Caylee/Casey Anthony Case: Baez Blasts Team Padilla
Orlando, Fl– Late last week the latest motions in the defense of Tot mom Casey Anthony for allegedly murdering her 34 month old daughter Caylee were filed. Talk about your average ingrate. The very team Jose Baez called on for help to bail out his client is the latest target in Baez defense teams attempt to restart the bilge pump in Casey’s sinking ship.
Baez latest attempt to un-ring the Padilla bell may as well have arrived at the clerks office on a cocktail napkin; it will be taken exactly that seriously.
There is no expectation of privilege where there is no attorney/client relationship in Florida. The question is, did Jose Baez sufficiently disclose that information to his client, Casey Anthony? Is this motion really designed to stave off the current Florida Bar complaints under investigative review?
Sources inside the investigation have confirmed to blinkoncrime.com that Baez is attempting to head the testimony of Padilla et al “off at the pass” for multiple reasons. It is expected that the backyard babblings of Casey Anthony to Tracy Mclaughlin will corroborate some of the evidence at the scene where Caylee Anthony’s remains were found. That’s not all. Baez is indirectly looking to block Leonard, Tracy, Rob and Tony from the civil case against his Client filed by Zenaida Gonzalez by blocking them from allowing their testimony as witnesses for the state in the criminal trial.
So What Would They Say?
Leonard Padilla, and occasionally Rob Dick have appeared on camera and spoken publicly about this case for the better part of a year.
Tony Padilla agreed to appear once on Nancy Grace to clear up some inconsistencies about the Surety process at the request of his surety firm early on, but prefers not to speak about the case publicly. Tracy has never given an interview publicly, but all of them have given statements to the FBI. What possible grounds will he claim to assert privilege when they did not work for Baez, nor did Baez ever pay any of them for anything?
None, because there aren’t any.
As far as revelations in their testimony, don’t expect any bombshells that have not been floating about already with the possibility of an exception or 50. They are:
Casey openly admitted to Rob Dick that she was forced to be following a script. He is also expected to provide some insight as to what Casey was doing in Baez’s office for 7 hours a day under the auspice of preparing for her defense.
The defense team revealed openly they would be pointing the finger at Jesse Grund. They are in possession of a first birthday card Jesse wrote to Caylee that they plan to use as the foundation of such an allegation.
Casey made Tony Padilla dinner the evening he got there to post her bond in George and Cindy’s presence in the Anthony home. He found her demeanor to be completely inconsistent with that of a mother whose child was missing, and she never once mentioned Caylee. Outside of Casey’s presence Tony asked Cindy who Caylees’ father was. Cindy presented him an article from the May 7, 2007 fatal crash that claimed the life of Jesus Ortiz. Tony initiated meeting Casey because one of his concerns when posting bond for her, was that she might commit suicide. Following that meeting, he felt confident there was a zero percent chance that was a possibility.
Remember this line, you will hear it again, “When are you going to stop acting like a cop and start acting like a Dad!!!”.
George Anthony purchased the handgun minutes following the rumor that Casey was about to be arrested on the economic charges and her bond would be revoked. Baez told the Anthonys’ that he alerted the OCSO that if that were the case, he would agree to turn her in, and they were under the impression they would agree to that arrangement.
What Baez did not know, is that OCSO was aware of the building potential for violence between George and Casey in the Anthony home and there was a genuine concern for Tracy’s safety on behalf of Team Padilla in the Anthony home. George Anthonys’ friend from Trumball County Ohio, we will call him Trumball Jim, told George everything he needed to know about Caylee’s whereabouts was in her room down the hall, (indicating Casey in her bedroom). George had it out with Casey demanding she tell him what she knew, and Jim had to pull George and Casey apart. Tim Miller, founder of Texas Equusearch, arrived shortly thereafter and was met at the door by Jim, with that episode being recounted to him as the first interface he had with anyone in the Anthony camp in that home.
This prompted Leonard’s comments on Nancy Grace that they could revoke her bond for any reason at any time and they were considering it. The photo on the front page of this article comes from the press conference following the meeting between Leonard and Baez that ensued after Baez had previously refused to discuss the issue with Leonard until he threatened to pull out.
Casey Anthony was scheduled to be interviewed by ABC at the Anthony home the day after she was rearrested and her bond was revoked. This was the reason that the Padillas received countless calls from Cindy and Lee begging Tony Padilla not to revoke her bond. Had they not, she could have been released within the hour as Baez stated at the time.
Lastly, the agreement Baez presented in his motion is not the only agreement between the parties in this motion. There is at least one more variation in which Tony Padilla requested language changes specifically that he did not include in the motion.
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“There is at least one more variation in which Tony Padilla requested language changes specifically that he did not include in the motion. ”
Blink, you can’t spill on this one?
Do you have any clue what was in the documents that the Anthonys dragged their feet on submitting to the prosecution?
Did George ever get the gun back?
Sorry, no.
Unconfirmed, but I am hearing docs related to the economic charges.
No, I am told he voluntarily agreed to put the gun in safekeeping where he does not have immediate access.
B
I find all you guys extraordinarily knowledgeable as to all of the facts and phenomena of this case. I have worked in law offices all my life for attorneys, as a paralegal, 32 years to be exact, and have always been fascinated with the criminal aspects of the law. I watch above every crime show, etc. that’s out there, I think. I started off in my career working for criminal defense attorneys in 1968,who at the time of the beginning of my legal career, were representing a runner for a bookie in a sensational Conn. murder trial. The fellow was ultimately found not guilty, and I remember as a young naive girl, comments that the senior attorneys made after the verdict was rendered, “that…was guilty as he !!. You know it and I know it!” I was shocked that they would say that about their own client. I was young and naive then.
What my point is, and what I wanted to comment on here is, this is by far the strangest case, with the most twists and turns on a daily basis, that I’ve ever seen. I have never seen such a diverse cast of characters. It’s just overwhelming and jawdropping, not only with the accused, but with the family members, and all the other ancillary characters involved. The amount of information and evidence that has been racked up over this past year is astounding, to say the very least. The players involved, from defendant to witnesses, all the way up to the defense attorneys – - – this is stuff you just cannot possibly make up. I think Stephen King would be hard pressed. This could very well go another year before a trial is in sight. I really don’t know if I can stand it.
There is one more defense position that no one discusses, but it would seem to me to be prudent that they would consider it. A documentary on a man accused of sodomizing and killing his niece, or I should say, the exhoneration of this innocent man who was accused of such horrible crimes, brings to mind what the international team of pathologists decided must be the case because of badly interpreted conditions at autopy. The reversal of the autopsy findings and conclusion pointed not to beating or sex crimes at all, but to simple observations of misinterpreting normal occurances after death. And here there was a body. Not to help in this, was the many many mistakes of one particular pathologist in his other autopsy findings. Not only was the man found to be innocent of these crimes, the finding was that the baby died of natural causes and NO ONE committed these crimes. (the remaining pathologist on the original autopsy would not reverse his findings– he says he was not wrong, but many other pathologists who reviewed the case, came to a different conclusion).
The accused and convicted man spent 12 years in prison when he was exhonerated and further, the courts declared him innocent because of the findings that the child died not of any suspicious circumstances but of natural causes. Further, (and this doesn’t happen easily in Canada), all the levels of government apologized publicly to this man, as did the pathologist who had read simple pooling of blood, as ‘bruising’ and other mistakes that were clear to his many international patholgist collegues who did their independent reviews.
So much has muddied the ‘accident’ waters in this case, much more complicated would be a theory of natural causes of death, not just the behaviour of the accused, but of the family after the fact. But I bet the defense has considered this thoroughly, maybe still is trying to explain away everything else, so that a natural cause of death becomes a possibility for their case.
One clue early on to suggest this, was some comment (maybe NG’s guests) to allude to the defense wanting to test Caylee for some genetic diseases– assuming that was the remains, but what other materials, samples, might give weight to some obscure health issue that was a timebomb waiting to go off and all the rest– well, just co-incidence and explained by mental health problems in the family.
It’s got to be considered and at a minimum, if someone else did not do this, and as her lawyers have stated publicly time and time and time again ‘she is innocent’, then natural causes would explain their position of innocence in the cause of Caylee’s death.
Dr. G. and her team
I know exactly what it is.. premature closure of the cranium, good luck with that, she never even had an xray while she was alive-
B
#148 ElmosMommy, I think the backpack everyone talks about is the one that GA says Casey & Caylee had the last time he says he saw Caylee. The one he described has not been found,IIR.
However, from above information you posted. It states no latent prints found on “above” items. Does that mean no fingerprints were found on the inside of the backpack, the diaper wipes, the diapers, the toothpaste,ect?? If it means NO fingerprints were in there then to me it means someone cleaned fingerprints off. No way in h-e-double L…. could I, as a jury member, believe that there were no prints on there UNLESS it was cleaned up prior to being seized by LE.
In my research on stuff on this case I have had an assumption that unless the Anthony home & the car were sealed off or designated by LE…with a court order to contain or whatever…… then Cindy and Lee and George were free to do what they wanted.
IE: The purse Lee got from Tony’s being poured out on the floor and Cindy taking what she wanted and putting it in her pockets…..AND here is the biggie…the LE officer grabbing something quickly as Lee stated….Can whatever the LE officer grabbed be used as evidence?
I do understand LE could not just walk into the Anthony home in the early part of this case, before they knew that the mother of the child was outright lying about her daughter’s disappearance, and grab pieces of evidence…BUT, to me, with the grandmother calling 911 saying the car smelled like it had a _______ body in it….couldn’t LE have put a police officer guarding the car and told the A’s not to touch it? IF, I am reading this correctly that the Dora the Explorer backpack…(that IIR was in the car)…has no fingerprints on or inside it at all….then someone blatantly did a thorough cleaning of that backpack & it’s contents.
You better have fun on your vacation, Silver, because I will have too many questions for you when you come back! As I am sure the other readers will.
I keep going back to the car at Amscot again and again because of one thing…..Tony’s statement that Casey had frozen popsicles or whatever in the grocery bags when he got there….I live 14 miles from the grocery stores…and in the summer I have to take a cooler to put my perishables in to travel home with them…and I live in the mountains…not the Florida heatwave! Those pops would be dripping outta the bag if she had to be pushed by 2 passersby into that spot and waited on Tony to come get her….now remember I am the one who believes she intended to return to get the car….but, this just does not ring right with me.
#138 red ranger. I was born in ’85 and I have seen “mel brooks” space balls. I have that movie in fact. Pizza the Hut, Barf the dog, and the helmut that kept getting bigger in every scene. “My schwartz is bigger than yours”. My bro who was born in’83 is a big star wars fan.
Caylee was 2 months shy of being 2 years old when her alledged father (Jesus Ortiz)was killed in the car accident. I was under the impression she was just a new born at the time of the car accident.
Blink, will we ever know the results of the DNA/paternity results being done to determine if Jesus is the real father?
Knowing the results will not help Caylee’s case. I guess I am just being nosey.
Do you think Casey was making phone calls, texting from Baez’s cell phone and communicating via computer(among other things…I’ll be nice) during the 7 hours a day at Baez’s office. I wonder if she had any visitors while at Baez’s office. I would loved to of been a fly on the wall of that office. hmmm
As for ‘frozen’ popsicles– Casey talked about a ‘Freeze-pop’ type frozen treat, talked about their ‘wrappers’ on the coffee table (something like that). IIRC, at one time, probably still, you’d be able to not only buy those frozen to eat right away like a Popsicle, but you could buy them in bulk at room temp, put them in your own freezer. Even if they were frozen, these seem to be described as the type of frozen treat that is completely enclosed and sealed in a tube of clear plastic. It would not matter what temperature they were at in that plastic bag of groceries. Even “IF” Tony had paid attention, put the groceries away at home (which almost certainly did not happen), the pops could be cold from being next to the frozen chicken, and if not frozen, who is to say that would raise suspicion in hot Florida weather– not a good indicator of ‘time’ from ‘home’ to ‘pick up time’. And Casey, if she had to wait a long time for Tony in the sun, could have gone into an air conditioned place. I don’t think this would be an effective way to learn much of scientific-time-line value.
Better to know who helped her push her car into the parking slot– they (if they exist) would definitely remember her and having to park the car perfectly between the lines as if driven in, and you bet Casey would tell them more than ‘I ran out of gas’… what’s the likelihood that she’d go into more detail about the car and circumstances yadda yadda yadda. They would remember her, no doubt. They would very likely have offered to go to Sam’s Club, or one of the other gas bars in the strip, maybe even had their very own cans to use to offer to the young woman. That makes sense– if there are indeed men out there who assisted her, they will very likely be found or come forward to clear themselves– and they would put their prints on the car in more than one place. Plus– there’s the Amscot cameras to help ID them! It would have taken more than a couple minutes to push the car in backwards, adjust its position.
Freeze-pops– Casey could have got them from home, frozen or not.
#154 j.g. Yea about that bag of frozen food. Makes you wander if she stopped by tthe anthonys, maybe had a run in with george about stolen gas cans in the trunk.hmmmm george did say that was 6/24 right, not say 6/27? Hmmmmmmmmm
J.G….. LOL
I believe Tony said KC had “Otter Pops” (juice in plastic sleeves), not regular popsicles. Thank goodness she wasn’t transporting 31 Flavors Ice Cream Cake ! Happy B-day from another Leo.
Have a Sparkling Week !
Lol, thanks gang for clearing up that last lingering question I had about the frozen food I kept imagining in that hot Florida sun! I just could not get it out of my mind. And yes, I bet Amscot has a recording of whatever day the car was parked there. And a lot of our questions will be answered with it.
Now help me with my understanding of no fingerprints on the backpack or what was in it?
Sparkling it is Silver’s birthday week….all together now 1,2,3….
Happy Birthday to Silver! Now Blink’s got to get another article ready just for her birthday. Remember her saying this article was the best birthday present?
Well, Blink – there you go again – with a fine presentation of top-notch information and analysis; many thanks, as always.
What a scene in that typical suburban Orlando neighborhood; heated confrontations with Casey, backyard “bar-b-clues” and plenty of sustained friction to go around. It must have been a pressure cooker.
Poor Jesse Grund. To think that his genuine concern for Caylee could be reduced to the worst sort of suspicion and inference is as out-of-order as other actions and reactions in this case, and IMO, if tried, this strategy would not find support.
There is much to re-read, which is why I always read, digest, ponder and return to repeat the process. Thanks to all for making this site truly informative, thought-provoking and a respectful source devoted to seeking justice for Caylee.
Blink, if your info is correct about the state’s recent request for documents, the info re: economics charges will be very helpful to Mn’M's civil case as that was a major sticking point for both Anthony’s in their depos, and probably added to their resistance and lawyer’s back aches and resulting successful delays in the defense of the civil case.
Begs the question, will the state be in a position to release this information to the defense BEFORE September’s next scheduled hearing and Anthony’s appearance re: deposition resistance? Will the Anthony’s delay caused success in an agreement to disclose this information to the state but that this information be withheld for a certain ‘delay’ period to the advantage of the civil defense and the Anthony’s own position of not wanting to answer certain questions in the civil case?
Perhaps Brad came to a deal so the state would agree not to disclose until at least after September, to the benefit of the defense in the ZG case.
I love reading here but I want to say…you’re all making this far more complex than is necessary.
The difference between truth and fiction is, fiction has to make sense!
I never meant to imply that jury tampering was a LEGAL ‘defense strategy’. Just putting in my opinion since a couple of posters have brought this up on this blog and the previous one. I think we all know that tampering with a jury would be illegal and nearly impossible in a high profile case such as this one.
kleat,sean krause and the anthony’s had a falling out,he outed cindy as saying casey was a sociopath,and lee got mad at him and threathened him that maybe he(sk)was invovled in the murder of caylee(dec. 2)and he was(rip) a prosecution witness.anyway i dont think zg should sanctioned from all discussion,but as you also said we’ll have to wait and see more discovery,or wait for blink’s book.BOO, did you notice casey’s,my space on which the diary of days appears has AMERICAN PYSCHO(i havent seen it) in her currently watching category,do you think she did that on purpose?http://www.docstoc.com/search/casey-anthony-case/?catfilter=1 ,page 27.
Silverspnr: Do you think Judge Strickland will prevent the prosecution from showing the tape of Casey reacting to the video of Caylee’s little body being discovered? (Heaven help us if it caused a mistrial or something even worse!)
Hi Blink: Can hardly wait to hear abouut the two new cases u r working on. Victims/familes are SO BLESSED to have you (and RR) fighting for JUSTICE! I’m so proud of you, and all of these GREAT bloggers…just amazing to see all of the love and caring for the victims. Especially the little ones, like little |Caylee. God Bless….
Mari, lol, you are soooo right! Some things in real life just defy logic, or rather we never come to know or understand the logic of them (if any). There is a tendency to start spinning wild theories when we are between document dumps, lol.
As to Jesse’s card, we can only imagine what it might say that they are trying to misconstrue, but I suppose it could say something about her belonging to him no matter what the DNA says, or that he loves her and will always consider her his daughter or something like that.
#165 susanm. American pyscho, yes I saw that and really I would not recommend that you do. Yea a movie like ap would be right up casey’ alley. And to watch a movie like that and not reporting caylee, what else is there to say about casey? Me I will stick to movies like “space balls” very funny.
How can team Baez expect for them to have the least bit credibility when this goes to trial by deviating from the sworn statement of “the nanny” did it? Wouldn’t that constitute perjury by switching to “Jesse Grund” did it? Plus, whatever happened to the “note of instructions” given to Casey to “follow” if she didn’t want “harm” to come to her family?(wow, how admirable taking the bullet for her family, be it that that would be the first time in her miserable life that she was selfless. Another thing that gets me, is, Cindy saying the nanny was real, although she never saw or spoke to her once, but is able to distinctively claim that the Zenaida Gonzalez wasn’t the right one at the deposition, saying that she wasn’t a “10″? How would Cindy know being that her own statement was she never met or heard the nanny’s voice?
The whole BS story about the “script” won’t fly either. Casey said Zanny gave her the script to follow for 31 days….how would Zanny know Cindy would find Casey in exactly 31 days?! Wouldn’t be very smart to go with that version either.
Todd, Casey said the nanny was the last one she saw her daughter with, she is charged already, not with perjury, but lying to investigators. She won’t take the stand, so no chance of perjury charges against her. If she pleads, then she’s got some explaining to do, interesting to see how she handles that, if and when. But I don’t think she will ever want to plead, not if she can stay front and center and influencing and harming everyone as much as she possibly can. That is giving her rewards each and every day.
For all those that haven’t had a chance to see casey in action !!
I was reading some instant messages between her and tony lazarro. this girl came up with one lie right after the other!! damn she was a fast quick witted liar.
http://www.docstoc.com/search/casey-anthony-case/?catfilter=1
come on now!!
who is going to believe the anthony’s anyway’s? they have no credibilility whatsoever!! they have tried to pin this crime on too many other’s since they decided to stand by their murdress of a daughter. for guilt or whatever bazaar reasoning.
First the zannie the nannie which was probably ( a zanez overdose)Casey said she didnt trust Jesse Grund( To her parents in a jail visit).
Had she not called Jesse trying to get some gas can’s from him but fortunately for him he was on the other side of town! she even went as far as going to his house. She may have been trying to set him up!!
Baez has casey !! believing that she is going to win ( beat ) these charges!! what a rude awakening she is going to have!!!
all of them for that matter. I usualy dont post much I mainly lurk and get updated. I admire the research and hard work That blink and other poster’s add here!!
I cannot wait for george and cindy’s reaction!! when they attempt to pull the same b.s they did in the deposition!!
I think cindy cant help but be tempted to do what she always does!! manage to stick her foot in her mouth(both feet)
Question……Does anyone think Cindy could have found the tiffany ring she asked Casey about,in the back yard…maybe under dirt that was disturbed.Just wondering if this is something found on July 3 2008.Also she asks who cut Caylees hair.Maybe a wad of hair was also found?????????Thoughts anyone
Kleat. At this juncture may I have your thoughts on when you think george found out the car was at amscot before it was towed? I know that you were previously digging into that. What are your thoughts at this point?
#174. Chica. Good to hear your point of view on casey. If this ever gets to the penalty phase I wander who casey will have to speak of her character in a positive way.
#175 vicki. I was just thing about the ring yesterdaym I wandered if jesse might have given casey a ring? And where that ring might be today? I have many questions about the ring cindy asked about.
Since we suspect casey’s latent prints are on the duct tape, could there be other evidence found with caylee that has not been disclosed?
Objects, probably not, I suspect the state would release anything of a direct nature with everything else, especially if it was particularly damning in the hopes that Casey’s attorney would evaluate and advise a plea. Since it seems clear that is the last thing on their mind, all the forensics will not likely be released publicly prior to trial.
B
vicki in ga, I suspect, just on my impression of Cindy’s intentions for the question, that Cindy was either searching for a reason that a ‘missing’ ring might implicate someone, say had Jesse given that ring to Casey, she’d have found a link– as if Jesse ‘took it back’. Or, maybe Cindy was just adding the fact of a missing Tiffany ring to public knowledge– they knew the videos would go public after Lee’s first visitation dates and before his second visitation. It’s all throwing out a wide net of stuff and hope that spin, if not evidence, can come from it. I think Cindy was trying to affect public opinion from her first media interview and she could grow that with her behaviour. JMHO (from what I know)
If Jesse had given the Tiffany ring to Casey, and that ring surfaced, useful if it surfaced to implicate someone.
Do you think Casey was making phone calls, texting from Baez’s cell phone and communicating via computer(among other things…I’ll be nice) during the 7 hours a day at Baez’s office. I wonder if she had any visitors while at Baez’s office. I would loved to of been a fly on the wall of that office. hmmm
OH I wonder? there are at least two people and more that know exactly what she was doing in that office and I do believe that we will hear it one way or another… but it won’t be before the trial….(dang it, if no trial, then maybe in a book?) who knows?
I am also very curious as to so many questions as we dont get half of what the LE has…. Oh I wish I could be invisible…
What Baez did not know, is that OCSO was aware of the building potential for violence between George and Casey in the Anthony home and there was a genuine concern for Tracy’s safety on behalf of Team Padilla in the Anthony home. George Anthonys’ friend from Trumball County Ohio, we will call him Trumball Jim, told George everything he needed to know about Caylee’s whereabouts was in her room down the hall, (indicating Casey in her bedroom). George had it out with Casey demanding she tell him what she knew, and Jim had to pull George and Casey apart. Tim Miller, founder of Texas Equusearch, arrived shortly thereafter and was met at the door by Jim, with that episode being recounted to him as the first interface he had with anyone in the Anthony camp in that home.
I am wondering if Trumball Jim is on the states witness list and Tim Miller? I also don’t know why this has not been discussed and we have seen no statements to this incident at all? hmmmm
Remember Nancy, there are broad exclusions to the Sunshine Law as it relates to discovery in a criminal trial. Tim would not be a witness as it would be excluded on the basis of hearsay. Personally, I think there are other witnesses in that house that may have heard/witnessed the exchange as well.
B
Just can’t find a superlative that adequately describes how good this is. Thank you thank you thank you.
PS sorry for my lack of knowledge/imagination but what does IIRC signify?
Sorry, My Bad, IIRC = If I Recall Correctly.
B
vicki, interesting. Perhaps cindy found a lock of hair that kc clipped to keep as a memento? I have a friend who does that with her deceased pets (cats and horses) prior to burial. Or maybe cindy was hinting that kc should finger caylee’s hairdresser a possible suspect, just as a way to obfuscate and throw in a red herring. (but who knows if caylee even had a hairdresser—prolly not)
vicki #175
The haircut question came because a hairdresser said that caylee had some bruises, i believe it was caseys hairdresser but kids fall and get bruises all the time so no big deal with that
the tiffany ring idea is interesting tho but that is possibly because “Jeff” supposedly gave the ring to her and nothing ever panned out with all of caseys mistruths so cindy wanted to know more about him.
#170-171-Todd in Tulsa and Shaye,
I also never understood what Cindy or Casey were thinking when it came to the “script” she was to follow. First of all, it shows that Casey is definitely not a very efficient liar, and as much as Cindy has tried to lie throughout this ordeal, you’d think she would have called Casey on that one immediately. I don’t think right at the beginning Cindy knew anything, other than something was really wrong. However, even at that point, you would think she would have said to Casey that the script she was following didn’t make any sense. She was supposedly given a script to follow for 31 days, but what if she hadn’t found Casey until 2 days later? Would it then have been a script for 33 days? Another thing I always wondered about was how they all tried so hard to cover for her, including Casey trying to cover for herself, BUT, none of them took into consideration that when LE got Casey, had her out riding around in the car that first night, looking for places Caylee might be……it was well after midnight. Therefore, the 31 days was over. So, had I been the one riding around with her on one of her wild goose chases that night, believe me, I’d have made mention of that fact for sure. “Hey, we understand the script you had to follow for 31 days, but since we picked you up from your parents’ home earlier, the time is now 2:00am. Thank God!!!! Time’s up, you can tell us EVERYTHING NOW, as you no longer have to follow the script because the 31 days is officially over.”
I was wondering the same thing about Baez, why in the world he let her continue on with that ridiculous story, and how he was dumb enough not to realize the 31 days had passed, not to mention it was quite the coincidence that the script was the exact amount of days it took Cindy to find Casey. Yet another ignorant lie on their part. I digress, asking that Baez say or do anything intelligent would be like asking Nejame to go to the Baez School of Law. Not happening!
Oh, btw, while everyone has voiced their pick for favorite lawyer, I haven’t seen mine mentioned, luckily, makes it easier to catch him…ha!! I’ll take Bill Schaeffer, (sp) the lawyer who does the analysis for Kathi Belich on wftv sometimes. I didn’t even know I like bald headed men. LOL…. Ohhhh the intelligence just flows from that bald head, not to mention such a nice voice. Though I do lovveeee Mark Nejame as well. Could listen to that fountain of knowledge and confidence all day long, mmmhmm, sure could!!!
Hey Y’all=)
I am indeed on vacation to today is indeed my 43rd birthday (JUUUU-LY 28th, 7:41 a.m. to be exact) -and am having the time of my life, whole-heartedly enjoying one of my favorite death-defying hobbies: extreme downhill/freeride mountain biking!! woooohoooooooo! 43 going on 16!! lol!!
My husband’s mistake??
He brought the LAPTOP with us!! (how fitting;)
I promised him I would only take a quick peep today, so I will (try to) limit my post (having said that;)
Dear, dear Lily-
I feel badly that my post on the jury tampering issue was taken that way by YOU=( So sorry if I wasn’t clear there. In fact, IIRC, you were the one who stated that you did NOT believe this was even a remote issue for consideration. I meant to address those who were actually suggesting that it could be a “strategy”. And I hope my post was taken by ALL in the vein it was intended, which was purely as general information (and not at all as defensive of Baez, in particular).
Blink
HERE WE GO on the law of search and seizure!!
You bring up what is known as the PLAIN VIEW DOCTRINE.
Yes. That is, indeed, one exception to the Fourth Amendment bar against unreasonable search and seizure. However, it is a very narrowly carved out exception, and has limits which are more clear than other exceptions which have been carved out by the courts.
The “Plain View Doctrine” is the basis for allowing certain evidence, seized by the police, without consent AND without a warrant, to be admitted into evidence AT TRIAL.
This exception is (generally)limited to items such as CONTRABAND (e.g a see-through bag of what is, or at least appears to be, illegal drugs; a gun, etc).
In general, a laptop does not fall within the definition of CONTRABAND.
People have a great expectation of privacy in items such as cell phones/computers/etc (almost in the same way that people have an expectation of privacy in their own home).
(you also wondered whether she abandoned it by leaving it at Tony’s apartment- without having done the legal research to compare other cases on point? i would just say this: probably not- she was living at Tony’s for a while and remember what she said as Cindy was marching her out the door? she intended to return– this is also evidenced by the fact that she left other personal items there-again-not sure, but that’s my guess)
The police cannot just seize/search items so far afield of what traditionally has fallen within the purview of the “Plain View” exception, that they end up entirely disregarding the mandate of the rule itself, which (let us not forget) is based in the U.S. Constitution.
In other words, the Plain View Doctrine is not used by LE to LIMIT our constitutional rights, but rather for the prosecution to argue to the judge why evidence that was (potentially illegally) seized/searched should not be held INADMISSIBLE at TRIAL.
It is not a rule about the propriety of police conduct. It is a law about whether evidence that was seized -without consent/without a warrant-can be introduced against a defendant at trial.
How does that matter??
Well-
If the police (illegally) seized/seached that laptop-and found evidence of her guilt??
WOW. (Could be a)MAJOR problem.
Why??
Well, –and this is a well known rule–
A SEARCH/SEIZURE CANNOT BE JUSTIFIED SIMPLY BY WHAT EVIDENCE IT TURNS UP. IF THE SEARCH/SEIZURE WAS ILLEGAL TO BEGIN WITH, THE PRODUCTS OF THAT SEARCH/SEIZURE ARE INADMISSIBLE IN EVIDENCE AT TRIAL, NO MATTER HOW INCRIMINATING THEY MAY BE.
In this instance, not only would evidence of what was ON the laptop be INADMISSIBLE against Casey at trial, but all evidence garnered by police/the state against Casey when STEMMED from whatever they learned from the (illegal seizure of the) laptop would likewise be INADMISSIBLE against her AT TRIAL based upon another doctrine of search and seizure law known as the “FRUIT OF THE POISONOUS TREE”.
The laptop would be the “POISONOUS TREE”, and the evidence which stemmed from it would be it’s (inadmissible) “FRUIT”.
I have to add this final caveat-
This is an abstract discussion. We simply do not know enough of the important facts to properly analyze the Fourth Amendment issues concerning the laptop at this point.
From a practical standpoint, let’s consider the complexity of the case facing the police on the evening of July 15th.
911 calls –several within a relatively short period of time by the same reporter (CINDY), who FAILED TO MENTION a “missing child”/”kidnapping” until officers were already on route to Hopespring to respond to her earlier call about a “stolen car” ONLY.
31 days- a suspicious amount of time that the child had been reported as “missing”/”kidnapped”–NO DOUBT ABOUT IT, but also, a young mother surrounded by family, who all provided statements which supported/mimicked information in the young mother’s statement
YES. There was something amiss. But WHAT??? LE cannot just GUESS. They must take the statements, and take reasonable investigative steps from there.
It takes time to separate family members, have them provide oral statements which are then reduced to written statements they can sign. It takes time to get the proper personnel on the scene, and for those officers/detectives to determine the best route to take from that point on, the MAIN GOAL of which was to try to LOCATE CAYLEE–and not to build a criminal case against anyone (though that goal certainly developed as their lawful investigation proceeded).
Etc, etc, etc
We don’t know for certain, because we don’t have all the facts, but it seems to me that the police were given CONSENT to go to Tony’s to get the CELL PHONE only.
HINDSIGHT IS 20/20 (but even with hindsight, we cannot go back and LEGALLY justify the otherwise illegal seizure of the laptop without CONSENT or a WARRANT).
Based upon what this ENTIRE family was reporting in their statements that night, A REASONABLE LE OFFICER might REASONABLY conclude that the child was taken by a caregiver/nanny that the family knew.
The family was consenting to other searches/apparently consented to LE retrieving the CELL PHONE from Tony’s apartment.
We just don’t know what, if anything, was said about that laptop.
What we do know, based on the statements alone, is that NOT ONE of the other Anthonys (Cindy/George/Lee) even SUGGESTED TO LE that they had ANY SUSPICION about the EXISTENCE OF the “nanny”/”Zenaida” on the evening of July 15, 2008.
Let’s all stop and think about that for a minute.
NOT ONE OF THEM pulled an officer aside and said, THIS ZANNY THE NANNY THING MAKES NO SENSE TO ME/TO US.
George may have said he thought his daughter was “holding back”.. but that is a far cry from what he could have (SHOULD HAVE) said.
They all knew Casey told the police that she was CURRENTLY EMPLOYED at UNIVERSAL, and yet…
NOT ONE OF THE OTHER FAMILY MEMBERS SUGGESTED TO LE THAT THIS MIGHT BE TOTALLY FABRICATED/FALSE.
NOT ONE OF THEM.
They all knew that Casey had been LYING about where she had been during the 31 days.. and yet?
NOT ONE OF THEM TOLD THIS TO LE on the night that Caylee was FINALLY reported as “missing”.
NOT ONE OF THEM.
They ALL knew SPECIFIC, VERIFIABLE things that would have supported that natural suspicion about Casey’s story, and yet… they didn’t mention them.
What position did that leave LE in that night???
Their own suspicions.
They had to start with what Casey told them and go from there. It takes time to develop sufficient facts to support a finding of PROBABLE CAUSE/to get a search warrant. (and notice how specific the warrants are as to what items may be searched/seized).
Other than their own subjective beliefs, it is my opinion, based on the facts that we DO know, that LE could not properly/legally justify the seizing/searching of the laptop that evening.
Yes–we’d all love to know what was on that laptop, but I can bet you that no one here would bet ME that it contained any evidence of “ZANNY”‘s PHONE NUMBER or EMAIL ADDRESS or communications, etc
We all know what it would have shown on that note, to wit:
NO EVIDENCE OF ANY CONTACT WITH “ZANNY”, so in the end, no potential leads to a LIVE Caylee were there anyway. (same as her cell phone)
AND–
We also know that just crashing the computer does not destroy what was “written” on its hard drive. You can bet that what was found on the laptop, legally, will be part of evidence at trial.
On a final note of American pride–
Just as we value Freedom of Speech, Freedom of the Press, Freedom of Religion, etc etc etc.. we MUST also value our right to be free of unreasonable search and seizure.
Am glad you brought this up, Blink (sort of;), because as I originally stated, this is a very interesting area of law, and I wholly encourage folks to read up about it on their own time.
There are other interesting exceptions (which I do not believe apply here) that people may wish to read about– for example, “HOT PURSUIT” or “EXIGENT CIRSUMSTANCES”.
I would prefer to STAY off of this little soap box though!
Sorry for the blabbing, Blink.
I hope it goes without saying to one and all that I have nothing be the utmost respect and admiration for BLINK, and it is only because of her keen insight that respectful reporting that I originally posted here to begin with, but it is both Blink and many others here that keep me coming back.
I’ll have to catch up on the rest of the discussion in a few days!
Back to my VACATION!!
A Very, Very Happy Birthday to you Silverspnr!
Outstanding Argument, as I expected, thus why I posed the question. I expect this information will be helpful to readers in many cases. Thanks for taking the time on your well deserved vacation and wear a helmet
B
Vicki in ga…..I think you are a very smart girl. I think that is very possible.
Happy 43rd silverspnr!!! I hopr you enjoy YOUR day! &hearts
1 more try ;&hearts ( it’s supposed to be a heart) if not I need more lessons
Happy Birthday, Silverspnr!! We got the present from YOU this morning!! Wonderful article/post!
(we should frame that and put it up front and center– in ‘the best of the best blink’ reader comments ever’!!)
The investigators on the night of July 15th, could have had three possible parties to the laptop re: claims of search privacy issues, Cindy the owner, Casey the user/borrower, and Casey’s employer, “Universal”.
How is the ‘wallet’ search and seizure of items that may incriminate Casey, such as the white document seized by the hand of the officer, going to play out? If that is a fake ID, or stolen ID, or even a legitimate document that leads somewhere to be used against Casey, was THAT seizure legitimate? Was the fact that a third party, Cindy, was taking items and pocketing them (money, perhaps stolen money as Cindy knew per George’s version), a legitimate reason for the officer to take control of that ‘white document’?
HA! Silver, I almost put in my post yesterday that you would be “peeking”…had a feeling you were mountain biking,but then thought you might be “roughing” it and not hit a wifi spot. I am lucky enough to live in an area of the mountains (1.5 hrs from Atlanta) that bikers love. Happy birthday and happy riding! And your post was an added bonus for me to find this AM!
Ms.Lyons seems she wants to have her double-decker cake and eat it too. She wants to put the trial off because her excuse is “she has a class to teach”. Then she uses the excuse of “she needs time to prepare for the murder trial”, so she wants to delay the fraud case. I say if she was truthful in her statements and the murder trial was so important and of top priority, then put the teaching off and concentrate on what is of importance. So, STOP MS.LYONS MANIPULATING JUSTICE FOR YOUR OWN GAIN
Todd, may be very true, but the state and Judge Strickland don’t want this to be reversed and have to start all over again so being very cautious. Of course, they can’t possibly be ready for October, or even January. But am with you all the way on the civil case, but every turn will be a new way to ‘delay delay delay’. I hope that Judge Rodriguez takes control of the situation and puts an end to the obvious game playing by the Anthony’s.
If the police actually have Crasey’s fingerprint on that ducttape that was found on Caylee’s mouth, Baez is completely incompetent not suggesting to Casey to confess and hope for Life with no parole, ofcourse, in Casey’s sociopathic world, she’s probably convinced herself that she truly will be found not guilty. I would think that since this is a nationally known case, that she would be hoping for prison instead of being found not guilty, because once she’s out in public, she’ll have to be looking over her shoulder non-stop, becuase there will definitely be someone waiting for her
One other sticking point of the Amscot Casey car parking — there is a discrepancy between Tony’s version of how the car was parked and Johnson’s tow driver. One says the car was askew, the other, the car neatly parked between the lines. I think it’s time to wait to learn more on this one– were both versions right? (ie: car moved/re-positioned between 27th and 30th and if so, who moved it?– why would Casey care if the car was askew. Who would care that a car be neatly parked– someone with a key who was a car-neatnik??? Someone who knew how to park cars in a lot tightly and neatly? That’s wild speculation of course. And how would the car be moved if it were completely out of gas, even a few feet forward and back without assistance to push it?)
From the arial photos of Amscot and the streets, what was Cindy’s actual route to work, she described a turn lane– anyone actually drive that and see if the parked white car would be in the line of sight for Cindy, either going to or from work during those busy times of day?
Why is LE being so soft towards Casey and all the Anthony’s? If it’s to prove that Casey truly doesn’t care, and playing “buddy buddy” with her to see her reactions, as in those interrogation tapes where she’s smacking her gum, asking the detective if there were cameras in the room, and the detective responding with a laid back “I have no freakin’ idea”. Now if that was calculated to expose Casey’s true thoughts and reaction, fine. But if they were playing “softball” and playing loosy-goosey with her because she was a waif and didn’t have the likes of Aileen Wuernos, then that is sickening and they need to be put on administrative leave
I heart silverspnr ! Thank you for your insightful posts, & Happy 43rd Birthday, Leo!! (My mother’s 75th birthday was the 27th – with 54 years in nursing & still going strong, & is an avid outdoorswoman & griller-extraordinaire! One of her other daughter’s a prosecutor who’s avocation involves jumping out of airplanes wearing a ‘shute – what is it about law & daredevils???)