Susan Powell Husband Josh Powell Murders Kids Commits Suicide During Supervised Visitation
Joshua Powell, husband of missing and presumed deceased Utah woman Susan Powell, deliberately triggered an explosion Sunday afternoon killing himself and the couples two young sons Charles and Braden Powell.
A case worker arrived with the children for the court ordered supervised visitation was blocked entry by Powell, and shortly thereafter the home exploded.
Josh’s Father Steven is awaiting trial for various perv charges and all over creepiness, and Josh was just denied custody of the children in favor of them staying with Susan’s parents, The Cox’s.
www.blinkoncrime.com wishes to extend our sincere condolences to The Cox and members of the Powell Family who are not perverted freaks or murderers.
It would seem I recall expressing my concern this was a definite concern early on. I wish to commend all that recognized this and did everything in their power to give these beautiful little cherubs their best chance.
These little guys see their Mother today, and I pray that there is comfort in that reality for those dealing with this loss today.
Related Posts
Related Posts:
724 Comments
RSS feed for comments on this post. TrackBack URI
I would like to make a comment…IMO, we cannot try to rationalize what an irrational mind does.
It is mental illness here. There is no predictability in what a sick mind will do to one’s self or others.
So sad.
@Blink- Very sorry about the last wrong info. I pasted your link for Michael C Powell in google & the C fell off. Since I didn’t follow the case in the beginning of Susan’s disappearance, I didn’t remember everything I’ve read over the past week. I only followed bits & pieces but as of right now I’ve read every site I could find on her disappearance, but I only posted here bc you’ve put so much time into this case and still accept different scenarios without going crazy with editing people’s opinions.
So having said that, in light of everything that came out regarding Skeven (not a sp error), and in light of the fact that Michael & his siblings endured much dysfunction as children, well quite frankly it’s odd how he could stick up for Josh is the way that he has but also had an interest in politics? He’s smart according to his bio. Army Intelligence? Strong interest in Asian studies? Pro level Korean Language (which means he’s fluent – which is hard to learn)? Pair that info with fluence in IT and this guy could know more than he let’s on.
One thing to note: He was a Human Intelligence Collector in the military. If he finished his BS on top of already earning an AAS in Intelligence Operations, then how the hell DIDN”T he know what was on his Dad’s computer, afterall HE LIVED UNDER THE SAME ROOF? Also, how didn’t he know more about Josh? I’m starting to thing something more is up with this. When Josh murdered his children along with himself, maybe in his own way he was trying to take the heat off of something bigger, bigger than Susan’s disappearance (& I believe her murder). Could his family be involved in something more? Something on a larger scale?
It’s my opinion that a certain sibling knows more than was let on and there’s more to their agenda of sticking up for their brother.
@Blink- thanks, I just read your response. Also, regarding what I just posted, I believe it could be useful considering he’s the one that started up 4thekidzz & bashed the Cox fam. Again, ran for politics at the same time he lived under his father’s roof? Wow!
#50 – Blink, I agree, something smells with Ms. Powell.
@ Hi Classygal99,
I do understand where you are coming from. <3.
And, trust me, I know tragedy, stress of life ending traumas.
I don't feel (and never have) we can compare a professional to family, the emotional panic button runs on different meters unconsciously. Exactly why doctors don't operate on their own family members. These were not her chidren, Josh was not her sonny boy, it was not a day for a picnic. She was not at home with her own children, she was on duty for a job.
I don’t expect, or accept, a worker on any level to lose their objectivity and see themselves as a grandma! That alone actually scares me about this woman in future cases!
I don't expect any professional responsible for childrens safety, to be without their phone immediately with them on the job at any given time.
I don't expect anyone that smells gasoline, to waste several minutes ringing a door bell.
Or a professional on supervised visits, seeing a locked door "slammed in her face" as her sonny boy making a mistake.
I don't expect any professional crossing the lines thinking a murderering client is their buddy! The very fact he was ON supervised visits, didn't have custody tells one to be on some guard.
We are human beings, we can’t shut off all emotions, but it is imperative professionals over come as much of that as possible and remain objective. They aren’t inhumane, but they do learn to remain detached enough to perform critical operations, quick calls of judgment. I’ve known professionals that dealt with life and death every day and when it came to family, reacted completely out of control. It just isn’t the same.
I should say, if I seem strongly charged, it is because I am. Please understand, it is nothing personal to anyone but myself. When you experience first hand the horrors of a greatly flawed system, the painful results it can cause, it gives you a different eye on things. God knows I’ve cried, why why why so many times! That is emotional, but not productive, it can’t change anything. So We can either crumble in tears, or pick ourselves up to fight the war on mistakes – A vocal neon sign ‘what could be done differently”.
I believe that if nothing else, by voicing out loud all questions, we can make a difference! That dispatcher is on his best behavior for awhile for instance. People become complacent, too comfortable, bored whatever with their jobs. But for those in emergency help jobs, that isn't a luxury they can afford. If everyone made excuses there too, oh well couldn't stop it, 'poor guy was just having a bad day, his condescending unprofessional act would go on for who knows how long to harm someone next time when it might be preventable.
And I don't buy his weak spin 'didn't associate the name'. He disgusts me. He didn't need to associate the name, GASOLINE was his clue it was not a #two priority and was life threatening.
I agree Cadillac, we cannot try to rationalize what an irrational mind does. However, Pathological people have common behavior patterns and thus their behavior is somewhat predictable. Shlom, Sharai
Could Susan be hidden inside a freezer, in a storage unit in Utah?
We found out JP had a storage unit near the Graham house-so why not another one in Utah?
She wouldn’t be the first murdered person found concealed in a storage unit.
It could be registered under another name, besides Powell.
@Cindy says:
February 11, 2012 at 4:11 pm
#50 – Blink, I agree, something smells with Ms. Powell.
—————————————————–
It certainly does.
@Blink- Do you know if a sample was cut from the carpet in the direct “kool aid” spill area? Going on the notion that a liar always uses bits of truth to appear more believable, maybe Josh put a poison or a drug in Susan’s drink & she dropped it on the carpet as she was passing out. I keep thinking that if there was blood detected in that wet spot, then Josh would have been arrested immediately upon returning. Maybe police didn’t check for arsenic, Strychnine or some kind of narcotic pill or substance. Maybe that’s the huge wet spot that those fans were drying but le’s minds automatically went to blood so they might not have checked for poisons? Just a thought…
I promise I won’t type how this is done but I believe Josh bought the cans of sterno to make a sterno bomb. The gasoline spread all over paired with an exploded can of gel sterno would blow that gel on all the walls, ceilings etc and make the fire spread faster with the gasoline. He had absolutely no intention of allowing room for survival.
Evil. Pure evil.
It’s so easy to say ‘what I would have done’ if I had been in the shoes of the lady bringing the kids. How many things in my life that have happened that I thought after the fact of what I should have done instead. We make decisions at the moment the best we can with the knowledge we have at the time. And yes, there are many things I would now look back and come up with better alternatives. I feel for all those involved, especially the caseworker. She will live with the what ifs for the rest of her life The major oversight to me was allowing the visitation to continue as is with the pending psycho-sexual exam. The judge should have ceased it until the exam was administered and results assessed. But it’s easy to say this now knowing what we know.
@ blink,
Appreciate feedback! Sorry if it sounded harsh, that wasn’t my feeling. Yes, I’m making assumptions, deductions, forming opinions, subjective, not all info in. Isn’t that what we all are doing in the mix with facts as they leak out. (including LE press).
At this stage, I can’t assume she IS a professional.
I did in the beginning. But flags have been going up.
I’m not basing a comment out of the air on raw emotions.
I can’t find any evidence of anything I consider professional.
Foster care parents, God Bless them! I thank God we see one that isn’t in the news as the abuser / killer. And I think if I had to have kids in foster care, she’d be a wonderful soul. However, I do not consider forster parent in the meaning of ‘professional’.
Deductive thinking –
Checked WA licensing, SW, nursing – can’t find anything there.
Checked FCN site, they appear to be primarily a Foster Care org.
Checked publications which are very few and give no credentials.
Appears she is a recruiter for Foster parents. Commendable, but anyone with her dedication could fill that role.
Media and LE who are known for identifying credentials in press have never once added any to her.
She herself presented none at any time.
And,IMO, seemed slightly off kilter as to what to ID herself as a ‘profession title’ in her calls.
Googled my finders away. Found nothing you’d expect on any ‘professional’.
Most importantly, it is not a question I have to disparage her in anyway! I think we come from the same line of thought – This goes to DHS, not her. WTH is WA DHS doing sending out these people? That ‘accepted’ practice I certainly do not blame Hall for! We can agree, the answers to that ludicrous gem goes much higher up.
On she would have died, maybe it will help to see my thinking –
all MY OPINION ONLY.
If I look at Josh’s choice of profession, Josh had the typical trait of programmers – very methodical. Step by step like the POS writing a program, he studied and knew this worker’s habits. How she got out of the car, how the children arrived ahead, how the elderly woman couldn’t run with them to keep up, how she allowed them to bolt out of the car before her etc. Nothing startling to call alarm IMO. But details calculating killers use.
He studied her. Saw her playing grandma. He played on that,counted on it! He knew she was in his favor, thought him mr nice guy, (guard down) she was predictable, a killer’s dream. She was no match. That’s not knocking her, FEW are! Her world came from a happy place, from innocent children, not cunning conniving killers.
By her own words, the children always ran ahead of this elderly woman. Checkmark in killer’s head. He knew she failed to carry her phone all the time. Checkmark. An astute methodical thinker, studying details important to him.
Hence, the plan was never set to take her with! IMO
Locking her out was pivotal to the plan. For sure, just as we easily can see she is a kind sweet unsuspecting lady, so did he!
In my deductions re: POS killer MO. She was never at risk to be in the fire. Locking her out was always part of the plan! I also suspect, leaving ‘grandma’ type, someone the boys liked, he seethed with anger / resentment under the surface. He perceived her too guilty of taking controls away from him, and worse, the boys liking her. Like the Cox’s, POS wanted her to survive — his deranged idea of paybacks for taking his “propety” (the boys) from him.
The ‘sheepish’ last look she said she saw – If he really said, I’ve got a surprise to Charlie — IMO, that sheepish look was his POS mind
“and I’ve got a surprise for you too”.
JMO
I guess this is a question for the medical examiners and forensic experts – if someone was murdered in December 2009 and kept refrigerated e.g., in a storage unit for all these years, and then the “utilities were shut off” would the ME still be able to determine how long the victim had been deceased?
Awww man…
http://m.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/02/josh-powell-children-funeral-photos-charlie-braden-0
Listening to all of the “after-blame”, is sickening.
Maybe one key part of this atrocity is that powell picked up and moved to another state. He may have been watched much more carefully had he stayed in Utah. I think that anyone that deals with intergovernmental law would agree. After that move occurred, everything was much more difficult, and I’m certain that powell knew that.
@blink.
Is Hall a licensed social worker in WA?
Sammi said not.
You have to have a license in Washington.
Was an unlicensed person assigned professional work by this non-profit.
I think we former agency workers have met “sweet” non profit workers, , who wreaked havoc by their “do gooding” & thus we may be sensitive.
@ blink
Re Alina connection, did you catch in Dateline they said Josh was staying at his father’s house, not at the ‘staged’ house.
Yes, I was aware that neighbors never saw him outside of the visitations.
B
http://www.doh.wa.gov/hsqa/Professions/Social_Worker/licensure.htm
Under provider search, I don’t see a license at any level under any name variation
With all due respect Blink, you would not want a hospital’s certified volunteer to perform your mammo or MRI.
Even though those are rote kind of jobs, and anyone with supervision could likely do them, they take professional training.
JP’s body will be released to a cousin? What about his sister Alina, or brothers?
______________________
“Pierce County sheriff’s spokesman Ed Troyer said Saturday that Josh Powell’s body will be released to a cousin Monday.”
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/02/11/10382339-two-beautiful-boys-hundreds-mourn-powell-brothers-killed-in-arson
Re the unclefixer channel – he/she joined Dec 20 2009, and by the posts he claims to be very upset about the system picking on dads and taking their kids away. Since December 2009,the only media case he’s commented on wrt. dad’s being unfairly targeted because mom “the whore” is missing – is the Powell case. Rest of the time he does political commentary. I’d put money he’s related, and if so, wonder if he/she has a storage unit too.
@ rose
Thanks for checking the license areas and confiriming you can’t find anything either. I appeaciate knowing I didnt’ miss something. Feel free to keep an eye on me though. I’ll miss something along the way.
@ blink, Dateline ref LE saying he was staying at his fathers (not the neighbors reports). Saw Troyer speculating on it a few days ago, has anyone seen if that’s been backed by something solid?
Could someone please explain what about the ‘wet spot’. I wasn’t following until recently and am not finding more than a mention of it. Was it tested, results ever known?
POS had IT skills, his Utah computer had ‘a form of child porn’ on it & some ‘disturbing drawing/s of woman/women’.
His father had ‘child porn etc’ on his computer.
There is 1 person who is free & alive, & drawing a lot of attention, & still living in the father’s home, Alina.
There were @ least 4 emails & 1 voice mail from POS to Alina. She claimed to 911 operators she didn’t know POS’s address …
… could all the w/d of $$ & transfer of $$ be as simple as keeping it from being seized by the Cox family for wrongful death, or from the owner of the rental house POS burned to the ground ??
… utilities ‘shut off’?? Computers & utilities … ??
Could there be some ‘cloud based child porn storage’ -or- ??
Yes, it seems 1 questions leads to 10 more…
“We are witnessing a seismic shift in information technology — the kind that comes around every decade or so. It is so massive that it affects not only business models, but the underlying architecture of how we develop, deploy, run and deliver applications. This shift has given a new relevance to ideas such as cloud computing and utility computing. Not surprisingly, these two different ideas are often lumped together.”
What is Utility Computing?
While utility computing often requires a cloud-like infrastructure, its focus is on the business model on which providing the computing services are based. Simply put, a utility computing service is one in which customers receive computing resources from a service provider (hardware and/or software) and “pay by the drink,” much as you do for your electric service at home.
Amazon Web Services (AWS), despite a recent outage, is the current poster child for this model as it provides a variety of services, among them the Elastic Compute Cloud (EC2), in which customers pay for compute resources by the hour, and Simple Storage Service (S3), for which customers pay based on storage capacity. Other utility services include Sun’s Network.com, EMC’s recently launched storage cloud service, and those offered by startups such as Joyent and Mosso.
What is Cloud Computing?
Cloud computing is a broader concept than utility computing and relates to the underlying architecture in which the services are designed. It may be applied equally to utility services and internal corporate data centers, as George Gilder reported in a story for Wired Magazine titled The Information Factories. Wall Street firms have been implementing internal clouds for years. They call it “grid computing,” but the concepts are the same.
Although it is difficult to come up with a precise and comprehensive definition of cloud computing, at the heart of it is the idea that applications run somewhere on the “cloud” (whether an internal corporate network or the public Internet) – we don’t know or care where. But as end users, that’s not big news: We’ve been using web applications for years without any concern as to where the applications actually run.
The big news is for application developers and IT operations. Done right, cloud computing allows them to develop, deploy and run applications that can easily grow capacity (scalability), work fast (performance), and never — or at least rarely — fail (reliability), all without any concern as to the nature and location of the underlying infrastructure.
Taken to the next step, this implies that cloud computing infrastructures, and specifically their middleware and application platforms, should ideally have these characteristics.
http://gigaom.com/2008/02/28/how-cloud-utility-computing-are-different/
imo Sammi’s deduction it was pivotal to his plan that JP to lock out EGH & integral that he planned her survival, and why he choose that path, are spot on. Ordinarily, unless he wanted her alive for a reason, anyone as sociopathic as JP would’ve chopped her too. Much easier & less risky the latter way. Ensuring she lived was more spiteful, . imo he was wage filled over her taking away the children twice a week He knew she’d scuttle back to her car, & he gave her time to do so. Probably watching out the window to be sure. He was a meticulously planful man & EGH would not have been left to chance. She was a gift to him by the foster care agency.
rage filled – sorry
Rose
EGH was a gift to JP not only by the foster care agency, but by the court (the judge) and the entire design of the CPS system in Washington State.
It always takes something as harsh and crazy as JP’s destruction of his family to make the public aware of the failure of government to properly do their job. Maybe someone will start a process to get this problem corrected. Without a doubt, the 911 system needs to be redesigned and new training proceedures envoked.
There should never be a grandmother type allowed to supervise children at a residence or any uncontrolled facility. There are plenty of young women who could have taken off with the boys and she could not have stopped the abduction just as this one was unable to stop what occured.
The key mistake was in letting JP leave the state of Utah. He was working from home and getting paid doing programming or system design, so it really didn’t matter where the residence was located. All JP wanted to do was to get to Washington State to get help from his fractured family.
Somebody in the secretive Powell family knows more than they are telling, whether it is the brother, Alina or the ghastly Steve-
Blink or others will LE have the proper tools to make them talk or can they keep stone-walling? I guess my question is if they lawyer up like they have in the past-what if anything can the authorities do to find Susan’s body and bring some closure to the Cox family?
@ Rose,
I see a very familiar face in mr smirk powell. No, I don’t know him per se. I’m not a shrink, or even an educated person. To me, it doesn’t matter what name they have, what color eyes, there are many ‘mr nice guys.’
Contrary to outward deviates, the ones that laugh outwardly, openly enjoy their dirty deeds and have no shame in letting others know it – mr nice guy operates from the very need to see himself as Mr Nice Guy! He isn’t evil, cruel or mean. ‘I don’t enjoy hurting’ ‘not my fault, they made me do it’.
I think it is more complicated than just anger, rage. In their mind it is all a game — he must win at all cost! Big games, little games, but always out to win. And dare you win, he’ll show you! I believe it isn’t about the rage as much as the mask and the games played for that. Rage alone, the Cox’s death would have been the goal. I believe the driving force is what I have call the mr nice guy monster. More formally we tag them passive aggressive but mr nice guy has his own slot in that, he must be seen as mr nice guy and works hard at it.
Hence you always see the infamous smirk when they think they won something or someone over. It is the one thing they can’t control and don’t even know that while their dark mind is enjoying their win, “Ha, I got em ” that subtle smirk slips out. Sometimes they are so damned pleased with themselves, they even brag aloud, burst out laughing, ‘you have to admit, I got you (them) good on this one’.
If one points out it wasn’t funny, it is never their fault ‘you made me do it’
Even things they do that aren’t violent but hurtful emotionally, mr nice guy isn’t mean, cruel, dangerous — “its ‘your own fault’ “I would never have done it if you/she/he/they hadn’t … ”
mr nice guy has very consistent physical traits.
Scrunched brows – playing dumb, innocent, indigence. And, the smirk. The smirk leaks out when they are enjoying their accomplishments or like in this case, getting away with their deeds. So damned pleased with themselves, unaware the smirk their thrill of the win or cat and mouse game is leaking out. The scrunched brow however, they are very aware, it is a deliberate facial expression. Part of the act.
I speak specifically to the ones that think they are masters at presenting mr nice guy persona. They hate not being liked because it represents failure to ‘win’ his deceptive mark. Worse however, is being ‘caught! Not in a criminal sense, even in every day actions, told “you don’t fool me’. If not believing his act actually makes him feel cornered, you might tell, or like here a situation where the mask would bring public outing, he panics. I swear, if you could take his heart rate, you’d see they do have feelings, for themselves. Actions go into fighting to preserve the mask at all cost! Emergency mode you might say.
Payback games for perceived wrongs, have many degrees to the games. Could be something just irritated him . He might hide your car keys. If you are family, accuse you of losing them. If a coworker or outside enemy, he will get a laugh out of watching you ‘hunt’ through your dilemma. And the ultimate, out right hurtful deadly vindictive paybacks. Often willing to wait. Cat and mouse can be a thrill. Until you threaten their mask! They become instantly consumed, they can barely breath! The ‘game’ is no longer a fun conquest but serious battle at this level, now driven in vengeance, ‘I’ll get em if it’s the last thing I do’.
Although there are other psychological contributory factors, twists and turns in POS brain, like many, I think it was the court ordering his mask be ripped right off his face that drew his serious revenge. The court called checkmate on a game he knew he could not win. He was cornered. He’ll show em!
And although we ‘see’ anger, what is really there?
I see mr nice guy playing his games. Spending last breath, still grasping desperately to hold his nice guy mask on – ‘can’t live without my boys’
and of course, it is important to get his final ‘win’ – dish his payback, ‘here, take this!’ ((smirk)) I’ve got a surprise for you all.
In his not my fault mind his enemy would have to live ‘knowing they caused this the rest of their life’. An IMAGINED fate but not being a nice guy, what he gave was his own ultimate reveal. He was a POS!
I’m also thinking the hachette was far more than payback to the boys for talking. That could play a part, as so could his perceived betrayal, the boys liking others. IMO, it goes beyond those feelings. Methodic revenge screams out of the whole act. He planned that part for the ghastly horror of it all, shock value which in his mind, would cement more suffering / guilt same old ‘ you caused it’ excuse. And of course the sick family shot out of the gate, couldn’t wait to jump to send the same BS message. That message was more important to them than their barely mentioned thought of two innocent children!
>>> Barf.
Sorry this got so long!
” sammi says:
February 11, 2012 at 7:22 pm
He studied her. Saw her playing grandma. He played on that,counted on it!
The ‘sheepish’ last look she said she saw – If he really said, I’ve got a surprise to Charlie — IMO, that sheepish look was his POS mind
“and I’ve got a surprise for you too”.
——————————————
Chilling. I have been thinking about those moments too, as IMO her description to 911 was just so inept.
There is no way he looked as safe as houses as the way she describes his ‘friendly enough, sheepish look’ WTH is a sheepish look?
-I am a wolf in sheep’s clothing.-
Her 911 call, so unalarming, and her interview, so unemotional, I am just floored by the inadequacy of her reactions. It helps me to understand it with your post in regard to seeing herself in a grandmotherly role. WTF?!
She was supposed to be a guardian between safety and horror. I’m just so sad. I still don’t really blame her, I’m just sick about it all for the babies.
“Rose says:
February 12, 2012 at 5:36 am
rage filled – sorry”
_________________________
I certainly get that. . .
Investigators of Powell case search recycling center
PUYALLUP, Wash. — Volunteers spent Sunday sifting through paper at a recycling center, searching for possible clues in disappearance of West Valley City mother Susan Cox Powell.
Pierce County Sheriff’s detective Ed Troyer said volunteers with experience in evidence searches have been searching the facility at the landfill near Puyallup since 8 a.m. and likely will continue until dark.
The sheriff’s office is following up on a tip that the missing woman’s husband, Josh Powell, may have dumped papers there before killing himself and his two sons a week ago.
“We had the tip awhile back, but we didn’t go out there because we’ve had better things to do until today,” Troyer said.
snip
Troyer said it’s unlikely crews will find anything of note at the recycling center.
“We may not find anything,” he said, “and it may just be old paperwork or cable TV bills.”
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=960&sid=19209943
Zeus…..I checked and in fact there are storage areas with electrical outlets that accomadate freezers, climate controled areas, of course all offered with an extra charge. Physician store medical supplies or medications in some. Even cremation does not turn the entire body into ash.
Another thought I recently had was life insurance on the Children. Pos would not benifit cause suicide is not covered on insurance.. Accident and murder victims are. Wonder if there is insurance who the benificiary is.
Riverpearl…..Thanks for the very informative post
In memory of Charlie and Braden Powell….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xExJRwDM1H4&feature=related
I prefer not to focus on the social worker at all.
I want to get back to the beginning of this crime
and rethink it in light of recent events.
Key questions for me –
1. Who killed Susan and why (basic stuff).
Was it Josh because she was leaving him?
Or was it Mr. Perv because she shunned his
advances? Or, related to Titch’s excellent
post above, was it for other reasons?
And of course the timing – this was def
in the premeditated category. Not a crime
of passion. Why then? Dec 6th?
2. Either Josh or his dad are logical
suspects, as are the motives. But a more
complicated question is how they both
might be involved. Was Steve brought in
for the disposal only? I have a hard time
imagining Josh disposing of Susan by himself.
Don’t think so. I think he had to have help
at some point in the process.
3. Cause of death is also very foggy.
Was she killed at home or elsewhere?
We can assume?? there was no blood discovered
on the walls or carpet. So violent blow to the
head seems unlikely, at least not in the house.
And the boys were home. Loud noises would have
run the risk of alerting them. Drugs seem likely,
but then that takes a little knowledge and
experience usually. No record of Josh having
any history with drugs or poisons. Discovery of
the drug (autopsy) would not have been a concern
if he/they were also going to dispose of the body.
Still, the dinner Josh cooked, the evidence of
Susan “not feeling well” all suggest poison.
But then a lot of drugs have a taste, at least
if you take a fatal amount. Knowing how much
to put in the food without the risk of discovery
is a problem for me.
4. How do two “amateur killers” dispose of a body
this well? Mine shaft? Help putting her there.
Chest freezer? None at the Josh house. So had
to use another person for that. Steve was involved
I believe. As with the “C word” trial, there is
some kind of sick bond between father and child
here (hell, the whole family’s pathological)
whereas even if Josh killed her, he could count
on help from Steve. I’m amazed that in the dead
of winter they managed to get rid of Susan so
effectively. No blood, no remains, no bones.
I’m reminded of Ira Eichorn and
putting his girlfriend in a trunk. A freezer
is a very likely possibility. Susan may well
yet be found.
Also, let’s remember that Josh worked for
trucking company. Maybe someone gave the
body a ride out of town?
5. And the why now factor? It would seem there
is now a strong possibility that Susan was threatening
to blow the whistle on Steve’s/Josh’s child porn
hobbies. And of course that meant Josh would
lose contact with his sons. She had to be silenced.
The act of murder, in a case where neither son
or father have any criminal (homicide) past, means
that something had reached a crisis point. Dramatic
steps had to be taken by one or both men.
What was that crisis that pushed things to the
ultimate solution? That is the key question.
How does everybody feel about subjecting Steve
to waterboarding to get more info out of him??
Would that seem unkind? Hah.
Sherlock
This is the second or third media explanation article I’ve run across. What’s going on that they are at attention to explain their coverage? Very interesting they are saying there are other things they didn’t report. WTH could be more disturbing than the hatchet details?!
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705550262/Josh-Powell-tragedy-Its-the-newsrooms-job-to-shine-light-in-dark-places.html
snip
At KSL, we have had many internal discussions about how to deal with the Powell story.
There are hundreds of pages of documents and search warrants all containing other very disturbing information that we have chosen not to report.
@Sherlock says:
February 13, 2012 at 1:06 am
How does everybody feel about subjecting Steve
to waterboarding to get more info out of him??
Would that seem unkind? Hah.
Sherlock
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
… maybe Steve needs a “little Q & A time with other inmates???”
Excessive press coverage of the details of this crime could be prejudicial to Steven Powell’s criminal case (at least his lawyer will argue that). For that reason, I think some of the detail will be slow to come forward.
I am not convinced that Josh was the murderer. It would not surprise me at all if his father was involved as more than an accessory after the fact.
I am not convinced these two humps are not responsible for epidemial gingivitis.
WHO on high alert.
Not being glib, demonstrating my open-ness to depravity I have not yet met with these two.
B
Got dropped
thanks
@Sherlock says:
February 13, 2012 at 1:06 am
How does everybody feel about subjecting Steve
to waterboarding to get more info out of him??
Would that seem unkind? Hah.
Sherlock
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
… maybe Steve needs a “little Q & A time with other inmates???”
… “a little PRIVATE time Q & A with inmates [we all know how inmates feel about child pervs/murderers]” …
Blink, I know this is an old story now but if it hasn’t been mentioned, do you think STUPID AZZ Powell got the money to buy the gas and hatchet from the media? Where did he get his money? Was he working or did he just get paid for interviews? Was the media sustaining his life style? I sure hope NOT!
BTW, I’m physically OK, just been away for a while. In case you’re wondering.
This article is worth a read
Murder In The Courts: All In The Name Of Parental Rights?
http://www.forbes.com/sites/crime/2012/02/13/murder-in-the-courts-all-in-the-name-of-parental-rights/2/
Last photo of Josh Powell alive
http://www.q13fox.com/news/kcpq-last-photo-of-josh-powell-20120210,0,7752867.story
Chuck and Judy Cox learn of grandsons’ deaths through Facebook
http://www.examiner.com/missing-persons-in-national/chuck-and-judy-cox-learn-of-grandsons-deaths-through-facebook
Expert: Dispatcher wasted time, delayed help to fatal Powell house fire
Dispatchers are trained to ask who, what, when, where and if there are weapons or injuries involved, Maeir said. The two pieces of information necessary to input a call into the dispatcher’s computer system are the address of the event and the nature of the emergency, she said.
She said that while one person is typing and asking questions, a second person already may be notifying emergency responders.
As for the 911 call placed outside Josh Powell’s home, Thompson ran that call information through his dispatching software four different times. Each time, one minute into the call, the software recognized the situation as a custodial abduction and immediately moved it to a higher dispatch level, meaning officers would have immediately responded.
“My personal thought is that the dispatcher didn’t know what to ask. He was shooting in the dark and trying to come up with something he could deal with,” Thompson said.
Thompson also was concerned that the dispatcher’s lack of clear questioning led him to believe the situation at Powell’s home was not life-threatening despite the protestations of the caseworker.
“They are on polar opposites of the issues — he’s not asking questions to develop the information, and she’s not giving that information on her own to make that decision,” he said.
http://www.fireengineering.com/news/2012/02/11/expert-dispatcher-waste
d-time-delayed-help-to-fatal-powell-house-fire.html
@BLINK~
You mentioned “Fred Meyer” …
Hope its cameras & dumpster etc were checked …
[more of POS's movement on Saturday @ LINK]
Powell’s mundane final hours before atrocity: Errands at bank, storage unit and Fred Meyer
Josh Powell spent his last day alive running the errands that mark the humdrum of daily life. Powell, it turns out, checked off the items on his list with monstrous intent.
Also Saturday, Powell is thought to have stopped by the Fred Meyer store at 17404 Meridian Ave. E. some time between 7:44 p.m. and 8:12 p.m, according to Sheriff’s Department records.
“Det. Tom Catey contacted Fred Meyer store security and was advised there is video of a male subject they believe to be Powell purchasing a gas canister within 24 hours prior to the homicide,” court records show.
Investigators later found two gas cans inside the burned-out house where Powell and his sons died. They believe he poured gasoline throughout the house, and possibly on his sons, before igniting the inferno.
Powell also is thought to have dropped off a box of toys and books at a Salvation Army donation center in the Fred Meyer parking lot, according to Sheriff’s Department records.
A woman called detectives Monday to say she’d taken a box of toys and books from the center Sunday night and found the names of Josh and Susan Powell written inside some of the books, the records indicate.
http://www.thenewstribune.com/2012/02/10/2021264/powells-mundane-final-hours-before.html?storylink=mrc
@sammie says:
February 13, 2012 at 9:30 am
… “There are hundreds of pages of documents and search warrants all containing other very disturbing information that we have chosen not to report.”
… “disturbing information” may be …
“They believe he poured gasoline throughout the house,
and possibly ***on his sons***,
before igniting the inferno.” http://www.thenewstribune.com/2012/02/10/2021264/powells-mundane-final-hours-before.html?storylink=mrc
__________________________________________________________________
@BLINK – Have you seen or know WHAT “hundreds of pages of documents and search warrants all containing other very disturbing information” is about??
Could it be “images from POS’s 2009 computer” -or- is this ‘strictly regarding Charlie & Braden” -or- ??
I guess I answered your question sammie. They paid for the hatchet!
Lea Conner says: February 7, 2012 at 3:54 am
Omitted. See post at:
http://blinkoncrime.com/2012/02/05/susan-powell-husband-josh-powell-murders-kids-commits-suicide-during-supervised-visitation/comment-page-4/#comment-1845753
Blink replied:
“Ok, point taken, and I should have mentioned I was speaking in a general sense of the best interests of the child- always the burden of the court.
“In the Horman matter, we KNOW an ex parte hearing resulted in the initial TRO- ergo, can we not assume that whatever the court considered as evidence in granting such a petition is NOT known to us? It is my understanding that the court considered evidence relative to the mfh as it’s basis for protecting the safety of Kiara?
“This sounds to me like LE was juggling case sensitive information to protect a prosecution, but providing what it could in a different jurisdiction because they took the concern for the children seriously.
“If you have never watched Powell in court, he was un-hinged at best. He had dark circles under his eyes and I am pretty sure he was on some sort of medications delaying his speech patterns.
“Is my predisposition to the belief he would absolutely harm his kids when backed into a corner?
“Perhaps.
“Let me ask it this way- if you had been representing the Cox family in the matter ( all other matters to date the same, to apply) with the judge’s finding that Josh had to undergo a psycho sexual evaluation based on information that was provided ( you would have been privy to) would you have advised the Cox’s to seek an ex parte TRO ?
“If you ever have a similar case and you personally feel there is a potential for violence against the children has this situation changed the way you might conduct your representation if you were representing the petitioners?
“I appreciate your perspective as always, and more importantly I appreciate your ability to direct meaningful and constructive conversation where I seem to be at a loss to do so.
“B”
It’s difficult for me to write objectively about the Josh Powell murders without it sounding like some kind of defense of the guy. I am horrified at what he did to Charlie and Braden Powell, and their mother Susan Cox Powell. I hope there is a very hot corner of hell reserved for him to suffer for all eternity.
Josh Powell’s children were placed with his in-laws as a result of a dependency action (RCW 13.34) that was filed after police discovered child pornography that belonged to Steve Powell, Josh Powell’s father, with whom Josh Powell and his sons Charlie and Braden were living at the time.
Under Washington state law, the court was required to provide a reunification plan, and to provide visitation unless limiting or denying visitation was necessary to “protect the child’s health, safety or welfare”:
“Visitation is the right of the family, including the child and the parent, in cases in which visitation is in the best interest of the child. . . . Visitation may be limited or denied only if the court determines that such limitation or denial is necessary to protect the child’s health, safety, or welfare. . . .” RCW 13.34.136(ii).
I agree that Mr. Powell looked unhinged in court. However, Mr. Powell had also completed a court-ordered psychological exam and complied with the court’s other orders, as noted by the court at the February 1 review hearing. The psychologist evaluating Mr. Powell found “improvements” that Mr. Powell had made in his life, which apparently referenced in part Mr. Powell moving from Steve Powell’s residence. There was also information before the court indicating that Mr. Powell had participated in residential time and his visitations with Braden and Charlie were going well.
In Washington state, the burden of proof is on the moving party to show good cause for restrictions on parenting time. Any restriction must also relate to the underlying concern.
In this case, law enforcement had not arrested Josh Powell for any crime. Although Mr. Powell was called a person of interest in his wife’s disappearance, he had not been arrested nor charged. The court had removed the children from his care in fall 2010 based on the fact that he lived with his father, who was arrested for child pornography.
The psychologist who evaluated Mr. Powell recommended that the court require Mr. Powell to obtain a psycho-sexual evaluation. The court ordered that this occur.
Based on the psychological evaluation of Josh Powell and the assistant AG’s stated concerns about the sexually explicit images, the court had good cause to require supervised visitation whereby Mr. Powell was not allowed to remain with the children unattended, and all communication and interaction between Mr. Powell and the children was monitored and documented in notes kept by the visitation supervisor.
Unless there was evidence that supervised visitation was inadequate to address the concerns, a motion to suspend or terminate visitation would have failed. Absent such evidence, the attorneys acted correctly in not bringing any such motion.
Judges and attorneys make decisions based on the information before the court. The difficulty here is the court had no evidence that Josh Powell was capable of murdering his children, nor that visitation in and of itself posed a threat to the children’s health, safety, or welfare. Whatever Mr. Powell had going on, it evaded detection by a psychologist.
For all of his problems, Mr. Powell is not the craziest looking person to show up in family court. His demeanor though “off” comported with the court rules. There are far worse characters that show up on the family law docket, and many of them are decent parents who do not do well under the pressure of appearing in court.
The Horman matter and Josh Powell’s residential time are very different matters.
The Horman TRO application does not allege specific threat nor specific dates. Contrast this with the Oregon FAPA Benchguide instructions as to adequate cause for a FAPA restraining order:
“F. Specific Allegations Required
“The petition must specifically allege: 1. The nature of the abuse, described with particularity; and 2. Specific dates of abuse.”
http://courts.oregon.gov/OJD/docs/OSCA/cpsd/courtimprovement/familylaw/FAPA_Benchguide_4-24-06.pdf
Compare this with the language in the order that does not specify personal knowledge nor specific facts as basis for the order:
“Describe the incident(s) of abuse that happened in the last 180 days: Describe how Respondent hurt or threatened to hurt you, starting with the most recent incident:
“Date: June 4, 2010 – present, County/State: Multnomah/OR: I believe Respondent is involved in the disappearance of my son Kyron who has been missing since June 4, 2010. I also recently learned that Respondent attempted to hire someone to murder me. The police have provided me with probable cause to believe the above two statements to be true.” The handwriting in the last sentence of this section differs from the other handwriting in the petition.
Elsewhere in the petition, Mr. Horman says “Respondent attempted to hire someone to murder me,” and states this occurred at the “end of 2009″ in “Mult[nomah]/OR.”
The order sealing the restraining order references “FTR” wich is an audio recording of the hearing. That recording remains under seal. There may be something within that audio recording that provides further evidence. That audio recording has been available to Terri Horman and her lawyers. I suspect that if anything, that audio recording might indicate that the court requested clarification of the section regarding incidents in the last 180 days, and as a result, the last line was added during the hearing. There may also be some indication on the records that the prosecutor believed it was necessary to seal the court file.
Given that Ms. Horman has never been charged, Mr. Houze and Mr. Bunch most likely did not challenge the restraining order because doing so would open the door to discovery. Through discovery in the civil matter, the district attorney could learn of information it would not otherwise have access and build a case to fit whatever facts resulted from discovery.
Terri Horman’s attorney Stephen Houze did not challenge the restraining order. To do so would have opened the door to discovery, and would essentially helped law enforcement shore up any problems with its case prior to charging.
Thus, if Mr. Houze believed that Ms. Horman was being railroaded or that law enforcement had a less than solid case, opening the door to discovery would only harm his client. That same rationale is why defense attorneys advise their clients not to talk to law enforcement.
This is a well-founded concern given the history of the FBI, Oregon State Police, Multnomah County District Attorney, and Multnomah County Sheriff’s Office in obtaining a false confession and conviction against Laverne Pavlinac and John Sosnovske, who were convicted of a murder committed by Keith Jesperson (the “Happy Face Killer”).
http://www.nytimes.com/1995/11/26/us/evidence-clears-two-the-law-doesn-t.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
http://articles.latimes.com/1996-09-01/magazine/tm-39549_1_jim-mcintyre
The people making claims about Ms. Horman–who has not been charged with any crime–are these same law enforcement entities and district attorney involved in prosecuting Laverne Pavlinac and John Sosnovske.
Hi Blink and All! This story is such a sad story. Steven Powell is the source of so much damage to so many people on so many different levels. Josh Powell’s psyche was no doubt poisoned by his predatory father at an age when he was not able to process ugly and deviant material shown to him. One can only imagine what else Steven Powell exposed his children to. As an adult, Josh Powell’s childhood experiences showed up in ways that alarmed many people, who knew he was not right. Susan Powell knew he wasn’t right either, and felt that she could fix him. When she realized she couldn’t fix him, and wanted out of the marriage, he made sure she could never leave. The whole story reeks of red flags that should have been obvious to the powers that could have protected Braden and Charlie. The tip-off for me was when Steven Powell was arrested last year for possession of child pornography. That should have been the ‘can of worms’ to open the psychological testing that Josh Powell needed to have done then! I’m sure we are not privy to so much of the alarming dangers that surrounded those boys while his father had custody. I’m not sure I really want to know.
Sherlock, I feel like you right now. I have been compelled into re-reading and re-watching old video interviews about this case.
It feels like something got missed or we are lacking some bits of info that would shine a light on how this horrible case was leading up to the hell this turned into.
I saw a video interview with JP from 2010, and in it he says a phrase that really bothers me–see what you guys think:
******************
“She knows she will be chewed up like hamburger when she comes back,”
Josh Powell said in a Wednesday interview with The Salt Lake Tribune.
(dated Nov. 8 2010)
*******************
Add http in front of link-
://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/50609169-78/powell-josh-susan-cox.html.csp
—————–
I found this Seamus O’ Reilly statement analysis, where the “hamburger” quote and other items are discussed-interesting reading:
Add http in front of link-
://seamusoriley.blogspot.com/2011/08/voice-for-susan-cox.html
———————
Sherlock says:
February 13, 2012 at 1:06 am
I prefer not to focus on the social worker at all.
I want to get back to the beginning of this crime
and rethink it in light of recent events.
@ Lea. You Go, Girl
True Dat Y’all.
B
Couple new items in this article about back when Susan went missing-and just before she went missing.
————————————-
“Police getting new tips in Susan Powell murder case”
~~Robin Snyder claims she recently met with police. She claims she saw Josh Powell and his two sons the day after Susan went missing in 2009.
Back then, Snyder says she at a Sandy hotel where she was in charge of overseeing the free breakfast for guests.
At the time she had no idea who Powell was or that anyone was looking for him.
“I was standing right behind Charlie,” Snyder says. “And Charlie looked right up at me and he says ‘do you know what happened to my mom?’ so I say ‘no what happened to your mom?’”
Before getting an answer Snyder was called to the kitchen.
When she came back she says they were gone.~~
http://www.abc4.com/content/news/slc/story/Police-getting-new-tips-in-Susan-Powell-murder/OO8aMVY0gku92ZTkRNmtyA.cspx
—————————————————–
I was not clear from that article if the name of the Hotel was Sandy, or the town?
B