McLaughlin and Robert Dick all spent countless hours in the Antony [sic] backyard while providing security for Miss Anthony.”
Oh really? Just what does that have to do with what their statements may reveal?
wink, wink @ Blink! Perhaps their statements will reveal the missing link. Evidence buried in the backyard sends Casey permanently to the clink???
Wink from Blink back- you know that girl-
B
1621 Boo
I definitely took what you wrote to mean you were glad Jose Ortiz was dead because he didn’t stay in Caylee’s life.
I apologize for reading it wrong.
Maybe the term “nanny” is used differently in different regions. I have NEVER heard a babysitter referred to as a “nanny” prior to reading about this case. Can somebody please tell me why a young woman, living at home with her parents (apparently middle-class folks) would need a nanny?
I had a nanny when my children were young. She was the grandmother of one of my cousins. She LIVED at my house, and provided 24 hour care for my five children, while I worked full-time. Generally, at least on the West Coast, the term nanny implies a full-time, life-in care provider. What the hell is this business about a nanny for a 20something chick who doesn’t have a job? And with regard to Casey “lying” about having a job…two of my kids live at home, and I SEE their paycheck stubs. I KNOW they go to work, and they also go to school full-time. What psychotropic drugs were the Anthonys on, to supposedly NOT KNOW that this girl wasn’t working. She never had a paycheck stub, right? Ever file a tax return? Ever get a tax refund? She LIVED AT THEIR HOUSE!!
I’ve tripped all along about the egregious misuse of the term “nanny”. Maybe someone in the south, or on the east coast, can tell me if you use the term “nanny” to mean occasional babysitter, or even regular babysitter.
ALL BS! Lies, lies, lies. And who is lying? Do Cindy and George Anthony, originally from where..the midwest??? Do they use the term NANNY for babysitter? I have MANY friends from the midwest, and they call babysitters babysitters, and nannies nannies. Help me out here… you folks call a babysitter where you drop a kid off for daycare a NANNY? Would you not KNOW if your kid had been unemployed for months to years, if they and their baby lived with you? Would you have never CALLED them at work for ANYTHING? C’mon. What a bunch of garbage!
Re Maura – #1605 – thank you so much. Truly I did not expect to put you to so much work.
I’ve been pretty much up here talking to myself about CMA. Early on I started documenting dates, events, witnesses, and then gave my head a shake when it became so complex. Transformed to leisure reading material. So I’m a diletante here.
I’m back at work again and again way behind. I had hoped I could catch up and stay there. Not.
Fascinated with July 3rd discovery prospects. Completely out of the loop about car rental. Pavers moved any distance – holy skemoli. I confess I had discounted that theory.
Naturally revisiting my vision of what G & C thought or knew and when.Very naive I can be esp. when reading. I cut them slack for trauma, horror and confusion etc. re their early specific dates. Silly me re this crew.
Wendy’s post #1569 re Casey’s comment to George put my heart in my throat. I am taking liberties here but along the lines of “I couldn’t be there without her there”
I was addicted to the first Phil Spector trial and the forensis experts and arguments. Thank god I at least have a bit of a heads up re LKB, MB and others in what may be coming up next in that regard.
Thank you Blink for the excellent ship you run and for the excellence of the contributors. Very appreciative of the information you offer one and all.
#1632 FredMcneil. Well fred since you asked! Let me put it to ya this way. If I was being considered for a potential juror “in this case”I think I would be death penalty qualified “in this case”.
Blink!
Question please?
I am stuck on Annie Downing interview…
Have they left out A LOT of it in discovery of what they released?
Or redacted like half of it for trial?
Thanks so much.
I think this girl has a lot of info that we did not get to hear and also from Amy?
Please tell me they are not airheads!
1624 Susan
There is no doubt whatsoever that Harry Garcia filled out the guest card. It’s in his handwriting, and it isn’t a car that would be signed out by a guest. Harry is a sales consultant, and what is referred to in the discovery as a “guest card” is really the salesperson’s worksheet. If you look at it in the discovery, you’ll see what I mean. It has a whole list of talking points at the top such as, “Offer the guest a beverage.”
Amanda Macklin confirmed that the card had been filled in by Harry. She recognized his handwriting and called him into the office to talk to the detective on July 16.
Zenaida Gonzalez said she went to Sawgrass with her boyfriend and son. They were all in the office together when she was talking to Harry Garcia.
And Amanda Macklin and Harry Garcia both said Zenaida Gonzalez had to provide a photo ID before being allowed to see the apartment. When Detective Melich went to Sawgrass on July 16, he showed Harry photos of 12 women in the FL driver’s database who are all named Zenaida Gonzalez (these were driver’s license photos). Harry picked out the woman who is suing Casey Anthony.
There is no doubt that Zenaida Gonzalez never touched the guest card herself and there is no doubt that the woman who is suing Casey is the one who visited Sawgrass on June 17.
#1632-Fred Mc…
I personally believe that Casey would suffer more being in prison for life. I’ve heard some people say that a sociopath can adapt to any environment, and though that may be true, I find it hard to believe that “party girl, socialite Casey” would be happy at age 23, locked up, no chance of EVER getting out. No interaction with men, no parties, no texting or myspace. Seems as if it would be pretty tough on anyone, most especially someone like her. Also, not to mention that in general population, she will be hounded to death. She will only have associates, never friends, they will use her for her money stash, or she will pay dearly. IMO of course. Always thought it strange that criminals, locked up in prison for awhile, or life even, have a set of morals. They may not have done the right thing while they were out, but prisoners do NOT like those that commit crimes against children. I would imagine she is hated more than most, simply because of her cocky attitude, not to mention that some prisoners may feel they will gain a sense of power or fame by being “the one” that took down Casey, or at the very least, made her life miserable.
On the other hand….there is always the death penalty. I suppose if this were taking place here in Texas, I’d be more apt to vote for the death penalty in this case. In Florida though, there are 392 inmates on death row, only ONE is a female. They have all been there many, many years. Some dating back to the 70′s. Only 69 people have been executed since the reinstatement of the death penalty in 1974. Gary Alvord is the longest resident of Florida’s death row, having been there since 1974. I’m guessing that in Texas, where we do it quick, and seems like many in a row, it would be harder on them. The not knowing, the waiting. Here, if you get the DP, you know you’re going to die, just a matter of when. They do allow the appeals process to be used up first of course, but it’s a rarity, if ever, that someone is granted a last minute stay. If you get the DP in Texas, then you do indeed GET the DP. Wouldn’t seem quite as scary or sufficient a punishment for Casey in Florida. She would know that it would be many years, if EVER that she would be executed. True enough the solitary confinement of it would be nerve-racking, but knowing that nut, it probably wouldn’t bother her. She could spend her days lost in daydreams of grandeur without being interrupted. I just feel like if you’re sentenced to die, then that’s what you should get. Of course I live in Texas, where as I said, they seem to go on killing sprees…literally. Huntsville will be quiet for awhile, then all of a sudden, every night, or every other night, they are putting them to death. Goes on for a week or two, then back to silence. But boy when they decide it’s time….yikes, they get as many as possible.
Kleat-
Not sure where the (entirety of the) sidebar took place. Sounds like it was solely in chambers, but I wasn’t there, so could have been partially in chambers/partially at the bench. Matters not. The only ones present were the judge and counsel– AND the court reporter.
This is a MAJOR development.
I, again, almost fell off of my chair when I saw the posts/read the WESH story about funds being sent to the bank, and then Baez filing PROOF of this with the Court.
For another poster- upon discovery of the offense last July, the bank credited Amy’s account with the money that Casey stole (to be simplistic about it) from her. So this was not a payment “to Amy”. She was already “made whole” by the bank (on a financial level; not sure how anyone could claim this activity had no psychological impact on her with trust issues, etc–and, in any event, she is still a crime victim, no two ways about it).
Now back to THIS CHECK.
Whewwwwwwwwww! I am almost giddy with laughter here, despite the fact that this is a very serious issue, because I just cannot believe this!
This check was –and I am guessing here– some inane attempt to make the fraud case “go away”, and/or some inane attempt to use this transaction as evidence for part of her defense at the Fraud trial and/or the Murder trial???
Neither makes sense.
EVEN IF THE SCHEMING CLIENT CAME UP WITH THE CRAZY IDEA,WHAT ATTORNEY WOULD ADVISE SAID CLIENT TO TAKE THIS STEP, AND THEN FILE PROOF OF IT WITH THE COURT?????!
A)Just on the fraud charges alone, why BOTHER to enter/maintain a NOT-GUILTY plea? Who ELSE but the person who forged the checks would try to make either victim “whole”!?!
B)Who would imagine that making this payment would make the criminal charges “go away”????! Could possibly believe that a BANK –which has legal duties to all of it’s depositors–would accept this check and call it a day???
C)The implications may be far-reaching on how Baez et al are being paid to represent her if he made statements to the court that would contradict her ability to pay his fees, etc.
I am sitting here both perplexed, and also LOL!
Sorry for laughing at such a serious issue, but it’s almost as if CINDY (queen of pay-it-back and sweep-it-under-the-rug) is running Casey’s “defense”.
Silver-
Thanks for taking the time and answering my question so thoroughly. And agreed ‘falling out of my chair’ is an apt description if the A’s are denying it was Caylee found. Absurd comes to mind, but sometimes the English language doesn’t seem adequate..so…uhm…er…I guess that’d be ridiculous beyond words? Again thanks,
Maura- TY for acknowledgement, (1601) I am flattered to be confused w/ one so knowledgeable on the details. (hat tip …curtsy
Kleat- Love how straight up you are in all your posts. (and open minded)
Blink- I’ve learned many things on this site, not the least of which is; it takes the patience of Job to run a blog. (now no runnin’ ’round the house today saying…I AM Job….k?).. or you’ll sound like Robin Williams.
Ok that’s my kudos, break it up, swinging slightly OT post for the week…..best to all, have a good day everyone.
Silverspnr, great comment #1518. If for some crazy reason KC is telling the truth (which I don’t believe for one second and it was someone else and they did take Caylee, could she be charged with accesory to murder because she did not report this at the time and she kept everything to herself and told all those lies (supposedly to protect Caylee and family).
http://www.clickorlando.com/news/20132611/detail.html
The sidebar that Bozo had with the judge about where the money is coming from has to be released to the prosecution by Thursday. Do you think we will ever see that?
Yes, and I think it will redact the in camera portion
B
Each news station has their own bit of info on this payment to the Bank of America.
WESH writes: “Baez denies he’s the one who cut the check, but he would neither confirm nor deny that the check came from Anthony.” And that ” Bank of America acknowledged a $664 check received from Baez’s office…” That is not correct– no check, it was a money order. The report says Baez didn’t admit to cutting the check but the reporter was asking about ‘the check’ so Baez may have been playing a little game by being evasive.
The Bank of America that “acknowledges the delivery of a money order” received from Baez’s office, the on July 10, 2009. The letter is posted on WFTV site.
My Mother (God rest her soul) used to always tell me that “there is a very thin line between love and hate.” The entire Anthony family epitomizes what my Mother was trying to describe. Look at how much Cindy and George love(d) Caylee..but how they were so hateful toward Casey they were willing to throw her out (with Caylee) knowing Casey had no job. (What were the words….”to bond”?) I am certain George and Cindy felt at the end of their ropes with all the lying and stealing..but what a “punishing” move…throw a jobless whack job into the street WITH her child hope for the best!
All the Anthonys hated each other back then (well, with the exception of Caylee) and THEN suddenly they LOVE Casey when they realize the seriousness of it all. I wonder if as time passes now they get more of a grasp on reality. The family paints one another with broad brushes…first a black brush then a white one. They are ALL borderline personality disordered.