Kyron Horman Missing Case Breaking News: Remains Believed To Be Human Located Off Sauvie Island
Sauvie Island, Oregon-There are unconfirmed reports that a teenage boy fishing off of Sauvie Island located a human skull, and potentially other human body parts.
Update 1: As referenced on KOIN, a teenage fisherman believes he snagged a scalp with human hair attached, which he originally thought was horse hair. Columbia County detectives cordoned off the scene last evening and MCSO dive teams entered the water but found nothing. The possible “hair” was sent for testing.
Multnomah County Sheriff Office will not comment on the find, or confirm whether their office has facilitated the removal of same, or forwarded any items to the medical examiner for testing.
Following the disappearance of Kyron Horman, Sauvie Island has been the subject of repeated searchers for the missing Skyline second grader with no results.
It is also the former home of a man considered to be Federal fugitive following a confrontation with a Lincoln City officer with nearly fatal results. Officer Steven Dodds was able to return to duty after extensive rehabilitation.
Durham was a Sauvie Island resident for over 6 years and a volunteer fire fighter until he was removed from duty 6 months prior to the shooting.
David Durham’s dog was recovered injured following what appeared to be an accident in the suspects vehicle and is being cared for by a friend of the family. Mr. Durham has not been seen since his vehicle was recovered in the bay town of Waldport, Oregon.
Please check back to www.blinkoncrime.com for updates to this breaking story.
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MockingbirdSings says:
June 17, 2012 at 1:29 am
Ode says:
June 16, 2012 at 8:48 pm
I have a question. If someone received an e-mail from TH and that
e-mail was presented to the grand jury, can the recipient of the
e-mail grant permission (because they want to) for it to be presented as evidence in the civil case?
———————————
(snipped)
Short answer, as you of course have a particular email and a particular individual in mind, advise them to seek advice from their attorney and if unrepresented, the prosecutions GJ witness coordinator who will facilitate any further discussion.
B
——————————-
I did not have a particular email and individual in mind, but I thought it seemed like Ode did. I appreciate your answer and it does help. It’s hard for the average person, I think, to understand why a document like an email that isn’t going to change, could be subpoenaed in one case or perhaps submitted through examination of someone’s computer by investigators, but that same document would not be allowed to be used in a civil suit with the proper court order in place – assuming the attorney in the civil suit knew about it.
I do understand why a person who testified and was subpoenaed to testify again in another suit would definitely need representation. With this cast of characters, there may not be enough attorneys in Portland to accommodate them all!
I may have mixed up the origin of the question here as I was fixated on the legalities of my response, lol, however, OMG, yes, it is like talking to someone under water for most, and that is not a bad thing.
B
I know you do and have. Your post is worth re-reading.
MockingbirdSings says:
June 17, 2012 at 12:13 pm
@ erose – I totally agree, but I still say even if a child leaves the school with a parent or other approved person on the school’s list, it is STILL the school’s job to KNOW that. The school should be held accountable if any child is missing on their watch for any reason. By accountable, I mean that the school should be able to demonstrate they followed standard procedures necessary to know where children are and that they are safe – in other words, that they have done their best. Skyline did not do that. It bugs me as a parent and it bugs me as a professional.
I know this has been asked many times before, but with all of the recent questions about why LE isn’t releasing a description of SZ – couldn’t one reason also be because the description is just too vague? If they were to say something like (and this is just a random example) “white male, between 25-35 years old, brown hair, approx. 5’10″, blue jeans and a t-shirt” that would litterally be thousands of people in Portland, seems it wouldn’t be enough to go on, let alone release as a description and cause possible panic, and likely a million more questions about what LE is doing. Just one possibility I wonder about.
Please, someone correct me if I am wrong…….the only person whom I’ve ever read/heard say that Kaine Horman was at the school on Thursday, the day before Kyron disappeared, was the poster here on SM “neighbor”. Has anyone else ever said that? Or does anyone else remember someone else saying that?
You know, this is one of the problems with this case, the longer it goes on, the more rumors there are. The more rumors there are, the more people tend to believe them as fact. It’s down-right scary.
T.Ruth says -
“Terri Horman’s attorneys have 30 days to respond to this right?”
30 days from the time she is served. I’m sure that’s been done by now, probably within a day or 2 of filing.
I suppose they could serve her through her attorney, Houze, or both at the same time. But since she has 2 attorneys they could also say they are serving her first so she could decide if she wants to be represented by her criminal attorney, her divorce attorney, or someone specializing in civil cases.
I can see that it would be Houze’s job to monitor the civil trial and make sure he puts a damper on anything he can that could be used against her, just like the divorce trial. But in the divorce trial, her divorce attorney (Peter Bunch) prepared and filed the paperwork, and spoke in court, at the same time consulting with Houze. I suspect they will have a third attorney for the civil case, probably cheaper than Houze. Perhaps someone will agree to represent her just for the chance to work with Houze?
Houze was served.
B
question for Counsel (Lea) and/or better researchers than I,
did this Oregon legislative proposal by State Sen Gordly in 2007 become law?
http://www.leg.state.or.us/07reg/measures/sb0400.dir/sb0487.intro.html
Sect 3 provides a GAL from a State list “shall” be appointed for the child in a custodial interference case.
so maybe this 2005 case made the statutory rewrite happen:
http://courts.oregon.gov/Publications/A120935.htm
Looks like if the language is the same, DY/ER will litigate the “entices”
rather than the “Keeps”.
@VHL, Forget the description, “they” (LE, PPS, the media, take your pick) won’t even release the fact that Kyron left with someone other than TH. I would at least think “they” would want “us” (people with children, neighbors, community at large) to know that someone other than the step-parent took this child, an this is perhaps not an isolated incident and we all might want to look out for the nondescript guy in the jeans and the t-shirt. My sarcasm is directed at the situation, VHL, not you. It’s as if everyone can go on with their day as long as TH took Kyron. But if she didn’t, well…what a mess the truth can be.
You are correct as far as I know. That was a personal account from Neighbor. P.S. Just about everything about this case is a rumor in the MSM because they quote “sources.” The people that should be talking, ie LE and PPS aren’t on the record for much of anything. As far as I know, they are still looking for Kyron Holms. It’s Monday and I am sarcastic, I know it.
T. Ruth says:
June 17, 2012 at 10:49 pm
@VLH
(snipped) “I know this has been asked many times before, but with all of the recent questions about why LE isn’t releasing a description of SZ – couldn’t one reason also be because the description is just too vague?”
———————————————————————
IMO yes.
@ T. Ruth says:
June 17, 2012 at 10:49 pm
“Please, someone correct me if I am wrong…….the only person whom I’ve ever read/heard say that Kaine Horman was at the school on Thursday, the day before Kyron disappeared, was the poster here on SM “neighbor”. Has anyone else ever said that? Or does anyone else remember someone else saying that?
You know, this is one of the problems with this case, the longer it goes on, the more rumors there are. The more rumors there are, the more people tend to believe them as fact. It’s down-right scary.”
—————————————————————-
T.Ruth, Kaine said he was at the school on June 3rd with Terri. The link to the interview is somewhere in the hundreds of comments here on BOC. It puzzled me when KH only mentioned Terri being there June 3, but in a subsequent interview (it might have been the part 2 with Desiree) his story was entirely different and he went into detail about he and Terri taking the project on Thursday. I am accepting as fact he was there as there were witnesses. Personally, I think it’s better KH and DY are no longer making public statements on their opinions regarding the case facts/fiction. I hope one day we all will know what actually happenend on June 4, 2010. Wishful thinking, huh?
erose says:
June 18, 2012 at 10:05 am
LOL!
lyla says:
June 17, 2012 at 2:48 pm
Here’s a link from SM regarding the SF project and setting it up on June 3rd. Lea Conner has some interesting remarks. You will note Kaine does not speak to being at the SF on June 3rd. Neighbor verified Kaine was there on June 3rd. There is also a link to an audio interview with KH and DY.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=9317.700
*************
Yes, thanks for that Lyla. Kaine never says he was at the school on Thursday, June 3rd. Also that audio interview implies he wasn’t there, as he says Terri was the one who took the truck and dropped off the project. The original audio of that interview also does not mention the day it was dropped off (don’t know who inserted the dates on the SM transcription, but they were not mentioned.) Kaine states *he believes* the reports (and Terri’s walkthrough!) were done on Thursday. (Which Desiree confirms.) He never mentions that he was there at all. At one point, he contradicts himself, by saying she wanted the truck to drop him and the project off because it had to be on display until 10:00, which sounds like he’s referring to Friday. It’s all very confusing and why should it be?
Here’s the transcription done by BeanE over on WS:
Reporter: And the truck is yours and the Mustang is hers. And so she was driving your truck. Why was she driving your truck that day?
Kaine: Um… it was supposedly to pick up his science project. That’s what she told me, and that’s part of her story that makes no sense.
Reporter: Why would she need the truck to pick up his science… I mean, it’s not like this enormous thing, right?
Kaine: Eh… she took it to drop it off too. If, if… Her trunk is relatively small. And it was just (unintelligible because Desiree interrupts and talks over him)… damage…
Desiree: (interrupts) Yeah. It wouldn’t have fit in the car.
Kaine: It might have fit but there was concern about damage with the diorama and that. With the truck you can put it in the back of the cab, and prop it up nice, and you can put the diorama on the seat and there’s no risk of damage.
So she took it in the truck too.
Reporter: So why wouldn’t that story make any sense then?
Kaine: um… because she went to take him to drop him off for the science fair and the display… it had to be on display for, until 10 o’clock.
So why would she go drop him off and then leave him there and leave with the truck and not pick up the science project? That makes no sense to me at all… now. Didn’t think anything of it at the time.
She, her story was that they had walked through and done the project on Thursday, which I believe they had done.
Desiree: (interrupts) Yeah. Correct.
Kaine: They had done their reports on Thursday but it still had to be on display for the science fair.
Desiree: Correct.
Kaine: So she dropped him off, and took, took the truck to drop him off and pick it up, but because it had to stay there, she left without the project, and you know, thinking about it now, it’s like, well, why would you need the truck to pick it up if it had to stay there? You pick it up after school.
Reporter: Right. And the project was already up before she took him off to school that morning. I gotcha.
Kaine: Yes. Yes. So, take the truck after school to go pick him up and the project, but why would you go pick up the project at 8:45 before the science fair even starts. Makes no sense.
Desiree: She had…
Reporter: (interrupts) Obviously, it sounds like there’s a more sinister motive for her to have this truck.
Desiree: Well, and she had emailed me during that day to let me know she was gonna find out when she could pick up the project so that I could see it.
So she obviously didn’t know when she was supposed to pick it up.
Kaine: Yeah. Well, she was pretty concrete that she was picking it up that morning when she was dropping him off. So that’s…
Again, you start to get into her story versus what law enforcement has as fact and her story is all over the place.
And law enforcement has different information that’s more factual.
But that’s what we have from Terri.
25 minute audio interview with the Oregonian
4:10
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index…kyron.html
**************
Neighbor’s statements:
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2010/07/28/kyron-horman-case-parents-give-informative-interview/#comments
(sorry the link doesn’t work anymore)
» Neighbor said: { Jul 28, 2010 – 03:07:44 }
I was there Thursday morning and Friday. On Thursday am, I did not see groups touring. On Friday, parents were invited from 8:00 to 10:00. For the students, the school day started at 8:45 as usual. My kids teacher did a short circle time, after which the students were divided in groups of 4-6. Each group was chaperoned by a parent-volunteer or in some cases an 8th grader. The older kids had notebooks that they used to make their reports. At 10:00 all groups were back in the classrooms, and the school continued “as usual”
***********
(So, in the above, Kaine & Desiree are being contradicted by neighbor.)
*************
» Neighbor said: { Jul 28, 2010 – 06:07:12 }
Thank you for that information, Neighbor.
Maura said “Do you know where Kyron’s (Ms. Porter’s) second grade classroom is?”
From the main entrance (on the 2nd floor), you would take a left into the long hallway. Kyron’s combined 2nd/3rd grade classroom is on the far West end of that hallway, just before the stairs. From the stairs there is an emergency exit that leads to tall grass, and a small hill down to the soccer field.
The electrical displays were two (?) classrooms before Kyron’s. Just before that on the right is the North exit door that leads to the basketball court and wooded area in the back of the school.
MLR says “Did the teachers take roll call on Friday at 8;45 a.m. before the science fair and then again afterward?”
Remember compared to PPS standards, Skyline keeps its classrooms relatively small thanks to money raised by the PTO. The typical size is about 23 kids. I can only talk about a different class, but I have never heard names called out as in a formal roll call, but whenever there was a student missing, it was always noticed and followed up on. The kids have designated tables, and it is easily noted if one is missing.
****************
» Neighbor said: { Jul 28, 2010 – 07:07:07 }
MLR said “Where were the projects set up? Were projects brought in on Thurs? Was there anything sent home with the kids stating when they needed to be picked up? If the projects were left at school did they have to be moved in order for students to sit at the desks?”
Most classrooms put the projects on top of the tables. Some put then along the walls. The projects were supposed to be in on Tuesday (?), but I saw many coming in late on Wed/Thu. The details about the IB Expo were well communicated. The paperwork contained several pages with requirements and a time line. It was clear that the expo was until 10:00am that day. Everybody knows that school is out at 3pm, so it is trivial to conclude that the project could be picked up any day after 3pm. Note that the size of the project was limited to “poster size”. Many kids used the typical tri-fold boards with a small extra in front of it. These boards fold up to about 20×30″. You don’t need a big car to transport that.
**********************
» Neighbor said: { Jul 29, 2010 – 12:07:57 }
MLR said “Was Kyron’s project set up in his classroom or a different one? Were parents and 8th graders the only volunteers? Was the science fair open to the public? How many exit’s/entrances were able to be used that day?”
Kyron’s project was on the first table when you walked into his classroom. Only parents, a few 8th graders and a few special ed. teacher chaperoned. In my kids class room it were only the parents with cleared background screenings. (You know who has a clearance, because only those people were able to help earlier in the year and have a badge.)
The expo was open to family and friends. It is a small school, and parents know who the other parent volunteers are. Anybody else is usually taken to the office to register.
The doors used were the South (main door); the East door (where the school bus goes) and North entry (for the overflow parking). Still there are plenty of other doors that can be opened from the outside.
******************
Neighbor said: { Jul 29, 2010 – 05:07:21 }
Valhall said “are you saying that the statement made by Kaine in the interview that the students (not the parents, just the students) formerly toured the science fair on Thursday is incorrect?”
Sorry for the delay. I don’t know what happened on Thu pm. To my knowledge, parents and friends were only invited on Fri from 8-10am. I toured the fair on Friday with a small group of students. From their remarks and questions, I got the impression that they saw the exhibits for the first time. If kids and parents toured the other classrooms, it had to be coordinated between all the classes, and would have been well announced. That is unless they did so after school hours (3pm)! I can ask around.
*******************
» Neighbor said: { Jul 29, 2010 – 07:07:40 }
Wanda said “I’m recalling (that parents signed up in advance to take the tour with the student groups and that Terri was not signed up nor expected to take the tour. Is my foggy memory correct? Did you “sign in” for the tour the morning of June 4th or prior to June 4th? Did you sign in at all?”
To clarify things a bit .. parents/friends could walk in and tour the expo from 8 to 10am. I don’t think anybody signed in just to tour the expo nor was there an advance registration.
For the kids the school day started at 8:45, and they toured with a parent-volunteer, or the occasional 8th grader or special ed teacher until 10am. The parent-volunteers were taken from whatever parents were in the classroom. I did not sign up for that ahead of time. Then again, it was in a different classroom. I signed in/out on the PTA log only because I volunteered until after 10am.
***********************
http://blinkoncrime.com/2010/07/26/kyron-horman-missing-and-endangered-grand-jury-meets-indictment-imminent/comment-page-40/#comment-1612336
neighbor says:
August 12, 2010 at 9:57 am
@Vern said “Someone reported that they were in the vehicle down by the road (ballfield) and could see another person sitting in Terri’s truck while she was in the school. So, if that “tip” is true – then obviously the parking lot and school are visible from that dirt drive.”
The parking lot is not visible from the dirt rd. Only from Skyline when you get close enough to the parking. Around 8:30 more cars were parked along Skyline and on the dirt road. The dirt rd and the far East of the adjacent field are out of view from pretty much anywhere.
***********
http://blinkoncrime.com/2010/09/09/kyron-horman-missing-case-review-and-birthday-wishes-to-the-frog-prince/comment-page-41/#comment-1626749
neighbor says:
September 30, 2010 at 8:11 pm
@Satori “I have NOT made up my mind about Terri’s character, etc. I am OPEN. I am also clueless and OPEN about all other characters involved.”
The last day I saw the Hormans was on Jun/3. I am open to new *facts*. Let me tell you this: Like hundreds of other neighbors, I have agreed to multiple searches of my house, outbuildings and property. Do not take this lightly. We respect our privacy here. Like many others that were at the school that morning, I have spent many hours talking to LE about the sequence of events that morning. Everybody that I know has gone out of their way to help LE solve this crime. That is except one odd duck: Ky’s own stepmother.
(Note, she says she saw the HormanS, so not sure, but I would say she is saying she saw both Kaine & Terri there on June 3rd.)
****************
http://blinkoncrime.com/2010/09/09/kyron-horman-missing-case-review-and-birthday-wishes-to-the-frog-prince/comment-page-28/#comment-1624877
neighbor says:
September 23, 2010 at 8:51 pm
@MBS wrote “Perhaps there is a parent from Skyline or someone who knows a Skyline parent reading this who would know for sure if the opening of regular school was officially delayed for SF.”
Nothing gave me the impression that this was a late start. Late starts are advertised as such in advance. Typically about once a month on a Wednesday.
The only unusual part was that parents/family/friends were invited from 8:00 to 10:00. Students reported to their classroom at 8:45 as usual. I was in another class where the teacher did a 10 minute group time at 8:45 after which she dispatched small groups of students with chaperons. Until 10:00 the students learned by visiting science projects in different classrooms. From 10:00 on, the normal routine resumed.
**************
http://blinkoncrime.com/2011/01/30/fugitive-cop-shooter-david-durhams-house-located-in-new-kyron-horman-search-grid/comment-page-79/#comments
neighbor says:
April 8, 2011 at 7:27 pm
correct, 3pm
T. Ruth says:
April 8, 2011 at 1:38 pm
@neighbor
Am I reading here correctly that you personally saw KH at Kyron’s school on Thursday, June 3rd? If so, do you recall approximately what time that was? (Hope you don’t find my asking too intrusive.)
******************
So here again, neighbor again confirms she saw Kaine Horman at 3:00 p.m. at Skyline Elem. on June 3rd. Yet Kaine nor Desiree mention that he was there at all. In fact they imply that only Terri dropped off the project (in the a.m.). So if Kaine was at the school on June 3rd @ 3 p.m. what was he doing there? Was Terri there as well? Were they just picking up Kyron? Why didn’t he take the bus home? Was there some sort of meeting with Porter? If Kaine was helping drop off the project at that time, why didn’t he ever say so?
If Kaine was in fact, at that school, there is something so fishy about him never, ever saying he was at that school on Thursday. Either he or “neighbor” are telling stories. Neighbor has not posted since (I think) August 2011. I wonder why. I hope she/he is okay. In any case, this is the only person I’ve ever come across that says Kaine Horman was at that school on Thursday. No reporter has ever asked either. I have no reason to think neighbor would come here and lie, unless neighbor is SZ. So I just don’t know what to believe until we hear from LE.
(Sorry, for the lengthy posts, just wanted to go over some of the things neighbor told us.)
@erose – I 100% agree with you. I also completely understand and share your frustration directed at the situation. It seems not releasing SZ info is a big huge CYA. What a frenzy that would cause – but you know what? I could give a flying goose if it would cause a frenzy because finding Kyron should be their number 1 concern, not their behinds.
With that said, I still hold out a sliver of hope that there is a better and bigger reason, one that is helping find Kyron, as to why their mouths are buttoned. No clue what the reason would be, but one can hope.
T.Ruth,
An absolutely stellar job you have done compiling neighbor’s comments.
I recall listening to the KH and DY interview and thinking something’s bothering me with the tone, words and mannerisms. Thought perhaps KH was the one who insisted on TH taking the truck the way he described the need for the fragile handling of the science project.
Also don’t ever remember KH eventually mentioning he was at the school on June 3 once neighbor had posted that she saw him.
Like you, I don’t know what to make of it either. However, this would not be the only time, imo, that KH has not been forthcoming – - if it’s true he was at the school June 3 pm, that is. 3pm would be the end of the school day, wouldn’t it? And the sign out front did say “Talent Show” (KH said he didn’t know anything about a talent show)?
Again, great compilation, T.Ruth.
Perhaps neighbor will respond after such a long absence.
I have always taken it that TH dropped the project off Thursday AM so Kyron could do his presentation. If Kaine could not be there on Friday to tour he may have come at the end of school on Thursday to see the project set up. Once the tours were done at 10AM projects could go home. Maybe Kaine thought TH was going to tour the fair and then take the project home but she did not stay. I doubt she could have picked it up after 3pm on a Friday in order to take it to show Desiree and Tony that weekend.
Interesting that Neighbor said she was there Thursday morning so she must have been there Thurs AM, Thurs PM and Friday AM. She did not mention if she saw TH there Thurs AM to drop the project off yet we are told she needed the truck Thursday and I am sure the class presentations were that Thursday before the fair. I also have never heard Kaine say he was not at school on Thurs. If neighbor says she saw the Horman’s there on Thursday, one could be in the morning and one in the afternoon. Do we know if Kyron rode the bus home on Thursday? Perhaps Dad picked him up at Thursday and stopped in to see the set-up since he could not be there Friday. There would have been no reason for TH to be there that afternoon.
@ T.Ruth – Thank you for posting! When I first read your question to Neighbor, and their response, I saw the same thing you did, confirmation that Kaine was there on Thursday.
I went back to see if I could find the post you were referring to (that you were asking Neighbor to confirm) and couldn’t seem to find it. Then I saw the post below from Rose, and it made me think, could Neighbor have thought you meant Kyron and not Kaine when you said KH? I looked and did not see a response to Roses’ question below. Did Neighbor say Kaine in the post that you were asking them to confirm?
I hope I don’t sound interrogative or anything, not at all my intention, I highly respect your posts. It would just make a big difference whether Neighbor meant Kaine or Kyron.
“Rose says:
April 9, 2011 at 1:43 am
@Neighbor. 46. We keep using initials.
I had read you as meaning Kyron and Terri at 3 on June 3.
When saying yes, do you mean Kaine, not Kyron?
The media said last summer Kaine was never around the school.”
from neighbor:
“From the main entrance (on the 2nd floor), you would take a left into the long hallway. Kyron’s combined 2nd/3rd grade classroom is on the far West end of that hallway, just before the stairs. From the stairs there is an emergency exit that leads to tall grass, and a small hill down to the soccer field.
The electrical displays were two (?) classrooms before Kyron’s. Just before that on the right is the North exit door that leads to the basketball court and wooded area in the back of the school.”
****
I’m confused. Thought Kyron was going “downstairs” to see a cool electric one?
ooops, I forgot my link to the WS transcription, above:
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5828811
@T.Ruth
(snipped)” If Kaine was in fact, at that school, there is something so fishy about him never, ever saying he was at that school on Thursday. Either he or “neighbor” are telling stories. Neighbor has not posted since (I think) August 2011. I wonder why. I hope she/he is okay. In any case, this is the only person I’ve ever come across that says Kaine Horman was at that school on Thursday. No reporter has ever asked either. I have no reason to think neighbor would come here and lie, unless neighbor is SZ. So I just don’t know what to believe until we hear from LE.
(Sorry, for the lengthy posts, just wanted to go over some of the things neighbor told us.)”
—————————————————————
Thanks for bringing over some of the old posts. I wish I would have saved some of the threads from HinkyMeter as there were links to this subject regarding the truck on June 3. As far as Neighbor is concerned, I would think BOC could verify the poster through email address. I will continue to do some more searches as I recall KH during a later interview address the June 3rd issue.
I wish to be clear on this issue. Neighbor was personally vetted by me, and is without hesitation a potential witness in this case. For that reason, I am very limited in what I will comment except to say you already know it would never have appeared here if it was corroborated.
B
@TRuth.
Haven’t finished your Neighbor review yet as my brain sprung in the first of your paragraphs.
You cite Kaine saying he believed the Sci Fair display was to be up until 10????
(Friday)
Well, by gum that makes sense. The kidlets had to go use their desks to work thru the school day at 10.
I’m willing to bet that Terri had planned to stay til 10 as a volunteer Sci Fr chaperone and take the project home at 10 when Sci Fr ended, like Kaine said. I bet she chaperoned frequently.
Now that’s a Great question for Mrs Porter & her lawyer: Was Terri originally scheduled to be a Sci Fr field trip
chaperone? Then, because Kiara was cranky as heck, she bagged it for a Motrin type plan and driving Kiara around. She Probably told Porter she wasn’t staying after all because Kiara felt sick. Explains why she’d then email asking when to get the trifold. Bet she didnt want to go back and was hoping for a Monday reply.
So Kaine said that 10 am thing, TRuth?
@TRuth. oh gosh. The Beanee transcript perturbs me.
There’s Kaine saying she’d told him she’d get the trifold
Friday am, and he considers it venal she didn’t.
(Heh, Moms, how often do our plans change on the run?)
Then Desiree chimes in Terri emails her she’d try to get it in the afternoon (after all)
so she could see it. Personally, I consider Terri had to work fulltime as a domestic service professional
with these two bios to keep them happy. Surely we domestic Moms can empathize.
Humorously, , my strong athletic 18 yo who is employed mere mornings in a nursery school with 3
yos, the best place in town where every teacher has a masters, well run, small classes,
has left her 4 hr duty daily exhausted. She’s virtually unable to walk from the tiredness that constant attention to 3 year olds takes, and she announced to her boyfriend she didn’t think she’d ever have children. And she is very social and hands on. She’s had it with 4 hours of kids already.
I don’t think in their great understandable anger the bios understood mother’s daily variations of plans when hands on and how hard having to also placate what should be another parent partner makes everything.
These comments don’t relate to Terri’s guilt or not. idk there.
@VHL, They can have my flying goose, too.
@TRuth, Love your “long post.”
http://www.katu.com/home/video/99665719.html
In this video, around the 4:50 minute mark, Kaine again talks about the science fair mentions both Thursday & Friday, when asked to clarify any confusion about the truck. He does not mention being at the school on either day. He does state that HE was confused about which day was for display and which day for tours, that he and Terri’s communication between one another wasn’t clear. Obviously, had Kaine Horman been at the school on Thursday, he would have known what was going on, so there would have been no confusion.
When KH & DY are asked if they thought there was anything sinister about TH borrowing the truck, they shrug and he says Terri borrows the truck whenever she needs it and it’s nothing out of the ordinary for her to do so.
In listening to this again, I noticed that when the reporter asks what they want to say to Terri’s friends about coming forward, Desiree says she wants to answer,telling them to come forward with anything, etc., but then Kaine says he wants to expand on her answer and says “I would broaden it. ***I would say it’s anyone who knows Kyron.*** Whether they know Dede or not or whether they’re really good friends with Terri or not, if they’ve had interactions with Kyron and with Terri, ***or part of our family***, and they have information that might help, they need to come forward. I’ve heard people say that they’re afraid, to get involved, to come into this….”
I wonder what he meant by “if they’ve had interactions with *part of our family*? Is he insinuating that there is suspicion that someone else in the family who took Kyron? Does LE think someone else in the family took Kyron? Terri’s side of the family? Or is he saying this, because SZ called Kyron by name? IDK, just never caught that before.
I’ve seen posts on OL that say the project was taken in on Thursday A.M. If true, and Kaine Horman was at the school at 3:00 p.m. on Thursday, then why was he there? Can anyone think of a reason someone would want us to believe Kaine was at the school on Thursday if he wasn’t?
We know so little about Kaine’s timeline on either day. LE did ask for video from both days, did they not? Here’s a thought, was Terri Horman there on Thursday afternoon with someone who neighbor mistook as Kaine? SZ?
@T.Ruth
It’s possible Kaine could have gone up to the school after he returned home from work on June 3rd to see Ky’s display. Didn’t neighbors say he was there at 3:pm?
T. Ruth says:
June 18, 2012 at 3:16 pm
lyla says:
June 17, 2012 at 2:48 pm
I think considering the amount of seemingly harmless information (like was Kiara with TH the day of the science fair) that takes forever to be confirmed and the amount of info Kaine has omitted (some talk of a doctors appointment?) or even stretched. ( TH is falling down drunk every night but I didn’t notice that she was drinking until friends told me). To say nothing of the texting sexting fiasco
I’m think I’m gonna believe Neighbor
IMO Kaine was probably at the school on June 3, at at around 3:00 pm although I don’t know what real difference it makes in this case anyway.
@wpg says:
June 18, 2012 at 5:54 pm
Thanks, but I can’t take credit, it’s the work of many friends who just want to find Kyron.
*************
@VLH,
Shouldn’t have used initials and I try not to. But yes that’s why I asked about Kyron’s school instead of “his” school. Neighbor indicated she saw “The Horman’s” on 6/3, I would take that as both Kaine & Terri. I can’t remember if that’s what made me ask the question, or if she stated it again elsewhere. Everyone here was referring to it though.
lyla says:
June 18, 2012 at 6:52 pm
@Blink says:
I wish to be clear on this issue. Neighbor was personally vetted by me, and is without hesitation a potential witness in this case. For that reason, I am very limited in what I will comment except to say you already know it would never have appeared here if it was corroborated.
******
Thank you for the information Blink. But did you mean to say if it was *not* corroborated it wouldn’t appear here?
*****************
@lyla
I would love to see that if you find it, because that’s something I’ve never heard/seen. As I mentioned, the only one I’ve ever read/heard say that Kaine was at the school on Thursday was “neighbor”. ( erose, hasn’t seen it either and I know she’s been following this since the beginning as well.) That’s the reason I asked neighbor to clarify and if she could relay the time.
Geeze, why can’t LE come out with some simple statements about this case. Would every darn clarification hinder the investigation?
***********
FWIW, here’s one of the posts from OL in regards to when the project was taken in:
thatkewlgirl March 17, 2012 at 5:42PM
Follow
They were due Thursday morning, and the science fair was ready for viewing first thing in the morning on Friday June 4. The science projects were all taken in on JUNE 3 AM, including Kyron’s red tree frog project!
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2012/03/kaine_horman_at_portland_roads/4053/comments-16.html
(I always take these with a grain of salt, but it seems to back up what neighbor says, that the projects were expected to be turned in between Tues-Thurs, but deadline was Thurs *A.M.*.)
Dang, yes, of course. Long day.
B
I was curious about the one interview — not much of one — that TH had with a reporter at her former home with KH. She would not talk about the case, and that “interview” was reduced to chit chat about the landscaping and some unmowed lump in the Horman yard. I looked it up. It occurred on June 23, 2010. It’s on page two of a google search I wrote up as “Terri Horman interviewed at her home.”
http://www.wweek.com/portland/blog-1080-a_visit_with_terri_moulton_horman_and_whats_change.html
Ooookay. That meeting with TH was on June 23, 2010. It was not published in WW until June 28, 2010 — a day that also included KH moving out and all hell breaking loose with that story. I will think in terms of the publication schedule of WW – it just happened to coincide with the June 28th “KH moves out with Kiara” saga.
Read the comments sections under the article.
I read all the comments at the end of that story. They end on 7/17/10. Except, for one more after that — on 12.26.2011 at 10:01.
The 12/26 comment is by an “Ernie.” And it is EXACTLY what EagleforFreedom posts on OL. Ernie is EagleforFreedom. If you scroll to the last page of the comments on this article, you will see that the “Ernie” comment is in December, 2011, and that it is 17 months after the last comment before it, in July, 2010. Why change your online i.d. for just one webpage? It’s not like anyone who regularly sees Eagle posting on OL would not see the identical theme and writing style in “Ernie’s” comment on the WW article.
Is Eagle4Freedom/Ernie SZ?
There. I asked.
If I was posting anyplace but BOC, I wouldn’t ask.
Or….is Ernie/Eagle4Freedom really TH? I doubt that. Houze would hear about a client posting non-stop on OL about PPS losing Kyron, and would tell TH to cut it out.
Or…is Ernie/Eagle4Freedom someone who knows that a person at the school, or a district employee, is SZ?
On OL, Eagle is not slowing down. He/she has posted as of June 18th, 2012. If LE wanted Eagle to shut up, that would have happened by now, IMO.
I need a drink.
I can promise you that TH and her counsel is under the impression all TH electronic activity is being monitored, not her.
B
Thanks again Blink. Glad to know when even just that little bit of information has been corroborated. This case has so many twists and turns I never know who or what to believe. I truly hope neighbor is okay and just stepped away from posting because of the same frustration we all have.
**********
So why then, if KH was at that school on June 3rd, would he be saying he was confused as to what was going on when? IMO, that makes no sense whatsoever.
@cd
(snipped) “I’m think I’m gonna believe Neighbor
IMO Kaine was probably at the school on June 3, at at around 3:00 pm although I don’t know what real difference it makes in this case anyway.”
———————————————————————
I’m with you cd.
wpg says:
June 18, 2012 at 6:30 pm
I’m confused. Thought Kyron was going “downstairs” to see a cool electric one?
—————–
There is nothing here about Kyron going downstairs
“He walked by the hallway and I’m like, ‘Hi, Kyron,’ and he’s like, ‘Hi. I’m going to go see this cool one. It’s electric.’ I’m like, ‘Alright, bye.’ And that’s the last time I saw him,” Tanner said. “He never did make it back to class.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHdLd2SvUSU
————-
Note Tanner says he (Tanner) is going downstairs not that Kyron is headed downstairs.
8-year-old Tanner Pumala, a desk mate of Kyron says, “I went downstairs, and that was the last time I saw him and I never seen him after that,”
http://realitychatter.forumotions.com/t2658-tanner-pumala-and-tyler-kessinger#62310
T. Ruth says:
June 18, 2012 at 11:09 pm
lyla says:
June 18, 2012 at 6:52 pm
@Blink says:
I wish to be clear on this issue. Neighbor was personally vetted by me, and is without hesitation a potential witness in this case. For that reason, I am very limited in what I will comment except to say you already know it would never have appeared here if it was corroborated.
******
Thank you for the information Blink. But did you mean to say if it was *not* corroborated it wouldn’t appear here?
—————-
I don’t think that Blink would let anyone make statements as first hand witnessed events by any person unless she had validated the statements authenticity. This is reason I post on this blog. We are all free to speculate on our own perceptions but not to mislead other posters by claiming to know first hand (eye witnessed) information which has not been validated by Blink. JMO
That is correct, and T. Ruth was right to ask if I might “was not corroborated” which is of course what I meant.
B
I understand that the SZ description is most likely vague, but I think it should be released anyway.
The reason being this. Would we rather read a description, for example: (white male with very short dark hair, slim build, under six foot)—or NOTHING?
What good does nothing do? Nothing gives us absolutely no chance of anything, no help, no hope.
A vague description at least helps narrow down some things such as, race, sex, height, weight, hair type, etc.
At this point in time, two years after the fact, I think that anything is better than nothing.
Yep. I also think parents deserve the right to dispel any false security and amp up their vigilence.
I can tell you as a point of fact that their have been parents at Skyline who took my advice and requested that “town hall meeting” setting. They were flat out told it is an active case and to their knowledge LE had not new information.
Well hey, I guess lightening never strikes the same place twice, right?
B
How long does forensic hair analysis take?
Depends on the condition of the hair and if it is human. My guess is if it is human it is going to be a while.
B
I am catching up on this case and so far my biggest concern is why Kaine would leave out specific information regarding being at school on June 3rd? I always though that Terri was the primary suspect, but now not so sure. Do you suppose one of them removed him to a place of safety where he’s alive and well? This is not very logical, I just don’t want him lost forever. Prayers for Kyron.
There has been speculation that the picture released of Kyron in front of his sci project was taken the day before, June 3rd. A date on the wall was said to look like June 3rd. No other people are around. If Kaine Horman was there on the afternoon of June 3rd, after school had let out, could it be he took this picture, not Terri?
I brought this up before, but here’s one of the first posters of Kyron where the description does not mention the CSI T-shirt. The picture shows him in it, and yet the description of what a missing child is wearing, leaves out the most obvious thing to be looking for. Just weird. If this picture was actually taken the day before, then was Kyron even wearing a CSI T-shirt the day he disappeared?
http://hothardware.com/News/Alert-7Year-Old-Son-Of-Intel-Employee-Missing/
I’m thinking about Kaine Horman’s “heads up to Intel legal”, I’ve always found that letter really odd. Is it possible that when Kaine Horman was at Skyline Elementary on June 3rd, that he was working? Is it possible that he was there to participate or monitor some display that was put on in conjunction with Intel? Such as a cool electric one? Has Kaine Horman in an employment capacity with Intel ever done work at Skyline Elementary? Has anyone found a link where it shows Intel put on some kind of kids program, teaching program or display at Skyline Elementary? Would this sort of thing be in line with Mr. Horman’s duties at Intel?
I’m still mulling over possible reasons why TH wanted to take the truck on both the 3rd and 4th of June (other than not wanting to damage the diorama). The one thing I do see that may be of possible significance is her red mustang with personalized plates (RDSQRL)would have stood out like a sore thumb! Lots of white truck around. Just a thought.
@ erose says: June 18, 2012 at 9:58 am
I agree! Blink knows about a SZ, and therefore her readers do too. I am sure Blink isn’t the only person with this information; I mean someone very credible had to have told Blink about SZ, right?
I don’t mind that LE hasn’t put out a sketch as much as I mind that they haven’t put out a statement that Kyron left with a SZ and not Terri.
I would think that Houze would be all over LE not releasing this information.
In addition to Houze being all over LE releasing the fact that Kyron didn’t leave with Terri…. I would think that the PRESS would be all over this too… And wouldn’t the parents of Skyline demand to know too?
How long does forensic hair analysis take?
Depends on the condition of the hair and if it is human. My guess is if it is human it is going to be a while.
**********************************************************************1)Would they take the time and resources if there were “no root” intact to the strands?
2)Not knowing who the hair belongs to and how long it has been in the water, would they be able to tell if the hair was color treated or fake? Would real red hair lose color in the water after a period of time?
3)And would they be able to tell if the strands of hair were “pulled or ripped” from someones head?
@Blink or all. I was looking at a list of grand jury witnesses.
From the school I only saw Keefer, Porter, and a 9 year old boy.
Was there any other person present at the Science Fair (ie from 490 list) who
testified at the GJ? Were some witnesses listed as “anonymous” or J Doe?
I’m wondering if the SZ witness was a 9 year old or an adult, of course.
cd,
Thanks for the links of the videos with Tanner speaking.
I know we are going over old ground again, but here is the video of 7th-grade Tyler speaking as well as KimH, mother of Curtis. Tyler says he saw Kyron in the gym with friends (LE requested he not release the time). KimH brings in a timeline of 9am and states that it was from the teacher that Curtis learned of a Dr.’s appointment – - he did not hear it from Kyron.
http://www.katu.com/home/video/98647489.html
ps
the gym is on the “main floor”, with it’s own door/exits to where vehicles can be parked?
****
In about 2 weeks should be a response to the civil suit filing (I think). Looking forward to attorney Lea’s article.
Blink, do you have a posting ETA?
As always, thank you.
Depends on Sandusky trial, will let you know when I can commit, thank you.
B
@NelMel says:
June 18, 2012 at 11:23 pm
LOL, I know this is just a coincidence, but isn’t Ernie Desiree & Tony’s dog? IIRC, Eagle is from the Medford area, although I could be wrong.
Neighbor says she only saw “the Hormans” on June 3rd, yet Blink says she may very well be a potential witness. Soooooo, what would a person be testifying to on June 3rd that may have happened at that school? Ideas? Kaine’s presence? Has he denied being there? Someone taking a photo of Kyron, which was said to have taken the next day? Was Terri there on June 3rd at 3:00 p.m. with Kaine, or was she only there the morning of June 3rd, dropping off the project? What if anything else, may have happened on June 3rd that would bring LE to ask for video from that day, and what why would witnesses be called for June 3rd testimony?
Why on earth Kaine and/or Desiree have not hired a Private Investigator in this case is beyond me. Although upon consideration just because I don’t know about it doesn’t mean they haven’t.
http://www.oregonlive.com/education/index.ssf/2010/09/for_safety_portland-area_schoo.html
For safety, Portland-area schools get serious about visitor badges, locked doors, phone calls home
(snipped, more @ link)
Beaverton’s Findley Elementary in Cedar Mill isn’t far from Skyline and was one of the sites where rescuers grabbed food and water during the massive search for the missing second-grader.
“Because some of our families work with the dad (Kaine Horman at Intel), there was a heightened concern,” said Principal Kathleen Skidmore.
The 800-student school opened Tuesday with a lock on its back gate, staff greeting students in the hallway instead of in the classrooms, and a requirement that parents enter and leave through the front doors.
– Betsy Hammond
**************
Just me, or does this sound like at least at this point, at the beginning of the NEXT school year, there were still concerns that this abduction may have something to do with Kaine’s employment?
Maybe PPS isn’t the only one covering their butts?
I wonder if David Anthony Durham or Dede Schneider were assoicated with any school employees? We know Terri was. Something keeps niggling at me that there is some sort of link that’s there, something in sight, but the connection simply hasn’t been made yet.
Honestly, if the lack of information is due to some coverup? I think the mother in me would drive my buns down to Oregon and speak to LE, politicians, and community leaders myself if nothing more than to honor this little boy who deserves so much more.
It has always been odd to me that Kaine has been comfortable believing his child is somehow going to mysteriously appear after four years. He’s an intelligent guy, not prone to wild theories. What could be his justification for believing this? It leads me to believe the abductor was in communication with either LE or Kaine himself.
Argh. Then there’s Blinks statement about this being an ‘open case’ and therefore no community meeting can take place? That’s nonsensical! Argh!
We know who suddenly disappeared after the fact: DAD, Elsie and children, Rudy Sanchez, and I believe one or two Skyline staff members but I don’t remember which ones. Also something about a bus driver who was in some way linked to other people who were possibly involved. Santiago somthing or other.
Many of you here have been totally committed to Kyron and have done a brilliant job of keeping your facts straight and understanding all the nuances of the case. My hat off to each one of you.