David Hartley Gunned Down On Jet Ski In Mexico : Tiffany Young-Hartley Facing Scrutiny
According to his wife, Tiffany Young-Hartley, who called 911, David Hartley, 30, was gunned down by Mexican pirates while the couple ventured across the Falcon Resovior lakes US border to take pictures of the “Mexican Atlantis” or Old Guerreo.
Hartley says her husband was shot in the head and as a result “flew” off his jet ski while the couple was returning from the landmark on the Mexican side of the lake, after taking pictures. She goes on to say she became aware of 3 different boats chasing down the couple only after she saw bullets hitting the water next to her. As she turned around to see where they were coming from, she claims she witnessed her husbands murder.
David was driving a new Sea Doo RXT ski that can climb from 0–30MPH in 1.7 seconds and is capable of top-end speeds of over 60 MPH. Blinkoncrime.com has not been able to confirm which model Ms. Hartley was driving. The couple had been on at least one earlier jet ski jaunt while still in Mexico, but was cut short due to a mishap with David’s craft on June 20th.
According to his wife, David was face-down in the water, wearing a life vest, after he was shot.
Despite the horror of what she had just witnessed and astonishingly avoiding injury to her or her watercraft, she circled back around, jumped off her jet ski, and turned her 250 lb. husband upright to observe the gunshot wound to his forehead. You read that correctly, according to Tiffany Hartley, while being chased from behind, David was shot from the front. Hartley maintains this is when she attempted to load him onto her jet ski, and also when two of the three boats were now positioned in front of her.
One of the alleged pirate boats from the front approached her within 10 ft. While she stared down the barrell of his gun, she was holding onto her husband with one hand, her ski with the other asking not to be shot. Apparently through some sort of Mexican telepathy or nautical sign language, the men who just ambushed the couple and murdered her husband in cold blood, made a decision to let her go and retreated IN FRONT OF HER.
Hartley claims she cannot identify any of the men, that they never said a word to her nor could she hear anything they may have said to each other, but believes the motive for the attack to be robbery or to kidnap her. It is not clear how Tiffany arrived at this conclusion as they never made an attempt to stop them or ask them for their money, she was off her $13,000 Sea doo they could have easily taken, and they let her go.
It was at this time that Hartley finally did hear something. She says she heard the voice of God tell her to leave David, save herself and get to safety. However, his instruction must have been non-specific because she proceeded to mount her ski in deep water, start it back up, and drive directly toward and then past the very band of gun weilding murderous cartel who minutes ago gunned down her highschool sweetheart and spouse of 8 years. (Editors note: I cannot imagine the nerve it takes to again have your back to the same crew who, unprovoked, sprayed the lake with bullets behind you while you were fleeing for your life).
While Tiffany admits the couple was aware of recent pirate activity in the area they learned about while David researched the location, she claims they had not heard of anymore incidents on Falcon Lake, which borders both Texas and Mexico, “in a while.”
The Hartley’s, who had recently been on a few tropical vacations, were in the process of relocating to Colorado next week from Reynosa, Mexico and McAllen Texas, where they had lived for only a few months, following David’s transfer request to Calfrac well services.
According to recent Facebook postings, although the couple could not agree on furniture tastes, they recently purchased a house full of it just after a luxury cruise and visit to a seminar for those experiencing financial difficulty.
I would love to be able to do no analysis and regergetate this story as reported by main stream media whereby not one reporter asks the obvious question:
After several known incidents of piracy in that location over the last months, why would the “pirates” suddenly go on a murderous rampage in lieu of attempting to rob a couple on jet skis that could outrun them on sight?
Not gonna happen. I have heard umpteen versions of Ms. Hartley’s version of events leading to the random execution of her husband.
None pass the smell test. However, just today, Zapata County Sheriff “Sigi” Gonzalez, Jr says his investigation, now aided by a witness who is a long standing member of the Zapata community, exonerates Mrs. Hartley of any wrongdoing.
Gonzalez completely rules out foul play on the part of Mrs. Hartley.
“A local witness saw Tiffany Hartley escaping on her jet-ski to the Texas side of the lake,” he said. “She came in at high speed and was being pursued by armed men in a Mexican fishing boat that that the witness clearly observed.”
Gonzalez said the witness was a long-standing member of the Zapata community who was well known to him and regarded as highly credible.
“The testimony of this witness dispels any idea Mrs. Hartley was involved in any wrongdoing regarding the murder of her husband,” he said firmly. “She called in a 911 phone call to our office at around 2:20 p.m. on the day of the incident, immediately after she got to shore, and her statements to my office confirm what the local witness observed.”
Unfortunately, the witness account does not match Tiffany Hartley’s own version of events. At no time has she ever said that she was again chased by the “pirates”, in fact, she claims she left them behind after driving “through” them.
Hartley references recent pirate activity, which is almost verbatim what she says happened to her and David, with the exception of the actual piracy:
On April 30, five people in two different boats were fishing on Falcon Lake and went to the Old Guerrero area, where they were taking photos of the old church. While they were there, a boat with four heavily tattooed men approached the two boats quickly. The men identified themselves as “Federales,” but they were not wearing uniforms. The men boarded the boats, demanded cash and asked “where are the drugs?” The fishermen told the men that they had no drugs and were just fishing and taking photos. They ended up giving the men $200 cash and left the area. The pirates followed the two boats, but the U.S. boats were able to outrun them and the men stopped following once the two boats entered U.S. waters.
In every recorded incident since April, the heavily tattoed pirates posing as “Federales” without uniforms, came upon anchored fishing boats, boarded them, robbed the fisherman at gunpoint of any personal cash, searched for drugs left without any violence. In the Hartley family interview on the Today show, Tiffany states that after David was hit, she circled around, jumped off her jetski, swam over to her husband and because he was “face down in the water” she had to turn him over where she discovered he was shot in the head.
It would seem I am not alone in my quagmire. Mexican Investigators, who hold jurisdiction have already begun to question Ms. Hartley’s story.
Marco Antonio Guerrero Carrizales, the district attorney for the Miguel Aleman Province adjoining Falcon Lake on the Mexican side, has questioned whether Tiffany Hartley was involved in foul play.
Early this morning, Sheriff Sigi Gonzalez announced the Mexican Authorities will be searching the area where David Hartley was murdered, and have committed to “not leaving” until they find him. Tiffany Hartley, accompanied by her parents, but without David’s, filed a missing person report at the Mexican Consulate last night as a matter of procedure to “get the ball rolling”.
Check back to blinkoncrime.com for updates
Madeline Tanner, contributing editor blinkoncrime.com
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Why is there such a glaring absence by the news media of questioning Tiffany’s fishy story? Have I missed something? Is it better for the tv ratings to play up her innocence? I just don’t get it.
I would love to see an intelligent, rational and experienced reporter do a moment by moment recreation of the story with Tiffany, instead of these little bits the news media are feeding us. If I saw that, then I might start to turn around and buy into her story a bit. But with these glaring inaccuracies and with this political hot button issue, things seem to be so mucked up. MOO
What type of bullet would it take to launch 250 pound man in mid-air?
and send flying over the jet ski?
Could Tiffany be Dyslexic? She can not operate a camera.
I find it extremely difficult to believe, Tiffany travels, and sightsees, and she does record her memories on a digital camera.
This brings me to wonder if she could be Dyslexic?
Blink, Packleader5s post fits in with what I heard too. One of the fishing guides who works Falcon said LE knows who did this and he’s been under investigation for a while.
According to other posts the guide posted the name, but the mods removed that post. I’m still searching for the name.. it’s got to be somewhere. From what the other posts said, I don’t think it was David who was under investigation.
and the locals have also questioned why LE stopped looking for Hartleys body so soon on 9/30. They stopped around 9 according to reports. They then gave an example of how when there is an alleged drowning, LE searches the water all through the night.
Is it possible LE is trying to downplay Davids death because they’ve got bigger fish to fry?.
omg.. I used a fish analogy. I gotta stay out of those fishing blogs.
I have not heard LE looked for his body 9/30. I assume you mean Zapata? I would be very interested in seeing an aerials.
Again, thermal scans of the water would pick up both the jetski and David, presumably.
B
Tiffany is on MSNBC now being interviewed by Alex Witt & she is struggling with this interview & with the newer story.. Alex is asking some pointed questions & a little story change taking place here.. Again TH bringing in securing the borders issue.. She has just addressed the poly again & she states (quote) ” that both she & the sheriff don’t feel a poly is necessary” (unquote)..
I hope that MSNBC puts this interview out in video on their web site today..
Unbelievable. Well then, since he has no jurisdiction here, perhaps the Mexican authorities will request one that she can refuse.
I look forward to seeing that video, Alex Witt is a fave of mine.
B
B’says…I have not heard LE looked for his body 9/30. I assume you mean Zapata?
By 9 p.m. Thursday, law enforcement called off searches for David Hartley’s body. His wife was forced to leave his body about two miles past the international boundary — beyond any U.S. law enforcement’s legal jurisdiction.
“We can only stay at that boundary and see if we can spot anything,” said Capt. Fernando Cervantes of Texas Park and Wildlife Department in Zapata.
The sheriff met with FBI, U.S. Border Patrol and state investigators Thursday evening. Gonzalez said authorities were contacting Mexican counterparts to deploy military personnel to search for David Hartley’s body.
http://www.themonitor.com/articles/-43245–.html
Did you see this one? Mexico named 2 suspects.
http://www.krgv.com/mostpopular/story/Investigators-in-Mexico-Name-Two-Suspects-in/3ZErjpGVMUSKdQOcMf4Rbg.cspx
Read that carefully, that is quite an opportunistic headline (again).
They are looking for 2 suspects in a string of fires, murders and kidnappings, not directly for this crime.
Again, emphasis on the kidnapping- they let her go.
B
MSNBC has put this video out on their site from an interview she also did this morning..
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/39601707#39601707
@ Madilu says
Why does she, during interviews, at times refer to him in present tense, and sometimes in past tense?
——————————————————————
I haven’t noticed that, but now that you bring it up, I am hearing it in clips all over here media tour. This only brings me to believe, even more than before, that David is still alive. Not unheard of, faking own death for financial reasons (gain or debt). Also, I noticed that the few times I’ve seen Tiffany on video, her story has changed.
I have a question for people with jetskis. If you were racing your wave runner at full speed, how can you look down, with all that water splashing up and see bullets hit the water? Is that possible?
——————————————————————–
A story from his morning….
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/10/10/world/main6944585.shtml
Mexican news media are reporting that Mexican police officials have identified two persons of interest in connection with the shooting of David Hartely on Falcon Lake, on the U.S.-Mexico border.
—————————————————————
Why do I get the feeling they are releasing this information so the US wil back off and leave them alone?
They have ID two criminals. Why just two people? Scapegoats? According to Tiffany there were 3 boats with many men on them. Who is in control of this case on our side? Hopefully, it’s not that boarder sheriff only.
—————————————————————–
Here’s an interesting outlook on Tiffany’s body language showing deception. Dr. Lillian Glass posts the following:
The shoulder shrugs, lip licking, like um and ums, monotone, verbal inconsistencies in her story and choice of words make me question what really happened to her husband.
Read more here
http://drlillianglassbodylanguageblog.wordpress.com/
The more Tiffany says she feels a poly is unnecessary, the more I feel it is.
Here is that Alex Witt interview (link) you wanted to see.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/39601707#39601707
Perhaps I was wrong about the link. The interview I saw did not ask any polygraph questions. I’ll have to check again.
Tiffany’s 911 call. Her voice is difficult to understand EXCEPT for
a clear Hello, and a clear pronunciation of her name, Tiffany Hartley.
I’m so sorry, the call sounds so Misty Croslin-like.
http://extras.denverpost.com/audio/Pirates_100510/911_call_13.mp3
If you were desperate to recover/rescue your husband, would you even mention “but he’s on the Mexico side”?
How in the middle of such chaos, are you even aware of the border issue?
Note the witness makes the call for her, and never intends to put her on the phone, the 911 operator asks to speak to her. I would like to hear an unedited version of this. I would like to know where she pulled up in her jet ski, exactly. Was she wearing shoes of any kind?
Anyone know if their visas would carry over past their relocation back to US?
Mr. and Mrs. Hartley may still be afforded some dual status- interesting.
B
@ momofjbsl says:
October 10, 2010 at 11:18 am
This video is from the Today show with Lester Holt (yummy) that she also did this morning (same clothes & same background) & I posted also.. I don’t think they’ve posted the Alex Witt interview yet since her show just ended at around noon EST..
Tamaulipas State Police Commander Juan Carlos Ballesteros told El Universal newspaper on Saturday that authorities believe Juan Pedro Saldivar-Farias and Jose Manuel Saldivar-Farias killed Hartley.
Ballesteros told the paper that the two men are accused in numerous crimes in Mexico, including burning homes, robbing businesses and several homicides.
http://www.newsrunner.com/display-article/?eUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbsnews.com%2Fstories%2F2010%2F10%2F10%2Fworld%2Fmain6944585.shtml&eSrc=Mountain+Home+News+-+Elmore+County+ID&eTitle=Report%3A+Mexico+ID%27s+Border+Lake+Suspects+%28cbs%29
So here is a novel idea. Show them to the living victim. I wonder how long they have been on the lam?
Certainly makes sense if your a wanted fugitive to not rob the couple that has about $30K worth of watercraft better suited for escape than your 20MPH vessel, kill an American, leave a living eye-witness unharmed, and only one of you gets a jet ski so if your caught, your both caught.
Hey, there are some really dumb criminals out there, I do not dispute that. Seems to me though they have been fairly elusive thus far.
I feel like I am watching an old movie in a different language dubbed over where the lip movements do not match the dialogue.
B
8.
nana2 says:
October 10, 2010 at 12:07 pm
@ momofjbsl says:
October 10, 2010 at 11:18 a
This video is from the Today show with Lester Holt (yummy) that she also did this morning (same clothes & same background) & I posted also.. I don’t think they’ve posted the Alex Witt interview yet since her show just ended at around noon EST..
@nana2 – Thanks. I wondered if I should have checked it out better.
I can’t figure out why she keeps insisting that his body has been removed from the water? Obviously, if her story were true she wouldn’t have any idea what the pirates would do with the body. Why would she keep pushing the “he is on land” theory? I don’t understand what her angle is.
I am positive that through some sort of investigative discovery, she was told he could not be in that water.
I say this emphatically. I can even tell you the second I knew “she knew”. It was statement that they need to be looking “in the brush.”
B
I am concerned that David and what happened to him is now being hidden behind a wall of suberterfuge and agendas.
Does anyone really care what happened?- especially those in the media, and Gonzales, and politicians who seem to be happily buying in to Tiffany’s account/S of what happened- no hard questions asked, simply because it allows each of them to insert their own agendas, and tout their on political issues.
A man, a husband, has disappeared, there is some evidence of blood, no witnesses to the crime- His wife, the last person to see him alive, tells many different accounts of what happened. It is only her word to support her claims and little to no evidence.
Would someone please follow procedures- and find out what happened?
They have a witness that came to her aid, who saw Tiffany crying and sobbing as she sped around the island- only saw her crying and sobbing- only saw one boat- He said it looked like something horrible had just happened…. Okay, that I understand, but what just happened?
I am very concerned that the circumstances surrounding that day at the lake and David’s disappearance will NEVER be investigated.
Tiffany is now saying that she is certain that whomever shot him took him and his jetski the second she returned to the US side. Why the change in her story now?
These ‘suspects’ IMO are nothing short of convenient, its almost as if they opened up the criminal records of those nearest to Old Guerrero Church ran their fingers down the page and chose the most likely convenient suspects-
Gonzalez says-
“If it’s the same pirates that used to be there two or three months ago, it’ll be these gophers, these Zetitas…the cartel member wannabes,” he said. “They got to prove whatever it takes to graduate to the next level as enforcers.”
How is any of these ‘easy’ scenarios leading credence to Tiffany’s story?
We already knew that the cartel is alive and well in Mexico.
We already knew that there were robberies and attempted robberies on Falcon Lake, but never ANY killings-
The one time it is reported to have happen- the killers think twice about killing a witness to their crime and let her go? They are okay with letting an attractive woman, on a thirty thousand dollar jet ski, who has witnessed their crime Just Go?
If someone doesn’t stand-up and take a hard look at this case, what’s to stop a bunch of people, from planning their ‘vacations’ to Falcon Lake?
I’m only half joking- seriously, it seems all one has to do is decide to disappear-or drug run or kill a person, and make sure that they do it in an area/open waters that are known for crime- and be sure to ignore warnings and do it during a political season- then come back and have a good story to tell-
This story is very upsetting. My heart goes out to the wife and family! What really has me upset though, is the way she is being treated. I contacted my congressmen and senators, to ask as their constituent that they do whatever they can to help recover his body and protect the borders. Violence in Mexico is of course out of control, but for it to be spilling over into the US and affecting our citizens is outrageous! And this IS NOT the first incident. It has been happening in Arizona, but this is the story that has gotten the most face time. I am sure my elected officials in Virginia will probably let my plea go in one ear and out the other, but since I am not a savvy blogger like Blink, it was the best I could do to help this woman and her family. Thanks for posting this story Blink!
@ momofjbsl says:
October 10, 2010 at 1:12 pm
I’m wondering if they will post that video from Alex Witt’s show this morning since her show doesn’t have the audience that the Today show has.. I have MSNBC on now since they do ‘news reruns’ throughout the day.. But I will check the site later you never know..
One last thought…as most of us know from watching unthinkable crimes be committed by repeat offenders who COULD HAVE been stopped, I think it is safe to say these crimes can be stopped if our government took a proactive approach. BE VIGILANT! Call your congressman and tell them (or their legislative aides) what you want to see done. Every turn of the head legitimizes the violence and slows down the path to peace. If we don’t stop problems when they start, the problems just get bigger. (Uh, helloooo UVA?! ).
Hello all,
Been studiously reading and pondering. I do have a question for anyone that may know the answer.
I believe it has been said, that Tiffany & David crossed over the boarder into Mexico illegally while jetskiing. Do we know if their work visas or whatever they were granted to live there for 2 1/2 yrs is expired? If not, is that still considered illegal entry as it was for pleasure and not work?
I am just curious what her status would have been considered in all of this.
I think her answers to questions in these interviews are a bit more careful and planned than last weeks, even if the info changes.
HA,
Thats what I get for not reading through, Blink you and I had the same thought.
Wow. This is the first time I heard TH’s 911 call and I find it more interesting than ALL of her television appearances. Is there an unedited version somewhere out there?
I have a question:
TXDPS stopped Tiffany and David as they were headed toward Falcon, and apparently other witnesses saw them launch the jet skis at Falcon….SO, If one believes that Tiffany shot David either on the water or on land, why haven’t they found his body?
It is illogical that they have not located him or his ski, I personally do not believe she killed him.
B
Everytime I read or hear “Protect and Secure our Borders” connected to this case. I just want to scream. If these people want to “Protect our Borders” they wouldn’t let Tiffany Hartley back in the country, given she crossed with no legal papers, on a high powered craft, they would also confiscated her jet ski.
Second when Tiffany Hartley Young states this in TV interviews about “Secure our Borders”, it seems to me she wants to change the subject..
I understand that everyone grieves in their own way. However grief is the toughest emotion to emulate. Many times the people who are crying or seemed upset, are showing more of the signs of fear than of grief, fear of being caught.
Tiffany needs to be locked in a room with a bunch of criminal detectives, who hopefully have some info after a serious background check of both David (Michael?) and Tiffany Hartley. They have to nail out the discrepancies in her story.
There is alot that points to money issues, given they liked to go on vacation, their expensive toys and having the right stuff like furniture.
I think why he hasn’t been found, because he isn’t in the Reservoir/Lake. This should be a missing person case, unless more evidence shows it is a murder investigation.
I really don’t know what to think of this case, because I have so little information. I read “Hoy Tamaulipas”, and it is interesting how they covered this case. They also said they had 102 investigating and looking for David Hartley as reported on Oct. 7th
I think right now, there needs to be evidence to prove or disprove Ms. Hartley Young’s story, it is questionable, and there needs to be some strong verification like a body to move forward. She needs to seriously questioned.
The investigative snafus in this case are going to trump contemporary high profile cases of the past, no doubt.
WHY are his parents not demanding the US open a missing persons investigation- here is a thought-
maybe he was picked up by a kind samaritan and taken to a TX hospital?
Pretty unlikely, but hello…
The evidence available to investigators, which is DIRECT and PHYSICAL, belies the account of the surviving DIRECT witness. What the Hell is wrong here?
B
B
She said they were chaseing them and clame he was shot in the front part of his head. No way the only ones that belive this story are the right wing nuts the law knows its not true but they wabt to use this to get more mmoney on there war on drugs.
When will this women take a lie deteter test. You woud think the cops woud haave aredy done this
Why is Tiffany so hesitant on taking a lie detector test? I have a feeling that the Sheriff down in the town where this happened is taking advantage of this case for political reasons. He’s been asking for more help for years and now he has a story that may finally bring him the help he needs; which may explain, why he thinks Tiffany does not need a polygraph. He’s trying to show political leaders of Texas, what he’s been asking for all along, more security. I think he “wants” to believe her story is true.
It’s very easy to hide money in private banks down in Mexico. This coupled lived in Mexico for a few years and they know the money ropes. I’m not sure if this has to do with money gain or debt, but here are a few stories, in recent history, where people faked their death then head to Mexico.
2010 … an Indiana money manager who tried to fake death by crashing plane; gets 10 years in … He said he pointed the plane toward the Gulf of Mexico……but the plane ran out of fuel first
2008…. (Pensacola, Florida) Ismael B. Rodriguez, 45, and his wife, Maria Rodriguez, 41, were involved in a conspiracy to commit mail fraud based upon a fraudulent life insurance claim. An indictment outlines a scheme wherein the defendants traveled to Mexico in 2008 and faked the death of Ismael. His wife is alleged to have then returned to the United States with a fraudulent Mexican death certificate in an attempt to obtain approximately $2 million worth of life insurance on her husband.
2005….Patrick McDermot, went on a tour fishing trip out to sea, but never returned. Many speculated that McDermott faked his death to avoid paying back huge child support and taxes. Now it’s believed that Patrick is alive and living in Mexico. …there have been many sightings of him down there.
2002- Lionel Correa, a School Teacher, fakes the death of his wife to collect 3 U.S. life insurance policies. He travels to a remote town in Mexico to fake her death and bribes the town’s mayor to conspire with him. He sets up a fake grave and takes pictures of his wife lying in an open casket.
1998…..A man who was believed to have burned to death in a car accident in Mexico in 1998 was sentenced to five years in federal prison on fraud charges. Prosecutors said Madison Rutherford, 39, formerly of Bethel, faked his own death to collect $7 million in insurance. He pleaded guilty to wire fraud.
Nice research Rhoni.
B
Must be two talented persons of interest to be able to drive three boats.
And apparently a jet ski.
B
To me, this case appears such a scam and I would bet the playpen that he is alive and well…except that Blink, you feel he is dead. What makes you think that? Is it because if that is the case he would have to ‘disappear’ from his life and family, and he doesn’t seem the type who could do that? It seems like he is close to his family, so I could see that. Blink???
I have been reading the posts and did not see mention of the article in the denver post given by tiffany’s dad. I would love to get your take on the info given.
http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_16293727?source=rss
OK: For those of you not familiar with Falcon Lake, it is a reservoir, not unlike a few others along the Rio Grande, that control the river flow and flooding.
The International border is CLEARLY marked by bouys. Anyone who has spent any time on water along the Rio Grande knows this. They lived in Reyenosa (by the way, Reyenosa is quickly becoming a ghost town because of the Drug Cartel that control it). The Hartleys knew where the border was. They did not accidentally enter into Mexican waters. NO WAY.
There is no way that a body has not been found in the area she has designated, if a body existed, and if she is directing them to the right place. This comes from Border Patrol who have the equipment to scan the lakes. People—this is what the Border Patrol does—the look for bodies, alive and dead! That’s their job. I believe that either A) she is purposefully not telling them where the murder happened because she doesn’t want them to find the body, because they’ll then be able to determine that she was involved, or B) He is not dead at all, and thus, no body.
Now: a word to the wise. The violence in Mexico is bad. But be very, very cautious about making blanket statements about the violence in Mexico. Very little of it is actually random. Yes, innocent victims exist, but they are victimized because of affiliation to someone in the drug cartels, or happening to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, with the wrong people. Yes, Mexican officials reek of corruption, but for every corrupts official, there are some very good ones too. Mexican Pirates? They’re after money and drugs. PERIOD. There is no way that they would just be out there doing target practice on some American jet-skiers who “just wandered into” Mexican waters. If this happened the way she said (and I’ve always had some serious doubts), this was a drug deal. They didn’t kill her because she’s left to leave a warning to anyone involved with them: Don’t mess with us; we mean business.
Now, the media is making this all the EVIL MEXICANS’ fault. I seriously think we’ll see the EVIL AMERICAN come out of all this. Most Blink readers are pretty good at seeing through the Media, but when you don’t live on the border, it’s hard to have an understanding of what is going on down here (I know this because my family (in the North) constantly believes that we’re in danger all the time, as if Mexican Nationals are walking up and down my street waiting for us to come out so they can kill us). Nothing is further from the truth. I’ve lived on the border for 23 years, and if anything, it’s safer now than 23 years ago because traffic over and back has slowed considerably in the past three years.
Once again, Border Patrol is not saying much, and AFT and DEA are very involved. Draw your own conclusions. Oh, and once again, in Texas, the Sheriff’s office has little or no authority on this crime. The county runs the 911 dispatch, but Falcon Lake is a Federal Recreation Area. If the Park Service’s Law Enforcement didn’t have the people/toys to handle it, then they would refer it to another govt agency, such as Border Patrol, FBI, ATF, DEA. So, Sheriff is just trying hard to get his name in the papers.
I’m still hoping that investigators are doing complete background checks on the Mr & Mrs including credit checks.. I know they don’t advertise those things but I don’t even hear or read a suggestion of it anywhere.. Hope the FBI is somehow in on this investigation since he was a US citizen gone missing in another country if they are then I guess I missed that too..
Whatever this case is about, it is not about US BORDER SECURITY. By all her accounts, this happened on the Mexican side of the Border. Does Mexico have a problem on the border? Yes. Does it spill over onto the US side? Yes. Do we need tighter border securtity? Yes.
But this happened on the Mexico side and the Hartley’s were aware of the dangers. So why is this about what the US has/has not done regarding the borders? The US does not have jurisdiction! I believe the border issues are serious political issues but it bothers me when something like this is used to push the buttons. It’s like claiming “two black men carjacked me”. Too many people are distracted by their concerns/fears to ask hard questions. Something tragic happened. Let’s not be distracted by a side issue, no matter how important.
I am now going to be highly suspect of ANYTHING the news media comes out with on this story. It is all beginning to sound like a “cover story” for some other agenda. Possibly political. It is just incredulous that ALL interviewers on the news media are treating this woman as if her word is gospel. We have completely LOST all decent honest investigative journalists in this country, the media sold out long ago for sensationalism, the big bucks interviews, etc. They WILL NOT tell you the truth! And the guy’s family, no tears from them either. Not one real tear shed from any family member to date. No polygraph taken. No body, no jet ski found. Supposed lone witness will only appear in shadow and his story does not match wife’s.
Does anyone else but me notice how quickly they held a memorial service for this man?? Based on the word of this woman alone. Absolutely NO ONE either friend, acquaintance, or family member said, wait, let’s find him first, not so fast. When everyone falls in lockstep on a fishy story like this including the media you have to be skeptical. Something else is going on.
My Mother asked me when I told me when I mentioned I would be writing on this case, that I should double check sources because she was sure she read there was a memorial so they must have recovered his body.
When I laughed and said, I am aware, she told me to get off the phone and do my job, lol.
B
If you were desperate to recover/rescue your husband, would you even mention “but he’s on the Mexico side”?
How in the middle of such chaos, are you even aware of the border issue?
Note the witness makes the call for her, and never intends to put her on the phone, the 911 operator asks to speak to her. I would like to hear an unedited version of this. I would like to know where she pulled up in her jet ski, exactly. Was she wearing shoes of any kind?
Anyone know if their visas would carry over past their relocation back to US?
Mr. and Mrs. Hartley may still be afforded some dual status- interesting.
B
Thank-you, Blink, for pointing out “kidnapping” is what the criminals are accused of, it bounced off of us.
“Kidnapping” is a little more logical, than shooting David, then
towing him to land. The culprits may have taken David, while he was
alive.
$he wants no commitment, just David’s body, so $he can go on.
I would not stress the “Mexican side” unless I didn’t want a Trial.
$he wants to “go on” – $he wants the culprit’s to “go on”, what?
Reporters are goo-goo eyed, and it is discussing. Wendy Murphy
needs to interview Tiffany. Credit to Anderson Cooper for asking
a hard question about the LDT. You have a nice intelligent following.
Thank-you for your blog.
@ Mermaid14 says:
October 10, 2010 at 3:38 pm
I asked the day of the memorial ‘why so quick’ the searching hadn’t really started yet..
I don’t think this is political. Hartley-Young may cover herself with the flag and become buddies with a certain political camp, but I think it is more to help her protect herself, and having a group circling the wagon for her to give her support and resources.
Money seems a more likely motive in this.
There is going to be lots of information, much of this bad info and innuendos in this case. I wouldn’t be surprise there are a dozen or so private investigators already on this case, from insurance companies hiring someone to find out what is going on, to Calfrac hiring someone, either out of protecting themselves, or for other workers’ safety, besides if there is something else going on.
I don’t know my insurance polices well, but there is also a chance, even if a body is found, that the life insurance policy won’t cover David’s death. He allegedly died in Mexico, and it wasn’t on the job. They could waive the claim because of the circumstances. The insurance company could be sticklers that a state court declaring David is legally dead, is invalid because it doesn’t have jurisdiction in where he allegedly died, across the border.
I am also curious, if Tiffany has been on Univision or TV Azteca. I mean if she wants to find David, she is better off doing spanish speaking media.
They need to find the body to have this case move forward. I just think all these people who are using this as a club to further their political agenda, should think of all the people who died at Ciudad Juarez, especially the women who worked at Maquiadoras, who have been murdered and found in mass graves, making TV sets for the US market. The Border is about cooperation, not castigation.
There have been some terrifying hold ups, especially in Baja California Norte, in which a bunch of rogue cops would pull over RVs from the US, at night, some of the RVs on surfing safaris or traveling down the coast. They would do the same thing as some of the robberies on Falcon Lake, try to pull over the person as pseudo law enforcement/game wardens.
Well, Blink, looks to me like you have been doing your job, you immediately and publicly voiced your suspicion about the story from the getgo, yet most media news outlets did not and still haven’t. Perhaps some are just “going along” in hopes to get future interiews to see how many times this lady’s story is going to change. Anderson Cooper did actually ask her if she was willing to take a polygraph.
I started my protest here in Texas because I was afraid we were about to hear, “three shots by a lone gunman fired from the Texas School Book Depository” any minute!
Perhaps we need to “follow the money” on this. That might tell the real story because I wonder where this couple has been getting the money to live like they have been living. Wife seems to not have a job at all, husband doing temporary work on oil rigs. Yet we have jetskis, cruises, house full of new furniture, etc. You know, like how did Oswald manage to live in luxury in Russia for several years if he was such a loser and broke all the time on a minimum wage job in Dallas?
The first thing that of course comes to mind is……drugs. I also question their willingness to live and recreate so close to the border given all the horror stories we have been hearing about what goes on down there, then we hear they had to actually cross the border into Mexican waters to take those photos. Yet this woman says “oh my husband would never put me in any kind of danger.” @#tch, please!
Why did this couple feel like they were not in danger? Because they weren’t. Because someone had their backs. Then perhaps they were exposed and their cover blown so they had to create a story to protect someone. Happens all the time when you are working as agents of the U.S.government or double dipping and working both sides.
I keep wanting someone to ask this woman something in Spanish to see if she knows the language. If you are going to either live, work, or recreate regularly in Mexico, you better learn the language. You get alot more respect down there if you speak their language, not unlike the reverse if Hispanics learn our language, right?
She lived in Reynosa for 3 years, her husband was the district manager for the Reynosa HQ plant, of course she knew Spanish.
B
You know, the more I think about this case, the more I believe there is something a little hinky about having that memorial service so soon. I can tell you that if he were my husband/brother/son, I would want to exhaust the search before I held any service.
And another thing….these two were very familiar with the perils of going to the Mexican side of Falcon. So, WHY do they not only go into Mexican waters, but go into Mexican waters on a WEEKDAY when fewer people are on the lake to help them if they get into trouble?
Makes no sense to me.
Ted, says…
Second when Tiffany Hartley Young states this in TV interviews about “Secure our Borders”, it seems to me she wants to change the subject..
That is it, TED!! She keeps changing the subject, good catch!
She told an Greta? “David watched your program EVERY Day”!
That was changing the subject… Why, is she changing the subject?
The Mexican Commerical Fishing Boat would know more, binnoculars, etc.
The boat that was reportly following Tiffany.
36.Ted says:
October 10, 2010 at 4:08 pm
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Excellent post, Ted. Lots of stuff to think about here. I agree that an interview on Univision or TV Azteca may help Tiffany in her quest to find David’s body.
@S.H.
Wendy Murphy needs to interview Tiffany.
———————————–
I agree! Here’s a clip of Wendy, in a recent interview on Foxnews, stating she has some serious doubts about Tiff’s story.
http://news.yahoo.com/video/world-15749633/tiffany-hartley-says-she-will-take-lie-detector-test-22350003
Also, Blink, I must of missed a part of your blog earlier when you posted about this couple recently visiting a seminar for those experiencing financial difficulty. Very interesting. Wow, then that would appear, most likely, they DID have financial problems, of some sorts.
I believe Tiffany’s story. It is most likely that the bullet entered in the back or some angle and exited the front of his head. I don’t doubt the story. It was mentioned in MSM that many of the members of drug cartels are ex military and capable of shooting accurately from long distances and they have very high powered machinery. Also, they may have been trying to scare them and didn’t intend to kill anyone. That I doubt though.
Mexican Visas and Immigration ~ snippets~
FMM – The Short-Term Non-Immigrant Visa
Short term visas are intended for visitors (usually tourists) to Mexico on short term (six months or less) visits.
FM3 – The Long-Term Non-Immigrant Visa
The FM3 visa is a renewable long term (more than six months) permit which gives non-immigrant temporary residency status to the holder. This means that it gives a person the right to live in Mexico (under terms as set out in the visa) but it does not lead to, and cannot be converted to, a visa leading to permanent residency or Mexican Citizenship.
Once applied for and granted, the FM3 may be renewed for an additional four years (for a total of five years). After this period, a new FM3 may be applied for and, if granted, will serve for another (max) five year period, renewable annually.
FM2 – The Immigrant Visa
FM2 visas are intended for people seeking permanent residency status in Mexico or those who may seek eventual Mexican Citizenship.
Technical or Scientific Professions
If you are a qualified technician or scientist, Mexico offers a category of visa which enables you to live and work in Mexico under sponsorship from a foreign company. For example, if the company wants to open an office or factory in Mexico, a person or persons representing that company may enter Mexico to manage the commercial operations on a long term basis.
For Work Placements: If you plan to live and work in Mexico, a Visitor’s Permit (FM3 Visa), renewable annually, is probably your best option.
http://www.mexperience.com/liveandwork/immigration-mexico.php#3
From Tiffany’s sister’s fb page. (Tia Young)
It’s decided my next gun is an AK-47!! I’m thinking this habit is going to get expensive! February 7 at 8:20pm
Then there’s a discussion about what types of guns are legal in the US and Tia says:
Im waiting for my brother in law to buy the AR 15 since he lives in Mexico I told him I would break it in for him til he comes back to a free country.
February 8 at 4:25pm
If you check out May 25th of this year, you’ll find pics of Tia with guns.
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/photo.php?fbid=422745419458&set=a.422744249458.212566.713984458&pid=5392600&id=713984458
Perhaps all of this has to do with bringing guns into the country? I do think though, that their financial situation paints a better picture of what they might have done to get out from under.
Some recent news:
http://www.krgv.com/news/local/story/Gun-Battle-Erupts-While-Mexican-Authorities/Rh7c65th9k6oI9G2Aefg0g.cspx
I was reading some Mexican online newspapers to see if they had any different takes on the story or as some of you have mentioned to see whether Tiffany has reached out to any of them. From what I have read so far, the stories are the same kind of thing as what is happening in our own media. However, I found one interesting part in this article that said there were officials from the Mexican state of Tamaulipas, where the incident occurred, that have raised questions of doubt due to no one in the area close to the lake has reported that they heard any gunshots or the sound of a jetski motors that day. (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sp/lavoz/7234136.html found here in Spanish, it says this was also reported to The Monitor but I wasn’t able to find the article it is in). Just something I thought I would throw out there, has anyone besides the mystery witness actually confirmed seeing the Hartley’s, or any jetskis, on the lake that day?
Tiffany was on Geraldo, last night? When does she sleep?
00:05:10 Here at home the disappearance of a 30-year-old colorado man allegedly shot in the head by mexican pirates as his horrified wife looked on created nonstop speculation about what happened.
http://www.livedash.com/transcript/geraldo_at_large/5202/FNC/Saturday_October_9_2010/317182/
(The transcript begins halfway down the page)
BlushingBride2Be says:
October 10, 2010 at 1:33 pm
Hi Blushing Bride- I think you may have read Blink’s piece wrong or perhaps the comments here. Although we all feel for David and his family if this happened the way it has been reported, Blink and many of us here have brought up hundreds of questions regarding Tiffany’s story. There are MAJOR DISCREPANCIES
Please, Blushing Bride, take a minute and read Blink’s entire piece. I realize that Mexico is a dangerous place. This couple lived there for YEARS- They were moving to get away from the danger, yet on a whim they head back to Mexico on a site seeing trip on a jet ski that has been having mechanical issues… Geez won’t those pirates be mad when they realize they took a faulty jetski?-
This sightseeing trip ends up with David disappearing off the face of the earth- No one can find him or his jet ski-
Something is very wrong- I took Spanish in high school and even I can understand Some Spanish- My toddler watches Dora and Diego and can understand and speak some Spanish- This lady lived in Mexico for nearly 3 years and can’t make out a single word they said?
rhoni, thank you for that research- it doesn’t seem to hard to disappear and live happily forever in Mexico….
S.H, thanks for posting the 911 call- Wow- she sounds like she reporting a broken fingernail – I would really like to hear the tape unedited- but I do not hear agony in her voice at all- perhaps she is in shock but definitely NOT distraught.