Caylee/Casey Anthony Case: Andrea Lyon Shows Her Thought Bubble
Orlando, FL– At a Defense Attorney Peer Lecture in Orlando, Florida last year, the self appointed “Angel of Death Row” lead defense attorney in the case against Casey Anthony for the murder of her daughter Caylee Marie, shows the world her thought bubble, courtesy of Bill Scheaffer, Legal analyst for WFTV.
It is unclear how Mr. Scheaffer attained the recorded audio which has since been removed from the WFTV site, but what is clear is Ms. Lyon knew her segment was being recorded.
..My Client is human, it’s the jury I’m worried about..” ..Sometimes ugly is presiding… or do you have really great judges in Florida?.. “I have a case right now where both the crime and my clients confession are on on videotape.. I just think that’s unfair.. I mean, one or the other, but both?..
I wonder if anyone has asked Alton Logan what he thinks about it?
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145 Comment by suz
one more to add to your list
i) she meets her Maker and spends eternity in Hell
I can sleep knowing that.
I am a firm believer in any and all punishments a jury hands down, if it is death the accused should die, not after numerous appeals, they should die then and there like back in the olden days. If it is life it should be just that LIFE not 20 years LIFE.
I had no prolem with Scott Petersons Death sentence, but, I don’t want to see Casey get out of this that easy, I want her to rot in her cell just like Caylee rotted in that swamp, the bugs that devoure Casey will be the roaches in her cell and flies buzzin around her inside that jail (immates)and each slam of the heavy metal doors will represent the the binding tape stretched across that innocent childs head.
suz, #141 — Casey’s statements regarding her mental state might be taken seriously, EXCEPT for the fact that everything she does and says seems to have such drama. Who among us hasn’t at some time reached a point of mounting stress and expressed that we just couldn’t take anymore. When I’ve been there, it hasn’t meant I needed to be committed — it just meant I needed a break. Given Casey’s propensity to lie and embellish, I truly doubt that she was in as bad a state as she indicated to her friends. She may have been momentarily stressed and “frushtrated” but she certainly recovered rather quickly. I guess I’m just not willing to give her that. I can’t read her mind, even if I wanted to. All I can do is observe her actions, and her actions do not portray a mother who momentarily snapped, realizes she made a bed mistake, and is sorry or remorseful.
Marcy, it’s a fair question, but I don’t know the answer to how mothers who snap act afterwards—that aspect wasn’t covered in the articles I read on the subject, so I don’t know if they feel remorse or if they are so crazy they just go on like normal, like casey. Hmmm. I’ll see if I can find any info.
I mean, I ask this alot because to me it always comes back to this—we all do know that casey’s crazy, right? yes, i know, not the kind of crazy that the court would recognize and that would absolve her from culpability—she was aware of right and wrong, tried to cover up the crime—-but we all do realize that she’s basically nuts in some way, shape, or form, don’t we? I’m not saying it makes her innocent, but I think we often look at her and try to apply logic to her actions, but you really can’t because she is just partially nutso, to use the clinical term.
dee, thank you, I had forgotten the afterlife, lol.
Marcy, i think casey will actually have access to men in prison, especially if she can lose some of that weight she’s put on or keeps from gaining too much more. I mean, they aren’t supposed to, but it just happens all the time—sex and drugs and all kinds of stuff that ought not to happen behind bars. Unless there is not one single, solitary male in the facility—which would be rare as the majority of guards are male (for instance, in 2005 70% of guards in women’s prisons were male)—- I imagine she can find a willing partner if she wants one.
Don’t forget, Maslow’s hierarchy of needs lists sex among the most basic of human needs along with food, water, sleep and excretion — it’s THAT fundamental to human existence. (The next level is safety and security, and then sex shows up again on the third level with love and intimacy). Of course, that particular urge can be sublimated (perhaps she will throw herself into art, creation, study—ha! but, ok, it could happen). But I guess we can expect that a little fooling around is to be expected, even when serving LWOP, or awaiting one’s execution.
145Comment by Marcy — November 29, 2009 @ 12:25 pm
“Dee, #143: I don’t believe for a moment that Casey would sit in her prison cell remembering what she did to her baby, should she get LWOP. As you stated in the end of your post, she will be thinking only of herself, as usual. But that’s good ~ at least she will live out a lot of years (probably) with no parties to go to, no men to bed, no movies, etc. Casey will just be someone else’s little bitch in the nasty prison sexual hierarchy. And the outside world will have long forgotten about her. Good.
Good.”
I like this and can deal with this…let her rot, watcing her friends grow old watch them succeed, watch them move forward, watch Lee have kids and grandparents that love them (stretching with that statement) all the while she sits and does nothing but turn gray!
love it, let her fester…….that will drive her more crazy then she already is!
that is justice as far as I am concerned let this selfish BIOTCH feel IT! Feel it FOREVER!
Blink, you are right. It’s what Lyons and crew want, us to be dirverted, or divided from the main issue, of her client and the case of her baby’s death.
Smoke and mirrors my friend.
Not to minimize the social impact on the overall issue. As far as Caylee is concerned, I don’t care that. I know that may be irresponsible and for that I apologize. I just cannot stomach how elusive dignity and justice have been for this cherub. Keeps me up at night. I stand with her.
B
Comment#4__ I DON’T UNDER STAND WHY SHE IS STILL ALLOWED TO TEACH AND PRACTICE LAW.THIS IS JUST ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF HOW BROKEN OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM IS. INSTEAD OF THE GOVERNMENT WORRYING ABOUT LEGALIZING 12 MILLION+ ILLEGAL ALIENS, THEY NEED TO BE WORKING ON THE JUSTICE SYSTEM.IT MAKES NO SENSE FOR THINGS SUCH AS WHAT THIS WOMAN DID,TO BE ALLOWED IN THIS COUNTRY AND SHE GOT AWAY WITH IT.
CHAD#93__ I’M WITH YOU ON THAT ONE,I KNOW THAT THE ANTHONYS HAVE BEEN SELLING CAYLEE’S LIKENESS IN ORDER TO MAKE MONEY FOR THEMSELVES AS WELL AS TO PAY CASEY’S DEFENSE. BUT,HOW MANY MORE PHOTOS AND VIDEOS CAN THEY HAVE AND ALSO,WHY WOULD ANYBODY WANT TO PAY FOR THESE WHEN THEY ARE ALL OVER YOU TUBE.I BELIEVE THESE FOLKS HAVE A BOOK DEAL OR A MOVIE DEAL IN THE WORKS. AND IF THEY DO,THEY OUGHT TO BE ASHAMED OF THEMSELVES.IF THIS IS THE CASE, I WILL NOT PARTAKE OF EITHER ONE.
#153 Steadychick… Casey may have been “frushtrated” but I hope her friends didn’t “misconshtrue” what she was telling them! LOL
suz
I just read “My daughter Susan Smith” by Linda H. Russell. I thought this was a great book. It came from Susan’s mom’s expereiences of loosing 2 grandchildren. No one thought that Susan would harm her children.. she thought about harming herself constantly. Her mother describes the reality of what it was like to realize your own child killed her 2 beautiful children and how to go on after the fact. — I know this is very different from the Casey case but it does give insight into mental illness and what can happen if it is not treated. I felt sucked into this book and had so much empathy for Susan and her family.
This is a rotten case, actually, to use to further the fight against the death penalty. Lyons is so clearly attached merely for the publicity and not for any real point of law. Casey Anthony made me glad that FL does have it. The problem is not with the Casey’s of the world, who will get a trial almost ridiculously fair. Her dream team will waste millions of dollars and great amounts of time that many other defendents do not receive. These neglected defendents may receive such inadequate representation and trials that the innocent could be found guilty. That is the inherent fault of the system: if murder is wrong, who accepts responsibility when an innocent is put to death? Such a wrong cannot be righted, ever.
I want Casey to be found guilty and sentenced to death as a response to her crime. I want her to know how despicable the rest of us find her. She didn’t care for Caylee but she does care about being seen as a victim herself, so the death penalty is the ultimate expression of society’s rightful anger. No, Casey: you are not too cute to face responsibility for murder. Mommy isn’t going to get you off this one.
#155 – Suz – Women behind bars will develope homosexual tendencies after awhile, even though they don’t “go that way” on the outside. If there is no access to men for sexual gratification for a female inmate – especially one that is doing LwOP, then women start to look pretty good. The need for such things as love and sex is so strong, and with women, “nesting” and setting up a family scenario is very powerful. For many, when they are released, and return to life on the outside again, they revert back to whatever sexual preferences they had before they were incarcerated. Human nature I guess – and survival.
sue, girl on girl sex behind bars is pretty much a given, i guess, but i’m 100% sure casey will be able to find male companionship as well. guaranteed.
Kind of depends on one’s attitude, but you can have a really fulfilling life in prison. Victor Frankl found his time in the concentration camp to be enriching and empowering, and I recall a Chinese prisoner who felt that his many years in prison were the best years of his life. Resiliency of the human spirit, I reckon. Who knows how casey will take life in prison. She half lives in a dream world anyway, so perhaps she will create a nice story for herself.
soulsister, I haven’t read that book but can imagine i would have the same reaction. I reckon we would have empathy for just about anyone if we really knew their whole story, even the easy-to-hate casey.
steadychick, who knows the truth, but I’m still thinking she snapped. I’m not seeing the premeditation some see. And since i think—rather, since we all probably know she is not normal—nothing she did post mortem should be all that surprising, even when it makes no sense.
I am not a proponent of the death penalty. I believe that the potential for error is just too great. However, it is upsetting that any state has to pay 30 times in taxpayer money to maintain a prisoner than it pays to educate a child.
Which leads me to the other disturbing aspect of this case. I don’t give a rat’s patootie what Casey’s hierarchical needs are because she didn’t concern herself with Caylee’s needs when she threw her in the trunk. My concern is the precedents that are being established with this case. The grandparents selling Caylee’s images to fund their daughter’s defense and the media involvement is very upsetting. Every witness becoming a potential suspect is revolting. Destroying reputations is commonplace in this case. The TES searchers privacy being invaded for some bogus defense is immoral.
Casey should have claimed it was an accident and received her 20 year sentence in hopes of an early release before the 31 days had lapsed. She didn’t, becasue she has never been held accountable for her behavior. The mental illness defense is not appropriate because Casey can differentiate between right and wrong. (I still wonder about Cindy and her mental health issues.) The people that continue to enable Casey in this horrific crime are also guilty of criminal activity.
How can Andrea Lyin’ feel compelled to defend people on Death Row without any reservations about a murdered 2 year old in unfathomable is beyond me. Every day that passes makes me more disgusted with Casey, her family and her defense team. I think the same is true of the potential jurors.
“How can Andrea Lyin’ feel compelled to defend people on Death Row without any reservations about a murdered 2 year old is unfathomable and beyond me”
Kleat, doesn’t it serve Ms. Lyon better if Casey is NOT found not guilty? If that’s true, then you could argue that she won’t be trying very hard to get casey off of anything other than the DP—so I guess you should be glad if she is co-opting the case for her own devices?
suz, that’s one excellent point, and taking it a step further, whose interests on the side of the defense SHOULD a case such as this, serve? Only the client, but is that what has been, and is, happening with the high public/media profile of this particular case?
Is the ’cause’ the underlying purpose, or the client, the only purpose of Ms. Lyon’s participation.
suz, could it be that the evidence of premeditation is really what the defense is seeking in their recent motion for the state to reveal aggravating facts for the dp? The defense already knows the age of the child, the fact that the child was in her mother’s care and control when she went missing, that the child was dependent upon her mother (as Cindy said, Caylee was Casey’s child, she didn’t need to keep track of where they were in those missing days, nor did she have the right). They also already know about the duct tape but they don’t know what the state might know about ‘when’, and they don’t know the narrowed timeframe of death or theory of ‘how’.
What else does the defense want revealed? Everything else that the state will use as ‘aggravating’ circumstances. Things that won’t come out until trial otherwise.
Suz,you asked, ‘Some possible choices for what exactly = justice for Caylee in your mind’
To me, I feel Casey forfeited the right, if not to life (and I don’t object to that, personally), but for those who are against the death penalty, she has at the least forfeited the right to live in society. Ever. The closest thing to justice we can achieve, she is prevented from bearing more children who will suffer due to her sociopathic tendencies, having the opportunity to repeat her same crime but with more expertise, and inflicting harm to all the others she would become involved with. Sociopathic people leave long lines of damaged lives behind them and enact a terrible toll on society. It is our responsibility to prevent this. The best way to honor Caylee at this point is to make sure there is no second Caylee.
As far as a personal desire to see Casey suffer, I have none. It serves no purpose that I can see. If being removed from society causes her suffering, then so be it, but that is not the purpose in my mind, the purpose is to prevent further damage. Casey is not normal and will not feel the feelings normal people would expect from the situation anyways. She will merely assess the situation she finds herself in and go on without looking back.
As far as whether I fear Casey may walk… strange things happen in our justice system… we just lost 4 police officers at the hands of a man who was once sentenced to 95 years for a brutal crime. I don’t know what to expect anymore, things don’t make much sense to a simple person like me.
bluewillow, should Casey be set free, yes, propagation is a concern, but also, even if she never has another child, she could be in control of a partner’s child, and that child too, could become a victim at some level of neglect, or worse.
bluewillow, what a thoughtful, measured response. i totally appreciate your point of view, thank you.
kleat, great point. yes indeedy, they are probably fishing for something, aren’t they?
You’all still standing firm against the death penalty. Just read what that guy did to his family on Thanksgiving. Not only the beautiful twins (one pregnant) but the beautiful little girl. She was sleeping. He shot her in the head, then the heart and in all I think they said six times.
You want to house and feed this guy for the rest of his life? Sorry, I don’t. We have DNA now and other more popular ways to prove crimes and criminals. If we make a mistake or two, I’m willing to live with that. I don’t want to try to “figure him out”. I want him gone. ASAP!
Shoot, we haven’t even caught him yet.
Blinkers
some of the pics casey took! Rubbing and kissin other girls
only prove that she can easily go that way
A true cameleon !!
boz, lol, no offense intended at all, but you are a perfect example of the type of ‘killer’ juror that Lyon was talking about. perfect!
I know I am simpleton…but this is plethora of stupidity.
“Anthony’s defense argued in their motion that Florida’s capital-sentencing procedure “violates the notice and jury trial rights guaranteed by the Sixth and Fourteenth Amendments to the United States Constitution.”
In another motion, the defense is asking that a judge order state prosecutors to detail the aggravating circumstances they think exists in the case.
Lyon, a nationally-known death penalty expert, and Baez stated the first-degree murder indictment against Anthony is vague and doesn’t give any insight as to how or when prosecutors think Anthony’s 2-year-old daughter Caylee was killed.
The defense said the prosecution’s decision to seek the death penalty is a “bad-faith tactic to put pressure on the defendant.”
“It is Miss Anthony’s position that her due process right to a fair trial requires the prosecution to provide her with notice of aggravating circumstances it will attempt to prove,” the motion said.
The defense asks that the court require prosecutors to provide them with what aggravating circumstances they will attempt to prove.
“Such notice would enable Miss Anthony to fully prepare for the charges against her, and would help to ensure the fairness of her trial,” the motion said.
So in other words. “Give us all the information so we can pick it apart and destroy it, and be able to frame someone else.”
Sick!
Relieved to hear that they found the little boy that was kidnapped in Brevard county. Apparently the Coast Guard found him with his father on a boat. (Snark alert) Wonder if C&G were out on their little boat looking for him. NOT.
I am re-listening to casey’s interview with detectives on July 16,2008. My good grief. The lies are outrageous! No emotion. Almost, like how dare you question my lies.
Scary feeling. Poor Caylee never had a chance.
Joan, that little boy is so lucky– was he on a one-way trip? Or has this father been unjustly accused of child abuse– not the way to handle that, but it’s not about the father or the mother.
Randie (this is not really directed at you, of course), put yourself in the shoes of the accused for a moment. You stand accused of a heinous crime. Public opinion is 1000 to 1 or more against you before the trial has even begun. The state is seeking to put you to death. They claim they have something on you that warrants the DP. Wouldn’t you want your lawyer to find out what the state thinks it has on you that is DP-worthy, so he or she can challenge it in an attempt to at least spare your life?
Same with the defense having news conferences or using the media. Everyone howls like they have been stung by a billion bees the second anyone on the defense opens their pie hole on tv, but practically no one bats an eye when anti-casey stuff (like her reaction to the discovery of the body) are wrongfully leaked.
yes yes, casey put brought this on herself, etc. etc. But still…people should get a fair trial and an adequate defense, right?
I know that as this case drags on we tend to get more aggressive with our comments, and theories. That being said, I’ve noticed more and more comments about Casey having quantified and multiple personality/mental disorders, which she does not(she has been tested), as in sociopath, etc. Below, for simplicity, I’ve used the ever usefull Wikipedia as a guide to what Casey most likely falls under, a Narcissistic personality disorder, which is not a mental disease or defect, suitable for a defense. I feel this is an important difference that all involved in the case remember.
I’ve also read in several comments, that if Casey is found not guilty, the “anti christ” will be released and the world as we know it will cease to exist. Really? This case is just one of hundreds, in Florida alone, of missing and murdered children. Its international media attention has brought the issue, and the Anthony’s to the forefront, but in no way is the anti-christ or God involved, and before I get blasted for that, keep in mind that God gave man free will, if He was involved in our world, Caylee would still be alive. He has no more to do with this murder than you or I, it rest solely on the shoulders of the person who took Caylee’s life, which evidence points to Casey, who has yet had a trail, and is presumed innocent.
Although I find most of her defense team’s actions dispicable, and some hopefully illegal, I would hope that we would want anyone facing charges as severe as Casey’s to have the best possible defense. Too many innocent people have spent years in prison based on incorrect witness ID’s, illegal police work, and just plain bad luck. Our system is so imperfect that it needs the most rigorous lawyers to defend the accused to even slightly balance Lady Justices weights.
Although I have also been one to spread what juicy gossip, and evidence I’ve heard living in Orlando, with the best of you, I think that this case and Blink’s site have become so important that we need to remember who may come here to read. What that might do to jury selection, and always, who the victim was, Caylee Marie Anthony, and what all the rumors and bloodlust could be doing to a child’s memory who only loved and wanted love. Its easy to say justice for Caylee, but to compound the evidence into diagnosis and conjecture that isn’t there is more damaging than contributable.
I sincerely don’t mean to offend anyone, and maybe I need to take a break from reading here. It just seems that in many ways the original design of the site has been forgotten. Jobs (defense)and (prosection), even though we don’t understand or approve, are being done because they have to be. Guilty or not, Casey should receive a DP worthy defense.
Also, we don’t know what is going on in her mind, we probably will never know what nightmares she has, what regret she swallows done every day, how impacted she is, and in what state of reality her narcissistic self will allow her to go, surely not to sentencing and possibly death. But even Casey must be beginning to see the path she began last June, and where it is taking her. I believe she won’t face what she has done until all her appeals are over, she has spent years in jail, and finally has nothing else but her demons to deal with, not the celebrity attention she is currently basking in.
This is a truelly horrible family tragedy that began the first time little Casey did something wrong, got her little “talkin to” and then when she repeated the wrong doing, threw her tantrum and took control of that household.
Blink I apologize for the length, I just felt compelled, and for those interested in my psychologist training’s view on Casey’s personality, enjoy the reading below:
Narcissistic personality disorder
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Narcissistic personality disorder
classification and external resources
ICD-10 F60.8
ICD-9 301.81
MeSH D010554
See also: Narcissism and Malignant narcissism
Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) is a personality disorder defined by the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, the diagnostic classification system used in the United States, as “a pervasive pattern of grandiosity, need for admiration, and a lack of empathy.”[1]
The narcissist is described as being excessively preoccupied with issues of personal adequacy, power, and prestige.[2] Narcissistic personality disorder is closely linked to self-centeredness. It is also colloquially referred to as the god complex.[citation needed]
Diagnostic criteria (DSM-IV-TR = 301.81)
The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders fourth edition, DSM IV-TR, a widely used manual for diagnosing mental disorders, defines narcissistic personality disorder (in Axis II Cluster B) as:[1]
A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:
has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
believes that he or she is “special” and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
requires excessive admiration
has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
is often envious of others or believes others are envious of him or her
shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes
It is also a requirement of DSM-IV that a diagnosis of any specific personality disorder also satisfies a set of general personality disorder criteria.
Millon’s variations
Theodore Millon identified five variations of narcissist:[2]. Any individual narcissist may exhibit none or one of the following:
unprincipled narcissist – including antisocial features. A charlatan – is a fraudulent, exploitative, deceptive and unscrupulous individual.
amorous narcissist – including histrionic features. The Don Juan or Casanova of our times – is erotic, exhibitionist.
compensatory narcissist – including negativistic (passive-aggressive), avoidant features.
elitist narcissist – variant of pure pattern. Corresponds to Wilhelm Reich’s “phallic narcissistic” personality type.
fanatic type – including paranoid features. A severely narcissistically wounded individual, usually with major paranoid tendencies who holds onto an illusion of omnipotence. These people are fighting the reality of their insignificance and lost value and are trying to re-establish their self-esteem through grandiose fantasies and self-reinforcement. When unable to gain recognition of support from others, they take on the role of a heroic or worshipped person with a grandiose mission.
The etiology of this disorder is unknown, according to Groopman and Cooper. However, they list the following factors identified by various researchers as possible factors.[8]
An oversensitive temperament at birth
Overindulgence and overvaluation by parents
Valued by parents as a means to regulate their own self-esteem
Excessive admiration that is never balanced with realistic feedback
Unpredictable or unreliable caregiving from parents
Severe emotional abuse in childhood
Being praised for perceived exceptional looks or talents by adults
Excessive praise for good behaviors or excessive criticism for poor behaviors in childhood
Some narcissistic traits are common and a normal developmental phase. When these traits are compounded by a failure of the interpersonal environment and continue into adulthood they may intensify to the point where NPD is diagnosed.[9] Some psychotherapists believe that the etiology of the disorder is, in Freudian terms the result of fixation, to early childhood development.[10] If a child does not receive sufficient recognition for their talents during about ages 3–7 they will never mature and continue to be in the narcissistic early development stage. It has been suggested[10] that NPD may be exacerbated by the onset of aging and the physical, mental, and occupational restrictions it imposes as can most personality traits.[11][dubious – discuss]
A 1994 study by Gabbard and Twemlow[12] reports that histories of incest, especially mother-son incest are associated with NPD in some male patients.
I found this
not mine!!
But interesting!!
Hmmmm…..check out this comment on the CayleeDaily site http://www.cayleedaily.com/2009/11/former-volunteer-to-be-questioned-in-casey-anthony-case/
Jess
November 23, 2009 at 5:54 PM
OMG Im going to be sick , I mean really sick…… I have talked to Joy for the last year and a half about everything……. What I got from talking to her is that she has personality issues, i thought maybe her attaching herself to this case was some type of mental situation and at times I felt very bad for the critisism she would get online I think I am possible the closest person to Joy at this moment, I let her tell me whatever she wants just to hear what she has to say without being mean to her or judging her, all this time I have just felt sorry for her…. Joy made me aware of these pictures back in Jan. 09 , she told me on the phone point blank she had pictures of that area, not at anytime in the last year and half that i have talked to her has she ever said anything about a video and trust me Ive made sure to keep contact with her and keep questions going about what she is saying…….The last time I talked to Joy would have been about 3 days ago , she messaged me to call her as soon as possible …… she stated that LE wanted to see her laptop so she took her laptop to bestbuy to have the harddrive fixed but the man working on her laptop saw pictures of the anthony case and called police on her…. he also told police that she asked to have certain files deleted off her laptop ( her reasons for wanted things deleted to me was because her hubby goes to sex web sites ) but I do believe now she wanted something deleted off that computer. She also told me she was scared that she would get into trouble with LE because some of the dates on the photos had been changed. This was 3 days ago when she told me this , after this conversation I decided to no longer speak with Joy until I knew what was actually going on , she has called my phone numerous times in the last 3 days.
Ok, so what happens when narcissist meets obsessive compulsive, and what happens when obsessive compulsive is OC about raising a child and raising a child with ‘issues’. Does that get cleaned up too, the ‘mama’ dollie wiped clean because she wasn’t as clean as she normally is– when that very ‘mama doll’ could be the key to solving the mystery of who took and was holding, Caylee?
I am not labelling Cindy– but her behaviours, her clean house, to a non-professional, using the OC term from this perspective. But her house is picture perfect, the yard was soiled somehow, and it too, needed ‘cleansing’. The pool ladder had to be perfect.
It’s strange to me, how a police officer, fully grown man, older than Cindy, could be so controlled once married, to leave his position, his ‘career’ in law enforcement (a relatively empowering and fulfilling profession, respected by others on a personal level as well as in a professional role), to be so emasculated (to use RG’s term), leave his ‘career’ for something that is not at all the highest in public perception of character, honesty (used car salesman/dealer).
So what chance does a child have, with those same issues when under the control of the adult ‘being’ obsessive compulsive in the child’s own upbringing. Does the child have an identity? Is this an explanation of why the child grows up with the same ideals and behaviours, fully accepting– then this all changes when the child hits a certain point in maturity, where the child says ‘no’ and the behaviours change, maybe even roles change in order to keep the peace and to keep ‘the secret’ of the child’s “issues” and to keep the “family issues” a secret too, ‘cleaned up’, ‘sprayed with Febreze’, and otherwise controlled. Just that the child doesn’t say ‘no’ in any constructive way, finds ways to reject someone else’s demands that they be just another extension of the OB behaviours. Plays the role long enough.
What doesn’t fit, is how an OB person, could live with the smell of the car as it permeated the garage and house and even when put outside, the smell stayed for 3 days (Cindy’s statement to fbi). That, in a compulsive cleaning person, I don’t get– how can you stay in the house with that, if all attempts to ‘clean’ and ‘mask’ fail.
Are all the phone calls from Cindy to her ‘best friend’ Casey, about being a chatty best friend, or is is the ultimate in control?
How, through her lack of actions to help Caylee, is Cindy also not culpable for what happened to the child, nevermind her ‘actions’ to help Casey?
Pamela, good post, but we haven’t actually seen any results of the psych tests Casey has taken, have we? I only know for sure (well, “for sure”) that she took the MMPA, and she told the caseworkers (or someone) that the results came back “normal” (ok, that’s not really even a result that the MMPA would spit out, so ???). So, with HIPAA and all that, how do we know what tests she took (I know she has taken at least 2) and what the results were? I mean, they obviously didn’t come back “WHOA, CRIMINALLY INSANE” but when you look at her actions—when you even just look at taking LE down to her office at Universal—you know she’s not normal.
Anyone notice the last two hearings, one Cindy and George were simply not there (cruisin’) and the other, George was visible, but Cindy off in the far corner seat in the gallery, hidden behind other heads for the most part.
Casey was being given a substitute dominant figure in her life, Ms. Lyon. Was Cindy a too destructive influence, or just ‘too’ much of an influence that had to have the chain cut between mother and client? Allowing Casey to be influenced by her advisors. (ie: ‘seafoam duo’, same long hair style, hair down– Baez surely had it wrong with the stern, grey business ‘suit’ styled ‘jacket’, hair in a bun, and oh yeah, those reading glasses for a photo op– he didn’t have a clue– or was that Cindy dressing her ‘best friend’?)
boz—i am in favor of the death penalty too. Why should we keep feeding and housing those on death row. If they are convicted and have enough evidence for a dp conviction, why should they stay on death row for “life”. Why not just convict them for that? As far as I am concerned, if Casey isnt a death penalty case what is. The prosecution has plenty of evidense I am sure that we havent even seen.
If the case fits, then why not apply the death penalty. Some people are just too horrific to be let out or be on this earth. I know God is supposed to do the judging but sometimes it is up to everyday people according to the law to make that decision.
Also, the above post about narcissistic personaly sounds like Andrea Lyon too. The Bobbsie Twins in seafoam green.
this comment on the CayleeDaily site http://www.cayleedaily.com/2009/11/former-volunteer-to-be-questioned-in-casey-anthony-case/
Jess
November 23, 2009 at 5:54 PM
OMG Im going to be sick , I mean really sick…… I have talked to Joy for the last year and a half about everything……. What I got from talking to her is that she has personality issues, i thought maybe her attaching herself to this case was some type of mental situation and at times I felt very bad for the critisism she would get online I think I am possible the closest person to Joy at this moment, I let her tell me whatever she wants just to hear what she has to say without being mean to her or judging her, all this time I have just felt sorry for her…. Joy made me aware of these pictures back in Jan. 09 , she told me on the phone point blank she had pictures of that area, not at anytime in the last year and half that i have talked to her has she ever said anything about a video and trust me Ive made sure to keep contact with her and keep questions going about what she is saying…….The last time I talked to Joy would have been about 3 days ago , she messaged me to call her as soon as possible …… she stated that LE wanted to see her laptop so she took her laptop to bestbuy to have the harddrive fixed but the man working on her laptop saw pictures of the anthony case and called police on her…. he also told police that she asked to have certain files deleted off her laptop ( her reasons for wanted things deleted to me was because her hubby goes to sex web sites ) but I do believe now she wanted something deleted off that computer. She also told me she was scared that she would get into trouble with LE because some of the dates on the photos had been changed. This was 3 days ago when she told me this , after this conversation I decided to no longer speak with Joy until I knew what was actually going on , she has called my phone numerous times in the last 3 days.
A. Lyons = “Face to face she has all the charm of a prison matron off her meds.”
Nope, not originally said about Ms. Lyons, but IMO the quote suits her. Why do I keep seeing in Ms. Lyons, the formidably-figured actress, Hope Emerson, from the women’s-prison movie “Caged” (1950)?
The quote was said about another very famous lady of our time, but I have gone too far afield, already.
the “anti christ” will be released and the world as we know it will cease to exist.
when i posted this I was not in any way, shape or form calling CASEY A’ the “anti christ”
what I meant was, it is a sign of things to come when the obviously guilty WALK…!
I wish I understood why some get so spun up on other peoples postings, I never call names, I just state my feelings…whether they are right or wrong there just my feelings on this terrible heart wrentching story.
opps…sorry sometimes I do, I called Casey a biotch…my bad
but I didnt call her the “anti crist”
Mise-en-scene:
You have left us with a dramatic pause. Please, pray tell (now that we’re already out in that field) who is the famous lady? Might she be mistaken for a lion?
Boz–we might be “killers,” but we get the job done.
Interesting story in today’s Chicago Sun-Times:
“Chicagoan Jim Lichtenstein is delighted he’s landed Glencoe native Clayton Frohman — who penned last year’s acclaimed “Definance” starring Daniel Craig and Liev Schreiber — to write the screen-play for Lichtenstein’s “Privileged Information” film, starring Jessica Biel. The actress will also produce the movie with Lichtenstein, Michelle Purple and Wendy Rhoads — a film about Chicago attorney Kathleen Zellner’s relationship with serial killer Larry Eyler, a client. Lichtenstein is still hoping to shoot in Chicago … ”
Is this the same Jim Lichtenstein we see with the A’s every time they’re out in public? The same A’s who continue to say there are no movie deals in the works? Yeah, right! Is he just hanging out with them ’cause they’re good people? Love to get the info on this deal. This could be very big $$$$ for them — and all because their granddaughter was murdered. It’s a hard concept to get your head around, isn’t it?
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-casey-anthony-stop-jail-recordings-20091202,0,5395555.story
Casey Anthony team: Stop jail video
Her team is challenging jail recordings, death-penalty procedure
Casey Anthony’s attorneys will get an opportunity next week to argue several motions, including one aimed at prohibiting the Orange County Jail from recording her visits with her defense team.
Jail officials said video recordings at the jail, which are routine according to corrections policies, are for the protection of the inmates and their attorneys, according to Allen Moore, a jail spokesman.
The attorney visits between Casey Anthony and her attorney, José Baez, are usually held in a classroom that is always digitally videotaped without any audio tracks, Moore said.
“Our recording system in that part of the jail does not have the ability to record audio,” Moore added.
Anthony’s team also wants the destruction of most existing video of their meetings.
Circuit Court Judge Stan Strickland has scheduled a hearing on those motions at 9:30 a.m. Dec.11.
Next week’s hearing, announced this morning, will likely draw more attention to the jail’s policies on recordings.
“We have followed jail policies and rules very carefully and directly and we intend to continue do so,” Moore said. “We will attempt to accommodate Mr. Baez, but never outside of jail policy,” Moore said.
At times, a corrections officer is stationed outside that classroom or in one of the monitoring stations to observe the meetings, but not to listen to the conversations.
Moore said the jail follows the same video monitoring procedures for all inmates.
The only time a report is generated in relation to a meeting is when something inappropriate happens. In October 2008, jail staff warned Baez that he was not allowed to touch his client. Reports show corrections officers witnessed Baez hugging Anthony.
Moore said in a statement that jail policy “forbids any kind of touching between visitors and inmates.”
Baez refrained from touching his attorney after those warnings.
This is not the first time the issue of jail recordings has come in the Anthony case.
A video shot at the jail on Dec. 11, the day the remains of Caylee Anthony were discovered less than a mile from her family home, reportedly shows Casey Anthony reacting severely to the news.
Corrections Lt. Tammy Unser told detectives Anthony began to breathe rapidly, her hands became sweaty and red blotches appeared on her neck after hearing the news on a TV hours after the discovery.
She also requested a sedative from medical staff.
Anthony’s defense team didn’t want the video, which has no sound, released to the media. Her attorneys argued the images could be misleading and it violated her medical privacy.
Local and national media, including the Orlando Sentinel, had filed legal documents to persuade Strickland to release the video. However, Strickland acknowledged the Sentinel’s request and ruled against it.
In June, Orange Circuit Court Judge Stan Strickland ordered the court to seal that video.
Next week’s hearing also will allow Anthony’s defense lawyers to argue another motion — one that argues that Florida’s death-penalty procedure is unconstitutional.
And because the procedure is unconstitutional, the death penalty should be precluded as a potential sentence, their motion argues.
Defense lawyers Baez and Andrea Lyon filed that motion about two weeks ago.
In it, her lawyers argued, “Even if the death penalty procedure were constitutional, the State has failed to charge Miss Anthony with the aggravating circumstances necessary to impose the death penalty; thus, a death sentence in this case would violate due process.”
Anthony’s lawyers argued in their motion that Florida’s capital-sentencing procedure “violates the notice and jury trial rights guaranteed by the Sixth and Fourteenth Amendments to the United States Constitution.”
Anthony, 23, is charged with first-degree murder in the death of 2-year-old Caylee.
The toddler was reported missing in July 2008 — about a month after she was last seen alive.
Caylee’s remains were discovered December 2008 in woods just blocks away from her family’s east Orange County home
Dearest Dee – I apologize if you took what I wrote as a personal affront, as I stated that was not my intention towards anyone. And I believe that I said that it wasn’t only on Blinks site that comments were made. But, that being said, you responded in a way that you also critized for.
MY whole point is, many many people get away with doing very heinous things to people, some never get caught, some never get convicted.
What I hate to see, is for the Anthony’s to get anymore power, to sell photos, or financially gain from the murder of their granddaugther and their complete corrupt behavior. If we give them the “power” to change our worlds, to say that the anti christ will have won, to make them anything more than the pathetic, dispicable people they have become, thru these blogs and other sites, it gives them more media hype, if anyone doesn’t know that the amount of sites and media attention given to this case isn’t being driven by the same, than they don’t understand the power we, and these sites have on this story.
I know there are always varied levels of interest, some cry at movies, some laugh at those who cry at movies, some get intensely involved in cases like this, some could care less, so I don’t mean to diminish anyone’s feelings, it is what it is for each person.
But I also don’t want what we do or say to be a means to finance the Anthony’s by empowering their impact.
For me, if Casey gets off, which I don’t see happening, but if she does, I’ll say a prayer for Caylee, I’ll put my faith in Karma, and know that she will never be truelly “free”, she will have to live with her actions for the rest of her life. If we make it seem like her story will diminish our view of the world, then we give her power, and her family the ability to milk and milk and milk this tragedy for years and years.
I want Casey to be diminished, if in jail or freed, I want her to know that she should walk in shame, that we aren’t interested in anything more about her or her family other than to disappear into obscurity. No donations for their Scamthony foundation, no money for pics or video, no interviews to continue to lie and perjure (sp), just dissappear.
Cry in private, write to legislatures, write to the judges, go to the trials and wear a badge of honor for Caylee for all to see, but don’t let them win by giving them power to affect your lives and to have any more importance than you or I in the mainstream of life and the media.
Prison or not, I bet Casey feels she is already a winner, she went from a deadend loser, with no bright foreseeable future to one of the most talked about women in the world, as they say the only thing worse than bad publicity is no publicity, lets work towards the no publicity when these trials are done. Lets work towards her and her family being as vacant in this world as she made Caylee.
Blink,
Is joyangels4caylee Joy Wray? I came upon an interesting comment here ,scroll down and read joy’s response to the 2 searchers that have just come forward.
http://www.rosespeaks.com/rose-blog/2009/11/25/casey-and-caylee-anthony-joy-wray-equusearch-finally-the-orange-county-sheriff%E2%80%99s-department-talks-to-her-only-eleven-months-later/
I am going to say this in the kindest possible way.
I have met this woman. I have spent time observing her behavior. I am aware of her former and current mental health issues, which btw, I do think she has, so I am not going to say anything I would normally say if someone shall we say, lucid, acted like she is.
In that instance, I would be saying she is crazier than a sh*t house rat, which I am not.
That article is not even factually correct. OCSO Interviewed Joyfulness a few times over the last year, one of those interviews where she is thumbing through her photos and telling John Allen she would not leave her kid alone with George for fear she goes missing.
Wait until Dom Casey’s depo, I say she shuts up right quick-
B
oh Pam, I am not angry or upset, I just post my feelings, I feel just like you do and everything you said in your last post I agree with EVERYTHING!
Justice for Little Miss Caylee is all I care about, true justice will not be had until her mother meets her maker, whenever that is and how ever that is, that is where my faith lies.
God Bless!
Blink you are hysterical! Yes I read that depo also . Even she is bothered by the defense !! Thanks for the Joyfulness laugh !