Kyron Horman Missing: Civil Suit Against Terri Horman DELAYED AND SEALED- Prompted By NEW LEADS
Portland, OR- As many of you have been following since June 2010, there is a new development today in the disappearance of Kyron Horman.
As predicted at BOC, the civil suit brought by Deisree Young, Kyron’s Mother, against Terri Horman, Kyron’s step-mother and the defacto suspect in his disappearance has been granted an abatement.
In a sealed filing, motions by Assistant District Attorney Michael Schrunk and Multnomah County Sheriff Dan Staton were granted, delaying the suit . The motions included supporting affidavits that continuing the action as already ruled would compromise the investigation.
The decision presents an ironic twist .
Terri Horman’s lawyers originally fought vehemently to abate the action, but were unsuccessful. As recently as last week, the Judge in the case ordered medical records to be accessible to both parties to the action.
In Judge Kantnor’s decision to NOT abate the suit at the request of Attorney Peter Bunch for Terri Horman, the Multnomah County Prosecutors Office declared “no position” on the matter after being contacted by the court.
It is not known if that order prompted the request to delay the suit .
Sheriff Stanton, Eldin Rosenthal, Norm Frink and Stephen Houze declined comment at press time.
On Monday, Judge Henry Kantor granted the motions to abate the civil proceeding and ordered the motions and affidavits filed by the district attorney and sheriff sealed.
A hearing had been scheduled for Dec. 14 to hear Young’s attorney argue before the court to compel testimony from DeDe Spicher, an alleged witness in the case. Today’s ruling is likely to render a postponement of that proceeding.
Sheriff Dan Staton, told Oregon Live, it is based on early leads that are now panning out:
“There are a couple of investigative pieces that are going to open up,” Staton told The Oregonian Tuesday. “Our belief is they’re going to open up several investigative doors.”
He said the new “investigative avenues” are based on information collected in the early phase of the investigation that are now yielding some results.
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I read back; some thought ransom treatment was due to a
speculation the eyeglasses pictured were the originals & a pic was
made without glasses. Another blog speculated you had inside info
on LE thinking ransom, but I didn’t see it in yr first thread.
http://www.kezi.com/schools-warn-of-stranger-danger/
SPRINGFIELD, Ore. — Two Springfield middle school students were offered soda if they agreed to get in a strangers car.
SPD is now investigating the encounter. It says two 11 year olds were walking home from Agnus Stewart Middle School Wednesday when they say on Cherokee Drive they were approached by two males in a blue SUV. The boys were told there was soda in the car and they should get in.
The boys did not and instead went directly home and told their parents who then called police. Police went out looking for the car but had no luck finding it.
(snipped more @ link)
Considering the failed sting was on June 26 2010, this snippet which infers a time-frame preceding the LE sting, struck me in an odd way:
from page 8 of pdf file,
Petitioner’s Response to Respondent’s Motion to Modify Restraining Order
filed/entered October 25, 2010
“I moved out of the marital residence on June 26, 2010 and took Kiara with me. Before leaving, I made Respondent aware through a text message that I had been briefed by law enforcement, that I knew what was going on, and that I would contact her later.”
http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/petition.PDF
or
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/10/kaine_horman_calls_his_estrang.html
So did or didn’t KH know about the upcoming sting?
Is this text message what TMH later references that night when saying he was pretty angry with her before he left and what can they do to resolve this?
You know wpg30- I think it must be back to basics week in this case. In retrospect, everything one needs to know is in that response.
Few things.. pay attention to the careful wording. “She ATTEMPTED” to hire a 3rd party to murder me. Desiree recently used the word manipulated. How strong do we really think a case for mfh is?
I find it incredulous that his text to her was not attached although hers were. Saying he was briefed by LE was not an announcement he was leaving the marital residence and the marriage.
My favorite- “she lied to the media when they were trying to assist us.”
So then, it is clear. Kaine et al tipped off the media that he moved out and therefore ambushed TMH at her own house before she was served.
That was part of DY assertions in her tort.
I was not aware of the legal basis for providing sworn statements to tresspassers or uninvited guests on one’s property who are asking you personal questions that are none of their business in the first place, to then be published publicly.
None of which included “Get the eff off my property” which is what they would have heard from me in a similar situation.
B
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2013/03/logan_storm_appears_in_texas_c.html#incart_river_default
Storm – the articles say that in addition to abusing two little girls, that he had a lot of kiddy porn on his computer. That’s why IOW if there is a connection to Kyron. Those pervs have to be networking and if he has bad stuff about little girls, I’ll bet he has little boy kiddies on his computer, too. I guess LE would be on top of that. You’d think.
…or knows stuff. Stoller is right down the street from SKyline. Plus that picture of him (who else could it be??) with Kyron that nobody is sure is “really” him (give me a break already!!) shows that he knows him. Wonder if he also knows KH? That could be a really good reason why KH isn’t saying more – doesn’t want to be connected in any way to someone like Storm.
Well,next, they need to find DAD. I still think the Marijuana growers in Oregon’s coastal forests either found him, or are hiding him.
And more important – we need to find out with any of these people did with Kyron.
It puzzles me why LE wouldn’t have directed KH to have no contact with TMH, or at least no communications indicating more or less “the jig was up” in the hours prior to the sting.
Personally, I think they wanted TMH to think that LE was on to her and RS, and so was Kaine, so when RS shows up it would compel her to incriminate herself- as an example- wth did you tell them? She called 911 not once but twice. Who wants to bet that on at least one of the recorded calls she says that RS showed up asking for money for harming her husband and she is very scared he might do just that.
That would be a wet blanket on a mfh case. Of course it probably is more interpretable with the actual text message.
B
re “My favorite- “she lied to the media when they were trying to assist us.”
So then, it is clear. Kaine et al tipped off the media that he moved out and therefore ambushed TMH at her own house before she was served.”
Imo that “us” is Kaine’s habitual use of the royal we. They were trying to assist “me”.
right to infer they sought her out he tipped them he’d moved out, but he didn’t tell her.
Imo she spoke to them because Kaine had instructed to be pleasant to certain media.
This Response is all the ammo TMH needs to lay the loss of her child & marriage at LE’s feet.
Now there’s a custofial interference case.
Kaine states LE briefing was the direct cause of the RO.
This is what I have been saying Rose- more to come.
Give me your best reason – why would neither kaine nor Desiree be called to the gj to testify? If you have both parents crying witch, would that not have been a bit of a shoe-in?
Anyone else is invited to weigh in on that as well. I have been re-visiting my wth list in this case thanks to you lovely people who apparently think blink has 36 hours in one day on her schedule, lol.
B
I don’t understand this unsubstantiated allegation on p 5:
“Also there was increasing concern that Respondent was involved in harming or secreting …Kyron.”
Increasing concern by who? LE or Kaine? From what baseline? Why?
Had the concern risen to 10%, 1/3 likelihood, 50%?
How could Meisenheimer tolerate this?
Is it usual in a Portland divorce to have 2 firm attorneys of record? My speculation is Engel brought Kaine into the firm, but a name partner who was a DA colleague of Meisenheimer and likely a personal acquaintance had to initially represent the RO in chambers. I am wondering who handled O’Donnell’s divorce.
chalk one more up to Kitzhaber interim appointments:
http://law.lclark.edu/offices/alumni/news/bio/?id=12139
Forgot link. Credit to wpg:
http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/petition.PDF
my best reason: Re depo & any gj appearance of Kaine regarding the mfh story & events of 6/26 weekend inclusive of RO. I have of course been thinking LE directed Kaine to Rackner’s firm, recommending he file for RO. Some newbie homicide detective who’d been in trouble (Guisto transcript) before & worked too many years (5) on a Portland CA detail. And that was why DA took investigation’s lead over.
What if, however, an attorney in the DA’s office (say in child abuse) ran a hypo by a Judge, a former DA colleague & CA litigator himself, and asked for representation suggestions from the civil side for a Horman in need of an emergency RO. That is, speculatively, Rackner didn’t forum shop for Meisenheimer, but the latter was solicited by someone in the DA’s office to suggest competent representation to enable the weekend scheme to unfold?. Kaine could’ve been handed the sting, LE opinions re TMH, the 2 civil attorneys, & Meisenheimer as a package and at the heart of this schema was the DA, not LE. LE probably wasn’t that smart or crafty anyway. I feel we need a Deep Throat to unravel events of 2010.
And it sure set up the grand jury to return an indictment.
re “That stuff I believe initially was to keep her
away from joint funds the second she said she wanted to hire an atty.”
Initially I read this comment as Kaine being cheap.
Now I realize you speak of LE’s strong motivation to
cut off $ access entirely after she belatedly
told them she wanted an attorney.
Yes, for both the dissolution and the Houze retainer. We know she could not access her own funds for the retainer, so you can assume he had those sheared up before his “divorce ya later” text on the 26th.
B
“Give me your best reason – why would neither kaine nor Desiree be called to the gj to testify?”
B
They were called, they were photographed by the media outside the courthouse.
xoxo’s
They were not called initially- they knew nothing about it. They all appeared on Aug 2, but I can’t tell you today if that means they asked to speak, they were asked to appear to answer questions but not subponead, or the GJ themselves asked if they could meet with them.
B
Ha! imo Here are the depositions that matter in the divorce–more so than the bios. Reported Oct 8, 2010: Houze subpoenaed Rudy & O’Donnell in the RO/divorce. He thinks DA will thwart, but good grief Kaine’s causal attribution to both in pleadings flung the door open. http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/10/judge_delays_terri_and_kaine_h.html
My best simple response would be the generic answer to why most people smack dab in the middle of a case are not called to the GJ. They have not been ruled out by LE.
Rose says:
March 22, 2013 at 6:04 pm
snip>
This is what I have been saying Rose- more to come.
Give me your best reason – why would neither kaine nor Desiree be called to the gj to testify? If you have both parents crying witch, would that not have been a bit of a shoe-in?
Anyone else is invited to weigh in on that as well. I have been re-visiting my wth list in this case thanks to you lovely people who apparently think blink has 36 hours in one day on her schedule, lol.
B
ya know …. I just had an idea.
What if, just supposin’ — TMH, who was in the same house as KH, probably had access to his computer, work, personal, pictures, whatever, while he was off doing his KH things, maybe having a drink with a pal at a bar, or whatever…
Just supposin’ that TMH is “a woman scorned”.
Has anyone ever thought that maybe TMH has SOMETHING on KH that he will move heaven and earth, hide his son, set up a fake MFH plot, totally trash her reputation any way he can, take their daughter, blame her …
…IF TMH has SOMETHING really bad that she knows about KH and for her to tell would make him lower than low? So he struck first?
Just supposin’….
@erose says: March 22, 2013 at 3:16 am
It was because Blink used the word “scorned”, that I started wondering (post I just sent)
About those 36 hrs days…My sis-in-law and I often wonder why we “the smart girls” never have had it as cush as the prima donnas of the family. (Now we wonder if the primas *are* the smart ones). We thought those 36 hrs days we put in would catch us up, but they only raise the bar, on ourselves. Thanks for setting your bar so high, it is appreciated, and now expected, LOL.
so that’s why Kaine was so hot in Oct about where’d ya get the money?
He was sitting on her “settlement” leftovers too?
I am glad you have 36 hrs a day it seems as I have 24 now
thx to bats, raccoons, oppossums, rats, & mice or whatever.
Appeared, but did not confirm he testified.
PORTLAND, Ore. — The father of missing seven-year-old Kyron Horman confirmed to KGW that he appeared before the grand jury Monday and could possibly be returning on Tuesday.
Kaine Horman told KGW that he appeared before the grand jury in the Multnomah County Courthouse but he did not elaborate on whether he testified. He was seen exiting the courthouse with Kyron’s mother, Desiree Young and her husband, Tony Young on Tuesday afternoon. However, Kaine did not say whether the other two appeared before the grand jury as well
http://www.nwcn.com/news/oregon/Kyron-Hormans-dad-appears-before-grand-jury-99866164.html
Reading up on the GJ. If the bios answered questions by the GJ, but did not answer questions posed by the DA, is that the difference between appearing and testifying? It’s as if they did little more than DDS. I did read somewhere that KH spent 3 hours with them, but perhaps the questions were not related to him.
July 28, 2010
Kyron Horman Update: Parents Not Scheduled to Testify to Grand Jury
The parents of Kyron Horman say they were surprised that grand jury was looking into the case of their missing 7-year-old boy.
Kaine Horman and Desiree Young say they haven’t been asked to testify before a Multnomah County grand jury and had no knowledge that Dede Spicher, a friend of stepmom Terri Moulton Horman, would be subpoenaed to appear Monday in the case.
“[She] shows up at the courthouse and I got a call — ‘saw Dede at the courthouse, it was a zoo,’ ” Kaine Horman said Tuesday, when he and Young sat down for an interview with WW.
They said the family continues to be briefed on the investigation about every other day. The family raised an alarm about Spicher last week when they issued a press release saying she wasn’t cooperating with investigators.
But they said they had no idea a grand jury was in play.
“That was kind of a surprise to us,” Young said, “that Dede was called in.”
http://www.wweek.com/portland/blog-801-kyron_horman_update_parents_not_scheduled_to_testify_to_grand_jury.html
July 26, 2010
Spicher appeared before an investigative grand jury in Portland on Monday, according to her attorney, Chad Stavley.
Stavley, who told HLN that he was retained Friday, said Spicher was not asked any questions by the prosecutor but was ordered to return at a future date.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/07/26/oregon.missing.boy/index.html
(KATU contradicts WWeek about testimony, only citing a Mult Co source. I have not found a confirmation by KH or DY that they actually testified. Very misleading. Wonder who the source was?)
PORTLAND, Ore. – The parents of missing 7-year-old Kyron Horman testified before a grand jury Monday afternoon, according to a source at the Multnomah County Courthouse.
http://www.katu.com/news/local/99801789.html
Translation from DY: Surprised because she knew they were not in a position to queen her for a day. (limited use immunity). One observation I have had in the last week or so when reviewing much of the data we have all seen but in contrast to new case developments (all 3).
Desiree was very much in control, in some cases overtalked Kaine, and seemed to be in step with LE ( or whatever source she was getting info from). Then we see her go through some less “confident” phases so to speak ( I am intentionally being vague, I don’t want to seem as though I am picking on this poor woman) and finally on the steps of the courthouse with Rod Underhill within earshot and visual range.
It was very clear to me that Rosenthal was expecting to subpoena LE and I quote ‘Make Terri Talk”. This got through an abatement filing with a very wordy memorandum. Very wordy and very loose on citation I might add.
I know the obvious answer is that she has evolved with the realizations in this case. That said, that is not at all reconciling with me in her last comments on the tort case “that the new DA was going to “do something”. New DA was old DDA. Same one with no standing.
So ff to these new investigative avenues now requiring this uber-wide and uber-uninterferable berth:
Have additional resources been requested and approved for this previously ignored rabbit hole?
B
Trying to sort out what the charges are and against whom.
PORTLAND — For weeks, a parade of witnesses came and went from the Multnomah County Courthouse.
Kyron Horman’s parents testified before a grand jury along with others surrounding the seven year old’s disappearance.
“We still don’t have the answer to what happened to Kyron,” said McIntyre. “The issue is, what charges are you going to ask the grand jury to return, and then against whom, and I think they are probably still very much sorting that out.”
http://www.kgw.com/news/Grand-jury-still-hearing-Kyron-Horman-case-101124089.html
http://www.kgw.com/news/Grand-jury-still-hearing-Kyron-Horman-case-101124089.html
Why would DA subpoena Rudy to testify
Aug 4 with associated immunity when the
Sting had obviously failed?
I think Blink was observing Kaine & Desiree
were not on the gj subpoena list. Who all were?
It is odd Kaine would not be by Aug 4 since he
could recount so many behavioral evils of TMH.
Why was that all that TMH motive evidence
put in the divorce filings rather than being sought by subpoena
for the gj? I suppose if he testified to it in the gj, it
?
couldn’t be given by interview & Court docs
to press as everything in the divorce could be.
The immunity is only tied to the scope of the testimony. There is absolutely nothing to preclude a prosecutor from asking a witness questions that do not broach an eventual case in chief- so in the event that person becomes the subject of criminal inquiry, the immunity only extends to exactly what was said under oath. Of course if that person lied- all bets are off. Perjury voids.
He does have to appear with counsel or is provided counsel interaction there, however counsel is not permitted within the proceeding.
He could have been asked his identity, address, occupation-
He could have been asked : Was it your understanding that TMH wanted you to kill her husband?
Imo, RS must have had some form of immunity in place before he ever agreed to that “sting”. What else could they do- entrap their own witness?
I have seen some of the weakest grand jury transcripts result in indictments- that are clearly an insult to ham sandwiches.
They only needed 5 out of 7 yes’s to indict.
Or, there’s this:
The grand jury is not bound to hear evidence for the defendant, but it shall weigh all the evidence submitted to it; and when it believes that other evidence within its reach will explain away the charge, it should order such evidence to be produced, and for that purpose may require the district attorney to issue process for the witnesses.
Maybe the gj asked to hear what he had to say.
B
The difference between Tony’s talk (emotional appeal directly to Kyron) & Kaine’s (community thank yous) was startling at the time. I attributed it to Kaine’s personality. But, knowing all was probably scripted by an fbi forensic psychologist or profiler, Blink’s reasoning the kidnapper may have had a personal revenge element with Kaine or Terri makes sense that the 2 men reversed roles.
@erose. with this well known to be coming down the pike in 2012, ’twas very wise of Kitzhaber to ensure Knight’s big donations were made to Kitz’ designated choices for election like his prior judicial appointment the current AG, & not to his own PAC, and to keep a couple years of faux squabbles in the press:
http://www.katu.com/politics/John-Kitzhaber-Oregon-Nike-expansion-special-session-182860381.html?m=y&smobile=y
One resident’s description of Rudy’s Canby, c 2009.
I wonder how he picked up his crews?
http://savethewest.wordpress.com/2009/11/09/mexican-latino-gangs-have-ruined-canby-oregon/
Has there been any follow up by the media or others to the September 14 2010 America’s Most Wanted episode on Kyron in terms of generating tips/calls/responses?
I would say based on the PIO overtime report only having a handful of hours attributable to Kyron’s case recently I would say no.
B
Thanks, Blink.
It would be interesting to know the volume of response to the AMW show.
Don’t recall reading the local media who reported on the making and air-date of Kyron’s segment following up with John Walsh, for instance.
The AMW segment aired after DY’s civil case began, so it’s part of my very short list of speculations as to what LE/DA didn’t have in the beginning of the civil case that may have come in at some point before the November stay.
Great question and I see why that makes sense.
B
@Rose, Would anyone from RS’s pick of crew match the SZ nondescript description? That is what always brings me back to random SO. For RS to be involved it means he was not there, but someone acting on his behalf was. All scenarios with any family member involvement seem to involve another person acting on their behalf.
I know nothing about psychological strategy, but wonder why KH spoke to the community, if it was TH that had the connection. Would they use the husband, to speak for the wife, or would they put TH front and center? IOW, does this speak to KH’s having as much to do with knowing this person as TH?
Rose says:
March 23, 2013 at 10:45 am
The difference between Tony’s talk (emotional appeal directly to Kyron) & Kaine’s (community thank yous) was startling at the time. I attributed it to Kaine’s personality. But, knowing all was probably scripted by an fbi forensic psychologist or profiler, Blink’s reasoning the kidnapper may have had a personal revenge element with Kaine or Terri makes sense that the 2 men reversed roles.
1. KH was not designated to speak at that conference. He did that impromptu after TY, which in and of itself speaks to Kaine’s control issue, and the whole event is the opposite of protocol if LE thought this was a stranger abduction. It is possible that they concluded he was abducted by someone that had a beef with one of them so it would serve to see them vulnerable and to present his other parents and personalize him. All in all- this was recommended by the FBI, they filmed it and analyzed the behavior for profile purposes.
B
What do you all think are the chances that perhaps Terri Horman was the one who had, at some earlier point in time, received some threatening note, or even a threat made to her face by someone, that she’d better either, do such-and-such, or watch her step, or something horrible would happen to one of her children?
It appears that most everyone thought that Kyron was Terri’s child, not necessarily a step son. Is it possible that Terri upon receiving such a threat, prior to January 2010, perhaps in December 2009?, decided to send James away, but it never occurred to her that the threat would be taken out on Kyron, since Kyron wasn’t her son? Could this be what resulted in LE thinking this may have been a kidnapping?
This would explain Kaine & Desiree’s insistence that Terri knows something about Kyron’s whereabouts. (Even though she may have no idea.) It would explain Terri’s Dad saying there’s a chance she may be arrested. (For not providing Kyron with the same protection she did James.) It is interesting to think about the fact that James was not only not at the Horman household that day, he also wasn’t at his new home with either Grandparents, or Angela & Ron Tarver’s home that day. He was on some boy scout camping trip, which was weird because it was a school day and a Friday. It would explain why LE will not give Houze the 911 call from December 26, 2009. It would explain the part of that new law that Kaine got behind that dealt with a parent not reporting a threatening situation of a child. (Can’t remember exactly what it said.)
Was Terri purposefully not going back home that day, i.e., driving around blowing time, because she was afraid to go back to the house alone? Did she know she had been being watched, followed in days prior? Was she being followed that day? She arrived at the house not long before Kaine got home, did she know he would be home early? Did she forget to pick up the project simply because she had something else major on her mind? IDK, this probably doesn’t make any sense in the big picture of things. Particularly when Kaine says she was acting normally.
I think TH phone activity between the time she left the school and the time Kaine returned to the home would be very telling.
Since I know that Kaine knew what that was, you can bet if it were suspect he would have included it in his filing, and Desiree would have been made aware of it as well.
B
Beejay’s concern was a once-removed from RS.
My post of a political fringe Canby resident was to note
there seemed to be a very active hispanic gang-connected element in Canby
creating public disturbances jeopardizing children, and criminal arrests.
Around here day laborers who paint or clear brush are picked up at known pickup
gathering spots by “landscapers.” It seems to me the pot of criminals in Canby area
who’d take a child for a little money, with secondary motives, is out there.
LE should’ve had hispanic undercover officers hanging out on those
known yard day labor street corners in Canby in 2010 to pick up stories. iirc
Beejay suggested streetwork.
Am I misunderstanding, or is the assumption that SZ is somehow related to RS or landscaper-types, or same nationality?
Has KH ever been ruled out as being in any way involved(even through his work or friendships)? Or TMH for that matter?
I guess nobody knows anything until something jiggles itself loose, and by now I wonder if that will ever happen. Poor little Kyron. So sad. You’d think some of these people – or even the people that know them or Kyron – would at least have a conscience. MOO.
@erose says: March 23, 2013 at 2:03 pm
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2012/11/multnomah_county_sheriff_cites.html
“But the sheriff indicated there are some developments in the criminal inquiry into Kyron’s disappearance, which his investigators have discussed with prosecutors.
“There are a couple of investigative pieces that are going to open up,” Staton told The Oregonian Tuesday. “Our belief is they’re going to open up several investigative doors.”
He said the new “investigative avenues” are based on information collected in the early phase of the investigation that are now yielding some results.
The sheriff said it does not include cell phone data or emails. ”
–mcso brought the rabbit hole to DA, not vice versa
(Why? abatement denied?)
–the couple investigative pieces are going to open up.
(no fresh info on table yet; just going back to drill an old oilfield that hadn’t come in) or bern explored)
–basis: info collected early
(not pings nor email = not Terri imo)
“That are going to open up” = someone willing to talk or is now legally permitted to open up whereby they were precluded previously?
B
Hmmm, just one more thing that situation would explain, Terri dropping the fight against the RO. Houze would have explained to her, that there is no way in hell a judge would grant her custody of her child, if in fact it could be proven she somehow knew that Kyron was in danger, but failed to act to protect him by reporting the threat to LE. Thus, she changed her pleadings to supervised visitation asking for a delay in the custody determination, until it could be proven she was truly unaware of any threat of harm circling around Kyron.
This doesn’t explain Desiree saying Terri was angry that day, but maybe Desiree misinterpreted Terri’s different attitude. Maybe it had more to do with fear and worry. IDK
re info collected early: ruling out pings & emails,
that leaves human intelligence and the road videotapes.
By June 18, the info sought was Terri focused (flier, pucs, questionnaire)
@Blink. perhaps after her depo & the 5th (persuading LE she knew something?),
DS was granted immunity in exchange for ?
I go back to the Spicher People interview. I truly do not believe she knows a thing, and if they thought she knew something she might not “know she knows”, she certainly spoke to LE long enough without an atty to know what they are looking for.
Not going to be popular, but I think it is a fair assessment that this case was blown at the interview phase all the way around.
Were those transcripts played/shown for the GJ? They have to be accompanied by the interviewer sans some legal reason not to- when did the original det ask to be reassigned?
B
So this wasn’t for Kyron, the community or the perp, this was to see how the parents perform? TH hugging DY. KH taking control. Wonder what they learned that set them down the TH path?
That tweet I posted from Pitkins was iirc from the 11th (same day, or thereabouts) saying tempers were flared. I am assuming not all LE’s were in agreement. Means MSCO would win out because it was their jurisdiction, might mean they were the agency on the TH path, and FBI or others disagreed.
snip>
1. KH was not designated to speak at that conference. He did that impromptu after TY, which in and of itself speaks to Kaine’s control issue, and the whole event is the opposite of protocol if LE thought this was a stranger abduction. It is possible that they concluded he was abducted by someone that had a beef with one of them so it would serve to see them vulnerable and to present his other parents and personalize him. All in all- this was recommended by the FBI, they filmed it and analyzed the behavior for profile purposes.
B
” the FBI, they filmed it and analyzed the behavior for profile purposes.”
what I personally get out of the behavior: Tony’s warmth; Desiree’s sorrow;
Terri is neither liked nor respected by any of them; Kaine depersonalizes.
clarifying, i meant that last word colloquially, not clinically. maybe detached is better.
“That are going to open up” = someone willing to talk or is now legally permitted to open up whereby they were precluded previously?”
B
The 5th’s fit the timeline of DY’s civil case if that is what is being referred to.
Here’s something else I’ve wondered . . . how long would it take to subpoena and successfully receive employee records from the unionized Oregon Education Association and the Oregon chapter of the SEIU (Service Employees International Union)?
wpg- for what purpose? That would dictate whether they are even open to a subpoena.
B
Ooops, I meant by Not reporting the threat to LE. Sorry.
“wpg- for what purpose? That would dictate whether they are even open to a subpoena.”
B
Focusing on the crime scene/Skyline School and what/who is attached to the crime scene/Skyline School.
Too weak?
If you mean for investigative purposes I would definitely think it would need to have a probable cause trail if I am understanding you correctly.
B
Reading early media reports and various blogging sites, there was A LOT of “where is the family?”, “why hasn’t the family spoken?” coming from local and non-local communities.
Found it interesting that the 2 “family4″ media pressers were within, what, 3 days of each other? In the 2nd presser (if I recall right) the family did not speak but stood behind Staton as he announced the investigation was now a criminal one.
Agree to LE observing the participants, and if I could add visibility and physical recognition of the participants to the public for the purpose of garnering tips, witnesses, etc.
wasn’t the original detective Bobby O’Donnell?
Did another Detective take over?
Detective & supervisors’ names
10/7/2010:
“subpoenas to depose the lead criminal investigator in Kyron’s disappearance, Robert O’Donnell, and Rudy Sanchez, the landscaper” http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/10/terri_horman_willing_to_agree.html
$14,035 in overtime June 4-30 (26 days:
http://victoriataftkpam.blogspot.com/2010/12/mccain-kyron-kops-confident-yet.html?m=1
8/11/10 side by side with Underhill
“Detective Bob O’Donnell and Chief Deputy District Attorney Rod Underhill listed a number of locations the pickup truck is believed to have been seen that mo”http://articles.cnn.com/keyword/kyron-horman
11/27/12
a MCSO Lt oversees the investigators & is spokesman.
I presume he supervises the full-time detective who is not named:
“Multnomah County sheriff’s Lt. Ned Walls, who oversees the investigators handling the case, said Tuesday, “We have some new leads, yes, and we have furtherance of old leads.”
“The case is still progressing, still evolving,” Walls said.
The sheriff’s office has a full-time detective sergeant and detective assigned to the missing child case, along with five detectives working on it part time. Investigators from the district attorney’s office, and FBI are also assisting, Walls said.”
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2012/11/multnomah_county_sheriff_cites.html
At present, Ned Walls is Lt in charge of concealed handgun licensing unit
http://www.mcso.us/public/concealed_handgun.htm
also the County Human Trafficking Task Force Program contact
http://www3.multco.us/budgetwebFY14All/PDF/60073-MINT.pdf
and the Warrant Strike Team program contact
http://www3.multco.us/budgetwebFY14All/PDF/60068-MINT.pdf
(I’ll stop looking after establishing he’s an Administrator with big portfolio.)
from a blog Walls’ Admin involvement dates at least back to Oct 2010. Walls was the Lt supervising the Cold Case Team of detectives and was the co-presenter when Staton ran his budget by Commissioners.
“Thursday, October 14, 2010
Board of Commissioners Meeting
Multnomah County, Oregon
Multnomah Building, Commissioners Board Room 100
SHERIFF’S OFFICE – 9:30 am
R-1 BUDGET MODIFICATION MCSO-07 – Requesting General Fund Contingency Transfer to the Sheriff’s Office in the Amount $209,656 for the Kyron Horman Investigation. Presenters: Sheriff Dan Staton and Lieutenant Ned Walls (10 min)
http://www.co.multnomah.or.us/cc/agenda.shtml”
1/30/11 Sgt Krafve is “a” supervisor of the Task Force Staton created
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2011/01/search_for_kyron_horman_resume.html
5/18/11 Sgt Det Keith Krafve is called the lead now
http://blogs.seattleweekly.com/dailyweekly/2011/05/kyron_horman_missing_child_has.php
This all makes sense if
Lt Walls is Admin head dating to 2010;
Sgt Det Krafve is under him full-time, at least since 1/11, or more likely the organization of the Task Force;
& Det O’Donnell is the other full-time, at Detective rank since 6/10.
Staton began talking about Task Force 9/15/10
http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/09/sheriff_dan_staton_talks_about.html
(Task Force disbanded 7/1/11) It was supposed to be for 120 days but lasted longer
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2011/06/kyron_horman_task_force_to_dis.html
a little history, Krafve on the stand on his first murder case
http://www.wweek.com/portland/m/article-2761-mobile.html#_Article
Krafve is the Sgt now in charge of the Cold Case Unit which Walls formerly held before his promotion to Lt
http://www.mcso.us/public/coldcase.htm
Neither Walls nor Krafve were on the Cold Case Unit in 2009, but Heidi Moawad was
http://www.portlandoregon.gov/police/article/346238
I have never watched this particular video (hard to believe, I keep thinking I’ve seen them all). Tell me, is this real footage of the sting and the landscaper (and or undercover officer) going to her door, just after 1:00 min. mark? Dude looks really young to me, but then, I’m getting old and everyone is starting to look young. Happens.
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/botched-sting-operation-complicates-search-kyron-horman-11114520
Also, later in this video they show a clip of another video *no sound*, Tony says something to Desiree, and it looks like he says “okay that’s enough”. Starts at about 4:20, She looks at him and says something short back, but her look back at what he says next, looks to me like she doesn’t understand why she can’t or shouldn’t say what she wanted to say next. You have to slow it down. Anyway,just wondering what she may have been saying at that point, as it seems Tony put a stop to it.
5:46- Brad Garrett- Then there’s the other side to this.. Terri Horman may not know anything.
I want to say that is the only qualified Agency (r) that has ever made that comment.
No, not the actual sting.
B
speculation. In 2009 Moawad was the DDA on the Homicide Cold Case Unit. She lost a high profile cold case.
She won an animal cruelty high profile case. She was assigned to the Child Abuse Unit O’Donnell had been on 5 years. At least recently she’s drafting affidavits for this case for DA. How did O’Donnell get moved from the Child Abuse Unit to Kyron ‘s case in June 2010? Maybe Moawad was the DDA assigned & having begun to work with him in the CAU requested him and/or vice versa. It’s interesting Lt Walls who was in charge of the Cold Case team is side by side with Staton on Kyron in Oct 2010. Apparently Sgt Krafve was made a Supv by 9/15/10 (the Task Force). Is O’Donnell still the full-time Detective grade investigator? Is Krafve (now head CCUnit) still the Sgt Detective? Did Desiree’s tough period coincide with the Task Force disbanding in 7/11?
If Moawad was the DDA assigned in 6/10, and she recruited O’Donnell as mcso lead from that Unit, why the heck was the Child Abuse Unit DDA & Detec involved early on?
If or (speculatively) since CAU team members took the lead initially in the person of O’Donnell & perhaps Moawad, can we infer that MCSO’s team was always looking at the family first with tunnel vision to identify an “abuser,” and the fall Task Force formation was an attempt to rectify that?
5 mice down. an army to go.
I hope that is a metaphor or you are channeling BEN.
Laugh- as a kid My Dad thought we had a mouse behind the stove and set a trap. Every night I would sneak downstairs and throw a piece of cheese behind it so it did not take the bait, lol. We were out of cheese one day so i threw a popsicle. I was nabbed in the morning.
I reminded my parents of Cinderella. They said good argument, you can play the stepsister and do more chores this week.
Read Charlotte’s web and learned mice are mini rats, cured me. Good luck Rose.
B
http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/20100708093701176.pdf
Yes. Moawad was 1 of 2 line level DDAs from June 4 2010
accruing the OT. Wonder if K Demer was also from CAU?
All I can say is a valient defender of a slaughtered cat did not a SZ-abduction/homicide DDA make, whatever the Supervision. Poor Desiree.
Staton says here 2 trial level attorneys Moawad & Demer were brought in (from the get go per billing) to do computer analyses, as was Woods the Sen Dep DA of the Child Abuse Unit. At this time iirc Moawad was on the CAU.
Now Moawad & Demer don’t show anywhere on googling as having computer expertise educationally or experientially. (Demer looks seasoned & a fine public servant on theft, burglary, embezzlement etc)
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/07/district_attorney_and_sheriff.html
So what’s this about computer analysis by a
a theater major
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/heidi-moawad/7/a02/6b8?_mSplash=1&sessionid=OLLB4_H0-M_bkDyfbCzX
reading emails?
Background on Portland Child Abuse Unit:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KkvHsnIIb90C&pg=PA122&lpg=PA122&dq=charlene+woods+child+abuse&source=bl&ots=Rq3FCW5OB8&sig=Rflojqk3gEqzC-Pa0uaZaRRStBc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=-aVOUei1BOqN0QG1noGgBw&ved=0CCsQ6AEwADgK
DAs (long time = Woods), detectives & CPSD Intake are all in the same location.
Personally, professionally, I don’t like that. It blurs professional roles & appropriate professional distance.
A CPSD worker heading over to the DA’s is jmpressed to have one’s facts nailed.
If a CPSD worker calls in detective for a home visit, a Detective (or a gun) better be needed.
imo DAs and Detectives need to rub shoulders with their professional
peers, so they don’t go subjective.
Anyway, as to this crime, I’m reminded long ago I shared CPSD Court cases represented by 3 US attorneys of varying capabilities (2 outstanding). Not a one of the 3 fine Child Abuse & Neglect US Attorneys (or me or my cpsd peers) would have the foggiest how to investigate a stranger kidnapping or a school abduction. So why did Shrunk/Staton assign Wood & Moawad to do ANY kind of investigation, at their hourly rates, from June on? It was inevitable imo they’d settle on a family member to the exclusion of a stranger abduction. I can hear the CAU’s experienced detectives grilling Kaine & Terri now. Who’ll throw the other overboard first?
Text of the message read by Tony Young, Kyron’s step-father.
Hello my name is Tony Young and I am Kyron’s stepfather. The family has asked me to speak on their behalf today. We would just like to say Kyron we miss you, love you and need you home right now. We are doing everything we can with law enforcement and the search and rescue crews to make sure you can get back to us as soon as possible. We want to say how much we appreciate the love and support, prayer and thoughts as we wait for you.Your school friends and their families, the teachers and the staff at your school and the community as a whole have shown how much impact one little boy’s smile can have on a community.You mean everything to us and until you come home this family is not complete. Please Kyron keep up the hope. We believe in you and we know you will be back with us soon.
Text of the message read by Kaine Horman, Kyron’s father:
Hi I’m Kaine, Kyron’s father. We want to thank the community, the parents, the children, the bus drivers and all those who are being interviewed multiple times to try to find Kyron. Thank you. We as a family know how difficult and stressful this is. By your memories and statements can help us find Kyron. We will never be able to thank you enough for that help. Finally, we would like to thank the media. If it was not for you showing Kyron on every newscast, printing his story in the papers, his face would not be known to everyone. People from around the nation have seen his picture, this helps tremendously. Please help us bring Kyron home.
http://www.katu.com/news/local/96088894.html