Dr. Phil Show Hosts Missing Portland Child Kyron Horman’s Step Mom Terri Horman Over Two Episodes
I have been covering this case since Kyron Horman disappeared from Skyline School in June, 2010. Like most missing persons cases I have covered in the past, I am of the strong opinion that best efforts at the truth are the only way to propel investigations that, similarly to Kyron’s, have gone cold for one reason or another. This approach has worked in resolving some of my previous cases. I am proud of that. I remain steadfast to the integrity involved in those and future cases.
Over the past 10 months (or so) I have been developing an updated series on Kyron’s case to include my multiple interviews with Kyron’s step-mom, Terri Horman. Needless to say as she was the subject of at least three simultaneous cases before an Oregon court and remains a person of interest by the agency investigating her sons disappearance, this has been an arduous and sometimes delicate journey. Ms. Horman’s experiences during the ongoing investigation of the disappearance of Kyron Horman are critically important to propelling his case and with great hope- finding the truth about what happened to this cherubic and innocent child. There are dozens of sources, collateral interviews, forensic experts and legal analysts that also contribute to my series and have done so because of their belief that my motivation is to bring to light information and opinions in such a way that would almost “require” a focused review of Kyron’s case and the likely shaking of that proverbial tree everyone talks about.
Set to publish about 6-ish weeks ago I was asked to postpone the first installment of the series, which I did. I subsequently learned Ms. Horman was participating in the Dr. Phil program after she completed taping. Dr. Phils producers were well aware that Ms. Horman had interviewed with me extensively, and anticipated my series would be publishing information that was not known to the public previously in the days prior to her scheduled episode. When Ms. Horman conveyed to me that she feels obligated to speak out about “her son” in any national medium that will have her, I most certainly respected that. I still do.
While Dr. Phil seems like a gregarious fellow for sure, I have zero interest in being associated with his program, nor do I believe his shows content is designed to do any furtherance of investigation or truth. There is much concern (although I have no affiliation to the show whatsoever) that the timing of the publication of my series on the Kyron Horman matter might be interpreted differently or inadvertently contribute to the programs content or audience reactions. Not what I signed on for. A missing 7 year old boy six years running is not a framework for entertaining a target audience. He is not fodder for online social media bully campaigns- yet it occurs.
I will be publishing my series on Kyron’s case at a later date, in it’s entirety with no editing adjustments as a result of any of the appearances on Dr. Phil. I appreciate your patience and your understanding. Feel free to discuss the show below.
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Good question on the silver SUV. IMO, SZ parked in the south lot. I think LE knows this either thru photos or witnesses describing a vehicle that no one came forward about. I think they have accounted for all known, photographed or witnessed vehicles, so thru process of elimination it is strongly suspected that SZ parked in the south lot and LE knows at the very least a general description of the vehicle, if by witness, or an accurate description if by photos.
I think TH and kids were witnessed going back to get Kyron’s backpack and this was construed as TH taking Kyron from the school. Perhaps the witness(es) thought the time that was later than it really was and that is what initiated those prejudicial fliers, coupled with DY’s “gut feeling.” I have forgotten how many vehicles were reported to be at Skyline that day, but given that there were many, I am sure more than one white truck was there. JMO, but I know see “white truck” as relevant as “red hair.”
T. Ruth says:
November 1, 2016 at 1:48 pm
snip>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIiDe5uib6c
According to this report, LE is saying TMH indeed parked in the front of the school, and this is where someone saw a person in or around the truck other than TMH.
So why are they also asking about a vehicle parked in the south lot? Was there a witness who saw someone exit a vehicle in the south lot and then walk over to the Horman truck?
saving ya’ll the trouble.
no more was said about her work assignment.
ot This 38 yo flew to DC to a rally
at the Capital to demonstrate wearing
homemade posters –merely anti Glen Beck
signs– on herself and kid. Really. Weighty
policy advisor to Kate Brown, Oregon.
Her “job” on the Lottery Dir Roberts was quite
an episode too.
ot kinda.
re County DAs, apparently the Gov’s public safety advisor receives and collates
public input on, cointerviews,, and advises the Gov as who to appoint as a County DA
between elections as needed. Just like her role re Lottery Dir.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2454166/da-applications-and-public-comments.pdf. I
infer she did the same re Mr Rod back when Kitz first appointed him. pretty powerful political job.
Flier went out June 18,doesn’t say how it “has gone” or was returned.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/06/18/investigators-ask-public-saw-kyron-hormans-stepmother-day-vanished.html
But attaching it to the adult/child questionnaires rended the latter virtually useless.
It’s like having a lineup with one person, dressed as the thief, but it’s not really the thief
yet it’s the only choice offered, so what’s a witness to do when told to pick the thief out
(from a lineup of one).
Aloha Barker’s bio when he first ran for office in 2002 in a newly gerrymandered District,
guaranteeing a Dem a safe seat, said his dau was an ADA then. Probably his PPB employment
opened the door, so she’d had 8 yrs experience designing fliers and questionaires anyway.
It really was an indictment, wasn’t it? I have zero doubt that the gj feedback in some manner made that clear to MCSO and the DA- I recall Gates saying something like- “No, I have nothing to say about Terri Horman” and iirc, Rod Underhill saying something like they were putting out the public request for information hoping for tips not influenced by the media (or words to that effect).
B
ot $12M to prosecute and the DOJ didnt even bring criminal trespass and destruction of govt property charges! I didnt realize consliracy was the only charge. http://www.wweek.com/news/2016/11/02/the-bundy-acquittal-isnt-just-shocking-its-part-of-a-pattern-of-arrogant-bungling-by-the-u-s-attorney-for-oregon/
If Loretta Lynch was not such a wimp she’d retire Williams now.
these twitter accts change so fast I don’t know what this link will say in an hour, but there are 10 successive tweets
differentiating the two types of charitable orgs: public charities or private foundations.
https://mobile.twitter.com/EOTaxProf/status/793593898572533760
From this, The KHF seems clearly the latter, and interestingly it is more strictly
regulated by the irs than a public charity.
It is definitely a foundation.
B
misc
http://www.mcso.us/profiles/pdf/org_chart.pdf
A Steve Bevins is now School Resource under Patrol.
I suspect he is the former pio Bevens for Troutdale,
absorbed in 2015. Did Reese lift a burden off
PPB such that now mcso is responsible for
public schools outside city boundaries?
Also the now Inspector Gulberg who headed River
Patrol until Reese arrived was listed with his supervisees
in a 2015 County award to River Patrol. The recognizable
name in that list is Herron. Wonder why River Patrol Lt
remains vacant?
So, TMH parked in A area, exactly where the truck was positioned in the flyer in the second photo down on the left. Obviously this information was given to LE by TMH. And LE was asking you to come forward if you parked in D area, on Quizzical’s map. Someone must have seen someone exit a vehicle in D area and walk over to the Horman truck. Why else ask that question?
http://s1130.photobucket.com/user/quizzi1/media/Truck%20Position/Truck%20Position%20Marks_zps1kjmcbrs.jpg.html
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:en5q_SQtjvIJ:media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/TRUCKPressConferenceFlier.pdf+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
I am flabbergasted that LE did not secure everyone’s computers/cell phones involved in this case. So, I’m guessing if they did not get a warrant for KH’s computer, then they also did not bother to get one for TY’s & DY’s either. How about Kaine’s brother as well? IIRC, they took DDS’s, why in the world would they not secure others? How about Kyron’s teachers? Goodness sakes, how could they not and how on earth did they clear anyone without investigating them?
Like TY said:
TONY YOUNG: I explained to each person that now our lives are not private anymore, that the investigators are going to want to know very detailed information about our lives.
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38420266/ns/dateline_nbc-crime_reports/t/little-boy-lost/#.WBofE8lhaK0
One would think computers, being an extension of one’s self these days, would be where LE would start.
I am going to need some time and study on that one if its ok with you Rose.
B
How do you all get your information? I am wondering where you found the documentation about Kyron leaving the building with someone else? Are there other photographs from the parking lot or from other parents at the science fair that morning? Could there have been a blue truck? … it seems a white truck is conjured up because the Horman truck was white.
Also, picture of stained glass that Kyron drew was mentioned here … does anyone know where I can see it? Thank you
“1. LE confirmed TH timeline and account via video confirmation by Monday June 7, without informing her, btw. That would obviously include the knowledge Kyron was not with her.”
http://blinkoncrime.com/2016/09/21/dr-phil-show-hosts-missing-portland-child-kyron-hormans-step-mom-terri-horman-over-two-episodes/comment-page-16/#comments
Then why were the Youngs & husband all over Teri June 7 ff. Did mcso/da just
lie to them for months?
I dunno. They KNEW Kyron was not seen, I dont know what they told them until T hired counsel and they decided on the ginger plot.
B
if there was one sewer drainage grate on Skyline, there were others.
Did mcso check the sewer system with cameras?
Reminds me of that joshua tree abandoned mine case scenario.
It seems to me establishing his charitable organizaton as a private foundation rather than a public charity could invite trouble–or speaks to knowing in 2010 kyron was gone. https://www.ncfp.org/export/sites/ncfp/knowledge/passages/2013/downloads/Avoiding-Conflicts-and-Self-Dealing-for-Family-Foundation-Boards-NCFP-2013.pdf
for example on p6 he couldnt pay Kristen as sitter while doing Fdtn activities unless he declared it as income to him
Coukdn’t buy bench materials for a bench benefiting his son. Coukdn’t fund a search for his child only. He could but he woukd have to declare it as income to him. Since he can’t directly benefit his minor child not declared dead by his Foundation why’d he set it up that way in the first place because donors in 2010ff wanted to benefit finding kyron.
I spent some time tonight looking at the gate area to the soccer field.
There is a gate across the access road with the large gate post at the very end (West). Adjacent to the gate post is another short post with a chain that runs to another post to prevent someone from driving up the slope to by-pass the gate.
I tried to see the lock, but it was not visible in the ground view. If the Parks Department was responsible for cutting the grass on soccer fields and other areas of Portland Public School system, why not have two locks, one for control of the school and another from the Parks Department. This is often done by commercial organizations that have multiple locations. One key fits all the company locks. Same keyway and same cut. Keys can have a special keyway and have six or seven pins rather than the normal commercial set up of five.
Depending on the size of the mower, I think the time-line could be off by as much as thirty minutes. Especially if the person has to park, then walk to the office to get a key, move the truck and its load to an unload spot, unload the mower, mow the grass, reload the mower and drive out the access road, stop and lock the gate and walk back and return the key.
Regarding the grate:
Where does the drain empty into a storm drain system? If the grate was never investigated it certainly is a possibility that it could have been used to dispose of a body. One would think that an organization that prided itself on search and rescue would have already checked this possibility. However, based on information that we have obtained over the years, that pride may be based on wishful thinking.
Sigh. I saw a bunch of patina on that grate.
B
@Blink
No expert, but, in my opinion …
It would be no problem driving a mower down to the soccer field, or driving a mower up from that field. The elevation difference is only about 25’ over a distance of about 300’. You could drive the truck, trailer and mower down to the soccer field, but driving it back up in early June could be problematic, due to probable moist soft ground, especially if the truck is not four wheel drive. I highly doubt anyone would be driving a truck on any of those fields at that time of year, if it had rained recently, unless absolutely necessary. The tracks leaving the parking lot as shown below are likely a medium sized mower. It appears in this case they lead to the large field west and north of the soccer field.
It seems to me, however, Stensen certainly could have parked his truck and trailer somewhere in the school parking lot, unloaded his mower, drove it down to, and mowed, the soccer field. When done he could have driven the mower back up to the parking lot, loaded it and driven off the grounds, never having to go up or down that access road. This would be if there was no fence separating the soccer field from the other fields on the north (back) side. An image to follow shows there was no discernable fence.
Back of School with Tracks and Elevations.
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Skyline%20School%20Google%20History/Mower%20In%20Back_zpsv4w1xinh.jpg
Moving Out.
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Skyline%20School%20Google%20History/Closer%20View%20From%20Back_zpsmqpxd2na.jpg
Moving Out Farther.
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Skyline%20School%20Google%20History/Farther%20View%20From%20Back_zpsgtdrs3ni.jpg
Image from Gwenabob in the direction of the 703’ elevation on the first image above. This shows no fence.
http://i780.photobucket.com/albums/yy81/gwenabob/Skyline%20School/SkylineSchool065.jpg
Another image of the field, from Gwenabob, generally behind the cover play area, probably taken from under the trees behind the play area.
http://i780.photobucket.com/albums/yy81/gwenabob/Skyline%20School/SkylineSchool062.jpg
School Grounds July 2016 showing mowing patterns
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Skyline%20School/School%20from%20Back%20%20July%202016_zpsxmbsaa9a.jpg
Blink, I hadn’t even thought of that relative to the grate. Turns out there are two grates not too far apart, one in the shoulder area where TMH parked and one right at the base of the access road, as shown below. One would certainly think (hope) they explored the grates, physically, with live scent dogs and subsequently with cadaver dogs.
Two Grates shown in Aqua in 2016
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Truck%20Position/Two%20Grates%202016_zpskc1bykvy.jpg
Two Grates shown in May 2009
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Truck%20Position/Two%20Grates%20May%202009_zpsoexaeajo.jpg
“… but for now I will say neighbors account checks out 100%. B”
That would mean Neighbor should have also seen TMH’s truck on the shoulder, but didn’t mention it. Was Neighbor told not to mention it publically? And, of course, where does that leave us with Stensen’s truck and trailer? He parked it there much of the time he was mowing and never attended to it between about 8:05am and 8:50am. Or was there another white truck involved that drove up (or backed up) the access road and then came back down to leave at about 8:30am? Maybe bringing Stensen something, such as, gasoline, parts, or lunch? Or just wandering around aimlessly.
I can hardly wait for the rest of the story.
Rose says:
November 1, 2016 at 6:19 pm
I suggest his usual practice when he was over and done was not driving back to the then full lot with his long liad, but walking into the school thru the exit door adjacent to 109, and back out again.
—————
I would think the door adjacent rm 109 would have normally been locked from the inside. I don’t think the school would allow anyone except school personal to regularly enter the school from any access door except the main office and GK did not work for the school.
If the GK brought the lawn mower with him then I would think when he was finished mowing he would put the mower on his trailer get all his tools packed up and drive down the access road lock the gate take the access key back to the office and be on his way. I don’t think he would have walked all the way down to the office and then back up to the soccer field to leave.
If he acquired the lawn mower at the school then he probably would have returned said mower and and still parked in the school parking lot to return the access road key. I think he would have kept the key with him while mowing the lawn because he might have relocked the padlock on the access gate while he was cutting the grass or he was worried that someone else would re lock it before he was done and he did not want to fetch the key twice.
I also think since the GK was an hourly county employee who took care of multiple green spaces for the county that he would be required to log each green space he mowed the time when he got there and when he left. I don’t think he was ever mistaken about his time of arrival and departure from Skyline school unless he was deliberately trying to mislead people
What does that say about the GK who knows but I have a hard time believing the GK disappeared Kyron it doesn’t fit with the encounter with SZ at the cool electric one and he did not look like a nondescript person someone would not remember. But as Blink has told us people do unexpected things for their own reasons.
I will simply say that not only were some doors actually ajar (as in, propped open) so were some windows.
B
@ATG. School, pta, and Foundation all needed access to the key. ie at carnival time,
food vendors and moonbounce transportation trucks might drive up there.
ie, Our eled soccer field has multiple large trucks parked on it near very large
inflatable slides and moonbounces each year.
why aqua? why grates there? Normally on rural roads ditching takes care of drainage.
In my area the State maintains County roads like this one.
I have no urls but recall not long before 2010 the soccer field was renovated
and as part of that work an underground well or something like that was covered over.
Could’ve been an underground drainage system and misidentified.
—–
Wonder why Herron was not just promoted to River Patrol supv?
Union Pres, ATV trainor, head of SAR.
What more would Reese want?
maybe ATG will get something out of Sect 5 drainage
https://multco.us/file/16499/download
In my county, the public schools have an engineer who
jointly works with a County engineer on streets near a school (commuting rtes)
on traffic flow and on fixtures such as signage, traffic control (humps) and one
woukd assume site drainage. The PS engineer works generally with
the same County engineer at all schools to evaluate and make recommendations
to those who carry out the work.
I was looking for the soccer fid renovation that mentioned the well (probably in a principal’s newsletter of 08 or 09 I can’t find), and instead found this grant appl. Idk if it was approved. iirc it was, as the school was later featured in the org’s newsletter. http://ecoschoolnetwork.org/docs/deq-grant-sample-application/?bp-attachment=17606057_2_00_DEQ_2008_GrantApplication_Final1.doc
Look at (A). Tidy source of side income for Inahara and Powell at $16/hr,
and Keefer at $50/hr. Put a fulltime Americorps worker in the school in 09-10.
—
Also I read tonite
the eled rec soccer team practices
after school with their coaches twice a week.
topography, hydrology, usage
many maps
http://www.oregonmetro.gov/sites/default/files/North-Tualatin-Mountains-Access-Master-Plan-draft.pdf
http://www.foxcarolina.com/story/21190245/fugitive-ex-teachers-car-found-in-los-angeles
I think I mentioned this before, Storm drove a Silver Jetta, which sure looks a lot like the silver vehicle in the LE photos. I seriously wonder if LE put that vehicle in both of those photos to let SZ know, we know what car you drove, we just don’t know WHO you are. ??
Which LE photos re Kyron, T. Ruth?
B
Where do the grates lead? It’s a rural area which does not seem they would connect to a larger (city) drain system. It doesn’t look like they would be much help with storm water on that large hillside. Someone must maintain them. Anyone driving past would see them even if school can’t which means anyone messing with them would have to wait until Stensen left, unless it was him – people dismissed him as having another purpose. (Not saying he did.) Would be true of anyone we’d assume had a valid reason for being at or close to that spot – from repair truck to school bus to a horseback rider.
Would SZ have had enough time and enough cover to use a drain? Are the actual drain pipes large enough to accommodate something big and not get plugged up? If he did, he could have gone back to the building (walking or driving?) to be seen again, but if the SF was over, he’d be more noticeable inside if he was not a “regular” in the building – unless he went back for the Talent Show and was seen again – people would assume (later) a criminal would not still be there so he must not be involved, even if they noticed him. Did Matthews go to the Talent Show? Maybe SZ hung around to enjoy the chaos he caused but was disappointed when no one noticed.
If SZ waited for Stensen to leave and Stensen left later than he thought, where was SZ in the meantime? Did anyone check Stensen’s next work site on his schedule to see when he arrived – to help with the timeline? Even if it was another field or park, or a return to work location, someone would have noticed then – a dog walker even. Probably too late now.
Are there other grate entrances or exits to the drain (assuming it’s a set of pipes and not a closed system? Perhaps across the street at the church or some distance along Skyline either way. Is the presence of the grates tied to a building or road requirement of some sort? How long have they been there – since before the church renovation work or in conjunction with? Can we find an older picture that would show they were NOT there?
If SZ knew when kids were supposed to report to class and thought Kyron would be reported missing, there was not much time to do whatever, stop and dispose of anything, even clothing, inside a grate – is it bolted or just fitted on top of concrete? Parents were leaving. I think it’s too exposed an area – but maybe LE did too, so didn’t check there.
I keep thinking of questions.
tzad says:
November 2, 2016 at 2:19 pm
FYI
http://photobucket.com/images/Artwork%20by%20Kyron%20Horman,%20age%207
There was quite a bit of Kyron’s artwork put out there by ???? at one point. Here’s the one of the sun that reminded me of stained glass. Much was discussed on many forums if you just take the time to google Kyron and “artwork”.
https://www.virtualgallery.com/galleries/l_lindall_a1839591/angels_of_amaranth_s11486/kyron_horman_o180303
Never saw this person’s rendition of Kyron’s aged composite, it’s a heck of a lot better than the one in the official flyers.
It appears that there is a 20″ concrete culvert at the drive into the East parking lot. That allows water from above the lot along Skyline drive to pass downhill and enter the grated opening to the storm drain.
There is definitely a blue patina on both grates referenced. The blue indicates the grates have some copper in the metal close to the surface of the grate.
Using the photo set, I also spotted a possible third grate located further West in line with the wye where the soccer field access road and the loop road meet. Again the patina is showing. This is a storm drain that empties into either a larger diameter pipe or a creek or open water course.
Hooking a piece of stiff wire under the bars of the grate would allow someone to lift it without disturbing the patina. There is enough grade difference downhill to move a pretty larqe object through the pipe. There is the possibility that the drain grates are secured with bolts.
frustratingly this is a goigked snippet from a former skyline student but despite searching each relevant issue (ie Sept & Dec 2006), I can’t the original post:
“Portland Public Art | Page 31
WordPress.com › portlandpublicart › page
Sep 10, 2006 – Did he go to Skyline Grade School? … In the ground below the cone, catching rainwater is a sewer …
September | 2006 | Portland Public Art
WordPress.com › portlandpublicart › 20…
Sep 16, 2006 – Did he go to Skyline Grade School? No, probably Catlin. … In the ground below the cone, catching rainwater is a sewer grate. As I approached …”
I suspect the cone with a sewer beneath may have been what was
on or near the athletic field until its renovation.
@Quizzi, cd. It is possible Neighbor arrived after 8:45 & saw Stenson’s white truck (or other) but not TMH’s.
Stenson”s mower was housed at PP&R, not Skyline. He wrote of his winter tasks being indoors and mechanical on PP&R equipment. Some of his site writing seems gone, didn’t see his comments on the diviorce. As for someone bringing him things, but fir family & musicians, he seems a loner. His site mentions, after retirement, howhappy he was to no longer get up at 4:45 am. Likely he mowed somewhere before Skyline.
@Quizzi. Agreed about mower, but not truck/trailer on wet ground.
But I think Stenson, who’d rolled out of bed at 4:45 am,
was a creature of habit in a rut til he could retire, thus followed
the same routine on each and every visit–the access rd designed
by PP&R for field maintenance.
On reflection, Neighbor probably arrived early not late since she saw his
spread in the parking lot –say 7:45?
Blink, are you looking into Zuzu Verk?
I am aware of it, but no, unfortunately.
B
If the GK had a trailer on his truck then I am inclined to believe he did not get the mower at Skyline, but drove from site to site with the same mower, which is why he would need the trailer to haul it. If he got the mowers at each location, he could just drive them to the fields and parks and wouldn’t need a trailer. Si?
Right.
B
cd says:
November 3, 2016 at 2:39 am
Rose says:
November 1, 2016 at 6:19 pm
I suggest his usual practice when he was over and done was not driving back to the then full lot with his long liad, but walking into the school thru the exit door adjacent to 109, and back out again.
I will simply say that not only were some doors actually ajar (as in, propped open) so were some windows.
B
—————
Yes that probably was the case but what I was saying was i don’t think that it would have been the GK’s
usual. practice to enter the school through access doors on days during the school year that were not Science Fair days.
There could be different people then him mowing to soccer field during the school year (the GK/Dave could have vacations or sick days) . I know the school security was not to sharp but would they have had a policy during the school year to allow anyone who showed up as a grounds keeper to enter the school through unlocked access doors to get a key from the office instead of making them enter the office from the school’s main entrance.
If the GK was using the access doors that day(June 4) then I think that is suspicious how did he know the door he wanted to use would be propped open that day.
If it is true he needed the gate key ( and I don’t know it is or isn’t) he needs to get it from Susan Hall.
B
I read in one of those big useless Portland enviro reports to the State last nite the tiny item that Portland had 2 Americorps members doing nothing but going & painting & marking those citywide grates. Enough to turn an Americorp draftee to drugs imo
@ MockingbirdSings says:
November 3, 2016 at 2:42 pm
See hydrology drainage maps i posted in big study above
lotsa major creeks
iirc skyline’s may flow South,
After taking Rose’s link to the street and other design standards for Multnomah county, it appears that the drains were put there to meet those standards. The minimum size pipe is between 73/4″ inside diameter and 11 3/4″ inside diameter. The entire standard is based on metric measurement to meet the Oregon state standards. The standard is plastic pipe with O-ring seals. The pipe is ok, but synthetic rubber seals will not likely meet the design standard of 75 years. A child Kyron’s size could easily fit into a drain of 11 3/4″ inside diameter or larger. Remember the design standards are minimums.
Pipe size standards are based on nominal inside diameters up to 12 inches where they change to outside diameter. A 14″ O.D. pipe with a wall thickness of 1/2″ or .500″ would have an inside diameter of 13 inches. A small man can get inside an 18 or 20 inch O.D. pipe.
With time spent looking at the roadway drainage for more than a mile in either direction from the school, I found no other drainage structures. This makes me believe that there is a well system that collects water run-off from the school yard. This could be on the property used by the soccer field. I did not find any indication of a surface access to such a system.
Skyline drive does not meet the current design standards. The roadway is in a poor state of repair with cracks patched by county work crews using cold or hot tar pourings. I would say that few streets and roads in the county that are more than thirty years old could meet the current standards. The sloped portion from roadway to drainage has a 2:1 minimum slope which is too steep for safe driving or parking. It should be 3:1 in places where the adjacent land is lower than the roadway.
I am questioning the wet ground thesis regarding the truck and trailer and the mower. There is a roadway around the soccer field. It appears to have a grass surface. However, such a roadway would likely have a sub-surface of small gravel that the grass has grown through. My driveway is just like that and the vehicles do not sink into that surface.
The mower probably has wide tires called turf tires that will not leave a track or sink into soils that are wet.
MBS
Suppose those drains actually empty into a stone lined well system that allows the water to gradually seep into the soil over time. Unless something blocked the normal operation, there would be no reason to open the top of the well for years and years.
Take a look at some of the Walmart or other big box stores with large parking lots. Most of them have and open pit lined with stone to hold the rain water runoff from the lot. This provides slow penetration into the soil and also evaporation into the air. These pits are especially helpful in rocky areas where water penetration is slow. Otherwise, the rain would use the street or highway as a drain.
I remember flying into Las Vegas, Nevada one afternoon after a heavy rain-more than normal for the area. All the streets were flooded. The whole valley sits on a rock base. The city had drain systems with drains about a half mile apart and no means to discharge the water out of the piping. The rain filled the storm drain piping and backed up into the streets.
What I commented on — Quizzis’s analysis of the truck and trialoe, rather than the mower alone, was going down the grassy slope elevation behind the school down to that grassy, subgravel truck in a wet season. Yes, he’d be fine when he got there, but would a farmer in a truck go down that elevation when wet, risking a slide and churning grass into mud when a gravel access road going up from a paved street was built for maintenance purposes. Plus Stenson had to ckean and repair mowers in wonter. I bet he would not risk gratuitous damage to his rig.
@ATG. Your description of an underground well being for rain drainage to allow slow dispersed soil entry is interesting. When I read, years ago cant find it now, of the athletic field well being covered over in the athletic field renovation prior to 09-10, I assumed it collected water to supply the school–toilets or whatever–and was no longer needed. Drainage makes more sense. The snippet I found referred to a cone above the well, feeding it, probably at ground level and part of the drainage system. I don’t see how the culverts below could run uphill and so think it must have an outlet in a creek-feeding area. I think I read about the renovation in a principal letter between 07-09 or a Skyline road runner way back or the ilk.
Which LE photos re Kyron, T. Ruth?
B
The ones in this flyer: One showing silver suv at Fred Meyers, and one showing silver suv at the school. Thinking about if LE possibly putting that type of vehicle there on purpose, I think DDS also drove a silver suv of some type, so maybe that’s why they did it. Makes me wonder if they know the car that was parked in the south lot, but not who drove it. Which would explain why they asked for the driver to include the make model etc., of his/her car. IOW some witness said they were parked next to a silver suv in the south lot, but the owner of said silver suv never came forward. IDK, prolly just to intimidate DDS.
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:en5q_SQtjvIJ:media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/TRUCKPressConferenceFlier.pdf+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
I am looking here http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/TRUCKPressConferenceFlier.pdf and fwiw I don’t see a comparable Silver SUV. I do notice they changed the position of TH truck spot in front of Skyline a few times- interesting.
B
B
Here are some pictures of the access road gate from gwenabob and ubrmel. Doesn’t look like any way to get around a closed gate.
http://i780.photobucket.com/albums/yy81/gwenabob/Skyline%20School/SkylineSchool032.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t166/ubrmel/ACCESS%20ROAD%20AT%20SKYLINE%202010/ROAD3.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t166/ubrmel/ACCESS%20ROAD%20AT%20SKYLINE%202010/ROAD8.jpg
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OT – Photobucket, where many Kyron case images are stored including mine,, has been having a great deal of problems staying up lately. The service was down for past two days. Apparently, a great many people depend on it for their small businesses, especially ebay sellers. Some have as many as 20,000 – 30,000 images on the site, another said they felt they lost upwards of $2,000 and counting due to the two day outage.
We actually do have a look into Room 109 in the first image below. I don’t think it tells of us much other than the outside door directly into that room does open. The narrative on the second image indicates this is Room 109.
These were pictures posted by ubrmel/freefallzzzz.
Open door into Room 109 from outside.
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t166/ubrmel/7%2015%202010%20SKYLINE%20SCHOOL/opendooronwestside.jpg
View of the west side of the school
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t166/ubrmel/7%2015%202010%20SKYLINE%20SCHOOL/updatedwsideofschool.jpg
Thanks Quizzi. I edited slightly as there are some cans that are better closed, lol.
B
Just to follow up. I think the tracks appearing to be from the back parking area were probably mower tracks returning from mowing the far west field.
http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m524/quizzi1/Skyline%20School%20Google%20History/Mower%20In%20Back_zpsv4w1xinh.jpg
@ATG
I agree that the truck, trailer with mower could traverse around the track with no problem.
My feeling was that going down and up the area north of the school (as shown above) with a truck and trailer would not be a good idea if the soil was even somewhat water soaked and the grass was wet, which was likely at that time of year. This would be due to lack of traction coming up the hill, tearing up the ground spinning tires, and/or “indenting” the ground with the greater weight of the truck and relative narrowness of the tires.
@Rose
I had made the argument that Neighbor’s time was off earlier, but with Blink indicating “… but for now I will say neighbors account checks out 100%. B”, unless corrected, I have to think Neighbor’s time of about “8.31” was accurate.
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Rose says:
November 4, 2016 at 5:36 pm
@Quizzi, cd. It is possible Neighbor arrived after 8:45 & saw Stenson’s white truck (or other) but not TMH’s.
~snip
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Rose says:
November 4, 2016 at 5:45 pm
~snip
On reflection, Neighbor probably arrived early not late since she saw his spread in the parking lot –say 7:45?
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Repeating Neighbor’s contribution
Neighbor says:
March 3, 2011 at 8:54 am
~snip
There was a white truck on the access road, but it was parked diagonal. The rear was partly on the access road and the nose pointing fairly steep down to Skyline blvd. Hope this clears things up instead of adding to the confusion. Time was about 8.31. As I recall (after many months) the GK had many spots blocked on the main parking.
~snip
Has anyone else noticed that there are no planned searches for Kyron, no car washes or vigils planned, the tort suit which the Gofundme account was created for was discontinued over 2 1/2 years ago. I also believe that the age progressed pictures of Kyron are probably free.
So why is Kelley still collecting monies and asking for donations on the WS site as well as on the on Gofundme page.
IMO
Where or to whom is that money being distributed to. Thats the thing about Gofundme there is no accounting for what or who donations are used for.
https://www.gofundme.com/kyronhorman
@Quizzi. I bite at 8:31 but the issue is was she coming or going? If going, then her arrival was earlier, perhaps 7:45 thus the parking lot observation. Personally I think it was coming, as 8:31 approximates school startup. Maybe the parking lot spread was heard by her via pta grapevine and not personally observed as she attests to with the truck.
And silence re Spot A truck might only mean to a driver passing by it did not stand out to the eye as a sloppily parked backwards truck on the access road.
It is also possible Dave left his truck/rig on the parking lot and drove the mower down to the track, and the kitty korner backwards truck was someone else desperate for a parking space and quick egress.